<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/14.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
Here's what I got at 2000 pts:

- Baharroth
- Farseer (Jetbike, Witchblade)
- 2x Bike Warlocks, one w/ Singing Spear

-5x Fire Dragons (Sisters of Averlorn with flaming bows!), Wave Serpent (TLSL, SC, HF, GWM)

-10x Dire Avengers (Dire Avengers bashed with Phoenix Guard), Wave Serpent (TLSL, SC, HF, GWM)
-6x Guardian Jetbikes (kit bashed with high elf/wood elf bits), 2x SC
-3x Guardian Jetbikes (kit bashed with high elf/wood elf bits), 1x SC

-5x Shining Spears, Exarch, Hit & Run, Disarming Strike
-10x Swooping Hawks, Exarch, Hit & Run, Sunrifle
-10x Swooping Hawks, Exarch, Hit & Run, Sunrifle

-Fire Prism, HF
-Fire Prism, HF


The warlock with spear rides deep with Shining Spears. May put the Farseer there for fortune? Warlock #2 goes with bigger squad of jetbikes. Flyers will be rough, but two Wave Serpents can help with that, plus some guided Shining Spears. What are the general thoughts? Like I said, trying hard to steer away from serpent spam and I don't like the Wraith style models in general. I thought about an Autarch/Knight sort of thing (really wish the Autarch could get the Swooping Hawks rule!), but I feel like the Farseer is just too good. Also, I expect to fall in love with the scouring!

Also, Baharroth has to be there. I just love the model! ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6238650.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6238650.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6238850.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6238850.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
On a side note: I'd really love to see some pictures of your Eldar.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6238995.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6238995.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
18 Swooping Hawks and two Exarchs is just too many points sunk into a very narrow unit, but if it fits your fluff go for it, just don't expect them to tear up the board unless you play nothing but Horde-style armies.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239282.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239282.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
Baharroth can also be amazing...but I generally find him to only be fantastic against Tau and Necrons.

Personally don't think you need hit and run on hawks either...as they don't scatter and have 24" range guns and can then run/fleet back...they will never see combat unless you're looking to use your haywire grenades

Warlock cannot join aspect squads.

Get monster hunter on those spears...its ridiculously good.

TL Shuriken catapults that reroll to wound bladestorm against MCs...it's so good.

Remember to deepstrike Baharroth separate from Hawks...to drop his grenade pack separate from theirs...and then immediate join by deepstrike placement/during movement.

I hate Fire Prisms...I think Night Spinners would do you much better.

Actually...you are lacking some Marine-killability...play it with prisms and keep the spinners in mind.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239650.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239650.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
 ductvader wrote:
I always throw my farseer with my Shining Spears...guide makes them amazing at killing nearly anything.


Just a note that you probably want Prescience, not Guide. Guide doesn't work in assaults, where the Shining Spears earn their keep.


TL Shuriken catapults that reroll to wound bladestorm against MCs...it's so good.


Yeah, if you're buying an Exarch you definitely want the Monster Hunter upgrade. It's good whether you're using the Lances or the TLSC's.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239712.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239712.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
LoT wrote:
 ductvader wrote:
I always throw my farseer with my Shining Spears...guide makes them amazing at killing nearly anything.


Just a note that you probably want Prescience, not Guide. Guide doesn't work in assaults, where the Shining Spears earn their keep.


Thank you, I misspoke...that is what I meant.

And getting that Star lance can be necessary for those 2+ MCs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I also don't generally Hit and Run my Spears...my philosophy is that if they didn't win in the first round...it's all over anyways. Unless your squad is big.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239726.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239726.page GMT Re:Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears No Warlock in my Spears? Boo! Geez, GW... way to keep making it harder and harder to get Shining Spears up to "Good" status. Oh, well, it does not weaken my resolve. Thank you!

Here's the proposed revised 2000 pts list:

- Baharroth
- Farseer, Jetbike, Singning Spear

-Fire Dragons (x5), Exarch (Fast Shot, Fire Pike), Wave Serpent (TLSL, SC, HF, GWM)

-Dire Avengers (x10), Wave Serpent (TLSL, SC, HF, GWM)
-Guardian Jetbike (x3), SC
-Guardian Jetbike (x3), SC
-Guardian Jetbike (x3), SC

-Shining Spears (x9), Exarch (Star Lance, Hit & Run, Monster Hunter)
-Swooping Hawks (x10), Exarch (Sunrifle)
-Swooping Hawks (x10), Exarch (Sunrifle)

-Fire Prism (HF)
-Fire Prism (HF)

Nightspinner should be play tested, for sure. I'm just worried about dropping tanks at range with Fireprisms... they can be guided/prescienced first turn to aid in that effort as I wait for the Hawks to sky leap off the table to come in turn two. Then I can apply a massive beta strike while I make access to cover. The guardian jetbikes will probably hide in reserve.

Nothing in this army is built. I own one Farseer (plastic on foot), Wave Serpent, Fire Prism, 5 Swooping Hawks, Baharroth, and the bits to make my Dire Avengers. With this concept I gotta go grab two boxes of high elf dragon princes to make my shining spears. I realize it's not a hardcore "Must Win" list. If I wanted to do that, I'd proxy the shining spears as warlocks and play a jetseer council and roll people. But that's not fun (coming from a tournament player) and I'd rather put models on the table no one has seen.

By the way, my Farseer on a jetbike will be the Island of Blood High Elf Prince on the gryphon, but I will be putting an eldar singing spear on him and a Ghost Helm. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239740.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239740.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
Warlocks and Screamers...because there are some scary concepts presented for what Tyanids Shadow of the Warp is going to do to such units.

I also think your dragon Exarch is unneeded...but he is fun.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239754.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239754.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
 ductvader wrote:
I'd watch out for building anything around psychic models.

Warlocks and Screamers...because there are some scary concepts presented for what Tyanids Shadow of the Warp is going to do to such units.

I also think your dragon Exarch is unneeded...but he is fun.


Yeah, we shall see. The farseer alone could be a detriment.

The dragon exarch is just for funsies. I had the extra points to hit 2K. It's not enough for a new unit, so basically it would have been upgrades to the fire prisms or just another better ranged melta gun for melta fun. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239760.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239760.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears GW has a way of killing spam to balance the game.

I like the list now...you'll win some, you'll lose some.

It's decent.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239767.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239767.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears

I also don't generally Hit and Run my Spears...my philosophy is that if they didn't win in the first round...it's all over anyways. Unless your squad is big.


I wouldn't take Hit and Run on a small squad of Spears either, but more for the reason that unit-wide buffs aren't generally a great idea on small units.

I don't think your philosophy is a good reason not to take Hit and Run - it's kind of silly, because there are many units that can survive a round of combat with Shining Spears, and those are the type of units you'd prefer to HnR out of on the opponent's turn, then shoot/charge again on your turn to wipe them out, or simply use the charge and 3d6 movement from the HnR to slingshot your spears across the board while inflicting hurt on the enemy.

I'd watch out for building anything around psychic models.
Warlocks and Screamers...because there are some scary concepts presented for what Tyanids Shadow of the Warp is going to do to such units.


This is kind of silly too unless your meta is literally just Space Wolves and Tyranids. The Seer Council w/the Baron is one of the most powerful tournament lists around right now and runs circles around 95% of the lists posted in this forum. I'm not saying the OP should run it, because it can be a very unfun list to play against, but not playing the list because you're afraid of Shadow of the Warp is silly.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239788.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239788.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
LoT wrote:

I also don't generally Hit and Run my Spears...my philosophy is that if they didn't win in the first round...it's all over anyways. Unless your squad is big.


I wouldn't take Hit and Run on a small squad of Spears either, but more for the reason that unit-wide buffs aren't generally a great idea on small units.

I don't think your philosophy is a good reason not to take Hit and Run - it's kind of silly, because there are many units that can survive a round of combat with Shining Spears, and those are the type of units you'd prefer to HnR out of on the opponent's turn, then shoot/charge again on your turn to wipe them out, or simply use the charge and 3d6 movement from the HnR to slingshot your spears across the board while inflicting hurt on the enemy.


I run 4 Spears with an Exarch.

If I get charged by the wrong unit...they're dead before I get to Hit and Run.

If I get my charge...as it normally goes...then with prescience I have usually won combat even if my enemy is not destroyed completely.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
LoT wrote:
I'd watch out for building anything around psychic models.
Warlocks and Screamers...because there are some scary concepts presented for what Tyanids Shadow of the Warp is going to do to such units.


This is kind of silly too unless your meta is literally just Space Wolves and Tyranids. The Seer Council w/the Baron is one of the most powerful tournament lists around right now and runs circles around 95% of the lists posted in this forum. I'm not saying the OP should run it, because it can be a very unfun list to play against, but not playing the list because you're afraid of Shadow of the Warp is silly.


As the OP does not current own all of these models I simply stated that someone should think twice before buying the models right now because they could get hit in the nuts this December by a Tyranid release.

To wait and see for a few weeks is more intelligent than to spend and get boned.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239801.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239801.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears

I run 4 Spears with an Exarch.

If I get charged by the wrong unit...they're dead before I get to Hit and Run.

If I get my charge...as it normally goes...then with prescience I have usually won combat even if my enemy is not destroyed completely.


Even if you win combat, the opponent still has to fail their morale and lose the sweeping advance roll - a hefty percentage of the time, your Spears will be stuck in combat despite winning. And that's not even considering Fearless units, of which 40k has approximately a billion. Sure, if your spears fight nothing but 5-man Tac Marine squads all day, you'll be fine without HnR, but against a varied assortment of enemy units Hit and Run is very useful.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
LoT wrote:
I'd watch out for building anything around psychic models.
Warlocks and Screamers...because there are some scary concepts presented for what Tyanids Shadow of the Warp is going to do to such units.


This is kind of silly too unless your meta is literally just Space Wolves and Tyranids. The Seer Council w/the Baron is one of the most powerful tournament lists around right now and runs circles around 95% of the lists posted in this forum. I'm not saying the OP should run it, because it can be a very unfun list to play against, but not playing the list because you're afraid of Shadow of the Warp is silly.


As the OP does not current own all of these models I simply stated that someone should think twice before buying the models right now because they could get hit in the nuts this December by a Tyranid release.

To wait and see for a few weeks is more intelligent than to spend and get boned.


Even the most popular armies won't be more than 20-30% of a meta, and we have no idea whether Shadow of the Warp will stick around in any form.

Even in its current form, I have beaten Tyranids playing a non-allied (and thus weaker) version of the Seer Council against a list with several SotW MC's. Is it a tough fight? Yes, but not an auto-lose or even close to it.

If he wants to build a Seer Council then it is a good idea even if he might have some tough matchups. Why? Because that's the case with literally every army in 40k. You will never build a list that doesn't have tough matchups.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239916.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239916.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
LoT wrote:

I run 4 Spears with an Exarch.

If I get charged by the wrong unit...they're dead before I get to Hit and Run.

If I get my charge...as it normally goes...then with prescience I have usually won combat even if my enemy is not destroyed completely.


Even if you win combat, the opponent still has to fail their morale and lose the sweeping advance roll - a hefty percentage of the time, your Spears will be stuck in combat despite winning. And that's not even considering Fearless units, of which 40k has approximately a billion. Sure, if your spears fight nothing but 5-man Tac Marine squads all day, you'll be fine without HnR, but against a varied assortment of enemy units Hit and Run is very useful.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
LoT wrote:
I'd watch out for building anything around psychic models.
Warlocks and Screamers...because there are some scary concepts presented for what Tyanids Shadow of the Warp is going to do to such units.


This is kind of silly too unless your meta is literally just Space Wolves and Tyranids. The Seer Council w/the Baron is one of the most powerful tournament lists around right now and runs circles around 95% of the lists posted in this forum. I'm not saying the OP should run it, because it can be a very unfun list to play against, but not playing the list because you're afraid of Shadow of the Warp is silly.


As the OP does not current own all of these models I simply stated that someone should think twice before buying the models right now because they could get hit in the nuts this December by a Tyranid release.

To wait and see for a few weeks is more intelligent than to spend and get boned.


Even the most popular armies won't be more than 20-30% of a meta, and we have no idea whether Shadow of the Warp will stick around in any form.

Even in its current form, I have beaten Tyranids playing a non-allied (and thus weaker) version of the Seer Council against a list with several SotW MC's. Is it a tough fight? Yes, but not an auto-lose or even close to it.

If he wants to build a Seer Council then it is a good idea even if he might have some tough matchups. Why? Because that's the case with literally every army in 40k. You will never build a list that doesn't have tough matchups.


I don't know you're attacking an idea that is based upon the foundation of conserving money...and possibly spending it anyways a few weeks later. I am done with that nonsense.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239937.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6239937.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
I feel like one crimson hunter is just quadgun fodder, but I'm not sacrificing the theme of the army to get more than one. I quite enjoy the swooping hawk model, hence 20 of them and Barry. I'm aware that, while not bad, are sub optimal to Warp Spiders. Also, running two farseers or farseer plus autarch would be much better versus a Phoenix Lord, but meh?

Eventually this will grow into a footdar army and maybe some wraith units. Eldar are one of the few where I would convert a great deal with fantasy as I have no aspirations of running High Elves or Wood Elves in fantasy. I much prefer Skaven (current army) and Ogres (future army).

18 Jetbikes is still going to be $$$ but I sold my necrons army to build this army as Eldar allow for some bright colors and I wasn't digging painting the Egyptian theme. Plus, I have fun with more elite style armies (see my Draigowing) so an elite style Eldar army that requires a surgical like precision or else it will get folded and torn like a wet napkin sounds like what I need as a challenge. Wave Serpents and Seer Councils are just too "safe."

Plus Dragon Knight Shining Spears. Fire Dragons. Hawks, Hawk Lord,... a Farseer riding a gryphon. All awesome. I'm tempted to get the bits from the Phoenix proper from high elves to make an amazor Autarch on a bike, but I imagine that will be a later project. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6240128.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6240128.page GMT Eldar, 2K: Hawks & Spears
 ductvader wrote:

I don't know you're attacking an idea that is based upon the foundation of conserving money...and possibly spending it anyways a few weeks later. I am done with that nonsense.


My point was that even if Tyranids came out and were an excellent army against Psykers, that should not play into his decision at all unless he's a cutthroat competitive player who happens to play in a group of nothing but Tyranid players. There's no point in waiting because the new information shouldn't affect his decision at all. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6240338.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/562531/6240338.page GMT