Latest posts for the thread "Do Non-Elysian Units Break Up an Elysian Detachment?"

Do Non-Elysian Units Break Up an Elysian Detachment?

Cadian16th — GMT

I don't want to re-visit whether Elysians can take additional doctrines, as it has been established by GW in their FAQ that their Aerial Drop, etc. count as their doctrine and therefore cannot double dip. But I was curious what people's thoughts were on them using the Codex strategems, relics, etc.

First, GW's somewhat related answer on the topic:

Q: Can Death Korps of Krieg, Elysian Drop Troops or Renegades and Heretics Detachments use any of the Regiment-specific rules (Doctrines, Orders, Stratagems, Warlord Traits, etc.) in Codex: Astra Militarum?
A: No. Instead these units use the bespoke abilities and Orders that are described in Imperial Armour – Index: Forces of the Astra Militarum.

Now, this can be read as either saying that Elysians cannot use the Regiment-specific rules in Codex: AM (which is what the question was asking), or it can be read as barring Elysians from taking anything in the Codex entirely (unless specifically listed in the respective allowable units in the Index).

So....

Does an Elysian detachment gain access to the Codex: AM strategems/doctrines/relics that are non-regiment specific? I.e., if I only have a single Elysian brigade, can I then use Fire On My Position? Every unit in the brigade has the AM keyword, so it would seem that it would count as an AM detachment and would therefore gain access. The usual limitations would apply to the targets of strategems, of course, so no combining Elysian infantry squads since the unit is technically an "Elysian Drop Trooper Squad".

If the answer to the above question is no, is there anything stopping me from taking a patrol detachment from Codex: AM to unlock the strategems, which would then be usable on any legal target in the Elysian brigade?

If the answer to the first question is no, is any ability/special rule lost for the brigade if I decide to fill up the Fast Attack slots with Cyberwolves, for example? Because there are no bonuses for all units having the AM keyword (Aerial Drop, etc. are not dependent on that), would everything else in the brigade remain the same, rule-wise?

Thoughts?

Re:Do Non-Elysian Units Break Up an Elysian Detachment?

Ghaz — GMT

From page 132 of Codex Astra Militarum:

If your chosen regiment does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine, you may pick the doctrine that you feel best represents your army. For example, as your army of Ventrillian Nobles does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine, you can decide that the Vostroyan Heirloom Weapons doctrine best suits these wealthy and well-equipped fighters.

This is the section of rules that the FAQ you quoted is referring to.

Re:Do Non-Elysian Units Break Up an Elysian Detachment?

Cadian16th — GMT

Ghaz wrote:
From page 132 of Codex Astra Militarum:

If your chosen regiment does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine, you may pick the doctrine that you feel best represents your army. For example, as your army of Ventrillian Nobles does not have an associated Regimental Doctrine, you can decide that the Vostroyan Heirloom Weapons doctrine best suits these wealthy and well-equipped fighters.

This is the section of rules that the FAQ you quoted is referring to.

Right, I understand that they don't get Regimental Doctrines, nor do they have access to Regiment-specific rules, but I'm asking about (1) the generic AM strategems/relics and (2) mixing in non-Elysian units, but still keeping Aerial Drop on the Elysian ones.

Do Non-Elysian Units Break Up an Elysian Detachment?

ph34r — GMT

You can use the generic stratagems and relics.

You can also put whatever not Elysian units in the army because elysians have no special doctrine to lose.

For this reason, if I ever take an Elysian aka no-doctrines detachment, I include an Eversor.

Do Non-Elysian Units Break Up an Elysian Detachment?

Cadian16th — GMT

ph34r wrote:
You can use the generic stratagems and relics.

You can also put whatever not Elysian units in the army because elysians have no special doctrine to lose.

For this reason, if I ever take an Elysian aka no-doctrines detachment, I include an Eversor.

Perfect, thanks! That was my reading of it as well. I was a bit short on points for the brigade so was looking at Cyberwolves to fill the FA slots, but an Assassin or two would be solid as well.

Edit: I actually think that, while a pure Elysian detachment could use the generic strategems, relics, etc. from Codex: AM (as all the units have the AM keyword), I believe that adding an Assassin/Cyberwolves would prevent them from doing so. Note that adding the Assassin/Cyberwolves would
not prevent the Elysians from Aerial dropping.