<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard

<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/17.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points
This is my final test of my Wave Serpent list and I'll make my choice whether to go Wraithguard or Fire Dragons.

Eldar 'Iyanden' - 1,650

HQ

Spiritseer - conceal/reveal & enhance/drain

Troops

5 x Wraithguard w/ Wave Serpent - Serpent w/ twin-linked scatter lasers & holofield
5 x Wraithguard w/ Wave Serpent - Serpent w/ twin-linked scatter lasers & holofield
5 x Dire Avengers w/ Wave Serpent - Serpent w/ twin-linked scatter lasers & holofield
5 x Dire Avengers w/ Wave Serpent - Serpent w/ twin-linked scatter lasers & holofield
5 x Dire Avengers w/ Wave Serpent - Serpent w/ twin-linked scatter lasers & holofield

Fast Attack

Vyper - shuriken cannon
Vyper - shuriken cannon

Heavy Support

2 x War Walkers - 2 x scatter lasers each
2 x War Walkers - 2 x bright lances each

Imperial Guard - 1,650

HQ

Company Command Squad w/ Chimera - 3 x plasma guns & flamer

Troops

Veterans w/ Chimera - 3 x meltaguns
Veterans w/ Chimera - 3 x meltaguns
Veterans w/ Chimera - 3 x meltaguns
Veterans w/ Chimera - 3 x plasma guns
Veterans w/ Chimera - 3 x plasma guns

Fast Attack

Vendetta
Vendetta
Vendetta

Heavy Support

Manticore Rocket Launcher
Griffon
Basilisk artillery - 5 x crew

Game: Dawn of War & Purge the Alien - no night fighting

Deployment

I won the roll off and decided to go first. I put my Serpents in the middle spaced out with the Wraithguard Serpents at the rear. Some Serpents would get cover from a ruin, though others were wide open. Lance Walkers deploy in a ruin on the right while Scatter Walkers deploy in a ruin on the left supported by the two Vypers.

Craig castles up top right corner using a ruin to block LOS to all artillery. He has has melta units at the front with the plasma units behind. All Chimeras are to the right of the ruin against the right table edge though one is on the left side of the ruin on it's own, though will get cover in the side arc. I'll note that Craig has placed his tanks very close together so if any are wrecked then he will have to emergency disembark.

* Tactical Notes

Craig has castled up nicely in the corner, but I can still get in some of his side armour as the CCS Chimera is sitting on top of the hill along the right edge and the lone Chimera has side armour mostly facing me, this will get cover from scatter lasers etc but not serpent shield!

My targets are the melta units which Craig has put up front, these stand more chances of penetrating my Serpents and if I use my serpent shield then I cannot save the pens. Even if I can shake the Chimeras I'll be happy.

The artillery can be a bit of a pain, but if I spread my units out I should be ok. I will flank the two Vypers down the middle of the board and get some side armour shots on the Griffon and then move onto the Manticore.

Once I am close enough I'll bail out Wraithguard and use them to auto penetrate side armour of Chimeras and use Dire Avengers to finish off what is inside.

I will leave the Vendettas to last and focus all fire power on one until Craig decides to jink or it goes down.

Turn 1

Craig attempts to seize and fails.

Eldar; Both Vypers come zooming down the centre of the board and land at the side of the ruin. Scatter Walkers come out the ruin rolling a 6 for movement. Two Serpents move up the centre between the two ruins while the others float behind using ruins for cover. Lance Walkers come out to play.

Shooting; Lance Walkers battle focus and run forward to get in side armour of the CCS Chimera and use the ruin for cover, they shoot it and take two hull points off it destroying both weapons. Supporting Serpents fire into the Chimera and booms it, CCS fails pinning test and two dudes die in the explosion - they pass morale. Vypers move flat out and are spread out nicely and the Scatter Walkers run forward. One Serpent fires into the front arc of the Chimera on the left of the ruin, I glance it another then punishes the side with serpent shield and it goes boom, squad is pinned though fails morale and runs off. Spiritseer's ride moves flat out and use a ruin by my table edge for cover.

Guard; tanks rumble forward attempting to get plasma units into range.

Shooting; mutli lasers, heavy bolters and plasma fire into the Lance Walkers and they go down, but it takes all units to do this. Artillery fires and the Manticore hits one of the Serpents mid field and scores immobilised. Basilisk fires at the Scatter Walkers and misses while the Griffon hits if I remember right and does nothing.

Kill Points - Eldar: 3 Imperial Guard: 1

* Tactical Notes

A good start for the Eldar; CCS tank is opened up, so I just need to shoot into them and get myself another kill point. Another Chimera has gone down and the squad inside has headed for the hills, something I do not have to worry about.

In return I have lost some War Walkers and lost a hull point on a Serpent, over all I do not think I can complain.

Next turn I shall send the Vypers along Craig's table edge and fire into side armour of the Griffon. The Griffon isn't bothering me, but judging on range it is all I am going to get with the Vypers.

I'll then position my Serpents to get side armour and bring the Scatter Walkers up. With some good rolls I hope I can take out another two Chimeras and the Griffon.

Turn 2

Eldar; Vypers move 12" towards Craig's table edge, one is easy in range the other is just in range of the Griffon. One Serpent lands mid field so can get side armour on another Chimera, I know this exposes my rear to Vendettas, but I hope holofields do well for me. I move up War Walkers and another Serpernt to support while the two Wraithguard Serpents move to confront the Chimera wall and hopefully keep distance between Vendettas - I am hoping Craig takes the bait of the rear armour of the Serpent and means I can dance back under him in future turns and I've got cover from ruins too.

Shooting; Vypers shoot into the Griffon's side armour and total it. Serpents supported by War Walkers fire into the Chimeras, after the dust has settled only two remain and one has lost a hull point. Two Chimeras have exploded, one squad is stunned while the other is shaken as well - the explosion practically wipes out the CCS and the lone Commander fails morale and falls back, a melta unit also fails morale and falls back - the explosion had killed two of the melta guys so limited meltas for me to worry about.

Reserves are rolled at all Vendettas arrive, as predicted they come in behind the Serpent with the rear armour exposed.

Guard; Commander fails to regroup on a double 1 and runs off the board giving me a kill point. The other unit regroups, but luckily for me only have a single meltagun and only snap firing now. In addition the nearby damaged plasma unit from the other exploded Chimera only have a single plasma gun and the other remaining plasma unit is stunned. This leaves a full strength melta unit in the Chimera which has two hull points left and a full strength plasma unit in the untouched Chimera. The untouched Chimeras rumbles forward while the damaged Chimera moves up, rotates so rear is exposed and melta unit jumps out ready to toast a Wave Serpent.

Shooting; The rear of the Serpent in the middle is too much temptation for Craig and he takes the bait, it takes ALL three Vendettas to put it down after very good holofield saves - squad is only stunned then. Melta unit who just got out the tank fire at a Wraithguard Serpent, hit once and I save the damage. Plasma fires into the Spiritseer's ride and only glances it, which I fail. Chimeras do nothing as does the snap firing melta unit. Manticore bombs the War Walkers and I make the invulnerable saves while Basilisk fires into the Serpent the meltas tried shooting at and holofield again makes the save.

Kill Points - Eldar: 7 Imperial Guard: 2

* Tactical Notes

An extremely good turn for me for saves, I cannot believe the amount of 5+ I rolled even though mostly needing 4+. All I have lost this turn is a Wave Serpent and a hull point, I really cannot complain at all. I think the best bit was having three Vendettas taking out a single Wave Serpent, damn did that thing absorb some fire power.

Next turn I'll move the stunned Avengers into the centre ruin for cover. Vypers will advance and side armour the Manticore. Wraithguard will bail out and sort out Chimeras side armour while Serpents will fire into the Veterans and finish them off with scatter laser support. It's possible I could get a Serpent to fire through the ruin at the Manticore.

Turn 3

Eldar; Wave Serpents carrying the Wraithguard move up and the Wraithguard bail out, Spiritseer marks the Chimera with rear armour facing me. War Walkers flank across towards the Wraithguard Serpents to dakka the exposed melta Veterans. Remaining Serpent drops in front of the ruin where the Manticore is positioned. Stunned Avengers move into terrain and use the upper ruin floors to stop ordnance bombardment. Vypers move up to tackle the Manticore.

Shooting; Wraithguard fire into the untouched Chimera, it gets cover from wrecks but is destroyed - squad is stunned. Other Wraithguard make the other Chimera go boom, kills two Guardsmen from the melta unit who fired into the Serpent. Serpents and War Walkers fire into the troops, melta unit has a single man left who passes morale while the depleted melta unit which regrouped is completely destroyed - just a two man plasma unit left holding one plasma gun in front of me now. Vypers dakka the side armour of the Manticore and it has a single hull point left. The Serpent sitting at the front moves flat out and lands behind the big ruin close to where the single melta gun dude is. Immobilised Serpent fires into the closest Vendetta and fails to damage it.

Guard; Vendettas move to blast the rear of the Vypers, I think Craig has had enough of them now. The remaining Vendetta aims for the immobilised Serpent. The solo survivor from the melta unit moves into a ruin for cover, only has a lasgun so doesn't threaten me. The remaining plasma unit moves up to get side armour on the Wave Serpent close to the right table edge, Spiritseer is in here.

Shooting; Vendetta fires into the immobilised Wave Serpent, I get a 6+ thanks to holofield and it survives - takes the Manticore to finish it off. Both Vypers go down pretty easily to lascannons though. Plasma fires into side armour of the Spiritseer's ride and manages to destroy thge shuri catapult. Bassie drops on a unit of Wraithguard and completely wipes them out. That's it for Guard!

Kill Points - Eldar: 10 Imperial Guard: 6

* Tactical Notes

Wow, Imperial Guard are really getting mopped up here. The Guard have ran out of tanks and the only one left is the Manticore. There's also little infantry left too and now it comes down to the flyers. I just hope I do not lose too many Serpents and that I can take down the Vendettas before they take me down.

Turn 4

Eldar; I zip the empty Wraithguard Serpent down the right flank so it can get side armour on the Manticore. Spiritseer's ride hangs back as does the blue Serpent. Avengers in the centre ruin move out so get in rear of the Vendetta while the other two by the Wave Serpents move into the ruin and are ready to dakka the lone survivor.

Shooting; Wave Serpent dakkas the side armour of the Manticore and it is toast. Solo survivor goes down to bladestorm and the two man plasma unit gets chewed up. Blue Serpent fires into the depleted remaining plasma unit, doesn't kill many. Wraithguard fire into the Bassie artillery, kills a single dude.

Guard; Vendettas move up and get in my face while the plasma unit moves about and a spotter for the Bassie comes out from behind the ruin.

Shooting; Vendettas fire into the blue Serpent and take it down, the one by the Manticore wreck and holofields save and into the Spiritseer's ride and take off another hull point. Bassie drops on the remaining Wraithguard and with plasma support finishes them off.

Kill Points - Eldar: 13 Imperial Guard: 8

* Tactical Notes

Looks like Guard are catching up on me now, though we have agreed to call it a day next turn and I think I have this in the bag. If I can take out that damaged Vendetta and last troop unit I'll be happy.

On another note I made a right dumb ass mistake and forgot to assault the Wraithguard into the artillery, would have smashed that unit and the artillery would have been destroyed. Ah well, force of habit as used to them getting out of a Wave Serpent and then shooting.

Turn 5

Eldar; Dire Avengers shoot into the rear of the damaged Vendetta and fail to take it out. Spiritseer's Serpent fires into it as well, fails to damage it. Remaining Serpent fires into the remaining plasma unit, kills three and squad remains.

Guard; Wave Serpent by the plasma unit gets taken out, though Spiritseer's ride survives - all Vendettas drop into hover mode.

We must have got mixed up and played another turn, basically on turn 6 (what we thought was turn 5) Avengers assaulted one Vendetta (failed to reach another) after the last Serpent immobilised it. The Vendetta got wrecked by plasma grenades though the Spiritseer's ride got took out by the Basilisk and the Spiritseer got gibbed by lascannons.

Kill Points - Eldar: 14 Imperial Guard: 12

As this was tournament practice for Craig we did not use secondary, though I would have got slay the warlord and first blood and Craig would have got slay the warlord.

Summary

After that battle I am going to have to say that Eldar are a top tier codex. I have always thought that Mech Guard is a very tough army and perhaps the best build in 40k, though Eldar just chewed them up easily - get in the side armour and unleash serpent shield and scatter lasers.

Craig caught up nicely in the end, turn 2 I had some cracking saves and after that the turned average. A pity my War Walkers and Vypers couldn't save anything later on.

I think Craig would have done better perhaps going for the Wraith Serpents, this would have left them stranded in the open and would take them some serious time to get into shooting range. Of course going first would help too, though this is just luck.

I made a boo boo myself and forgot to assault the Basilisk artillery with the Wraithguard, if this would have happened the artillery no doubt would have been destroyed and I probably would have had a Wraithguard unit and War Walker unit left, which possible could have taken out a Vendetta or the remaining plasma unit. Mental note made!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854222.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854222.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points
I'm wondering what would your list do with wraith knights x 2 + wave serpents instead of some of the other support elements like vypers though I think this becomes more flavor choices instead.

Btw, if you guys have enough tanks, want to try an armored battle group vs the wave serpents? Should be a fun match up.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854273.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854273.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points
How many tanks consider of an armoured battle group?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854372.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854372.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points

mercer wrote:
I am not a fan of the Wraithknights if I am honest. I think people big them up when really they are not that good. I would rather spend points on other units which I like better.

How many tanks consider of an armoured battle group?

It will probably be something like:

LRBT/vanquisher or w/e variant Company commander - obtained for special ammo and as mandantory choice
Commisar tank (LRBT or variant) - obtained for special ammo
Techpriest in Trojan (or proxy chimera) as elite giving preferred enemy everything to things

3 LRBT/varients as troops
3 LRBT/varients as troops (personally one squad of LRBT's as troops is enough generally - I'd rather take cheap divination rune priest ally for twin link something or other)
Chimera vets (6 man) as troops
Chimera vets (6 man) as troops

Artillery support as you'd like heavies
Vendettas/valks/vultures as Fast attack

The wraithknight is basically a big beatstick and while not as killy as a squad of warwalkers, it's really hard to kill (almost unfairly hard for a lot of basic lists) Also it's fast enough to wipe up a lot of MSU squads and the 2 str 10 shots is enough to threaten quite a lot of stuff even in default mode like vs FMC daemon princes or some nids if you happen to get enfeeble.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854418.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854418.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854506.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854506.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points
Keep in mind though that Holofields only kick in if you move so when you wrote "Shooting; Vendetta fires into the immobilised Wave Serpent, I get a 6+ thanks to holofield and it survives" this was technically a wrong application of holofields =).

How did the Wraithguard do for you? I usually try to have 2 regular with a unit of d-scythe and that works out well for me.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854639.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854639.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854674.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5854674.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5855017.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5855017.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points

mercer wrote:
Is that an apocalypse thing or something?

It is forge world but for regular 40k. Imperial armor vol 1 version 2]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5855813.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5855813.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points

deathmagiks wrote:
I think the codex, if I recall correctly, states you have a 6+ if you don't move.

The codex says you get +1 cover save if you move so it is impossible to get a 6+ if you do not move...Holofields become useless if you become immobilized. So you did not recall correctly =(.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5856210.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5856210.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points

mortetvie wrote:Nice report, good to see Eldar kicking butt.

Keep in mind though that Holofields only kick in if you move so when you wrote "Shooting; Vendetta fires into the immobilised Wave Serpent, I get a 6+ thanks to holofield and it survives" this was technically a wrong application of holofields =).

How did the Wraithguard do for you? I usually try to have 2 regular with a unit of d-scythe and that works out well for me.

Yeah, you're totally right. I thought you got a 6+ save if you didn't move and then a +1 if you did move. Ah well live and learn, wasn't a game changer.

The Wraithguard destroy the standard transports with ease. In fact they destroy anything with ease except av14, but with spiritmark and two units firing at av14 I think I should be ok. I think the d-scythe is too expensive and should be a straight swap.

Marthike wrote:why take vyper when you can take more walkers

Not enough points, the Vypers are only 60 points each and that would only get me a single War Walker with points spare. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5877433.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5877433.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5879536.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5879536.page GMT Eldar Serpent Spam vs Mech Guard - 1650 points ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5884436.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/540407/5884436.page GMT