<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "Necron Biotransferrance: Why Not Just Use Automatons? "]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/31.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net Necron Biotransferrance: Why Not Just Use Automatons?
The Immortal and the Divine makes it pretty clear that necrons don't have "souls" as they conceive of them. If the minds of the potters and gardeners that got turned into warriors still exist, they don't seem to be getting used for anything that couldn't have been accomplished with a canoptek construct "brain." So if the original gardener's flesh and soul aren't present and his mind is just being used as a computer and his bosses are perfectly capable of cranking out canoptek computers, then forcing his consciousness to suffer eternity without free will just seems like a pointlessly dickish move. Like, the necrontyr higher ups had to expend time and energy in the middle of the War in Heaven to round up all their reluctant servants and screw them over.

What am I missing? What is the point of turning a necrontyr servant into a necron? Are necron bodies impossible to make without converting the necrontyr's life force into a critical component or something? And am I mistaken in thinking that warriors retain (a converted version of) their original minds despite their lack of free will and silence? ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11031994.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11031994.page GMT Necron Biotransferrance: Why Not Just Use Automatons? IIRC). But it was all a plot by the C'tan, for whom "pointlessly dickish" is SOP. (Although it wasn't really pointless from their PoV, because they got to feed on the 'life-energy' that was the byproduct of Biotransference, which they wouldn't have gotten from just creating an army of robots.)]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11032088.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11032088.page GMT Necron Biotransferrance: Why Not Just Use Automatons?
They didn’t want unconquerable armies so much.

They wanted immortality.

Fairly standard Faustian bargain really. They were so obsessed with what they’d gain (impervious bodies, ever lasting life), they never stopped to consider what it would take from them.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11032470.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11032470.page GMT Necron Biotransferrance: Why Not Just Use Automatons?
Creating new 'automatons' wouldn't have served any purpose whatsoever. They were being 'saved' and also end up in better forms for the long war they were fighting.

Like, the necrontyr higher ups had to expend time and energy in the middle of the War in Heaven to round up all their reluctant servants and screw them over.

Nope. This was salvation, as far as they _all_ understood it.
While there probably were some who were reluctant, even they didn't really understand what was happening.

What am I missing? What is the point of turning a necrontyr servant into a necron? Are necron bodies impossible to make without converting the necrontyr's life force into a critical component or something? And am I mistaken in thinking that warriors retain (a converted version of) their original minds despite their lack of free will and silence?

Warriors have, perhaps, a dim recollection of the original mind. It isn't clear that any necron has a continuation of consciousness- that they aren't just computer copies of the original brain, starting from zero with another entity's memories that they believe are their own. (And it isn't really a theme the necron fluff explores).

But one important thing here, your questions are present tense. This doesn't happen anymore. The necrontyr are entirely gone (as far as anyone knows, there hasn't been a living member of the species for million of years). They do make new bodies, but the most recent fluff is that they just transfer a warrior's mind to a new body if the old one becomes too damaged. 'Cybercrypts' and networks and insert <blah blah technobabble> here.
But at this point there are no necrontyr to convert. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11032503.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11032503.page GMT Necron Biotransferrance: Why Not Just Use Automatons? did have automatons, in the shape of Canoptek constructs.

That’s not a technology that just appears. So it seems likely that at some point at least, they had specialist combat models.

But that takes resources. It’s entirely possible they lead with those to spare their living population, but found them for whatever reason outmatched.

With bio-transference, they obtained an army of trillions, relatively overnight in terms of galactic timescales. And just as united as Orks and Tyranids are in the modern day when it came to a single purpose.

Between those incalculable legions, their ridiculous level of technology and literal gods, they were able to turn the tables.

What came next was likely a question that fell by the wayside, as their victory was anything but assured. In many ways, bio transference can be seen as equal parts blind hope, and bloody minded spite. A way to go down swinging so hard, you at least shatter the enemy’s civilisation.

And we still don’t know exactly what the deciding factor was in that conflict. Was there a single, decisive victory which inflicted such damage the Old Ones were forced on a permanent back foot? Or, as the original Codex claimed, was the Old Ones own desperation and unfinished creations knacker the warp, stripping away the Old Ones’ biggest advantage?

But needing an automaton level basic infantry was never a requirement. And given Szarekh had species wide command protocols, it’s entirely possible what the standard Necron Warrior was reduced to wasn’t discovered until many, many millennia later.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11032522.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11032522.page GMT Necron Biotransferrance: Why Not Just Use Automatons?
Wyldhunt wrote:
Can someone explain to me what the point of transforming the rank and file necrontyr into necrons was? I get that those who retained their free will and memories were basically seeking a form of immortality. But why go to the trouble with a basic warrior? If the end result is just a body of living metal with a mind that essentially operates more or less like a robot (like a canoptek construct), then couldn't the higher ups have gotten the same results by just building warrior bodies and giving them canoptek CPUs?

The Immortal and the Divine makes it pretty clear that necrons don't have "souls" as they conceive of them. If the minds of the potters and gardeners that got turned into warriors still exist, they don't seem to be getting used for anything that couldn't have been accomplished with a canoptek construct "brain." So if the original gardener's flesh and soul aren't present and his mind is just being used as a computer and his bosses are perfectly capable of cranking out canoptek computers, then forcing his consciousness to suffer eternity without free will just seems like a pointlessly dickish move. Like, the necrontyr higher ups had to expend time and energy in the middle of the War in Heaven to round up all their reluctant servants and screw them over.

What am I missing? What is the point of turning a necrontyr servant into a necron? Are necron bodies impossible to make without converting the necrontyr's life force into a critical component or something? And am I mistaken in thinking that warriors retain (a converted version of) their original minds despite their lack of free will and silence?


They (the necrons) didn't want retcons gdi. In the beginning, the c'tans enslaved the necrons after they opened pandora's box. Now, they just what gw said they'd never be: tomb kings in space. That's the disconnect.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11033019.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11033019.page GMT Necron Biotransferrance: Why Not Just Use Automatons? http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11033080.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11033080.page GMT Necron Biotransferrance: Why Not Just Use Automatons?
Necron background doesn’t diverge until after their victory over the Old Ones and their slave species (seriously, slaves. If you create something purely to fight your battles for you, it’s a slave species).

Originally, The Deceiver convinced the C’Tan to start eating each other, until only four were left.

In the new, the Necrons turned on the C’Tan, shattering them.

Best thing here? The two are not mutually exclusive.

C’Tan shards could be the scraps left from consumption, repurposed as weapons. The original four survivors could simply be acting from the shadows.

The Silent King and his super duper command protocols? Sure. He’s in no way programmed to dance to something else’s tune at all. Clearly he’d be able to tell, right? After all, only a truly colossal buttmunch could conceive of such a conceit....oh wait!.

See, once your consciousness is essentially digitised, it’s open to being tweaked. Little hack here, tiny poke there, and you’ve got a head full of false memories, with no way of realising that to be the case.

Or the new background is entirely correct, and in the end the Deceiver, like his brother C’Tan fell to his own hubris.

All depends on your point of view and preference.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11034061.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/795433/11034061.page GMT