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		<title><![CDATA[Latest posts for the thread "BT allies for IG 2k"]]></title>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ So ive been looking at the new marines as allies for my guard still and ive come up with some Black templars.<br /> <br /> <br /> Allied detachment: Black Templars(I dont have the new marine codex so I dont have exact points down or know entirely everything stat  wise for them) 540pts in total for the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(15);'>BT</span><br /> <br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(56);'>HQ</span><br /> Chapter master<br /> Artificer armor<br /> some chainsword of teeth.<br /> <br /> troops<br /> <br /> 5man crusader squad <br /> grav gun<br /> lascannon<br /> Razorback-las/<span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(166);'>plas</span><br /> <br /> 5 man crusader squad<br /> grav gun<br /> lascannon<br /> razorback-las/<span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(166);'>plas</span><br /> <br /> Thunderfire cannon<br /> <br /> Fortification: Aegis/quad gun<br /> <br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> Primary Force<br /> <br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(19);'><span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(338);'>CCS</span></span><br /> x4 plasma<br /> chimera<br /> <br /> Troops<br /> <br /> Vets<br /> x3 plasma<br /> Chimera<br /> <br /> Vets<br /> x3 plasma<br /> chimera<br /> <br /> Vets (vendetta)<br /> x3 flamers<br /> demolitions <br /> <br /> Fast attack<br /> Vendetta<br /> Vendetta<br /> <br /> Heavy Support<br /> <br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(89);'>LRBT</span><br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(87);'>LR</span> eradicator-bolter sponsons<br /> <br /> 40pts left<br /> <br /> So here is the idea.....Guard dies.  Everything that is guard will be pushing up to capture and contest objectives and to hopefully keep the opponent at bay.  The defense line will be set up in a way that the 5 man crusader squads will be against the wall with their razorback behind them.  1 will be on the left the other on the right the Chapter master will probably be attached to a squad and fire the quad or detach and fire the quad at something separate like flyers if needed.  <br /> <br /> The idea with the master is that he has an orbital bombardment to add to sitting back to fire one turn but usually there is something that gets into my lines that is a big threat and he will be used to attack it in melee.  I thought about helbrecht instead so I can have a nice charge for those marine squads but the odds of all the marines being alive in their squad and most of the time marines arent amazing in assault.  With the grav guns I can atleast put my opponents unit at initiative 1 allowing my chapter master to swing first.  I did think about the emperors champion for this as he does have an insta death stance.<br /> <br /> So whats the general consensus and whats everyones views? <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <span style="font-size: 9px; line-height: normal;">Automatically Appended Next Post:</span><br /> ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Wed, 25 Sep 2013 21:10:16]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Anybody, any suggestions?]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Thu, 26 Sep 2013 14:47:40]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ I suggested almost the exact same detachment to one of the local <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> players.<br /> <br /> /suspicious <br /> <br /> Well, I'm bias towards it, but I like it. Mechplars live again, without having to move towards the enemy when they get shot!]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Thu, 26 Sep 2013 20:49:12]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ <blockquote><div><img src="https://www.dakkadakka.com/s/i/a/cd40025994d794e2c2d46f0b16ab1981.jpg" height="20" border="0">&nbsp;<a href="/dakkaforum/posts/preList/554374/6090210.page"><b>obsidiankatana wrote:</b></a><br/>I suggested almost the exact same detachment to one of the local <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> players.<br /> <br /> /suspicious <br /> <br /> Well, I'm bias towards it, but I like it. Mechplars live again, without having to move towards the enemy when they get shot!</div></blockquote><br /> <br /> Well thats ironic because I live in Ohio and I was suggested this list by someone else <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(84);'>lol</span>.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Fri, 27 Sep 2013 00:56:58]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ <blockquote><div><img src="https://www.dakkadakka.com/s/i/a/9a5145a9dff4c1ac741028d7d6a53555.jpg" height="20" border="0">&nbsp;<a href="/dakkaforum/posts/preList/554374/6090839.page"><b>tankboy145 wrote:</b></a><br/><br /> Well thats ironic because I live in Ohio and I was suggested this list by someone else <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(84);'>lol</span>.</div></blockquote><br /> <br /> Yeah, pretty sure we know each other. ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Fri, 27 Sep 2013 01:02:13]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Gamers Haven?]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Fri, 27 Sep 2013 02:50:27]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Indeed.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Fri, 27 Sep 2013 02:52:41]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ There we go! Yup figured I would try getting a 2k list going  with that detachment and see where I can get. Unfortunately I believe its pretty solid <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(84);'>lol</span>. ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Fri, 27 Sep 2013 14:19:33]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ I did get thinking about our discussion though - if you're looking for more long-range firepower, an infantry platoon has far more to offer. 6 lascannons for 300pts in an infantry platoon +1 Heavy Weapons Squad, better than what the marines can offer. Add in two Special Weapon squads for six plasma guns and that brings it to 460pts for more weapons than the marines can bring.<br /> <br /> Reconsidering the options offered by the marines I think you should look at Legion of the Damned for some ignores-cover special weapons and 3++ goodness.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Fri, 27 Sep 2013 16:13:04]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ But another thing to consider is all those weapons are at bs3 which will miss half the time and if I plan on using orders I would have to keep the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(19);'><span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(338);'>CCS</span></span> with their chimera back just to make the platoon useful for its points.  The special weapon squads will miss or even kill themselves most of the time and the smallest amount of fire will make the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(695);'>SWS</span> and <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(59);'>HWS</span> run off the board.<br /> <br /> Yes there will be more bodies on my side but they are also more fragile than the marines are.  The marines also have some more survivability in assault with the gravguns and the Chapter master.<br /> <br /> Ive also seen some good reviews of the legion of the damned but I havent looked at them in the new codex, I know in the last codex they werent very great for what they did compared to their cost.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Fri, 27 Sep 2013 18:09:41]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ 6 Guard lascannons hit just as often as 4 <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(119);'>SM</span> ones, assuming rapid fire on all the special weapons marines will actually hit more (if you use the grav guns over plasma). So, yeah, you're right there.<br /> <br /> Legion got a 20 point reduction at the minimum squad size and the price of their special/heavy weapons went down a bit. They're a bargain bunch now, though I don't have straight point costs available to me. The only downside is the mandatory deep strike (no pod), but you can re-roll the scatter. Couple that with <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(489);'>SNP</span>, Fearless, and all the goodness.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Fri, 27 Sep 2013 18:56:09]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Yea a couple guard squads chilling back isn't bad. Only effective orders are <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(371);'>frfsrf</span> which basically just adds a shot to lasguns and bring it down just twin links shots when firing at vehicles or monstrous creatures. Once I throw a command squad to chill back I start sacrificing a mobile forward force for a stationary gun line. <br /> <br /> I mean I could switch to gun line guard and then use the marines as the forward force to do the attacking but at that point I probably be better off with another chapter rather than black Templars. ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sat, 28 Sep 2013 03:23:05]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ 6 <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(126);'>TL</span> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> Lascannons will hit more often than 4 <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(119);'>SM</span> ones, but then you sacrifice the mobility of a mech list. Granted lascannon marines aren't amazingly mobile, but the razorbacks do add that degree. At that point maybe drop the grav guns or bump the squad to ten and combat squad them (I think Crusader squads can combat). Take the five with the special in the Razor to follow the guard and leave the lascannon boys back to pop shots.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sat, 28 Sep 2013 04:32:32]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Damn, Im really gunna have to grab the codex sometime so I can actually start looking over some of the different space marine stuff.  The legion of the damned do seem pretty fun and cool to try out.  On the other hand if I upgrade the squads to 10 guys I would have to take the points away from some of the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> stuff in order to do so. Also what would be a good idea for the Chapter master at that point, just attach him to a 5 man squad and go forward or still keep him back with the longer ranged guys?]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sat, 28 Sep 2013 15:20:55]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Either that or take a Master of the Forge as your <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(56);'>HQ</span> and utilize the Conversion Beamer. Though if the squad will be ten strong rather than five, the reason for taking <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(15);'>BTs</span> is gone. Might as well go Iron Hands or some such at that point. Or Imperial Fists for tank hunting lascannons.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sat, 28 Sep 2013 18:18:39]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Yea that was my thought, I figured if I changed up anything with the general list above the black Templars would be pointless at that point. <br /> <br /> What exactly is the conversion Beamer, I've never heard about it?<br /> <br /> I'm gunna have to draw up some more strategies and see what I can come up with. I think with iron hands I would probably be best off with a pod list having tacticals and iron class dropping from pods. ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sat, 28 Sep 2013 22:22:58]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Conversion beamer has three different firing profiles variable on the range of the shot - the longer the distance, the stronger the shot. Can't recall if I can post direct rules on these forums, but its stats are in the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(13);'>BRB</span>. Goes from a dinky small blast to a funtastic large blast.<br /> <br /> For pods I'd recommend Salamanders for <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(126);'>TL</span> / <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(93);'>MC</span> flamers and meltas.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sat, 28 Sep 2013 22:37:15]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ I may even think about the ultramarines, as tigarius is a beast and if I ran a guard foot based list I could probably get a nasty combo in a blob going for him. ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 00:44:49]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Yeah, he can certainly psyker up some goodness for <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span>. I'd rather have Azrael for that (4++ on 50 Guardsmen is hilarious), but Tigurius does some fun things.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 01:02:10]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ I could even try to get invisibility on a guard blob so that my guardsmen have a higher weapon skill than my opponent and I could give them prescience for rerolls to hit. And there's probably some other powers that could buff a blob or separate unit up. ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 01:08:31]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ True. Of course if you're using Tigurius to buff a blob of guardsmen for close combat, there are simply better options for <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(19);'>CC</span> out there. Honor Guard in the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(119);'>SM</span> codex come to mind, as well as terminators.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 02:20:22]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ I could go with Calgar of the Ultramarines in a <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(261);'>LRC</span> with honor guard with power swords and axes and then use a basic scout squad with snipers as troops.  <br /> <br /> Or just go with a deep strike type of army with salamanders and have 2 tactical squads and an ironclad drop in and use vulkan so I can get the twinlinked melta as well.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 03:56:52]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ I'd consider swapping the Ironclad for a squad of Legion. They can take a Heavy Flamer, and <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(489);'>SNP</span> lets them shoot it out of their <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(471);'>DS</span>. Although you do lose a pod that way.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 04:02:09]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ That would be rather interesting.  I would only have 1 squad come in turn 1 with a pod which means they are pretty much dead.  But turn 2 I would have the legion and some other unit in a pod or deepstrike down.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 04:54:39]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Maybe give Vulkan a Command Squad with some plasmas or meltas to pod in. So that's Vulkan Pod, <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> Pod, <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> Pod, and Legion.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 06:21:16]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ I actually do like that, it's pretty solid and allows me to basically being in 2 squads each turn if reserve rolls fair with me turn 2. <br /> <br /> For the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>tac</span> squads should I max them out to be 10 man squads so I can get a heavy weapon or should I keep them at 5 man squads with a special weapon and having the sarge carry a combo weapon that compliments the special weapon. <br /> <br /> With so many points in the marines portion of the list I may even have them as the primary and have guard as the detachment. <br /> ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 15:22:49]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ It depends how many points you want to put into the marines. Ten man adds ablative wounds and a multi-melta, that snap fires on the turn it came down and every time you move (granted with <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(126);'>TL</span>, giving you a 33% chance to hit). Keeping them cheap will retain a pair of weapons (one being a combi), but they are less durable.<br /> <br /> Also recall that Vulkan has a flamer in his glove. Or a heavy flamer, I forget which, but he does shoot fire from his hands.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 16:55:33]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Sounds like starwars force lightning but with fire  <img src="/s/i/a/a634d4056bc15b21ef25d1960801aa76.gif" border="0">   <img src="/s/i/a/5d13fa41280d6fdef786d41bc175d3f6.gif" border="0">  <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(84);'>lol</span><br /> <br /> I could even combat squad the 10 man teams and have the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(330);'>MM</span> sit still while the flamers/meltas(depends on what I add to the squads) will move around.<br /> <br /> I think I might just be set with salamanders. YEAAAA I get to add more green to my already green guardsmen force <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(84);'>lol</span><br /> <br /> The command squad that will be attached to vulkan, thats just 5 guys? all I need for them will just be like plasma and melta, or even melta and flamers if I want to assault.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 17:32:31]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Five guys, yeah. I think one auto-upgrades to an apothecary, so they'll have <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(265);'>FNP</span>. Not sure in the new book. The other four can take plasmas or meltas for 15pts/10pts each. <br /> <br /> I'd recommend combi-flamers over combi-meltas, since I prefer re-rolling wounds to re-rolling to hit if you're combat squading - then it'll be flamer/combi-flamer with one group, multi-melta in the other, melta/multi-melta on Legion.<br /> <br /> Edit - you could also paint 'em as a successor to Salamanders. Black Dragons and Storm Giants come to mind.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 19:03:40]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ I will have to look into the successors and see what schemes might catch my eye, or even just make a new one.  <br /> <br /> I will most likely pick up the codex sometime over the next week or so and work in points and repost an army using salamanders instead. <br /> <br /> I will most likely find this in the codex when I get it but do the black legion benefit from the chapter tactics? I mean the legion are kinda their own guys and aren't attached to a chapter but I will have to look that up. ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 20:46:09]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Legion of the Damned? I don't think they benefit - not sure if they have Chapter Tactics, but I doubt it.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Sun, 29 Sep 2013 21:36:32]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Yea I was gunna say I don't believe the legion would benefit from a separate chapters tactics. <br /> <br /> I do question using Vulcan though. His melta benefit is nice but I'm not sure he's worth his points<br /> ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Mon, 30 Sep 2013 02:41:51]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ He's a bargain as a pure beatstick. 2+/3++ with a <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(93);'>MC</span> Relic Blade and built-in flamer.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Mon, 30 Sep 2013 02:46:04]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ <blockquote><div><img src="https://www.dakkadakka.com/s/i/a/cd40025994d794e2c2d46f0b16ab1981.jpg" height="20" border="0">&nbsp;<a href="/dakkaforum/posts/preList/554374/6093198.page"><b>obsidiankatana wrote:</b></a><br/>6 Guard lascannons hit just as often as 4 <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(119);'>SM</span> ones, assuming rapid fire on all the special weapons marines will actually hit more (if you use the grav guns over plasma). So, yeah, you're right there.</div></blockquote><br /> <br /> Until you use Chapter Tactics: Imperial Fists, and you get re-roll of all 1's with Bolter type weapons. Give the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> squads Lascannons too, don't forget Plasma gun/Combi Plasma. Throw in IF Tank Hunters rule on a Devastator Squad with Lascannons and it's a mighty sweet tank busting deal. <br /> <br /> Don't mean to diminish what everyone is mentioning here, but you're going to have a a <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(700);'>sht</span> tonne of bodies moving up the board by way of the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span>, why not take advantage of it?<br /> <br /> Librarian (65)<br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> squad x10 w/ Plasma, Combi Plasma, Lascannon (185)<br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> squad x10 w/ Plasma, Combi Plasma, Lascannon (185)<br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(29);'>Dev</span> squad x10 w/ 4x Lascannon (220)<br /> <br /> Combat squad the 2x <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> squads (4x marines + Lascannon and 3x marines + Plasma + Combi) and the Devastator squad (2x Lascannons + sgt + 2x marines and 2x Lascannons + 3x marines). That's a lot of pseudo split firing that you can do. Screen the marines with the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> plebs, sit back and pick off vehicles with Lascannon goodness while the mobile elements of the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> squads with Plasma advance and target heavy infantry and take advantage of Bolter Drill.<br /> <br /> That's a potential 6x Lascannons from 2x Troops and a <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(29);'>Dev</span> squad, one of those would also be at BS5 every turn. Once the tanks are dead, that's also an instagibbed Broadside squad per turn (if you don't wiffle your shots). All for only 655 points for a very flexible and hard hitting firebase. Leaving 1355 points for some <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> spam!<br /> <br /> Want to be a real bastard to your opponents? Get yourself some Centurions and equip them with <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(756);'>TLLC</span> and Missile Launchers. Remember, those are relentless! March those suckers up behind the guard, and watch your opponent sweat because he needs to deal with that threat. All the while your back field Lascannons are picking him apart!<br /> <br /> Doing that would still leave you over 1000 pts for <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span>, giving you enough for a <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(19);'><span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(338);'>CCS</span></span>, 3-4 squad platoon, <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(331);'>PCS</span>, heavy weapons teams (if necessary), 2-3 Valk's (I wouldn't bother with Vendetta's because the Marines will be taking care of Lascannon duties, give them Rocket Pods and Heavy Bolters). Also.. as it's your primary detachment, you can still add a couple of heavy support <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> choices. Russes? Manticore?<br /> <br /> Could be a fun list <img src="/s/i/a/c944477abc92c1c101da485e07ff06d8.gif" border="0">]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Mon, 30 Sep 2013 04:17:15]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ Skabfang]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ <blockquote><div><a href="/dakkaforum/posts/preList/554374/6099915.page"><b>Skabfang wrote:</b></a><br/><blockquote><div><img src="https://www.dakkadakka.com/s/i/a/cd40025994d794e2c2d46f0b16ab1981.jpg" height="20" border="0">&nbsp;<a href="/dakkaforum/posts/preList/554374/6093198.page"><b>obsidiankatana wrote:</b></a><br/>6 Guard lascannons hit just as often as 4 <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(119);'>SM</span> ones, assuming rapid fire on all the special weapons marines will actually hit more (if you use the grav guns over plasma). So, yeah, you're right there.</div></blockquote><br /> <br /> Until you use Chapter Tactics: Imperial Fists, and you get re-roll of all 1's with Bolter type weapons. Give the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> squads Lascannons too, don't forget Plasma gun/Combi Plasma. Throw in IF Tank Hunters rule on a Devastator Squad with Lascannons and it's a mighty sweet tank busting deal. <br /> <br /> Don't mean to diminish what everyone is mentioning here, but you're going to have a a <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(700);'>sht</span> tonne of bodies moving up the board by way of the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span>, why not take advantage of it?<br /> <br /> Librarian (65)<br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> squad x10 w/ Plasma, Combi Plasma, Lascannon (185)<br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> squad x10 w/ Plasma, Combi Plasma, Lascannon (185)<br /> <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(29);'>Dev</span> squad x10 w/ 4x Lascannon (220)<br /> <br /> Combat squad the 2x <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> squads (4x marines + Lascannon and 3x marines + Plasma + Combi) and the Devastator squad (2x Lascannons + sgt + 2x marines and 2x Lascannons + 3x marines). That's a lot of pseudo split firing that you can do. Screen the marines with the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> plebs, sit back and pick off vehicles with Lascannon goodness while the mobile elements of the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>Tac</span> squads with Plasma advance and target heavy infantry and take advantage of Bolter Drill.<br /> <br /> That's a potential 6x Lascannons from 2x Troops and a <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(29);'>Dev</span> squad, one of those would also be at BS5 every turn. Once the tanks are dead, that's also an instagibbed Broadside squad per turn (if you don't wiffle your shots). All for only 655 points for a very flexible and hard hitting firebase. Leaving 1355 points for some <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> spam!<br /> <br /> Want to be a real bastard to your opponents? Get yourself some Centurions and equip them with <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(756);'>TLLC</span> and Missile Launchers. Remember, those are relentless! March those suckers up behind the guard, and watch your opponent sweat because he needs to deal with that threat. All the while your back field Lascannons are picking him apart!<br /> <br /> Doing that would still leave you over 1000 pts for <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span>, giving you enough for a <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(19);'><span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(338);'>CCS</span></span>, 3-4 squad platoon, <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(331);'>PCS</span>, heavy weapons teams (if necessary), 2-3 Valk's (I wouldn't bother with Vendetta's because the Marines will be taking care of Lascannon duties, give them Rocket Pods and Heavy Bolters). Also.. as it's your primary detachment, you can still add a couple of heavy support <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> choices. Russes? Manticore?<br /> <br /> Could be a fun list <img src="/s/i/a/c944477abc92c1c101da485e07ff06d8.gif" border="0"></div></blockquote><br /> <br /> IF seem like a much better list for this type rather than the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(15);'>BT</span>, what powers would you run with the libby, <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(70);'>iirc</span> he doesnt have divination still.  <br /> <br /> This is deffinetly a consideration and is cheap which also gives be a very solid fire base.<br /> <br /> I would probably stick with 1 vendetta also just incase my opponent has anti air, I dont want to waste shots trying to snap fire lascannons at a hell drake or something.<br /> <br /> But thanks for the list suggestion and break down of it, really helps look at other chapters.  Also because If I ran the salamanders detachment of vulkan and command squad, 2 <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>tac</span> squads(all those 3 in pods), and a legion of the damned squad I would basically be making that my primary and Im pretty sure thats gunna run close to 1k points unless I make the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>tac</span> squads 5 man.<br /> <br /> Thanks again!]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Mon, 30 Sep 2013 12:07:57]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ I would consider a group of <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(80);'>LC</span> Centurions or a las Pred over the devastators. With the rise of Tau, the existence of the Heldrake, and recent Eldar shenanigans the 3+ save of <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(29);'>Devs</span> just doesn't cut it <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(72);'>imo</span>.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Mon, 30 Sep 2013 13:44:12]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Yea it would be situational. The centurions would have to focus on one target where there's a squad of <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(29);'>devs</span> combat squaded which allows them to fire at 2 targets and with correct spacing behind a line could be hard to hit. Hell drake just doesn't care about anything anyways <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(84);'>lol</span>. I don't think the ores would be much help as tau has enough high strength to knock it out quick. ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Mon, 30 Sep 2013 18:16:18]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Cents have a 2+ save that laughs off a Helldrake. <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(29);'>Devs</span> can split fire 2 <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(80);'>LCs</span> at two targets with a combat squad, but all that does is tickle two vehicles rather than turn one to slag. Cents can get the split fire for one cannon if you put an omni-scope on the sergeant and they can reposition themselves away from a threat while firing at full <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(14);'>BS</span> thanks to <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(489);'>SNP</span>.<br /> <br /> I'm assuming ores is a misspelled Pred, and while it isn't the best choice, it's the cheapest weighing in at a 145pt triple las platform (one of which is <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(126);'>TL</span>).<br /> <br /> ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Mon, 30 Sep 2013 18:25:42]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ obsidiankatana]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ Those are good points and I will have to consider that, Reluctantly I picked up the codex today so I can actually start llooking over each of the armies potential and get point costs down for stuff.  Honor Guard seem like a very nasty close combat squad as I finally looked over them and the command squad. ]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Mon, 30 Sep 2013 23:12:14]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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				<title>BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ <blockquote><div><img src="https://www.dakkadakka.com/s/i/a/9a5145a9dff4c1ac741028d7d6a53555.jpg" height="20" border="0">&nbsp;<a href="/dakkaforum/posts/preList/554374/6100646.page"><b>tankboy145 wrote:</b></a><br/>IF seem like a much better list for this type rather than the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(15);'>BT</span>, what powers would you run with the libby, <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(70);'>iirc</span> he doesnt have divination still.  <br /> <br /> This is deffinetly a consideration and is cheap which also gives be a very solid fire base.<br /> <br /> I would probably stick with 1 vendetta also just incase my opponent has anti air, I dont want to waste shots trying to snap fire lascannons at a hell drake or something.<br /> <br /> But thanks for the list suggestion and break down of it, really helps look at other chapters.  Also because If I ran the salamanders detachment of vulkan and command squad, 2 <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>tac</span> squads(all those 3 in pods), and a legion of the damned squad I would basically be making that my primary and Im pretty sure thats gunna run close to 1k points unless I make the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(167);'>tac</span> squads 5 man.<br /> <br /> Thanks again!</div></blockquote><br /> <br /> If I use a level one Libby I always roll Biomancy and hope for a 3. Relentless, <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(265);'>FNP</span>, It will not die <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(264);'>ftw</span>! If using level two I will roll Biomancy and Telekinesis hoping for (can't remember the name) the one which forces your opponent to re-roll to hit and wound rolls of 6.<br /> <br /> I use him as a <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(27);'>de</span>/buffer essentially, because if I am playing higher points games I have Captain "Beatstick" Lysander on staff to bring the pain!]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Thu, 3 Oct 2013 01:51:47]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ Skabfang]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ I would say the Las-<span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(166);'>Plas</span> is not the best option...it is just...too hit and miss. I would recommend the Twin <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(80);'>LC</span>. Though, as always, it is up to the gamer!]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:16:26]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ Xadakk]]></author>
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				<title>Re:BT allies for IG 2k</title>
				<description><![CDATA[ With only a side of 11 I dont see the pred being to effective.  I will keep the armor for the <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> primary.<br /> <br /> I have posted in this forum an <span class="glossaryitem" onmouseover='gp(69);'>IG</span> list with the allied IF youve suggested.<br /> <br /> <a href="http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/555732.page" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/555732.page</a>   This is the updated list.]]></description>
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				<pubDate><![CDATA[Thu, 3 Oct 2013 21:25:42]]> GMT</pubDate>
				<author><![CDATA[ tankboy145]]></author>
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