<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/16.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset Warhammer 40,000 Custom Redux

Cover:
Spoiler:


Here is the last edition of Warhammer 40,000 you will need. It is a renovated ruleset, completely playable as is without need to refer to any other sources. It takes the best rules from the past and present and polishes them up with several new additions.
Custom Redux is for all who want a more competitive game suitable for pick up games and tournaments. It is for people who want faster games that have more depth and make more sense.

Blog:Warhammer 40,000 Custom Redux

Rules: Custom Redux Rules

Overview
Spoiler:

Streamlined Pre-game: Less random tables are needed before starting a game. No more random Warlord Traits or Psykers who forget Powers between battles.

Abstracted Line of Sight: Line of Sight has returned to its roots no more peeking through pinholes in walls or having to take hedges for cover instead of trees. Cover can now be representative instead of having to be absolute. This allows for a much greater variety of terrain pieces to be effective.

Rebalanced Phases: Now all phases of the game can make or break an army. Mobility, Range, and Melee are all now very important factors. Run moves can now officially be made as an addition to normal movement in the Movement phase. Unengaged models may still fire their weapons instead of standing around even if their unit is locked in combat. You should now have less trouble getting into the assault thanks to assaults out of Deepstrike, Outflank, and stationary Transports. Winning an assault is now a much more rewarding process as they may then consolidate much farther or even launch another charge.

Selective Overwatch: Overwatch now only comes up if you ready a unit to receive charge by not firing in the shooting phase or during special circumstances such as Charges out of Reserves or Charges during Consolidation. It can also be much more powerful as giving up a unit's Shooting phase allows them to fire at Full Ballistic Skill instead of wasting time hoping for 6's.

Resilient Vehicles: Vehicles make a triumphant return with a new Vehicle Damage table and being able survive having zero hull points. Vehicle Ramming is now a deadly option and Walkers have been given their own version of the Tank Shock. Pintle-mounted weapons may now fulfill their roll by firing Overwatch.

Down to Earth Flyers: Flyers have been brought in much closer to the rest of the table. Now they can be assaulted by Jump and Jet Pack units as well as only halving a unit's Ballistic Skill instead of Snapshots. Flyers may also now initiate Dog-fights in order to bring down Jinking opponents. Finally Fighter Aces and Special Manouevres make a return.

Potent Psykers: No more Psychic phase or random powers, instead all powers have been rebalanced to be roughly equal. Psykers now work much like they used to simply needing to pass a leadership test. The best aspects from the last edition have been carried over, blessings can now be denied and without having to spend Warp Charges. Psykers trying to use Mastery Level 2 or higher powers also risk having to roll on the new Warp Calamity Table should they peril.

Interactive Buildings: Buildings are now a much more interactive component of the battlefield. They may now be breached, invaded, and even completely leveled. Ruins can give way to craters with enough firepower. It's also now easier to make your own buildings with rules and guidelines.

A Return to Limitations: The Force Organisation Chart has now been fully restored. No more cookie cutter formations and Allies have been reigned in with new limitations and disadvantages. Super Heavies and Gargantuans have been pushed back into their rightful place, Apocalypse.

Reworked Missions: Missions have been redone from the ground up to allow victory through objectives or simply wiping out your opponent. They are now much less random and should greatly ease Tournament play.

Optional Rules: Everything from Mysterious Objectives to a new Alternating Turn Structure can implemented to customize your experience.

Custom Redux Codexes: All new Codexes tailored for the new core rules and incorporating all new units and units that haven't been seen in years. Each Codex is a self contained Army List with everything needed to play.

And much much more: All of the changes are too numerous to list in a single post, but have a look yourself and you'll find that their isn't a detail that hasn't been put under the spotlight.


Current State of Custom Redux:
Core Ruleset: Finished. Some sections are a little rough and may be subject to change. Needs critique and playtesting.

Codex Sisters of Battle: Finished. Needs playtesting. Codex subject to change to fit with the Core Ruleset.

Dataslate Assassins: Finished. Needs playtesting, but pretty solid.

Dataslate Imperialis: Finished. Needs playtesting, but pretty solid.

Future Codexes: The next Codex will likely be one of the more popular Armies. Armies that are currently in a great amount of Flux will come later (Ad Mech, Inquisition, Tyranids).

I would like to get feedback on what is sure to be a game changer. Let me know if you would like to contribute to the project here or on the Blog.





]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8954499.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8954499.page GMT Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset
Question: do you have or plan to have anything like rites of war from 30k?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8954528.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8954528.page GMT Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset
 Lance845 wrote:
Excited to look this over. Will be sure to do so over the next day or so.

Question: do you have or plan to have anything like rites of war from 30k?

Have a look at the Codex Sisters of Battle. All Codexes will come with a few Alternative Army Lists. Codex Sisters of Battle allows you to build an all Deep Striking Army with benefits and limitations or even an all Ecclesiarchy List with their own army wide Mechanics.

Think of it like having a lot more Army List Options similar to the Space Marine Siege Assault List or Elysian Drop Troops List.

Rites of War accomplish pretty much the same thing, but I prefer the Alternative Army List approach.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8954538.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8954538.page GMT Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8954955.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8954955.page GMT Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset
 CryonicCenobyte wrote:
Has it been playtested?

Not nearly enough, that's where I can definitely use input from the Community.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8956443.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8956443.page GMT Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset
Armor Saves and AP Values

My first thought comes with saves.

You are writing an entirely new base rule book. Armor saves are some kind of exception to the normal rules of every other stat in the stat line. It reminds me a lot of THACO from dnd in that it's sort of working backwards. (really every other stat is closer to thaco but this is the odd ball)

So, why not make armor saves work exactly like BS.

A Armor save of 5 succeeds on a 2+. a 6 grants a reroll at 6+.

By building the save system to function the same way you can eliminate damaging save rerolls like a 2+ rerollable by changing those "rerolls" to +1 or +2 to save potentially granting a reroll or just improving it.

The darkshroud currently allows for 2+ rerollable cover saves. If the darkshround was just a +2 to cover saves it might instead grant a 2+/5+. or some such. A much more reasonable barrier to hit and much easier to scale across the entire game.

This also opens up the possibility for AP values to act as a modifier instead of being an all or nothing value.

AP
6 = 1
5 = 2
4 = 3
3 = 4
2 = 5
1 = 6

So what was a AP3 shot at what was a 2+ save used to do nothing. Now a AP4 shot against a Sv 5 reduces the save to 1 which only succeeds on a 6+. What was AP6 is no longer basically worthless.

Vehicles

Your rule set maintains the same issues with vehicles that the base game does.

There is no reason for WH40k to have so many different resolution methods. Vehicles should not function fundamentally different from every other model. Vehicles should have a T value based on their current highest av.

av = T
10 = 6
11 = 7
12 = 8
13 = 9
14 = 10

Armor saves should be based on the actual value of the facing.

av = sv
14 = 2+
12-13 = 3+
10-11 = 4+

The idea here is that a tank is a tank and is always tough, but might have more vulnerable places in the rear allowing lower AP weapons to penetrate.

If you want to maintain the vehicle damage charts/glance/pen, then if your to hit roll is 3+ a roll of 3 is a glance 4+ are pen. Interestingly enough if you do the math on this system it actually works out to mostly use the same rolls you would be using now with the AV system but now it's not an entirely different resolution method and vehicles gain a save to make them a little more durable.

Optional Rules: Command Deck

While I don't mind an option for randomized unit selection, what I really want is an option for alternating unit selection. There is a lot more tactics that can come into play when you activate one unit, run it through all it's phases, and then your enemy responds. Which unit do you send forward first to be the first target of his next activation? Do you activate psykers early to buff your army or wait for your enemy to move into more favorable positions so they can be attacked? That is the method I want.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Overwatch
I propose a different method of overwatch.

A during shooting a unit can choose to shoot, run, or enter overwatch. A unit in overwatch may interrupt the enemies movement phase to make a shooting attack at full BS but 1/2 range. All units begin the game deployed in overwatch.

This accomplishes several things.
1) It allows armies who are just outside effective range for their weapons to "lay ambushes" for advancing enemies who get too greedy.
2) It allows the strategic choice of taking your shots in your shooting phase or keeping some shots in reserve to try and discourage advancing enemy units.
3) It allows the opponent the opportunity to try and send decoys to eat up your overwatch to allow for other units to advance unharmed.

Basically it's a big ball of strategic counter play. The game only benefits from more of that.

Over watch does not need to be based on charging units. If the idea is that we are using turns to represent a real time battle field then each unit shooting once is realistic. You either shoot overwatch at enemy units that enter your range or you shoot during your shooting.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Bookmark 18

Under the assault phase the final book mark is not named.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sweeping Advances/assault phase

I recently participated in a thread that went through a lot of things with the assault phase. Lemme repost the bullet points here.

1) Any unit that arrives from delivery systems that would normally restrict them from charging on the turn they arrive (infiltrate, outflank, deepstrike, disembarking) can now charge, but it's a disordered charge and they loose all bonuses in the doing of it. To expand, any special rule that would allow a unit to charge in these circumstances now allows them to charge normally with all special rules and bonuses intact (assault vehicles, formations rules, Genestealer cult's Cult Ambush roll of 6).

2) Sweeping advances are rolled as normal, but instead of eliminating the loosing unit it suffers a number of wounds, that cannot be mitigated by any means, equal to the difference if the winner of the combat has the higher result. This means no saves, no FNP, no reanimation protocols.

3) You can shoot at units locked in combat but any to hit roll of 1 hits friendly models starting with the closest. These rolls of 1 are not misses that can be rerolled since they did hit.

These changes eliminate the exploitable aspects of assault (using locked in combat to act as a invulnerability for the unit), the over powered elements of assault (where 1 wound can potentially eliminate 30 wounds of models), and allow for assault to actually occur more often allowing the units who specialize in it to get in there and get it done.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8957952.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8957952.page GMT Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset
The Command Deck does let you choose the unit you want to activate. It is the way it is to accommodate Armies of different sizes. A MSU army versus an elite Deathstar Army work under the system because neither player gets to activate more points of their army sooner than their opponent over the course of the game.

I'm not a fan of modifiers, so the AP system will stay the same. I really don't see a problem with it. If the game was on the scale of Inquisitor or Even Dark Heresy, I could see that being implemented.

Vehicles are also fine as is. The whole high toughness with Armor saves thing is for Monstrous Creatures. Tanks are meant to shield Infantry from other Infantry. They need to be Invulnerable to Small Arms Fire. The trade off is that they lose effectiveness over the course of the game.

I've already increased the uses of Overwatch, I don't see the need to have it interfere with Movement. It would also discourage fast Armies and slow down the game.

Assault needs Sweeping Advances to be effective. Otherwise some Hoard Armies can Tarpit indefinitely. Also Assault is trade off between the safety of firing from cover and range and having move up the board to engage. Without Sweeping Advances a lot of time Assault isn't worth it.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8958947.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8958947.page GMT Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8959069.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8959069.page GMT Re:Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset long time stalker of the forums trying your new set of rules that me and a friend find interesting. We hit a snag however on interpretations of two major rules and need clarification before we can play test and send you some data back.

1. Vehicle table is our first snag

Me and my friend want additional clarification on the 0hp rule. We thought it made sense that if you only glance a 0hp vehicle and role the damage table to determine what happened to it when shot by small arms,like heavy bolters and scatter lasers ect.

But now we realize that if a strength 9 las cannon glances that means we again have to roll the dice with a potential 50/50 result. We are confused by this as lascannons are incredibly powerful and would still cause serious damage even on a glance.

So there are scenarios where we role our las cannons shooting and say i have 4 they all hit a rhino but all 4 only glance (don't laugh i role 4 ones like its nobody's business) so now the rhino is -1 HP technically and then if i role 4 ones and twos there is a very real probability that rhino will still be alive come the next turn and could rejoin the fight if our shooting misses.

We found this alarming when we applied this to the likes of a Baneblade or imperial knight.

2. Quick clarification on shooting at fliers. Rules say you halve your BS to determine what numbers your rolling to hit a flyer. Do i round up or down if i am BS 5?

Thanks again for the awesome rules, we will give it a try and tell you how we fare once we get some clarification.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8959306.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8959306.page GMT Re:Warhamer 40,000 Custom Redux a completed alternative ruleset
 husker98 wrote:
First ever post long time stalker of the forums trying your new set of rules that me and a friend find interesting. We hit a snag however on interpretations of two major rules and need clarification before we can play test and send you some data back.

1. Vehicle table is our first snag

Me and my friend want additional clarification on the 0hp rule. We thought it made sense that if you only glance a 0hp vehicle and role the damage table to determine what happened to it when shot by small arms,like heavy bolters and scatter lasers ect.

But now we realize that if a strength 9 las cannon glances that means we again have to roll the dice with a potential 50/50 result. We are confused by this as lascannons are incredibly powerful and would still cause serious damage even on a glance.

So there are scenarios where we role our las cannons shooting and say i have 4 they all hit a rhino but all 4 only glance (don't laugh i role 4 ones like its nobody's business) so now the rhino is -1 HP technically and then if i role 4 ones and twos there is a very real probability that rhino will still be alive come the next turn and could rejoin the fight if our shooting misses.

We found this alarming when we applied this to the likes of a Baneblade or imperial knight.

2. Quick clarification on shooting at fliers. Rules say you halve your BS to determine what numbers your rolling to hit a flyer. Do i round up or down if i am BS 5?

Thanks again for the awesome rules, we will give it a try and tell you how we fare once we get some clarification.


This is handled under page 5 "Dividing to conquer"
You always round up unless stated otherwise.

As for vehicles that's functioning as Intended. In 7th edition it would take 3 glances to take out a rhino. In Custom Redux it takes 4 and rolling 4+(or 3+ with AP1) on the damage table. Effectively adding 1 and a half Hull Points. Rolling that low is just bad dice. Of course rolling all 1's with Lascannons against the Rhino's front Armor doesn't even glance.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8959365.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/705062/8959365.page GMT