I ask because the modelling on the Dark Eldar Raiders and Ravager side guns look as if they get a 180 degree arc and there has been some confusion at tournaments with Raiders moving up sideways across the board and shooting broadside and Ravagers taking rear shots.

Basically I've already done the conversion and it looks in line with the Talos and Jetbike modelling, really ties the army together. The downside is I've lost 4" of range so I've been looking for a ruling on arcs of fire. I can always pivot the tank in the firing phase to present the rear if I can swivel the gun 180.

As a side note, moving broadside is a way to create some long los blosking terrain if they shoot you down.

Yep see my "rule #1" in my sig. You can do all sorts of nasty tricks to gain advantages in the game through modeling.

You can use epic sized Whirlwind models to hide behind pretty much anything, you can build Daemon princes with giant pirate hats to block line of sight to your Land Raiders behind. You can build incredibly long Raiders, deploy them sideways and then pivot them in the first movement phase to gain ridiculous amounts of free movement.

But just because you can do something, does it mean you should? Its a choice each person has to make for themselves based on how badly they want to win a game of toy soldiers.

The rules on firing arcs are clearly unclear: unless the weapon is in a turret, sponson or defined as "fixed" (which no weapons in the game are besides the Earthshaker cannon on a Basilisk shown in the 'fixed' weapon fire arc diagram) then you simply draw line of sight from the weapon mount to your target. If you can successfully do so, then the weapon may see and shoot its target.

As for moving Raiders broadside to create terrain when they're shot down, I do know that's a useful tactic but it is important to remember that once shot down the Riader ohly blocks line of sight as the profile of the model (WYSIWYG) and line of sight can be drawn ofver the top of it as normal.

I know you are being coy, and the RAW allows for this sort of thing, but I cannot believe that you would promote/advocate/brag about these sort of tactics.  Seriously, how many games do you think you would play getting away with any of that bull*gak*e?  In a tourney, besides getting hammered on sportsmanship, if any of this helped you win the game, you would be lucky to get out of there unharmed.  I can't even see a friendly casual game player tolerating this kind of "spirit of the game" violation.  While I enjoy creative modeling, doing it to gain advantages, especially the lengthening of vehicles to gain more range is pathetic.  I am typing this is a calm and rational "voice", so don't get all bent, but that is nothing to be proud of.  Play the game.  Don't ruin it.  If you have to model your raider to gain an unfair advantage over other raiders, just play with yourself in your garage, you will win every game!

They are WAY better becuase the minimum range loses 6 inches or more with the rockets on the back of the tank, and the missiles are turreted, instead of fixed. 2 clear advantages, but I don't regret it because I had to at least pay some points. I have wondered about the legality...

I know he softened it with the "...but just because you can do something...", but it is his #1 rule.  The impression/promotion is clearly defined in his signature, tegues. 

He plays at a highly competitive level, I presume the crowd he plays against regularly does also, and his "#1 rule" no doubt is a product of that environment.  Whether he did it as a joke or meant to teach a lesson to some arseclown he ran into one day, I don't know, and I am not knocking the guy for doing it, I'm sure he has his reasons.  All I'm saying is that promoting that kind of modeling to gain an advantage is bad form to say the least.  How you, Mannahnin, or anyone else can argue against that is beyond me.  Unless you are saying that you have no problem with that sort of tactic, and you are entitled to say it, but don't tell me it doesn't violate the spirit of the game.  At least give me that.

BTW~ most of my ire was directed at the guy looking for the advantage with the raider.

akira5665 wrote:Is this corn-ball? Or is it going with Yak's call? I think if you model your figs to your Adv. without being a Corn-meister....

Laserbait wrote:If YOU were in an armoured personnel carrier, would YOU use the side exits knowing there was a heavy weapon blasting past you?