<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list"]]>

<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list 40K (Kill Teams excepted) and so I'll have a 1350 pts game with a player who'll bring his Grey Knights, with whom he only have played like 5 games so far. I chose 1350 pts because that way I can bring all my collection in one list (don't have much yet), I play Skitarii/AdMech and can detail my list if you want. My problem is that it looks like I'll be tabled by turn two, especially if he starts first. Here's his list:

1x Librarian, Cuirass of Sacrifice, Nemesis Daemonhammer - 130
1x Techmarine

5x Terminators, Incinerators - 175

10x Interceptors, 2 Incinerators - 260

2x Dreadknights Nemesis, Teleporter, Nemesis Greatsword, Heavy Incinerator, Heavy Psycannon - 550

Kaldor Draigo the one and only

I have 10 Vanguards with 1 Plasma Caliver, 5 Rangers with 2 Arquebii, 5 Rangers, 5 Infiltrators, 3 Kataphron Destroyers, 1 Techpriest, 1 Kastelan Robot Maniple, 1 Sydonian Dragoon and 1 Onager Dunecrawler.

My main problem is that he can basically wipe out a whole squad with his S6 flamers in one turn, and because of that 30" jump (WTF ?) he'll just appear and kill my whole squad in once, yeah. If I try to charge anything other than like the Librarian or the Techmarine with my Infiltrators they'll be sure to be ID on Overwatch flamers. So for the Skitarii side this doesn't bodes well. My Destroyers might have more chance, as do the Kastelan, but he won't be able do try do deflect anything since they almost all have template weapons. Just have to roll nice dice I guess ? I don't know anything about his Psychic phase too but if it's worst than what an Eldar psyker can do I just don't know what to expect.

Anyone have a few tips to give me ? What should I focus first if I get the first turn ? Something I might be able to beat in melee with my Infiltrators ? I'm not even sure my Dragoon would survive Overwatch against S6.

Thanks in advance !]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9192857.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9192857.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
EDIT: Forgot that NDK Heavy Incinerators have torrent. So you need to deploy even farther away if possible. Also try to position your guys so that it's hard to get many hits with the template.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193051.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193051.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
SJ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193109.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193109.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
With his 30" shunt, keep in mind that's once per game and he can't charge after using it. After that they have 12" move as they are jump units.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193341.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193341.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
Deploy your Vanguard as two five man units. He has five units at best, you have ten. He's on the other side of the table unless he deep strikes first turn. Either way he can't charge so use the Doctrina Imperitive that grants +3 WS and use the Kastelans to shoot his Interceptors, with AP3 they will put a tremendous first turn hurt on them.

Use the Cantical that allows re-rolling to hit and shoot the (grav I hope) Destroyers at his Terminator squad. You don't say the weapon on the Onager, if it's the TL Phosphor blaster shoot the Interceptors, or the Terminators if it's the Neuron Laser. Two turns of shooting should devastate both of the units leaving him crippled. Feed the Dreadknights five man units if you can't avoid them and shoot them with the grav destroyers when they're unengaged.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193357.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193357.page GMT Re:Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list DK on the other hand, is much more troublesome with the mobility.

I spot you only have one unit of Kataphron, so your Cult Mech is only allied detachment?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193384.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193384.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list

Fueli wrote:Deploy farther than 37" away if the shunt move scares you. I really can't say anything more than just shoot the crap out of Dreadknights and Interceptors and constantly move away from termies. Draigo is scary and comes with a teleport spell, but his unit can't charge after using it.

EDIT: Forgot that NDK Heavy Incinerators have torrent. So you need to deploy even farther away if possible. Also try to position your guys so that it's hard to get many hits with the template.

I'm afraid we'll be playing on a 2x2 table, but maybe we'll have two more tiles. He told me some units can sprint AND shoot even after teleporting, now that's scary.

jeffersonian000 wrote:Use vehicles, any vehicles. He has too many Incinerators, not enough Psycannons.

SJ

I play AdMech, vehicles, what is that ? Haha

No, I don't have any at home sadly.

troa wrote:Vehicles, and spread out to avoid the template hitting all your guys at once (positioning is key and helps avoid casualties). Make him use at least 2+ templates to kill any given squad(assuming you fail all saves or your armor value is bad enough for the incinerator to ignore it.

With his 30" shunt, keep in mind that's once per game and he can't charge after using it. After that they have 12" move as they are jump units.

Yeah he ignores my 4+ and my 6+ FNP won't save me. Only the Kastelans, the Datasmith and the Techpriest have better saves.

Solis Luna Astrum wrote: I play both armies and you should wipe the table with him. His weakness is too few units. Spread your army out as much as possible.

Deploy your Vanguard as two five man units. He has five units at best, you have ten. He's on the other side of the table unless he deep strikes first turn. Either way he can't charge so use the Doctrina Imperitive that grants +3 WS and use the Kastelans to shoot his Interceptors, with AP3 they will put a tremendous first turn hurt on them.

Use the Cantical that allows re-rolling to hit and shoot the (grav I hope) Destroyers at his Terminator squad. You don't say the weapon on the Onager, if it's the TL Phosphor blaster shoot the Interceptors, or the Terminators if it's the Neuron Laser. Two turns of shooting should devastate both of the units leaving him crippled. Feed the Dreadknights five man units if you can't avoid them and shoot them with the grav destroyers when they're unengaged.

Good idea to deploy my Vanguards in two squads. I used it as it is to benefit from Preferred Enemy with more models at first. If I do two squads I'll have to find 10 points to do that, I'll look into that. The Onager have the Neutron Laser and an additionnal Stubber, that I might drop to find the points for the second squad. Yes they have the Grav Cannons so I'd like them to stay alive more than one turn haha.

Neophyte2012 wrote:Shoot your Grav Destroyers at his Dread Knights first, his terminators are likely having Dragio tanking for them with 3++, which if he cast Sanctury, it become 2++, but the Terminators are easier to avoid and blockaded by your sacrifice unit, DK on the other hand, is much more troublesome with the mobility.

I spot you only have one unit of Kataphron, so your Cult Mech is only allied detachment?

Yes it's an Allied Detachment, I used whatever I could with what models I have. Can you chose yourself who to allocates the wounds to ? So I could take all the Wounds inflicted to my Destroyers unit with my Techpriest ? I don't think it works against templates, does it ? The Terminators can deep strike I guess ?

Thanks for the advice guys, what should I do with my infiltrators ? Keep them hidden until I can charge in a fight or use Infiltration to charge him first turn ? I'm afraid of Overwatch fire annihilating them.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193405.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193405.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193477.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193477.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
If you go first use Shroud Pslam and deploy your AdMec units in cover for a 4+ cover save. That should keep your Warlord and the robots safe. I'd probably put the Destroyers and plasma Vanguards in reserve, with only a 24" tile they will be able to shoot most anything on the turn they arrive.

Also a more detailed list of your army would be helpful, as you listed it I come up with about 1200 points so I'm curious what upgrades you have chosen.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193485.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193485.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list

The wounds are allocated to the nearest model from the firer. so even it is torrent and the template come from other direction, who are closet to the DK eat it first.

Yes, the Terminators can go Deep Strike, or Draigo will teleport with them from their back field to just in front you incase rolled a 1 or 2 in 1st turn reserve. If I were playing GK, I'd hide them behind LoS terrain to avoid opponent first volley (either because going 2nd or being seized inititive) then in psychic phase get some blessing up (invisibility, or sanctury, or Veil of Time) and use Gate of Inifinty forward. However, as pure GK, his major killing power come from close combat, and he cannot charge out of DS or GoI. So you will have time to run away from them. DK on the other hand, can jump 12 inch a turn so as Cult Mech and Skitarii, I don't think you can out run this MC, so better shoot it dead first.

If you have another unit or two of Grav Kataphron Destroyers, the battle is gonna be so much easier for you.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193542.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193542.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
I would say deploy on the back line let his unit teleport in and jump across the board. You will take heavy damage but kataphrons should survive to take out a knight at least.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193654.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193654.page GMT Re:Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list If you are playing on a 2x2 field then you will have nowhere to hide for your infantry.
His Dreadknights can move 30" and their flamers are torrent. meaning that he can easily control the whole field with them.
You should drop the rangers in favour of more plasma on your two 5x vanguard squads which you will have to put in reserve. Then when he jumps into your backline you can let them come from reserves (with a bit of luck on turn 2) and light them up with your plasma.
Put the Techpriest in your unit of Kataphrons to act as a 2+ shield from one side. Giving them a little bit more survivability.
Your Dragoon is

in this match-up. Everything has a S6 flamer. Your best chance would be running him into a unit of which you killed the flamers or the one with the least of them.
Otherwise you have quite the chance that he will be killed by overwatch.
Your main focus for the Kastelans would be the Interceptors if you give them the Twin-linked Heavy Phosphor Blasters. But they can also be use offensively against the Dreadknights. Give them the Powerfists, keep your Infiltrators close by because then you will both hit at the same time (since the Dreadknight is normally I4, as it becomes I3 while near your infiltrators) and you will have a decent chance to kill one of the Dreadknights. Just be careful for him casting force, because then he can easily wipe the floor with your robots.
Something you can also try to do with your infiltrators is charging a Dreadknight. Sure, their chance of victory is not that high. But your sheer number of attacks on the charge might kill it as you will be able to strike first because of your aura. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193674.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193674.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list MCs in the game.
However, they are rather vulnerable to grav weapons, since they are wounded on 2+ and then they only have their 5+ inv. save available. Its not hard to take one or two NDK's down in one or two rounds with your Kataphron Destroyers. Two units of three would be better.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193717.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9193717.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
SJ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9194013.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9194013.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list

Solis Luna Astrum wrote:Nemisis Strike Force, his units can run and shoot the the turn they arrive, but only the turn they arrive. Unfortunately the advantage you have, more units and decent shooting, is going to be erased if you play 1350 on a 2X2 board. If he goes first he will deep strike on top of you and if you go first he won't deploy any units on the board giving you nothing to shoot at first turn.

If you go first use Shroud Pslam and deploy your AdMec units in cover for a 4+ cover save. That should keep your Warlord and the robots safe. I'd probably put the Destroyers and plasma Vanguards in reserve, with only a 24" tile they will be able to shoot most anything on the turn they arrive.

Also a more detailed list of your army would be helpful, as you listed it I come up with about 1200 points so I'm curious what upgrades you have chosen.

But the flamers ignore cover right ? Hiding them for LoS I understand, but no cover will save me here I'm afraid :/ Having reserves is a good idea, but I always fear they'll never arrive and every other squad will be dead. I'll post my list at the bottom of this answer !

rawne2510 wrote:When you say 2x2 you mean tiles right?

I would say deploy on the back line let his unit teleport in and jump across the board. You will take heavy damage but kataphrons should survive to take out a knight at least.

Yes that's what I had in mind, keeping them as far as I can. I have a nice range myself and two AP3 sniper shots at 60", plus my 48" S10 AP1 Blast Onager. And yes, 2x2 tiles, I don't know the exact measurements sorry, could it be they're 24" large each ?

Arlen wrote:His list is quite a pain for your more heavy infantry based Skitarii list.
If you are playing on a 2x2 field then you will have nowhere to hide for your infantry.
His Dreadknights can move 30" and their flamers are torrent. meaning that he can easily control the whole field with them.
You should drop the rangers in favour of more plasma on your two 5x vanguard squads which you will have to put in reserve. Then when he jumps into your backline you can let them come from reserves (with a bit of luck on turn 2) and light them up with your plasma.
Put the Techpriest in your unit of Kataphrons to act as a 2+ shield from one side. Giving them a little bit more survivability.
Your Dragoon is in this match-up. Everything has a S6 flamer. Your best chance would be running him into a unit of which you killed the flamers or the one with the least of them.
Otherwise you have quite the chance that he will be killed by overwatch.
Your main focus for the Kastelans would be the Interceptors if you give them the Twin-linked Heavy Phosphor Blasters. But they can also be use offensively against the Dreadknights. Give them the Powerfists, keep your Infiltrators close by because then you will both hit at the same time (since the Dreadknight is normally I4, as it becomes I3 while near your infiltrators) and you will have a decent chance to kill one of the Dreadknights. Just be careful for him casting force, because then he can easily wipe the floor with your robots.
Something you can also try to do with your infiltrators is charging a Dreadknight. Sure, their chance of victory is not that high. But your sheer number of attacks on the charge might kill it as you will be able to strike first because of your aura.

I'm already planning to have the Techpriest in the Kataphron unit, so I could repair one from time to time. Honestly I'm not eager on having 5 models less, that's a squad that can be targeted instead of my more important guys. It's nice to have 9 plasma shots but if they never come out of reservers, miss all their shots or just get incinerated that won't help me :/ The best target for the Dragoon would be the Interceptor squad I think, I don't know their regular weapons but they only have two Incinerators. The Infiltrators flank attack is the best idea for them to not have them killed stupidly in Overwatch. I'm afraid of CC even with my Kastelans, the Dreadknights still have big swords that look mean, and I'd be better focusing them with my snipers and Kataphrons I think. I still have torrent flamers with both Kataphrons too, that may be useful, especially since I can shoot all my weapons at once.

jeffersonian000 wrote:Last I checked, 7th ed lets you take detachments and formations from any army. The statement "I play AdMech, where are the vehicles" simply means you are not trying. Good luck, though. I'll take my AdMech Knights home, now.

SJ

It's not that I'm not trying, it's just that it's ALL I have in models in 40k, I'm not going to buy some Rhinos for a single 1350 pts game after all. In the future I considered some Tempestus allies but the opinions about that are diverse on this forum

Thanks for the good luck anyway

So yes in short I'll be playing on 2x2 tiles (the big square ones), but I'll ask if we can up to 4x2 so we get more time before getting shot. I don't have any other options as that list is my whole AdMech army right now, so no adding more Kataphrons. It's just a friendly game to try out both our armies, I just asked for a little advice as I'm a beginner and I can say I'm quite overwhelmed by your answers, thank you all, really

Here's my list below:

Spoiler:

*Now I remember why he said he feared the Kastelans. I don't know if he knows about this relic yet but it gives all the units weapons Cognis, so Overwatch fired at BS2, with the flamers getting 3 shots straight each. Plus the Gamma Gun of the Datasmith, S6 AP2, making my unit kinda fearsome if he charges it with just his two Dreadknights. If I keep my Infiltrators nearby I can assure myself to hit at the same time as them, as Arlen said earlier. The datasmith also has a Powerfist (nice) and a Dataspike (that's something) so I'd best not forget him. I'll just keep the FNP protocol up so I get a little save and it should be nice enough. Comes my turn if the combat is still on, I charge with the Infiltrators and I think it'll be enough to break them. That plan could apply to any other units charging them, what do you think ? Also, should I be better using their Smash attack instead of the regular attacks ?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9194345.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9194345.page GMT Re:Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
Double Toughness ID removes any FnP, the AP4 negates any armour save, Ignores Cover removes the only other save you're likely to have (even worse if you are relying on Stealth/Shrouding canticle from a WarCon), and it doubles out the wounds on Ruststalkers/Infiltrators. Add that to the fact that it's on an 2+/5++ MC with a 30" shunt and you've got a big problem.

As others have mentioned, he looks like he's really relying on the Incinerators for anti-infantry duty and is lacking in anti-vehicle. Skitarii and Cult Mechanicus aren't exactly vehicle heavy armies, so you're in a bit of a pickle (unless you want to start allying in other armies). You do have Dunecrawlers and Dragoons (the S6 is still threatening, but far less so than against a squad of Vanguard), but he's pretty much tooled his list to be a counter to yours as best as he can. Hopefully soon we'll have some Mechanicus transports in 40k to use and then our poor Skitarii won't have to slog their way across the field so much.

This being said, you have plasma and you have grav, which should take care of Dreadknights if used effectively. You can also force a lot of wounds with Vanguard (I like them better than Rangers), but 12-24" is where GK shine, so that 18" range can make it a dicey situation.

If you're not getting to the 'max canticle' for the number of units, you can plug in a couple of 10 point Servitors in your elites slot (thanks to Agents of the Imperium) and get 2 extra units you can hide somewhere as, effectively, Canticle batteries.

Something I also like to do is throw Inquisitor Coteaz into a squad of Kataphron Breachers (maybe you have a proxy model that can work for this). Gives them a 2+ up front (and he still needs to wound vs T5) plus some Divination psychic powers (including Prescience) and the ability to re-roll/force re-roll the seize the initiative.

Other than that, best of luck!

DoW

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9194697.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9194697.page GMT Re:Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list

Yes the more I play them the more I love my Vanguards. The short range is problematic sometimes but 3 shots each are nice, especially with the 6's to wound. Killed a Wraithlord in Overwatch with just two lucky hits the other day ! Still love Rangers for their sheer range and more powerful guns, but they should never me more than the Vanguards in numbers.

I'll have to make my Kataphrons and the Vanguard squad survive a full turn and then I have a chance. Every unit has a chance to wound the Dreadknights I reckon.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9196906.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9196906.page GMT Re:Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
So the setup for the plan is first to swap the twin-linked phosphor blasters of the Kastellans to give them the Power Fists. Replace the torrent flamer by a single heavy phosphor blaster to give more chance of the Luminagen rule activating. Now I switched my two rangers squad for Vanguards, so I have four five-man squads of Vanguards, just equipped with refractor fields 5++ and two squads with Plasma Calivers. I also gave my Dunecrawler the Cephaloscan to lower my opponents attacks on the charge if possible. Aaand I gave my Infiltrators the Phaser Taser, which instakills no saves allowed on a failed Init test after a successful wound inflicted.

The plan now combines all this in the following course of action;

1) Let his Dreadknights come to me. It's obvious that he's going for the Kastelans in CC but if he teleports he won't charge, leaving me open to shoot them with...
2) ...the Heavy Grav-cannons of the Destroyers, if they're all alive at this time they'll pop out 18 shots, at least one should wound, leaving the Dreadknight with the Commotion debuff, lowering his Init to 1. Which helps me to...
3) ...CHAAARGE ! I throw the Kastelans at the Dreadknights, followed by at least one Vanguard unit that needs to survive all this. There NEEDS to have one Vanguard in the fight. I should survive the Overwatch and then hit first. For bonus I can activate the Conqueror protocols to double their attacks. Now, as his Toughness is reduced by one tiny point, he's on the dangerous 5 Toughness threshold. One successful wound is all I need for the Dreadknight to be crushed and lose all his wounds at once.

I discovered that he could instakill with his Force sword and was quite upset by this amount of cheese in a single unit, so I built this plan. It may work with different parameters too:

- I can use the Neutron Laser to inflict commotion too, but as it's a blast template it's less reliable to hit it;
- Then charge with the Infiltrators if they have survived, and should they resist the overwatch the Alpha might stay alive long enough to drown him in attacks and force him to do this Init test with the Phaser Taser. With Init 1 he'll most certainly fail it and the unfortunate Dreadknight will be sent to another dimension.

I think this plan sounds nice in theory, but it's flawed in that I require a good amount of my guys to stay alive, which will not be really doable considering the sheer amount of Torrent instakilling flamers all over the place. It also heavily relies on the commotion rule to happen, and I can have less shots due to some fallen Kataphrons or bad luck in rolls, as well as the Onager not hitting him. The most flimsy part of all this is my dependence on my Vanguards to stay alive so close to the enemy and succeed the charge. If I can put a Luminagen on them I'll reroll my charges and this could work. The part of the plan with the Infiltrators is even more unlikely to work, just because I don't expect them to survive the first round of shooting at all.

Any thoughts on this ? Something I might have overlooked ?

EDIT: Forgot that the Powerfists make them attack at Init 1 too. So I've got a choice between keeping the twin-linked heavy phosphor blasters and trying my luck at the Smash attack, or I try this anyway and hope they don't die at the same time...]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9203123.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9203123.page GMT Re:Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list

Aaranis wrote:

- I can use the Neutron Laser to inflict commotion too, but as it's a blast template it's less reliable to hit it;
- Then charge with the Infiltrators if they have survived, and should they resist the overwatch the Alpha might stay alive long enough to drown him in attacks and force him to do this Init test with the Phaser Taser. With Init 1 he'll most certainly fail it and the unfortunate Dreadknight will be sent to another dimension.

EDIT: Forgot that the Powerfists make them attack at Init 1 too. So I've got a choice between keeping the twin-linked heavy phosphor blasters and trying my luck at the Smash attack, or I try this anyway and hope they don't die at the same time...

FYI characteristic tests are made on that unmodified characteristic. He will still attack at the same time as your powerfists, but any actual Initiative tests he is asked to make will still pass on a 4 or lower. Nevertheless it is still a worthy attempt. I have lost one of my own Dreadknights to this very same ability on one of the CSM relics (Black Mace I think) wielded by a daemon prince. Anything with AP2 is gold against GK, so don't pack your powerfists away.
Or it sounds like even without powerfists you still have access to Smash, which automatically gives you AP2, often at higher Initiative. If that's the case, go with the phosphor blasters AND the CC Smash. I don't know much else about the AdMech, but I know that if you can weather his alpha strike you just need to keep your spirits up and win in the later turns. With only 20 models, every. single. wound. hurts.
As for his psychic phase, most of the Sanctic list is blessings. If you have access to Adamantium Will that's fine, but don't dig deep for it or expect it to help much. You will mostly want to chuck all your DtW dice at either Gate of Infinity to keep him stuck in bad position or Sanctuary to keep the Dreadknights from having much of an effective Invuln. I'd even let Vortex of Doom go just for the hilarity in case it scatters back on his own guys!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9203525.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9203525.page GMT Re:Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list

SkrawnyNob wrote:

FYI characteristic tests are made on that unmodified characteristic. He will still attack at the same time as your powerfists, but any actual Initiative tests he is asked to make will still pass on a 4 or lower. Nevertheless it is still a worthy attempt. I have lost one of my own Dreadknights to this very same ability on one of the CSM relics (Black Mace I think) wielded by a daemon prince. Anything with AP2 is gold against GK, so don't pack your powerfists away.
Or it sounds like even without powerfists you still have access to Smash, which automatically gives you AP2, often at higher Initiative. If that's the case, go with the phosphor blasters AND the CC Smash. I don't know much else about the AdMech, but I know that if you can weather his alpha strike you just need to keep your spirits up and win in the later turns. With only 20 models, every. single. wound. hurts.
As for his psychic phase, most of the Sanctic list is blessings. If you have access to Adamantium Will that's fine, but don't dig deep for it or expect it to help much. You will mostly want to chuck all your DtW dice at either Gate of Infinity to keep him stuck in bad position or Sanctuary to keep the Dreadknights from having much of an effective Invuln. I'd even let Vortex of Doom go just for the hilarity in case it scatters back on his own guys!

Oh bummer. Are you sure about the characteristic test being on the unmodified number ? I just read the rules concerning char. tests again, and it only mention to use the value on the profile, nothing covers the case where it has been lowered (thanks GW). Yes the Kastelan Robot is still a Monstrous Creature so it has access to smash, but it's trading all his attacks for this one, and so less attacks means less chances to hit it. I don't have access to Adamantium Will whatsoever sadly. Thinkin about getting a Greyfax maybe in the future to change that.

I'll ask at my LGS if they have an idea about the characteristic tests, because it would really help me out to have at least two plans ! Especially because he has two Dreadknights. Another way would be to engage him in CC with Vanguards and have the Neutron Laser scatter on it, but that would require prayers to the Omnissiah for it to happen haha.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9204066.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9204066.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list cc you always have AP2. I don't know what the strength or attack# of the castellan is, but if its at least 5 I would probably swing with the full number of attacks rather than try your luck on one attack that might miss.
Unless you can lower his T to 5 with rad grenades. Then go for that ID for sure!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9204654.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9204654.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list

SkrawnyNob wrote:
Have you read the Smash SR lately? In cc you always have AP2. I don't know what the strength or attack# of the castellan is, but if its at least 5 I would probably swing with the full number of attacks rather than try your luck on one attack that might miss.
Unless you can lower his T to 5 with rad grenades. Then go for that ID for sure!

It's not the AP2 that is worrying me, it's the Toughness. I can down it to 5 with a Vanguard locked in CC with him, so in order to get the S10 required I need to equip Power Fists, that effectively gives me more attacks, but reduce me to Init 1, and so he'll ID me first, unless I drop him to Init 1 myself with the previous use of Commotion. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9204926.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9204926.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list MCs don't get slowed down by Unwieldy weapons. Meaning, the MC always strikes at his I - only I1 when they charge through terrain. I don't know particularly about Castellan Robots though, they might have a special Power Fist interaction.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9204945.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9204945.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
SJ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9205027.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9205027.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list

Saythings wrote:I may be thinking of the wrong scenario, but I thought MCs don't get slowed down by Unwieldy weapons. Meaning, the MC always strikes at his I - only I1 when they charge through terrain. I don't know particularly about Castellan Robots though, they might have a special Power Fist interaction.

If they do I don't know where it's written, I'll do research right away !

EDIT: Oh damn, you're actually right. I'm quite relieved. still needs to Concuss him though.

jeffersonian000 wrote:It's concussion, not commotion.

SJ

In French it's Commotion so I didn't looked up the translation, thought it would be the same haha. Thanks for the info

From what I've heard of him he thinks the biggest threat is the Kataphrons, so I should build a kind of trap around that. Thinking about having the Raiment of the Technomartyr on the Techpriest in the Kataphrons unit to make him eat a mean Overwatch that will give him Concussion, then I as the effect of Init 1 is staying until next Assault phase I should be able to either kill it with the Robots or the Infiltrators with Taser Phaser.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9205197.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9205197.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list
Cheers!

SJ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9205522.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9205522.page GMT Re:Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list

I think I'm still not very good at deploying, I tried to keep Vanguards near my Kastelan to do the trick I talked about to ID the Dreadknights but in reality he basically moved them to the top of building to pee on my guys with torrent flamers and Psycannon shots. Psychic phase was basically a slaughterfest as I had no way to deny anything and he just ripped me with Geomancy (is it called that in English ?), killing my two plasma guys in one turn. I short, I just killed his two Interceptor squads and the Techmarine, and removed one wound to each of the Dreadknights. My Dragoon had no way to charge because the targets were either in cover or too far away for me to move it fast enough.

It wasn't fun :/ I'm definitely using a psyker Inquisitor in my future bigger lists. Just to at least deny more. And give him a Conversion Beamer too, because it looks rad.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9215040.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9215040.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list GK. GK frequently suffer vs meched up opponents. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9215067.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9215067.page GMT Re:Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9215107.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9215107.page GMT Advice as to how survive this Grey Knights list GK are a very poor match up for admech. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9215119.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/717426/9215119.page GMT