<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Assaulting 2 Units at once?"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Assaulting 2 Units at once?
How is this possible? I thought you could only assault the unit you shot at?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620110.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620110.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620141.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620141.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once? However, see the exception over the page for multiple targets." Read top of the second column on page 34 ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620143.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620143.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Remember...'tis always better to actually look up the rules before asking

Edit:Ninja'd]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620146.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620146.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
(although 5th ed is a great edition of 40k)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620149.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620149.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once? LOL.

yeah makes sence to me now.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620160.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620160.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once? .]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620189.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620189.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620481.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620481.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Nenya97 wrote:you can only assault another unit , though, when it is impossible for all your models to get into base to base contact.


...which is REALLY easy to do if you use your movement phase to set yourself up correctly.

It is even easier for units with Fleet, Bikes, or Jump packs. And, it is incredibly easy for large units, such as Ork Boyz.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620535.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620535.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Nenya97 wrote:you can only assault another unit , though, when it is impossible for all your models to get into base to base contact. You can't just throw one guy at the squad you wanted to shoot then assault the other.


Absolutely false and incorrect. The assault rules clearly state how you have to models to get into assault, and those rules are:

1) First model moves into BTB with the closest enemy model in the first squad you're charging.
2) Assaulting player can choose ANY model to move next. This model must move as follows:
2A - Must move into BTB with an enemy model if possible.
2B - Must move within 2" of a model that's in BTB, if 2A isn't possible.
2C - Must move within 2" of a model that's already moved, if 2A and 2B aren't possible.
3) Repeat for all models in the assaulting squad, in whatever order the assaulting player wants.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620673.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620673.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Centurian99 wrote:Absolutely false and incorrect. The assault rules clearly state how you have to models to get into assault, and those rules are:

1) First model moves into BTB with the closest enemy model in the first squad you're charging.
2) Assaulting player can choose ANY model to move next. This model must move as follows:
2A - Must move into BTB with an enemy model if possible.
2B - Must move within 2" of a model that's in BTB, if 2A isn't possible.
2C - Must move within 2" of a model that's already moved, if 2A and 2B aren't possible.
3) Repeat for all models in the assaulting squad, in whatever order the assaulting player wants.
OK so then, if I may ask another stupid question. In the attached picture here (courtesy of VASSAL) I have a line of Ork Bikers and 2 Tau Units there.
Can I Declare the assault against the fire warriors, move Bikers 1and 2 then move 3 into B2B with the warrior on the edge in such a way that Biker 4 can then move into B2B with a Drone while remaining 2" away from Biker 3?

Apologies again for a stupid question as I'm still a little unclear about this (might just be the Patrick's day grog talking but who knows )]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620927.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620927.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
At that point, though, there's nothing to stop you from next moving biker 4 into base contact with a drone (as long as biker 4 ends in coherency with biker 3). You don't have to move bikers 1&2 before biker 4

After that you can move models in any order, as long as they end up in base with an enemy model (from either unit) and in coherency with a friendly model.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620964.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620964.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Centurian99 wrote:
Nenya97 wrote:you can only assault another unit , though, when it is impossible for all your models to get into base to base contact. You can't just throw one guy at the squad you wanted to shoot then assault the other.


Absolutely false and incorrect. The assault rules clearly state how you have to models to get into assault, and those rules are:

1) First model moves into BTB with the closest enemy model in the first squad you're charging.
2) Assaulting player can choose ANY model to move next. This model must move as follows:
2A - Must move into BTB with an enemy model if possible.
2B - Must move within 2" of a model that's in BTB, if 2A isn't possible.
2C - Must move within 2" of a model that's already moved, if 2A and 2B aren't possible.
3) Repeat for all models in the assaulting squad, in whatever order the assaulting player wants.



See thats nearly right but your missing a few key points, first off;

The first bullet point = "The most important one is that each model must end its assault move in coherency with another model in its own unit that has already moved. " Emphasise is mine.

This means you CANNOT move a back model in your assault unit towards/to engage unit B (or a distance part of your orginal assaulted enemy unit for that matter), If that assault moves places it outside of coherency. Im only making a point of this as it is the most important part (the rule itself says so) and you didnt mention Cent, after quoting somone else wrong.

Also

2A...


You forgot to mention that after youve moved your first model with its assault move (assuming it was a successful one BTB'ing it with an enemy model) you must first try to base your subsequent assaulting models with models that are not based with any of your own assaulting models. If there is an un-based model and you can assault it, you must assault it.

Please try and get it right, I mean reeally right, before you start quoting other people wrong then giving your own advice (even if they are wrong!) ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620971.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/620971.page GMT Re:Assaulting 2 Units at once? Does that mean in the Biker example posted above, that he can't assault the second squad with Biker #4? Because, it looks like that one is within range of the the first squad, depending on how he moves the first biker.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621063.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621063.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
But in case there is no shooting prior to the charge, then a simultaneous charge is possible as long as the charging maintains formation. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621101.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621101.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once? pg 34 in the BRB about assaulting multiple units... particularly the 3rd paragrach under "Assaulting multiple enemy units".

It is perfectly legal to assault mutiple units, even if you shot, as spelled out in the BRB.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621160.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621160.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
This obviously relies on having a good assualt squad against units that are poor (or fair at best) in close combat, but it's highly effective.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621214.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621214.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Razerous wrote:
Centurian99 wrote:
Nenya97 wrote:you can only assault another unit , though, when it is impossible for all your models to get into base to base contact. You can't just throw one guy at the squad you wanted to shoot then assault the other.


Absolutely false and incorrect. The assault rules clearly state how you have to models to get into assault, and those rules are:

1) First model moves into BTB with the closest enemy model in the first squad you're charging.
2) Assaulting player can choose ANY model to move next. This model must move as follows:
2A - Must move into BTB with an enemy model if possible.
2B - Must move within 2" of a model that's in BTB, if 2A isn't possible.
2C - Must move within 2" of a model that's already moved, if 2A and 2B aren't possible.
3) Repeat for all models in the assaulting squad, in whatever order the assaulting player wants.



See thats nearly right but your missing a few key points, first off;

The first bullet point = "The most important one is that each model must end its assault move in coherency with another model in its own unit that has already moved. " Emphasise is mine.


My rule 2C. The rules repeat this twice. I was boiling it down to make it easier to understand.

Razerous wrote:
2A...


You forgot to mention that after youve moved your first model with its assault move (assuming it was a successful one BTB'ing it with an enemy model) you must first try to base your subsequent assaulting models with models that are not based with any of your own assaulting models. If there is an un-based model and you can assault it, you must assault it.


You are right there, up to the part where you say that "If there is an unbased-model and you can assault it, you must assault it". First, you don't actually have to multi-charge if you don't want to. Second, the order in which you move models can seriously affect what models get based, and is perfectly legitimate. Regardless, I should renumber the 2A-2C to 2B-2D, and add a 2A, "Must move into BTB with an unengaged enemy model".

I may have forgotten one detail, which I thank you for pointing out, but the original poster I was responding too was absolutely wrong in saying that a unit can't assault more than one unit until the first unit is entirely based. . ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621413.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621413.page GMT Re:Assaulting 2 Units at once? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621711.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/621711.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Centurian99 wrote:
My rule 2C. The rules repeat this twice. I was boiling it down to make it easier to understand. .......


.......You are right there, up to the part where you say that "If there is an unbased-model and you can assault it, you must assault it". First, you don't actually have to multi-charge if you don't want to.


2c - come after A & B. This suggests you can do A or B while ignoring C.

2c comes first. You must maintain your '2c'. I pointed it out because your post suggested otherwise.

I dont ohnestly know why I picked you up (or tried to clarify- maybe it was a little unclear?) your 2A point. I forgot.

Besides.. read p34. It has four bullet points which you must adhere two. But ofcourse you may move the other (assaulting models) in any sequence you desire.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622131.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622131.page GMT Re:Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Right those Ork bikers vs tau troops & tau drones. This is what you could do (and why - going on guestimation on aprox distances)

Begin the assault phase:
=================
-Assault biker 3 to rightmost (and its the closest so its a must) tau trooper engaging the tau-trooper squad.

- Assault move biker 2 to the tau trooper next to the first assaulted trooper (to the Tau's left)

-Assault move biker 1 to the tau trooper next to the second assaulted trooper (again to the Tau's left)

Now... if you decided to assault move biker 4 before bikers 2 & 1, the second assaulted trooper would have probably been within its charge range. As that trooper is now based with biker 2 and the guy next to him is based with biker 1, and the back row is too far away to assault, you can;

-Assault move biker 4 to place him within coherncy next to biker 3 (to the right side, as you look at the picture)

-Assault move biker 5 to engage/base a model in the drone sqaud.

-Finally all of the tau & drone squad make a pile-in move. Both sqauds are engaged.

-Let the krumping begin.

HTH ( & Makes sense...) ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622143.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622143.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Looking at page 34, I see that the rules require models after the first to move "into base contact with an enemy model within reach that is not already in base contact with an enemy model." Nowhere on page 34 do I see any restriction that all enemy models from the unit fired at/declared on must all be in base contact before a second unit can be contacted--that's a 4th edition holdover.

A drone fits the definition of "enemy model within reach that is not already in base contact with an enemy model" even though there are also fire warriors in reach that are not in base contact. So biker #4 can move into the drones immediately after biker 3 contacts the fire warriors and before bikers 1 & 2 assault.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622231.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622231.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Razerous wrote:
Centurian99 wrote:
My rule 2C. The rules repeat this twice. I was boiling it down to make it easier to understand. .......


.......You are right there, up to the part where you say that "If there is an unbased-model and you can assault it, you must assault it". First, you don't actually have to multi-charge if you don't want to.


2c - come after A & B. This suggests you can do A or B while ignoring C.

2c comes first. You must maintain your '2c'. I pointed it out because your post suggested otherwise.

I dont ohnestly know why I picked you up (or tried to clarify- maybe it was a little unclear?) your 2A point. I forgot.

Besides.. read p34. It has four bullet points which you must adhere two. But ofcourse you may move the other (assaulting models) in any sequence you desire.



Okay, I see what you're talking about. So from now on, I'll describe moving into assault as:

1: move closest model to unit being assaulted into BTB
2: pick another assaulting model - any assaulting model, assaulting player's choice
3: move 2nd model ...
3-A: ...so that its in base with a previously unbased enemy model while being in coherency with a model that's already moved
3-B: ...so that its in base with an enemy model, if 3-A isn't possible,
3-C: ...so that its within 2" of a model that's within 2" of a model in BTB with an enemy model, if 3-A and 3-B aren't possible.
3-D: ...so that its within coherency of a model that's already moved, if 3-A, 3-B, and 3-C aren't possible.
4: pick another model and repeat until all models in the assaulting unit have moved.


It's impossible for 3-B, 3-C, and 3-D to result in non-coherency. That's where I made an assumption...as I said, my bad.

None of which, of course, does anything to prevent assaulting multiple units if the first unit hasn't been 100% based, which was my original point. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622337.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622337.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Flavius Infernus wrote:Not sure, but I think there may still be a disagreement here. I'm saying that it's within the rules to move biker #3 into base contact with a fire warrior first, then immediately move biker #4 into base with a *drone* without moving bikers 1 & 2 as long as biker 4 ends movement in coherency with biker 3.


100% correct.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622341.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622341.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
If I two tactical squads to be safe from being assaulted by the same unit, then I need to place them so far apart that the assaulters would have to break coherency to reach the other unit.

In praxis: 5man combat squad, hereafter called Baitsquad.
10man sternguard squad with lots of combi meltas, hereafter called Killinsquad.
Huge Assaulting Nob biker squad.

I set the Baitsquad up front, single line wide, maximum dispersal. They cover 13" of width.
Behind them, I place Killinsquad, making sure that the distance to the nearest model from the Baitsquad is more than 2"+2x(the length of a biker base wich I guess is 40mm). In that case more than 13 cm away.

If this works, the nobs will charge the baitsquad (and either kill them horribly or at least break them.) But they will not be able to get a single model in coherency and in BTB with my Killingsquad. So at the end of the assaultphase, the baitsquad is either dead or running (remember: marines may choose to fail morale checks) and the nob bikers are standing in front of my gunline.

Have I missed something?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622351.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622351.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Mellon wrote:Hmm, so let me see if I got this right.

If I two tactical squads to be safe from being assaulted by the same unit, then I need to place them so far apart that the assaulters would have to break coherency to reach the other unit.

In praxis: 5man combat squad, hereafter called Baitsquad.
10man sternguard squad with lots of combi meltas, hereafter called Killinsquad.
Huge Assaulting Nob biker squad.

I set the Baitsquad up front, single line wide, maximum dispersal. They cover 13" of width.
Behind them, I place Killinsquad, making sure that the distance to the nearest model from the Baitsquad is more than 2"+2x(the length of a biker base wich I guess is 40mm). In that case more than 13 cm away.

If this works, the nobs will charge the baitsquad (and either kill them horribly or at least break them.) But they will not be able to get a single model in coherency and in BTB with my Killingsquad. So at the end of the assaultphase, the baitsquad is either dead or running (remember: marines may choose to fail morale checks) and the nob bikers are standing in front of my gunline.

Have I missed something?


Yes.

Remember that #1 - the assaulting player chooses the order in which models move. Also, if a model can't make base contact with an enemy model, or even make it to within 2" of a model that's within base, all it has to do is maintain coherency.

So given the chance to set things up properly in the movement and/or shooting phase (for models with fleet) any two squads can be assaulted by a squad that's large enough.

Take the infamous 10-man nob bikers, mounted on bike bases - about 3"/60mm long. If the ork player has the movement to set things up, they could have one model that can charge squad A, one model that can move to within 2" of that model, and then 7 models that form a nice conga-line, and the last model assaulting unit B at the other end of the conga-line. With that 10-man bike squad, they could be charging units that are 48" apart. (30" for the 10 bike bases, and 2" between each base).

Of course, that's under ideal circumstances, and is bloody tough to set up. But 12-16" is childs play for someone who knows how to maneuver.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622401.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622401.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once? atm ) for the first time.

It ended up in a 70 min argument over if i can do it or not lol.

But much fun anyhow, and when we did finally get around to doing it, it worked a treat ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622423.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622423.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Centurian99 wrote:

Yes.

Remember that #1 - the assaulting player chooses the order in which models move. Also, if a model can't make base contact with an enemy model, or even make it to within 2" of a model that's within base, all it has to do is maintain coherency.

So given the chance to set things up properly in the movement and/or shooting phase (for models with fleet) any two squads can be assaulted by a squad that's large enough.

Take the infamous 10-man nob bikers, mounted on bike bases - about 3"/60mm long. If the ork player has the movement to set things up, they could have one model that can charge squad A, one model that can move to within 2" of that model, and then 7 models that form a nice conga-line, and the last model assaulting unit B at the other end of the conga-line. With that 10-man bike squad, they could be charging units that are 48" apart. (30" for the 10 bike bases, and 2" between each base).

Of course, that's under ideal circumstances, and is bloody tough to set up. But 12-16" is childs play for someone who knows how to maneuver.



Gods... Another challenging part of the movement phase. Thanks for explaining! ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622518.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622518.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Mellon wrote:
Centurian99 wrote:
Of course, that's under ideal circumstances, and is bloody tough to set up. But 12-16" is childs play for someone who knows how to maneuver.


Gods... Another challenging part of the movement phase. Thanks for explaining!


Remember though...movement doesn't matter in 40K. Just ask any fantasy player. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622543.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622543.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Do you think it would bother you or your opponent if you turned your Nob Biker and assaulted the side of his Fire Warrior just to maintain unit coherency?

I mean fun is fun, and the rules are stated a certain way but come on!? Really?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622551.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622551.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Facet_X wrote:Question about some of these examples.

Do you think it would bother you or your opponent if you turned your Nob Biker and assaulted the side of his Fire Warrior just to maintain unit coherency?

I mean fun is fun, and the rules are stated a certain way but come on!? Really?


As I said, the 48" thing was a perfect situation, and unlikely to come up ever. The initial charge cuts down on that somewhat, because the closest model has to move towards the closest enemy model in a straight line.

Bike bases are an extreme example, though, because of there oval shape. Think about another friendly unit mounted entirely on 60mm round bases, in a fluffy and characterful size...like 8 Bloodcrushers of Khorne. 60mm is approximately 3 inches. And taking Khorne in squads of 8 is fluffy!

So a squad of 8 bloodcrushers could theoretically span a gap of 38"! Add a herald, and they span 43"!

Completely unlikely to ever occur, of course. I just want to put paid to this misconception that some people have that assaulting more multiple units is either impossible or the next closest thing to. It's simple (although not necessarily easy), especially with units that have semi-decent movement.

Playing against someone who doesn't understand the moving into assault rules, when you do a multi-assault, it can lead to bad feelings, even after you walk them through the assault rules. That's not my fault...its the rules, and its theirs, for misunderstanding the rules. It also doesn't help that the units most able to assault multiple units also tend to be extremely dominant HTH units - and with the deadliness of HTH in 5th edition 40K, that means that those units become exponentially more effective with the right generalship.

The really important lesson to take from all this?

If you want to defend against a multi-assault, the only real defense is to make it so that enemy models physically cannot reach the unit you want to protect. This means you have to surround them with a combination of impassable terrain, the board edge, and models from other units that are spaced close enough together to prevent enemy models from moving between them. This is the ONLY way to reliably keep enemy units from multi-assaulting.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622609.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622609.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once? IG firebase (backed up by Fateweaver of course).

Needless to say, after loosing 2 infantry squads, a LRBT and a HW squad to ONE assaulting unit... I realized the importance of positioning and movement in 5ed (and the dominance of assault, but that is another thread).


But then I remembered that movement only matters in fantasy. I mean they have facings! FACINGS!!!


]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622683.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/622683.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Flavius Infernus wrote:Not sure, but I think there may still be a disagreement here. I'm saying that it's within the rules to move biker #3 into base contact with a fire warrior first, then immediately move biker #4 into base with a *drone* without moving bikers 1 & 2 as long as biker 4 ends movement in coherency with biker 3.

Looking at page 34, I see that the rules require models after the first to move "into base contact with an enemy model within reach that is not already in base contact with an enemy model." Nowhere on page 34 do I see any restriction that all enemy models from the unit fired at/declared on must all be in base contact before a second unit can be contacted--that's a 4th edition holdover.

A drone fits the definition of "enemy model within reach that is not already in base contact with an enemy model" even though there are also fire warriors in reach that are not in base contact. So biker #4 can move into the drones immediately after biker 3 contacts the fire warriors and before bikers 1 & 2 assault.


Ah the reason why I didnt go stright for the 4th biker to move is that I would be dubious to where ever or not bikers's #3 & #4 would be within coherency. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623006.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623006.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Centurian99 wrote:
Facet_X wrote:
Bike bases are an extreme example, though, because of there oval shape. Think about another friendly unit mounted entirely on 60mm round bases, in a fluffy and characterful size...like 8 Bloodcrushers of Khorne. 60mm is approximately 3 inches. And taking Khorne in squads of 8 is fluffy!

So a squad of 8 bloodcrushers could theoretically span a gap of 38"! Add a herald, and they span 43"!


Actually, 60 mm is 2.34 inches (2.56 cm per inch), so the spannable gap would be a little less than 33". Still pretty impressive, but I was feeling anal retentive today.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623346.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623346.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
I find people violate the "each model must end its assault move in coherency with another model in its own unit that has already moved" most often violated, and that makes this messy/difficult. People will move their models in a way that the final result is in coherency, but not each individual move.

I love the image of the 48" away multi-charge with the bikers. With a unit with a 12" move it would be pretty easy to set yourself up exactly where you needed to be. I can just imagine what it would look like if the fight went a couple rounds - since pile-in doesn't require coherency you could end up with parts of the nob squad 40" apart after combat ended. That would be sweet.

(edited for failing at english)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623368.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623368.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
lambadomy wrote:I can just imagine what it would look like if the fight went a couple rounds - since pile-in doesn't require coherency you could end up with parts of the nob squad 40" apart after combat ended. That would be sweet.
Oh man that would cause problems. What happens if one half wipes out their enemy? Do they even get to move in the movement phase to try and reintegrate coherency? Would the only move available be the pile in move at the end of combat? What happens if this straggling half gets assaulted itself. ARGH! Zee Mind! She Boggles!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623399.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623399.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
lambadomy wrote:This is a great thread - the final (correct) breakdown by centurian99 is very useful.

I find people violate the "each model must end its assault move in coherency with another model in its own unit that has already moved" rule is the one that is most often violated, and makes this messy/difficult. People will move their models in a way that the final result is in coherency, but not each individual move.

I love the image of the 48" away multi-charge with the bikers. With a unit with a 12" move it would be pretty easy to set yourself up exactly where you needed to be. I can just imagine what it would look like if the fight went a couple rounds - since pile-in doesn't require coherency you could end up with parts of the nob squad 40" apart after combat ended. That would be sweet.


That's the potential problem from multi-charging...if your unit is spread out enough, you put yourself in a situation where they essentially can't do anything for a turn or three, as they have to try and get into coherency. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623406.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623406.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
Centurian99 wrote:
lambadomy wrote:This is a great thread - the final (correct) breakdown by centurian99 is very useful.

I find people violate the "each model must end its assault move in coherency with another model in its own unit that has already moved" rule is the one that is most often violated, and makes this messy/difficult. People will move their models in a way that the final result is in coherency, but not each individual move.

I love the image of the 48" away multi-charge with the bikers. With a unit with a 12" move it would be pretty easy to set yourself up exactly where you needed to be. I can just imagine what it would look like if the fight went a couple rounds - since pile-in doesn't require coherency you could end up with parts of the nob squad 40" apart after combat ended. That would be sweet.


That's the potential problem from multi-charging...if your unit is spread out enough, you put yourself in a situation where they essentially can't do anything for a turn or three, as they have to try and get into coherency.
But the thing is, can they even attempt to move in the movement phase to get into coherency?
Page 12 wrote:During the course of a game, it's possible a unit will get broken up and lose unit coherency, usually because it takes casualties. If this happens, the models in the unit must be moved in such a way that they restore coherency in their next Movement phase. If the unit cannot move for some reason in its next turn (because they are pinned down by a barrage or sniper fire, for example), then they must move to restore unit coherency as soon as they have the opportunity.

Page 40 wrote:While a unit is locked in combat it may only make pile in moves and may not otherwise move or shoot.

Emphasis mine. Since the whole unit counts as locked so long as one model is in B2B, the "stranded" models technically wont be able to move in the movement phase. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623495.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623495.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
If the entire combat ended, the unit would spend its movement phase moving back into coherency until it was able to end its move in coherency - then it could go back to acting as normal.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623630.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/623630.page GMT Re:Assaulting 2 Units at once? BtB with Unit B, that I have also assaulted unit B? Or does it have to be actual BtB contact? Keep in mind that models from Unit A and in BtB with Unit B as well.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/624001.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/624001.page GMT Assaulting 2 Units at once?
If you have a MODEL in base to base with a MODEL in an enemy unit, then their UNITS are in close combat

If you do not have any models from your unit in base to base with the enemy unit in question, then you are not in close combat with it, even if you're within 1". You have to be in base to base.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/624059.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/233726/624059.page GMT