Icculus wrote:
So I am going to be playing a tau army soon and I think it is going to be 750 points. This is my brother's army and he is usually really good at beating me in strategy games, so I want to destroy him. I need to be as competitive as possible in this situation. WAAC sort of thing. From what I know he will have an ethereal, a few fire warriors and some crisis suits. At least I think thats what he has. not sure what else there will be. He lives a few states over and Im going to be there in October.

This is what I am thinking so far.

Warboss, bike, pk, bp, cybork = 140
3 nob bikers, painboy, PK, cyborks = 200
5 lootas = point cost of 5 lootas
5 kommandos w/ 2 flamers = 80
12 boyz, nob, bp = 87
12 boyz, nob, bp = 87
Trukk, ram = 40
Trukk, ram = 40
Total = 749


at my disposal i have
40 boyz
8 nobs
3 battlewagons w/ deff rollas
2 trukks which are also looted wagons
2 deffkoptas
1 deff dread
1 weirdboy
1 warboss. I have proxied him as a big mek a couple times
1 deff dread
3 warbuggies
5 warbikers/nob bikers
1 bikerboss
5 lootas
2 burnas

 Delevarius wrote:
Are those boyz shootas or sluggas?
Boyz spam is always effective on lower points, but not as fun.
Deffkoptas are awesome vs Tau if they have TL Rokkits
3x Trukkboyz
KKF Bigmek
2x 1man Deffkoptas /w TL Rokkits
5x Lootas
this should be a good and fun list

 Icculus wrote:
Thats a good idea, I know the BWs are pretty tough but in the larger point games I have been playing it's always the nob bikers that shine, but they are so expensive at 750 its not even right.

So yeah, just get the two av14 BWs with a few lootas in the back. makes perfect sense. I think the simplest most straight forward list should be the most effective. Having played trukks before I have seen how fragile they are. But if we end up playing objectives it may be nice to have 3 troop choices. i may keep both of these ideas handy and see what he is playing with.

Maybe if I squeeze in a few points here and there I can get the deffkopta in. just keep it to 5 lootas, drop the skorcha, drop the RPJs, drop a big shoota. Meh, I'm not sure if it would be worth it to get one deffkopta. It would smoked pretty quickly. and even if it is TL, thats still a BS of 2.

 Orkimedezz wrote:

 Icculus wrote:
Thats a good idea, I know the BWs are pretty tough but in the larger point games I have been playing it's always the nob bikers that shine, but they are so expensive at 750 its not even right.

So yeah, just get the two av14 BWs with a few lootas in the back. makes perfect sense. I think the simplest most straight forward list should be the most effective. Having played trukks before I have seen how fragile they are. But if we end up playing objectives it may be nice to have 3 troop choices. i may keep both of these ideas handy and see what he is playing with.

Maybe if I squeeze in a few points here and there I can get the deffkopta in. just keep it to 5 lootas, drop the skorcha, drop the RPJs, drop a big shoota. Meh, I'm not sure if it would be worth it to get one deffkopta. It would smoked pretty quickly. and even if it is TL, thats still a BS of 2.

the nob bikers vs tau are pointless. they loss there 4+ cover and are left with feel no pain. to costly at 750pts
trukks give firstblood so at low points 1 point means alot.
and if your in kill points 1 squad deffkopptas are to poop. witch they also loss there jinx vs tau.
i like the skortcha cus you can cover a squad of fire warriors with it and kill a good amout.
im very curious as to how this would go. if you would play 2 games i would love to see what you think of both lists and witch felt better vs tau
But if you can find a good proxy for a squad of bigguns! kannons would do great vs tau! you got t7 grots tanking for the gun with a 32" range

 Icculus wrote:

 Orkimedezz wrote:

 Icculus wrote:
Thats a good idea, I know the BWs are pretty tough but in the larger point games I have been playing it's always the nob bikers that shine, but they are so expensive at 750 its not even right.

So yeah, just get the two av14 BWs with a few lootas in the back. makes perfect sense. I think the simplest most straight forward list should be the most effective. Having played trukks before I have seen how fragile they are. But if we end up playing objectives it may be nice to have 3 troop choices. i may keep both of these ideas handy and see what he is playing with.

Maybe if I squeeze in a few points here and there I can get the deffkopta in. just keep it to 5 lootas, drop the skorcha, drop the RPJs, drop a big shoota. Meh, I'm not sure if it would be worth it to get one deffkopta. It would smoked pretty quickly. and even if it is TL, thats still a BS of 2.

the nob bikers vs tau are pointless. they loss there 4+ cover and are left with feel no pain. to costly at 750pts
trukks give firstblood so at low points 1 point means alot.
and if your in kill points 1 squad deffkopptas are to poop. witch they also loss there jinx vs tau.
i like the skortcha cus you can cover a squad of fire warriors with it and kill a good amout.
im very curious as to how this would go. if you would play 2 games i would love to see what you think of both lists and witch felt better vs tau
But if you can find a good proxy for a squad of bigguns! kannons would do great vs tau! you got t7 grots tanking for the gun with a 32" range

Actually, i never thought about it before, but my looted wagons/trukks have the boom gun detachable. I could proxy the boomguns as big guns. I would only have two of them though.

morfydd wrote:
Hrmmn just you and your brother ..then its time for a bit a nice Freindly competitive list
Do you have access to Imperial Armour Volume 8 ?

 Icculus wrote:
Warboss, pk, ‘eavy, bp, kombi-skorcha, cybork = 110
20 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, bp, pk, 2 big shootas = 169
19 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, big shoota = 134
Battlewagon deff rolla, RPJ, 2 big shoota = 125
Battlewagon deff rolla, RPJ, 2 big shoota = 125
3 kannons, 6 extra crew, 3 ammo runts = 87


Hows this?

Total = 750

 Icculus wrote:
when i do 20 boyz, nob, big shootas, I mean that there is a boyz squad which consists of ....

Yeah it looks like my math was off a bit there, but I know each wagon can only hold 20. I was making the list and going through and adding piece by piece, so it looks like I missed something. Oh I know what it was. I started the list as 19 boyz and upgraded to 20 but forgot to put on the extra 6.

when i add for my lists I just do 20x6 plus nob addition, plus gear

 Orkimedezz wrote:

 Icculus wrote:
Warboss, pk, ‘eavy, bp, kombi-skorcha, cybork = 110
20 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, bp, pk, 2 big shootas = 169
19 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, big shoota = 134
Battlewagon deff rolla, RPJ, 2 big shoota = 125
Battlewagon deff rolla, RPJ, 2 big shoota = 125
3 kannons, 6 extra crew, 3 ammo runts = 87


Hows this?

Total = 750

looks ok but the boyz are funky
should be 19boyz nob evy,bp,pk, x2 big shootas cus battlewagons can only hold 20men! also that point value is 175pt
and the one with 18boyz n 1nob is 140pts
you made the nobs cost 10pts each! the way to do the nob in a boy squad is take a boy 6pt+10upgrade makes 16pt nob leader so ur up 12pts! so scrach 1 crew from kannons and 1 bigshoota from each battlewagon
otherwise looks great just alittle math mistake!

Warboss, pk, ‘eavy, bp, kombi-skorcha, cybork = 110
19 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, bp, pk, 2 big shootas 175
18 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, big shoota 140
Battlewagon deff rolla, RPJ, 2 big shoota = 120
Battlewagon deff rolla, RPJ, 2 big shoota = 120
3 kannons, 5 extra crew, 3 ammo runts = 84
my math is correct you are back to 749pts looks great!



Automatically Appended Next Post:

morfydd wrote:
Hrmmn just you and your brother ..then its time for a bit a nice Freindly competitive list
Do you have access to Imperial Armour Volume 8 ?

no need for av14 tank HQs/Elites/Troops thats just rude!

 Icculus wrote:

 Orkimedezz wrote:

 Icculus wrote:
Warboss, pk, ‘eavy, bp, kombi-skorcha, cybork = 110
20 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, bp, pk, 2 big shootas = 169
19 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, big shoota = 134
Battlewagon deff rolla, RPJ, 2 big shoota = 125
Battlewagon deff rolla, RPJ, 2 big shoota = 125
3 kannons, 6 extra crew, 3 ammo runts = 87


Hows this?

Total = 750

looks ok but the boyz are funky
should be 19boyz nob evy,bp,pk, x2 big shootas cus battlewagons can only hold 20men! also that point value is 175pt
and the one with 18boyz n 1nob is 140pts
you made the nobs cost 10pts each! the way to do the nob in a boy squad is take a boy 6pt+10upgrade makes 16pt nob leader so ur up 12pts! so scrach 1 crew from kannons and 1 bigshoota from each battlewagon
otherwise looks great just alittle math mistake!

Warboss, pk, ‘eavy, bp, kombi-skorcha, cybork = 110
19 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, bp, pk, 2 big shootas 175
18 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, big shoota 140
Battlewagon deff rolla, RPJ, 2 big shoota = 120
Battlewagon deff rolla, RPJ, 2 big shoota = 120
3 kannons, 5 extra crew, 3 ammo runts = 84
my math is correct you are back to 749pts looks great!



Automatically Appended Next Post:

morfydd wrote:
Hrmmn just you and your brother ..then its time for a bit a nice Freindly competitive list
Do you have access to Imperial Armour Volume 8 ?

no need for av14 tank HQs/Elites/Troops thats just rude!

Wait, you put this at 140. is that right?
18 boyz, nob, ‘eavy armor, big shoota 140

 Icculus wrote:
well like I said, when I show 19boyz. nob, 'eavy, big shoota

I mean there are 19 models in the squad. of the 19 there is a nob, and 1 with a big shoota. So that would equal 134.

the reason i do it that way is because if i did "17 boyz, 1 nob w/ 'eavy armor, 1 big shoota" it gets too drawn out.

I just like to see the number in the squad up front and then list the upgrades separately. cause the nob is just an upgrade.

 Delevarius wrote:
At 750 points a KFF BigMek is rly cheap and does alot, besides the more markers the tau spend on removing cover, the lower the chance for them to hit, since they wont have that many free markers, not to mention that pathfinders cant mark every vehicle before the Orks get to them
Shooty or not, orks want to get close and personal with Tau, so Trukks and Battlewagons are great vs them filled with boyz

 Icculus wrote:

Actually that does make sense. but with the lists I am either looking at 3 trukks with 35 boyz to deliver. or two battlewagons with 39 boyz to deliver. I am subtracting one from each option for the HQ.

Also Since I am going against a shooty army, I think two AV14s with 4 HP will last longer than AV10 with 3 HP. Because if he is bringing firewarriors (im not sure what the firewarriors weapons are) he wouldnt even be able to glance then battlewagons.

 Delevarius wrote:

 Icculus wrote:

Actually that does make sense. but with the lists I am either looking at 3 trukks with 35 boyz to deliver. or two battlewagons with 39 boyz to deliver. I am subtracting one from each option for the HQ.

Also Since I am going against a shooty army, I think two AV14s with 4 HP will last longer than AV10 with 3 HP. Because if he is bringing firewarriors (im not sure what the firewarriors weapons are) he wouldnt even be able to glance then battlewagons.

Before I go on , you should know that I trully am a fan of trukk lists at low to mid point values and prefer battlewagons at higherpoint games.
Now then, let me begin.

The big thing about trukks is that you deliver smaller squads across the field a bit faster and can chose between charging more units at once or ganging up against tougher targets (turn 2 charging is awesome )
Dont forget turn1 trukks flat out at 24 inc getting to the edge of their deployment zone instantly, not to mention that even though they are easy to wreck the ramshackle rule giving you deployment of the unit after any of the 3 results (6 extra inches of movment) and loosing trukks is not as big of a deal past turn one as loosing a BW who cost almost 3 times in points if you only slam a deffrolla on it
not to mention that 12 boyz (and even less if some die from overwatch or something) can whipe out any tau squad in CC with ease.

Note that with trukker boyz are better off being Sluggaboyz then Shootaboyz (the only exception to the "Shooty is betta" rule of 6th eddition) since trukker armies are all about getting into CC)
also, I really dont like 'eavy armor on the nob, it seems like a waste of points, its not like he is getting hit out of challenges, and if someone challenges you chances the 'eavy armor wont help.

Still dont get me wrong, battlewagons are awesomesauce, the front AV14 is always great, especially if you learn how to position the battlewagon properly (a skill not as easy to master as it sounds). Chances are you will probably get across with both of them across, maybe even get to smashing things with deffrollas after you deliver the payload. And lets not forget that Shootaboyz shine when they riding BWs, not to mention that the big mek can actually repair Hull Points.
Just dont bank on the 4 HP too much since its open top and they explode really easy, chances are even on the first pen (especially if an AP2 weapon pens them) , and the tau suits are mobile enough to flank your battlewagons and shoot your side, maybe even rear armor.

I'd probably drop to one big shoota per BW , maybe even none at all, since you might get tempted to not flat out so you can shoot turn one xD
Here is how I'd run a 750 BW list


Note that if you go the trukk route, you can probably bring up to 4 trukks and a bigmek in a 750 list (687 points for slugga boyz and the Big Mek and their trukks)
that is a payload of 47 boyz that charge in turn 2 (and dont forget the Big Mek still has a choppa, str4 and 3 atks base, and you have 4 claws at your disposal to get rid of any pesky vehicles that dont get gunned down by your kannons)