<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions"]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/69.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions 40k with my middle schoolers. i like second so i am going to use that with them (with paper mini proxies until i get my 3d printer churning out proxies - nice legal in the realm of civil law ones besides guard are hard to come by, the kids are quite worthy of khorne when it comes to horse play and violence with fragile things so that means my collection is staying home lol) . honestly the rules i think are not that hard despite common opinion, including melee, so long as they are small games. plus with second rules maybe this will open up into necromunda which would be very fun.

so that being said, i have chose one definate faction blood angels, taking from the said white dwarf:

499 points
1 chaplain -63 points
-rosarius

5 man Assault Squad -214points
*all have jump packs, bolt pistols, krak grenades
-veteran sgt with power sword
-marine2 power sword, hand flamer
-marine3 chain sword, plasma pistol
-marine 4 power sword
-marine 5 chain sword

5 man combat Squad -167points
*all have bolt pistols, krak grenades
-sgt with chainsword, bolt gun
-marine2 bolt gun
-marine3 bolt gun
-marine 4 bolt gun
-marine 5 heavy bolter

Rhino -55 point
auto launcher w/ blind grenades

Now I would like at least two other factions 500 points relatively balanced ,
which factions do you guys think I should go with? i really cant make up my mind as i like them all :/]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11263586.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11263586.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
Most of the smallest games I ever saw in 2nd Ed were 1000 points.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11263671.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11263671.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
Ditch the Rhino. Transports, any transports, were death traps for their occupants. If it take out the Transport, it’s very likely I’m killing its passengers too.

Assuming it’ll be carrying the Tacticals and the Chaplain? A single shot can, and because Sod’s law, probably will, kill 285 points worth of models. And because it’s a Rhino, it needn’t be a Lascannon, either.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11263675.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11263675.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
sandor1988 wrote:
which factions do you guys think I should go with? i really cant make up my mind as i like them all :/
Orks were the classic opposition force in 2nd.

At those low points probably tyranids for your third. Eldar were the next 'biggest' faction but at 500pts they might just throw an exarch through your squads and call it a day.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11263676.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11263676.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Ditch the Rhino. Transports, any transports, were death traps for their occupants. If it take out the Transport, it’s very likely I’m killing its passengers too.
You should'a done what we did with transports. Anyone could drive them (if the crew were dead).

Had a game (Ultras vs Guard), where a Rhino lost its driver, so my half brother and Commissar Yarrick spent the game stealing the Rhino, attempting to run one another over, and then stealing it from the other guy. Hilarious fun. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264401.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264401.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
In such a small point game of 2nd Ed?

Ditch the Rhino. Transports, any transports, were death traps for their occupants. If it take out the Transport, it’s very likely I’m killing its passengers too.

Assuming it’ll be carrying the Tacticals and the Chaplain? A single shot can, and because Sod’s law, probably will, kill 285 points worth of models. And because it’s a Rhino, it needn’t be a Lascannon, either.


I don't think I ever saw anyone outside of the WD battle report actually put passengers in one. We used to just use them as battering rams against enemy vehicles.


For other factions, Guard or Orks would at least get some wiggle room with what would fit at points limits that low. Eldar would be horrific unless you stick with Guardians and leave the Aspect Warriors and skimmers at home. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264415.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264415.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
Really I'd mostly be concerned about getting a good deal of cover on the table.

As for armies? Nids are fun. Take some Termagants, Genestealers and a couple Warriors.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264419.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264419.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
Man the Genestealer Cult list was wild. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264420.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264420.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
They might have thick armour, an excellent Field save and loads of wargear, but that’s not a bike they’ve got between their legs. Oh no. It’s a bomb waiting to go off…..]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264483.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264483.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions WD had some extra rules for smaller games? Or the staff got the rules wrong (quite common at the time). What WD I probably have it.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264521.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264521.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Oh, and if you’re putting a character on a bike, don’t tool them up.
Bike units were hilarious. The few times I used full units of 5 Marine Bikers, a volley of fire would render them useless within a turn, and that's probably because half of them would go out of control and slam into one another.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264560.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264560.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Ditch the Rhino. Transports, any transports, were death traps for their occupants. If it take out the Transport, it’s very likely I’m killing its passengers too.
You should'a done what we did with transports. Anyone could drive them (if the crew were dead).

Had a game (Ultras vs Guard), where a Rhino lost its driver, so my half brother and Commissar Yarrick spent the game stealing the Rhino, attempting to run one another over, and then stealing it from the other guy. Hilarious fun.

Funniest use of a rhino in my old club was ablative armour, 5 storm bolters, 5 hkm's and a scout squad inside - takes at least 2 shots to take down and happily hunts down all targets.

Tygre wrote:Normally in 2nd Marine squads were only 10 strong, and a Techmarine was needed for a vehicle. Maybe the WD had some extra rules for smaller games? Or the staff got the rules wrong (quite common at the time). What WD I probably have it.

After codex chaos came out with super flexible unit options, WD did indeed put out rules for buying marines in combat squad size (basically half the points, half the options). Speaking of which, chaos marines are probably one of the better factions for very small games due to being able to take some of their more elite units in 3 man squads.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264598.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264598.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Techmarine appears to be a requirement for certain vehicles. And there were rules allowing you to buy 5-man Combat Squads. Can't for the life of me remember where they were printed though.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Oh, and if you’re putting a character on a bike, don’t tool them up.
Bike units were hilarious. The few times I used full units of 5 Marine Bikers, a volley of fire would render them useless within a turn, and that's probably because half of them would go out of control and slam into one another.



I think it’s my 2nd Ed experiences with bikes which make me eschew them to this very day.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264605.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264605.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
In such a small point game of 2nd Ed?

Ditch the Rhino. Transports, any transports, were death traps for their occupants. If it take out the Transport, it’s very likely I’m killing its passengers too.

Assuming it’ll be carrying the Tacticals and the Chaplain? A single shot can, and because Sod’s law, probably will, kill 285 points worth of models. And because it’s a Rhino, it needn’t be a Lascannon, either.



Disagree. In 2nd bolters or other basic guns can´t hurt rhinos. So he would only need to watch out for heavy weapons.

Anyway, why were rhinos considered death traps? Maybe because players are used to drive today directly towards enemy lines, get their transports blown away, passengers brush dirt from their uniforms and charge the opponents without a fuss. THIS is utter garbage gameplay and needed to go way of the dodo twenty years ago but GW wanted to sell rhinos en masse.

Rhinos were fine in 2nd. Just use them when you actually need them. In Epic it went like like this:
First turn: Rhinos drive to the middle of the board, unload troops and pretty much do nothing for the rest of the battle. Passengers died automatically in Epic when their transports were blown away so you needed to unload troops as fast as possible.
Same goes for 2nd 40K. Drive and unload troops in first turn. If you can´t move a single rhino safely around the board avoiding overwatch with heavy weapons then maybe your terrain is lacking.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264804.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11264804.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Oh, and if you’re putting a character on a bike, don’t tool them up.

They might have thick armour, an excellent Field save and loads of wargear, but that’s not a bike they’ve got between their legs. Oh no. It’s a bomb waiting to go off…..
The move is to jump off the bike after traveling 20+". Use the Conversion field to save the S10 hit, then blind everyone within that sweet 10" radius. THEN throw the Vortex Grenade. bonus points if you take out the opposing Psyker with it. Then you can dominate the psychic phase.

Warning, your opponent may quit the game after that.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11265010.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11265010.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
 Insectum7 wrote:
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Oh, and if you’re putting a character on a bike, don’t tool them up.

They might have thick armour, an excellent Field save and loads of wargear, but that’s not a bike they’ve got between their legs. Oh no. It’s a bomb waiting to go off…..
The move is to jump off the bike after traveling 20+". Use the Conversion field to save the S10 hit, then blind everyone within that sweet 10" radius. THEN throw the Vortex Grenade. bonus points if you take out the opposing Psyker with it. Then you can dominate the psychic phase.

Warning, your opponent may quit the game after that.


Make it a Libarian on the bike and then you can also cast Vortex as well in the psychic phase, which was the last phase back then. The back of the Vortex power card was slightly different. If you knew what to look for you could always pick it from the "random" draw (I know that's cheating).]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11265045.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11265045.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
 Insectum7 wrote:
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Oh, and if you’re putting a character on a bike, don’t tool them up.

They might have thick armour, an excellent Field save and loads of wargear, but that’s not a bike they’ve got between their legs. Oh no. It’s a bomb waiting to go off…..
The move is to jump off the bike after traveling 20+". Use the Conversion field to save the S10 hit, then blind everyone within that sweet 10" radius. THEN throw the Vortex Grenade. bonus points if you take out the opposing Psyker with it. Then you can dominate the psychic phase.

Warning, your opponent may quit the game after that.


You act like you’ve never heard of a Vortex Detonator!

Though the must fun I ever had with a Vortex Grenade was my Magus lobbing one, missing by a couple of inches, followed by a barrage of Shotgun fire from Hybrids, which knocked Ezekiel back into the Vortex. After that, the Vortex Template chased a lvl 4 Inquisitor like an affectionate puppy. Can’t remember if it actually caught up with him, but run as he liked it was hot on his heels!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11265051.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11265051.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions Orks - low points cost with lots of variety 500 points would be fun and the classic foe of space marines.
Sisters of Battle - The alternative marines but with access to militia and preachers (could include IG allies too).
Squats - Although they only have a list in the black codex they would be very able to field a 500 point army.
Genestealer/Chaos Cult - Both are designed for low point level battles.

I'd be reluctant to go with these armies.
Chaos Space Marine - Would be similar to the Space marines at this point level, but low unit count per squad could work out well.
Imperial Guard - Might work, but I'd use the Black codex instead of the actual IG codex so you have more wriggle room.

I would not bother with:
Tyranids & Eldar* are best left to one side at this points level. Leader characters are too expensive and require psykers to be invloved. Also troops you need not flexible enough to be accommodated with only 500 points.

*Giving it more thought a harlequin force would probably work at 500 points.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11265061.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11265061.page GMT 2nd edition 500 point lists, faction suggestions
Tygre wrote:
Normally in 2nd Marine squads were only 10 strong, and a Techmarine was needed for a vehicle. Maybe the WD had some extra rules for smaller games? Or the staff got the rules wrong (quite common at the time). What WD I probably have it.

number 209 may 1997! this was as you know late 2nd edition, prior to this would of been strictly 10man like you said

 Shuma-Gorath wrote:
As an avid fan and player of 2nd edition I would suggest for 500 points other armies to use should be:
Orks - low points cost with lots of variety 500 points would be fun and the classic foe of space marines.
Sisters of Battle - The alternative marines but with access to militia and preachers (could include IG allies too).
Squats - Although they only have a list in the black codex they would be very able to field a 500 point army.
Genestealer/Chaos Cult - Both are designed for low point level battles.

I'd be reluctant to go with these armies.
Chaos Space Marine - Would be similar to the Space marines at this point level, but low unit count per squad could work out well.
Imperial Guard - Might work, but I'd use the Black codex instead of the actual IG codex so you have more wriggle room.

I would not bother with:
Tyranids & Eldar* are best left to one side at this points level. Leader characters are too expensive and require psykers to be invloved. Also troops you need not flexible enough to be accommodated with only 500 points.

*Giving it more thought a harlequin force would probably work at 500 points.

great food for thought thanks!

it seems orks definately will be an army! and luckily one that is legitimately 3d prinatbale to proxy.. i might have to start a painting club too...
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11265751.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/802222/11265751.page GMT