http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5005465.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5005465.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5005777.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5005777.page GMT
When he does bring them, he generally brings a pair and puts both in the same wave, then uses phelgm to blow things apart on arrival (and more often than not they have a few Tzeentchy units in the same wave to add additional firepower). ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5006496.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5006496.page GMT They can die in a single shot, whereas a Greater Daemon or Prince takes several.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5006504.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5006504.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5008643.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5008643.page GMT CSM to go with a defiler, forgefiend, and helldrake.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5010726.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5010726.page GMT
I run them with Phlegm this edition because you can get multiple S8 vehicle hits and it forces opponents to spread out their army (along with Flamers). At 1850 I run 2 of them, I would consider taking a 3rd to go to 2k.

In tournament play at Da Boyz GT I ran 2 grinders over 7 games. I lost a single grinder in less than half the games and I never lost both of them. My record across those games was 4-2-1 and I played Mech Guard, Space Wolves, 3 Grey Knights, Tyranids, and CSM lists.

I actually posted an analysis of these up here]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5010735.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5010735.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5010812.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/490486/5010812.page GMT