<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "[1500] - Chaos Space Marines - Vanilla - Friendly tourney"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/14.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net [1500] - Chaos Space Marines - Vanilla - Friendly tourney previous "friendly" list didn't go so well.

I am one of those old-timey chaos players who prefer to see Marines on the table, but the current state of Chaos Space Marines, and 40k in general, sadly, do not favor boots on the ground.
It's all about big armor, big bots, and the size of your oval base...

Anyhoo, on to a revised list for the next Friendly Tourney.

Recap of Tourney rules (probably won't change much);
Rules for the Tourney;
only 2 detachments (any combo of CAD and Allied)
No LoW
No Formations
Soft scores for army comp, theme, sportsmanship
Forgeworld is on a case-by-case basis (I have none, so this isn't an issue for me)
0-2 on all non-troop selections
0-2 on all bike/jet-bike squads

List;

Bike Lord, Khorne, Sigil, Burning Brand, P.Weapon - 165 (I'd prefer a juggernaught, but no moneys and I already have a bike...)

Demon Prince, Wings/Armor, Khorne, Axe of BF - 220

8 berzerkers, P.fist champ, Rhino - 222

8 Marines, Plasma, P.Fist champ, Rhino - 191

15 Cultists, Hvy Stubber, Autoguns
15 Cultists, Flamer, shotgun - 165

MaulerFiend - stock
Heldrake - baleflamer
5 Nurgle Spawn - 475

Points leftover, could use some tips, but I'll likely just sink them into more marines or upgrades to the marines/rhinos.

Everything moves forward but the cultist blobs and just does what they can to the enemy. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8874200.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8874200.page GMT Re:[1500] - Chaos Space Marines - Vanilla - Friendly tourney WYSIWYG?

The burning brand on the bike lord isn't really an optimal choice. You want that lord up front and killy, getting into assault as quickly as possible, and he won't have many free turns to use the template. I'm assuming you're placing him in the nurgle spawn blob, which is a great choice. I'd swap the burning brand for the axe of blind fury, that'll make him a real powerhouse. You'll still have slight issues with walkers as you will be a relatively low S6 so you may want to avoid them.

Since the burning brand and axe of blind fury are both relics you probably can't bring them both unless this tournament specifically allows that. The most effective daemon princes I've seen fly around and ruin everyone's day with psychic powers, a khorne daemon prince will have issues with durability since he's only T5 W4 3+/5++. Your only hope is that he can be a distraction carnifex for the lord. Overall not a bad choice but keep his wargear as limited as possible - ditch the armor (always jink because you have no guns) but keep the wings.

A power fist on the berserkers won't end up being very helpful. Most of the time you'll end up in challenges, where your T4 no invuln I1 will be a liability. A power maul or a power sword would be better choices.

For rhinos, always take dozer blades. Always.

Marines are in the same boat, but use their ability to takebetter guns to shoot out of the rhino until forced to disembark.

Standard cultists shouldn't ever take upgrades - they are there for one purpose, and that is to be warm bodies on an objective.

Maulerfiend is great, as is the heldrake.

Overall your list will have an okay time. You'll need to find a way to crack open enemy transports, obliterators are a good choice. The berserkers should move 18" forward turn one (or 12" + smoke if you're facing a ton of firepower, don't bother against Tau though as they'll just remove the cover save) and then move 6" and disembark 6" on turn two. Marines should be opportunists with their shooting, plan on them being reactionary towards deep strikers and outflankers. Maulerfiend picks the toughest tank and beelines for it. The spawn/lord throw at enemy terminators and other death stars.

If you're going with a khorne theme, another option is just to take the plunge and bring them all as khorne daemonkin. If you have possessed models, this list fits pretty well into a blood host detachment (minus the heldrake).]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8874288.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8874288.page GMT [1500] - Chaos Space Marines - Vanilla - Friendly tourney WYSIWYG preferred but not strict, as long as it's reasonable.

Relics? According to my codex, they're artefacts. Top of page 69 states "one of each", not "one artefact per army".
Demon prince - I hate psychic powers. I hate the psychic phase. Recent games have only cemented that opinion.

P.Fist Berzerker - made before 5th edition, only one unit of generic berzerkers available. I'm just going wysiwyg on the unit.

Cultists - i have two DV sets, I'm just using what I have.

Not interested in allies, not even blood brothers. It's a personal choice. I feel Allies, Flyers and other non-sense introduced in 6th edition has dampened my opinion of the game and my preferred play-style. I'm already bending to flyers and dino-bots, I'll skip allies (all chaos should be in one book anyway...).

Other models - mostly 2nd-5th edition marines. Plenty of armor, 2+ units of non-berzerker cult marines (of each god). No demons. 2 DV sets. 1 each Heldrake and Maulerfiend...and only because those were gifts 2 years ago. 2 defilers. 1 land raider. 1 Vindicator. 2 Predators. 4 Oblits. Havocs... vary. I have to make the Spawn yet, 5+ bikes, etc. I have a pretty good collection IMO, without FW. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876343.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876343.page GMT [1500] - Chaos Space Marines - Vanilla - Friendly tourney http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876369.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876369.page GMT [1500] - Chaos Space Marines - Vanilla - Friendly tourney
Deadite wrote:
WYSIWYG preferred but not strict, as long as it's reasonable.

Relics? According to my codex, they're artefacts. Top of page 69 states "one of each", not "one artefact per army".
Demon prince - I hate psychic powers. I hate the psychic phase. Recent games have only cemented that opinion.

P.Fist Berzerker - made before 5th edition, only one unit of generic berzerkers available. I'm just going wysiwyg on the unit.

Cultists - i have two DV sets, I'm just using what I have.

Not interested in allies, not even blood brothers. It's a personal choice. I feel Allies, Flyers and other non-sense introduced in 6th edition has dampened my opinion of the game and my preferred play-style. I'm already bending to flyers and dino-bots, I'll skip allies (all chaos should be in one book anyway...).

Other models - mostly 2nd-5th edition marines. Plenty of armor, 2+ units of non-berzerker cult marines (of each god). No demons. 2 DV sets. 1 each Heldrake and Maulerfiend...and only because those were gifts 2 years ago. 2 defilers. 1 land raider. 1 Vindicator. 2 Predators. 4 Oblits. Havocs... vary. I have to make the Spawn yet, 5+ bikes, etc. I have a pretty good collection IMO, without FW.


Sorry about the relics, I didn't have my codex in front of me and looked at the 1d4 chan page instead which said one per army - looks like that page needs updating.

Power fist berserker can get work done, but be careful and try not to send him into a challenge he doesn't have a chance in.

Depending on how strict your WYSIWYG is you may be able to just say "hey this is a cultist blob without upgrades" but either way its a small points investment and won't be a big deal.

I'm not sure what you mean by allies, I didn't mention them. I mean changing what codex you're using from CSM to Khorne Daemonkin for this list.

Honestly the land raider filled to the brim with berserkers may be a pretty awesome delivery method, and gives you the transport-popping lascannons to boot.

KhorneontheCobb makes a great point in that you can't mix spawn and the lord with different marks, in which case I'd just mark everything with Khorne or leave them unmarked. The spawn only need to last while the lord gets across the table, once he's in the enemy's lines it's going to be pure pandemonium.

Here's a possible list for you to run:

HQ
1 Chaos Lord (Axe of Blind Fury, Bike, Mark of Khorne, Sigil of Corruption, Warlord) 155pts

Troops
15 Chaos Cultists (Shotgun, Heavy Stubber) 77pts
5 Chaos Space Marines (Plasma Gun, Rhino w/ Dozer Blade) 130pts
10 Khorne Berserkers (Power Fist) 225pts

Fast Attack
5 Chaos Spawn 150pts
1 Heldrake (Baleflamer) 170pts

Heavy Support
Chaos Land Raider (Dirge Caster, Dozer Blade) 240pts
Maulerfiend 125pts
3 Obliterators (Mark of Nurgle) 228pts

The lord joins the spawn and rushes up the table. Berserkers go into the land raider. Cultists camp on a backfield objective (there were a few extra points so I tossed misc upgrades on them). Marines troubleshoot deep strikers and outflankers. Obliterator's focus is on enemy transports and on things that have the same job as them (providing fire support). Turn the heldrake and maulerfiend on their specialized targets (MEQ and vehicles, respectively).]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876523.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876523.page GMT [1500] - Chaos Space Marines - Vanilla - Friendly tourney csm?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876733.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876733.page GMT [1500] - Chaos Space Marines - Vanilla - Friendly tourney
Deadite wrote:
I like that list... but... violates one of the tourney rules. Limited to 2 Heavy support selections. So how about swapping the raider for a rhino and more csm?


Oops, my bad. Honestly I see you getting more mileage out of a land raider than a maulerfiend. The raider is a force multiplier in that it can likely deliver your berserkers to where they need to be safely and let them do the one thing that zerkers do very well: charge first. In addition it can cover some of the maulerfiend's anti-vehicle role with its lascannons. With no enemy LoW's and 1500 being just under the point in which armies start to field lots of dedicated anti-armor, I think your land raider is going to run around the board virtually unchallenged. Which, side note: point your lord/spawn at things that can hurt the raider, and the raider at things that will double out the lord.

I think what this list is lacking is additional troop support to cover midfield objectives and cause trouble for deep striking or highly mobile enemy units. Swapping out the maulerfiend for another 5-man chaos space marine squad with a meltagun (and a rhino w/ a dozer blade) is a great addition and is exactly 125 points. The meltagun again helps with the anti-vehicle you're losing.

If you end up facing an army with a ton of infantry (like orks) you may find yourself in need of more templates. So based on your knowledge of your local meta you may want to swap out the chaos space marine guns to be flamer/combi-flamer or something like that, juggling around a few minor upgrades as necessary. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876764.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876764.page GMT [1500] - Chaos Space Marines - Vanilla - Friendly tourney http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876805.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8876805.page GMT [1500] - Chaos Space Marines - Vanilla - Friendly tourney
exaltedrage05 wrote:

I think what this list is lacking is additional troop support to cover midfield objectives and cause trouble for deep striking or highly mobile enemy units. Swapping out the maulerfiend for another 5-man chaos space marine squad with a meltagun (and a rhino w/ a dozer blade) is a great addition and is exactly 125 points. The meltagun again helps with the anti-vehicle you're losing.


Good constructive criticism. I like it. Thank you!
I also like your proposed changes, definitely worth testing out.

I may just have to play around with points in HS and Troops.
I'm thinking a viable alternative may be dropping the Zerker's to 8 and using those spare points for a Rhino. Keeping the Fiend and trading the Raider for a Winged DP, possibly (and I am loathe to write this) as a psyker... maybe even as a very expensive second helldrake (take the Brand and just torch things from the air and beat up things on the ground). Might be a way to help cover midfield objectives and cause trouble for deep strikers/mobile units.

Thoughts?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8878557.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/701135/8878557.page GMT