Latest posts for the thread "The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins"

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Cryonicleech — GMT

Ok, so here's the deal.

I've been reading the DH 'dex. As old as it is, I've found something.

Assassins

"Oh leech, you're out of your mind" etc. etc.

Whatever, here's the thing.

With these, it is possible to not only kill off the Daemon Prince, but the Oblit's and Plaguemarines that so happily nestle their way into chaos lists.

Of all the choices, mine are.

1. Callidus: Basically, she pops up anywhere and allows No saves (even invul's).

2. Vindicare: The only reason he's in second is that he gets only 1 shot per-turn. Otherwise, he'd be in first.

3. Culexus: A bit risky, but what I like about it is the LD reduction and Anti-Psyker Abilities.

4. Eversor: He's only good against low-save multiple opponents. Good against Daemons though!

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

jeffersonian000 — GMT

I had the same conclusion recently after playing against a 2 lash-prince/7 Oblit army. I'm going to go with the Callidus to first use "A Word in You Ear" to move the squad of 3 Oblits out of cover and out of coherency before the game starts, and then on the turn when she arrives she’ll bog-down/take out which even unit I'm going to have issues with later in the game.

At least, that’s my theory. Should work even better versus Tau, yet maybe not so well versus ‘Nids.

SJ

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Canonness Rory — GMT

A word in your ear can be mean against 'Nids if they don't have a lot of synapse.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

sourclams — GMT

No grenades really hurts the assault-oriented ones. I was running the Callidus for a little while just to try her, and found myself trading her useless against the things I most wanted to kill, like Eldrad with Wraithguard, that sort of thing.

Daemon Princes also brutalize her at I5.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

willydstyle — GMT

@Cryonicleech:

I think you're vastly overestimating the capabilities of T4 2W characters.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Casper — GMT

willydstyle wrote:@Cryonicleech:

I think you're vastly overestimating the capabilities of T4 2W characters.

I was thinking the exact same thing. They have potential but after awhile you find out they are expensive one trick ponies whose points should be spent elsewhere.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Augustus — GMT

That's my asesment as well, expensive, one trick. I have seen the calidus go down in CC to almost anything, a broadside, a vet sarge marine with a fist, a high number of T3 models of any sort, whatever, she's not very good in CC, actually...

I found a nasty combo:

Combine a Calidus neuro pistol with a battle psyker squad, reduce a units LD to 4 or less, then hit them with the neuro pistol at S9 and insta kill the entire unit on 2s.

Hard to set up, but could be a game winning shot, really cool against multiwound models also!

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

jeffersonian000 — GMT

Well, I'm going with an assassin specifically for their one trick, because it's the trick I want to use in my current GK list.

SJ

Re:The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

A-P — GMT

4+ Invulnerable Save won´t keep the Assassins going for very long with 2 Wounds, if your opponent seriously wants to kill a lone model. And the lack of grenades is just stupid. "A word in your ear" is still the most useful ability. Forget the old days of "one massmurderer wiping enemy units in close combat"- tactics. 5th Edition along with its changes on how Close Combat works were not kind to Assassins.

Re:The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Jerjare — GMT

I suppose they could update Inquisitorial Assasins to be useful in 5th, with rules that benefit the whole 'assassin' thing- like being able to allocate wounds in close combat rather than having the defender do it, having offensive grenades, all having fleet of foot, etc.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Kid_Kyoto — GMT

I've had good luck with the eversore. I don't use him as a lone bezerker but keep in my lines and then have him charge 12" to intercept incoming assault units.

Re:The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

killerb255 — GMT

I'm a fan of the Eversor + 6 Death Cult Assassins combination myself.

Considering that this is not just one unit, but seven different units, one can take advantage of this both in assault and going into one as a counter-charger.

However...that is a lot of KP...

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Emperors Faithful — GMT

I'm sorry, I have to say it.

Death-Cult assasins...Cheap, and awsome.

for 40 points they make the BEST distraction, really unerves your opponent, and if they DO ignore them the they can either be really annoying by harrasing large squads (they'll die but) or you can throw them at solitary heavy support squads (like Devastators or Dark Reapers) or even a lone HQ (better gang up though).

Re:The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

extermikator — GMT

Love the theory of killing an Avatar with one Callidus Assasin. There's a new Apoc list I'd like to try, where you can have 9 assasin. The ultimate daemon-killing army

MC

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Danny Internets — GMT

The real anti-lash unit: any troop transport.

Mount up and you have little to fear from lash.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Wehrkind — GMT

Yea, I used to use the assassins pretty heavily in 4th, but now they really are a tad overpriced.

Callidus: Word in your Ear is still cool, especially with mitigating your opponant't reaction to you getting the first turn. The neural shredder is fun and all, but very few units have Ld <7 anymore so getting wounds usually requires a 5 or 6. Her ability to assault after DS is nice, but not too exciting since it tends to mean you can have her assault units without any support, which means she dies with the new combat allocation rules. She is still very good at rocking heavy weapons squads in the backfield though, or shaking vehicles to prevent shooting. Still, probably 10-20 points overcosted now.

Vindicare: Way overcosted in 4th, and a little less now. Hitting on 2's is cool, but wounding on 4s means you have a 50% chance of wasting that one of 5-7 shots you get in a game. The more I used him, the more I hated him. Basically he has a lot of abilities that are worth 5 points, but stacked up are not worth 100+. Give him a heavy 2 rifle and we can talk.

Cullexus: Fun but kind of silly. No powerweapon is a huge issue, making the only real benefit the Ld penalty which is not useful against fearless chaps. The gun is cool, but 12" isn't exciting. He does, however, combo really well with Death Cultists, as they don't care about their Ld, have power weapons, and can infiltrate like him. Move him and 3-6 DCs towards an enemy unit, shoot them, then charge in the DCs and watch the enemy run due to not being able to get full advantage of their attacks (allocating hits to specific DCs instead of the blob leads to sub-optimal wound allocation efficiency).

Eversor: Probably still the best assassin, as he is cheap, has a mess of power weapon attacks, and can wound high T baddies easier than most. One thing to ask yourself is "Does my list offer a melee IC with T4 W2 and a mess of power attacks for 90 odd points? If so, is it better?" The answer might be yes, but then it probably won't be in the Elites section. Again, the Eversor combos well with DC assassins for a infiltrating blob of "OMG POWER WEAPONS!"

All that said, I don't use assassins too much anymore. Not being able to wipe a kill zone and the new charge reaction move really makes it hard for a model with a 4+ save and two wounds to live through a round of combat against a moderately sized squad, especially without grenades and the possibility of throwing a few 1's and 2's to hit. The DCs can make nifty little counter assault squads though I think, mixed with more specialized assassins for special ops.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Tri — GMT

Cullexus: has the most going for him in IG army and is Stupidly powerful in Apocalypse. Stick him in a and follow him with 2 full squads of Psyker battle squads and the Inquisitor lord. He's now spitting out 21 shots a turn at Str:5 AP:1 ...
Total cost 388 pts and will remove most targets (which will then run away because they're LD 7).

In Apocalypse sit him in a storm lord with as many Psyker as possible (you may also want to take more then one Cullexus) and then just drive up and mow down every one.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Wehrkind — GMT

Well, two problems with your plan Tri.
The first, and most minor, is that the range on the Animus Speculum is only 12". Not bad for holding off assaulting troops, but not much of a danger zone.
The second and most crippling is the fact that assassins can not ever ride in transports, so he can only walk beside the storm lord.

Still, your plan would be great for close firesupport for the tank

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Tri — GMT

completely forgot about that rule still he could hide behind said tank and jump out when within 12"

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

willydstyle — GMT

Wehrkind wrote:Well, two problems with your plan Tri.
The first, and most minor, is that the range on the Animus Speculum is only 12". Not bad for holding off assaulting troops, but not much of a danger zone.
The second and most crippling is the fact that assassins can not ever ride in transports, so he can only walk beside the storm lord.

Still, your plan would be great for close firesupport for the tank

Don't forget that the rules for the PBS also specify that they count as one psyker.

Re:The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Volkan — GMT

Don't forget that the rules for the PBS also specify that they count as one psyker.

The Psychic Choir rule only counts then as one psyker for the purposes of using a psychic power.

They all have the Psyker special rule except the Overseer.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

jeffersonian000 — GMT

The answer in Apocalypse is: take an Assassin formation of Cullexus' and a Stormlord full of battle psykers. Yep, its only 12 inches, but that is a hell of a lot of attacks!

SJ

Re:The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

willydstyle — GMT

Volkan wrote:
Don't forget that the rules for the PBS also specify that they count as one psyker.

The Psychic Choir rule only counts then as one psyker for the purposes of using a psychic power.

They all have the Psyker special rule except the Overseer.

Could you quote for me where it says that every model in the squad (other than the overseer) is a psyker, please?

Re:The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Volkan — GMT

If they only counted as 1 psyker then they would only take a single perils of the warp attackfor the squad when the overseer is dead, however every model takes one individually.

Under their powers they are noted as "the Psykers" instead of "the psyker squad".

And with Special rules: Psyker (sanctioned psykers only).

Nowhere does it specifically state that they count as one psyker for anything but the purposes of using a psychic power.

Can you show me the rules that state that they only count as 1 psyker for the purposes of other units and rules interacting with them?

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

willydstyle — GMT

I just wanted a quote so I could evaluate the wording myself, as I don't have the codex.

Re:The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Volkan — GMT

Ah my bad

"Phychic Choir: The Psyker Battle squad is treated as a single psyker for the purposes of using a psychic power. The controlling player may measure range and line of sight from and Sanctioned Psyker model when resolving psychic powers."

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Tri — GMT

jeffersonian000 wrote:The answer in Apocalypse is: take an Assassin formation of Cullexus' and a Stormlord full of battle psykers. Yep, its only 12 inches, but that is a hell of a lot of attacks!

SJ

Range 12" Strength 5 AP 1 Assault 38 or
times 6 = 228 (^_^)

Not to mention the special rule you get for having these guys ...

Culexus Temple: The presence of a single Culexus Assassin causes a mighty disturbance in the ebb and flow of the Warp.
When a group of them are present in the same area, their powers are merged; echoing, reverberating and resonating in a
manner crippling to psykers in the vicinity. The range of the ‘Psychic Abomination’ special rule is increased by 6” for each
assassin in the Execution Force.

that's 42" from each guy .... Eldrads gona cry

.... total points cost 1700pts

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Wehrkind — GMT

Yea having a half dozen of the buggers is a good time, though is Psychic Abomination the ability that makes psykers run, or the one that gives 7 Ld?

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Tri — GMT

its the one that makes psykers runaway... which is why we lock them in the storm lord so they can't run away

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

jeffersonian000 — GMT

Actually, that would be 6 range 12", S5, AP1, Assault 42 attacks if all of the Culexus' are within 12" of a Stormlord full of Battle Psykers. And if evenly spaced around the Stormlord, they would create a flat Psychic Abomination bubble 37" high and nearly 96" across.

Too bad 3 good hits from a Strength D weapon would wipe them out.

SJ

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Tri — GMT

? yes about the Strength D weapon but you've got the wrong range. Each guy starts at range 6" and then times by the number of assassins 6x6" so 6"+36" = 42". from each guy no matter where they are on the board (keeping them near the storm lord would be a waste since they can just relocate to it when it needs them.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

jeffersonian000 — GMT

The range boost is only stated for the psychic abomination ability, not for any other ability or attack.

SJ

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

willydstyle — GMT

Rather than trying to muck around with iffy tactics and limited-use units... just bring rhinos. For 35 points you get the ultimate anti-lash unit.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

Flavius Infernus — GMT

I've had good luck with a culexus. Forget the animus speculum--it's not that hot. The culexus works best as a disrupting unit, using mainly the Ld reducing ability.

I usually outlfank and try to park him behind some kind of LoS-blocking cover as close as possible to non-fearless enemy units (like vanilla marines for example) and then force the affected units to take pin and break tests from shooting casualties.

The opponent's backfield is the place to use him. Usually people expect an assassin to charge in to HtH, but most players don't know that the culexus is crap in melee (he should never charge against anything other than a psyker). So they divert units to take care of him, wind up failing the leadership test to shoot or assault, then have to stand there for a turn and do nothing. He can soak up a lot of fire this way and pin down counterassault units without actually having to take wounds or roll saves.

I freely concede, though, that it's hit or miss. Sometimes a culexus in certain matchups and with certain luck can totally disrupt an opponent and change the outcome of a battle, and sometimes he can get scragged immediately by a single lascannon shot or whatever. IMO he's a heavily underrated and misunderstood unit, though.

The Anti-Lash Unit: Inquisitorial Assasins

ketsugami — GMT

I use an Eversor quite a bit in my IG army if I'm playing a gunline style setup with infantry. He can't join a squad, so you hide him behind a tank, and hit anybody who gets within charge range. Ideally either a) they're nice and whittled down by fire, so he can finish them off, or b) he charges along with a big squad of guard. In the latter case, his high init means that even if he gets killed he hopefully contributes quite a few wounds to the guard side of the combat.

For 95 points, definitely worthwhile. His natural prey is Wraithlords; if you can put a wound or two on one, he'll drop it on the charge, which is great in an infantry horde army -- obviously having a T8 monster against a 50-strong squad is a bit of a nightmare.

Other assassin tricks: Vindicare vs. horde orks -- pick off a PK nob, and also his mask reduces KFF save...

And of course Callidus + PBS = Instant Death, some people claim, although I think that's dubious unless it gets addressed in a FAQ.