<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/14.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 hq. This was my original list.

+++ imperial guard vs nids (1485pts) +++
+++ 1500pt Imperial Guard 5th Ed by TC Roster (Primary Detachment)) +++

Selections:

Imperial Guard 5th Ed by TC (Primary Detachment) Selections:

+ HQ + (160pts)

* Company Command Squad (160pts)
2x Bodyguard (30pts), Camo Cloaks (20pts), 2x Grenade Launcher (10pts), Krak Grenades (5pts), Medi Pack (30pts), Vox Caster (5pts)
* Company Commander (10pts)
Laspistol, Power Weapon (10pts)

+ Troops + (795pts)

* Infantry Platoon (305pts)
* Heavy Weapons Squad (80pts)
3x Autocannon (15pts), Krak Grenades (5pts)
* Infantry Squad (70pts)
Grenade Launcher (5pts), Vox Caster (5pts)
* Sergeant (10pts)
Laspistol, Power Weapon (10pts)
* Infantry Squad (70pts)
Grenade Launcher (5pts), Vox Caster (5pts)
* Sergeant (10pts)
Laspistol, Power Weapon (10pts)
* Platoon Command Squad (85pts)
2x Grenade Launcher (10pts), Medi Pack (30pts), Vox Caster (5pts)
* Platoon Commander (10pts)
Laspistol, Power Weapon (10pts)

* Infantry Platoon (305pts)
* Heavy Weapons Squad (80pts)
3x Autocannon (15pts), Krak Grenades (5pts)
* Infantry Squad (70pts)
Grenade Launcher (5pts), Vox Caster (5pts)
* Sergeant (10pts)
Laspistol, Power Weapon (10pts)
* Infantry Squad (70pts)
Flamer (5pts), Vox Caster (5pts)
* Sergeant (10pts)
Laspistol, Power Weapon (10pts)
* Platoon Command Squad (85pts)
2x Grenade Launcher (10pts), Medi Pack (30pts), Vox Caster (5pts)
* Platoon Commander (10pts)
Laspistol, Power Weapon (10pts)

* Veteran Squad (185pts)
Autocannon (10pts), Forward Sentries (30pts), Gunnery Sergeant Harker (55pts), 4x Lasgun, 3x Sniper Rifle (15pts), Vox Caster (5pts)

+ Heavy Support + (530pts)

* Leman Russ Squadron (170pts)
* Leman Russ Exterminator (170pts)
Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolters (20pts)

* Leman Russ Squadron (170pts)
* Leman Russ Exterminator (170pts)
Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolters (20pts)

* Manticore Rocket Launcher (190pts)
Camo Netting (30pts), Heavy Bolter

List was made with battlescribe. This is a rough list I know and I could use any tips or unit ideas from the experienced players.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6145796.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6145796.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500
As far as your list... you want some heavier anti tank than autocannons, as in lascannons. A good place to put these in would be on your russes, although some heavy weapon lascannons work well too with orders. More special weapons are also in order, your CCS and PCS should be rolling deep in them. Grenade launchers are cheap but pretty meh, plasma is a good all rounder, although if your hard up for points I would take the grenades over say, melta or sniper(unless you expect multiple wraithlords or knights...but if falcons are your bane you want plasma)

Medics are bad for IG, and laughable against eldar. Eldar can spam S6 like no tomorrow rendering your medipacks useless...and for the cost you could buy more PCS or a second CCS. If you insist on a survivability upgrade, carapace armor or cloaks are better.

Vox casters are garbage for PCS to pass FRFSRF or incoming...ok for fire on my target or bring it down(both great against eldar for multiple reasons) Ld8 is good enough, and a regimental standard will hold your gunline within a range. Commissars are also great for blobs for extra Ld and the ability to resist morale fails.

Power weapons on your officers is also a joke against eldar...a decent aspect warrior will roll anything short of a company commander with their bare hands more often than not. You will not swing first, so best to stay cheap and shooty, using sarges as chumps for combat. Should CC happen, use your numbers to wipe the warriors and let a sarge die to the superior elf challenger. Then next turn decline the challenge and swamp in attacks...if they survive that long. Points saved in power weapons can be more guns on the table.

Chimeras are really good for the points cost and offer decent protection for the troops inside. Consider adding some into your list with points saved.

IG can get plasma pistols cheap, and if you have a BS4 model to receive one...I would take it, particularly on the Company commander. It is cheap and deadly, and your Company commander has multiple wounds to suffer the burn.

In summary, drop frill melee upgrades and voxes for more Ld boosting and shooting. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6146364.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6146364.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500
Infantry squad 60pts
grenade launcher (do not list points of upgrades)
vox caster

Also get rid of the krak grenades on the Heavy weapons teams. They shouldnt be assaulting anything, and if they are being assaulted they are as good as dead, no reason on wasting points on something that wont happen.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6147522.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6147522.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 lol.

P.S. Is the Harker vet squad a good idea or a point sink?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6147733.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6147733.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 10 squads of 30 guardsmen with a lascannon in half of them and autocannon in the other half.(get them behind the wall and fire!)
some LMBT's


Automatically Appended Next Post:
1500 points for guardsmen
depends how many LMBT's you have depends on how many points(preferably 3)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6147878.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6147878.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 (HQ) CCS w/ plasma gun, regimental standard, lascannon, plasma pistol, carapace - 130 pts

(T) PCS w/ (4) plasma guns - 90 pts
(Tsub) Infantry Squad w/ grenade launcher, autocannon, commissar - 100 pts
(Tsub) Infantry Squad w/ grenade launcher, autocannon - 65 pts
(Tsub) Infantry Squad w/ grenade launcher, autocannon - 65 pts = 320 pts

(T) PCS w/ (4) plasma guns - 90 pts
(Tsub) Infantry Squad w/ grenade launcher, autocannon, commissar - 100 pts
(Tsub) Infantry Squad w/ grenade launcher, autocannon - 65 pts
(Tsub) Infantry Squad w/ grenade launcher, autocannon - 65 pts = 320 pts

(FA) Vendetta - 130 pts

(HS) Leman Russ Exterminator w/ bolter sponsons - 170 pts

(HS) Leman Russ Exterminator w/ bolter sponsons - 170 pts

(HS) Manticore - 160 pts

(Fort) Aegis Defense Line w/ quad gun - 100 pts

1500 pts

Gives you 23 str 6 shots, 24 str 7 shots, 4+ cover for you gunline, commissars and a standard to keep them there, as well as an answer to flyers and one of your own. Turtle up for the first 2 turns and lash out with all your firepower, then advance to take objectives on turn 3+. Have your CCS man the quad gun. Cover your flanks with the LR's. Manticore in the back. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6148153.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6148153.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 HQ + (155pts)

* Company Command Squad (155pts)
2x Bodyguard , Camo Cloaks , 2x Plasma Gun , Regimental Standard (
* Company Commander, Plasma Pistol (10pts)

+ Troops + (740pts)

* Infantry Platoon (265pts)
* Heavy Weapons Squad (80pts)
3x Autocannon (15pts),
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun (15pts)
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun
* Platoon Command Squad (60pts)
Plasma Gun, Platoon Standard
* Platoon Commander


* Infantry Platoon (265pts)
* Heavy Weapons Squad (75pts)
3x Autocannon
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun

* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun (15pts)

* Platoon Command Squad (60pts)
Plasma Gun (15pts), Platoon Standard (15pts)


* Veteran Squad (210pts)
Autocannon, Forward Sentries, Gunnery Sergeant Harker , 3x Plasma Gun

+ Heavy Support + (595pts)
* Leman Russ Executioner (225pts)
Heavy Bolters Lascannon
* Leman Russ
Heavy Bolters , Lascannon
* Leman Russ (185pts)
Heavy Bolters, Lascannon

Sorry it is again a copy paste from battlescribe. I wanted to try an executioner and see who it does. I took out the manitcore because I just never used them and I don't know how it do against eldar. My buddy likes his wraithguard, war walkers, grav tanks and seer council of a$$holes. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6148810.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6148810.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 LRBT's or demolishers upgraded weapons. According to GW FAQ they got rid of lumbering behemoth and replaced it with the heavy rule, which states that the tank can move no faster than 6" and fire all its weapons. BUT because the main weapon is ordnance all other weapons have to snap fire. So if you fire a battle cannon or demolisher cannon all the lascannons and heavy bolters have to snap fire, thats 35pts in bs1 firing weapons, a waste of points if you ask me. The standard LTBT is actually rather poor for a tank right now and isnt really a great choice to take unless you really want to spam cheap av14/ s8 ap3 pie plates.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6148850.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6148850.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6149093.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6149093.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500
-I personally like the Vanquisher with hull lascannon and Plasma cannon sponsons. It puts out a good amount of strength 7-9 shots all at ap2 and is pretty good at hunting vehicles and monstrous creatures alike, it really even threatens meq and teq alike. But once you include this tank in your army your vendettas are also anti tank so if you run 2 or more vendettas I would maybe try to avoid the vanquisher.

Eradicator with heavy bolters all around also isnt a bad decision either. Ignores cover with the main gun and the hull and sponson heavy bolters just add wounds. All the shots are Ap4.

Executioner really isnt a bad decision either. Each of the small blasts is ap2 so most of your opponents stuff wont get a save. Whenever I run this tank I usually believe in the go big or go home method and give it a hull lascannon and plasma cannon sponsons and just annihilate my opponent with a great volume of ap2 blasts.

If you just want cheap av14 with s8ap3 large blasts then just run 2-3 standard russes but I would go for any of the other variants listed above as they will probably perform better. The LRBT is my favorite of them all but I just personally believe that at the moment it really isnt worth its points, if it was 15 or so points cheaper than I would justify using it more often.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6149216.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6149216.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6149237.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6149237.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500
The exterminator would be great for putting wounds on units and taking care of stuff with a 4+ save, the main gun can even deal with light army pretty decently. Give it a lascannon and MM sponsons and it can pretty much fire at any target.

The vanquisher with the load out I presented above is actually what I use in just about every game of mine. It usually tends to make its points back and is a fairly good tank and taking on most rolls.

If you plan on running an airborne list and use vendettas the exterminator might be better because then the vanq and vendettas will be competing for armor targets. But if you use like a valkyrie with rocket pods and a vendetta then the vanq may not be a bad idea.

Whenever you get around and update the list I could give some more insight on what could be improved.

Also for your PCS I would drop the platoon standard, it really is not good. It benefits the squad in assault but more likely the squad will be gunned down and killed before assault or as they are only a 5 man squad and eldar has higher LD the squad will probably be dead before they can swing. I would swap it for another plasma gun.

Also double check the points on the autocannon heavy weapon teams. I believe for 3 autocannons the total should be 75pts not 80. I dont have my codex on me to check this for you.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6151091.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6151091.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 lol. The airborne list going to try and make my fluffy list. Either like the 101st airborne from ww2 or go airborne rangers from Vietnam. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6151133.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6151133.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 lol. I started heavy mechanized with lots of russes as I am a tanker and love my tank lists lol.

Yea most of the time I build list I just stick with the simple paper and pencil and write em out. Ive had some friends use a couple apps but some of the apps arent updated correctly and its messed some of their lists up.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6151185.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6151185.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6152160.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6152160.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 CCS has also allows your guardsmen to reroll failed LD tests. I recommend the regimental standard but drop the Platoon standards for more plasma.

Also I would keep the executioner. The ap2 is really nice against nids monstrous creatures. Also if you drop the executioner for a punisher you would add a lot more shots but then the only ap1-2 you have in the list is relying on guardsmen with bs3 plasma guns that are only a 24" range which is in my opinion rather poor. I would keep the executioner.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6152502.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6152502.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6152631.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6152631.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 LD 10 bonus all around which also benefits the squads when it comes to order. But to be honest I dont use lords much as they are usually best if used with blobs. I always take a regimental standard with a foot list.

As for vox casters. I used to use them all the time to pass orders and they definitely improve the ability to issue orders but in general it can add up pretty quick. 5 points here, 5 points there, and before you know it you got a bit of points in voxes that you dont need. It really depends on if you truly want to rely and hand out quite a bit of orders. Because if you choose not to issue and order with your PCS or CCS then you are jipping yourself on points that you spent for that. In a competitive environment I wouldnt use voxes but in casual games I would give them a try. I have some extra guardsmen I plan on giving voxes to so I can try some different things out with IG. The vox caster also uses up a slot that could be used for another special weapon, so you can ask yourself if that order you pass with the vox is really worth giving up that slot for another special weapon.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6152901.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6152901.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500
1480 pts
+ HQ + (155pts)

* Company Command Squad (155pts)
2x Bodyguard , Camo Cloaks, 2x Plasma Gun, Regimental Standard Plasma Pistol

+ Troops + (740pts)

* Infantry Platoon (265)
* Heavy Weapons Squad (75pts)
3x Autocannon
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun
* Platoon Command Squad (60pts)
2x Plasma Gun
* Infantry Platoon (265pts)
* Heavy Weapons Squad (75pts)
3x Autocannon
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun
* Platoon Command Squad
2x Plasma gun
* Veteran Squad (210pts)
Autocannon, Forward Sentries (30pts), Gunnery Sergeant Harker (55pts), 3x Plasma Gun

+ Heavy Support + (605pts)

* Leman Russ Squadron (245pts)
* Leman Russ Executioner
Lascannon , Plasma Cannons sponsons

* Leman Russ Squadron (170pts)
* Leman Russ Exterminator
Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolters sponsons

* Leman Russ Squadron (170pts)
* Leman Russ Exterminator
Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolters sponsons
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6153526.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6153526.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 av 13-14 better than autocannons.

I also dont see any defense line so your infantry will die pretty easily. I assume the infantry are going to bubble wrap the tanks and you're just going to do a slow advance up the board?

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6154350.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6154350.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500
I used to use the "incoming" order till i read the rulw book again and after going to ground you can only snap fire the turn after

This is a rubbish order , thought it was one of the best ones , now it appears that its no good at all]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6154725.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6154725.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 frfsrf is a awesome one if you can spam lasguns on the board. I was thinking I take a vanquisher but just feel nervous when I am not bringing my pies to share with my friends lol.

I was going to try and keep them in cover and just either do move move move to get them to objectives. I am sending Hasker's squad in to deal with HQs or try and get some of his heavy armor in the rear. Since all eldar tanks are rear armor 10 the autocannon or plasma should be able to do something there. The only HWS I have every used have been bolter or autocannons squads. Could save points and go mortar but idk how that would do when he does his wraithguard walk with a warlock behind to give them some boost or another. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6155617.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6155617.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500
 GreenWarMachine wrote:
Bring it down and Fire on my target are good orders. of course frfsrf is a awesome one if you can spam lasguns on the board. I was thinking I take a vanquisher but just feel nervous when I am not bringing my pies to share with my friends lol.

I was going to try and keep them in cover and just either do move move move to get them to objectives. I am sending Hasker's squad in to deal with HQs or try and get some of his heavy armor in the rear. Since all eldar tanks are rear armor 10 the autocannon or plasma should be able to do something there. The only HWS I have every used have been bolter or autocannons squads. Could save points and go mortar but idk how that would do when he does his wraithguard walk with a warlock behind to give them some boost or another.


If you trade an exterminator for a vanq then you arent losing any pieplates.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6158305.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6158305.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500
1500 pt list updated

+ HQ + (155pts)

* Company Command Squad (155pts)
2x Bodyguard ), Camo Cloaks , 2x Plasma Gun, Regimental Standard
* Company Commander, Plasma Pistol

+ Troops + (750pts)

* Infantry Platoon (265pts)
* Heavy Weapons Squad (75pts)
3x Autocannon
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun
* Platoon Command Squad (60pts)
2x Plasma Gun
* Infantry Platoon (265pts)
* Heavy Weapons Squad (75pts)
3x Autocannon
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun
* Infantry Squad (65pts)
Plasma Gun
* Platoon Command Squad (60pts)
2x Plasma Gun

* Veteran Squad (210pts)
Autocannon, Forward Sentries, Gunnery Sergeant Harker,, 3x Plasma Gun

+ Heavy Support + (605pts)

* Leman Russ Squadron (245pts)
* Leman Russ Executioner
Lascannon, Plasma Cannons

* Leman Russ Squadron (190pts)
* Leman Russ Vanquisher
Heavy Bolters, Lascannon

* Leman Russ Exterminator (170pts)
Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolters


]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6159408.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6159408.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 IG a bit now and from my experiences, you can lose the following:

-CCS Camo cloaks, plasma pistol on the officer, and bodyguards. Reasons are; Camo cloaks are for hiding, it looks like your CCS is going to get stuck in with the rest of the army (if it isn't, lose the plasma guns/pistols). Plasma pistols are useless and a pointsink. You're playing IG, not SM, adding bodies to a CCS just makes it a bigger target.

-Infantry squads; lose the HWT's, they're never going to earn their keep. They're big bases and if any deepstrikers or outflankers make a appearance near them, they're toast. If you absolutely have to have heavy weapons in the platoon, just put them in the squads themselves. Instead, take special weapon squads, drop the points from the HWT's into them (demo charges, 3xplasma/melta guns) and you'll get a far better return.

-PCS; Up to you. Plasma guns are nice, and with the point changes from the rest of the army you'll be able to give them their max compliment. Or save the points and drop Commissar's in your platoons to give that sexy stubborn bubble and extra melee punch.

-Tanks; They're big targets and draw a lot of fire pretty much from the start of the game. Executioners are great tanks, even with the sponsons (which is generally a no no). Vanquishers are decent variants now, given the change from Lumbering Behemoth to Heavy Vehicle. The Exterminator is pretty much the go-to tank now, and fitted with MM sponsons, you'll see a return on the points investment.

Note: Don't bother with HB sponsons unless you're running Punishers, they don't make up for the difference in weapon profile on the other variants (not going to be shooting HB's with your Vanquisher at armored targets, right?)

All in all, trim some useless stuff and use them for more special weapons in the IF platoons (meltas are great for hiding in a group of guys), specialize your tanks for their roles, and you'll be set.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6160063.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6160063.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500
Drop the heavy bolters on the vanq, they do not compliment the tank in any way, heavy bolters fire at different targets from the LC and vanq cannon.

The CCS is a small squad and adding 2 more guardsmen to it really wont help your survival, most shooting will probably kill the whole squad in 1 go. I also would say drop the camo cloaks as well. You dont have any aegis line to hide behind so it may be pretty hard finding any type of cover to save yourself with.

HWT's are hit or miss, they can be good when given orders but they only pass an order half the time and are easily insta killed by anything s6 which forces them to take a LD test which they will only make half the time but the regimental standard will help a little bit.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6161142.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6161142.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6162072.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6162072.page GMT Re:Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6163432.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6163432.page GMT Imperial Guard vs Eldar 1500 http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6165300.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/557643/6165300.page GMT