<![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "The High Lords of Terra."]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/31.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net The High Lords of Terra.
Also I wonder about their identities. Who can they be? There are no stupid suggestiongs (okay there are several like suggesting Sly Marbo or Ciaphas Cain just for fun).]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5558565.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5558565.page GMT Re:The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5558704.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5558704.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. Actually, I do wonder how they get promoted/found/etc.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5558866.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5558866.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
Inquisitor Czevak wrote:
You are not free whose freedom is won by the sacrifice of other, more honorable men. You are merely protected. You suck the honorable man dry and offer nothing in return.


Power should go to the ones who deserve it; not to the scions of decadent aristocracies and ignorant bureaucrats.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5558972.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5558972.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Admiral Valerian wrote:
A bunch of dirty politicians and cowards who have no real power.

Inquisitor Czevak wrote:
You are not free whose freedom is won by the sacrifice of other, more honorable men. You are merely protected. You suck the honorable man dry and offer nothing in return.


Power should go to the ones who deserve it; not to the scions of decadent aristocracies and ignorant bureaucrats.


How do you decide whose earned it?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5558984.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5558984.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 LoneLictor wrote:
 Admiral Valerian wrote:
A bunch of dirty politicians and cowards who have no real power.

Inquisitor Czevak wrote:
You are not free whose freedom is won by the sacrifice of other, more honorable men. You are merely protected. You suck the honorable man dry and offer nothing in return.


Power should go to the ones who deserve it; not to the scions of decadent aristocracies and ignorant bureaucrats.


How do you decide whose earned it?


We keep the Lord of the Imperial Administration, the Representatives of the Imperial Astropath Corps and the Navigator Houses, the Fabricator-General, and add the Lord Commanders and the Lord Admirals along with the Captain-General of the Custodians. If any Primarch returns, they get a place (no Space Marines). Kick out the meddling priest, the gutless assassin, etc.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559001.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559001.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
I mean, it's almost impossible to rule the Imperium, and they manage to.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559010.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559010.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 thenoobbomb wrote:
I find the High Lords doing their job allright.

I mean, it's almost impossible to rule the Imperium, and they manage to.


Sure they do. I'm also sure both the Emperor and Malcador would be appalled at how well run the Imperium is.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559017.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559017.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
Admiral Valerian wrote:The War Council is a good example - the Primarchs and the Imperial Army Lord Commanders.


Firstly, the Primarchs were born into those positions. Considering that Lorgar (who cared more about building chapels than making war) and Magnus (who cared more about reading than making war) had spots on it, I'd say it wasn't really earned.

Secondly, would they even be good rulers? Just because a General is good at killing people doesn't mean he'd make a good ruler. He could be a terrible ruler.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559023.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559023.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559025.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559025.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Admiral Valerian wrote:
 thenoobbomb wrote:
I find the High Lords doing their job allright.

I mean, it's almost impossible to rule the Imperium, and they manage to.


Sure they do. I'm also sure both the Emperor and Malcador would be appalled at how well run the Imperium is.


They had the Space Marine Legions, and weren't assailed from all sides.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559026.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559026.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 thenoobbomb wrote:
 Admiral Valerian wrote:
 thenoobbomb wrote:
I find the High Lords doing their job allright.

I mean, it's almost impossible to rule the Imperium, and they manage to.


Sure they do. I'm also sure both the Emperor and Malcador would be appalled at how well run the Imperium is.


They had the Space Marine Legions, and weren't assailed from all sides.


They were also relatively forward-thinking men, something that cannot be said for the High Lords. A forward-thinker is a 'heretic', after all...

The Emperor wrote:
Verona's work was never meant for darkness. Humanity is the same. Only when it is free of a religion that teaches us not to question will we see its true brilliance.


Oh the irony. The Emperor wanted men to think, to look forward and aspire to the future...but his 'divinely-appointed' regents want men to be ignorant and to simply rot under them.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559041.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559041.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
The Emperor wanted men to think. Thinking, however, will probably stop the worshipping of the Emperor, wich is what is keeping the Imperium together.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559054.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559054.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Admiral Valerian wrote:
 LoneLictor wrote:
 Admiral Valerian wrote:
A bunch of dirty politicians and cowards who have no real power.

Inquisitor Czevak wrote:
You are not free whose freedom is won by the sacrifice of other, more honorable men. You are merely protected. You suck the honorable man dry and offer nothing in return.


Power should go to the ones who deserve it; not to the scions of decadent aristocracies and ignorant bureaucrats.


How do you decide whose earned it?


We keep the Lord of the Imperial Administration, the Representatives of the Imperial Astropath Corps and the Navigator Houses, the Fabricator-General, and add the Lord Commanders and the Lord Admirals along with the Captain-General of the Custodians. If any Primarch returns, they get a place (no Space Marines). Kick out the meddling priest, the gutless assassin, etc.


Alright, so you kick out the Ecclesiarch?

He controls the Adeptus Ministorum, which controls all the preachers and priests in the Imperium. They have their own private army, the Adepta Sororitas. They rule entire planets, known as Cardinal worlds. They've burned billions of souls for heresy.

The Ecclesiarch will kill you. Considering he owns multiple worlds, he can probably hire a lot of assassins. He can bribe your own men to turn them against you. He can bribe other High Lords to turn against you. If he wants, he can have you publicly declared a traitor and executed. And if you try to act against him, you might just spark a civil war, and go down in history as the heretical High Lord who nearly destroyed the Imperium.

And what about the Grand Master of Officio Assassinorum? Its pretty obvious what he'd do.

In the end, ruling comes down to keeping important people happy. When you start pissing off important people because, "They haven't earned their positions" (even though they probably did, through politicking and backstabbing though), your reign is going to be a short one.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559057.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559057.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 LoneLictor wrote:

Alright, so you kick out the Ecclesiarch?

He controls the Adeptus Ministorum, which controls all the preachers and priests in the Imperium. They have their own private army, the Adepta Sororitas. They rule entire planets, known as Cardinal worlds. They've burned billions of souls for heresy.

The Ecclesiarch will kill you. Considering he owns multiple worlds, he can probably hire a lot of assassins. He can bribe your own men to turn them against you. He can bribe other High Lords to turn against you. If he wants, he can have you publicly declared a traitor and executed. And if you try to act against him, you might just spark a civil war, and go down in history as the heretical High Lord who nearly destroyed the Imperium.

And what about the Grand Master of Officio Assassinorum? Its pretty obvious what he'd do.

In the end, ruling comes down to keeping important people happy. When you start pissing off important people because, "They haven't earned their positions" (even though they probably did, through politicking and backstabbing though), your reign is going to be a short one.


Not if the one who boots them off the council is the Emperor himself. The Emperor hates religion. Heck, even Bile of all people calls the Imperium out on this. And assassins aren't even supposed to operate in the open. They're the thousand blades of death in the shadows; they should be under the Captain-General's or the Emperor's direct command.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559072.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559072.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. It is what is keeping the Imperium together]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559085.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559085.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 thenoobbomb wrote:
Sure, the Emperor hates religion. So what?
It is what is keeping the Imperium together


Uh-huh. And he burned a city and humiliated a Lorgar to prove the point. I don't think he'd mind burning down the Imperium, disappearing into the shadows, and then starting over again after a few millennia.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559093.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559093.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559130.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559130.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Beaviz81 wrote:
Are they bumbling pawns in the game of the Ruinous powers? Or crafty men and occasionally women that can trick even Tzeentch when the situation demands? And how are them kept free from taint?

Also I wonder about their identities. Who can they be? There are no stupid suggestiongs (okay there are several like suggesting Sly Marbo or Ciaphas Cain just for fun).

They direct the really, really high levels of the Imperium and make very, very broad strategic and political decisions. The Imperium is far too large for them to micromanage to any degree at all. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559173.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5559173.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
Like it or not, it is the faith of uncounted trillions of Imperial citizens that keeps the Imperium together and moving along. He may have hated religion, but, in the end, he attempted to keep people (Primarchs, especially) ignorant, and so they were badly-equipped to handle Chaos when they encountered it.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560290.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560290.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Psienesis wrote:
The Imperium is Humanity's last hope for survival against the Old Night. If the Emperor came back, burned it all down... well, Humanity is done for. If the Xenos don't get them, Chaos will. Alone, the Emperor, as a man, can do nothing significant to stop the many threats that assail the Imperium.

Like it or not, it is the faith of uncounted trillions of Imperial citizens that keeps the Imperium together and moving along. He may have hated religion, but, in the end, he attempted to keep people (Primarchs, especially) ignorant, and so they were badly-equipped to handle Chaos when they encountered it.
Given that new empires that can rival the Tau are cropping up, frequently at the Imperium's expense, all over the place and not one, but two galaxy ending threats in the Tyranids and Necrons are arriving, I think the gotterdammerung of humanity is rapidly approaching.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560300.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560300.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Admiral Valerian wrote:

Uh-huh. And he burned a city and humiliated a Lorgar to prove the point. I don't think he'd mind burning down the Imperium, disappearing into the shadows, and then starting over again after a few millennia.


Luckily for the Imperium he is a rotting corpse, and what he thinks doesn't matter. What the Ecclesiarch says the God-Emperor thinks matters a great deal, though.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560400.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560400.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560458.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560458.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560461.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560461.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560533.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560533.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 LoneLictor wrote:


Alright, so you kick out the Ecclesiarch?

He controls the Adeptus Ministorum, which controls all the preachers and priests in the Imperium. They have their own private army, the Adepta Sororitas. They rule entire planets, known as Cardinal worlds. They've burned billions of souls for heresy.

The Ecclesiarch will kill you. Considering he owns multiple worlds, he can probably hire a lot of assassins. He can bribe your own men to turn them against you. He can bribe other High Lords to turn against you. If he wants, he can have you publicly declared a traitor and executed. And if you try to act against him, you might just spark a civil war, and go down in history as the heretical High Lord who nearly destroyed the Imperium.


Not if the you're the Fabricator-General or have allied with him to curtail the Ecclesiarchy's growing power and infuence; the Assassin Grandmaster (is he on the Council? I thought the assassins were subordinate to the Inquisition) might decide not to interfere because he agrees that the Ecclesiarchy has too much power or can't decide who he should support either way.
Similarly, if you're the Lord Commander of the IG you won't be too worried about a few million Sororitas; and anyone powerful enough to make it to the rank of High Lord will a) have worlds of their own, and b) not be in it for the dosh - at that level, your poison of choice is power, not money - so bribery will not be very effective. Each High Lord will chose sides (or not) based on which side they think will serve their interests best and/or has the clearest advantage.

I mean, the Ecclesiarch is probably the most powerful man on the Council, excepting *maybe* the Fabricator-General, but if you're powerful enough to be a credible threat to his position on the Council. you're not going to get rofl-stomped that easily.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560535.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560535.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560582.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560582.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560817.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560817.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560840.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560840.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. 40k. I mean they train and indoctrinates the members of the IOM going from Inquisitor to lowliest soldier. But their influence has waned since they were at their peak with Von Dire. *Strikes the bell and watches Lynata magically appear in the discussion.*]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560955.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5560955.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
They're don't control the Imperium enitrely - for one thing, the Mechanicus' control over the Imperium's technology is absolutely vital to its survival, and you'll be hard-pressed to find an organisation within the Imperium more opposed to the Ecclesiarchy.

I'd even go so far as to say that those are the two main opposing powerblocks in the Imperium]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5562736.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5562736.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5562975.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5562975.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5563015.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5563015.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5563024.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5563024.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5563107.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5563107.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5563144.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5563144.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5564928.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5564928.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5564939.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5564939.page GMT Re:The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5564966.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5564966.page GMT Re:The High Lords of Terra.
 Kain wrote:
The Administratum and Mechanicus are the two dominating bodies in the Imperium. Vandire made sure that the Ecclesiarchy's chances for dominance were permanently gutted. Without the Mechanicus the Imperium dies overnight, without the Administratum there isn't an Imperium in the first place.


That's not entirely true. Vandire made sure the Ecclesiarchy's chances for overt, military dominance were permanently gutted - they can (and are working on it) still rule the non-Mechanicus parts of the Imperium through more subtle means.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565396.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565396.page GMT Re:The High Lords of Terra.
Bran Dawri wrote:
 Kain wrote:
The Administratum and Mechanicus are the two dominating bodies in the Imperium. Vandire made sure that the Ecclesiarchy's chances for dominance were permanently gutted. Without the Mechanicus the Imperium dies overnight, without the Administratum there isn't an Imperium in the first place.


That's not entirely true. Vandire made sure the Ecclesiarchy's chances for overt, military dominance were permanently gutted - they can (and are working on it) still rule the non-Mechanicus parts of the Imperium through more subtle means.

The Administratum can still wipe the Ecclesiarchy off the map by fudging some tax forms and labeling them as treasonous traitors. You do not mess with the pencil pushers. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565409.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565409.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565418.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565418.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Beaviz81 wrote:
Too bad the ecclechiarchy is the power behind the throne. Not many likes them due to their dogmatic fanaticism.
And then the Mechanicus stops sending the Ecclesiarchy spare parts for all their religious machinery, twiddles their thumbs, then laugh as all their cathedrals collapse upon themselves and the sisters of battle die as they run out of ammunition. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565442.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565442.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. And should any of them decide to do so, the Ecclesiarchy can a) count on a portion of them defecting due to having been raised in the tradition of the God-Emperor (except the Mechanicus) by the Ecclesiarchy, and b) declare those who try to sabotage the Ecclesiarchy's Most Holy and Righteous mission Diabolus Extremis and have frenzied mobs rip them apart.

That's why all of these people are High Lords. If any one of them decide to stop providing their services, the Imperium collapses. It's a balance of power.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565480.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565480.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
Bran Dawri wrote:
Sure they could. The Inquisition could also label all senior Ecclesiarchy clergy as heretics, mutants and Chaos worshippers, or the Navigator Houses could decide not to guide any of their ships and/or ships with people/cargo belonging to the Ecclesiarchy anywhere anymore.
And should any of them decide to do so, the Ecclesiarchy can a) count on a portion of them defecting due to having been raised in the tradition of the God-Emperor (except the Mechanicus) by the Ecclesiarchy, and b) declare those who try to sabotage the Ecclesiarchy's Most Holy and Righteous mission Diabolus Extremis and have frenzied mobs rip them apart.

That's why all of these people are High Lords. If any one of them decide to stop providing their services, the Imperium collapses. It's a balance of power.

Except the AdMech doesn't care, because the AdMech is effectively it's own nation that's merely in an alliance of convenience with the Imperium. Worship of the Emperor is at best, encouraged within it. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565485.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565485.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. IOM. Their Forge Worlds need the Agri Worlds in order to churn out tanks and battleships.

Though the idea is not entirely without merit. The AdMech is fettered to a corpse much like the Germans anno 1916, that's how I see the 40k. they need to win but can't as the combined might of their enemy is greater, yet by some miracle they subsist.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565499.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565499.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Beaviz81 wrote:
Lies, they can't survive without the rest of the IOM. Their Forge Worlds need the Agri Worlds in order to churn out tanks and battleships.

Though the idea is not entirely without merit. The AdMech is fettered to a corpse much like the Germans anno 1916, that's how I see the 40k. they need to win but can't as the combined might of their enemy is greater, yet by some miracle they subsist.

The Adeptus Mechanicus is explicitly described as being more or less an independent political entity, just one that's closely allied to the Imperium. Also, do you know what's the food of choice in a forge world? I'll give you a hint, it comes from the same source as Solyent Green. Food isn't the main concern, it's raw materials for their factories such as ores and metals, and the AdMech could get them on their own if they wanted to. But right now the Imperium does it for them so why bother? Given time to set up mining infrastructure, the AdMech could survive on it's own. But without the AdMech the Imperium dies because the AdMech's ten thousand year monopoly on practical sciences has made damn sure that there's no hope for getting anything done without them. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565518.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565518.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. 40k they need their food-stuff from the Agri-Worlds.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565534.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565534.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Beaviz81 wrote:
You are that lost in it that you can't even envision me having any good points? Wow take some Valium. Logistic is still king even in 40k they need their food-stuff from the Agri-Worlds.

Why grow real food when rendering down people and vermin corpses into paste gets the job done just as well and is technically more nutritious? Flavor concerns are for meatsacks. The AdMech's main requirement from the Imperium are raw materials from mining worlds, not food from agri-worlds. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565543.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565543.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565579.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565579.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Beaviz81 wrote:
Actually you are up against fluff there and that would steal place from the industry. That's why they have space-ports.
To get raw materials such as metals and minerals from mining worlds. The traditional diet of a forgeworlder is nutrient paste and blocks made from the bodies of dead workers and vermin. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565587.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565587.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565613.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565613.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Beaviz81 wrote:
That's useful if you want your whole workforce to be like Jeffrey Dahmers.

You think the AdMech cares about the living conditions of it's workers?

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565639.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565639.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. IOM ain't stupid evil!!! And scurvy leads to too many hospitals, better to import some oranges.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565671.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565671.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Beaviz81 wrote:
The IOM ain't stupid evil!!! And scurvy leads to too many hospitals, better to import some oranges.
So they're dying earlier? Good, that means they can be reprocessed sooner. And we can make vitamin C without fruit, given that 40k's chemistry seems to be significantly beyond ours it's not a stretch to think that they can manufacture vitamins, which as biological compounds go are fairly simple. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565681.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565681.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. IOM ain't stupid evil.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565700.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565700.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Beaviz81 wrote:
Actually try reading some literature about this setting even Schaeffer gives his troops something boring yet practical, orange juice. Just to keep them off sick-bay for scurvy. remember boys and girls the IOM ain't stupid evil.
And do you know what the Adeptus Mechanicus isn't? The Imperial Guard. The AdMech explicitly uses reprocessed corpses for nutrients and considers eating real, physical food to be a weakness. Once again you try to accuse others of ignorance while only revealing your own. You know, I was under the impression that Norway was a rather intellectual nation filled with reasonable people. But hopefully you're just an outlier. Okay, now unlike you I plan on getting some sleep so I can enjoy international worker's day tomorrow. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565713.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565713.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
I'm showing you the basic food-thingy and you are dismissing it to make me me look stupid? If I claim humans in 40k. drink water at least every second day are you going to refute that as well?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565734.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565734.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Beaviz81 wrote:
You have shown yourself to have an ostrich-bran Kain, little else.

I'm showing you the basic food-thingy and you are dismissing it to make me me look stupid? If I claim humans in 40k. drink water at least every second day are you going to refute that as well?
Except you haven't shown the AdMech uses it. All you're doing is flapping your arms like some great Scandinavian chicken clucking about how it'd be more realistic if they needed to import food when canon flatly says they don't because they just grind dead bodies into paste and flavorless blocks and use that because it's more efficient. And water? Water is piss easy to synthesize. One of it's components is literally the most common baryonic substance in the universe, oxygen isn't exactly rare either. All you need to purify dirty water is some heat to boil it and some where to move the vapor to condense.

Okay, now I'm going to bed now that I've tucked the kids in. Enjoy acting like an ignoramus and try not to hurt yourself. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565755.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565755.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
Agri-Worlds exist to feed Forge and Hive Worlds. If either of these two latter types of worlds could be self-sufficient, you would not need Agri-Worlds. As they are not, however, the cities still need farmers in the countryside.

What keeps the AdMech a part of the Imperium is the knowledge that, should the IoM decide to, it could erase Mars. The AdMech also knows that it could not hope to survive the galaxy without the manpower of the IoM. It is a mutually beneficial arrangement for both parties. The AdMech exists as an empire within the Imperium.

The AdMech may hold the keys to the technology, but the Ecclesiarchy holds the hearts and souls of the people.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565849.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5565849.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Psienesis wrote:


The AdMech may hold the keys to the technology, but the Ecclesiarchy holds the hearts and souls of the people.


Yeah right. A few whispers here, a few whispers there, and the whole thing goes to hell.


 Beaviz81 wrote:
It's Valerian, he regards the Ecclecharchy as the KKK, just leave him be. He is like them a dogmatic fanatic.


I'm flattered. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5566377.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5566377.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
Forge Worlds if anything would rely more on raw materials such as ore than foodstuffs simply because the vast majority of their occupants are techno-organic like servitors. This means that not only are they more efficient (which by extension more replaceable because they just need to grab various criminals to mindwipe/"servitorize") and require less nutrients in terms of food but the process by which they maintain said numbers is probably created by some form of technology provided by the technical capabilities of a Forge World.

And I think people are also missing out the key role the Mechanicus plays in maintaining the Imperium. Yes the Ecclesiarchy is critical in creating relative social and political unity in the vast territory of the Imperium but this is all for nought if the Imperium cannot enforce or expand this influence through manpower/military strength. Which of course is impossible to do in any meaningful form if the Mechanicus refused to help supply/maintain any the vast fleets that are required to do this as well as the many members of the Imperial Navy taught at least the basic understanding of how these ships work. The Mechanicus are an underlying part of the Imperium thanks to their monopoly on technology and without them by and large the Imperium are sitting ducks.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5566487.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5566487.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Admiral Valerian wrote:
 Psienesis wrote:


The AdMech may hold the keys to the technology, but the Ecclesiarchy holds the hearts and souls of the people.

Yeah right. A few whispers here, a few whispers there, and the whole thing goes to hell.

they have the Inquisition to stop that getting far and the Space Marines have been separated from Legions into Chapters so a repeat of the Horus Heresy won't happen again, at least not as dramatically fast anyway. besides, even if humanity went to hell, it wouldn't be the first time... how many times so far?

haven't the Ecclesiarchy held the top representative role the longest?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568536.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568536.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Lotet wrote:
 Admiral Valerian wrote:
 Psienesis wrote:


The AdMech may hold the keys to the technology, but the Ecclesiarchy holds the hearts and souls of the people.

Yeah right. A few whispers here, a few whispers there, and the whole thing goes to hell.

they have the Inquisition to stop that getting far and the Space Marines have been separated from Legions into Chapters so a repeat of the Horus Heresy won't happen again, at least not as dramatically fast anyway. besides, even if humanity went to hell, it wouldn't be the first time... how many times so far?

haven't the Ecclesiarchy held the top representative role the longest?

The Ecclesiarchy only usurped the Administratum's position as most dominant seat holder in the council for a brief period of time, then Vandire buggered everything up and the Administratum responded by ripping out their balls.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568543.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568543.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Beaviz81 wrote:
Are they bumbling pawns in the game of the Ruinous powers? Or crafty men and occasionally women that can trick even Tzeentch when the situation demands? And how are them kept free from taint?

Also I wonder about their identities. Who can they be? There are no stupid suggestiongs (okay there are several like suggesting Sly Marbo or Ciaphas Cain just for fun).

Who/what they are: http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/High_Lords_of_Terra#.UYFCtLWyBxU

In the end, everyone is a bumbling pawn of chaos.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568554.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568554.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
 Selym wrote:
 Beaviz81 wrote:
Are they bumbling pawns in the game of the Ruinous powers? Or crafty men and occasionally women that can trick even Tzeentch when the situation demands? And how are them kept free from taint?

Also I wonder about their identities. Who can they be? There are no stupid suggestiongs (okay there are several like suggesting Sly Marbo or Ciaphas Cain just for fun).

Who/what they are: http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/High_Lords_of_Terra#.UYFCtLWyBxU

In the end, everyone is a bumbling pawn of chaos.

Who in turn are bumbling pawns of Jervis Johnson. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568559.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568559.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
That's the grimdark fun of it all, it's not that there are "bad people" in charge, it's that there is no one steering the ship. The Imperium is a perpetual motion machine, grinding away with human life for fuel. Considering it has kept the species intact so far, it's not far from what the Emperor intended.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kain wrote:
 Selym wrote:
 Beaviz81 wrote:
Are they bumbling pawns in the game of the Ruinous powers? Or crafty men and occasionally women that can trick even Tzeentch when the situation demands? And how are them kept free from taint?

Also I wonder about their identities. Who can they be? There are no stupid suggestiongs (okay there are several like suggesting Sly Marbo or Ciaphas Cain just for fun).

Who/what they are: http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/High_Lords_of_Terra#.UYFCtLWyBxU

In the end, everyone is a bumbling pawn of chaos.

Who in turn are bumbling pawns of Jervis Johnson.

Who, in turn, is a bumbling idiot. Yay!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568564.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568564.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
KnowItAll wrote:
Beyond issuing the occasional decree or creating a new Space Marine Chapter, the High Lords are mostly a ceremonial position; the size of the Imperium makes active governance an impossibility.

That's the grimdark fun of it all, it's not that there are "bad people" in charge, it's that there is no one steering the ship. The Imperium is a perpetual motion machine, grinding away with human life for fuel. Considering it has kept the species intact so far, it's not far from what the Emperor intended.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kain wrote:
 Selym wrote:
 Beaviz81 wrote:
Are they bumbling pawns in the game of the Ruinous powers? Or crafty men and occasionally women that can trick even Tzeentch when the situation demands? And how are them kept free from taint?

Also I wonder about their identities. Who can they be? There are no stupid suggestiongs (okay there are several like suggesting Sly Marbo or Ciaphas Cain just for fun).

Who/what they are: http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/High_Lords_of_Terra#.UYFCtLWyBxU

In the end, everyone is a bumbling pawn of chaos.

Who in turn are bumbling pawns of Jervis Johnson.

Who, in turn, is a bumbling idiot. Yay!

No, he's a bumbling pawn of the malevolent force known only as...the board of directors...]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568581.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568581.page GMT The High Lords of Terra. http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568590.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568590.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
KnowItAll wrote:
Who, in turn, are bumbling idiots?

Yes.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568593.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568593.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
KnowItAll wrote:
Who, in turn, are bumbling idiots?

No, they are bumbling pawns of the even more nebulous force known as the shareholders, who are bumbling pawns of we the customers, who in turn are bumbling pawns of Cegorach in a bizarre fourth wall breaking turn of events. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568644.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568644.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
So I guess, we the customer are the bumbling idiots. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568709.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568709.page GMT The High Lords of Terra.
I find it funny that if you really think about the Imperium, it's modeled after a dystopic American/Roman Republican system pitted with a strong arm church continuously propping it up, while simultaneously fighting for power. The High Lords being the sluggish Legislative/Judical/and executive branch all rolled into one, they are the federal government - an almost omnipotent vessel of power when concentrated on a single issue, but like the armies they deploy, it takes an enormous effort to get them to agree on anything. The majority of the daily decisions made by the Imperium are on a local level. Sectors, regions, planets, even lowly commanders are where the true power of the Imperium lies even if all owe their dues to Terra.

Games workshop has done a service to the community by allowing this because it means one thing:

The players have the power. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568779.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/523943/5568779.page GMT