http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/93.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net MSU army and Butchers are more or less mandatory.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1157041.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1157041.page GMT
Ironguts are your friend. Besides the 1 unit of mandatory Ogre Bulls, You want Ironguts to really hit things.

Also, Gorgers and Maneaters are also your friends. Gorgers mess up Gunlines, and Maneaters with a Tyrant or Bruiser aren't going anywhere (As in, they won't flee)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1157098.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1157098.page GMT Ld 8, they have a decent amount of staying power.

The thing to remember with Ogres is, as you have stated, they are best used in the MSU format. This means that, although, they look really beefy and they CANNOT hold against large blocks. This is key. Use your speed and and fear to position yourself to take out the small units on the board. Your whole army moves 12 inches, so this should be easy. Go after weak/small units early on. Use any maneaters to defend their big units until you can hit with multiple small ones.

A good rule is, if you think there unit could give you trouble, it probably will. Ogres require a lot more finnesse then most people think. They are NOT an easy smash and grab army like Chaos.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1158591.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1158591.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1158613.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1158613.page GMT
1. Your units can't stand up to full combat res units (unless you roll really well which is more difficult with WS3).
2. Gotta get the charge or your going to be hurting.
3. Ironguts are much better than regular bulls.
4. MSU tactic is pretty good - take more models than expensive command upgrades.
5. Butcher magic is pretty decent, although magic defense is going to be hard for you. All of your magic is pretty much designed to support the bull charge and reduce initial damage and has cheap casting values - however - casting them on one dice is double edged because your opponent usually won't need that much to dispel them. Dispelling the RIP are slightly better though as they are at PL 7 I believe.
6. Gorgers can be helpful against gunline armies, providing you roll well for them to come in.
7. Don't run leadbelchers in big units as their misfire can kill the unit & cause panic tests
8. Tyrants are great for taking down big nasty things, especially if outfitted with the tenderizer.

Sample List I've seen run at 2250 (don't remember the magic items)

Tyrant
3 Butchers
1 unit of 3 bulls
3 Maneaters (go with Tyrant for stubborn combat res)
1 Gorger
Rest of your points in units of 3 Ironguts

Ogres are hard to run effectively - definately considered at the bottom tier, if not the lowest army in the tournament scene.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1158709.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1158709.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1158992.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1158992.page GMT MSU of Ironguts and basically saturate the board with Ogres, thus giving the opponent too many units to deal with?

Sounds like my kind of tactic.

Totally agree with taking a Tyrant in 2K or more, i can understand the use of tenderizer, but what about Siegebreaker?

Totally agree with Butchers too.

Has anyone thought of using Skrag? On paper, he seems to be a beast. Adding in more Gorgers and leaving the Rare choices to the Maneaters.

On the subject of Gorgers - always take at least 1. These things can really mess up someones day when they come on from a table edge off the flank or from behind an opponent. Many well laid plans have I seen go wrong because of a Gorger coming up the rear.

But what about Gnoblars? Are they worth taking?

I don't think Ogres are the lowest on the tier, but they are close. However they can be very deadly in the right hands.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1162540.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1162540.page GMT
Skragg is the most common version of a tourney ogre list from what I have seen. That being said, gorger spam is a paper rock scissors type army, since it trumps gun line. It loses even harder against block hammer than normal.

Gnoblars are actually one of my favorite untis. 2 points a piece for static resolution? The ability to shoot a high volume of "sharp stuff"? They work great against the normal rank and file infantry that people bring, keep in mind they need support from flank charging ogres. They can't take on more elite units that have high S or multiple attacks, but against normal 4/5+ infantry with 1 S3 attack, they hold up pretty well. Not bad at all for 40 points. If nothing else, you can use Rune Maw to redirect spell towards a throw away unit of gnoblars. I have actually seen a few lists that emphasized the gnoblars over the ogres, using the ogres to just be flankers for the little guys. It actually makes sense from a denial of movement point of view. I never owned enough to truly pull it off, but the 2 units of 20 gnoblars I ran never disappointed. Also the gnoblar trappers are very effective at what they do, and are cheap as scouts are usually priced. It also doesn't hurt to look at the scrap launcher if you are playing a list with at least a couple units of the small fry.

Ogres are pretty awful, they aren't as bad as beasmen, but beastmen are getting a new book soon. That being said my ogres never lost against VC, Dwarfs, or Empire. They won about 40 percent against WoC, but lost hard to lizards, any elves, and skaven. Lizards because they wouldn't budge, an the others because of skirmish style shooting. I beat the gunline dwarfs and empire because of gorgers and magic, and VC since I had volume of attacks, decent dispel dice, and didn't worry about fear. Also tyrants can kill a vampire lord in on round of combat. VC don't last long without a general.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1162650.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/268140/1162650.page GMT