http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/93.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net The way the rule is written at the moment if two units in close combat both have the "Always Strike First" rule the order is determined by initiative. Didn't the older version say....if both units have always strike 1st, prioity goes to the charger, if this doesn't apply then it's determined by initiative, and then a die roll if they have the same initiative. Makes more sense to have the prioity given to the charger (if they both have always strike 1st)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/402751.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/402751.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/402912.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/402912.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/402965.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/402965.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/403247.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/403247.page GMT d6]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/403487.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/403487.page GMT FAQ. it discusses what happens when two models who both have the always strikes first rule fight and one has a great weapon. the great weapon strikes last even if he had a higher initiative. it actually says "in effect the two Always Strikes First rules cancel eachother out." or something similar to that. I know what your saying, and what I'm saying is it is already that way.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/403559.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/403559.page GMT D6

the bonus for charging is striking 1st, yet the opponent also strikes 1st, so really it has no effect, if both characters have strike 1st then charging makes no difference.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/403562.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/403562.page GMT if both have ASF, just ignore it]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/404399.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/404399.page GMT FaQ you use.. the European one says Init order the US one says apply weapon mods then init order.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/432089.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/432089.page GMT faq said great weapon with ASF goes last, then what if the great weapon is charging?

if you count the always strike last thing for the 'great weapon', you have to count the 'always strike first' for charging.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/443829.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/443829.page GMT
In the BRB it clearly says ASF v ASF is just on initiative (doesn't matter about great weapon or charging)

I think there was a FAQ for a while that said otherwise, but they changed it.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/443869.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/443869.page GMT FAQs.

The first one stated that Swordmasters (and any Elf with Great Weapon), in combat with another ASF unit, would strike last, due to the Great Weapons.

Then a second version came out saying it is *always* highest Initiative going first.

Personally, I don't like the second ruling. I agree, concur and indeed ratify, that in the case of ASF v ASF, just ignore ASF and treat it as a normal combat.

Either that, or change the wording of charges and great weapons thusly....'when charging you always count as having higher initiative than your opponent' unt 'when determining strike order in HTH, then, and only then, models armed with Great Weapons are treated as if they had Initiative 0.

But hey ho, I know the ruling, so I can houserule it at mine if need be.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/488462.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/488462.page GMT faq's one for US and one for EU. The timing really isnt important more of do you use diff rules per yoru local?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/488534.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/219933/488534.page GMT