<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists
Most soup lists aren't mixing within detachments (supreme commands of Guilliman and Assassins notwithstanding!). They are taking separate detachments from each codex which contain the most powerful or useful models that codex has to offer.

Another thing we see constantly in Imperium lists is the CP battery. Cheap Astra Militarum Battalions which can now get you 5cp for as little as 180 points, whilst also giving many Imperium Codexes access to efficiently costed wounds they wouldn't normally have.

I don't want to stop soup entirely. People should be able to run guardsmen alongside their space marines. This happens in the fluff constantly, not to mention that many many people have made model purchases based on mixing these factions.

So here is my idea for a different rule for discussion:

Determine the main keyword in your army, the keyword which is carried by the highest combined points value of units in your army. Detachments that do not entirely consist of units with this keyword do not generate CP this game. Such detachments still cost CP if they have a negative CP value. Ignore the keywords IMPERIUM, CHAOS, and AELDARI for the purposes of this rule.

What do you think? Would this help? ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941153.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941153.page GMT Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists cp batteries.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941435.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941435.page GMT Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists
B1okHead wrote:
My preferred solution is that you only get strategems from the codex your warlord is from. Helps with am cp batteries.
How exactly does it stop CP batteries? Oh noes I can't use Guard Stratagems on my 180pts of Guard. Woe is me.

Unless they do some kludge setup where you can only spend CP generated by detachments on stratagems of that faction, CP batteries are here to stay.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941439.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941439.page GMT Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists CP batteries are an issue (and they are) why instead of all these detachment and ally restrictions not just make a hard cap for the CP? (It could be a tournament suggestion type of a rule.) In 1000 point game you can ever have max 9CPs, in 1500 point game 12CPs, in 2000 point game 15Cps and so forth. (Numbers made up ad hoc, could be different numbers, this is just the basic idea.)

Oh, and there really should be an rule that you can't stack CP regen abilities. One instance can ever benefit from one such rule.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941462.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941462.page GMT Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists
 Crimson wrote:
Frankly, if the CP batteries are an issue (and they are) why instead of all these detachment and ally restrictions not just make a hard cap for the CP? (It could be a tournament suggestion type of a rule.) In 1000 point game you can ever have max 9CPs, in 1500 point game 12CPs, in 2000 point game 15Cps and so forth. (Numbers made up ad hoc, could be different numbers, this is just the basic idea.)

Oh, and there really should be an rule that you can't stack CP regen abilities. One instance can ever benefit from one such rule.


Some armies are heavily balanced around using multiple CP abilities a turn. Dark Eldar for example.

This sort of rule would gut / heavily harm those armies simply to rein in imperial soup lists, which is a trade not worth the collateral damage.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941473.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941473.page GMT Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists
 morganfreeman wrote:

Some armies are heavily balanced around using multiple CP abilities a turn. Dark Eldar for example.

Could you elaborate?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941477.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941477.page GMT Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists CP cap, but not that low. On average, a 2k list has about 10-14 CP (outside of Imperium soup, then you get ridiculous), so maybe something more indicitive of the standard instead of nerfing everyone including the problem armies?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941495.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941495.page GMT Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists
 vaklor4 wrote:
I like the idea of a CP cap, but not that low. On average, a 2k list has about 10-14 CP (outside of Imperium soup, then you get ridiculous), so maybe something more indicitive of the standard instead of nerfing everyone including the problem armies?

As I said, the numbers were made up on the spot, so I didn't give the exact figures that much thought. Though my suggestion for 2000 point game was 15, so that's a bit more than your estimate of the average.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941517.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941517.page GMT Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists
 vaklor4 wrote:
I like the idea of a CP cap, but not that low. On average, a 2k list has about 10-14 CP (outside of Imperium soup, then you get ridiculous), so maybe something more indicitive of the standard instead of nerfing everyone including the problem armies?

Where the hell are you getting the average as going up to 14 CP? I can't imagine that as anything other than a horde army. 9 is the upward limit for any of my armies post-faq.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941567.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9941567.page GMT Alternative to the new Beta Battle Brothers for balancing soup lists
 Arachnofiend wrote:
 vaklor4 wrote:
I like the idea of a CP cap, but not that low. On average, a 2k list has about 10-14 CP (outside of Imperium soup, then you get ridiculous), so maybe something more indicitive of the standard instead of nerfing everyone including the problem armies?

Where the hell are you getting the average as going up to 14 CP? I can't imagine that as anything other than a horde army. 9 is the upward limit for any of my armies post-faq.


Agreed. 'Normal' for 2k games is a Battalion and one other detachment which is normally +1 CP.

So that's 9 CP. 10-11 if you have your faction leader in the army.

To hit 14 you usually need a second Battalion, which isn't going to be a good idea for most armies, though nothing at all to Astra Militarum of course!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9942116.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/755395/9942116.page GMT