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Hive tyrant w/ Hive commander, wings, x2 scything talons, Acid Blood, Adrenal glands, Implant Attack, Leech essence, and paroxysm

Trygon Prime w/ Adrenal Glands (deepstriking)

Zoanthropes x3 in Mycetic spore with barbed strangler (for pinning when I jump out)

Zoanthropes x2 in Mycetic spore with barbed strangler

Deathleaper (for +1 to reserves, no scatter, and reduce enemy psycher's leadership)

Hormaguants x26 w/ adrenal glands and toxin sacs (outflanking via Hive commander)

Devilaguants x20 (termaguant with devourers) w/ toxin sacs in Mycetic spore with Barbed strangler

Devilguants x20 (termaguants with devourers) w/ toxin sacs in Mycetic spore with Barbed strangler

Genestealers x 9 w/ ST, AG, TS, and Broodlord w/ Acid blood, Implant attack, and scything talons (outflanking)

Genestealers x 10 w/ ST, AG, TS, and Broodlord w/ Acid blood, Implant attack, and scything talons (outflnaking)


So what do you think of this list? any changes needed?
btw, I have no hive guard, don't plan on buying any either. They just don't fit me.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4321744.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4321744.page GMT You would get more mileage out of your stealers if you kept them with TS only and your broodlords with ST only.
That alone saves you 155 pts!!!!
Not to mention you took BS on your pods. Drop those and save another 60 pts.
Just in those savings you now have 215 pts lifted from stuff that won't help you. You need more stuff in 2500 pts games.
Also, why drop BS and LW from your Tyrant. They are the best thing he has and will make him so much stronger.
Never deepstrike Trygons. They can't assault, they will be in the open, and are such a threat that they will be targetted right away. With the points saved for your steal upgrades get another trygon. They work well in pairs.
Your Tyrant doesn't need those upgrades also. Run Him :

HT: Wings, ST, BS/LW, Hive commander. DONE

To be frank there are a few holes need fixing and I'm hoping others can help you as well. It's a cool list but you really need more models rather than upgrades that offer no constructive support.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4322961.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4322961.page GMT I did put way to many upgrades on most of my stuff, I'll cut those out and add more units!
The reason I put BS in there is for pinning. If I manage to pin you when I drop out of the skies, then you won't be able to shot me = no casualties on my side! Or am I wrong and the BS aren't effective at pinning anybody?
As far as not DS Trygon, I don't want to have to run across the board, I want the ability to choose where he comes in, so I can choose better match-ups. Also, his shooting is nothing to laugh at, It really helps dwindle big squads down when he drops in nearby. I'll think about adding a second one.
I figured with Hive Commanders +1 to reserves and Deathleapers +1 to reserve, I'd have a 2+ for reserves on turn 2, (or do I remember this incorrectly?) and just have target saturation on turn two everybody arriving to help with minimizing casualties.
I'll remake this list after a few more suggestions and see where it goes from there. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4323149.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4323149.page GMT you I have a dislike for hive guard. Here are some recommendations I
have for you list:

1. I would drop a pair of scything talons from your Hive Tyrant and
give it bone swords and lashing whips. On the charge 2x scything
talons give you 4.44 hits, bone swords and lashing whips and 1 set of
scything talons gives you 3.88 hits. So odds are you will average 4
hits will both but you get the added advantage of lashing whips (which
are amazing) and you have an added chance to insta-kill with bone
swords. A set like this becomes an independent character/monstrous
creature killer. One other thing to consider might be toxic miasma if
you have the extra points. It will keep your Hive Tyrant from getting
bogged down in a tar pit of weak units; you want him to me smashing
big stuff. Also consider added regeneration. Odds are it will buy you
one or two extra wounds in a game and since you do not have Hive Guard
you are going to need the extra wounds.

2. If you can make the points I would consider adding a Zoanthrope so
you have 2 broods of 3.

3. As for the Deathleaper it is hard to say. Some games he will really
pay off but most you will probably not get your points worth. But if
you were taking him for the reserve roll I would not bother. He does
not affect reserve rolls unit after he deepstikes. So if he comes in
on turn 2 you wont get the bonus unit turn 3 and by then you will have
your reverse coming in at +2 with hive commander. So it is not really
worth it.

4. You might want use a smaller hormagaunt brood. You do not want to
wipe out your opponent on the charge because then you will be shot up
on their turn. You want to win combat on your opponent’s turn. Then
you are free to charge again and you have not been shot up. A brood of
18 should be about right. (I would use the extra points to get
Gargoyles with AG and TS (you can get ten for the cost of extra
hormagaunts and if you have free up some more points a brood of 12-18
is ideal)

5. I would not put a barbed strangler with the devil gaunts pod.
Spores have to shoot the closest target and have a bad BS. So you risk
the scattering on to your gaunts. I would put a non-template weapon
the these pods or leave a weapon off all together.

6. I am not sure about the brood lords. They are great for dealing
with really powerful characters. But against standard heavy infantry
your better off to just bring more Genestealers. So it really depends
on what you intend on using them for. But if you do keep them I would
drop the acid brood. It is an expensive upgrade that is better suited
to a unit with more wounds.

7. Scything talons and adrenal glands are not cost effective on
Genestealers. I would just use toxin sacs. If you drop the other
upgrades you could afford to bring 5 more genestealers and that will
do more damage than the upgraded units you have now.

Good luck with your army. I love the idea and I think it will be killer.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4324575.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4324575.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4324596.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4324596.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4324602.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4324602.page GMT For Deathleaper, I know I won't get to use his reserve benefits bc they only come in effect if he starts on the field. but that is fine with me. He is still great at shutting down psykers, acting as distraction, psychological warfare stuff, and taking out small non-assault squads (a.k.a. heavy weapons squads, eldar pathfinders chillin in cover, dang 2+ cover)
I'm keeping barbed stranglers on my pods for now, in hopes that I can pin a few enemy units down. If pinned, they won't be able to shoot, or assault me = no casualties for me!

Hive Tyrant w/ wings, ST, LW, bone sword, AB, TS (to make sure he wounds everybody bc I have bad luck with dice I like rerolls), Hive commander, leech essence, paroxysm; deepstriking
Trygon prime w/ adrenal glands, deepstiking
Deathleaper
Zoanthropes x3 in Mycetic spore w/ barbed strangler
Zoanthropes x3 in Mycetic spore w/ barbed strangler
Hormaguants x20 with TS, AG outflanking
Genestealers x10 w/ TS, outflanking
Genestealers x9 w/ TS, +Broodlord w/ ST, Acid Blood, outflanking
Devilguants x20 w/ TS (so they can wound anybody, even wraithlords) in Mycetic Spore w/ barbed strangler
Devilguants x20 w/ TS (so they can wound anybody, even wraithlords) in Mycetic Spore w/ barbed strangler
Warriors x3 w/ Lashwhip, bonesword, sycthing talons, TS in Mycetic spore w/ barbed strangler. (they deploy behind the spore for cover)

So I plan on turn 2, 3 having everything in. make a wall of cover, block firing lanes, block escape routes with the spores. deatleaper combined with shadows in the warp means almost no psychic powers against me haha! pinning with barbed strangler and target saturation turn 2&3 means minimal casualties.
I'd rather have objective holding/LW/BS warriors in a pod, then have raveners.
My main enemy will be footdar- wraithguard/lord heavy
I take toxin sacs on everybody because I've been screwed over by being locked in combat with wraithguards and wraithlords that I couldn't wound at all. Also, at S4 poisened, that means I get to re-roll wounds against Meq, and I love rerolls!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4335774.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/451611/4335774.page GMT SITW and testing on 3d6 is generally pretty good. For the costs of deathleaper and the warriors that's maybe 5 raveners and a cheap as chips gargoyle brood. Seems much better spend to me.

Cheap gargoyles are great for giving cover saves to everything bar the trygon. Who cares if they get shot up - at 6 points each that's what they are there for and with the wings they look far more threatening on the table than they actually are.

Best outflanking troop choice from hive commander is a tervigon. If you get the gants in range then they benefit from it's upgrades.

Toxin sacs on tyrant is not great against normal T4 troops. Normally wounds on a 2, now has a rerollable 4 for more points ...

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