<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/14.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness

Hey y'all,

I've been a Dark Angels fan for a decade now and I just built my first list with the new codex. Don't worry, I haven't purchased any models yet. I just wanted to post it and give some feedback. My main opponents are going to be Orks, IG, SW, CSM and Necrons. Any tips would be appreciated. Keep in mind im not going for a tournament winning build, just something that is strong, themed, and fun to play. I write everything longhand to make it as clear as possible for me and my opponents. I copy pasted it in here so I apologize for the long scroll.

HQ:

Belial - 190
Sword of Silence, SB

Librarian - 150
- Master Level 2 (Divination)
- Terminator Armor
- Force Staff
- Lion's Roar

Elite:

Veteran Squad (10 man) - 275
- Sgt w/ Power Sword, bolt pistol,
- 5x Combi-plasma
- 2x Plasma Gun
- 2x Boltgun
+
Drop Pod - 35

Troops:

Deathwing Terminator Squad I - 265
1) Sgt w/ Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield
2) Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield
3) Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield
4) Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield
5) Assault cannon, Chainfist

Deathwing Terminator Squad II - 255
1) Sgt w/ Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield
2) Storm Bolter, Powerfist, Cyclone Missile Launcher
3) Storm Bolter, Powerfist
4) Storm Bolter, Powerfist
5) Storm Bolter, Chainfist

Deathwing Terminator Squad III - 255
1) Sgt w/ Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield
2) Storm Bolter, Powerfist, Cyclone Missile Launcher
3) Storm Bolter, Powerfist
4) Storm Bolter, Powerfist
5) Storm Bolter, Chainfist

Scout Squad (5 scouts) - 70
- 5x Sniper Rilfes
- Camo Cloaks

Heavy Support

Land Raider - 255
- Storm Bolter (pintle)

TOTAL: 1750

Reserves = 4/7 held in Reserve. OK as 50%, rounded up, may be placed in reserve.

Strategy: Scouts and the Land Raider with Deathwing Squad I inside deploy defensively, but forward, in my deployment zone. Scouts should be in hard cover or elevated on or near an objective near my deployment zone. Use scout and infiltrate to get into a good position to survive the first turn. Land Raider should surge forward on turn, at least 6" move and then fire all weapons to try and whittle down opposition's larger vehicles etc. that can put the hurt on the close-ranged Deathwing deep striking in.

Belial and Deathwing Squad II arrive via deep strike on turn 1. Depending on enemy, the Librarian and Deathwing Squad III can arrive turn 1 or 2, using Belial's beacon.

The veterans should land wherever is necessary in order to provide cover fire for the Deathwing OR to claim an objective and be a scary presence with their plasma guns. Use the drop pod to heard the enemy into the crossfires etc, and act as cover for my vets.

Use Deathwing Squad I as a hard counter charge unit should Belial or the Librarian get into trouble, or as a hard spearhead unit to push into the enemy deployment zone. Effectively a hard to kill tank full of hard to kill terminators. Possible Linebreaker unit? Land Raider tank shocks and supports as much as possible and breaks enemy units apart to be killed by combined fire from my whole army. Can quickly re-embark any surviving squads to nab a quick objective. Also used as a wall to block LOS of larger, shootier armies.

Scouts claim objective and try to pin as many units as possible. Basically a free objective for minimal points.

Again comments are appreciated!

-VardenV2
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5180999.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5180999.page GMT Re:Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5181544.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5181544.page GMT Re:Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5181577.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5181577.page GMT Re:Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5183460.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5183460.page GMT Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness
Anything that must start in reserves (the squads in the drop pods) does not count towards this limit.

Deathwing Assault is a special rule, and gets around the general rule of only placing

Units that would be succeptible to the normal reserves rules from this list:
Scouts
Librarian

Your Librarian does not have the Deathwing Assault Special Rule, so cannot be a part of the Deathwing Assault deployment. He could, however, be a part of a DW squad that would be deepstriking as normal reserves.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5183598.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5183598.page GMT Re:Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness
In this case i'm assuming that both HQ's and all 3 Terminator Squads will be in reserve? This totals 5 units, since your Independent Characters use up their own force org slot when entering Reserve regardless of whether they are attached to a unit or not. (page 124 BRB)

The BRB says that units that MUST start the game in Reserve, such as your drop pods, are ignored for the purposes of allocating Reserve slots. You therefore have 5 units in Reserve (plus 2 drop pods which aren't counted) out of 8 units in your force. That's 5 vs 3, I'm afraid you tactic isn't legal.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 nolzur wrote:
It's 50% rounded up that can go in reserves, you do not need 50% on the board.

Anything that must start in reserves (the squads in the drop pods) does not count towards this limit.

Deathwing Assault is a special rule, and gets around the general rule of only placing

Units that would be succeptible to the normal reserves rules from this list:
Scouts
Librarian

Your Librarian does not have the Deathwing Assault Special Rule, so cannot be a part of the Deathwing Assault deployment. He could, however, be a part of a DW squad that would be deepstriking as normal reserves.


I'm curious as to exactly where the Deathwing Assault rule says that the normal rules for allocating Reserves are ignored?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5183632.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5183632.page GMT Re:Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness
Enceladus wrote:
Correct, only up to 50% of your units can go into Reserve.

In this case i'm assuming that both HQ's and all 3 Terminator Squads will be in reserve? This totals 5 units, since your Independent Characters use up their own force org slot when entering Reserve regardless of whether they are attached to a unit or not. (page 124 BRB)

The BRB says that units that MUST start the game in Reserve, such as your drop pods, are ignored for the purposes of allocating Reserve slots. You therefore have 5 units in Reserve (plus 2 drop pods which aren't counted) out of 8 units in your force. That's 5 vs 3, I'm afraid you tactic isn't legal.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 nolzur wrote:
It's 50% rounded up that can go in reserves, you do not need 50% on the board.

Anything that must start in reserves (the squads in the drop pods) does not count towards this limit.

Deathwing Assault is a special rule, and gets around the general rule of only placing

Units that would be succeptible to the normal reserves rules from this list:
Scouts
Librarian

Your Librarian does not have the Deathwing Assault Special Rule, so cannot be a part of the Deathwing Assault deployment. He could, however, be a part of a DW squad that would be deepstriking as normal reserves.


I'm curious as to exactly where the Deathwing Assault rule says that the normal rules for allocating Reserves are ignored?


It says "making a Deathwing Assault" instead of "coming in from reserve" or anything else. Until GW makes their will known, reserves are not mentioned once in the entire paragraph. They released the FAQ with no mention of it, either.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5183751.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5183751.page GMT Re:Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness
I don't see what the fuss is about, personally. So you want to deep strike a load of Deathwing? Be my guest. You can still deep strike 3 units of Terms and an IC if you have 8 units in your force as per the above list. The fact that it's a new dex and people are getting greedy, trying to circumvent game rules is irrelevant. It's not legal, you can't do it.

In the case of this list, all i'd do is start the Libby on the table with the Scouts. After all, he can join any unit that deep strikes later if he wants to. Problem solved, list is legal.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5184397.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5184397.page GMT Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness
 nolzur wrote:


Your Librarian does not have the Deathwing Assault Special Rule, so cannot be a part of the Deathwing Assault deployment. He could, however, be a part of a DW squad that would be deepstriking as normal reserves.


Yes he does, look at terminator armor under war gear in the new DA Codex, and it states equipping terminator armor gives Deathwing Assault.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5184427.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5184427.page GMT Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5185501.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5185501.page GMT Re:Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness
Enceladus wrote:
Meaning reserves still apply. The Deathwing Assault rule doesn't create some magical wonderland in which Deathwing Terminators think they can be in reserve and not count towards the reserve allocation. If a unit chooses to deep strike it is choosing to start in reserve. If it's choosing to start in reserve it's subject to the reserve rules unless it has a special rule which says otherwise. Deathwing Assault makes no such reference, and is therefore bound by the game rules for reserves. It really is that simple.

I don't see what the fuss is about, personally. So you want to deep strike a load of Deathwing? Be my guest. You can still deep strike 3 units of Terms and an IC if you have 8 units in your force as per the above list. The fact that it's a new dex and people are getting greedy, trying to circumvent game rules is irrelevant. It's not legal, you can't do it.

In the case of this list, all i'd do is start the Libby on the table with the Scouts. After all, he can join any unit that deep strikes later if he wants to. Problem solved, list is legal.


I definitely understand where you are coming from. That 50% reserve roll must have slipped my mind. As such, I may be removing the scouts and swapping out one of the vet squads with a Land Raider Crusader. Therefore, I would have Belial, a DW squad, and a Land Raider Crusader (3 units) on the table out of an army of 6 total units that are restricted by the reserves rule. This would fix the problem.

I am still curious about the Deathwing Assault rule though, as it is basically worded as the deathwing using an ability that allows them to enter the table via the Deep Strike rules, not as in reserves. However, it would make sense that Deep Strike counts as a being in reserve.

I am simply trying out lists in my excitement so I guess this one will have to go back to the drawing board. I will update the original post with a new list soon if I feel that it could work. Be on the look out for some of my otehr posted lists though, and I am trying to get a good solid list before purchasing any models. I'd love all of your feedback.

As for the list, despite the legality of it, do you think it would be a strong type of list? to expand to 2000 I would add another land raider and add a vet squad back in, keeping that reserves limit correct.

-VardenV2


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Hello all, I have UPDATED the original post with a new list. Please leave comments about the NEW list from now on. I have addressed the issues of illegal reserve/deployment ratio and would like some feedback on the list. Thanks ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5185585.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5185585.page GMT Re:Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness ) and I read that you are required to take the Deathwing upgrade for Land Raiders if they are going to transport a unit of Terminators.

Other than that, my IG are quakin in their boots, the twin-linked deepstrike is insanely good! ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5185880.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5185880.page GMT Re:Yes, another Dark Angels list... 1750 shooty deepstrike madness
 Vladsimpaler wrote:
Hey man, looks good to me! Only thing that I would note is that I was reading some Dark Angels tactic threads (need to know more about the enemy nomsayin? ) and I read that you are required to take the Deathwing upgrade for Land Raiders if they are going to transport a unit of Terminators.

Other than that, my IG are quakin in their boots, the twin-linked deepstrike is insanely good!


From my understanding that rule only applies if it is being taken as a Dedicated Transport, and therefore not being used on the Force Org chart. I have purchased a regular ol' Land Raider for the Heavy slot and therefore do not need to buy the Deathwing upgrade... it will still be painted in Deathwing colors however haha.

I was contemplating taking combi-flamers for your IG, but I figured plasmas were more flexible and dropping in close enough to use flamers is pretty risky. Here i can land 12" away and still unload my hot plasma all over your guardsmen's faces (no homo... well, a little bit). Plus plasma vs our Space Wolf bud is always good... and against the slew of necrons, Chaos Marines and Grey Knights the GW has popping up now haha.

Thanks for the comments.

-VardenV2]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5185896.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/500917/5185896.page GMT