<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
While brainstorming my way to a decent Eldar hybrid list(with the generous help of other Dakka's), I came across this unit, which is the single most non-HQ USR packed unit I've seen so far in 40k universe. Hit and Run, ignore cover, Furious Charge, Rending Weapons, Veil of Tears, WS5, A2, I6, 5++ save...all that sounds amazing for just one unit. On paper, that is.

But how good are they truly, in practice? Basically, I'd like to hear people's experience with them in play. If you field them, what kind of lists do you field them with, how many of them and how many you give the Kisses to? How do they compare point-for-point to Eldar's other close combat specialist units: Striking Scorpions and Howling Banshees...and really anything else that you can think of that might be useful to know about them.

Thanks in advance ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866400.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866400.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
They can be a very difficult unit to use correctly though, because even though they can't be shot at further than 24" (and even then, it's usually less) they are very squishy, T3 with a 5+ invuln is aweful, and if you do get caught out in the open with them a rapid fire necrno/tac squad will just tear them apart.

Even in the assault they can be a little bit tempramental, I remember 10 of them got the charge on a squad of 11 necrons...two rounds later and the Necrons consolidated with 7 guys left.

A popular list is harlequins and pathfinders together. The harleys give the pathfinders the 2+ cover save and the pathfinders just shoot away, hopefully pinning a unit or two.

Those are just my limited encounters with them though. Used in the right hands they are amazing, but they are one of the wmost tactically unforgiving units in eldar, probably even the game.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866488.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866488.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns

In all seriousness, if you field them, it should be considered required to have a Farseer to cast Fortune and Doom to help them. The drastic change to Rending from 4th to 5th and getting stuck out in no mans land after an assault in 5th edition really took a lot of bite out of this unit. So much so, I think they are extremely overpriced for what they bring to the table, especially when you consider a Farseer should be mandatory for them.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866493.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866493.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns HQ seeing as how htey have to roll to see the harlies.

Psychologically the Jester and the Shadowseer probably one of the most annoying things ever.

3 pinning shots coming from a unit I can't even see?! Ugh.
But ya, keep them in cover, it won't affect they're movement since they ignore difficult terrain.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866547.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866547.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns for me they're flamer bait, bc I play vulkan marines. at least against that army I feel they're pretty weak. Against others I couldn't say. The local eldar players seem to like walking these guys. I dont know if thats because of their codex restrictions or what but it seems like an exceptionally bad idea to me. Elite units like harlequins should never walk.
AF]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866553.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866553.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866567.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866567.page GMT Re:Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns atk unit which most people use them for. but they do help out in combat for me as i occasionally get my wraithguard stuck in combat. also i do see this alot from people...never use hit and run on your turn its just plain stupid, it needs to be done on your opponents turn...and you know who you are if you do this. now i do run a farseer with them as well with doom and fortune which as you all know makes them a beast in cc...cant argue with a second chance to get more rending hits in. all in all they are more suited for a footdar army if you do it right(*cough* more threatening units *cough*) . but if you decide to go hybrid with it, you can always toss them in a transport for better survivability]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866573.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866573.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866632.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866632.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866833.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866833.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns tac squads pretty good with or without a charge. I always seem to roll terribly to get range on them and end up having my marines be all like oops and just stand around fist bumping instead of shooting. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866874.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1866874.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1867459.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1867459.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns They behaved admirable in the qualifying GT heat at 2008.
But in 5th ed, rending became less effective. In my mech Eldar army, I stay away from them.
However, at the moment, I'm working on a footslogging Iyanden army and they'll find a place there. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868142.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868142.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
Just curious on this one.

I haven't played in 4th, how was rending nerfed? ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868240.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868240.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns DE harlies. w.e.

Rending in 4th, if what everyone says is true, was that rending happened on the to hit roll. So you could reliably expect 1/6 of your attacks in CC for example to just automagically cause a wound.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868247.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868247.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
Maybe DE get a 5th ed codex. But that doesn't mean that Eldar will get a 5th ed codex, too. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868312.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868312.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868324.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868324.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
7-8 str 6 pinning shots? Most of which rend? And I can't see them? Ugh. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868333.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868333.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns IC to the Harlies, they'll lose eventually their special rules.
E.g., if you add Eldrad, they can't fleet as Eldrad cannot. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868351.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868351.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns CC.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868354.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868354.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns inv save.
In the GT final 2009, my Seer Council came across a C'tan.
The C'tan wasn't able to kill Eldrad and then died horribly against my Warlocks. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868359.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868359.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868362.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868362.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
As for the rending in 4th, it sounds pretty OTT...and as for the Eldar 5th edition dex...dunno, it's already been 4 years, I've checked how long it took them to write the 4th edition one, and it was something like 5 years or so. So I think we can reasonably hope for a 5th ed dex in a not that long a time. But that's just my assesment.

And don't C'tan ignore any save, even invulnerable ones? Or is that just Nightbringer with his war scythe...I haven't seen a Deceiver yet.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868382.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868382.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns AS BAD as say daemon hunters, de, or necrons. But eldar do need it more then say, CSM=whiners.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868394.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868394.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns But they make a great counter-strike unit if you field a foot slogging army,
since the enemy cannot target them.

Harlies not foot are vulnerable when they approach the enemy.
Here one can use skimmers or jetbikes and throw them in front of them.
This will give them a 4+ cover save and with fortune, they should survive incoming fire, if any ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868403.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868403.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
Right behind them is a unit of 10 Wraithguard with Eldrad in toe, so they are always supported by Fortune and Doom. No unit in the game benefits from Doom like the Harlies.

I usually field them @ 2k like this:

10 Harlequins: 2 Fusion Pistols, 9 Harlequin's Kiss, Shadowseer, Troupe Master w/ Power Weapon]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868431.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868431.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868467.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868467.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868527.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868527.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns DE don't need Harlies. They have Wyches, especially if Wyches get a boost. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868531.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868531.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
wuestenfux wrote:@Envy: How about fast moving units (say with flamers) that can threaten the Harlies walking in front of your 'castle'?


Flamers don't really scare me that much. I'm still getting a re-rollable 5+ and you aren't going to hit them much because I deploy them in a line. You can probably get some hits on the wraithguard behind them, but you'll be wounding on 6's and I'll have a re-rollable 3+. Not to mention, if you've moved a unit close enough to my harlies to flame them, you are now in range of my Wraithguard, Avatar, 3 Wraithlords, and 20 or so guardians.



]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868629.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868629.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
I'd field Harlies only if they are well painted. I have about 20 old Harlies incl. 3 DJs half of them fully painted.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868635.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868635.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
xxBlazinGhostxx wrote:I don't think Eldar need a new codex AS BAD as say daemon hunters, de, or necrons. But eldar do need it more then say, CSM=whiners.

I'd like a new book, of course, even though I'm new, I see irregularities with the current dex and the 5th edition. But a couple of rule tweaks(with White Dwarf) would be enough to fix the most obvious ones. I'm not saying we MUST get a new dex asap, I just said that it wouldn't be foolish to hope for one within a year or two, that's all.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868656.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868656.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
Araenion wrote:Haha, a list with Harlies, Eldrad and Maugan Ra...gosh...
And don't C'tan ignore any save, even invulnerable ones? Or is that just Nightbringer with his war scythe...I haven't seen a Deceiver yet.


All c'tan ignore all saves.... So by by eldrad... Except if you manage to kill him before his initiative (but i don't think so).... Just for the record ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868661.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868661.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
wuestenfux wrote:Harlies not foot are vulnerable when they approach the enemy.
Here one can use skimmers or jetbikes and throw them in front of them.
This will give them a 4+ cover save and with fortune, they should survive incoming fire, if any

I don't understand what you mean here...you said they don't belong in a mech list, but that you can use skimmers and bikes to give them cover...]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868663.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868663.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
Mostly I was whining about people wanting a new CSM dex. At least it was made with 5th in mind. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868666.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868666.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868668.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868668.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns Three issues are 1) skimmer nerfing, 2) low toughness of scoring units, and 3) variable game length.

Harlies are overpriced as they were designed for the 4th ed and in the 5th ed, rending got nerfed. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868681.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868681.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
Pinning, while not reliable is just really annoying, and that you can't see him makes most people go out of their way to silence them.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868683.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868683.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
wuestenfux wrote:Eldar needs a new codex, too.
Three issues are 1) skimmer nerfing, 2) low toughness of scoring units, and 3) variable game length.

Harlies are overpriced as they were designed for the 4th ed and in the 5th ed, rending got nerfed.


I really want to be able to take Wraithlords in squads. 3 of em with just a Wraithsword and two flamers would be buckets of fun.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868690.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868690.page GMT Re:Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns WS:4 BS:4 S:4 T:4 I:5 A:1 Sv:3+ with fleet) Or perhaps a bit mix of orks for extra attack and furious charge

On second thought i could make one model like that
Space marine body, eldar head and ork arms]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868694.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868694.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
I'd like to see a playable Harlie faction, eventually similar to the old experimental Harlie codex of Gav Thorpe. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868711.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868711.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
a) take a small squad all armed with kisses, and put them in a falcon.

b) Take a dedicated transport for outflanking scorpions, decline to put the scorpions in the transport and put the harlies there instead on turn one.

Thing is, option b) takes up 2 elite slots, which leaves only one left for a dragon squad, and because of the shadow seer, any other unit that can take a serpent needs it more then the harlies on account of being so fragile.

The problem with option a) of course, is that falcons make terrible transports, they are built to be gunships these days, and perform mediocre at any other role.

I will agree though, harlies are excellent additions to wraithhost armies.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868718.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868718.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
I will agree though, harlies are excellent additions to wraithhost armies.

A basic question is how to deploy the Harlie in an advancing Iyanden army.
I'll play such a list soon, but now I'm waiting for a few Wraithguard to arrive from eBay. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868727.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868727.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
And Wuestenfux...I don't know about skimmers being weak...as a newcomer to the 40k, I find them quite strong actually. So I think at least a part of the problem lies in them being nerfed from OTT to average.

As far as toughness, well, only Guardians(which are completely undefined atm) and Avengers actually have low T. Bikes have 4 and Wraithguard have a whooping 6. So I don't think Eldar have much problem there.

About the game length, that's true, but I like that there's uncertainty involved, and I'm sure that with the next Eldar dex, they'll adress this apparent weakness of the Eldar.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868728.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868728.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868733.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868733.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns GW changed the way of shooting fast skimmers.
In 4th ed, a fast skimmer moving 12'' was only able to get glancing hits via shooting.
Moreover, a Falcon was able to shoot all its weapons after moving 12''.
These days are gone. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868735.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868735.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns PFs!
Soon they will be tearing it up in place of my Banshee squad.
One problem is they really require some good talent to paint well.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868748.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868748.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
wuestenfux wrote:
I will agree though, harlies are excellent additions to wraithhost armies.

A basic question is how to deploy the Harlie in an advancing Iyanden army.
I'll play such a list soon, but now I'm waiting for a few Wraithguard to arrive from eBay.


I deploy them as my leading edge. They go up front of my Wraithguard (and in the future I'm thinking of adding a foot council) and give my valuable scoring Wraithguard and guardians a cover save whilst being immune to shooting until I'm nice and close, which is when I do my damage. I deploy everything in single file lines like this:

-------Harlies----Avatar
------Wraithguard-----
-----Guardians--------

Wraithlords on the flanks. Mine have Bright Lances and Missile Launchers to try and keep any battle/demolisher/earthshaker cannons silenced until I can get close.
Make sure to use running to space the Harlequin's from the Wraithguard or else the Wraithguard can be targeted with blast weapons and still hit the Harlequin's. I like to put Eldrad with them, because his is thusly protecting from shooting by the Veil of Tears. When it comes time to assault, I drop him back into the Wraithguard and in we go.

I've only played two games with this list (both wins), and in my very first one I tabled my IG opponent.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868751.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868751.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns Undercoat: white and then bleached bone.
Then bright (complementary) colors for legs, arms, chest, and whatnot. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868761.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868761.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns
xxBlazinGhostxx wrote:I think guardians need a bump. I know it's been beaten to death, but still. The only thing they do better then a guardsmen is their higher I. And you expect me to pay 3 more pts for that?


Guardians aren't that bad. Shuricats are much better than lasguns. The 24" in range only comes into play when they stand still, and who is afraid of 10 lasgun shots? The Weapon platforms are great. They are heavy weapons that can be fired on the move, and I always take a Spiritseer/Warlock with Destructor(Heavy Flamers). I'd give them a 5/10, which means they're not for everybody, and really only work well in certain lists (Iyanden footdar).

All they really need is a 4+ save and maybe 18" shuricats. Maybe.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868770.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868770.page GMT Eldar Harlequins - thoughts on the dancing clowns SM way...you have to take one and you can take another if you field 10 Guardians. Tbh, I'd rather they stay with 8 points/model and up their efficiency than lower their point cost. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868790.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/313246/1868790.page GMT