<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "CSM List Building Help"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net CSM List Building Help DE players? I have a lot of experience as a player and can pretty much take out any of the players at my store aside from two which i consistently lose to, they are eldar and DE.
Some of my units include:
HQ:
2 Daemon princes
Daemon prince w/ black mace
Blood thirster
Sorceror
Sorceror on bike
Nurgle lord on bike w/ PF/LC
Typhus

Elite:
30 Plague marines w/ 6plasmas
10Termies various weapons

Fast:
3 HellDrakes
4 spawn
15 bikes
10 raptors w/ 2 meltas

Heavy:
2 predators
9 oblits
8 autocannon havocs
4 missile havocs
2 forgefiends

Troops:
60 cultists
40 marines

Im looking for some help in building my lists to be super competative, i usually place 3rd out of 12, but i can never beat those 2 players! Im looking ot build an awesome list can deal with all sorts of threats, between 1500 - 1750 pt lvls.

Problems I have: those eldar vehicles shooting the crap out of me, whether its Eldar shooting their shields at me or a crap ton of venom shots i am getting lit up
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6256409.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6256409.page GMT Re:CSM List Building Help
HQ
Chaos Lord: Terminator Armor, Lightning Claw, Burning Brand of Skalathrax, and the 4++ item, with MoS, VoTLW

Elites:
Terminator Squad (These deep strike)
Terminators x3 all with lightning claw + combi-Melta
Terminator Champion: duel lightning claws
MoS , VoTLW

Troops:
Cultists
20man squad, w/autoguns, 2 heavy stubbers, Champion w/shotgun

Chaos Marine Squad
10 man squad, 2 plasma guns, Champion with lightning claw + melta bombs
VoTLW
Rhino

Chaos Marine Squad
10 man squad, 2 melta guns, switch bolter for CCW, Champion with lightning claw + melta bombs
MoS, VoTLW

Fast Attack:
Heldrakes x 2

Heavy Support:
Land Raider (second unit of marines goes in here)

Obliterators x 3, VoTLW (Deepstrike and Lord goes here to make fearless)

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6256595.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6256595.page GMT CSM List Building Help LD, as well as the cultists]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6257060.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6257060.page GMT CSM List Building Help DE is that they usually rely a lot on cover, so anything that will negate that will be really painful for them. It's also true that they will immediately recognize the threat and kill it ASAP.
So be sure to have some redundancy.

Unluckily we don't have many choices on ignoring cover: Heldrakes, Noise Marines or the Burning Brand of Skalathrax.
The important thing to consider is that anything that ignores cover will be a primary target, so always add some redundancy: never take less than 2 of such units.

Also, being the Chaos Daemons codex quite competitive, it is often a good idea to ally with them. Apart from broken solutions (pinkstar/screamerstar), I do think that the Flesh Hounds can be of great help against Eldars: scout, 2W T4, fleet, move through cover, move 12" and also pass all the Deny the Witch with a 4+. Add 15 of them, find anything that is T6 or less that is really annoying you, charge it, kill it, repeat.
As for troops, they all have their uses: 20 Daemonettes, being S3 and T3, may not considered a primary target, but they do run d6+3", have the fleet special rule and thanks to their 2 base attacks with the rending special rule can pretty much kill everything that a DE or Eldar player can field on the battlefield. Plaguebearers are wonderful at defending objectives, while the Pink Horrors are the only one able to do some damage from the distance.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6257115.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6257115.page GMT CSM List Building Help http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6257129.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6257129.page GMT CSM List Building Help Lord uses is brand a LOT!
Because I take votlw my space Marines stay more often than not.
Cultists run some but hey, they drew fire so whatevs.
What is better than lord on bike is deep striking and not caring about scatter because you still have 12 in. range.
Two heldrakes also means paper vehicles crumble w/no cover save]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6258369.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6258369.page GMT CSM List Building Help http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6259193.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6259193.page GMT CSM List Building Help
theonlyxaso wrote:
@ diablix the problem im running into is that there stupid paper vehicles keep passing their cover saves and outshoot me and out maneuver me!


That's why I suggested to pack some Ignore Cover weaponry.
Regarding their damn wave serpents our best bet is charging them with Power Fist and so on, not only they lose the cover, they also can't ignore the penetrating hits.

A good way to deliver a power fist is a Chaos Lord on Bike with 5 Chaos Spawns with the Mark of Nurgle. 15 T6 Wounds with a 5++ are tough, even if you have poisoned weapons, since they won't be able to instant death them.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6259282.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6259282.page GMT CSM List Building Help How do you feel about taking daemon allies and spamming princes i have a 1750 list in mind that consists of 3 daemon princes bloodthirster and 3 helldrakes]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6262826.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6262826.page GMT CSM List Building Help
Diablix wrote:
theonlyxaso wrote:
@ diablix the problem im running into is that there stupid paper vehicles keep passing their cover saves and outshoot me and out maneuver me!


That's why I suggested to pack some Ignore Cover weaponry.
Regarding their damn wave serpents our best bet is charging them with Power Fist and so on, not only they lose the cover, they also can't ignore the penetrating hits.

A good way to deliver a power fist is a Chaos Lord on Bike with 5 Chaos Spawns with the Mark of Nurgle. 15 T6 Wounds with a 5++ are tough, even if you have poisoned weapons, since they won't be able to instant death them.


Be advised, if you focus fire you can force wounds onto the spawn. I know that's probably the point but I'd hate to see the spawn torn apart by poison or something that the lord could have saved.

But, again, that's not terrible of they shoot the spawn insteadof your lord.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6263259.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6263259.page GMT CSM List Building Help
theonlyxaso wrote:
We are allowed to proxy to a minor degree.
How do you feel about taking daemon allies and spamming princes i have a 1750 list in mind that consists of 3 daemon princes bloodthirster and 3 helldrakes

That sounds hilarious but the plasma-centric scene makes this list impossible, your DPs and Bloodthirster would die, and your Heldrakes.. Would last, but not for very long, especially not against Tau]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6263276.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6263276.page GMT CSM List Building Help http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6265565.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6265565.page GMT CSM List Building Help
and now my tactics
use terminators and oblits to kill enemy armour and anti air units. you don't need to aim for infantry that will come later. once 90% of his army is footslogging have your chaos lord who looks like davy jones cry "RELEASE THE DRAGONS" and set his army alight with your drakes. 2 drakes should remove all infantry in around 3 turns, 3 drakes will do it even quicker with no tanks and no infantry your opponent has lost the game. make his scoring units a priority as without them he cannot win.

the rest of your units should be cc orientated and covering the oblits and any other heavy fire platforms, as they will be targeted heavily and you don't want them in cc because other wise they aren't shooting.If your enemy has any tanks the drakes cant burn the infantry inside and like I said taking away his scoring units makes for an easy win

against tau Huron's infiltrate ability should allow you to close with them quick then they have choose between shooting dragons or the unit of angry marines, either way he will make a bad choice and you will benefit from it

unfortunately my area has no elder players of any kind but im pretty sure that this plan is kind of universal]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6265827.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6265827.page GMT CSM List Building Help
theonlyxaso wrote:
@BrotherOfBone I played against tau and i told the guy i was packin heavy fliers so he took all sky fire, i got tabled turn 3 was not fun, im going to drop a prince and add a nurgle lord on a bike with fist and drop a drake, or add some khorne hounds

That guy sounds like a proper . If I were you I'd definitely go for some khorne hounds (PS they whup Tau ass)
Aside from this, I would be tempted to, instead of bloodthirsters, go for Great Unclean Ones as they can soak up a hell of a lot of firepower xP]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6266176.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6266176.page GMT Re:CSM List Building Help CC army. So bikers, spawn, deepstriking terminators and terminator lords, land raiders. Stuff like that.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6266274.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6266274.page GMT CSM List Building Help http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6268510.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6268510.page GMT CSM List Building Help
Lord on bike with powerfist
30 shooty cultists
30 cc cultists
10 noisemarines, 2 blastmasters
10 noisemarines, 2 blastmasters
5 noisemarines, blastmaster

5 spawn, mark of slaanesh
heldrake

2 maulerfiends with lasher tendrils
vindicator


It has a very good win ratio so far, only having trouble against occasionally eldar, tau, and necrons.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6268647.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6268647.page GMT CSM List Building Help
theonlyxaso wrote:
@BrotherOfBone How do you run khorne hounds? I think thats the next thing im going to pick up. Also whats all this nonsense about servo skulls nerfing scouts and infiltrate? Do the khorne hounds infiltrate?
Khorne Hounds scout, and are beasts. Scout them into the open (or into cover depending on who gets first turn) and then run them forward into cover, then the next turn you can charge ;P This works best with 2 units, a smaller unit of possibly 5 hounds to sponge all the overwatch fire, and then a (much) larger unit to charge in after it and deal some real damage ;P]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6270808.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/563517/6270808.page GMT