<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Sisters of battle and custom fluff."]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/31.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
So I've got my Sisters of battle. Like everything else I do, I've been trying to come up with my own fluff. But the problem is...I'm kind of in a block. The way I usually do it is I determine what my force/army/etc *does* compared to everything else, and then go from there.

But Sisters of Battle tactics are so...limited in the in game rules, and what fluff I've been able to get my hands on. Like, the six major orders seem to be, as follows;

WE GET REALLY CLOSE, AND BURN ****, THEN WE PRAY.

WE GET REALLY CLOSE, AND BURN ****, THEN WE PRAY. AND WE'RE REALLY DETERMINED.

WE GET REALLY CLOSE, AND BURN ****, THEN WE PRAY. AND WE'RE NICE PEOPLE.

WE GET REALLY CLOSE, AND BURN ****, THEN WE PRAY. AND WE HAVE LOTS OF REPENTIA

WE GET REALLY CLOSE, AND BURN ****, THEN WE PRAY.

WE GET REALLY CLOSE, AND BURN ****, THEN WE PRAY.

I don't really know how to...characterize my SoB as a combat force, because their arsenal seems so limited. (Bolters, Melta, Flamers of different varieties, and two singular units that do other things (repentia and exorcists)).

Like, with space marines you can go "Well, this chapter is all about lightning assault!" and "This one is all about hand to hand superiority!" and "This one basically put a small town on tank treads and oh gak there's cannons everywhere!," and it just doesn't feel that way with Sisters.

Now, I admit I haven't been able to read the fluff from the WD codex, and that's why I'm here.

Are there things that tactically differentiate Sisters orders? Are there new things not listed in the crunch? Cool units/classifications that aren't represented that could supplement an in-game model to give tactical diversity to an Order? (ie infantry/flying support that would combo well with Seraphim to make aerial assault-focused things, or heavy tanks that could represent a 'citybreaker' order or...whatever the smaller classifcation is of an Order?)

Maybe I'm just missing something, but that's why I came here to ask.

(And if it was supposed to be in background, I apologize, I'll delete it and move it.)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984141.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984141.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. Apply that to Sisters.
Say you have one order, the Order of the Bloody Lady or whatever. They love to rush forward, shouting prayers to the Emperor and use a lot of Dominions and Seraphim. They want to get in as close as possible as soon as possible.
Then you have the Order of the Iron Vow. They love lots of heavy weapons behind protective barriers. They have a lot of bastions, ADL's, Excocists and Retributers.
The you have the Order of the Penitent Lady and guess what they use a LOT of: Repentia and Penitent Engines.

So, though the orders use the same tactical doctrine, there is still a lot of room for variation.

As for new toys? Use allies but make them sisters. Exp. Use allied IG with a LR tank and have a sister sticking out the top. Or sentinels and make them look like something the sisters would use. Or an allied Space Marine, use a Master of the Forge, but model it like some weird Mechanicum freak and have a Thunder fire cannon with a flyr de lies on it.
Official stuff? Not so much.
My army has a female tech priest. Because.

Oh, and I got some SOB fluff in the More Dakka fluff section.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984176.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984176.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
My store is super duper serious about WYSIWYG (to the point they won't even allow you to use certain conversions), and even if they weren't it's not like I could just make them sisters with a different color scheme. That'd be too much confusion, I think.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984225.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984225.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
They're basically space pirates.

Their combat doctrine is basically akin to a pub brawl, except with fire.

Dear god so much fire.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984410.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984410.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984564.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984564.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
Firstly, the six main Orders are a little more varied than you're making out. Going off of this image, the six main Orders seem to operate like this in tactical doctrine, with some small inferences where appropriate:

- Bloody Rose: Kill the enemy quickly, do this by getting in close with meltas and flamers.
- Sacred Rose: Keep a cool head, don't acty rashly. They also seem to have a focus on Retributiors, so one could expect more emphasis than usual on heavy fire from these Sisters.
- Martyred Lady: Determined no matter what, fight to the last.
- Ebon Chalice: Strict traditionalists. Unfortunately their description above doesn't actually say a lot about how they operate tactically, but I often like to think of them as having lots of Celestians due to their status as the oldest and most traditional Order.
- Valorous Heart: As you said, lots of Repentia. Expect more close combat attacks from these Sisters than usual.
- Argent Shroud: Have a reputation for heroism and silence. Though a lot of people also like too interpret them as being caring altruists (which is fine, and I'll admit that I enojy that interpretation), it isn't necessarily true. here, we see them carrying out purges on IG that they come across. Sure they're into heroics, just don't mistake them for softies is all I'm saying.

Now, one thing I'll address is that you seem to have bought into the myth that the Sisters are an extremely tactically rigid force, only having access to certain weapons and fighting in a certain way. They actually have access to whatever weapons they need (there's actually some fluff specifically saying they can field whatever, but I can't find it at the moment). The bolter/flamer/meltas thing is actually just a result of them really liking those weapons rather than being limited to only those weapons. As for who and how they can fight, well, they can do whatever. We have stories of them fighting Daemons, Eldar and Marines. We have stories of them sacking a fortified city, defending against a Marine/Mechanicus siege and raiding a Daemon world. They're perfectly able to adapt to whatever the situation demands. They're elite soldiers, after all, and they can stratigise as such.

Eissel wrote:
Like, with space marines you can go "Well, this chapter is all about lightning assault!" and "This one is all about hand to hand superiority!" and "This one basically put a small town on tank treads and oh gak there's cannons everywhere!," and it just doesn't feel that way with Sisters.

Now this, in my opinion, is the beauty of Minor Orders. Basically, Minor Orders are small detatchments of Sisters that have settled down to guard a specific area, nominally splitting off from their parent Order (though they are theoretically still under its command) and to some extent developing their own identities. For us fans, this is our way in to make something for ourselves. On /tg/ recently, the idea of biker Sisters came up. After some discussion, it was decided that Bloody Rose made the most sense as the parent Order due to their appreciation for quick, brutal attacks. The fluff reason of them needing to remain mobile at all times was given as the justification for the adoption of bikes. Boom, custom SoB faction with a unique tactical doctrine. It's really not as challenging as you'd think. Hell, just as an example I've just come up with the idea of Sisters who favour fixed positions and wars of attrition. They can be Sacred Rose descendents fighting on a world with lots of high, rocky terrain. So they make lots of use of traps, heavy bolters and turrets.

Another thing I'll mention is that there is precedent for Sisters adopting new equipment into their ranks. here, we see some Sacred Rose Sisters adopting a new vehicle. Initially it was only them using it and other Orders not liking it. But eventually, the Ecclesiarchy decided it was okay and the Sisterhood at large officially adopted it into their ranks. Bearing this in mind, there's no reason you can't contrive a similar thing for your own custom Sisters, and is the perfect way to do what MWHistorian suggested about modelling non-SoB units as SoBs.

However, one thing I would like to clarify is that, though they aren't as samey as a lot of people think, they're still farily consistent in mannerisms. For example, you're not going to see a contrast like the Space Wolves to the Ultramarines with the Sisters. They're a much more consistent organisation than the Astartes.

One last thing, if you need help getting the creative juices flowing, this can be helpful. Was how I got a starting base for my own custom Order. Roll a few things, see if any solid ideas start to form. Though by no means feel obligated to stick with the results you get, if you don't like a result or want to disregard it later, go right ahead.

Wow, lots of text. Anyway, I hope it helps. Good luck making your custom Sisters!

Edit: One other thing I forgot to mention, I can understand why you're having trouble making custom fluff for them. The thing about the SoB is that their fluff is more obscure than other amries, due to the lack of "proper" codex updates, having shared with the Ordo Hereticus for 3e and 4e and then getting a mini WD codex for 5e and, so far, 6e. Hopefully the new codex, when it comes, will flesh out their fluff and make it more well known to the masses.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984880.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984880.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. OP and thought I could still contribute something. Then I saw Troike's post.

You've come far!

MWHistorian wrote:My army has a female tech priest. Because.
That might actually fit in quite nicely with the Sororitas "sanctified and pure of heart" to care for a convent's vehicle pool as mentioned in WD #269. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984914.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5984914.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Lynata wrote:
Damn. Came here, read the OP and thought I could still contribute something. Then I saw Troike's post.

You've come far!

MWHistorian wrote:My army has a female tech priest. Because.
That might actually fit in quite nicely with the Sororitas "sanctified and pure of heart" to care for a convent's vehicle pool as mentioned in WD #269.

That's exactly why I put her in. She's in the short story I wrote in the "More Dakka" section. I figured Sisters wouldn't want male tech priests entering their convents even though the Mechanicum couldn't care less and I don't see Sisters going to Mars to learn mechanics. Ergo, female tech priests in a Sisters army.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5988246.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5988246.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.

Myself, I'm pursueing the angle that it basically is "Techsisters" based on the following indications:
- the Sororitas/Ecclesiarchy try to be as independent from the AdMech as possible
- the Codex mentioned the Sisters severely limiting contact to outsiders
- that WD article mentioned the Sisterhood "maintaining" this pool, which makes them sound like a part of the Sororitas

I'm not entirely sure how the necessary technical knowledge could have been initially attained or passed on, but the Orders Pronatus are also said to collect, catalogue and analyse technology (mostly recovered by Missionarius Galaxia scouts), which would hint at a certain minimum of engineering expertise.

I doubt said expertise would rival that of the Techmarines, though, as the relationship between AdMech and Ecclesiarchy just makes a bare minimum of exchange more plausible than the same kind of education (or willingness to conform, to see it from the other side). It could be that the personnel of the Sisterhood (I like the idea of "Mistress of the Armoury" as a title, to go along with Mistress of Repentia and Mistress of Novices) know very little about building things from scratch as the Techmarines do in their Forges, but are sufficiently schooled to conduct repairs and provide maintenance.

Supposedly there is a large manufactorium on Ophelia VII (Ophelia-pattern Immolators and Rhinos were mentioned in the fluff, and I recall a bit of fluff about Thor basically scamming the AdMech into a permanent lease contract for the necessary machinery), and I'd theorise that all convents would depend on it or the Mechanicus directly for newly crafted equipment. After all, three of the six Major Orders are located right there, and the Minor Orders seem entirely too small to sport their own forges.

That's just an idea I've come up with, mind you, because I kind of like the mental image of a "Techsister" with a sort of crimson robe or trenchcoat with a gakload of pockets and belts holding all manner of diagnostic and maintenance tools. Could even sport a weird "hybrid insignia", a crossbreed between the AdMech Cogwheel and the Halo Skull of the Ecclesiarchy. I need to draw this some day. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989004.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989004.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989035.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989035.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
I think the current Codex also reflects this in that you cannot field them without having a Priest in your army?

Where it gets more dicey would be the drop pods and starships mentioned in some of the more obscure sources, but I imagine this at least would be where you have considerable overlap with other Imperial organisations such as the Navy (penitent officers), Ecclesiarchy (frateris crews) and AdMech (engineering).]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989089.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989089.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. PE's. Interesting.
And you also bring up what I've always wondered about. Ships. Do they just hitch rides with the navy? Does the Ecclesiarchy have its own ships or do the major orders? I don't remember what the books Fire and Faith and Hammer and Anvil said and I don't remember what the dex's say. I'll have to dig out my Witch Hunters dex. (its the most recent source of fluff I own.)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989163.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989163.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. GW sources just haven't touched the subject at all for many years, but the 2E Codex Imperialis mentioned the Major Orders having their own fleets based at the two primary convents, comparing the way the Orders are run to the Space Marine Chapters - hence my attempt at expanding this comparison to potential naval assets as well (non-SoB officers, chapter serfs = frateris crews, etc). It would certainly fit to the high amount of mobility the Major Orders' have displayed in the past, and to their mandate essentially stretching across all Imperial space and beyond (unlike with the Minor Orders that are largely limited to local operations).

It'd also explain how the Ecclesiarchy can do stuff like launching a punitive expedition to Fenris, unless you assume that the Imperial Navy is now counted among the factions that have a beef with the Space Wolves.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989283.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989283.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989295.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989295.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
MWHistorian wrote:Minor orders hitch rides when they're needed?
That's my assumption, anyways. My custom Minor Order is more or less space-based due to its focus on extended range purity control, but the ship the Sisters are travelling on is a proper Naval frigate "temporarily" seconded to the Ecclesiarchy (about as temporary as the Emperor's Land Raider decree). They have a planetbound convent with a shrine, but that facility serves only to train the next generation of Sisters. The ship visits the planet once every 10 years or so (+/- the usual Warp distortion) before resuming its eternal path.

As for the Frateris crews, it's just an amalgamation of the Navy's practice to press-gang hapless Imperial citizens into service and the Ecclesiarchy's practice of raising large formations of the faithful either by calling on volunteers or by sentencing penitents to assume this function. The latter was briefly touched upon in the 2E SoB Codex, but I also recall the novel "Hammer & Anvil" making use of this idea when it described the civilian workers tasked with rebuilding the convent on Sanctuary 101. There's quite some potential in all of this, if you consider the possible uses for background details. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989468.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989468.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989492.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989492.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 MWHistorian wrote:
That's true, they've always shown an ability for rapid deployment which means at least the major orders have their own ships. It's the only way to make it possible what they do. Minor orders hitch rides when they're needed? Frateris naval crews...hmm...makes sense.


There's a whole lot of faithful Rogue Traders who have the ships necessary to transport a large number of people and materials to wherever they want to go. C: WH makes it a point to state that the Ecclesiarchy is denied armed fleets by the Decree Passive. At the time, though, the SOB were the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Hereticus, who are not bound by any decrees of any kind, and so can deploy their own fleets to fly the Sisters to wherever they need them to go.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989722.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989722.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Psienesis wrote:
At the time, though, the SOB were the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Hereticus

They still are, nothing said that they weren't. It's just that the WD codex took the focus back to their role as the Ecclesiarchy's army.

Also, I believe that Andy Hoare wrote something in a WD that also stated that they are the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Hereticus.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989866.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989866.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Troike wrote:
 Psienesis wrote:
At the time, though, the SOB were the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Hereticus

They still are, nothing said that they weren't. It's just that the WD codex took the focus back to their role as the Ecclesiarchy's army.

Also, I believe that Andy Hoare wrote something in a WD that also stated that they are the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Hereticus.

Citation needed. The only place that Chamber Militant thing really existed was to shoe horn SOB into the Inquisition codex. It hasn't been repeated really past that point (and in the WD that accompanied its release).]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989871.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989871.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 pretre wrote:
 Troike wrote:
 Psienesis wrote:
At the time, though, the SOB were the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Hereticus

They still are, nothing said that they weren't. It's just that the WD codex took the focus back to their role as the Ecclesiarchy's army.

Also, I believe that Andy Hoare wrote something in a WD that also stated that they are the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Hereticus.

Citation needed. The only place that Chamber Militant thing really existed was to shoe horn SOB into the Inquisition codex. It hasn't been repeated really past that point (and in the WD that accompanied its release).

If my research is correct, Hoare wrote up some background for them in WD 292 (US issue number), which included them forming "ancient pacts" with the Ordo Hereticus to act as their Chamber Militant. None of this has been retconned, the 5e 'dex just shifted focus back to their main role.

Honestly, I don't understand why some people so resistant to the idea of them being the Chamber Militant for the Hereticus. It changes literally nothing important about them, effectively they are just moonlighting a little bit in order to kill even more heretics.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989917.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989917.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
Psienesis wrote:C: WH makes it a point to state that the Ecclesiarchy is denied armed fleets by the Decree Passive. At the time, though, the SOB were the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Hereticus, who are not bound by any decrees of any kind, and so can deploy their own fleets to fly the Sisters to wherever they need them to go.
To be precise, the Decree Passive was issued some time before the Convocation of Nephilim, and thus before the Sisters were formally allied with the Ordo Hereticus. What studio fluff actually says is that the Sisters of Battle were "the one exception" to the Decree Passive, meaning it simply does not apply to them.

"Sebastian Thor was ordered to disband the Frateris Templar of Vandire and any armies and fleets assembled by other members of the Ministorum while away from Terra. This was duly done, but for one exception. Seeing that some military force would be needed, and not wishing the Ecclesiarchy to be totally subservient to the will of the Adeptus Terra and the Imperial Guard, Sebastian Thor kept the one army he was allowed under the Decree Passive."
- 2E C: SoB

"The Decree Passive was issued in 288.M36. This historic act forbade the Ministorum from raising 'men under arms' and Thor disbanded the armies and fleets that had served Vandire, incorporating the Daughters of the Emperor into the military hierarchy and renaming them the Orders Militant of the Adepta Sororitas - the Sisters of Battle. Though this sat uncomfortably with the newly reinstated High Lords of Terra, they could not oppose Thor, and his insistence that they would regulate the Ecclesiarchy as much as enforce its will reassured many of his doubters."
- 3E C:WH, p5

In fact, it was the Sororitas' exception from the Decree Passive which led the Ordo Hereticus to call for the Conclave of Nephilim in the first place. Only after a deal was struck that would ultimately bind the Sisterhood as allies to the Inquisition was the tension resolved.

Note also the reasons behind this exception: The Sisters of Battle are to preserve a modicum of independence from other Imperial organisations. This includes the Imperial Navy. This is actually a vital detail to their task of policing the Ecclesiarchy, as just like every single regiment of the Imperial Guard has its Confessor, the same applies for every capital ship of the Navy, meaning members of the clergy can have a much higher influence with individual officers than the Sisters. Imagine how awkward it would be for the Sisters to not get around because the Cardinal they're about to hunt down managed to cancel their ride!
Whilst it is true that the Inquisition can, if need be, arrange for transportation, this is by no means a guarantee (I assume there are less Inquisitors than even Sisters around), and this prospect did not exist in the gap between the foundation of the Orders Militant and the Convocation of Nephilim.

Lastly, we also have the designer notes for the 3E Codex that it aims to incorporate anything published in earlier material (even directly referencing the fluff snippets in the original Rogue Trader rulebook), which kind of "reaffirms" the bit from the Codex Imperialis.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989930.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989930.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Troike wrote:
If my research is correct, Hoare wrote up some background for them in WD 292 (US issue number), which included them forming "ancient pacts" with the Ordo Hereticus to act as their Chamber Militant. None of this has been retconned, the 5e 'dex just shifted focus back to their main role.

WD292 is almost 10 years ago. I have it, so I'll go dig it up (it had zealots rules in it). Either way, it has been overwritten by the 5E dex for both SOB and GK. "The Sisters of Battle are the army of the Ecclesiarcy". Completely different than the C:WH info. Additionally, the Grey Knight codex established that the GK are the Chamber Militant for the Inquisition now (C:GK P44) not the SOB.

Honestly, I don't understand why some people so resistant to the idea of them being the Chamber Militant for the Hereticus. It changes literally nothing important about them, effectively they are just moonlighting a little bit in order to kill even more heretics.

I'm not resistant to them working with the Inquisition. I, in fact, use it as fluff for my IG allies. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989947.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989947.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. always been "the army of the Ecclesiarchy", even in 3E times. As the designer notes said, nothing changed with C:WH, they just expanded upon what was already there.

I recall the 6E Rulebook having a textbox about the Inquisition's three Chambers Militant, though I'd have to get back home to check. Maybe someone else can take a look? It was on a left page in the section where the structure of the Imperium and its forces were discussed. Either that or in the Appendix at the back. But definitively left.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989996.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5989996.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990005.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990005.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. SoB not being a chamber millitant I find it makes them appear significantly more independent and powerful if they don't have to rely on the Inquisition to get things done. By not being reliant on the Inquisition it becomes more plausible for an Order's mission to be at odds with an Inquisitor's despite neither side being any form of radicalism. The Inquisition's goals are not and should not always be identical to the goals of the Ecclesiarchy. Being a chamber millitant means an Inquisitor can always pull rank, no questions asked, rather than putting in a request for the Sister's aid, then the Superiors deciding if the aid should be given depending on the current goals of the Order. Now 95% of the time, the aid will happily be given, but being an Chamber Millitant removes the possibility of the Order not agreeing with the inquisitor's goal or simply refusing due to not having the resources available.

This is why I'm okay with the Grey Knights being the only official Chamber Millitant of the Inquisition and why I prefer the FFG take on the Deathwatch (though I don't want to make that the focus of this post).. Yes, individually the Grey Knights are the most powerful and specialized branch, but it also makes them bound to the Inquisition and limits their flexibility in a way that a non-chamber millitant SoB or Deathwatch are not. Now this doesn't mean that ordo hereticus and ordo xenos inquisitors will be calling on Grey Knights to be their strong arms. The SoB and deathwatch are still better suited to their needs. It's simply that these organizations can have their own agendas instead of being wholly subserviant to the Inquisition.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990054.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990054.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990094.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990094.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990158.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990158.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
This is also the only way I could see the Sororitas being a Chamber Militant making sense, by the way. Even before the Convocation of Nephilim, any Inquisitor could have gone and requisitioned their services.
Yes, a Canoness could have said no back then. However, a Canoness could still say no now. Officially, there is no such thing as "degrees of authority", and by law, a Canoness is just as bound to obey now as she was before, regardless of whether the Convocation formalises this relationship or not.

What I see as the actual difference between the "now" and "before" is that the Convocation of Nephilim binds the Sisters to the Ordo Hereticus in particular, rather than the Inquisition as a whole. Meaning, ironically, they may have more autonomy now than before, as the Ordo Hereticus will likely enjoy a sort of priority claim to its Chamber Militant compared to the other Ordos. A Canoness saying "no" to an Ordo Xenos or Ordo Malleus Inquisitor may now have the political backing of the Hereticus faction. In return, the Ordo Hereticus receives advance warning to purity control sweeps, ensuring that the Ordos Malleus and Xenos may not use something dug up by the Sisters to pin on their rivals in the Ordo Hereticus.

It's all part of good old fashioned Inquisitorial internecine rivalry. At least that's my interpretation.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990240.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990240.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990272.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990272.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. A very interesting interpretation to what it means to be a Chamber Millitant, and not one I had previously put any thought into.

But what about conflicts between two inquisitors within the Ordo Hereticus? Where both parties request the Sister's backing? Would an Order be in the right to choose the party that best futhers the Ecclesiarchy's goals? Or would it be their duty, as Chamber Millitant to all of the Ordo Hereticus, to remain out of internal issues? Or would the fact that such an affair was brought to their attention mean that it becomes their duty to investigate both inquisitors, in the name of routing out The Enemy Within?

Fun stuff. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990289.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990289.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990302.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990302.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
If two OH Inquisitors would petition a convent, I imagine the Canoness would go either with the request that seems more urgent, or would tell the Inquisitors to sort out their order of precedence there and then. In most cases, an Inquisitor should be aware of how dangerous a colleague is and whether they can risk defying them that way. In even more cases, both Inquisitors will already be connected through a web of contacts that would determine the senior, likely by how close they are to some Inquisitor Lord.

That being said, how likely is it that two Inquisitors petition a convent simultaneously? And if it does not happen at exactly the same time but still within a short timeframe, the Order will likely already be too busy when the second request arrives, or will be able to spare the necessary troops anyways. No conflict of interests there.

SerQuintus wrote:The idea of the Grey Knights being the only Chamber Militant irks the hell out of me.
I'm almost sure that was just a one-off in the GK Codex, and that the 6E Rulebook has backpedaled on it. Either because the Codex bit was an error by the author, or because GW reconsidered this change.
But as I'm still not home I can't check the exact wording to make sure ... Psienesis?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990396.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990396.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. Okay...
P159, Sisters of Battle are the military wing of the AMinistorum.
P180, "The Ordo keeps close ties with the Sisters of Battle" Does not list as a chamber militant. This is the bottom left I think you're thinking about.
P195, SOB page reiterates military arm of AMinis. No mention of Inq.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990457.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990457.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 MWHistorian wrote:
Well, SOB orders simply aren't as divergent as Space Marine chapters. Variations in tactical doctrine will be more subtle. Look at the United States marines vs. the Army. Same people, same equipment, same weapons. (for the most part.) What differentiates the two are the way they apply those what they have and the attitude. The US Marines fight different than the Army. The Marines are fewer, far more aggressive and work more with the Navy. The Army brings a whole lot more troops that are less trained and dedicated and have a few more neat toys.
Apply that to Sisters.
Say you have one order, the Order of the Bloody Lady or whatever. They love to rush forward, shouting prayers to the Emperor and use a lot of Dominions and Seraphim. They want to get in as close as possible as soon as possible.
Then you have the Order of the Iron Vow. They love lots of heavy weapons behind protective barriers. They have a lot of bastions, ADL's, Excocists and Retributers.
The you have the Order of the Penitent Lady and guess what they use a LOT of: Repentia and Penitent Engines.

So, though the orders use the same tactical doctrine, there is still a lot of room for variation.

As for new toys? Use allies but make them sisters. Exp. Use allied IG with a LR tank and have a sister sticking out the top. Or sentinels and make them look like something the sisters would use. Or an allied Space Marine, use a Master of the Forge, but model it like some weird Mechanicum freak and have a Thunder fire cannon with a flyr de lies on it.
Official stuff? Not so much.
My army has a female tech priest. Because.

Oh, and I got some SOB fluff in the More Dakka fluff section.


MW has the way of it. Use allies and just make them additional units in your SOB force. Just model heads appropriately. Use similar paint schemes, and view this as a chance to let your modeling talent shine. You could even take ally units rules and model something very unique. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990497.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990497.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. CM of the OH. That does not mean that they *aren't*, though the WD Codex seems to have cut out most/all of the Inq-specific units, which suggests that they are no longer attached to the Inq... which is sad, really, because that Finecast mini of the Solomon Kane-like Inquisitor with the sword and the inferno pistol is hell of cool.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990755.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990755.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Psienesis wrote:
the Solomon Kane-like Inquisitor with the sword and the inferno pistol is hell of cool.

I have him in metal. He's the primaris psyker in my counts-as Ordo Hereticus strike force that uses IG rules. He still manages to get the SOB to help him out occasionally. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990768.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990768.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Psienesis wrote:
though the WD Codex seems to have cut out most/all of the Inq-specific units, which suggests that they are no longer attached to the Inq...

Not necessarily, it just seems to be a shift of focus. The WH phase obviously focused on how they worked alongside the Ordo Hereticus, their previous and subsequent codexes are focused on their role as the Ecclesiarchy's soldiers.

The 6e rulebook says that they keep close ties, which would suggest that they still work together a lot. Not unexpected, really. To me the OH and Sisterhood seem like such natural allies.

I think the problem here is that nothing has been explicitly retconned or clarified, so it's kinda ambigous.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990783.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990783.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Troike wrote:
I think the problem here is that nothing has been explicitly retconned or clarified, so it's kinda ambigous.

What are you looking for? A note in the codex that says specifically that they aren't an Chamber Militant? Other than that, they've done everything to change the C:WH stance in C:GK, C:SOB and the Main Rulebook.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990803.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990803.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 pretre wrote:
What are you looking for? A note in the codex that says specifically that they aren't an Chamber Militant? Other than that, they've done everything to change the C:WH stance in C:GK, C:SOB and the Main Rulebook.

Though they're still noted as working very closely. Sounds like a Chamber Militant relationship to me.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990861.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990861.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
Eissel wrote:
^ Thank you for that response. The "Allies but sisters" thing is actually something I was thinking about because I have a land raider that I wanted to do something with, but I had no idea how to make the actual space marines.

My store is super duper serious about WYSIWYG (to the point they won't even allow you to use certain conversions), and even if they weren't it's not like I could just make them sisters with a different color scheme. That'd be too much confusion, I think.


Why? You can make it comepletely WYSWYG.
example: IG
1. converted light: same exact IG units, just in similar colors to the SOB, and with female heads.
2. converted heavy: female heads; SOB colors, actual same weapons but different vehicles (Panther body instead of a Leman Russ Body, that sort of thing). ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990875.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990875.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
pretre wrote:P159, Sisters of Battle are the military wing of the AMinistorum.
P180, "The Ordo keeps close ties with the Sisters of Battle" Does not list as a chamber militant. This is the bottom left I think you're thinking about.
P195, SOB page reiterates military arm of AMinis. No mention of Inq.
Thanks, just got back home and took a look myself. The term "Chapter Militant" seems to have vanished entirely, although it is of note that the Inquisition's relationship to the Deathwatch and the Grey Knights are described in a similar manner as the Sisters. Also, as per page 187, the Grey Knights are "again" only the military arm of the Ordo Malleus rather than the Inquisition as a whole, just as I suspected/recalled.
The three organisations thus seem to remain Chambers Militant in all but name.

But I have to say, I wonder if GW is aiming to get rid of the term entirely or if this is just a "phase" and it'll pop back up in the next book. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990877.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/5990877.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. IG, but I treat them as the ones in charge who are using the mass of soldiers as fodder and support. Though they are also vampires commanding undead...sooo not really able to be called loyalists anymore. Still, check out my gallery (Vampire Counts 40k) to see the idea behind painting and modelling 2 armies in a similar scheme.

Creates a cool look and allows your allies to make sense no matter what they are. Then just make the tactics whatever you want to suit the new army/faction you have created.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6003359.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6003359.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Dannyevilguy wrote:
I have a sisters allied detachment for my IG, but I treat them as the ones in charge who are using the mass of soldiers as fodder and support. Though they are also vampires commanding undead...sooo not really able to be called loyalists anymore. Still, check out my gallery (Vampire Counts 40k) to see the idea behind painting and modelling 2 armies in a similar scheme.
That's a lot of heresy you have going on there. I approve. The Hellhounds with the bubbling goo tanks are pretty slick.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6003374.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6003374.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 MWHistorian wrote:
Well, SOB orders simply aren't as divergent as Space Marine chapters. Variations in tactical doctrine will be more subtle. Look at the United States marines vs. the Army. Same people, same equipment, same weapons. (for the most part.) What differentiates the two are the way they apply those what they have and the attitude. The US Marines fight different than the Army. The Marines are fewer, far more aggressive and work more with the Navy. The Army brings a whole lot more troops that are less trained and dedicated and have a few more neat toys..
So of this is correct, some not so much.

Marines are, as you said fewer in number, their tactics are to secure positions in short order allowing for large scale deployment to proceed. I.E. securing a beachhead. Because of this the Marines are trained in ways different for the U.S. Army infantry men. (The Marines are used by the Navy in mission required by them.)

The U.S. Army is too large a force to be so simplified. The U.S. Army consists of the Airborne, Rangers, Delta Force, Special Forces, armored companies, infantry companies, and artillery companies. The U.S. Army is trained for a variety of different tasks, whether lighting fast assaults, prolonged wars of attrition or silent infiltration and disruption. In no way is the Army, less trained. (The Army is a standalone force, but often works in conduction with the Air Force as they used to the Army Air Core and the two branches retain their close ties.)


ON TOPIC: A way to differentiate your SOB is two have them be a strict assault force. I.E. if the unit cannot fit into a transport you don't take it


]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6003619.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6003619.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6013342.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6013342.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. 40K universe is that there is no canon and all of the fluff is up to your own personal interpretation. That leaves a lot of fluffy flexibility with which you can define your army's style however you choose.

For example, my SoB army is comprised of a bunch of strong independent black women who don't need no God-Emperor. They travel through Imperial space in a giant Battle-Barge shaped like Margaret Thatcher's face, liberating oppressed Sororitas from the Patriarchy.

I use a Beyonce' doll as a counts-as Celestine model.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014186.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014186.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 BlaxicanX wrote:
The best thing about the Warhammer 40K universe is that there is no canon and all of the fluff is up to your own personal interpretation. That leaves a lot of fluffy flexibility with which you can define your army's style however you choose.

For example, my SoB army is comprised of a bunch of strong independent black women who don't need no God-Emperor. They travel through Imperial space in a giant Battle-Barge shaped like Margaret Thatcher's face, liberating oppressed Sororitas from the Patriarchy.

I use a Beyonce' doll as a counts-as Celestine model.

At that point they're not SOB, so why bother?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014213.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014213.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014228.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014228.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 BlaxicanX wrote:
How are they not Sisters of Battle at that point? Chaos Marines are still Space Marines.

They're defined by their faith in the emperor. Take that away and they become something else. SM are defined by being giant super human warriors. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014259.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014259.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014360.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014360.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Void__Dragon wrote:
Why couldn't it be faith in their own independence?

Why don't I have chaos marines that love everyone and open charities for the poor?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014361.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014361.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
The path to Hell is paved with good intentions after all, so a warband could start off quite charitably and honorably. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014436.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014436.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. 40k" for you guys - well, I guess we all have our opinions.

BlaxicanX: Do you also have Space Marines that see themselves as the Imperium's last line of defense against encroaching Feminist Cults? Seems like that would fit the theme. You could have them wear those Al Bundy t-shirts maybe. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014671.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014671.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Void__Dragon wrote:
Why couldn't Chaos Marines do that though?

The path to Hell is paved with good intentions after all, so a warband could start off quite charitably and honorably.

But that actually fits in with the fluff. Chaotic corruption has often crept in through good intentions. This is more similar to something like pacifist Orks or highly emotional Necron warriors. Pretty much goes against the entire nature of that army.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014699.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014699.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
... or is it?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014734.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014734.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Lynata wrote:
Shush. I'm fairly sure this is not intended to be a serious debate.

... or is it?

Was just making a point against Void Dragon's, which was made seriously.

And I basically made the same point that you did, with your catgirl regiment and teddy Big E.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014747.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014747.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014764.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6014764.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6015538.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6015538.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
I don't know if I'd really want to play against that just on principle.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6016249.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6016249.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6016298.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6016298.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 Troike wrote:

But that actually fits in with the fluff. Chaotic corruption has often crept in through good intentions.


Indeed.

This is more similar to something like pacifist Orks or highly emotional Necron warriors. Pretty much goes against the entire nature of that army.


Highly emotional Necron warriors are a thing now though, haven't you read the fifth edition codex?

As for pacifistic Orks, it is not unheard of, since Orks can indeed go through non-violent periods, though they tend to become fat and flabby as a result. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6017468.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6017468.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6017678.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6017678.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6018345.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6018345.page GMT Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
 MWHistorian wrote:
Pacifist orks, loving chaos marines and emotional necron warriors. I don't think we're playing the same game here.

Well sexual love is as much part of Slaanesh' realm as lust, excess, beauty, desire, art, and sensation are.

Familial love is Nurgle's thing though.

So in a way you could have loving Chaos Space Marines, although the idea of a romantic noise marine makes me giggle.

Noise marine: "DAEMONETTE OF SLAANESH...oh how your eyes sparkle in the flickering fires of the warp."

Daemonette: "Eh?"

Noise Marine: "Your supple grace and form have been the center of my world for so long..."

Daemonette: "This flattery is somewhat jarring"

Noise Marine: "So I ask you...will you go out with me?" *Takes out flowers*

Daemonette: "..."

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6018381.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6018381.page GMT Re:Sisters of battle and custom fluff.
Indeed, I'm sure Slaanesh would disapprove of his/her/its minions "caring" for their victims, as that pretty much prevents the excess bit.

Then again I'm still thinking that those posts really were not meant to be taken seriously ...]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6018628.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/548335/6018628.page GMT