vipoid wrote:
I was about to say that those seemed tolerable... and then I got to the last one.

 chalkobob wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Staunch Traditionalist: Friendly characters that are part of Cadian Detachments must issue and accept challenges wherever possible. If there is more than one friendly model with a rule that has this effect in a challenge, you may select which model issues or accepts the challenge. When fighting in challenges, friendly Characters that are part of Cadian Detachments can reroll failed To Hit and To Wound rolls.

Ouch. Are you absolutely sure this isn't mistranslated?

 Kanluwen wrote:

Celeritas 10 points
S User AP -- Melee, Deadly Riposte, Master-Crafted.
Deadly Riposte: When fighting in a challenge, a model wielding Celeritas has an Invulnerable Save of 4+. For each successful save made by the model during a challenge, it can immediately make an attack with Celeritas that hits automatically and has the Rending special rule, even if the model is slain as the result of failing other saves at the same time.
Well, at least it's cheap. Would have been nice if it gave some sort of bonus S or AP though.

The Iron Left 25 points
S +2 AP 3 Melee
...
Next

Volkov's Cane 10 points
S User AP 4 Melee, Concussive.
Company Commander only. When a model carrying Volkov's Cane issues an Order to a unit within 6", the Leadership test will only fail on a roll of a double 6.
Oh goody, another 10pt S3 melee weapon. The order thing seems a bit redundant, given that the formation already makes orders more likely to succeed. Also, isn't one of the main formation bonuses being able to issue orders within 24"? So, why on Terra would I want an item that only works when I'm at a quarter of that distance?

Standard of the Lost 113th 30 points
One Veteran in the army that can carry a Regimental Standard can instead carry the Standard of the Lost 113th. This follows the same rules as a Regimental Standard. At the start of your Movement Phase, you can declare that the bearer will plant the standard and fight to the last. The bearer's unit cannot Move, Run, or Charge for the rest of the game, but it and any friendly Cadian units within 18" are Fearless.
No comment.

Kabe's Herald 20 points
A Tank Commander in your army may be equipped with Kabe's Herald. When a model equipped with Kabe's Herald uses its Tank Orders special rule, you can pick any other Leman Russ squadrons within 12"; each of these squadrons is also affected by the Tank Order, as though it was part of the Tank Commander's unit. If the Tank Commander chose the "Gunners, Kill on Sight" order, any other squadrons that are affected gain the Split Fire special rule for the duration of the phase.
Seems alright if you use a lot of squadrons.

Wrath of Cadia 5 points
12" S3 AP -- Pistol, Punitive
Punitive: A weapon with this special rule always wounds on a roll of 4+. In addition, when making armour saves against attacks made by a weapon with this special rule, a roll of 3 or less will always fail, even if the target's Save characteristic is 3+ or better.
Amusing.

 Kanluwen wrote:


I didn't translate the body of the text. I translated the name of the trait, then consulted the Glossary.[/quote

Which Glossary? ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/671426/8280069.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/671426/8280069.page GMT

 vipoid wrote:
My thoughts in red:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Celeritas 10 points
S User AP -- Melee, Deadly Riposte, Master-Crafted.
Deadly Riposte: When fighting in a challenge, a model wielding Celeritas has an Invulnerable Save of 4+. For each successful save made by the model during a challenge, it can immediately make an attack with Celeritas that hits automatically and has the Rending special rule, even if the model is slain as the result of failing other saves at the same time.
Well, at least it's cheap. Would have been nice if it gave some sort of bonus S or AP though.

The Iron Left 25 points
S +2 AP 3 Melee
...
Next

Volkov's Cane 10 points
S User AP 4 Melee, Concussive.
Company Commander only. When a model carrying Volkov's Cane issues an Order to a unit within 6", the Leadership test will only fail on a roll of a double 6.
Oh goody, another 10pt S3 melee weapon. The order thing seems a bit redundant, given that the formation already makes orders more likely to succeed. Also, isn't one of the main formation bonuses being able to issue orders within 24"? So, why on Terra would I want an item that only works when I'm at a quarter of that distance?

Standard of the Lost 113th 30 points
One Veteran in the army that can carry a Regimental Standard can instead carry the Standard of the Lost 113th. This follows the same rules as a Regimental Standard. At the start of your Movement Phase, you can declare that the bearer will plant the standard and fight to the last. The bearer's unit cannot Move, Run, or Charge for the rest of the game, but it and any friendly Cadian units within 18" are Fearless.
No comment.

Kabe's Herald 20 points
A Tank Commander in your army may be equipped with Kabe's Herald. When a model equipped with Kabe's Herald uses its Tank Orders special rule, you can pick any other Leman Russ squadrons within 12"; each of these squadrons is also affected by the Tank Order, as though it was part of the Tank Commander's unit. If the Tank Commander chose the "Gunners, Kill on Sight" order, any other squadrons that are affected gain the Split Fire special rule for the duration of the phase.
Seems alright if you use a lot of squadrons.

Wrath of Cadia 5 points
12" S3 AP -- Pistol, Punitive
Punitive: A weapon with this special rule always wounds on a roll of 4+. In addition, when making armour saves against attacks made by a weapon with this special rule, a roll of 3 or less will always fail, even if the target's Save characteristic is 3+ or better.
Amusing.

 Kanluwen wrote:


I didn't translate the body of the text. I translated the name of the trait, then consulted the Glossary.

Which Glossary?

 Kanluwen wrote:

Why? It hits automatically and has Rending--even if the model dies.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Throw that onto the cheapest character that has access to it and if you get Warlord Trait #6, they HAVE to Challenge.

 Kanluwen wrote:

The Company Commander who is taken as part of a Battle Group Command formation gets to do the 24". It's a rule called "High Command", and it also allows 3 Orders per turn. Every other Company Command Squad(which basically every Formation that isn't Tanks requires them) has the standard range and Order numbers.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Company Command Squad in an Emperor's Blade Assault Company, take some objectives and then plant the standard. Your Veterans are now Objective Secured with Fearless.

 Kanluwen wrote:

An Emperor's Fist Armoured Company uses 3 Squadrons. Even doing two tanks per squad, you're looking at effectively 4 Tank Squadrons(Tank Commander and his mandatory bodyguard tank, 3 Leman Russ Squadrons) that can potentially Split Fire.

 vipoid wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Why? It hits automatically and has Rending--even if the model dies.

Yeah, but not on the model's actual attacks. And only in a challenge. And only if it succeeds on a 4+ save. With Rending that's a 1/12 chance of doing anything meaningful for each wound on your character.

I'm still not seeing the appeal.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Throw that onto the cheapest character that has access to it and if you get Warlord Trait #6, they HAVE to Challenge.

But why would I want to? This is an artefact that requires your commander to get murdered, and then hopes that a couple of S3 Rending attacks actually does something back.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Company Command Squad in an Emperor's Blade Assault Company, take some objectives and then plant the standard. Your Veterans are now Objective Secured with Fearless.

Moreover, their Fearless is dependant on your ability to protect another T3 unit which will have already been a priority target from the beginning of the game.

 Kanluwen wrote:

An Emperor's Fist Armoured Company uses 3 Squadrons. Even doing two tanks per squad, you're looking at effectively 4 Tank Squadrons(Tank Commander and his mandatory bodyguard tank, 3 Leman Russ Squadrons) that can potentially Split Fire.

It does require you to concentrate your forces though.

AncientSkarbrand wrote:
Anyone translated the tactical objectives yet?

 Kanluwen wrote:

 vipoid wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Why? It hits automatically and has Rending--even if the model dies.

Yeah, but not on the model's actual attacks. And only in a challenge. And only if it succeeds on a 4+ save. With Rending that's a 1/12 chance of doing anything meaningful for each wound on your character.

I'm still not seeing the appeal.

That's in addition to the model's actual attacks. Yes, it is "only in a challenge" and if it succeeds on a 4+ save, but really? For 10 points, that thing is a bloody steal.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Throw that onto the cheapest character that has access to it and if you get Warlord Trait #6, they HAVE to Challenge.

But why would I want to? This is an artefact that requires your commander to get murdered, and then hopes that a couple of S3 Rending attacks actually does something back.

Well, we need to see who exactly in the Cadian list has access to Relics. A Platoon Commander or a Commissar or a Priest with that?
Oh hell yes. That's worth it.

 Kanluwen wrote:

Company Command Squad in an Emperor's Blade Assault Company, take some objectives and then plant the standard. Your Veterans are now Objective Secured with Fearless.

They're also T3 with, at best, 4+ saves. Fearless only matters when you have models left.

Moreover, their Fearless is dependant on your ability to protect another T3 unit which will have already been a priority target from the beginning of the game.

 Kanluwen wrote:

An Emperor's Fist Armoured Company uses 3 Squadrons. Even doing two tanks per squad, you're looking at effectively 4 Tank Squadrons(Tank Commander and his mandatory bodyguard tank, 3 Leman Russ Squadrons) that can potentially Split Fire.

But then you have the issue of three/four tank squadrons all concentrated within a 24" space (12" either side of the commander) and that is just asking for trouble.

It does require you to concentrate your forces though.

Oh please do start flinging pie plates at my glomping of Tanks! Please do!

That many Leman Russ are going to be a pain in the rear to deal with.
Additionally? Kabe's Herald synergizes BEAUTIFULLY in that formation. The Formation bonus is BS4 when in 12" of the Tank Commander.
Too many tanks that becomes difficult to achieve without some clever spacing, but that many tanks firing at BS4 is actually pretty nice.

Oh, and the tanks when within 6" of the Techpriest Enginseer? If they suffer a Penetrating Hit, they force your opponent to roll 2D6 on the vehicle damage table and discard the highest.

Wow, so now we HAVE to take the formation to have a slightly better chance of surviving long enough to use this relic.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/671426/8280288.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/671426/8280288.page GMT
Look at the pictures of the leaks. It's not doom and gloom like you're espousing.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/671426/8280314.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/671426/8280314.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/671426/8280402.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/671426/8280402.page GMT

 KharnsRightHand wrote:
You know a character can challenge even without the warlord trait stating they have to, right?

War Kitten wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 War Kitten wrote:
I don't know, it would be kind of funny to see the look on my opponent's face when that humble company commander is re-rolling to hit and wound in CC.

Not just the Company Commander.

ANY model with the "Character" type. Ogryn/Bullgryn "sergeants", Infantry Squad Sergeants, Commissars, etc.

You're right, I forgot about that. Yeah, if I can get the book fun times will be had.

 War Kitten wrote:
Now I just need to pick up some Ogryns/Bullgryns. I already have a commissar. Any other funny combos that we can make with the new stuff?

 Tactical_Spam wrote:
I see we have no "CREEEEEEEEEEED" warlord traits... Just when I wanted to infiltrate my Warlord Titan

.....maybe because you've stuck it on the commander that comes with the artillery formation where the artillery count as LD8 and can't have vox?

I mean, it costs less than a vox net for four units, and it's practically guaranteed. I'll take that every time I field that formation.