<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/16.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress I am now done with the codex, can be downloaded here:
http://www.fancodices.com/ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex.pdf



====================================================
Hello everyone.

I am almost done with my second custom codex, which is the Chaos Space marines. I still got a bit of work left, re-defining some of the disciplines and adding a few new rules, you can preview it here:
http://www.fancodices.com/ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex.pdf

I have not yet written a rationale for the additions and changes, but in short it goes like this:
Chaos space marines has been slightly cheaper than loyalists because they are worse (they are likely going to break and flee at some point and can be overrun).
Chaos space marines are supposed to be slightly stronger than their loyalist counter part because the power of the warp give them benefits, therefore I made the chaos marks much more powerful and more expensive.
I added HQ's for each traitor legions which unlocks legion squads and troops, such as alpha legionnaires, Iron Warriors, etc. This means you can build a whole army of cheaper renegades chaos troops (similar to vanilla marines) or more high cost specialised legions troops.

TODO:
I will make some slight changes to the disciplines (for example making doom bolt primaris power in Tzeentch and similar).
Probably add some more Anti-air.
Will add some additional flavour do chaos cultists, if joined with a chaos sorcerer they can try to cast a major spell (that takes 1-3 turns) and kills chaos cultists in the progress, does something like:
- Voices on the vox: Disturbs the enemies reserve rolls somehow.
- Warp storm, not sure what this will do yet, perhaps large blasts template damages?
- Greater Summoning, makes the sorcerer a daemon prince.
Added chaos riders, which can be used to accompany a chaos lord on a mount.


Any feedback is welcome.


]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6923198.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6923198.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
I am conflicted. On one hand, I am sad that there are so many other chaos fan codices, because people are tired of them and not very many people will read this.

On another hand, I am very happy that there are so many other fan codices because the contrast between yours and all the others really highlights how good this is and how much garbage the others are. This is so much better than they are that it absolutely demolishes them.

The wording of "covert operations" is confusing, and there are things like "all units in his detachment
must have the same mark as him" should be "have the same mark as he (has). I don't know anything else because I have jumped around a lot.

The explosive rhino is a small stretch. It is also the best suggestion I have ever seen, and by that I mean I have never seen any one besides this one that even merits debating.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929407.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929407.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
pelicaniforce wrote:
This is really nice. Having actual separate units for different legions, with different options even, is vastly better than "legion traits," or anything else.That is the first step. The second step is that all of your different units are actually interesting. They are strong and simple, instead of having miles-long special rules that don't do anything, they have modest rules that are very effective.

I am conflicted. On one hand, I am sad that there are so many other chaos fan codices, because people are tired of them and not very many people will read this.

On another hand, I am very happy that there are so many other fan codices because the contrast between yours and all the others really highlights how good this is and how much garbage the others are. This is so much better than they are that it absolutely demolishes them.

The wording of "covert operations" is confusing, and there are things like "all units in his detachment
must have the same mark as him" should be "have the same mark as he (has). I don't know anything else because I have jumped around a lot.

The explosive rhino is a small stretch. It is also the best suggestion I have ever seen, and by that I mean I have never seen any one besides this one that even merits debating.


Thank you for taking your time to read my suggested codex, and thanks for the mostly positive but always constructive critique.

I also felt the issue of many people making custom codices in various styles and formats, the main issue is that they mostly put it up on a thread here on dakka dakka (and perhaps somewhere else), then it is lost shortly after when the thread get pushed down from the first page. Therefore I created http://www.fancodices.com, a place where you always can get all of my complementary codices for warhammer 40k. It is a long term project, but I hope to build codices for the majority of races (perhaps I go sisters or battle next).

Thanks for pointing out the errors in the covert operations rule, I will reread it and fix the issues you mention.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929482.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929482.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
My favorite thing is that you are writing a codex that has very little to do with any of the official versions, unlike the constant tweaking/wishlist/mashup that it is possible to do with fandexes. I was disappointed to see deathwing knights in you DA list, for example, but I love that Night Lords have their own terror squad troops choices that are totally different than other units, even to the point of changing what is considered a heavy or special weapon.

Chaos chosen have s5? of course they have s5! moving on! that is very good.

however, some of the profiles seem off-pitch, e.g. bs5 or attacks2]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929511.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929511.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress "The whole unit must purchase one of the following Marks of Chaos:"

I am doing a few changes to the codex now, will upload later.

To be honest, the purpose of my codices is not to make ithem different from the original, rather the opposite, my goal is to stay as close as the original codex while adding some spice and fixing the obvious balance errors that Games Workshop put in.
I prefer to stay close to the original codices because I want my codices to be quick to pick up and easily played.I don't like the idea of making a codex different for the sake of being different.

In some cases, like the DA it means small fixes, like having viable anti-air and not horrible over-priced flyers.

In other cases, like the chaos space marine codex, it will divert much more from the original because it is necessary due to the blandness of the original.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929628.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929628.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
Here's mine if you want to have a look
https://sites.google.com/site/potica40k/ultimate-codexes

(it's intended to go with a core rulebook fix too, so some things might look weird out of context)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929695.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929695.page GMT Re:www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
Psychic Blank:
A unit with at least one model with this special rule are ren-
dered immune to any psychic effects (good or bad). Also, if
this unit contains a psyker, the psyker can use any psychic
abilities.

Thousand Sons Sorceror:
Options:
• Replace his Boltgun with a Plasma pistol . . . . . 15pts
(This should be bolt pistol instead of boltgun)

Chaos Cultists:
• If the squad numbers less than ten models, one
Chaos Cultist may replace his Boltgun (should be autopistol?) with either
a special weapon or heavy weapon from the list to
the right. (There's no such list to the right. Looks like this was just copy-pasted out of the Space Marine Codex tbh)
• The Chaos Cultist (Champion?) may take items from the Melee
Weapons and/or Ranged Weapons sections of the
wargear list.
(Also, there are four 4 point cultists and a champion in the squad, yet it still costs 50 points? it should be 30 max)

Chaos Vindicator:
Wargear:
• Demolisher Cannon
• Storm bolter (I'm guessing this should probably be a twin-bolter instead?)
• Searchlight
• Smoke Launchers]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929719.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6929719.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
 lord_blackfang wrote:
I just skimmed but it seems like you have some cool ideas. Mind if I borrow anything?

Here's mine if you want to have a look
https://sites.google.com/site/potica40k/ultimate-codexes

(it's intended to go with a core rulebook fix too, so some things might look weird out of context)


Feel free to take anything from my own codex, I don't even mind if you lie and says it is your own ideas, just go ahead and steal away


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 sultanare wrote:
Just pointing out some typos(?) as i work my way through the document:

Psychic Blank:
A unit with at least one model with this special rule are ren-
dered immune to any psychic effects (good or bad). Also, if
this unit contains a psyker, the psyker can use any psychic
abilities.

Thousand Sons Sorceror:
Options:
• Replace his Boltgun with a Plasma pistol . . . . . 15pts
(This should be bolt pistol instead of boltgun)

Chaos Cultists:
• If the squad numbers less than ten models, one
Chaos Cultist may replace his Boltgun (should be autopistol?) with either
a special weapon or heavy weapon from the list to
the right. (There's no such list to the right. Looks like this was just copy-pasted out of the Space Marine Codex tbh)
• The Chaos Cultist (Champion?) may take items from the Melee
Weapons and/or Ranged Weapons sections of the
wargear list.
(Also, there are four 4 point cultists and a champion in the squad, yet it still costs 50 points? it should be 30 max)

Chaos Vindicator:
Wargear:
• Demolisher Cannon
• Storm bolter (I'm guessing this should probably be a twin-bolter instead?)
• Searchlight
• Smoke Launchers


Thank you for reading through my codex, I have fixed everything you pointed out (and yes I am guilty in copy and paste from chaos space marines to chaos cultists profile).

I done some more cleanup and smaller changes, one of the big things is that I now added the daemon prince together with a new rule called mass ritual (on the chaos cultists):


I am tempted to remove the daemon prince as an HQ option and only make it possible for him to enter the game through the mass ritual.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6930011.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6930011.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress http://www.fancodices.com/ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex.pdf

If anyone has suggestion to what to work on next I am open to suggestions.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6971848.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6971848.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
Why does the Iron Warrior Siege Master have one more Wound and Attack than everybody else?

The World Eater Commander has a Power Axe and WS7 where the Renegade Lord has WS6 but the Renegade Lord reduces the cost of Marks for all units - why would I get the World Eater Commander? Just for the Khorne Berzerkers?
Shouldn't that reduction also happen when taking for example the World Eater Commander?

No Daemon Weapons?

No God-specific vehicle upgrade?

Why does Chosen have S5?

Shouldn't the cost of the Helbrute be 100 points?

Shouldn't the base cost of Chaos Bikes be 110 points?

Shouldn't the base cost of Chaos Riders (what are these?) be 70 points?

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6972656.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6972656.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
Chaospling wrote:
I'll probably have more questions as I read it more thoroughly but what was the reason that Chaos Space Marines is at -1 to Leadership? That makes it even more easy to sweep them in close combat.

Why does the Iron Warrior Siege Master have one more Wound and Attack than everybody else?

TBH I don't know, it is an copy and paste mistake, I am will lower his wounds to 3.


The World Eater Commander has a Power Axe and WS7 where the Renegade Lord has WS6 but the Renegade Lord reduces the cost of Marks for all units - why would I get the World Eater Commander? Just for the Khorne Berzerkers?
Shouldn't that reduction also happen when taking for example the World Eater Commander?

You make a valid point here, perhaps the reduction should also be added for legions that are aligned with a specific chaos god.


No Daemon Weapons?

I did not find a unit in the original Chaos Codex that had daemon weapons, if you point out where in the rule book or chaos codex I can find it, I might add it to the more daemonic units in my codex (daemon prince/chaos riders).


No God-specific vehicle upgrade?

Except for the khorne rhino. Adding chaos marks for vehicles is not much work thou, I will consider it.


Why does Chosen have S5?

You are right, they should have STR 4 (probably copied their profile from possessed).


Shouldn't the cost of the Helbrute be 100 points?

I did not change this unit, it is extactly as in the original codex. I prefer not changing units and costs if it can be helped.


Shouldn't the base cost of Chaos Bikes be 110 points?

According to my original Chaos Codex, bikes costs 70 points, I did not make any changes to this unit.


Shouldn't the base cost of Chaos Riders (what are these?) be 70 points?

The chaos riders are a new unit that I invented, they are basically daemons on a chaos mount. The reason for adding them is that I wanted chaos lords with a mount to have a good unit to accompany them.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6987060.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6987060.page GMT Re:www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6987145.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6987145.page GMT Re:www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
I think Chaospling asks about the hebrute is because it has later been errataed to a 100 points instead of 105. The codex had the price at 100 points in other languages than english, turned out the foreign codii were correct and the english one was wrong.

Wouldnt it be easier to have the chaos riders upgrades listed as one? instead of split in both a marks upgrade and a steed upgrade?
For instance: may upgrade to mark of nurgle and palanquin for 33 points.

Furthermore, Gorka/morkanauts only pay 20 points for IWND, and they have 13 front armour and 5 HP, I think you could easily lower the cost of IWND on your warmachines.

Your khorne bezerkers doesnt have a champion in the base unit, all other seems to have one. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6987322.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6987322.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
On the other concern, i noticed explosive assault rhino rules. Just interested, did you make in yourself, or was you inspired by 1d4chan's Angry Marine exploding Rhinos?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6990397.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6990397.page GMT www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
- The Helbrute was corrected to cost 100 points.

- You changed the amount of Chaos Bikes. In the original codex it's three bikes in total: 3 x 20 + 10 (the champion) = 70

- The same calculation could be used for the Chaos Riders which only cost 50 points.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6991525.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6991525.page GMT Re:www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
 Clefty wrote:
Why not replace Split Fire and Slow and Purposeful with Relentless?

Split fire was to allow the psyker to target a different unit, but I think with the 7'th ed they can do that anyways now given the new psychic phase.

If I would replace splite fire and slow and purposeful with relentless, would that only allow them to fire overwatch, or does it have more implications?

I already gave thousands sons a buff through changing the tzeentch psyker powers, also rhino's got a buff in 7'th making thousands sons easier to deliver, so I will have to be careful not to buff them too much.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Britneyfan12 wrote:
I like it, very flavourful and good choices. I especially like those deranged cultists. And of course how youve handled the different traitor legions.

Thanks for the praise.


I think Chaospling asks about the hebrute is because it has later been errataed to a 100 points instead of 105. The codex had the price at 100 points in other languages than english, turned out the foreign codii were correct and the english one was wrong.

Ok, I changed the cost on the helbrute from 105 to 100 points.


Wouldnt it be easier to have the chaos riders upgrades listed as one? instead of split in both a marks upgrade and a steed upgrade?
For instance: may upgrade to mark of nurgle and palanquin for 33 points.

Not for me really, I used a pretty advanced text system (latex) to gererate the codex in PDF format, and have already defined macros for chaos marks and chaos mounts, but I will probably do the changes you recommended since they make sense.


Furthermore, Gorka/morkanauts only pay 20 points for IWND, and they have 13 front armour and 5 HP, I think you could easily lower the cost of IWND on your warmachines.

Hmm, if I did drop the price of IWND, it would make those units 10 points cheaper than the original codex. My thought on this was to make those vehicles more viable in smaller point games by removing the IWND but adding it back as an upgrade.
Also vehicles got their buff already in the 7'th, so I rather avoid buffing them further by lowering their price.


Your khorne bezerkers doesnt have a champion in the base unit, all other seems to have one.

This is an intended change for fluff reasons, i thought that berzerkers does not really care so much about ranks after their fall to chaos and are organized in a more flat structure.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Mezmerro wrote:
This codex need serious spellcheck and wording check. English is not my first, second or even third language, but it still hurts me to see this.

On the other concern, i noticed explosive assault rhino rules. Just interested, did you make in yourself, or was you inspired by 1d4chan's Angry Marine exploding Rhinos?


Yeah, I finally enabled spell checking in my editor and fixed about 50-75 spelling errors.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Chaospling wrote:
@flodihn:

- The Helbrute was corrected to cost 100 points.

- You changed the amount of Chaos Bikes. In the original codex it's three bikes in total: 3 x 20 + 10 (the champion) = 70

- The same calculation could be used for the Chaos Riders which only cost 50 points.



Herbruted [fixed]
Chaos Bikes [fixed] - Thanks for pointing this out, they are now a unit of 2 bikes + biker champion.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6998729.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6998729.page GMT Re:www.fancodices.com - ChaosSpaceMarinesCodex in progress
As for the army list, over all I like it. The only 'major' issues I have with it aren't limited to just this codex and are more symptomatic of GW's current design ethic so I can't fault you for them. I do have several points that reading the army list raised. I made notes as I read it.

Mark of Nurgle:
Why -1 to their weapon skill? In the past it's been a -1 to their initiave

Explosive Assault vehicle:
First off, the mechanics has laid out give me be a rather humorous image of a bunch of Khorne berzerkers charging out of a flamming rhino on fire screaming.
Second, if the explosion is successful what happens to the Rhino? Is it destroyed? Does it count as destroyed? Who gets credit for destroying it?

Chaos Undivided:
"A unit with at least one model containing with this special rule ignores the effect of desperate allies for itself and surrounding units with different type of Marks of Chaos."

So... does the army ignore desperate allies entirely for the purposes of Marks of Chaos? The rule says 'Surrounding units', but doesn't define surrounding. Does it just count the unit with the model with Mark of Chaos Unvidided (Don't really see the point to this) or is it like I said before and just the entire army? If the former... yeah you lost me. If the later, hell I'll take a single dude with Chaos Undivided, stick him in a unit and say party time.


Psychic blank:
Okay I get what you're saying when you say the unit is immune to psychic effects, but there isn't a rule for being immune to psychic abilities. And like wise, not all powers are described as being used directly against the unit. As an example, if I cast Iron arm on my Company Champion does the power stop working if that champion then attacks the unit in question? Like wise if I cast invisibility on a unit, does this unit continue to benfit from invisibility should a unit with a Psychic blank in it attack them? I think this rule would be clearer and less problematic if it was simple It can not be targeted by friendly psychic abilities, and it passes a Deny the Witch roll on a 2+ against all other type of psyhic abilities.

Discipline of Tzeentch:
Tzeentch Firestorm
Okay a little confussed by the application of this power. So I turn an enemy model into a spawn, that then sits there so they can shoot it next turn. Does it count as a kill for me or for my opponent in this situation?

Discipline of Nurgle:
Nurgles Rot: So I can add an additional wound, but it's not cumulative. So if I add a wound turn 1, suffer a wound turn 2... can I or can't I restore that wound?
Why wouldn't flyblown Palsy stack?

Nurgling Vomit:
The blessing targets a psyker. Can it be any psyker in the army? Or was it meant to say "The psyker himself"? The latter makes more sense based on what the sentence says, but the former would be more prefered. The rule then goes on to say that the nurglings have no effect on the movement, shooting, or assault phase, yet they grant additional attacks and count as extra wounds? How does that work?

Grammar nitpick-
Discipline of Slaanesh:
Under hysterical Frenzy, it reads: blessing that targets an single friendly non vehicle. It should be "blessing that targets a single friendly non-vehicle"

Hysterical Frenzy: So I can now have a unit of Chaos Space Marines that will be I5 with 6 attacks on the charge?

Warp Rift: So... this is a one shot power? It says after the first unit in the game has been destroyed, but there's nothing to say weather it's that one time, or any time after the first unit is destroyed.

Accursed Crozius:
I can understand why it would get Soul Blaze, but I don't understand why it doesn't have concussive when basically every other comparable example of this weapon does.

Spelling nitpick-
"Knives used by the Emperor’s Children, linked with arcane wires that puts the victim into chock."

I think you were going for:
"Knives used by the Emperor’s Children, lined with arcane wires that put their victim into shock."


Chaos Undivided Standard: Units within 12" of the standard auto-pass their leadership for desperate allies... but mark of Chaos undivided means they ignore it. So... the Chaos Unvided standard is just a fancy battle standard in this situation?


Grammar nitpick-
Under Chaos Space Marine Wargear list, special issue Wargear. It reads "A model may take uo one of the following" it should be "A model may take up to one each of the following".

Special issue Wargear:
Why can't the Dark Apostle take a Jump Pack?

Why would taking a Jump pack prevent me from taking Melta Bombs or Sigil of Corruption?

Character Options: I can't find the rules for the Juggernaut of Khorne, Palaquin of Nurgle, Disc of Tzeentch, or Steed of Slaanesh. Are you just defaulting to the current Chaos Space Marine Codex with them?

Chaos Sorcerer: I would honestly cap the non-named Sorcerers at Mastery Level 3. mastery level 4 seems to be the domain of special characters.

Alpha Legion Command Cell: So if I include a blank and a Psyker... how does that work for generating power dice?

Grammar nitpick-
Under the Word Bearer Lord entry, actually under all of the legion commander entries, it reads: In a detachment that contains an [commander name]
It should be: In a detachment that contains a [commander name]


Under the World Eater Commander entry, it reads that a detachment that contains a world eater commander may include Khorne Berzerkers units. So... can I not include Khorne Berzerkers otherwise? Why? Khorne Berzerkers aren't exclusivly tied to the World Eaters.
Same point for Emperor's Children Lord and Noise Marines, and the Deathguard Lord and Plague Marines.

With the Thousand Sons Sorcerer, I would cap him at Mastery Level 3.

Why can the Aspiring Chaos Sorcerer be given Mark of Khorne?

Grammar nitpick-
Under the Warpsmith entry it reads: "you may include an warpsmith in the detachment", it should be "a warpsmith"

Renegade Chaos Space Marines:
why is it Renegade Chaose Space Marines? Are they attempting to betray Chaos and return to the Imperium? Shouldn't it be just "Chaos Space Marines"?

Possessed:
The Stat-lines are listed as being for Chosen, and it says the chosen champion may take melta bombs.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6999057.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/600049/6999057.page GMT