<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/14.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list
I will go in a few months to my first tournament which should be quite competitive.
I am mainly a GK player but wanted to try a strong Alpha Strike list with some SW allies.

Main detachment : GK
Coteaz
3 henchmen in psyback
3 henchmen in psyback
3 henchmen
3 henchmen
DK, teleporter, heavy incinerator
DK, teleporter, heavy incinerator
DK, teleporter, heavy incinerator

Allied Detachment : SW
Rune Priest, Jaws and other power
Rune Priest, bolter, Jaws and Lightning
6 Wolf Guards with combi melta in droppod with deathwind launcher
10 GH with 2 melta in droppod with deathwind launcher
10 GH with 2 melta in droppod
Whirlwind

The strategy should be quite simple : Alpha strike
I keep the acolytes and Coteaz in reserve, put the RPriests with the WG in their pod.
First turn i shunt the 3 DK, drop the WG and one pod of GH (the one with deathwind launcher) and thus have :
- 3 heavy incinerator torrent templates
- 2 Deathwind launcher templates (S5, big template)
- 1 Whirlwind shot (likely the one that ignores cover)
- 8 melta shots
- 2 Jaws

That should be enough to cripple quite a lot of typical opponents i think.

Does anyone have any tips or anything on the list, or small stuff to change?
I really want to keep the alpha strike theme with DKs.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Noone?
Is the list so bad (or so good but i doubt it, its still GK...)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6494514.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6494514.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list imo.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6494936.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6494936.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list DKs. Love the swords...plus they look cool...

Not sure if I would want both RPs in the same pod...dunno...have to think about that one...it would be really easy for Tau (which is really why you take JOTWW anymore - and maybe Necrons) to kill them with both in the same unit.

And even though you have 8 meltas dropping turn one you can only shoot at two targets with that. So if you're going against Eldar you might be able to deal some damage to one maybe two WS. Or against DE two venom's unless you're a really bad shot. If it's an army that stands still you'll probably do well but if they're all mech'd up or are faster than your average bear you'll need to get creative. Plus you'll be in everyone's face with the GH so you'll need to be careful where you aim that whirlwind. I have a similar debate about my lone vindi.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6494994.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6494994.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list For the RP i would also prefer to take them in different units but then takes takes a GH and thus a melta out :(

Against TAU yes they have interception but i can either land very close to them so they cant land their template (and then its only 3 shots at BS3) or use the DPod as a screen for LOS (at least in theory, i did not try it yet)

i agree that mechdar will be probably the hardest to face, i can likely kill almost 2 WS if i get first turn and then it will be hide and seek.
if he does not move flat out, i will charge him and kill the WS, if he does move flat out, then he cant shoot as well...

For DE, i would likely put the psyback on the field for some S6 TL shots

As for taking the deathwing launchers, if they have to snap shot i agree, that means i will likely take another psyback for my acolytes instead of swords (will have to think about it)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6495313.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6495313.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list AV 12 waiting to give away first blood.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6495345.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6495345.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list
Actually the pod giving first blood would surprise me.
With 2 pods of wolves including 6 meltas and 2 Jaws as well as 3 DKs, i would be surprise a pod is the target or that i have not gotten the FB in the alphastrike.

I could give away first blood if i dont play first (33% chance as i have Coteaz) AND someone manages to get one of my DKs who would be hiding]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6495396.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6495396.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list
There are exceptions, but DP's are not one of them.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6495467.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6495467.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list gk shunting list with 3 dreadknights and 2 interceptor squads. In this case you have switched out the interceptors for drop pod wolves and taken up 2 RP. as HQ which is quite nice. Your opponent will have a lot to deal with on the first turn between 3 shunting dreadknights and 2 RP GH units drop podding into their lines. I'd say this list is a top teir tournament army once you've come to practice and get in terms of playing it. It will crush most armies through it's resilency and many threats. (orks, nids, sisters, necrons, chaos, daemons of chaos) You will have trouble against those list that have quite a load of AP2/3 fire and posions hence (dark eldar, taud dar with riptides and burstcannons, white scars, Eldar running wraithguard with d-sythes) will be problem match ups for you. Dark Eldar would be a large struggle for you as they can wipe a dreadknight or 2 in one shooting phase, then they can turn and begin pouring in fire on the R.P. or Vice versa and with the number of shots they have... there is a reason they are top teir army right now especially with so many MC's being run as they don't care for toughness values and just pour it on and make you fail saves. Taudar with 2x Riptides and wraithknight, backed up with Missile Pod Broadsides and large number of tau support with bikers and pathfinders will give some trouble especially if they go first. being able to drop at least a Dreadknight maybe even 2 in one shooting phase. Jetseer (Guide, misfortune, prescience). White Scars is really a match of does the white scars player role well with the grav guns. If they take out the dreadknights they will probably win as your army does not have the mobility to catch them. Finally I don't ahve to tell you how bad it is facing up against d sythes and wave serpents in addition to a reaper death star. If you can come to be able to find strategies to get around those 4 problem match ups this list definitely has the potential to win a grand tournament. I also run a form of gk/sw allies at 1750 and I have found that they work fantastic together. The rune preist dealing with Riptides and Necron destroyer lords / carnifexes with ease. The psychic protection being provided by the rune preist is fantastic. and the Dreadknights really come to help support those Grey hunters coming in via drop pods and making it so your opponent has to make tough decisions of being hit by a 10 man grey hunter unit or 3 NDK... all in all your units are back capping all the objectives and even if you do lose everything up front it's like turn 5 or 6 and your opponent has taken major casaulties trying to deal with the brunt force and now no longer has the mobility or range of weaponry to reach out and take out the objective cappers even if they are henchmen or just a 5 man marine unit.

Yea the best allies that I know work well with gk are
gk/sw, gk/necs,

gk/sm , gk/tau and gk/eldar
-have some combos I could imagine working out but I personally have not dwelved into them. The major theme is to be able to support via deepstrike/ negation of psychic powers, flyers and deepstriking onto objectives. Eldar would probably next best in line. Taking warpspiders with a jetseer supporting alongside guardian jetbikes. They are quick can deal with flyers and allow for late game objective grabs.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6495784.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6495784.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list IG fits my necron flyer list would have a field day, though. Probably so would flying circuses. Not saying it's not strong but after seeing what Tau and Eldar do at the Nova Open...well good luck!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6496141.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6496141.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list As for necron flyer list i would try to table on T1 i guess, afterwards i agree it would be very hard.
For flying circus, i still have lots of small units for grounding tests and DKs can really hurt almost all MC in CC i found.
For TAU, i am going to try next week against a list with 3 riptides, 2 skyray, 3 broadsides and some units of FW and Kroots, it should make a nice test.

Really thanks for the feedback i apreciate and will let you know]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6496460.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6496460.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list
I don't know if I'd go so far to call it top tier - although I might try it at my club just for something different. You have no flier defense at all and no ranged weapons other than the anti infantry wirliwind. Granted you'd probably give Tau and gunline IG fits my necron flyer list would have a field day, though. Probably so would flying circuses. Not saying it's not strong but after seeing what Tau and Eldar do at the Nova Open...well good luck!


who needs flier defense when your in assault on the second turn? I have played a similiar list against heldrakes and necron flyers and won them with ease.. when they come on they have nothing to target other than vector strike a Nemeis dreadknight. All the while they then get locked in combat later on. How the list plays it wipes all the ground troops and then takes line breaker, one objective, most probably FB., and wins the game. Seems harder said then done, but you'd be suprise how often this is the end result.


For TAU, i am going to try next week against a list with 3 riptides, 2 skyray, 3 broadsides and some units of FW and Kroots, it should make a nice test

Against Tau it's all about how you position units and what units you fire at. The Drop Pods come in right next to a unit of fire warrios or path finders and they are 1" away from them so that EW systems can't use ion accelerator bast because they would hit their own people. All the while you place a drop pod in a place where you will obtain a cover save from said riptide while at the same time leaving LOS for the RP to use J.A.W.S through the unit of fire warriors out the other side and hitting the riptides. All the while the Dreadknights have shunted forwards and flamed off all the pathfinder units and will be in assault with said riptides next turn so if your opponent choices to target the space wolves the dreadknight will kill the riptide, however he it targets the dreadknight the space wolves are free to get into assault the following turn and sling shot into cover, and the best part is that you get 2 RP with Jaws meaning you will proably kill at least 1 maybe even 2 riptidews on the inital alpha strike alone. Tau are good but they aren't THAT good to withstand such an alpa strike. Then their is still the wolf guard unit not to forget about with combi-meltas....

For flying circus, i still have lots of small units for grounding tests and DKs can really hurt almost all MC in CC i found.

Against Daemons of Chaos there are 2 builds you will see. FMC or Screamer Star. Against FMC you pretty much move your dreadknight over to the place where the daemon prince make it fail a grounding check. Assault it kill it instantly through str 10 DF or FW, rinse and repeat. He's got 2 drop pods 2 grey hunter units wolf guard, henchmen in rhinos, rhinos... he'll at least drop 1 probably 2 FMC per turn. Against Screamer Star that is a laugh fest. He charges in with 3 dreadknights uses Dark Excommunion and followingly wipes the entire unit in proably 1 maybe 2 assault phases. All the while the Grey hunter units and the wolfguard and henchmen are capping up the map...

As for necron flyer list i would try to table on T1 i guess, afterwards i agree it would be very hard.

necrons are a piece of cake as well..He drops down on oppisite sides with RP next to the 2 wraith star untis Jaws the 2 destroyer lords kills them... proceeds to unload everything into said Wraith units and proably wipes 1 or half of each wraith star unit at the least. The dreadknights then shunt over to the Barges in the back and next rurn proceed to smash them into pieces. The game is over at this point. he can set his dreadknight on each objective and pretty much sit henchmen and grey hunters on each objective doubling up...

The reason I know how this army plays and it's potenital is because I play something similiar and it does amazing... trust me it's very much top teir]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6496579.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6496579.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list - Having the 2 RP in the same unit was not great as it means they have to focus a single ennemy, and it means there is only ONE really threatening SW unit.
- If Droppod really counts as moving as cruising speed (where is that mentionned btw?) then i need to take out the Deathwing launchers.

Thus here is the new list :

Coteaz
RPriest
RPriest

3 henchmen in razorback with psyamo
3 henchmen in razorback with psyamo
3 henchmen
3 henchmen
8 GH, 1 meltagun, droppod
10 GH, 2 meltagun, droppod
10 Wolf Guards, 7 combi melta, 3 normal (one of the combi melta will go with the GH squad)
Whilwind
DK, teleporter, heavy incinerator
DK, teleporter, heavy incinerator
DK, teleporter, heavy incinerator

So i have 3 full pods of 10,
- One with a melta, a combi melta and a RPriest (and 7 normal GH)
- One with 6 Combi Melta and a Rpriest (and 3 normal WG)
- One with 2 melta and 8 normal GH

I think it improves the list quite a bit as the threats are more evenly matched (thus forcing harder decisions)


]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6503149.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6503149.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list

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Always max out combies on wolf guards best upgrades space wolves have, one of.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6503159.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6503159.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list SW).
I wanted to max them out but am out of points for the last 3 combies, i would have to take a GH out and i think i need the bodies.

By the way i have a question regarding combi weapons.
If i have 7 of them in a unit, can i fire regular bolters with 3 and 4 melta so i still have some melta shots left? or does it need to be a single volley?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6503428.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6503428.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6504047.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6504047.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6504130.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6504130.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list MSUs and gave the DKs swords - gotta love the swords. I did shockingly well against a good Eldar player at my club considering I don't play SW and had to literally dust off my GK (been playing the crap out of my crons for the past year). So needless to say I made several tactical errors. We played the relic / hammer&anvil. I got first blood and he got line breaker and I squatted with a rhino on the relic at the end of the game after he killed the MSU that was holding it thus denying anyone from having it (specifically his bikes if it went another turn). The DK force weaponed his WK out of the game in turn two and took out one of his WS while the WG podded in and melted an unprotected WS which was good because even one WS spent the rest of the game wrecking the rest of my army :( (along with some war walkers and spiders).

The biggest problem I see with the list is there's zero flyer support...

HQ: Inquisitor Coteaz

Troops: 3x Warrior Acolyte, 1 Razorback Psybolt Ammunition
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolyte, 1 Razorback Psybolt Ammunition
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolyte
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolyte
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolyte

Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight , Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator, Nemesis Greatsword
Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight , Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator, Nemesis Greatsword
Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight , Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator, Nemesis Greatsword

HQ: Rune Priest in Power Armour, Melta Bombs, JOTWW, LL
HQ: Rune Priest in Power Armour, JOTWW, LL

Elite: 1x Wolf Guard in Power Armour, Storm Bolter, melta bomb 6x Wolf Guard in Power Armour, Combi-Meltagun, Storm Bolter, DP

Troops: 9x GH, Wolf Standard, Plasma gun, DP
Troops: 9x GH, Wolf Standard, Plasma gun, DP
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510302.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510302.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list
Here's my version of the list. I dropped the wirlwind and added more MSUs and gave the DKs swords - gotta love the swords. I did shockingly well against a good Eldar player at my club considering I don't play SW and had to literally dust off my GK (been playing the crap out of my crons for the past year)


I think someone likes it

but yea flyers are a ehhh problem... the main thing is that you really don't have to worry about them because after you drop pod in your like 6" from the enemy in the following turn and will be in assault the next turn anyways so that when they come on they will have no targets. You break out after they've flown past and put a nice number of rear AV10 shots into the back of them and try and pop them before they fly off the board next turn, that is if they don't just come straight in and fly off the board period... so really flyer protection comes in that of manner of ignoring them by being in assault]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510348.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510348.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list I was supposed to try it with a good TAU player on friday but he just cancelled :(

I agree that flyers seem the main issue but if we look at the classic flyer lists :
- necron : Then the aim would be to kill all ground forces quickly (should be done by T2) and then move the razorbacks and Dks on objectives
- Vendetta heavy IG, they would be an issue, but the main gunline would die really quick, so then its again just an issue of tanking on objectives while waiting for his troops to disembark from vendettas
- FMC : those should not be too much of an issue with the number of units and shots to make grounding tests and then the DKs can handle them in CC.
- Stormraven heavy army. Given the cost, the aim would again be to take care quickly of ground forces, 3 SR at 1850 with something inside will leave little on the ground
- DE, Eldars and others rarely have too many flyers]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510657.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510657.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list RP to prescience a squad the other to get perfect timing for the flier. as you don't need JAWS against IG obviously and prescience on a drop pod wolves squad should take out any tanks by just deep-striking in back of them or on the sides+ perfect timing will rid all the IG trying to get cover saves. Against trip SR. I mean that is like 750pts. so 1100 is either on the field or there is even more in reserves due to the fact they are riding in the storm ravens... to which once again I'd say to roll on divination for prescience and misfortune, perfect timing. Misfortune as most SR. armies are SM so not only will it help out against the jink saves but making the marine forces re-roll successful 3+ saves. If you get perfect timing you don't have to worry about the jink save and prescience should ensure that some of the plasma shots hit, all that has to happen is that you get a good number of glances or a lucky pen. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510684.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510684.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list DKs being level 1 psykers? Does that mean I can give up hammer hand (like I need that) or Dark Excommunication for a roll on Telekinesis? Imagine if you could get Gate Of Infinity?! You got three shots at it. That would be just silly business...]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510776.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510776.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list DKs cannot change their powers.
In GK only the inquisitors and archivist can switch (not Grand Masters or Captains either).
That would be OP

But its true i can take some divination against some armies (even against eldars it would probably be better)
Take the 10 TL meltas on first turn after disembarking from the pods you WS ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510822.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510822.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list
 Dezstiny wrote:
Don't forget that against flyers that you can also roll off of divination and try and take up misfortune/prescience. One RP to prescience a squad the other to get perfect timing for the flier. as you don't need JAWS against IG obviously and prescience on a drop pod wolves squad should take out any tanks by just deep-striking in back of them or on the sides+ perfect timing will rid all the IG trying to get cover saves. Against trip SR. I mean that is like 75pts. so 1100 is either on the field or there is even more in reserves due to the fact they are riding in the storm ravens... to which once again I'd say to roll on divination for prescience and misfortune, perfect timing. Misfortune as most SR. armies are SM so not only will it help out against the jink saves but making the marine forces re-roll successful 3+ saves. If you get perfect timing you don't have to worry about the jink save and prescience should ensure that some of the plasma shots hit, all that has to happen is that you get a good number of glances or a lucky pen.


That all sounds great but the Rune Priests podding in cannot manifest blessings or maledictions the turn they arrive. I find divination RPs to be questionable at best as they don't do anything on the turn they arrive.


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Against Daemons of Chaos there are 2 builds you will see. FMC or Screamer Star. Against FMC you pretty much move your dreadknight over to the place where the daemon prince make it fail a grounding check. Assault it kill it instantly through str 10 DF or FW, rinse and repeat. He's got 2 drop pods 2 grey hunter units wolf guard, henchmen in rhinos, rhinos... he'll at least drop 1 probably 2 FMC per turn. Against Screamer Star that is a laugh fest. He charges in with 3 dreadknights uses Dark Excommunion and followingly wipes the entire unit in proably 1 maybe 2 assault phases. All the while the Grey hunter units and the wolfguard and henchmen are capping up the map...


I have to disagree with you on this one. The flying circus is the most popular build for Daemons but straight Screamerstars are on there way out. There are better, more balanced daemons lists with elements of both lists you pointed out that could give the DKs a run for there money. I also think you are overestimating how easy it is to ground the FMCs and catch Screamers if they don't want to be assaulted.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510873.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510873.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list
That all sounds great but the Rune Priests podding in cannot manifest blessings or maledictions the turn they arrive. I find divination RPs to be questionable at best as they don't do anything on the turn they arrive.


That is where to if your going up against flyer armies... you won't have to worry about them not being on the field before they come in as on T1 you deep-strike half of the units you want onto the field (Grey hunters) then you drop pod in the wolf guard after where now they will be able to benefit from blessings and maledictions. At that, it's all about knowing who and when to utilize psychic powers for and against.

Chaos
Divination Misfortune, perfect timing, foreboading, and prescience will all be great abilities on the RP. Foreboading 4++, prescience re-rolling plasma/melta , Misortune F.U. heldrake perfect timing, goodbye chaos lord on bike.

SM
Divination Misfortune, perfect timing, foreboading, and prescience again. Misfortune for bikers, stormtalons, marines in general. Perfect timing for Stormtalons, Bikers, prescience on the plasma and melta guns

Eldar
Divination Misfortune, perfect timing, Yea you can re-roll your saves/ get rid of the pesky 4+ W.S. cover saves/ Reaper star re-rolling saves/ seer council re-rolling saves... really can't pass that up

GK
Misfortune, foreboading, perfect timing. Perfect timing for the Stormravens. Foreboading for anything to get saves from FW's and misfortune to deal with pali stars/ marines

Orks
Divination
Misfortune, perfect timing. Goodbye loota squad, re-roll your saves biker nob squad.

Nids
Keep Codex Psychic Powers in the case of Mawlocs, Tervigons, Carnifex, Exocrine, and Tyrannofex. If they're running majorly FMC 2x FLyrants multiple Croans switch in for Divination and get perfect timing, misfortune. Perfect timing on the croans or flyrants. Misfortune as well.

Sisters
depends on how I'm feeling and what they have really... probably Keep for Living Lightning as they run so many vehicles

Necs
Keep Codex Psychic Powers Jaws, Living Lightning for Destroyer Lords, and Barges

Tau
Keep Codex Psychic Powers for Jaws on RIptides

Daemons
Divination Misfortune, Foreboading, re-rolling sucesful saves on daemons, and 4++ against them... couldn't ask for more. Or you get ballsy take up a R.P. and JAWS the heralds if they are nurgle or tzeentch.

DE
Divination Presicence vs vehicles (melta guns) Foreboading 4++ against lance shots, Misfortune on beastpack or vehicles to make them re-roll cover saves or flickerfield saves. It's really between that or L.L. which gives you range over the entire field and is also str 7 which Is also useful as DE is very vast and the skimmers can easily pull out of your range, so having the ability to always shoot them is always a +

IG
Divination perfect timing, misfortune, prescience. Prescience on meltas and plasma. Misfortune for tanks, fliers and guardsman, perfect timing for guardsman and fliers

Really what you see is that the times you keep the psychic powers you really want to and the times you don't you actually would be better off without them so... Divination is very good take in my opinion on R.P.

I have to disagree with you on this one. The flying circus is the most popular build for Daemons but straight Screamerstars are on there way out. There are better, more balanced daemons lists with elements of both lists you pointed out that could give the DKs a run for there money. I also think you are overestimating how easy it is to ground the FMCs and catch Screamers if they don't want to be assaulted.


I agree on the flying circus part but, the it can be done which is all that matters... at least it's not (well I'm screwed... type of situation ) also I agree there also other more balanced builds although you just don't see them too often. As for being able to catch them... My army is very well balanced and has the speed to catch them so that is why for me I said they are easy to catch. However what has to be noted is that in the above list there are 3 shunting knights, and 2 drop pods coming in turn 1... there really isn't a way for them to get away if they tried. 30" shunt then next turn 12" move then assault 2d6... pretty hard not to make that... and drop pods are going to be right on top of them/ supported by the knights

Edit**
I also keep totally forgetting about Coteaz.
Coteaz can take up 2 psychic powers from divination as well. He can grant an even higher chance to pull out perfect timing or misfortune.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510931.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6510931.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list DKs, yes they are great but i prefer more threats as the DK already have big SHOOT AT ME signs...
So i was wondering if instead of the whirlwind (who i must admit does not really fit the them and style of the army), squad of 4 SW bikers would not be better.
They have 4 attacks on the charge, are not really expensive and while they are obviously not RW or WS bikers, they can still help the list a bit i think.
I could keep them in low profile at deployment and turbo boost them on T1 for a T2 charge with the rest.
And with their krak grenades they would be another threat to Wave Serpents]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6514388.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6514388.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list SW bikes?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6517617.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6517617.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list TL along with a stormraven loaded up with a tech marine (grenade chassis) and a hoard of DCAs and a banisher. I expected a complete route by turn 3 however my opponents dice absolutely hated him and mine were lukewarm. We went 6 turns and by the end he won - think the score was 12 - 8 or something like that. Overall I don't think this is an indicative game of what would normally have happened however it was pretty funny seeing jaws work on bikes when it really should have been very ho-hum. Same with the heavy incinerators. Sure I should have killed a hew bikes here and there but, wow, by the end of the game he had two bikes left that could score. Like I said it was a fun game just for how poorly his dice were rolling. Otherwise I probably could have gotten in two games last night.

One suggestion he made was to drop the WG and pick up some LF+DP+Inquistor making them TL and I was able to pick up another acolyte. I'm also swapping out the plasma in the GH units for meltas to make up for the loss of meltas from the WG. We'll see how that goes next Thursday.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
sleekid wrote:
any idea on the SW bikes?


If you take bikes your losing the third pod you need to make sure the 2 GH+RP units get in on turn one to add to the fun of the three shunting DK.

I would like to say that in the two games I've played with this list I couldn't fit two pods plus three DK plus the dudes getting out of the pods in a way that maximized the threat. In one game two of the DKs kinda sat out the first turn and didn't really jump and do stuff until the second turn. Although holding back a shunt may not be a bad thing to help with line breaker as this list has nothing that can turbo boost.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6517817.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6517817.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list GH droppods and one WG droppod.

I dont really agree on LF + DP + Inquisitor instead of WG.
Do you prefer 9 melta shots at close range or 4 missile shots (even with prescience)
Vs both vehicles and MC i think i prefer the 9 Meltas (even for a single turn), especially since they can then charge on T2 if necessary. It is another close combat threat for many top armies
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6518043.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6518043.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list
I see where you're coming from with the WG vs LF however you'll only ever get 9 shots with the meltas and it won't be on turn one unless you choose them over the second GH+RP (in my game last night they didn't show up until turn 4). It'll occur sometime way later in the game where as the LF can start shooting straight away with 5 AP3 TL S8 shots from across the board. It could also be the only decent flyer support you'd have.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6518097.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6518097.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list GH + 1 WG + RP, a pack of GH and a pack of WG with a RP.
So for me its more the 2nd pack of GH who will not be there T1 (more melta shots T1 this way^^)
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6519644.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6519644.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list LF+Ordo Hereticus w/ Psyocculum and mastery level 1, due to the complete lack of AA in the list. My storm Raven flew around the board with nothing to worry about.

I played SW allies with my IG over the summer in a couple of GT's and the LF paired with prescience were on point. Also it's 5 shots per turn with the ability to shoot a 2 targets.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6519942.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6519942.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list LF with prescience are great, but i am not sure they go well in the list :
- they bring the risk of giving first blood as they are fragile (few of them, just a 3+ and need LOS) while the only other unit on the board at first would be the 3 DK who can be behind LOS blocking terrain and further away


Automatically Appended Next Post:
After some more thinking i think i will take out the Whirlwind, give a standard to the GH pack with RP and take a Landspeeder with 2 Multi melta who will deep strike]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6521286.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6521286.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list LF + Squad Leader + Inquisitor (that's 7 dudes) in some cover pretty far away would not be a very enticing target when you have thee monstrous creatures and two units of GH+RP sitting on your front door. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6521805.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6521805.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list
But if i play second, i can put the DK behind LOS blocking terrain, i cant do that for LF.
And that is200pts and i dont have 200pts left on my list :(]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6522006.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6522006.page GMT Re:Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list LOS terrain about for something like a DK. Might be something that would give one of the DKs a cover save vs a melta or something but most of the time you're dealing with either things that ignore cover (Tau) or are fast enough to get around LOS cover (Eldar and DE) or will pod in themselves with a bunch of meltas. Now if you did hide your LF in ruins such that your opponent couldn't see them first turn and then you do move them so they can see your inquisitor can TL them and if you give the inquisitor a psyocculum then you'd be BS10 against pskers and their units (another suggestion from Franks1313). And with the inquisitor you can get some servo skulls to inhibit scout/infiltrators and make your pods and missile launchers hyper accurate.

Here's my latest rendition:

HQ: Inquisitor Coteaz

Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes, Razorback, Psybolt Ammunition
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes, Razorback, Psybolt Ammunition
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes

Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator, Nemesis Greatsword
Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator, Nemesis Greatsword
Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator

HQ: Rune Priest in Power Armour, JOTWW, LL
HQ: Rune Priest in Power Armour, JOTWW, MH

Troops: 9x GH, WS, Melta, DP
Troops: 9x GH, WS, Melta, DP

HQ: Ordo Hereticus Inquisitor, Psyocculum, Servo-skulls x3, Upgrade to Psyker

Heavy Support: 5x LF ML, 1x Squad Leader, DP
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6524348.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6524348.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list LF + inquisitor dont go in as well as some WG with multi melta.
Here is my revised list :

HQ : Inquisitor Coteaz

Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes, Razorback, Psybolt Ammunition
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes, Razorback, Psybolt Ammunition
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes

Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator, Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator,
Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator

HQ: Rune Priest in Power Armour, JOTWW, LL
HQ: Rune Priest in Power Armour, JOTWW, MH

Elites : 10 WG, 10 combi-melta, DP (one will go in GH squad 1) 1 RP goes there
Troops : 8 GH, melta, WS, DP (one WG goes there, 1 RP goes there)
Troops : 10 GH, 2 melta, DP
Fast Attack : Land Speeder 2MM

So i loose 3 acolytes, the LF + inquisitor, the swords and gain lots of Melta (11 on T1 instead of your 2), another squad in ennemy deployment zone (the WG) and the Land Speeder ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6525858.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6525858.page GMT Grey Knight/SW 1850 Tournament list WG instead of the GH)
So here is the revised list :

HQ : Inquisitor Coteaz

Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes, Razorback, Psybolt Ammunition
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes, Razorback, Psybolt Ammunition
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes
Troops: 3x Warrior Acolytes

Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator,
Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator,
Heavy Support: Nemesis Dreadknight, Personal Teleporter, Heavy Incinerator

HQ: Rune Priest in Power Armour, JOTWW, LL
HQ: Rune Priest in Power Armour, JOTWW, MH

Elites : 10 WG, 10 combi-melta, DP (one will go in GH squad 1) 1 RP goes there
Troops : 8 GH, melta, WS, DP (one WG goes there, 1 RP goes there)
Heavy Support : 6 LF (5 missiles)

Inquisition ally
Inquisitor, psyker, 2 skulls and the relic that gives a boost depending on ennemy (dont know english name)

This way i get the skulls, the LF with divination (either ignore cover or prescience) and potentially some good boosts (monster hunter vs tyranids, tank hunter vs Necrons mainly), more troops with 6 troops in the main detachment, a better alpha strike then before (with the LF)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6529363.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/577205/6529363.page GMT