http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/16.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net

--AV---T---Sv, for tanks-- skimmers -- flyers
--14--10------------1+-----2+--------------3+----
--13---9-------------1+-----2+--------------3+----
--12---8-------------1+-----2+--------------3+----

and so on...

W = HP +1

Armor facings stay the same as before. In addition tanks are immune against: Poison, Instant death, Fleshbane, Shred, Sniper

Whenever a vehicle looses more than half it's W during one turn roll on the integrity-table:
1-2 Weapon destroyed
3-4 Immobilized
5 Wrecked
6 Explode

Armourbane - treat tanks T as 3 lower, add +1 if there is a role on the integrity table this turn
Tankhunter - rerol failed to-wound rolls against tanks
Lance - treats everything over T8 as T8
Impulse - automatically wound tanks on a 2+ and ignores armour
Rending - against tanks a successfull rend only ignores armour
Melter - when in halve range treat tank's T as 3 lower, add +1 if there is a role on the integrity table this turn


For all army specific roles: everything which lowers AV instead lowers T, everything that deals HP damage now deals W, everything which deals automatic penetrates does 1d2 wounds instead

Thoughts?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/550476/6022801.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/550476/6022801.page GMT 40k could benefit from a straight conversion of vehicles to "creatures", or at least for walkers. They've been blurring the line for awhile now and the difference in durability is HUGE.

What you're proposing is a little bit clunky - the integrity table in particular. And I'm confused about the armor save values. Do you really intend for all tanks to have a 1+ save? That would make them invulnerable to most weapons in the game.

What I'd do for armor-to-toughness/save, and this could be adjusted on a case-by-case basis:

--AV----T------Sv--
--14---10-----3+
--13----9------3+
--12----8------3+
--11----7------3+
--10----7------4+

(reasoning behind the Av10 to T7 conversion: lasguns and the like should not be affecting light vehicles)

I would do straight HP to Wounds in most cases, and I would scrap the integrity table for now. The mechanic for it seems clunky, and re-introducing the ability to one-hit kill (or almost one-hit kill) a vehicle kind of makes the whole conversion to toughness values redundant. Plus in most games I play, vehicles are glanced to death or exploded far more often than any immobilized/weapon destroyed results appear.

Then you modify things from there, keeping it as simple as possible (I kept a bunch of your ideas, credit where credit is due):

All vehicles have Fearless, Eternal Warrior, unaffected by Poison, Sniper, and Fleshbane

Ws = 0 if stationary or 1 if moving

Movement rates and the limitations on firing weapons are unaffected

Shred grants no re-roll.

Rending is unaffected.

Open-topped = -1 Sv

Melta, Armorbane, and Tank Hunter grant a re-roll to wound.

Lance treats over T8 as T8 (good idea)

Weapons or effects that cause an automatic glancing hit or remove a hull point remove 1 wound instead

Weapons or effects that cause an automatic penetrating hit, or weapons are AP1, do 2 wounds

Effects that would restore a hull point or repair a weapon destroyed or immobilized result will restore a lost wound instead

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/550476/6023134.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/550476/6023134.page GMT
The idea behind SV1+ was to make tank hunting more of it's own niche again. The impression I got so far was that there are two weapons in 40K:
1. Specialist weapons (Lasercannon, flamers, etc.)
2. versatile weapons (plasma)

The first kind should only be good at one thing, but very good at that. The second kind should be better than average at a maximum of two jobs.

By giving tanks a 1+ save (which acts like a 2+ but can only be countered by ap1), I wanted to nerf plasma, while giving tanks a noticeable boost to survivability against mid range weaponry, but not against specialist anti tank weaponry.

(Also Lascannons and weapons which fill a similiar role would be upped to ap1)


Just giving melter and armourbane rerolls would be a serious nerf for those weapons, and I don't think it is the dedicated anti AV that needs a nerf.


The integrity table is mostly there to give vehicles a decidedly different "flavor" when compared to MC's and is admittedly the weakest/less thought out part of the system atm.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/550476/6023326.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/550476/6023326.page GMT