<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/57.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
Juves turn into champions between campaigns if they have 5 or more advancements.

Yet it would take around 14 advancements to put them on par with a champion stats wise. So odds are you're just going to end up with a terrible champion. (even if you rule out the possibility of injuries along the way)

Why would you ever do this rather just waiting till you get the rep to straight out hire a new champion?

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847635.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847635.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847641.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847641.page GMT Re:Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
Juves turning into Champions is mentioned in the Downtime section of Gangwar.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847649.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847649.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
I think GW have done it that way for the story element - the top of p.27 says "Leaders, Champions and Juves are central to the gang's narrative".]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847655.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847655.page GMT Re:Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
I'm just wondering why they will always be terrible (stats wise) versions of champions?

EDIT - let me reword it - The idea of juves earning their stripes and becoming champions is a good story element, but surely when they become champions they should be good?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847661.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847661.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847664.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847664.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
I got no Juves in my gang so far, and have no motivation to get some.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847665.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847665.page GMT Re:Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
beast_gts wrote:
Well, by spending XP for advances rather that randomly rolling for them you can choose what direction to take the Juve/Champion in - sniper or brawler, for example.


Yeah i understand that having choice of what you level is an advantage, but still your going to be down like 9 stats.

And also you can choose direction for standard hired champions too.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847666.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847666.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847757.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847757.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions as Juves.

In Mordheim, which is pretty obviously where they're drawing the ganger/everyone else version of the henchman/hero paradigm from, "Juves" were just cheaper lower-stated Heroes typically given to 5-starting-hero warbands where giving them 5 full-on Heroes would have been OP, so they got Leader, two good Heroes, and two Youngbloods. Sure they were useful in the same sense as N17 Juves are, in the sense of beginning earlier in their experience track and so having more possible "builds", but they were also Heroes in all other regards, meaning they contributed to income and could perform postgame activities.

The tradeoff was being weaker to begin with in exchange for more chances to advance the way you wanted them to, but even if they ended up suffering missing limbs, Stupidity, and blindness while being stuck with all-shooting skills & stat upgrades they would still have added a lot of value to your band in the postgame.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847796.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9847796.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions GW spent even 5 minutes thinking about it, that's why.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9848393.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9848393.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
 lord_blackfang wrote:
Because nobody at GW spent even 5 minutes thinking about it, that's why.

Pretty much this.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9848639.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9848639.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9848992.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9848992.page GMT Re:Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
For example lets look at echer.

Leveling a juve up to exactly match an escher champion (except with 6 move) would give them a value of 280 points.

Adding +1 move to a store bought champion would give them a value of 105 points.

I realise the advantage is in you get to choose how exactly to level your juve, (min/max towards a goal etc) but 175point difference? really?

I'm thinking of house ruling that when they turn champion they get +1W and +1A for free, that would go someway to close the gap (90pts) while still having them slightly weaker but specialized.



]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9849047.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9849047.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
 Yodhrin wrote:
Frankly what I think Juves need is to be good at something/have some purpose as Juves.

They might have a purpose not mentioned before. In previous Necromunda, Juves were cheap, gained a handfull of level-ups and became Gangers quickly. After becoming Gangers, they could contribute by generating income. Now, Leaders and Champions generate income. But you could only have 2 Champions + 1 Champion per 10 reputation. But is this limit also prohibiting Juves from leveling up? I haven't found anywhere where it says so. If you don't have enough Reputation to increase the amount of Champions, lose Reputation or can't increase Reputation fast enough, what about using Juves and leveling them up? If you start with 1 Leader, 2 Champions 5 gangerse and 2 juves, you could end up with 4 champions after the first Turf War?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9849457.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9849457.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
Baxx wrote:
 Yodhrin wrote:
Frankly what I think Juves need is to be good at something/have some purpose as Juves.

They might have a purpose not mentioned before. In previous Necromunda, Juves were cheap, gained a handfull of level-ups and became Gangers quickly. After becoming Gangers, they could contribute by generating income. Now, Leaders and Champions generate income. But you could only have 2 Champions + 1 Champion per 10 reputation. But is this limit also prohibiting Juves from leveling up? I haven't found anywhere where it says so. If you don't have enough Reputation to increase the amount of Champions, lose Reputation or can't increase Reputation fast enough, what about using Juves and leveling them up? If you start with 1 Leader, 2 Champions 5 gangerse and 2 juves, you could end up with 4 champions after the first Turf War?



I would interpret this as you can't level juves to have more Champions than your Reputation allows, which I would assume is why they mention using downtime to create splinter gangs. Keep the narrative going without breaking the rules.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9852882.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9852882.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9853147.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9853147.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions
Baxx wrote:
Ok, I didn't study those rules too closely. Doesn't that make the Juves even worse?


It's currently rather ambiguous (there's a surprise). However I'm inclined to treat Juves as outside the normal Champion recruitment restrictions, for precisely this reason. Juves are already questionable given how slow you gain XP, their lower maximum stats, few equipment options and that they don't 'level up' until the end of the turf war. If you don't get an extra Champion out of it then really what is the point?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9854190.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9854190.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions




Going back to a random progression table for everyone is my personal preference, but I do believe the official system is not functional. Many reasons have been stated by others above.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9854914.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9854914.page GMT Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9854932.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9854932.page GMT Re:Necromunda - Advancement system Juves to Champions WS/BS at number 7, I'd put it at number 8, put the cool/willpower etc. at number 7, swap strength/toughness and move/init around and place attacks/wounds at number 9. This is closer to the original upgrade table from the old necromunda.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9855033.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/751418/9855033.page GMT