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Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




FSM = Female Space Marines

Not trying to start a flame war, but honestly. Entirely new edition, there are rumblings that GW wants to wipe the slate and go back to the basics, and build from there. Understanding the implications, should GW begin letting FSM into the lore? I put "other" because there are some ultra contrarians out there that will gnash their teeth at being forced to answer Yes/No.
   
Made in us
Ancient Venerable Dreadnought




San Jose, CA

Nope, Sororitas are more badass than any Astartes, cuz they're just normal women...don't need no extraneous genetic engineering to go against the horrors of the 41st Millennium, just faith in the Emperor and a bolter!
   
Made in us
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps






Racerguy180 wrote:
Nope, Sororitas are more badass than any Astartes, cuz they're just normal women...don't need no extraneous genetic engineering to go against the horrors of the 41st Millennium, just faith in the Emperor and a bolter!


Then we don't need male space marines either, since we have the Astra Militarum.

I'm on a podcast about (video) game design:
https://anchor.fm/makethatgame

And I also stream tabletop painting/playing Mon&Thurs 8PM EST
https://twitch.tv/tableitgaming
And make YouTube videos for that sometimes!
https://www.youtube.com/@tableitgaming 
   
Made in us
Powerful Pegasus Knight





The sororities are female space marines. Both are monastic orders that lead semi religious lives in both service and in war to a divine being. Each has their orders and their chapters. Each has bolter, chainsword and power armor.

One is just more focused on the monastic aspect, and the other on transhumanist themes. I'm not a big fan of transhumanism to begin with, so I find the sisters to be more thematically engaging.

There is no need for female space marines as their inclusion would only serve to be redundant at best, and reductive at worst.
   
Made in mx
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan




Mexico

Sororitas aren't female Spaces Marines.

They are T3 W1 vs Marines' T4 W2. But even more egregious than stats it is the lack of thematix variety. Where is my Space Vikings Sororitas? Or Space Vampires Sororitas? Or all psykers Sororitas? Or even Chaos Sororitas?

The game is bloated with Spaces Marines of all shapes, sizes and colors, meanwhile Sororitas are just nuns with guns.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/10/04 23:48:54


 
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins





Tacoma, WA, USA

There is no good time to introduce FSM. There is also no bad time to introduce FSM. Either they do it or they don't. Any time is as good as any other.
   
Made in us
Terrifying Rhinox Rider




It would 100% be a good time to have women in the space marines. I think there’s already a problem with depersonalizing characters in general in warhammer, without calling them female space marines.

The situation that in the US military they call women females doesn’t mean anything because “this is the way we do it in the military” almost never means it’s a great way to do things.

I’m a fundamentalist on 40k. The very first article ever describing marine organs is the one that specifies “male hormones and tissue types.” The thing is, that article will still exist no matter what GW says, I don’t believe retcons matter, and modern GW has no connection to original/real 40k so they can publish anything they want, which should include marine women doing genocide, women marines plotting to poison or maroon Guilliman on behalf of some Hugh Lord's, marine women executing arrest warrants ordered by Guilliman on the protagonists of a story

This whole ideology that makes women and men into discrete categories has always been a social control, a distraction. Every character in a story and every person in the real world can join a hierarchy that crushes the weak, and everyone can resist that hierarchy and struggle for self determination and freedom for everyone. Women are enforcers and freedom fighters in equal amounts it makes total sense.
   
Made in us
Powerful Pegasus Knight





 Tyran wrote:
Sororitas aren't female Spaces Marines.

They are T3 W1 vs Marines' T4 W2. But even more egregious than stats it is the lack of thematix variety. Where is my Space Vikings Sororitas? Or Space Vampires Sororitas? Or all psykers Sororitas? Or even Chaos Sororitas?

The game is bloated with Spaces Marines of all shapes, sizes and colors, meanwhile Sororitas are just nuns with guns.
There is plenty of room in the established lore to accommodate that. Different worlds all have different imperial cults with their own cultural adaptation to the imperial faith (looks at Fenris). Thematically they are so similar to space marines that the inclusion of female space marines would make them redundant.

As for game mechanics I couldn't freaking care less.

   
Made in us
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps






 Sledgehammer wrote:
 Tyran wrote:
Sororitas aren't female Spaces Marines.

They are T3 W1 vs Marines' T4 W2. But even more egregious than stats it is the lack of thematix variety. Where is my Space Vikings Sororitas? Or Space Vampires Sororitas? Or all psykers Sororitas? Or even Chaos Sororitas?

The game is bloated with Spaces Marines of all shapes, sizes and colors, meanwhile Sororitas are just nuns with guns.
There is plenty of room in the established lore to accommodate that. Different worlds all have different imperial cults with their own cultural adaptation to the imperial faith (looks at Fenris). Thematically they are so similar to space marines that the inclusion of female space marines would make them redundant.

As for game mechanics I couldn't freaking care less.



But what about the models - are the models so similar that the inclusion of FSM would make Sororitas redundant? Have you ever looked at a space marine unit and been like "Dang, if that had a woman's head I would not be able to tell if that was a Sister of Battle or not!"?

I'm on a podcast about (video) game design:
https://anchor.fm/makethatgame

And I also stream tabletop painting/playing Mon&Thurs 8PM EST
https://twitch.tv/tableitgaming
And make YouTube videos for that sometimes!
https://www.youtube.com/@tableitgaming 
   
Made in us
Powerful Pegasus Knight





pelicaniforce wrote:
It would 100% be a good time to have women in the space marines. I think there’s already a problem with depersonalizing characters in general in warhammer, without calling them female space marines.

The situation that in the US military they call women females doesn’t mean anything because “this is the way we do it in the military” almost never means it’s a great way to do things.

I’m a fundamentalist on 40k. The very first article ever describing marine organs is the one that specifies “male hormones and tissue types.” The thing is, that article will still exist no matter what GW says, I don’t believe retcons matter, and modern GW has no connection to original/real 40k so they can publish anything they want, which should include marine women doing genocide, women marines plotting to poison or maroon Guilliman on behalf of some Hugh Lord's, marine women executing arrest warrants ordered by Guilliman on the protagonists of a story

This whole ideology that makes women and men into discrete categories has always been a social control, a distraction. Every character in a story and every person in the real world can join a hierarchy that crushes the weak, and everyone can resist that hierarchy and struggle for self determination and freedom for everyone. Women are enforcers and freedom fighters in equal amounts it makes total sense.
A construct fundamental to the very idea of a religious monastic cult nonetheless.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Rihgu wrote:
 Sledgehammer wrote:
 Tyran wrote:
Sororitas aren't female Spaces Marines.

They are T3 W1 vs Marines' T4 W2. But even more egregious than stats it is the lack of thematix variety. Where is my Space Vikings Sororitas? Or Space Vampires Sororitas? Or all psykers Sororitas? Or even Chaos Sororitas?

The game is bloated with Spaces Marines of all shapes, sizes and colors, meanwhile Sororitas are just nuns with guns.
There is plenty of room in the established lore to accommodate that. Different worlds all have different imperial cults with their own cultural adaptation to the imperial faith (looks at Fenris). Thematically they are so similar to space marines that the inclusion of female space marines would make them redundant.

As for game mechanics I couldn't freaking care less.



But what about the models - are the models so similar that the inclusion of FSM would make Sororitas redundant? Have you ever looked at a space marine unit and been like "Dang, if that had a woman's head I would not be able to tell if that was a Sister of Battle or not!"?
Then put female heads on space marines for all i care. I just don't advocate for fundamentally changing the identity of an established faction and the ensuing themes that make it what it is; all in order to pander and appeal to a fanbase that obviously is not put off by their protestations enough to disengage with the product all together.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/10/05 00:04:27


 
   
Made in us
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh




GW could always just say that FSMs come from one of the lost original Legions (2 or 11). Not taking a side in the issue but just pointing out that there is design space for them. You could even split them 1/1 Imperium/Chaos.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Custodes would've been the perfect way to introduce female super soldiers, since they had so little fluff you'd have been able to make them 50/50 and nobody would've bat an eye.
   
Made in us
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps






 Sledgehammer wrote:

 Rihgu wrote:
 Sledgehammer wrote:
 Tyran wrote:
Sororitas aren't female Spaces Marines.

They are T3 W1 vs Marines' T4 W2. But even more egregious than stats it is the lack of thematix variety. Where is my Space Vikings Sororitas? Or Space Vampires Sororitas? Or all psykers Sororitas? Or even Chaos Sororitas?

The game is bloated with Spaces Marines of all shapes, sizes and colors, meanwhile Sororitas are just nuns with guns.
There is plenty of room in the established lore to accommodate that. Different worlds all have different imperial cults with their own cultural adaptation to the imperial faith (looks at Fenris). Thematically they are so similar to space marines that the inclusion of female space marines would make them redundant.

As for game mechanics I couldn't freaking care less.



But what about the models - are the models so similar that the inclusion of FSM would make Sororitas redundant? Have you ever looked at a space marine unit and been like "Dang, if that had a woman's head I would not be able to tell if that was a Sister of Battle or not!"?
Then put female heads on space marines for all i care. I just don't advocate for fundamentally changing the identity of an established faction and the ensuing themes that make it what it is; all in order to pander and appeal to a fanbase that obviously is not put off by their protestations enough to disengage with the product all together.


You're the one that said the themes are so similar that they would be redundant if there were Female space marines. So would actually it be a fundamentally changing the ensuing themes of the faction, if they're already so similar?

I'm on a podcast about (video) game design:
https://anchor.fm/makethatgame

And I also stream tabletop painting/playing Mon&Thurs 8PM EST
https://twitch.tv/tableitgaming
And make YouTube videos for that sometimes!
https://www.youtube.com/@tableitgaming 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




pelicaniforce wrote:
It would 100% be a good time to have women in the space marines. I think there’s already a problem with depersonalizing characters in general in warhammer, without calling them female space marines.


It's a fethed up, depersonalized setting. Also, the use of the word "female" here isn't depersonalizing, since it's being used as an adjective.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
pelicaniforce wrote:


This whole ideology that makes women and men into discrete categories has always been a social control, a distraction. Every character in a story and every person in the real world can join a hierarchy that crushes the weak, and everyone can resist that hierarchy and struggle for self determination and freedom for everyone. Women are enforcers and freedom fighters in equal amounts it makes total sense.


Women and men are not the same thing as male and female. Male and female are biological terms that have meaning, inasmuch as anything does.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/10/05 01:22:11


 
   
Made in us
The Marine Standing Behind Marneus Calgar





Upstate, New York

I was hoping this was going to be a discussion about adding the Flying Spaghetti Monster as another chaos god.

Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? Ramen.

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Please no. Lets not just uproot 20+ years of established lore and pretend like it was there all along (again), all for something nearly no one even really wants to play, but just wants to say we should have.

How about more xenos. Actual, not off-shoots of humanity, xenos?

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/10/05 02:06:11


 
   
Made in us
Powerful Pegasus Knight





 Rihgu wrote:
 Sledgehammer wrote:

 Rihgu wrote:
 Sledgehammer wrote:
 Tyran wrote:
Sororitas aren't female Spaces Marines.

They are T3 W1 vs Marines' T4 W2. But even more egregious than stats it is the lack of thematix variety. Where is my Space Vikings Sororitas? Or Space Vampires Sororitas? Or all psykers Sororitas? Or even Chaos Sororitas?

The game is bloated with Spaces Marines of all shapes, sizes and colors, meanwhile Sororitas are just nuns with guns.
There is plenty of room in the established lore to accommodate that. Different worlds all have different imperial cults with their own cultural adaptation to the imperial faith (looks at Fenris). Thematically they are so similar to space marines that the inclusion of female space marines would make them redundant.

As for game mechanics I couldn't freaking care less.



But what about the models - are the models so similar that the inclusion of FSM would make Sororitas redundant? Have you ever looked at a space marine unit and been like "Dang, if that had a woman's head I would not be able to tell if that was a Sister of Battle or not!"?
Then put female heads on space marines for all i care. I just don't advocate for fundamentally changing the identity of an established faction and the ensuing themes that make it what it is; all in order to pander and appeal to a fanbase that obviously is not put off by their protestations enough to disengage with the product all together.


You're the one that said the themes are so similar that they would be redundant if there were Female space marines. So would actually it be a fundamentally changing the ensuing themes of the faction, if they're already so similar?
Your individual decision to put different heads on a space marine is quite different from advocating for a top down narrative change to fulfill your own personal wishes. To do so would only be to the detriment of others enjoyment after they have already emotionally, and financially invested in an army or theme.

To put it bluntly advocating for this top down change requires a complete dismissal of the concerns or feelings of those that are already attached to their army.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/10/05 02:26:03


 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle





In My Lab

You can’t have it both ways-either Marines and Sisters are so similar that there’s no need for lady Marines, or including female Marines is a radical change to their identity.

Those positions are mutually exclusive.

Clocks for the clockmaker! Cogs for the cog throne! 
   
Made in us
Powerful Pegasus Knight





 JNAProductions wrote:
You can’t have it both ways-either Marines and Sisters are so similar that there’s no need for lady Marines, or including female Marines is a radical change to their identity.

Those positions are mutually exclusive.
The very idea of a monastic order (you know, a brotherhood?) is fundamental to the separation of the sexes.

To add females to space marines is to #1 destroy the themes of a medieval militant order and or #2 to make the sisters redundant as we now we have two monastic orders of space crusading religious weirdos, just that one is transhuman.

You will destroy the theme of one faction and make redundant the other.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





It's awkward. There always *should have been* FSM, especially for the sake of not making the flagship army a boys-only club. But there's so much lore either stating or implying that there are no FSM that it's kind of hard to change at this point without it feeling really clunky and ham-fisted. The introduction of the primaris probably would have been the time to do it; emperor knows that doubling the size of the recruitment pool would have been way more helpful than adding a couple inches to the marines' height.

Basically, I'm all for FSM, I'm just not sure there's a particularly elegant way to introduce them. Then again, apparently squats have just kind of been around this whole time, so... *shrug*

 Sledgehammer wrote:
 JNAProductions wrote:
You can’t have it both ways-either Marines and Sisters are so similar that there’s no need for lady Marines, or including female Marines is a radical change to their identity.

Those positions are mutually exclusive.
The very idea of a monastic order (you know, a brotherhood?) is fundamental to the separation of the sexes.

To add females to space marines is to #1 destroy the themes of a medieval militant order and or #2 to make the sisters redundant as we now we have two monastic orders of space crusading religious weirdos, just that one is transhuman.

You will destroy the theme of one faction and make redundant the other.

Nah. Sisters are awesome not because they're women but because they're unaugmented humans given enough decent gear to stand a chance who are willing to face Horus himself for the sake of their faith. You're definitely not ruining sisters by giving long hair to the frankenstein gorillas. And you're definitely not ruining the frankenstein gorillas by saying some of them had innies instead of outies prior to being turned into an inhuman monstrosity.

Also, Space Wolves are vikings, not monks/crusaders. So at the very least we should have some fenrisian shield sisters joining the packs at the Fang, right? After all, sword maidens were a thing.


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




I do not think we need FSM.

But I do think it’s rather bland, and hasn’t been done particularly well.
And it’s rather generic how often a thing in sci fi or fantasy is this way.

If 40k had more women in the setting all these years, then I think the all male part of space marines would have been better set out to be a real interesting part of the setting than it is.
This isn’t just a setting thing, but a minis thing. I want to be able to have minis and characters to paint without it being one of two a faction if lucky.
Even factions like Necron seem to be all guys due to omission mostly..

Also, it doesn’t help that the hard sci fi part is often pushed as a reason. When the emperor being a ass is a better starting point.


Added a bit.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/10/05 04:05:20


 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Necrons are pretty frequently described as being women these days. I mean, they're in the same meatless robot skeleton bodies as everyone else, but they use feminine pronouns.


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
Made in de
Contagious Dreadnought of Nurgle





It should have been done when they introduced Primaris and could have been an explanation why it's suddenly able to produce SM that fast (Double the amount of possible recruits is helpful).
It was always a point for debates because Sisters languished with their oldest range while SM got all the stuff. Now that Sisters have been updated I think it's not as necessary anymore, women in power Armour are there with an excellent range.
Chaos needs more FSM than loyalists do at this point. Show us that Fabius got stuff done, too.
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Wyldhunt wrote:
Necrons are pretty frequently described as being women these days. I mean, they're in the same meatless robot skeleton bodies as everyone else, but they use feminine pronouns.


I had read the book, but I didn’t know if they had done any more with recent releases or using more feminine language.
If they have done more characters then great But still need off more for the whole setting.
   
Made in us
Powerful Pegasus Knight





 Wyldhunt wrote:
It's awkward. There always *should have been* FSM, especially for the sake of not making the flagship army a boys-only club. But there's so much lore either stating or implying that there are no FSM that it's kind of hard to change at this point without it feeling really clunky and ham-fisted. The introduction of the primaris probably would have been the time to do it; emperor knows that doubling the size of the recruitment pool would have been way more helpful than adding a couple inches to the marines' height.

Basically, I'm all for FSM, I'm just not sure there's a particularly elegant way to introduce them. Then again, apparently squats have just kind of been around this whole time, so... *shrug*

 Sledgehammer wrote:
 JNAProductions wrote:
You can’t have it both ways-either Marines and Sisters are so similar that there’s no need for lady Marines, or including female Marines is a radical change to their identity.

Those positions are mutually exclusive.
The very idea of a monastic order (you know, a brotherhood?) is fundamental to the separation of the sexes.

To add females to space marines is to #1 destroy the themes of a medieval militant order and or #2 to make the sisters redundant as we now we have two monastic orders of space crusading religious weirdos, just that one is transhuman.

You will destroy the theme of one faction and make redundant the other.

Nah. Sisters are awesome not because they're women but because they're unaugmented humans given enough decent gear to stand a chance who are willing to face Horus himself for the sake of their faith. You're definitely not ruining sisters by giving long hair to the frankenstein gorillas. And you're definitely not ruining the frankenstein gorillas by saying some of them had innies instead of outies prior to being turned into an inhuman monstrosity.

Also, Space Wolves are vikings, not monks/crusaders. So at the very least we should have some fenrisian shield sisters joining the packs at the Fang, right? After all, sword maidens were a thing.


I agree that is why I like sisters, but fundamental to their identity is that they are......... sisters.....

The same thing holds true for space marines. Each chapter may not be FULLY based on the idea of a medieval militant order, however their structure is still inherently derived from it. What do you think a chapter is (definitely has nothing to do at all with the Tutonic order)? Why the terminology of serfs, chapter masters, chaplains, etc? Why crusades, and why battle brothers. Its all there evidently in service of the theme....
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 JNAProductions wrote:
You can’t have it both ways-either Marines and Sisters are so similar that there’s no need for lady Marines, or including female Marines is a radical change to their identity.

Those positions are mutually exclusive.


Yes and no, because if Sororitas and Astartes are defined as sex-segregated organizations, it would be unthematic of either of them to be sex-integrated. However, doesn't stop them from filling the "spess knight" role.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Wyldhunt wrote:
There always *should have been* FSM, especially for the sake of not making the flagship army a boys-only club.


Why? This is like thinking we'll solve the prison-industrial complex with more female prison guards. The Imperium is supposed to be fethed up and nonsensical.

Anyway, one of the big elephants in the room is that for a good portion of the pro-FSM crowd, it's not about making women feel welcome in the hobby but about their own psychosexual hangups, and I don't want to be part of that.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/10/05 05:14:23


 
   
Made in us
Master Engineer with a Brace of Pistols





washington state USA

No.

GW has already done enough damage to the lore of the universe, stop trying to make it worse.

sci-fi and fantasy settings have rules that set them apart from our real world on purpose. there cannot be female space marines in the rules of the 40K universe. stop trying to make it like our real world.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/10/05 05:37:45






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Made in us
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Apple fox wrote:
 Wyldhunt wrote:
Necrons are pretty frequently described as being women these days. I mean, they're in the same meatless robot skeleton bodies as everyone else, but they use feminine pronouns.


I had read the book, but I didn’t know if they had done any more with recent releases or using more feminine language.
If they have done more characters then great But still need off more for the whole setting.

The Twice Dead King series (at least the second book) has a lychguard, a cryptek, a lord, and an offscreen phaeron who are all women. A short story from the Tyranids omnibus has a cryptek and a lychguard who are both women. So it seems necrons do have at least two genders, and those genders apparently persist into their new metallic existence.

Hecaton wrote:
 JNAProductions wrote:
You can’t have it both ways-either Marines and Sisters are so similar that there’s no need for lady Marines, or including female Marines is a radical change to their identity.

Those positions are mutually exclusive.


Yes and no, because if Sororitas and Astartes are defined as sex-segregated organizations, it would be unthematic of either of them to be sex-integrated. However, doesn't stop them from filling the "spess knight" role.

I guess I don't feel that either faction is strongly defined by being sexually segregated. I mean, they are segregated, in the current lore, but I'm not sure that segregation is a huge part of either faction's appeal for most people. Maybe I'm wrong. I know that for me personally, the marines being exclusively male and sisters being exclusively female wasn't a factor in why I started collecting them. It's not like I was on the verge of buying Space Wolves and then went, "I guess these guys are cool, but only if none of them are girls!"

The sexual segragation is just a splash of flavor on both factions. I just think it's an element that has aged kind of poorly on marines given that they're the flagship army.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Wyldhunt wrote:
There always *should have been* FSM, especially for the sake of not making the flagship army a boys-only club.


Why? This is like thinking we'll solve the prison-industrial complex with more female prison guards. The Imperium is supposed to be fethed up and nonsensical.

Anyway, one of the big elephants in the room is that for a good portion of the pro-FSM crowd, it's not about making women feel welcome in the hobby but about their own psychosexual hangups, and I don't want to be part of that.

I'm afraid I don't follow your prison analogy or know what you're referring too about hangups. I just find it a bit unfortunate that the most visible faction in the game is monosex for no particular reason because:
A.) I do think there's value in representation.
B.) I do worry that women who might otherwise be interested in joining the hobby could be put off by the heavy emphasis on factions that are all male or coded male (orks).

Basically, making marines monosex doesn't really make them any cooler to me, and I'd hate to think we might be missing out on good games with players who never joined the hobby because the focus on male characters made it seem less welcoming. Monosex marines aren't the worst thing in the world, but it does seem like a lore element that has more cons than pros. I genuinely believe less women would get into Star Wars media/games if the jedi were exclusively male. And I don't think the jedi would have been more interesting if they were exclusively male.


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Chaplain with Hate to Spare






EviscerationPlague wrote:
Custodes would've been the perfect way to introduce female super soldiers, since they had so little fluff you'd have been able to make them 50/50 and nobody would've bat an eye.
Very much agree. It would have been ideal, imo.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Wyldhunt wrote:
I'd hate to think we might be missing out on good games with players who never joined the hobby because the focus on male characters made it seem less welcoming.
There are so many factions that are not Marines for players who don't want all-male. The fix here is for GW to stop showering so much attention on Marines.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/10/05 07:36:46


And They Shall Not Fit Through Doors!!!

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Gore-Drenched Khorne Chaos Lord




Why is nobody asking for males in sisters of battle?
   
 
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