http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477093.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477093.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477097.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477097.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477100.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477100.page GMT With my Tau, I bring two units of pathfinders, do to the scout rule they can disembark before the battle begains, then in my first turn I have a unit of Fire Warriors right next to the devil fish, they jump in and I've got a transport for my troops to go claim objectives in.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477111.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477111.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477117.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477117.page GMT init

only limitation of dedicated transport is that only the unit that came with them may deploy, embarked on them ... though some old codexs also have rules stating that only the unit that selected them may use them (just check that tau doesn't list them as such) (see IG chimras)

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477135.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477135.page GMT

Thank you Tri.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477136.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477136.page GMT The reason is that they don't need plasma grenades for charging (as their charge is not slowed down by terrain) and if they are in-midst the enemy veil of tears is rather useless. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477169.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477169.page GMT
A falcon would wanna go fast, to get places - meaning 24' no firing of its weapons. A wave serpent can pull this off better because it doesnt have to have lotsa weapons. Also star enginers for 36' move (the extra 12' you completely in the shooting phase).

I like footslogging harlies w/ a shadowseer as thier a tempting target, t3 and only 5++ but the enemy can easily waste alot of shots at 18' & thats the (maximum, granted) possible charge range - also you can 'hide' IC in there w/ the harlies (like farseers) to make use of thier various abillites.

A full 10man banshee squad in a WS, i think, will do more damage than a 6man harlie squad in a falcon. Costs more points, doesnt use a Heavy sup choice. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477225.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477225.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477236.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477236.page GMT
Was toying with the idea of 5 harlies in falc with farseer (equipped with doom & guide)plowing the path for a guardian jetbike squadw/warlock. Two fusion pistols on the harlies w/a troupe masterw/powerweapon. Moving 12" at a time shooting, then JSJ the jetbikes back behind the Falcon for at least 4+ cover.

The wave serp sounds better but then I have to buy a squad for the serp to abandon, this is what makes the banshees sound better. but the shees dont get furious assault or fusions.

Am working on what else in army. Any thoughts?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477332.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477332.page GMT

That 5man harlie squad w/ pistols & the troupe.. you want to fleet as much as you can (10 points for a fusion pistol isnt cheap either) and as youve got doom, you wanna make use of those kissies (so no bother w/ troupe power wep) and rending. Why guide w/ a farseer w/ the harlies? For the falcon.. mk.

Synergies, a fortune&doom (and mindwar) farseer. a re-rollable 5++ itsnt bad at all when you can quite easily get a re-rollable 4+ cover save fairly often. Doom+ rending = win.

But when your footslogging it there, nothing can shoot you at 25'' and at 18'' you wont get hit often where you can snipe useful models with mindwar.

Avatar + horde of guardains. Add in another 3 wraithlords.. MC spam woo. 3+ save is pretty fail though. T8 isnt ^.^
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HQ: Farseer(RoW,Ss,Doom,and Guide) 130 pts

Elite: 5 Harlequins( 1TM w/power weap,2 kisses, 2 fusion) 138 pts

Troop 1: 11 Storm Guardians (2 flame)warlock(enhance)
Wave Serp (TL miss, Spirit stones) 270 pts

Troop 2: 6 Jet bikes( 2w/cannon) Warlock( enhance) 212 pts

Troop 3: 11 Storm Guardians( 2 fusion) Warlock (Enhance)
Wave Serp (TL Lances, Spirit Stones) 285 pts

Troop 4: 6 Pathfinders 144 pts

Fast Att: 9 Swooping Hawks (Exarch, Hawks Talon, Sky Leap, Intercept) 231 pts

Heavy 1: Falcon (Miss Launch, Holo, Stones) 180 pts

Heavy 2: Fire Prism: ( Holo, Stones) 160 pts

Total should be a balanced 1750 pt army With a slight altoic or Iyanden theme. The other write up uses Vypers in place of Hawks.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477564.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477564.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477624.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477624.page GMT
rending (harlies) + doom = major win]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477783.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477783.page GMT
rending (harlies) + doom = major win]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477784.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/477784.page GMT
How would you deploy? what supporting what? I know what I'd do. I'm just looking for perspective.

If there is a different tactic you favour the drop troops and such pretty much as you wish. Only the Farseer,Falc,&Harlies are set. Looking for variety in options.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478693.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478693.page GMT
Your harlequins (its a Shadowseer, not a troupemaster(T/M) . But uve got the points right) are a lil small. Your farseer should go with them. You dont need guide. Fortune is by far superior with thier 5+ inv. (add in mindwar to snipe of targets as you move towards them (but granted, no fleeting) is also a bonous) As for the Ss, as you have pistols (Not worth the 10pts/piece) it works but it costs ur farseer 1 A in CC and str 4 rending is just fine against back armour 10. You should stay away from walkers reguardless. You wanna charge from as long a range as possible (to avoid getting shot at) so drop the SS and fusion pistols - add in more harlies.

Your swooping hawks are in conflict from ur strong AT heavy support. Long range is nice, 4+ sv and str 3 guns isnt. Thier good for haywire grenades against vechiles (not walkers.. I went to a store & checked with a guy, walker combat is just ment to be difficult.. its annoying it doesnt get overriden by intercept though) but uve got a EML falcon + 2 prisms. - Swap that squad out for some spyders.

With ur transports - you want star engines, spirit stones & low-cost weapons (Plus shruiken cannons are higher volume str 6 hits -youve already got good AT) to boost your CC orientated troops into the fray.

Drop down the pathfinders to 5man (to make points for) changing ur jetbikes to a 10man DA squad w/ a wave serpent.

OR focous much more on jetbikes (thier as mobile as serpents, can have good firepower and be enchanced via a warlock. and 3+sv) i.e swap guardains as they are for jetbikes with the same theme. = A 9man jetbike squad w/warlock & 3 shrui cannons is a lil cheaper (9pts) than ur current guardain set, Your choice.

.... Until you add in the 20 points for that warlock jetbike... then its slightly more ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478712.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478712.page GMT CC(this is my steady advance with shooting wing, thats designed to dance right at an 18" range).

Yeah, I know the hawks don't really fit with the no aspect theme. Was looking for deepstrike flexibility. Was planning on keeping them and ,depending on mission, the PFs in reserve.

I like the guardian wave serps with the prism backing for the hard punch. Something that can run right up the middle if need be. Like your idea of optimization as to the heavy weapons. I, tend to over do it because dice have failed me 1 time to many.

Not a big fan of the star engines because the cautious side of me says that I gotta go with vectored engines to if I boost while troops are inside. If I use them I think it would be on the Falc. But have to look at it first. An empty serp dashing across to deny an objective Maybe.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478751.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478751.page GMT
& Usually uve got a close-ranged squad inside meaning the closer the better

Star engines on a falcon, your moving that smaller 6 man crew comparement, your forgoing the use of its very heavy weaponary and its more vunerable. You can get vectored engines but why bother when the points can improve things elsewhere alot more. If it was a choice Star engines > Vectored engines.

Jetbikes on thier own, in that lil 7man squad (without a fortuneseer or nething) will get nuked, early on. Also wont do amazingly well in CC (with only 7 models)

Focous on those guys or move to the DA's.

Again, guide with ur falcon -I can see that. But you move 12 and fire only one of its weapons. you use your guide fully and fire everything and the harlies are stuck inside not moving! Your fleeting harlies can move 7-12'' and then charge from 13'-18' away (Proving you dont waste ur time shooting instead of fleeting). If you take into account the time ur loading up, moving slowly and disembarking ur harlies they'll probably take longer to get there plus thier vunerable to being exploded by somthing cracking the falcon.

If they footslogged it, w/a shadowseer then thier invunerable from shots at 25'' and pretty protected (even more so w/ a fortuneseer) at about 12''+ (due to the avarge roll of 2D6x2)

If you really want to transport harlies (Just not what thier designed to do, look at the flip belt rules.. granted you loose em w/ the farseer) put em in a falcon, a shruiken cannon, Star engines, holofield - Blaze up the field with your 36'' move, unload turn 2 to move off the harlies and move off ur falcon, shooting all the way. Dont take guide.

Just think - a full 10man banshee squad w/ a doomseer in a serpent costs about the same points for ur falcon/harlie combo and will do the job much much better without taking up a extra heavy support slot. Also energyfield is as good as holofield (if not better as it prevents damage rather than mitigate it) but its free. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478783.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478783.page GMT EML in frag mode. Doesn't make sense but was ruling 4 months ago. Which increases the firepower over the Banshee setup.

As to hard charging, They can do that when they unload later in game. Then the Bikes are right behind them for support. Looking for this combo to be the counter punch on third round.

I, agree with star engines on at least one Serpent. Thinking of that ruling with the miss launch. Would be potent anti-infantry shuriken cannon/missle launch(frag).

If you've heard diff on the MLs please let me know.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478790.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478790.page GMT
But thats still a waste of its firepower capabilities.

Your assuming your 7 bikes survive that long. Your bikes should be moving the 24'' atleast once at the start of the game to benifit from a) the dist move and b) the 3+ cover save.

Thatll put them infront of the falcon.

Two-three turns of potentially being shot at & having to do an emergency disembarkation w/ a 5++ isnt at all friendly.

Your wave serpents arent gunboats, their transports. Your prisms are gunboats and alot better at being gunboats.

If you get whatevers inside the waveserpent to the infantry, then they can be anti-infantry instead & do alot better at it.

If you really wanna gunboat up a falcon, put a guideseer with some direavengers (alot cheaper) inside, load up the falcon with all manner of weapons (EML + shruiken Is nice) and slowly move it forward, blazing at whatever nessicary. Then after a few turns, unload those DA's onto an objective.

Plasma (i.e eldar frag) are superior to normal frag as thier AP4 which is quite nice. . .]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478860.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478860.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478893.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478893.page GMT JSJ with the bikes by having them trailing beside the Falc and then jump behind the tank for 4+ cover.
The serps were going to be my hard chargers with the back up of the prism.
I definitely agree about the hawks. Just trying to figure out what to throw out as shot magnet instead. The Pfs and hawks are were the tweek will happen. Maybe another troupe of harlequins instead. This one kitted out or 2vypers loaded.

What I,ve envisioned is a three pronged force. One to stay on the Obj, one to charge hard, and a Firepower flanker. All of this on a harlequin themed army that can be either Iyanden or Altoic(no aspects).

As to them being 2 few, how many attack do they deal out on the charge. My math puts 4 sm killed on the charge not counting shooting or Farseer. I'm not planning on charging a maxed squad of sm or anything else. Want to whittle them down first.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478913.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478913.page GMT
Shooting from the harlies..will end up at them getting shot at alot more and that 5++ wont stand against massed fire.

You might get a cover save from a front arc with one serpent covering. Imagine infiltrate marine scouts plinking off your bikers as they move up. 2 wounds & youve got a morale check. (Where-as boosting you could have a 3+ cover save!)

Pathfinders, even rangers or a cheap guardain squad can sit on home objectives (and still have the range to engage)

Harlies excel by causing the opponent to entirely waste shots, via the shadowseer (Just as shruiken fire would be mostly wasted on termies). Which means the opponent may choose to avoid these guys and go for more sure-fire targets. In a tank they waste this ability.

Shot magnets.. well a direct comparison in fast attacks, spyders will survive better with thier save & do more damage albeit at a closer range. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478951.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/478951.page GMT PF. add 3 bikesw/another cannon and another Harlie squad thats on foot with shadowseer.

Ones in falc, by the time they get out, they'll be so close that shadow seer would be waste of points. If they're getting shot on turn 3-4 that means the bikes aren't. Which improves the chances of the bikes capturing an objective.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/479467.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/224623/479467.page GMT