<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Best knight heirloom combination?"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Best knight heirloom combination?
In light of the new Engine War book and some of the changes made with the new stratagems, I'm torn in which two relics I want to use for my knights so I was hoping for some advice on which would be most optimal. Note I'm referring to Endless Fury on the Warden, Fury of Mars on the Errant, and Paragon gauntlet on the Gallant.

Should I do:

Paragon gauntlet/Endless fury?
Paragon/Fury of Mars?
Fury of Mars/Endless Fury?

This is paired with an Admech batallion, Serberys Raiders will function as a screen for the Errant and Gallant as they move close and harass the smaller units while the Warden acts as a support for my gunline in the back and hits anyone that gets too close to said gunline. As my main damage source are my Errant/Gallant, I was leaning most towards the Paragon/Fury of Mars as I believe most of the damage would come from them but if it would be better for my Warden to move up and shoot with Endless fury, I can adjust as needed.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830388.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830388.page GMT Best knight heirloom combination?
I magnetized the weapons on all my knights, so I’m thinking I will drop the errent from my list entirely, and run it as a knight preceptor instead, as the new strat makes it better in my opinion.

Hope this helps.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830434.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830434.page GMT Best knight heirloom combination?
I'm not tremendously impressed by Fury of Mars. Increased range is such a temporary benefit for a Knight already trying to close the distance. At least it does have synergy with the stratagem.

Paragon Gauntlet is an absolutely staggering increase in damage against hard targets. Without invulnerable saves, the Gallant's Thunderstrike averages 16 wounds against T8 3+. The Paragon averages over 27. So the question is: do you actually need your Gallant to kill another Knight in each round of combat? The Thunderstrike already kills most other vehicles in one round anyway.

If you're committed to these relics, I'd go Paragon and Endless Fury. If you don't think you'll get the full use out of the Paragon, I'd take Sanctuary on the Gallant instead.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830444.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830444.page GMT Best knight heirloom combination?
 DarkHound wrote:
If your goal is to use the Warden's Belligerent Machine Spirit as a deterrent, then it actually has anti-synergy with Endless Fury. The stratagem doesn't roll to hit, so can't proc the relic's exploding dice. Still, I think you're probably not going to get to use Belligerent Spirit every game.

I'm not tremendously impressed by Fury of Mars. Increased range is such a temporary benefit for a Knight already trying to close the distance. At least it does have synergy with the stratagem.

Paragon Gauntlet is an absolutely staggering increase in damage against hard targets. Without invulnerable saves, the Gallant's Thunderstrike averages 16 wounds against T8 3+. The Paragon averages over 27. So the question is: do you actually need your Gallant to kill another Knight in each round of combat? The Thunderstrike already kills most other vehicles in one round anyway.

If you're committed to these relics, I'd go Paragon and Endless Fury. If you don't think you'll get the full use out of the Paragon, I'd take Sanctuary on the Gallant instead.


I appreciate the feedback. I actually realized I forgot something with my original post, I had selected Cold Eradication on the Errant to have a better chance at getting a higher number of hits combined with the Fury's other ability, rolling 2d6 for damage and selecting the highest number as a means of combining the two for extra damage. I really liked the synergy between that stratagem and the Fury of Mars to get a higher level of damage on it. I will definitely keep the Paragon gauntlet on the Gallant for sure and I did debate a second relic on the Gallant but I was concerned about it getting burned down and thus by having the Endless Fury or Fury of Mars there would be another strong relic on the field.

I was thinking about Belligerent Machine Spirit as well and how it doesn't really work with the Endless Fury, but since my Warden also has a gauntlet, I figured if something was that close I could shoot it and then charge it with Titanic Feet or if it's a character, attempt to use Death Grip. But thank you again for answering me, after thinking about it, I think Paragon and Endless Fury is a better selection.

Should I take Cold Eradication off the Errant? Is there a better WL strat for this loadout?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830452.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830452.page GMT Best knight heirloom combination?
 Khalith wrote:
I really liked the synergy between that stratagem and the Fury of Mars to get a higher level of damage on it.
For the sake of conversation, think about analyzing the relic this way: would you pay 1 CP for 6" extra range for one turn? After you close that 24-19" sweet spot, the Fury of Mars stops providing any benefit. Realistically, you're going to deploy the Knight at the front, then you have a 12" move and 18" range. If you save your Knights to deploy last, you will have something within 30" to shoot at.
I will definitely keep the Paragon gauntlet on the Gallant for sure and I did debate a second relic on the Gallant but I was concerned about it getting burned down and thus by having the Endless Fury or Fury of Mars there would be another strong relic on the field.
Unfortunately you can only take one relic on a model.
Should I take Cold Eradication off the Errant? Is there a better WL strat for this loadout?
Cold Eradication is fine on the Errant. With the stratagem in effect, it bumps the average damage from 9.4 to 12.

I have to say, I agree with Mariongodspeed that these aren't really the optimal Knights. You'll really benefit from magnetizing your Knights to keep them flexible.

For example, you mentioned the Warden has a Thunderstrike. The Thunderstrike is actually a downgrade from the Reaper if the target is T7 and 3+ or worse (Thunderstrike averages 10, while Reaper averages 11 damage). Hell, honestly, even against T8 3+ targets the Reaper pulls 9 damage to the Thunderstrike's 10. You have to be pretty sure you're going to consistently melee T8 targets because, every time you fight anything else, you paid 5 points for less damage. How often are flanking units going to be T8?

Then you have to consider: how often is the Warden going to be in close combat with a vehicle, or at all? A Crusader fights infantry exactly as well as the Warden, but provides more ranged firepower. That might be a better fit as the backfield anchor.

I'd also consider swapping the Errant for a Preceptor. At 18", with both respective stratagems but no Cold Eradication, the Preceptor does a tiny bit more damage (9.43 vs 9.39) at a 21pt discount. The Errant can be better if you spend more points and a Warlord trait, so if you're married to the idea of an Errant then you have to go all-out to justify it.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830473.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830473.page GMT Best knight heirloom combination?
 DarkHound wrote:
 Khalith wrote:
I really liked the synergy between that stratagem and the Fury of Mars to get a higher level of damage on it

I have to say, I agree with Mariongodspeed that these aren't really the optimal Knights. You'll really benefit from magnetizing your knights.


I didn’t know about magnetizing until it was too late, I had already built them by that point. As for them not being optimal, yeah I know. I forgot to mention that in my OP I legit picked the ones I liked the most and decided to run with it. I’ll probably invest in more of them, money is not an issue for me honestly. I actually want to collect and have all the different versions and paint them differently. I just really want to make my three favorites as good as possible for my local games. But I feel like I’ve gotten what I needed from this thread. I’m going for Paragon/Endless. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830709.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/789207/10830709.page GMT