http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/14.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net
Hoping for some feedback/constructive criticisms for a 1750 point tournament in a couple of weeks.
Here goes...

HQ
Daemon Prince: 155 points
Prince, Wings, MoS, Lash

Elites
Chosen: 213 points
6 Chosen, 5 meltas, IoCG, Rhino

Troops
2x
Plague Marines: 261 points
7 Plaguers, Champion w/ Fist, 2 meltas, Rhino, Personal Icon

Khorne Berzerkers: 213 points
8 Berzerkers, Champion w/ Fist, Personal Icon

9 Summoned Lesser Daemons: 117 points

Heavy Support
Defiler: 150 points

Land Raider w/ Combi - Weapon: 230 points

2 Obliterators: 150 points

Total: 1750

That's all. Any comments much appreciated!
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3039847.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3039847.page GMT
You have 2 heavy vehicles, one of which is AV12. They will get shot down pretty quickly. if you drop the LR and Defiler you can get 5 more oblits. Those guys are scary in numbers like that.

The khorne berserkers aren't needed. I'd drop them for more plague marines.

Also, why have you got 9 lesser daemons? When they come down, they will get shot pretty quickly. and they barely survive, with no hitting power in CC. Drop them.

The chosen are not needed since, with this, you will have more obilts and plague marines with melta guns. Drop them and get another prince.

Either run them as you have now, or change one to have MON - Warptime, or MOT - Warptime - Breath of chaos. TL Breath of chaos is nasty.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3039871.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3039871.page GMT HQ
2 x Lash DP

Troops
3 x Plague Squads (as above, except one rhino has a havoc launcher for defending home objective)
9 x Lesser Daemons

Heavy
3 x Oblits
2 x Oblits
2 x Oblits

Total is 1750]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3039962.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3039962.page GMT
Also, I hope your princes have wings. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3040135.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3040135.page GMT DS one of the 2-man squads later on to create havoc in the enemy ranks. I'll get rid of a couple of daemons for the extra points required for plasma guns?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3040225.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3040225.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3040228.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3040228.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3043964.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3043964.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3043999.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3043999.page GMT HQ
DP: 155
Wings, MoS, LoS
DP: 155
Wings, MoS, LoS

Troops
2x
Plague Marines: 256
7 x Plague Marines, Champ, Fist, 2 meltas, rhino

Plague Marines (home objective squad): 281
7 x Plague Marines, Champ, Fist, 2 plasmas, rhino w/ Havoc Launcher

Plague Marines (support squad): 195
5 x Plague Marines, Champ, Combi weapon, rhino, 2 meltas

Heavy Support
2 oblits
2 oblits
2 oblits

total 1748]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3044138.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3044138.page GMT CC threat. Sure the DPs can scare some MEQ units, if they're small. But if they can get you're Lash Prince stuck in CC, then they're winning.

I'd switch out one or two PM squads for Zerkers. You're playing a gun line style CSM, an army that can kick butt in CC. Right now you have no counter charge units, and this is an entirely defensive army. Now there is good target saturation, and alot of redundency. But maybe too much.

But hey, if its not broken, don't fix it. GL.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3044887.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3044887.page GMT fzorgle, only because the current meta has lots of anti-psychic abilities. Savvy use of Lash can still do very well though.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3044933.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3044933.page GMT MoN and winds, and the squad of zerks. For the first time since ive been using them is this list they really worked, taking out 6 gk termies with one casuality. Keep them in, they make the list much more fun and although plagues are good they don't strike fear into anyone!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3045385.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3045385.page GMT LR, as the moment they disembark they'll just get shot down before they can charge if they're just in a rhino.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3046502.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3046502.page GMT
I like 2 lash princes, but it is by no means mandatory. However if you do play 2 lash princes, Berserkers are anything BUT worthless, in fact, they're amazing, even in rhinos.

The point of playing lash princes is to draw your opponent into a position to be assaulted, and no one assaults better than berserkers. Tons of attacks, hitting and wounding on 3s against meqs, and carrying a powerfist that gets what, 3 attacks on a charge?

I do very well with a list at a similar point cost with 2 lashes, 3x7 berserkers + Champ with PW or PF, a boat load of oblits, extra points usually just become mixed terminator squads or a greater daemon, usually both.

Then again, I play tau a lot, so when I swich to CSM, I like lots of assaults . ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3046568.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3046568.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3050917.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3050917.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3052682.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3052682.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3052739.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3052739.page GMT
I agree that you'd be better off swapping one squad of PMs for Berserkers for more assault power. You don't need a LR. You can drive up, using one Rhino to cover another, then popping smoke on the back one the second turn, then hop out and assault on turn 3. Lash and/or aggressive enemy movement may allow a turn 2 charge.

I also think you ditched the Chosen a bit too easily. They're really a nice piece to take out an enemy LR, which are extremely common when you're up against loyalist Marines of almost any flavor, or another important vehicle. They can also Outflank to disrupt the backfield against enemy shooty armies.

Try this, maybe:
HQ
Winged Lash prince: 155
Winged Lash prince: 155

Elite
5 Chosen, 4x meltaguns = 130
Rhino w/Combi-melta= 45

Troops
7 x Plague Marines, Champ, Fist, 2 meltas, personal icon =226
rhino w/combi-melta = 45
8 Berserkers, incl. champ w/fist=208
Rhino=35
5 x Plague Marines, 2x plasma guns, personal icon = 150
Rhino w/combi-melta = 45
8x lesser daemons = 104

Heavy Support
2 oblits = 150
2 oblits = 150
2 oblits = 150

total 1748
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3052758.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3052758.page GMT IG, trukk orks & tau. Dropping the 5 man plague squad for 5 chosen w/ meltas.
New list:
HQ
DP: 155
Wings, MoS, LoS
DP: 155
Wings, MoS, LoS

Elites
Chosen: 185 points
5 x Chosen, 5 x Meltaguns, Rhino w/ combi - weapon

Troops
2x
Plague Marines: 256
7 x Plague Marines, Champ, Fist, 2 meltas, rhino (one has a combi - weapon)

Plague Marines (home objective squad): 281
7 x Plague Marines, Champ, Fist, 2 plasmas, rhino w/ Havoc Launcher

Heavy Support
2 oblits
2 oblits
2 oblits ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3069523.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3069523.page GMT
You may want to think about dropping your chosen for another troops choice however, as all of us found it difficult to shift that pesky Vanilla Marines list from the objectives, and an extra troops choice would mean that more Plague Marines will be able to push forward and sit on objectives and not move / ram stuff, and we all know what happens when we ram stuff hehehehehe . But yeah, the Chosen sat in their Rhino shooting passing FNP Nobz and equivalents with their meltas and although they did down a few in your games I think that an additional troops choice would give opponents something else to think about in objective games.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3085402.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3085402.page GMT Next tournament I might replace them with something else, but 5 chosen with meltas still have more dakka than 5 plague marines.
Dilemma!
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3093424.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3093424.page GMT
The plague marines are tougher though, I think you only lost one squad all tournament? And that was when they were jumped by a 435pt Nobz squad, correct me if i'm wrong here, but either way, considering that 2/3 of the missions are objective based, they would prove useful (albeit expensive) camping units.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3097427.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/381378/3097427.page GMT