<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread ""Traitor" Legions loyalists - Death Guard. "]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/31.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net "Traitor" Legions loyalists - Death Guard. So, speaking shortly, me and two friends of mine are aiming to run Space Marine forces, with me also in-process of creating Death Guard loyalist army in 30K. And obviously, I've been thinking about how to use my Death Guard in 40K enviroment, checking qutie a few threads in different forums. And I got this idea...

Durring Great Crusade, with growing inner problems within XIV Legion, certain detachments were gaining mark of... unfavor from their Primarch. So it was with two groups of warriors - parts of 7th and 4th Great Companies of the XIV Legion, a Armoured Detachment that served under Battle-Captain Nathaniel Garro and an Orbital Assault Group under Captain Ullis Temeter. Said detachments were engaged in massive Compliance campaing against human splinter-empire using forbidden technologies rumored to be Silica Anima, Abominable Intelligence. Armoured Detachment of 7th and Orbital Assault Group of 4th were caught in brutal fight upon irradiated wasteland of this world, suffering heavy casualties and yet in the end unable to finish off the central hub of the corrupted human empire. This honour has fallen to 2nd Great Company and it's mass of Terminators, led by Commander Ignatius Grulgor.
After victory was secured, honoured by others, Commander Ignatius Grulgor spoke an idea, that perhaps Astartes of those two detachments were "weak", hence requiring him to interfere. Perhaps they were "tired" of constant fighting and required a bit of rest, to restore their battle-spirit? Or perhaps, both Nathaniel Garro and Ullis Temeter failed to hone their warriors into Unbroken Blades befitting their Primarch? Such accusations were heavy, and talks of inner conflicts rose within Legion, some speaking about possible duels to wash away such insult. Yet before blood was shed, Primarch himself intervened, passing his judgment - both detachments have failed in their duty and Commander Ignatius Grulgor's conclusion was correct in the eyes of the Primarch. For such failure, both detachments were sent away from bulk of the Legion, to most unfitting duty for men of Legiones Astartes - to guard new colonies and trade routes on fringes of the Imperium. And should Primarch summon them later, both Detachments can try and prove that they've changed their "weak ways".
Dozen years later, Horus rebelled and Mortarion joined him, turning weapons against his own sons, with Battle-Captain Nathaniel Garro forced to abandon his men and Captain Ullis Temeter dying from betrayal of his gene-father. When news about Mortarion betrayal reached two exiled Detachments, they swore to hunt down fallen Primarch - be it even ten thousand years from that day, they shall find and slay their unworthy gene-father, avenging Fallen of Istvaan III. As Heresy went on, both Detachments fought against men of Horus with zeal and fury, reaping a massive tally of dead from those loyal to Warmaster, even fighting alongside warriors of Adeptus Custodes in the closing day of the Heresy.
After Warmaster was defeated and Emperor was bound to Golden Throne, exiled detachments of Death Guard faced "issue" that visited all those loyalists of Traitor Legions - new Imperium would not tolerate their existance, rather forget all blood they shed to protect it, forget fallen of the Istvaan III, ones who secured fighting chance for Imperium by their defiant last stand on the ruined world. Both exiled Detachments would have nothing of this, yet they obviously were in no position to fight rest of the Imperium (nor they wanted it). So they retreated to world on fringe of the Imperium were they were originally exiled by their Primarch, taking second oath, to protect fringes of Imperium against predations of heretic, xenos and whatever other horror may lurk beyond light of the Throne. With remnants of the Ruinstorm still raging in the Warp, region where two Detachment of Death Guard have retreated was largely isolated from most of the Imperium, contact with those fringe colonies being sporadic at best. Proper contact was reestablished only in M34 by a fleet of Rogue Trader - what Imperium found there, were a mass of loyal and productive worlds, protected by three Space Marine Chapters, Mortis Praetors, Storm Blades and Iron Marshals. Some effort was made to investigate origin of this Chapters, yet with many records lost durring War of the Beast, there was little reason to doubt claims that said Chapters are originating from Imperial Fists geneseed.
Up until M41, three Chapters stood vigilant and zealous in their defence of Imperium - some may say, even a bit over-zealous, with Mortis Praetors just barely avoiding extinction - some voices were raised with question, what drives Chapter to act with such fanatical zeal? Perhaps there's a sin they're trying to wash away with blood they spill and their own? Yet, such fanatical behavior wasn't unfamaliar for sons of Dorn, so no massive suspicion was raised about this question. Meantime, Storm Blades gained fame as protectors of travellers and traders, defenders of void stations across southern fringes of the Imperium, patrolling the cold void of space, ready to answer for any plea of help. Iron Marshals proved to be resolute fighters, standing unbroken against any threat, their Armoured forces and Mechanized infantry eventually coming in service of local branch of Ordo Xenos - with lack of Deathwatch forces in the region, Iron Marshals became something akin to Ordo Xenos' private army in the region, protecting Inquisitorial facilities, forming kill teams from their Veterans and often facing waves of untold xeno-horrors that were coming upon worlds of the God-Emperor from beyond borders of the Imperium.
With Time of Ending coming to Imperium, all three Chapters were facing more and more pressure - be it need for Storm Blades quickly respond to a number of human worlds in distress, or waves of Xenos, coming screeching and roaring only to die from blade and bolter of Iron Marshals, or schemes of Ruinous Powers put to end by Mortis Praetors with fanatical zeal of purifiers. Yet as rumors of Guilliman's return, of Adeptus Custodes again walking galaxy and, what's most important, of Daemon-Primarch Mortarion leading Plague Marines, forces of those three Chapters have returned to a single world, home of Mortis Praetors. And next week, a new force marched from a tundra world and fortress-monastery of the Mortis Praetors - clad in ivory and jade, proudly bearing sigils of 4th and 7th Great Companies, men of Death Guard, the true Unbroken Blades, went to wage their war on traitors, as their forbearers swore ten thousand years ago. 2/3 of Storm Blades and 1/3 of Iron Marshals joined Mortis Praetors, revealing that all three Chapters were of same geneseed and origin.
Local Imperial authorities were largely unaware of what new heraldry of three Chapters mean, for few know true about Traitor Legions after ten thousand years, and only men and women of local branch of Ordo Xenos were aware of what does it mean - yet they were faced with two surprising issues regarding this re-emergeance. First of it was a fact, that all three Chapters fought valiantly in defence of the Imperium for ten thousand years, and Ordo Xenos itself emloyed Iron Marshals' steel cohorts against innumerable xeno-horrors, seeing first-handed that those Chapters were pure and loyal to Imperium, perhaps more than others, as they were ready to do whatever it takes to protect Humanity and Imperium to wash away their own sins. And second issue came in form of an old scroll, paper bearing Seals of Terra and Adeptus Custodes - if its describtion was true, said loyalist detachments of Death Guard have secured a deal with Adeptus Custodes in closing days of the Horus Heresy: while they still were guilty of Crimes by Association, they have proven their loyalty to the Imperium with their own blood spilled upon battlefields against Traitors. And yet, it was not in power of Adeptus Custodes to Judge of those Astartes are to forgiven or not - upon this, both Loyalists of Death Guard and warriors of Adeptus Custodes agreed. So they were to remain in self-imposed exile in the fringes of Imperium, protecting humanity there, until someone with power to judge Loyalists of Death Guard would come and pass his verdict - be it Son of the Emperor, one of the loyal Primarchs, or Master of Makind himself, for no mortal, be it burocrate of Administratum or pompous fanatic of Inquisition, was in right to judge those, who spent their lives to protect Imperium. And now, with return of Guilliman, men of Mortis Praetors, Storm Blades and Iron Marshals thought, it was time to reveal their ancient oaths, take arms under their true heraldry and, perhaps, face judgment passed by Son of the Emperor.

And here it is. Actually, it is just a bit, but been Lore-geek, I want my force to be as fitting, as possible. And you can obviously see, that I wrote this to reflect my armies on table-top - Death Guard (Mortis Praetors) and Custodes for me, while my friends would be running Storm Blades and Iron Marshals.
So, any advices, thoughts and opinions on this?
P.S. Colour Schemes for Storm Blades and Iron Marshals, if anyone is interested. My friend intends to have Iron Marshals be as much Sci-Fi Marines, as possible (using new Guilliman-pattern Marines coming in 8th Edition, for example).
Spoiler:

P.S.S. Posted here, since it is not a full-blown Chapter background story, but more of a question - can it work at all?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9347762.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9347762.page GMT "Traitor" Legions loyalists - Death Guard.
The Iron Marshals being Deathwatch-lite isn't quite fitting -the Deathwatch are always able to reach across the Imperium, and are routinely stationed on Ordo Xenos establishments. I don't really know how viable having the Chapter be hired in by the Ordo Xenos is.

Secondly, is the Chapters coming together and repainting themselves and admitting their heresy. Admitting that they're Death Guard, no matter how loyal, is still cause for them to be purged - look at the Dark Angels. They've proved their "loyalty" thousands of times over, yet refuse to admit, even as a first founding chapter, that they have half their number turn traitor. They'd rather kill other Space Marines than reveal that. Judging from that, I'd say that these Chapters would operate exactly as they have done, still saying that "oh yeah, we're the Storm Blades etc etc!" but internally identifying as the Death Guard.

I even that that, over all that time, they would actually not identify as Death Guard (seeing as they would have needed to dupe geneseed samples, and their new recruits would probably use Imperial Fist geneseed, if it were donated back from the Terran vaults), and because no actual Death Guard remain. They'd identify as their respective Chapters, but they would still have a hatred of the Death Guard traitors, so wouldn't announce their "secret".

You can still always have the three Chapter band together, and use the excuse of "we're going on a crusade to kill Mortarion because we're good Imperial Space Marines", and that would be fine. The only issue is them saying "oh yeah, we've been Death Guard this whole time guys, trust us!". That would just earn them a nice HERESY stamp, in the form of a bolt to the skull.

Still great lore, aside from those two things.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9347792.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9347792.page GMT Re:"Traitor" Legions loyalists - Death Guard. Regarding Iron Marshals, it is less case of Deathwatch, and more case of a Chapter that is really good at fighting against Xenos - to a point, where Ordo Xenos just uses them for this sake very often, since unlike Deathwatch, they can and do field not small kill-teams, but also masses of tanks and mechanized infantry. But once again, it is not my Chapter, so I merely process general idea of my friend into more refined state.
And regarding Dark Angels... aren't they over-doing all this "OMG we will be purged" thing? Look at White Scars and Sagyar Mazan. It seems that Dark Angels have commited more crimes in their pursuit of the Fallen, than they actually had crimes before. Also, with Dark Angels, it does seem like it is less about fear of being purged and more about fear of being revealed as not "the Best, the First" (fact in which Dark Angels are known to have great pride).
It just always seemed to be very annoying, that it was essentially Death Guard, Emperor's Children, Luna Wolves and World Eaters loyalists, to whom Imperium and Emperor owe a debt of existing. If not for events of Istvaan III, Horus could've just hit Terra without any obstacles.
Anyway, thanks for reply. I'll work it around I think, try to supress my love for Death Guard colour scheme ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9347821.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9347821.page GMT Re:"Traitor" Legions loyalists - Death Guard.
Jane Warral wrote:
Thanks for answer!
Regarding Iron Marshals, it is less case of Deathwatch, and more case of a Chapter that is really good at fighting against Xenos - to a point, where Ordo Xenos just uses them for this sake very often, since unlike Deathwatch, they can and do field not small kill-teams, but also masses of tanks and mechanized infantry. But once again, it is not my Chapter, so I merely process general idea of my friend into more refined state.
That's fair enough - perhaps you could look into the lore of the Exorcists or Red Hunters Chapters for ideas on Space Marine Chapter closely linked to the Inquisition, but not a Chamber Militant.

And regarding Dark Angels... aren't they over-doing all this "OMG we will be purged" thing? Look at White Scars and Sagyar Mazan. It seems that Dark Angels have commited more crimes in their pursuit of the Fallen, than they actually had crimes before. Also, with Dark Angels, it does seem like it is less about fear of being purged and more about fear of being revealed as not "the Best, the First" (fact in which Dark Angels are known to have great pride).
It just always seemed to be very annoying, that it was essentially Death Guard, Emperor's Children, Luna Wolves and World Eaters loyalists, to whom Imperium and Emperor owe a debt of existing. If not for events of Istvaan III, Horus could've just hit Terra without any obstacles.
Anyway, thanks for reply. I'll work it around I think, try to supress my love for Death Guard colour scheme
I think simply admitting traitorous heritage, especially with the whole vilification of the traitors, would be an issue.
Think about it, the Imperium's said that "The Chaos Space Marines are traitorous Space Marines, being related to them at all is wrong, they're disgusting scum etc etc", and then some Space Marines on the outer reaches say "oh yeah, we're related to them directly, but we're good, we're going over to fight them!". It's enough to warrant concern, especially if they renounce their Imperial heraldry to do so.

Again, Istvaan III was important, but it was Garro that did all the work, getting to Terra and directly warning Dorn and the Emperor. Istvaan just pinned Horus for some time. Istvaan V wouldn't have happened, and that would have left three Loyalist Legions and their Primarchs ready to defend Terra instead of spent and wasted at Istvaan V.

And besides, none of the surviving Death Guard are alive - that Chapters would now have a connection to their identities as descendents of the Death Guard, but not Death Guard themselves.

Still, this is good lore. Very good!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9347852.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9347852.page GMT Re:"Traitor" Legions loyalists - Death Guard.
 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
I think simply admitting traitorous heritage, especially with the whole vilification of the traitors, would be an issue.
Think about it, the Imperium's said that "The Chaos Space Marines are traitorous Space Marines, being related to them at all is wrong, they're disgusting scum etc etc", and then some Space Marines on the outer reaches say "oh yeah, we're related to them directly, but we're good, we're going over to fight them!". It's enough to warrant concern, especially if they renounce their Imperial heraldry to do so.


Problem is EVERY legion had traitors. Ultramarines, white scars, blood angels, imperial fist...

That' the one part I don't like about DA fluff. Secrecy is good but reason should have been bit better thought out. When everybody had traitors DA's secret isn't really that big deal.

Of course you could say that adds little humour to it. Dark angels go to great length to protect secret that would have been responded with "oh? Well good job on getting rid of traitor elements" if they had just admitted it in the first place :lol:]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9348146.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9348146.page GMT Re:"Traitor" Legions loyalists - Death Guard.
tneva82 wrote:
 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
I think simply admitting traitorous heritage, especially with the whole vilification of the traitors, would be an issue.
Think about it, the Imperium's said that "The Chaos Space Marines are traitorous Space Marines, being related to them at all is wrong, they're disgusting scum etc etc", and then some Space Marines on the outer reaches say "oh yeah, we're related to them directly, but we're good, we're going over to fight them!". It's enough to warrant concern, especially if they renounce their Imperial heraldry to do so.


Problem is EVERY legion had traitors. Ultramarines, white scars, blood angels, imperial fist...

That' the one part I don't like about DA fluff. Secrecy is good but reason should have been bit better thought out. When everybody had traitors DA's secret isn't really that big deal.

Of course you could say that adds little humour to it. Dark angels go to great length to protect secret that would have been responded with "oh? Well good job on getting rid of traitor elements" if they had just admitted it in the first place :lol:


Their secret is that they were gonna side with Horus.. but then realised he was losing so flipped back to the Imperium]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9348375.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9348375.page GMT Re:"Traitor" Legions loyalists - Death Guard.
GodDamUser wrote:
Their secret is that they were gonna side with Horus.. but then realised he was losing so flipped back to the Imperium


Except BL has pretty much shown that's not the case.

Maybe BL comes up with bit more believable secret when they get around it.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9348776.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/725248/9348776.page GMT