<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Imperial question"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/31.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Imperial question
But I have often tried to fathom how the Imperial economy works in WH 40K.

How does commerce exist or even turn a profit in the WH 40 K universe, with the exception of the insurance underwriters.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4964741.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4964741.page GMT Re:Imperial question
There will be trade between planets in subsectors, facilitated by merchant ships(where the merchant basically is renting a Warp Drive from the Ad Mech)


Plus there are individuals called Rogue Traders. These are very powerful individuals/families that are authorized to explore and trade and actually own their own ships. They are even allowed to trade with Xenos. Many of the older Trader families have charters signed by the Emperor himself.

But aside from the rare event(depending on the planet) of a ship arriving, individual planets pretty much are left to themselves.


Traders won't even use money(the Imperium doesn't have a universal currency) but will simply barter in bulk.

Subsectors that are developed enough will have a Sector currency that is used, although travel between the planets is not common at all. Maybe 2-3 ships a year, several dozen at a Sector capital or trade hub.


The Imperium gets all it needs from the Tithes. Which are paid in whatever the planet can provide. Recruits are most common, but planets do also provide materials.

Plus the Imperium can requisition whatever it needs at any time, compensation is in the form of a tax credit.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4964773.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4964773.page GMT Imperial question raw materials. If there wasn't trade, they couldn't transport all the stuff they make.

The same is true in general. There's sort of this feeling that a majority of worlds in the Imperium are single-purpose. It's a hive world, or an agri-world or a mining planet, etc. This kind of specialization completely falls apart instantly without a proper distribution network. The only way it's going to work is if there are billions if not trillions of ships constantly going back and forth all the time.

Now, of course, this trade isn't free, per se. It sort of feels like there's a giant bureaucracy that tells every ship where to go at what time with what cargo, but there's still a lot of trade. Plus, as mentioned, a small amount of privately owned space-faring vessels owned by planets that maintain their own fleets, etc.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4964849.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4964849.page GMT Imperial question
 La Rouge Beret wrote:
This will probably show my field of work.

But I have often tried to fathom how the Imperial economy works in WH 40K.

How does commerce exist or even turn a profit in the WH 40 K universe, with the exception of the insurance underwriters.
The IoM is very dependant on the movement of goods. But because of its unimaginable size it does it in a strang way. Each planet is basically set up to provide one servise or product type/resource. That is then shipped to another planet/s to be used. This basically happens in two chains Mining world/colonies mine and ship it to Forge worlds/colonies. Who in turn make products that are shipped to where ever they are needed; usually war related. The other chain is Agro worlds grow produce that's shipped to hive worlds. The Hive worlds make humans who are paired with the Forge World's goods and sent to the galactic meat grinder.

The IoM take what it wants. The rest is what ever people can make off of the trading going on. With the small % of planets that are self sustaining.

So just like how the global trading works on Earth now. At least in the simpleist of terms.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4964868.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4964868.page GMT Imperial question
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4964873.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4964873.page GMT Imperial question
 La Rouge Beret wrote:
This will probably show my field of work.

But I have often tried to fathom how the Imperial economy works in WH 40K.

How does commerce exist or even turn a profit in the WH 40 K universe, with the exception of the insurance underwriters.


Think Roman Empire and you're on the right track.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4965214.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4965214.page GMT Imperial question
 Ailaros wrote:
There is trade all the time in the Imperium. I mean, you couldn't have a forge world that is literally nothing but factories unless they had HUGE imports of food, fuel and raw materials. If there wasn't trade, they couldn't transport all the stuff they make.


There is a difference between the moving of supplies and trade. Each IoM world has a tithe of some sort, this tithe is in the most part base supplies (food, wood, fuel, metal) which is then redistrobuted within the IoM. This is not trade.

Trade does exist however in the IoM but is usually on a much lower scale, working within systems or sub-sectors. Once a tithe is met a planetary governor can do what ever they want with surplus goods. Most likely it will be traded with close planets for other goods that the planet can use (a good example of this is Ultramar). There is also high-end trading usually between nobles and rogue traders, trading in exotic animals, alien weapons, rare gems, high end tech and luxury materials like silk and spices.


]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4968210.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4968210.page GMT Imperial question http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4968284.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4968284.page GMT Re:Imperial question OP's reference to commerce. Do you mean private sector commerce? Do you mean governmental level? For government level, see what previous posters have already written. The Imperium matches supply and demand for specialized worlds and deals in commodities, of which manpower is just one. There doesn't seem to be an Imperium-wide currency, though sector level currencies exist.

The Imperium does have noble houses, trading houses, and at least in the Calixis sector, corporations (that are structured more like a noble house than a corporation). These can and do engage in trade, however the time scale of contracts could very well be on the order of generations and start to resemble more feudal obligations than purely commercial transactions.

That there is extensive transport of materials is a given considering how hive worlds are described as being reliant on imports of food to stave off starvation.

For some glimpses of hive world society, try the Necromunda rulebook. In it, the ruling house of the planet, has a monopoly on access to space.


To the greater universe Lord Helmawr is Necromunda and the planet is his to rule as he pleases. The patriarchs and merchant families of the Noble Houses vie for his attention, and are eager to perform whatever favours are necessary to secure landing and shipping rights, trade licences and tax concessions.

...

The Houses are manufacturers of goods of all kinds,from foodstuffs to armaments. These products are traded with the Noble Houses and in this way the wares of Necromunda reach the wide universe. A complex but efficient trading relationship has grown up based around the competition between the Houses to produce goods, and between the Noble Houses to buy them.

p. 62, Necromunda rulebook


So at least on Necromunda, the ruling house extracts wealth by charging for access to space, and presumably also via direct taxation since the head of the house is the Imperial Governor. In turn, the Noble Houses turn around and hand down contracts to the common manufacturing Houses. The products are then bought back by the Noble Houses either for internal consumption or export (via the aforementioned landing rights purchased from the ruling house). Imports (such as food) are presumably bought and then consumed directly by the Noble Houses or sold on for profit to the lower Houses.

In the Imperium, industrial capital is held by nobles or by governmental institutions. The Adeptus Mechanicus for example is described as granting Armageddon the license to manufacture goods like the Chimera. In return, the Adeptus Mechanicus probably would get either a cut of the production or some other payment in kind, such as other hive world products.

Individual shipping is described as basically falling under Chartist captains or full Rogue Traders. Rogue Traders are the true free agents since they are bound only by the limitations of their Charter. Chartist captains run standard routes, via charts instead of necessarily having a Navigator, and are thus restricted to the same set of cargo runs. Considering the monopoly on technology held by the Adeptus Mechanicus, and the costs of ship construction and maintenance, I would imagine multi-generational mortgages on ships (essentially debt bondage) would be the case, with them being in thrall to either nobles or other such entities.

Now if we turn our hands to the area of finance. The vagaries and time delay of warp travel prevent real-time markets on an interstellar level. Astropaths are also not depicted as so common as to be wasting their time sending messages about mundane information like equity pricing. Also individual worlds of the Imperium are independent from each other, aside from the veneer of overarching Imperial government and culture, so issues of trust in settling financial transactions can remain. Now banking did exist before quick communications, via the use of things like bank drafts, so think pre-modern banking in terms of various branches having to write cheques to each other. While not 40K, the GURPS Traveller supplement Far Trader does an interesting bit on banking in a science fiction universe where travel and communication times are limited.

One key difference to also remember is the Imperium as a whole does not appear to be a consumption economy. Nobles may consume luxury goods imported from off-world, but the rest seem to either get by on local products or only on mandatory staple imports (such as food for hive worlds or raw materials for forge worlds). ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4968363.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/488116/4968363.page GMT