<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "2500 Competitive CSM"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/14.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net 2500 Competitive CSM
HQ:
Daemon Prince - 155
Wings, MoS, Lash

Daemon Prince - 155
Wings, Mos, Lash

Greater Daemon - 100

Troops:
10 CSM - 210
Champ w/ PW, IoS, 2 Flamers
Rhino - 35

7 Plauge Marines - 221
Champ w/ PF, 2 Meltaguns
Rhino - 35

7 Plauge Marines - 221
Champ w/ PF, 2 Meltaguns
Rhino - 35

6 Noise Marines - 160
Blastmaster
Rhino - 50
Havoc Launcher

8 Berserkers - 223
Champ w/ PF, Plasma Pistol (not on champ)
Rhino - 35

8 Berserkers - 223
Champ w/ PF, Plasma Pistol (not on champ)
Rhino - 35

Heavy Support:
3 Oblits - 225

3 Oblits - 225

Defiler w/ 2 CCWs - 150

Total: 2493

So here's how the list works. My DPs hide behind the wall of 6 Rhinos and Lash my opponent's units around. The Rhinos will advance with the Zerkers and MoS CSM in front, which smash into infantry units. The Greater Daemon can be summoned through the CSM or a Zerker champ (preferably the CSM one) and tear up units in CC. My PMs will go tank hunting and support the other units by shooting to weaken them. The Blastmaster NM squad hangs back in their Rhino and camps objectives, lauching pie plates at lashed units. Oblits can hang back and pop armor and drop plasma templates, or DS if needed. The Defiler adds to the template onslaught until enemies get too close or until the battle cannon is destroyed; then it'll charge and support my other CC units.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1324854.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1324854.page GMT Re:2500 Competitive CSM
6 Noise Marines - 160
Blastmaster
Rhino - 50
Havoc Launcher


These guys seem a bit out of place as they have such a set roll. You have an entire board to play against this squad. then again thats something to test out...

seem solid over all..]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1326675.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1326675.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM IMO defilers are a unit full of compromises. they aren't really *good* at anything... are they? possess a defiler for a tank that means business when it drops a template. looks good.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1326830.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1326830.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM
GloryToThe16th wrote:IMO defilers are a unit full of compromises. they aren't really *good* at anything... are they? possess a defiler for a tank that means business when it drops a template. looks good.


Did you mean vindicator or something? Defilers come with possession. I agree that they really could be better for the points. They do have an excellent main weapon and can still be deadly even if it is taken out. I personally dislike them because the model is so expensive and it just isn't worth the $ for the stat line you get.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1326881.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1326881.page GMT Re:2500 Competitive CSM
6 Noise Marines - 160
Blastmaster
Rhino - 50
Havoc Launcher


I have to agree, these guys are really out of place. If thats all you got i understand, but noise marines are a very role based unit and since they dont have sonic blasters they are really just expensive marines. Blastmasters are point sinks, they really arent effective for the points. and havoc launcher on a rhino is generally a no no. Naked rhinos are usually best. If you want to upgrade them another twin-linked bolter is a good option.

Plasma pistols on the zerkers is a big risk. I have found most of the time, im not even shooting my bolt pistols and the plasma pistols become a waste, or i roll 1's and then my 36 point bezerker dies, which is a bit let down. Another thing to consider is, power weapons on the Skull Champions instead of power fists. It becomes 5 strength 5 attacks at I5 that ignore armor. Good for killing things fast, however not as strong. I personally prefer power fists on mine, as i hope the rest of the squad has killed enough for the power fist to survive and finish the job. But power weapons are cheaper and still effective. Its something to consider depending on how you plan to use your zerkers.

If you so choose to drop the noise marines and the plasma pistols you have quite a few points on your hands now. A suggestion would be bikers or raptors. Generally not my preferred units, however with that greater daemon on the board, raptors and bikers provide good placement for him to come in. Personally, you have more than enough troops so i wouldnt invest more there, and your heavy support is fantastic. Other options could be lesser daemons, you would have enough points to make a fairly large ammount of them for holding objectives or using them for a fast assault screen. I believe you have plenty of anti-tank, but termicide is another option. On the riskier side of things dreads and possessed are an option at higher point games. I find these to be undervalued units, but its a lot of personal choice and what you like.

Overall a very strong list, i just dont believe the noise marines quite fit.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1326901.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1326901.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM

Automatically Appended Next Post:
don't take blast masters. they're too expensive in a game full of 4++ cover saves. it misses half the time anyway, and you can't bring enough of them to seriously threaten most armored targets. imperials get basically the same gun in their tac squads for like 5 or 10 points. at that price i'd take them.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1327037.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1327037.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM
Also the defiler.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1327057.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1327057.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1327065.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1327065.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM NMs. I don't mind dropping them; I don't have the models yet anyhow.

The plasma pistols were pretty much point-fillers, but I see how they could be an issue. I'll take them out, as one in a single squad will hardly do much.

I was considering taking a small unit of flamer Chosen in a Rhino with a champ to deliver my GD. Seems like a prefered GD taxi from what I hear. Interesting you should metion lesser daemons. I've always wanted to try them out, but I've been unsure as to how effective they really are.

EDIT

I agree about using sorcs now that I think about it. The DPs could work in a smaller list, but in such a high points range, my opponent will probably be able to take them out easilly. Not sure which units to hide them in though. Probably the PMs as my other squads are more CC-oriented.
Still unsure about what to do with the Defiler. I'd think it takes more fire off my Rhinos.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1327134.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1327134.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM btw) the thing about a greater demon is it doesnt have wings and will almost always beon the board by turn 3. so definitely take chosen to get it out front. you don't want this thing showing up in your endzone on turn 2. at 100 points though it's really a good buy.

I disagree with the other posters about noise marines but if you want to drop them and still have an objective taker consider a 5 man unit of lesser demons. they are basically terrible at everything except holding rear objectives. but they do that pretty well.

consider a vindicator instead of the defiler. they're cheap, scary, effective, a wonderful fire magnet, and when (not if) the gun gets blown off they can drive around and get in the way. once in a while you get to shoot that big awful gun too, and that can be fun.

as an experienced chaos player i can tell you that a major weakness of our codex is that the rhino is our only real option for mobility, and at armor 11 it's not that hard to crack. my preferred solution to this problem is to bring vindicators, which can shield the rhinos by getting directly in front of them (armor 13 so they'll live longer) or simply scare the opponent with its big gun and attract fire that would otherwise bust your rhinos. it usually takes people a while to realize that rhinos are actually the better target for their artillary. which is fine too b/c then you get to shoot the demolisher cannon

let us know how your games go.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1327171.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1327171.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM
HQ:
Sorcerer - 125
MoS, Lash

Sorcerer - 125
Mos, Lash
(Each will probably be in a different PM squad)

Greater Daemon - 100

Elites:
5 Chosen - 120
Champ, 4 Flamers
Rhino - 35
(Greater Daemon taxi)

Troops:
10 CSM - 210
Champ w/ PW, IoS, 2 Flamers
Rhino - 35

7 Plauge Marines - 221
Champ w/ PF, 2 Meltaguns
Rhino - 35

7 Plauge Marines - 221
Champ w/ PF, 2 Meltaguns
Rhino - 35

8 Berserkers - 208
Champ w/ PF
Rhino - 35

8 Berserkers - 208
Champ w/ PF
Rhino - 35

5 Lesser Daemons - 65

5 Lesser Daemons - 65
(Backfield objective holders)

Heavy Support:
3 Oblits - 225

3 Oblits - 225

Vindicator - 145
Daemonic Possession

Total: 2473 (27 left)

So I added in some suggestions and now I have 27 points left over. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1328860.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1328860.page GMT Re:2500 Competitive CSM http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1329373.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1329373.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1329380.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1329380.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM DPs will go down damn quick, FYI Not much you can do about that really though. Icons and add an additional TL bolter to every one of your Rhinos. The 5 points give you extra shootyness vs. hordes and make your Rhinos a hell of a lot more survivable. Best 5 points in the Chaos book IMO. Very solid though. I'd prefer a 5-man Havoc Squad with Autocannons to the Vindi. Throw them on area terrain and get off 8 str 7 shots a turn as opposed to 1 Str 10 blast. Half the time opponent's won't even bother to shoot at them even though their some of the best dakka value-wise in the CSM dex.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1329392.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1329392.page GMT 2500 Competitive CSM DPs to sorcs. With 27 points left, I can add personal icons to my PMs and my Zerkers. Now every squad asides from my Chosen will have an icon. I think I'd rather have a Vindi than thse havocs since it takes more fire away from my Rhinos and can be used to block line of sight to units and so fourth.

HQ:
Sorcerer - 125
MoS, Lash

Sorcerer - 125
Mos, Lash

Greater Daemon - 100

Elites:
5 Chosen - 120
Champ, 4 Flamers
Rhino - 35
(Greater Daemon taxi)

Troops:
10 CSM - 210
Champ w/ PW, IoS, 2 Flamers
Rhino - 35

7 Plauge Marines - 226
Champ w/ PF, 2 Meltaguns, Personal Icon
Rhino - 35

7 Plauge Marines - 226
Champ w/ PF, 2 Meltaguns, Personal Icon
Rhino - 35

8 Berserkers - 213
Champ w/ PF, Persoanl Icon
Rhino - 35

8 Berserkers - 213
Champ w/ PF, Personal Icon
Rhino - 35

10 Lesser Daemons - 130

Heavy Support:
3 Oblits - 225

3 Oblits - 225

Vindicator - 145
Daemonic Possession]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1330403.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/278623/1330403.page GMT