<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Rhino vs. Razorback"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Rhino vs. Razorback tac marines.
Why would one want to give up the fire access port (where they can use meltaguns/flamers) to upgrade a stormbolter to a hvy bolter?
Do you disembark your tac sqd, shoot, leave yourself open to attack, then embark in your next turn to start the cycle over again? So you can only shoot every other turn if you keep embarking and disembarking.
Or in KP missions they are forced to still combat squad to use the transport functionality of the razorback?
How do people use the razorbacks effectively?
Thanks in advance,
-Pav]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/540859.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/540859.page GMT Re:Rhino vs. Razorback
With a Rhino, you do not lose a Fire Point by upgrading it to have a Stormbolter.

Now with the difference between the two vehicles, here is a short list.

Most people I know use Razorbacks as a small fire base. Being as you can get most of the weapon combinations in a Twin Linked form, they are reliable in terms of shooting for doing what you kit them for. Also moving 5 Tac Marines in it isnt all that bad. It makes your force mobile and able to react to changes in the game while bringing a Heavy Weapon of sorts with them in support. All this while the other 5 people int he squad are sitting in terrain or on an objective using their own heavy weapon in support of all that or another part of your army.

Rhinos are just good at moving bulk units of Marines around the board. The are also cheap ways of blocking LOS due to their size. They can make excellent blockers of Fire Lanes and provide cover to units partially obscured by them. While a Razorback can do this just as well, they cost o much and given the heavy weapon arent best suited to this purpose.

This is a very basic short list, and more advanced tactics can be thrown in as well. The overall effectiveness of either is going to be determined by the overall creation of your list. Razorbacks can take the pressure off other vehicles like Dreads and Predators depending how they are themnselves kitted out, while Rhinos can move a sizeable Marine force of 50 - 60 models across the board into stragegic spots rather quickly.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/540920.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/540920.page GMT Rhino vs. Razorback I really get a lot of use out of the fire access port with flamers/meltaguns and extra boltgun shot(s).
I struggle with having the tac sqd get out to fire, then climb back in the next turn and miss a turn of firing because they cannot disembark the same turn they embark (well, unless the vehicle is destroyed).
It's not my normal play style so I am looking to understand the tactics and pro's and con's.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/540944.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/540944.page GMT Rhino vs. Razorback
I really get a lot of use out of the fire access port with flamers/meltaguns and extra boltgun shot(s).

Huh, in 5ed an occupant can't shoot when embarked if the rhino moves more then 6", so I've found that tactic less useful. Means essentially either with razorback or rhino, the squads gotta get out to shoot if you moved more then 6", access point or no.

I struggle with having the tac sqd get out to fire, then climb back in the next turn and miss a turn of firing because they cannot disembark the same turn they embark (well, unless the vehicle is destroyed).

Probably best to rethink how and when you use a razorback to transport. Think of them as a 40 point mobile HB that can, if absolutely needed, move a 5 man squad somewhere fast (usually objective grabs, etc).

HTH]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/542212.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/542212.page GMT Rhino vs. Razorback Though I do like the 40pt Hvy Bolter idea that can hold troops if necessary. It's a cheap but a tin can for a tank. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/542239.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/542239.page GMT Rhino vs. Razorback
The razorback is support to a shooty tactical squad which may occasionally need moving to an objective or whatever.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/543811.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/543811.page GMT Rhino vs. Razorback KP out there.

I usually take a couple of razorbacks and then keep my marines mostly on foot, with the razor just providing extra heavy bolter support. It's cheaper than a speeder in that role, doesn't take up a fast slot, and is more heavily armored (if slower). So the marines aren't getting out to shoot every turn--they're already out.

Then in a game if I need to get a combat squad close to an objective in a hurry or get a melta close to a heavy tank, I can mount up combat squads and rush.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/543833.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/543833.page GMT Rhino vs. Razorback
Flavius Infernus wrote:If you're only moving your rhinos 6" because you want to shoot out the hatches, why not just walk? Marines can move up 6" on foot and shoot (all their weapons instead of just 2) without paying extra for a rhino or putting the extra KP out there.


Because they're incredibly safer IN the tank.
A unit of S4 guns unleashes on the front armor of a Rhino chassis tank... the models inside laugh, point, and make other rude gestures while ridiculing the shooting unit.
A unit of s4 guns shoots at a walking unit... then rolls for wounds, then comes the armor saves... Walking models die faster then transported models.


Eric
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/545529.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/545529.page GMT Rhino vs. Razorback
On paper, the way rhinos are supposed to work like WWII German mechanized infantry transports is nice. In practice the 5th edition limits on shaken units shooting, the fragility of the vehicle, how far you can move and still shoot, and the severely limited firepower you can get from the hatches makes it impossible to use them as true infantry fighting vehicles.

You get much better protection from a rhino (while not impairing firepower) walking your infantry next to it while using it as mobile terrain. A razor works just as well in that role, plus adds the extra HB shots for only 5 points more.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/545703.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/545703.page GMT Rhino vs. Razorback CSM's shooting at you with Bolters (rapid fire) is 20 shots, 10 hits and 5 wounds on average. That's 1 or 2 dead marines per shooting barrage.

In the experience I've had in the game, the Rhino chassis tank is a better buy than the bodies... I do agree that walking behind it is good. I admit that I prefer IN it, though, in case you want to really take off.

Eric]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/546368.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/546368.page GMT Re:Rhino vs. Razorback I pump a few strength 10 shots into it, explode it, the marines inside all take a strength 4 hit, a pinning test and after a couple of them die from that, then I unload my shooty stuff at you.

Yes please!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/546535.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/546535.page GMT Re:Rhino vs. Razorback http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/546808.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/546808.page GMT Re:Rhino vs. Razorback
Dashofpepper wrote:Well, I play Tau - you moving up the field slowly in vehicles means that my broadsides feel useful. I pump a few strength 10 shots into it, explode it, the marines inside all take a strength 4 hit, a pinning test and after a couple of them die from that, then I unload my shooty stuff at you.

Yes please!


LOL

Y'think?
That's funny.
You're only talking about this one SM unit.

If you're sporting broadsides, I'm going to do everything in my power to
(a) ensure my rhino is getting cover saves against them (BTW...Against broadsides, "in" the rhino is STILL safer than out of it, unless I'm behind it)
(b) You're going to have too many threats heading straight at your broadsides for them to worry about a dinky little Rhino, halfway across the table.

Go ahead. Shoot that 35 point transport and wound 2.5 of the models inside (which I'm likely to pass all my saves for). Shoot. At elast if I'm IN the tank, I get my 3+ armor saves when you blow it up. The BEST I can hope for, if out in the open, is a 4+ cover save or miraculously large scatter... the scatter would happen regardless of whether I'm in a tank or not, and the 4+ is inferior to my 3+ armor. Also, now that your Broadsides have taken the bait, I'll just Powerfist them to death next turn with the 2 bike units that just turboboosted up your flank.

We can go at this all day. You can say how you'd counter the bikes, I can say how I'd counter that... yadda yadda yadda...

How 'bout we just stay on track and talk about the subject GENERALLY, so that we don't delve into pages of Off Topic "Well, I'd just do THIS" e-peen waving posts?


Eric]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/549057.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/549057.page GMT Re:Rhino vs. Razorback
MagickalMemories wrote:


Go ahead. Shoot that 35 point transport and wound 2.5 of the models inside (which I'm likely to pass all my saves for). Shoot. At elast if I'm IN the tank, I get my 3+ armor saves when you blow it up. The BEST I can hope for, if out in
Eric


Sure you get your saves. But a broadside will kill one very unfortunate footslogger marine with its TL railguns. If it pops the Rhino and chances it will it becomes a free Heavy 10 S4 Ap- shot. Given the choice I would fire the potential heavy 10 round all day weak though it looks and get a free burning Rhino on the side per attack.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/549160.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/228716/549160.page GMT