<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? LD 5, I know that, however, what if I put a Lord Commissar with them? Giving them LD 10, and Stubborn, then when they die they will just come back!

Not fit for a tourny at all? Or would it have some potential? Any advice is appreciated! ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145207.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145207.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? ICs attached are killed and don't respawn. The ideal usage of the power as a 20 man speed bump for artillery sitting on the table edge. They can guarantee an extra turn of shooting against assault armies, but the question is: is that worth a fifth of your points?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145255.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145255.page GMT Re:Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? BS 2 with lasguns isn't going to do much, and if they don't die, the ability is wasted.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145256.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145256.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145321.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145321.page GMT Re:Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
Also, even with BS2, if you FRFSRF 50 conscripts at 12in. You're gonna do some damage I would think. According to math-hammer, that comes out to about 50 hits, if I'm correct. From there you have Str 3 so that'll bring it down to 20-30 wounds depending on the opponent.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145333.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145333.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145343.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145343.page GMT Re:Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? .]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145382.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145382.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145385.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145385.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? HWTs with lascannons can really give them that anti-tank/ heavy infantry that artillery can't provide.

Sounds cool. Go for it!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145397.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145397.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
I'm gonna do a game on Vassal with a list in a bit.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145407.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145407.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
Spending 80 points on a 20 man squad that'll give your guns cover and buy them an extra turn of shooting is probably efficient. Spending 200 points to possibly do that twice isn't.

Samus_aran115 wrote:anti-tank/ heavy infantry that artillery can't provide.
Also: what?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145421.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145421.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
When you add chenkov, they keep the cover save, but they also gain the ability to do unfortunate things to your opponent on objectives games, and have the ability to seriously disrupt your opponent if they make it over onto your side of the board.

Basically, it changes the game from "can I kill 50 dudes?" to "can I kill 50 dudes EVERY TURN?!" If you think you can make use of that, chenkov is probably worth it. Otherwise, just use them as the sabot for the rest of your army that they are.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145443.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145443.page GMT Re:Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145454.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145454.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? KP, but even in KP, they provide a shield for my basilisks.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145467.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145467.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
"the new unit moves onto the board from the player's board edge..."

Because otherwise, I'd play that guard army every game.

Creed+conscripts+alrahem+more conscripts....

... every turn 170 guardsmen show up from a random board edge...

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145470.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145470.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? for the duration of the game."

EDIT: Ignore me, Ailaros has it right.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145482.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145482.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145510.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145510.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145534.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145534.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
Of course, then the conscripts walk back on your side to cover an objective.

I think I almost like the ability to remove them better than the ability to bring them back. And yeah, you'll want to bump up their LD and/or give them stubborn and rerolls though various means, but it sounds fun, at least.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145940.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2145940.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
ElCheezus wrote:I think I almost like the ability to remove them better than the ability to bring them back.

lol, spoken like a true guard player.




]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146217.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146217.page GMT Re:Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? However this costs 220+ points. Just Chenkov, Kell and Send in the Next Wave for one squad. In addition you have to pay for a at least 40 conscripts (it is not worth it otherwise), preferably two squads (which adds another hefty sum for SitNW).
I did it only once, with a single 40 man conscript squad at 1500 points and it was glorious because my opponent was caught completely by surprise. However, I had to sacrifice basically my whole heavy support section, and a lot of other firepower. Which, dependin on your play style, can be nice or not.
Just a note - the conscripts are sacrificial unit, but especially with these outrageously expensive upgrades they have to be sacrificed for a very good thing. They require a lot of thinking and positioning, which is kind of counter intuitive - you cannot just throw the conscripts in the grinder.

Incidentally, adding Kell and conscripts without Chenkov/SitNW makes them pretty cool if you have some other command structure already (Lord Commissar).

P.S. In my experience you need to lose the conscripts two times(and gain a significant tactical advantage) to justify taking them in such an expensive way.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146261.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146261.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
Sure, they can get Send in the Next Wave (which makes them more expensive than regular guardsmen), but with Ld5 they run pretty much the first time they have to take any check, and keep on running. And SitnW isn't even that great unless you're playingwith zero objectives or missions and can just sit in your deployment zone all game. Adding a Lord Commissar just compounds your already very poor investment, and as already stated he doesn't get to come back with the rest of them.

I might screw around with Conscripts in huge games that are just for fun, but to rely on them in a tournament setting, much less a 1000-point tournament, is downright stupid.

@Plasminator: What the hell are you talking about? Listen up, Maggots! only works for orders, nothing else. And no, he's not "pretty damn good" in close combat. He's about as potent as a vet. sgt with a powerfist.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146363.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146363.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? BS, a lower Ld, no access to special/heavy weapons, no access to Commisars, no access to power weapons period. AND you have to pay extra point to bring them back from the dead?

They should be priced the same as Grots as they share pretty much the same statline (just without the extra funky rules), and if they were so I'd be more inclined to recommend them.

However, when you're paying 190points BASE (Chenkov + 20 x Conscripts w/ SiTNW, whilst not including the Lord Commisar, nor the two PIS you HAVE to include) you've just dedicated close to 20% of your points allowance for a glorified speedbump.

Outside of casual games where your doing it for the lulz my only recommendation is to avoid them completely. Standard combined PIS will serve you much, much, MUCH better.

L. Wrex]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146592.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146592.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146605.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146605.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
At such point levels, the opponent will have fewer tools at their disposal to deal with AV14, and 2 or 3 such targets may well overwhelm them. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146643.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146643.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146653.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146653.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146719.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2146719.page GMT Re:Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2147096.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2147096.page GMT Re:Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
(this is from codex as stated) Any unit with this special rule that is removed from play may be brought back into play at the beggining of the controlling player's next turn. The new unit moves onto the board from the player's board edge. THE UNIT (read carefully) ARRIVES WITH AS MANY MODELS AND EXACTLY THE SAME ARMAMENTS AS ITS FULL STREGNTH PREDECESSOR- it is treated as a new, IDENTICAL unit that has just arived from reserve.




IF I AM CORRECT this mean creed, kell, phsyker, priest, gay guy, squirll, commisar..ANYONE that was in the squad before can come back. Its identical to the other one when it started. it doesnt say IC's are excluded or that after they die they cannot come back. Is this a loop hole? take advantage of this?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2168064.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2168064.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? FAQ'd, ICs are lost. Might be in INAT.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2168201.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2168201.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? INAT, because it is in the GW official FAQ.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2168426.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2168426.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
5 point guardsmen are a better cannon fodder..

And that's coming from an old school Alpha Legion player who misses the old days of 2nd edition where we could send in cultists armed with nothing more than a sharp pointy stick.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2169378.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2169378.page GMT Re:Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
LD5 to LD9 stubborn

kill 5 conscripts and 15 men will retreat. Kill 19 guardsmen and they will hold.

tank shock 20 or 50 conscripts and they will retreat.
tank shock 10 regulars and they will hold and DOG you to death if you are uncautious.

The opponent does not need to charge the conscripts, he will just send 2 rhinos to scatter them and your whole first line is crying without even being shot at.

No, conscripts are not worth it.

And SiTNW just boost the costs of the "nothing" so that they are more expensive than regulars, but worse in combat....]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2178141.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2178141.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? LD. . . Lord Commissar, Priest, Primaris Psyker, Yarrick. Doesn't Chenkov also boost LD in a bubble? Or is that just stubborn? ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2178452.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2178452.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? Id take the cover for a turn or two and be happy.

The second Blob would be led by Al'Rahim of course with some help from an Astropath.

Creed would be ordering HW teams within 24 inches to Bring It Down (also using his LD10) to support Chenkov's advance.

Throw in 3 Stromtrooper squads with meltaguns for some diversity.

All for the cost of about 1850.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2178743.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2178743.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2179060.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2179060.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? lol an elite foot guard list ... ouch]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2179070.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2179070.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
kaiservonhugal wrote:Im liking the Creed/Kell combo with Chenkov and essentially using a small Conscript PLT to provide 4+ cover to Chenkov's PLT (all three elements would be stubborn and the Conscripts are rolling on LD10 within 24 inches of Creed to get back in the fight). I wouldnt pay the points to Send in the Next Wave. Id take the cover for a turn or two and be happy.

The second Blob would be led by Al'Rahim of course with some help from an Astropath.

Creed would be ordering HW teams within 24 inches to Bring It Down (also using his LD10) to support Chenkov's advance.

Throw in 3 Stromtrooper squads with meltaguns for some diversity.

All for the cost of about 1850.


God. That army is one ogryn squad and three squads of Griffons away from being the most spectacularly underwhelming thing I've ever seen. Moves like Green Tide, hits like a firewarrior squad. I must say though, I'm dangerously close to contemplating the 20 man conscripts squad. At least for a couple test games.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185164.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185164.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
Thanks for all the great advice and replies on this thread, if you are not to busy, or or are bored, would you mind checking out my new idea thread, and tell me what you think of it?

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/331514.page#2185135 ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185183.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185183.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? KP for your opponent? Or is that overridden since they basically are replaced by an identical squad?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185216.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185216.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? KP is awarded to your enemy, it is just like the Tyranid unit that spawns guants, after you kill the squad that is spawned, the opposing player gets the KP.

That is why it is a tough army to use in Annihilation. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185222.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185222.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
That's what I thought. As much as I love IG and know that our troops should die like guardsmen, I dislike the idea of handing over a KP that really wasnt earned. It's like Gen. Patton said about retreating from territory that had already been taken from the enemy "I don't like paying for the same real estate twice."]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185241.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185241.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185253.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2185253.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
revackey wrote:I'm kind of leaning towards ditching the blob army, and getting an Armored Veteran army, but its going to be "Old Fashioned".

Thanks for all the great advice and replies on this thread, if you are not to busy, or or are bored, would you mind checking out my new idea thread, and tell me what you think of it?

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/331514.page#2185135

Armored Veteran is old-hat, and not even that great in my experience. It absolutely folds as soon as something reaches your lines. All those "six veteran squads with meltaguns!" armies never really did very well.

The best IG army uses a combination of veterans and infantry squads. You can always use a blob for ablative armor for your artillery and to hold objectives, plus as a source of cheap heavy weapons. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2186523.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2186523.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? Yeah - its got a crazy number of expensive characters in it, no doubt. And Im sure it looks GAWD-AWFUL on paper.

Look past the characters and you'll find 150 guardsmen, 52 PW attacks on the charge from stubborn units, 9 LD10 BiD Lascannons, 2 BIG Infantry Platoons that Outflank supported by an Astropath, and 10 BS4 Meltaguns (some of which can benefit from BiD). This includes 3 suicide melta storm trooper squads to round things out (these could be more INF squads if I wanted though).

By no means saying its a proven tournie winner. Unorthodox - certainly.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2187193.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2187193.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...?
revackey wrote:Yes, the KP is awarded to your enemy, it is just like the Tyranid unit that spawns guants, after you kill the squad that is spawned, the opposing player gets the KP.

That is why it is a tough army to use in Annihilation.



The conscripts are part of a platoon, so for the Kp...doesnt the enemy have to kill off the entire platoon?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2192244.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2192244.page GMT Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? KPs are awarded on a unit by unit basis, not by FOC selection.

L. Wrex]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2192845.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/2192845.page GMT Re:Conscripts...? Yes...? No...? (I kid you not.) who later joined the fray.

Because of the wall of flesh, I managed to fire an unhealthy amount of fire power into the enemy and keep my army relatively safe with clear LoS. The cover save prevented MANY wreck/explode rolls on my russ'.


Though now that I look at it, I really didn't need the SitnW or even Chenkov, the Lord Commie played his part and the role probably may have been played better by a Primaris Psyker attached. Oh, and also, I had 50 conscripts when perhaps 30 would do just as well.

That's my two cents, it worked great, I lost, but I learned a lot, and that's what counts, I might incorporate it again as it really confused my opponent as to how to appreciate this covered blob firing at them from the corner.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/3423837.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/329464/3423837.page GMT