http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net
Over Time I've started to cringe every time I hear a newer / less practiced player starting one of those armies, because the learning curve is so severe, and it always seem to put strain on the social contract between players.

I appreciate that those armies play like nothing else in the game. They are truely a unique play experience, and I see why people are drawn to it.

My question is, do you think that the complex rule mechanics that make those niche armies so distinctive are worth the strain they put on the casual gaming community? I.E. Would you rather Harlies were to Eldar in the same way as Militarum Tempestus are to Imperial Guard with applications of basic rules concepts being what separates them, or do you like them as they are (And similar examples for other armies).

ETA: One issue with divergent and complicated rules is that players can't help each other out, because the rules mechanics that apply to their own army are so different than their opponent. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757640.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757640.page GMT
The only person I've seen struggle with rules has been playing for about five years and has not grasped Infantry move 6" in the movement phase.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757689.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757689.page GMT

I've play with people who are not new players anymore and they still screw stuff up. Veteran players have the added hurdle of remembering how it used to be, and confusing that with how it works now. It's not just a 40K thing.



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Personally, I find that unique rules are the main thing that draws me to an army. Sometimes increased diversity means increased complexity. I'm very willing to sacrifice some simplicity for the sake of cool, flavorful rules.



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Pretty much auto pass all pin, fear, and most leadership tests, and get some special rules on turn one.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757709.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757709.page GMT
For example. The chaos boon table is rather complex allmost all players have to look it up but it really adds something to the game.

Poorly written stuff like: failing a charge because you rolled 8" when you needed 7" for your charge distance resulting in your modes just reaching difficult terrain and only being able to assault 6" or unclear wording is what I really dislike ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757726.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757726.page GMT
Complex rules are great, they offer a great many rules interactions and can offer deep, layered and nuanced gameplay.

Complex rules can still be simple, concise and easy to interpret.

Complicated rules are unnecessarily involved, they may require remembering multiple steps, exceptions, modifiers etc above what would be strictly necessary to arrive at the same result.

40K just now has too little of the former and too much of the latter. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757758.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757758.page GMT 40k is that the rules are really complicated, but they aren't very deep. So you have a lot of rules to memorize and interactions to argue about but in the end you're still making the same strategic decisions as you would be in a much simpler game. You could take out huge chunks of 40k's rules and not lose anything, IMO.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757861.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/695781/8757861.page GMT