I am really sorry everybody for not being able to post when the Kickstarter will launch...it is not because we are trying to be mysterious or that we are ignoring everyone....I really wish we could launch today, but in fact, we are still working on Cavern Pieces, photography, and video....I am afraid we won't really know exactly when we will be ready until we are....please bear with us...
Those really do look fantastic, and I'm counting down the 23 hours until it launches (even with recognition that if it's like their last KS, it'll likely last a month and have thousands of open spots at each tier).
Went 3 sets unpainted for the dungeon tiles, and now that I've got them I have to respect just how heavy that much stuff is, and how much work went into painting them. Extrapolating ahead roughly how much each tier might be (they said a while back they expected the sets to be around 15% more expensive, due to the higher complexity of the pieces/molds), I'm thinking I might go with 2 sets painted instead.
I suppose I could go unpainted instead and use the leftover paint from the dungeons (with a higher emphasis on brown rather than grey, obviously), but considering the raw hours it took to get where I did (and I should say that even as an amateur effort, I am happy with the outcome), a few extra bucks to have some people with greater skill knock them off is pretty appealing.
Their tier system definitely makes it a tough call. 3 sets unpainted or 2 sets painted. One gives me 50% more tiles but requires a lot more work on my behalf, the other gives me some truly incredible pieces to use. The sheer space and weight of each set actually has me leaning towards fewer, higher quality pieces, for the time being. I'd love to go up to 5 sets or more (or like some of the well funded folks who talked about getting 10 or 20+), but I'm pretty sure that much terrain would lead to trouble with the girlfriend and needing to clear out some serious space in the condo to hold it all.
I went for 3 unpainted + at least one of all the add-ons last time round. This set up used almost all of my tiles (I'm always short floor tiles).
Took about a weeks' worth of painting (compressed that is) in 3-4 hour chunks to get everything done. Still have some small items like the pillars and stairs, dungeon accessories and details, and doors left to paint. Well worth the effort imo. Wish I'd done one extra brick color, but two was enough.
I'm excited to see what base color the cavern tiles will be. Hopefully a quick wetbrush will bring out details and define a solid basecoat. Then I'll probably get the airbrush out and do some modulation. The small pools on the sides of the caves will be great for water effects.
Sweet. A buddy and I split a 10 set last time, might do the same this time as well. I already have 2 room sets, 1 passage, 1 river and a ton of random passages I snagged on Nobleknight back in the day. Have they posted side by side comparisons to the old stuff? I might actually have to do painted this time.
Which ones are supposed to represent the factory paint job- the top or the bottom? The top pieces in that pic seem either unpainted or painted differently, but the others look good.
I'll probably go in for painted this time. I went nuts on terrain last year and still have so very, very much to paint. I can't *not* get some caverns though.
RiTides wrote: Which ones are supposed to represent the factory paint job- the top or the bottom? The top pieces in that pic seem either unpainted or painted differently, but the others look good.
The larger radius corner walls (as evidenced by the smoother, more uniform floor) are the resin Master Maze Caverns, the smaller radius corner walls (with the more rocky shaped floors) are the Game Tiles pieces cast in Dwarvenite.
Might just want to keep a link to the campaign in the OP with "Go look for yourself" under it.
Because it's going to be bat-gak crazy. Even with reasonably long stretch goals, I imagine they're going to blow through a handful very quickly, considering how happy the user base seems to be with their last product.
It'd take a hell of a showstopper to keep this one in check (like, the tiers are 50% more expensive and it takes 5+ sets to get stretch goals, or something else that reigned in the viability of the average user participating).
Alpharius wrote: I'm counting on you -IPaint- to keep this thread updated when the KS goes active!
I'll try my best through the work day. I may resolve to an end of day update for the first few days, judging by previous Kickstarter sequel projects I've taken part in (the project creators tend to have a hard time managing the flood after the gates have burst open, so I expect it to be no small task). Once it quiets down I'll start compiling information and keeping track of stats, pics, infographics, etc.
Is there a recommended format people might be interested in? I know pic-heavy posts are often wrapped in spoiler tags to allow for easier page loading. I can also do a hyper-linked table of contents as milestones/updates are hit. I know certain sites are often blocked at work. I've been re-hosting DF's images via imgur. Would attachments be better suited? I'm open to suggestions. Either comment here or send me a message - I'm more than happy to accept help.
Edit: and they're going to fund at 100k in about 5 minutes. Seriously flying, obviously not sustainable, nice to see the positive response all the same.
Edit 2: funded within 10 minutes, first stretch goal within 20 minutes (2 passageway pieces per set pledged).
As with the last campaign, stretch goals apply to backers who pledge for 2 or more sets.
Looks like you really need 5 sets to make it useful, though, which runs $325 unpainted. I don't do dungeon crawling games enough to warrant that kind of purchase.
Wait for the added stretch goals. I pledged for three sets last time, and got almost two full sets free with the extra stretch goals by the end of the campaign.
Yeah, by the time 1-2m+ in funding has hit, the stretch goals will make even 2-3 sets a massive pile of tiles.
It certainly helps to already have 3 sets (basically 4.5-5 after stretch goals) of the Dungeon ones already, so any time I can combine them will lead to a simply massive table.
Ah, that makes more sense then- so basically you're saying the 3 set pledge will be bulked out to be more usable like the pics of the 5 set pledges are currently... got it
That makes it a ~$200 investment, which is much more reasonable! Time to not watch the KS page anymore to avoid temptation
-iPaint- wrote: Wait for the added stretch goals. I pledged for three sets last time, and got almost two full sets free with the extra stretch goals by the end of the campaign.
~iPaint
Same with me... the 2 set had the same parts of 3 full sets + extra when the stretch goals were done. That makes close to 3-4 square feet worth of terrain.
Between Tyson's 3D dungeon boards, my Dwarven forge and secret Weapon's ruined temple, I will be able to cover 10 square feet of table with dungeon stuff. This should add another 4 square feet. It adds up!
Forar wrote: Yeah, by the time 1-2m+ in funding has hit, the stretch goals will make even 2-3 sets a massive pile of tiles.
It certainly helps to already have 3 sets (basically 4.5-5 after stretch goals) of the Dungeon ones already, so any time I can combine them will lead to a simply massive table.
That actually makes me feel a lot better.
Correct me if i'm wrong, but the 3 set one, at the start, will cover around 3 square feet, yeah? ( or in better terms, each Set will cover around 1 square foot)
After looking at it more, while these tiles appeal to me Much more than the ones in their previous campaign (I would paint them with lava in the cracks if I went for it ) it seems like you get a lot less, and get charged more, per set than in that campaign.
I know that's normal because companies tend to undercharge on their first campaign... but it just seems like a double hit.
Current campaign 1 set contents:
The Cavern Set comes complete with these 26 pieces:
·9x Straight Wall "A"
·9x Floor "A"
·8x Curved Corner "A"
Prior campaign 1 set contents:
The Game Tiles set comes complete with these 34 pieces:
14x Straight Wall*
12x Floor*
6x Corner Wall*
2x Swinging Door
So, you get 8 less pieces per set, for $10 more per set. Even worse, at the higher pledge levels that I looked at, the difference is actually greater- $25 for 2 sets, and $35 for 3 sets, and a whopping $65 more for 5 sets!
At 3 sets then, you're getting 24 less pieces for $35 more... at 5 sets, you're getting 40 less pieces for $65 more!!
And that's just for starters, but I can't believe that the stretch goals will be more generous than in the first campaign, so that gap may widen. I just find it a bummer because the sets seem a bit unrealistically small now... still a good value, but not nearly as good a one as in the previous campaign... which is a shame because I like these much better! I don't think they should cost more to make, though, as they're the same size... and I don't see why the discount compared to the first campaign gets worse at the higher pledge levels.
They said in the comments last year that they expected the Caverns campaign to be around 15% more expensive than the first one, due to a few things (more complex shapes, etc), so them being more expensive for fewer tiles was totally anticipated.
But I'd wait until we're closer to the end to make a real value judgement/comparison as to whether or not it's a dealbreaker.
Well dang, I could have saved myself typing all that up because a backer posted a very similar statement in the comments . Copied below:
Spoiler:
I'm a bit disappointed to see the jump from last year's kickstarter. I'm glad this was mentioned in the video, but I put myself in last year for 5 painted sets which were amazing, and well worth it, but seeing now the jump up from was going from 3 sets hand painted to 5 sets hand painted was $235 to $380, or $145. Now, to get 3 sets, we're going up by $50, to $285, or if I wanted to match my pledge last year, the five set has jumped up by $75.
If you go further into the costs on a per set basis, talking just about core inclusion of materials versus painted, we can start with the single set, last year, priced at $65 for flat grey or $95 for hand painted. That's a $30 difference, yet now that same single set gray is $75 (a $10 difference already), and then hand painted is further upped to $110, ($15 dollar difference). Has the costs of manual labor gone up versus the painting, assuming it's done in house, were your painting costs increased as well, as the material costs are one thing, but the paints weren't mentioned on the video, and this just feels like it's a 5,10,15 difference here and there. Your product is well worth what you offer, yet if these prices were to continue the exact same trend next year, your drop off is likely again, going in the direction that you fine folks stated you didn't want to see.
Worse yet is the fact that sliding molds do cost more, yet despite the cost difference that we are paying for, we are dropping down the number of pieces substantially.
Last year without dealing with stretch goals, we got a total of 34 pieces, with two of those pieces being doors. I'm not expecting doors in caves, but they are wholly unique fitted pieces and gave us four total types of tiles to work with on the base set.
This year, we plummet down to 26 pieces without stretch goals, there are three base types of tiles. The numbers don't make a lot of sense without going into more detail.
Have the costs risen so dramatically, that you felt the need to drop roughly 25% of the pieces out of the price of one set, while raising the costs 10-15%, while going from 4 unique types of tiles to 3?
I'd expect that shrink ray from a cereal box at a chain grocery store, not Dwarven Forge.
This really feels like you're pricing out of the market which I know is the exact opposite of what you guys are going for. I had small emails with you guys last year, and I know it's real people that are working their butts off with this stuff, but I think that the pricing model is a bit too high, and could see less support because of it.
Hell, I'm likely wrong, you guys will blow away the numbers, but for every person that looked last year and couldn't afford it or weighed it carefully before deciding they could get maybe a set, this year grew even further out of reach.
That's a real worry.
Please reach out, I'd like to hear back, even if it's in private.
There have been a few good responses but I hope Dwarven Forge actually addresses it, too.
Also first update looks to be an accidental one intended for the original campaign
RiTides wrote: I don't think they should cost more to make, though, as they're the same size...
Many of these pieces, due to their complexity, will require slide molds to produce. The recessed detail is much more elaborate than the first Kickstarter tiles, so the production costs needed for each tile are a bit more. I think Stefan mentioned it in the campaign video. I also think the amount of material needed for each piece may be a bit more, so that could potentially be a factor as well.
The discount at 10 sets is 18% this time, whereas it was closer to 23% in the Dungeon Tiles KS at 10 sets, so yes it is a bit more expensive, but I'd argue the tile quality and variety for tile type is vastly greater this time.
At a glance, we got 19 extra tiles at 400k last campaign, versus 10 extras at 450k this campaign, however in the first they were mostly just duplicates of things we already had (as we all know, the molds are the expensive part for these things, punching out a few thousand more pieces is comparatively pennies), whereas these are being described as "Wall B" and "Floor C", etc, indicating to me that there'll be a lot more variation present, which means more molds, which means a higher cost.
It's definitely something to factor into ones judgement as to whether or not they can afford to back, but I think 3 hours and a half dozen stretch goals is unlikely to be indicative of the entire campaign, in the same way that the Kicktraq information won't be either. It's asking to ascertain too much from too little information.
iPaint, to respond to your comment from the last page, it's not just 15% more expensive, though- it's 25% more expensive for almost 25% less pieces! I'm not good with percentages so I don't know how to reconcile those two, but that makes a big difference.
My numbers come from: 5 unpainted sets last time was $260, now it is $325 (25% more). Each set came with 34 pieces last time, now it is 26 (23.5% less contents).
That said, I'm much more interested in this one than the last, so that's why I bothered to calculate that . And I agree with you that these do likely cost more to make... but that almost 25% drop in contents is the really worrying part, not the price increase, to me.
It's worth noting that in the first campaign, they gained those 19 extra tiles/pieces in 6 days.
We should gain 10 in the first 2.5 hours.
Yes, they are more expensive per piece and we're starting with fewer pieces, but we're also still in the literal opening gambit of the campaign. Sure, only one chance to make a first impression and whatnot, but I think it's worth waiting at least a few days, if not a few weeks, to see where we really start to settle into before comparing the 'value' found in this campaign.
As the mold costs are front loaded, it may simply be they want to have that all settled out before they can really justify throwing piles of extra pieces our way.
RiTides wrote: iPaint, to respond to your comment from the last page, it's not just 15% more expensive, though- it's 25% more expensive for almost 25% less pieces! I'm not good with percentages so I don't know how to reconcile those two, but that makes a big difference.
My numbers come from: 5 unpainted sets last time was $260, now it is $325 (25% more). Each set came with 34 pieces last time, now it is 26 (23.5% less contents).
That said, I'm much more interested in this one than the last, so that's why I bothered to calculate that . And I agree with you that these do likely cost more to make... but that almost 25% drop in contents is the really worrying part, not the price increase, to me.
That is significant, but as mentioned earlier, much of this might be due to it being 'underpriced' in the last KS, maybe?
Same thing happened to Mierce betwen their two KS campaigns...
Forar wrote: It's worth noting that in the first campaign, they gained those 19 extra tiles/pieces in 6 days.
We should gain 10 in the first 2.5 hours.
Yes, they are more expensive per piece and we're starting with fewer pieces, but we're also still in the literal opening gambit of the campaign. Sure, only one chance to make a first impression and whatnot, but I think it's worth waiting at least a few days, if not a few weeks, to see where we really start to settle into before comparing the 'value' found in this campaign.
As the mold costs are front loaded, it may simply be they want to have that all settled out before they can really justify throwing piles of extra pieces our way.
Well, for what it's worth I agree and am seriously considering backing for 3 sets! Just trying to make an informed decision is all
And I'm a big fan of people making informed choices. I do strive to keep my blind, ravenous fanboyism in check, but it's not always easy.
Obviously they sold tiles before and are selling tiles now, so it'd be disingenuous to try to paint this as some sort of "can't compare apples to oranges!" moment, but we were warned they'd be more expensive, and we have no idea what their end game is. Perhaps we'll end up with the same number of tiles (or more) but they decided they wanted to have more/bigger stretch goals later on, even when funding has dwindled from the first few days of insanity? Or found that they massively undervalued their first lot and just ate costs left and right to deliver a solid product all the same. Or any number of other potential causes.
I do think you have valid concerns, and it's awesome that you're thinking of backing despite having them. I sincerely hope that by the end, you find the value matches or exceeds your expectations, but for now it's all academic, and I'm simply trying to give my perspective (with the bias well recognized, of course).
RiTides wrote: iPaint, to respond to your comment from the last page, it's not just 15% more expensive, though- it's 25% more expensive for almost 25% less pieces! I'm not good with percentages so I don't know how to reconcile those two, but that makes a big difference.
My numbers come from: 5 unpainted sets last time was $260, now it is $325 (25% more). Each set came with 34 pieces last time, now it is 26 (23.5% less contents).
That said, I'm much more interested in this one than the last, so that's why I bothered to calculate that . And I agree with you that these do likely cost more to make... but that almost 25% drop in contents is the really worrying part, not the price increase, to me.
It's a valid concern, and I understand where you're coming from. The thing is, I'm not sure we should be comparing the dungeon tiles KS prices now that those sets are available at retail, since you'd be hard-pressed to find someone willing to sell the dungeon tiles w/ KS extras at cost a year later (though you potentially could). The retail price is $10 less for a single unpainted dungeon set, but has much fewer pieces than the same single dungeon set plus a single KS stretch-goals set.
I think you'd want to make the comparison to what you will be getting in this KS versus what you might potentially be getting later at retail. I imagine the caverns KS will be the single best time to get these sets for the best price per tile. We're still pretty early on in the campaign - let's see where things take us, then we can start making the comparisons once the campaign is nearing an end.
The only thing holding me back from backing is that I actually don't really play many RPGs... but the look of these is fantastic.
If they ever make a sci-fi version (which could be used for, oh I don't know, SPACE HULK) they'll make a killing there, too!
Yeah, my tiles don't see a ton of table time, admittedly, but whenever I get the chance (an errant game of Malifaux) or can re-purpose them (for Hero Quest (not sure I'll have enough, at least until I get the caverns in), Through the Breach (Wyrd's Malifaux RPG) and Robotech's Miniatures game, etc), I'm happy to pop them out.
As someone new to wargaming of any sort, I essentially have zero terrain aside from some scraps and a couple Terraclips boxes, so that also helps me justify snagging a few here and there.
It also doesn't hurt that they stated they'd deliver in October and, unlike what feels like the vast majority of Kickstarters, actually delivered in October (mid Oct to be specific, even earlier than the 'end of the month' I was expecting). Doesn't mean this one won't hit a snag or two, but they've proven to be able to handle producing gak-tons of tiles and firing them off to thousands of backers once, and that alone has my respect and loyalty (on top of producing a top notch product, imo, of course).
I don't think there's much point crunching the numbers on the first day -- other than knowing that, yes, these tiles are more expensive. I think in three weeks we'll have a better idea!
I haven't played RPGs in years, but started painting mini's. The game tiles greatly improved the display of my fantasy miniatures, and the cavern tiles should look good with my Cthulhu ones.
iPaint, I hope to see another suggested painting scheme for these tiles! I may have to do more than just a quick drybrush to make them look good! (:
Using the rough 25% more expensive and 25% fewer tiles numbers, it works out to being around 66% more expensive than the dungeons KS (or only getting 60% as much for your money if you like to think that way, which is my personal preference.) Those numbers should shrink towards 25% and 80% respectively with stretch goals, but yeah... right now there's some decent sticker shock compared to last time.
Slightly more expensive be damned, my first Dwarven Forge KS was a tremendous value and delivered quickly for really high quality dungeon fun. The cavern tiles are even higher quality and I'm in for 2 sets right now, and may bump to three, as I did during the pledge manager. Plus the add on special sets are always fantastic.
I agree that these are fantastic, and the creators seem totally awesome! Not to mention that they delivered the first KS on time... which has to be some kind of record given the size of the campaign.
Hopefully you can find some cash in the next 4 weeks, or at least, a well funded friend willing to let you play with their (surprisingly heavy) terrain when it arrives.
Great info guys! Glad someone is number crunching. Similar stuff happened with BONES 2 where people were comparing every stretch goal and every 'this time in the campaign' and comparing value. I think it is valid info for people to know, but I also think there is a level of shrewd entitlement as well.
I am sure a company would like a million dollar KS which has a 5% profit than a 2 million dollar KS with no profit or even negative. Once the molds they want to get made are produced, if the rest of the increased pledges are not decreasing costs then a company can be like 'nah, that's cool... pledge if you want but no more value.'
Dwarven Forge was pretty open last time about costs if I remember right, so I am perfectly willing to let this get going for a week or so before I determine 'true value' for myself.
Unlike boardgame KS, DF tiles aren't sold retail, so won't have the usual 30% discount boardgames have. I checked the DF website, and the KS1 base sets are the same price as the KS base sets BUT without the stretch goal items, so you're getting half as much stuff. (The add-ons are the same price as in KS1 if you buy multiple sets.)
I wouldn't have pledged if it wasn't for the quality of the sculpts. I'll probably paint them up more like my large miniatures than my drybrushed terrain. Also, these will be my first attempts at using that water effects stuff!
EDIT: Whoops -- looks like the KS1 SG added 50% more tiles, not 100%?
Well, I just found these too attractive to resist... decided to put off an army-related purchase I was going to make that was going to use the funds from an ebay sale I made recently, since I don't expect Dreamforge Wave 3 to deliver until summer anyway (and I won't be able to use it until it does).
So I'm pledged for 3 sets unpainted though, as I'd like to do them in a lava theme.
Another factor to consider - they're still offering free US shipping, and these are heavy tiles. Heavier than the dungeon tiles and (maybe more importantly) considerably bulkier.
Anybody who backed the first KS knows how tightly and compactly the tiles fit into the boxes. That's really unlikely this time around, with the large organic shapes of the cavern pieces...
Well next stretch goal is a mapmaker program upgrade, has anyone used the software in its current state / is it useful? Hopefully the one after is, well you know, more tiles
judgedoug wrote: I'm in for 2 sets right now, and may bump to three, as I did during the pledge manager. Plus the add on special sets are always fantastic.
Were you able to change to the 3-set pledge level during the pledge manager, or did you have to pay single set add-on price? I.e. can you change pledge levels during the manager?
Also, how long did it stay open last time? Anyone can answer, of course
It's functional, but probably not $100k worth of programming functional
It gets the job done, but is very basic (click to rotate, no click remove function, just click-drag). It does save layouts though which is alright, but has nowhere near the utlity of PYMapper.
People are being truly over-receptive to these stretch goals when the stretch goals have been quite average.
Eh. A little cautious optimism during the first 22 hours (as in, we're not even a full day into the campaign yet) and giving the creators benefit of the doubt shouldn't be all that surprising. I'd be astounded if the majority of backers (especially the vocal ones) weren't also backers of the first campaign.
Which isn't to say that people shouldn't speak up if they're displeased. I joined late in the last one, but it's my understanding that they were quite receptive to constructive criticism.
For all my gushing fanboy love, if this campaign ends and the stretch goal based value hasn't brought it up to a level I'm happy with, I might just have to pass as well. Even if I drop from Painted to Dungeon Grey, $220 USD (currently $243 CAD) is a sizable chunk of change out of a budget I'm trying to keep reasonable while paying off some bills.
But that'll take weeks to determine, and the final "go/no go". Like, sure, I'm not super excited about a 100k SG for the dungeon planner that I don't use, and presumably another 50-100k for us to get back to more tiles, but with the draw down in funding it's possible the later ones account for this and will reflect the slower rate we may proceed at. Momentum in a campaign is definitely a thing, and keeping a slow but steady pace and backers feeling like they're progressing can be just as valuable as raking in funding hand over fist (especially when those last few days kick in and everyone is making their ultimate choices).
If nothing else, I imagine we'll see things pick up a bit once they begin revealing add ons.
Hey guys, so for those of you who were in on the first campaign, can you tell me:
1. Were you able to change pledge levels during the pledge manager (for instance, bump up to a 3 or 5 set pledge level from a 2 set pledge level)? Or were you locked in to your original pledge level and could only add add-ons / new pledges?
2. How long did the pledge manager remain open for, and when were you asked to pay the additional funds?
RiTides wrote: 1. Were you able to change pledge levels during the pledge manager (for instance, bump up to a 3 or 5 set pledge level from a 2 set pledge level)? Or were you locked in to your original pledge level and could only add add-ons / new pledges?
Someone in the comments (and an example was given for this campaign as well) where people could 'buy' extra tiers that were lower than their base tier, so if someone wanted 7 sets, they could pledge for 5 and add on the funds for a double as well.
Kind of makes sense if they want to emphasize people participating (at least to the highest tier they can) during the campaign itself, but leaving the option open for people to decide to toss in for an extra set or 2 (at a slightly less efficient price point) post campaign.
A glance at the old campaign's update section indicates that the Pledge Manager was open for approximately 10 days; from May 10th to May 20th.
The passage pieces are really different than what they had before, so much that it will make them look weird on the table together. However the old passage pieces were kind of hard to move figures around in. The elevation stuff for future stretch goals looks great.
I don't know what their profit margins are like, but the last campaign did 1.9 million, and that was with Amazon Payments soiling itself and dying repeatedly during the end of their campaign, including like 4 hours during their last day. It was shenanigans, and they totally should've broken 2m.
Obviously they had a strong start, and I'm hoping they get there again, but we'll have to see how the next few weeks go.
Yes, but I can't afford any paid add-ons so I hope as much as possible goes into the sets. Or at least, I won't plan to put any paid add-ons into my base pledge, since those can be added via the pledge manager, but the pledge level can't be changed- and I'll be tapped out just from the pledge level.
So, if there are any paid add-ons I feel are must haves, I'll wait to add them via the pledge manager, personally.
I have to say, I'm quite happy with the variety of tiles already, just not quite there on the quantity... but I expect that to change by the end.
I'm surprised there hasn't been an update yet (with the exception of the first that was meant for the prior campaign, it seems ). It looks like they had a lot of updates on their prior campaign... I wonder why they haven't here with all the progress made?
I kinda of wonder if they didnt want to spam people with a bunch of updates on the first day since there are generally a lot of first day unlocks. Though I would have figured they would have atleast put out an end of first day here is what unlocked today type email
Dwarven Forge wrote:Update #2 Mar 13 2014
A Big Thank You and Survey Link
Just a quick note to everyone to say thank you for such a great start to our Cavern Kickstarter campaign. We can’t tell you how much your early support means to us. Your Caverns have already gotten bigger and better. As of right now, each set you pledged for also includes the following stretch goals:
2x Passage Pieces
2x Straight Walls "B" version
2x Curved Corners "B" version
2x Floors "B" version
2x Straight Walls "C" version
2x Curved Corners "C" version
2x Floors "C" version
1x Passage End Cap
And we’re not done yet! We’re working hard on upcoming stretch goals and add-ons, but we would also like to have your input now. Please CLICK HERE to take our short survey regarding what add-on packs you would like to see. Of course, we’re going to do our best to make this a fun and rewarding 4 weeks.
RiTides wrote: Hey guys, so for those of you who were in on the first campaign, can you tell me:
1. Were you able to change pledge levels during the pledge manager (for instance, bump up to a 3 or 5 set pledge level from a 2 set pledge level)? Or were you locked in to your original pledge level and could only add add-ons / new pledges?
2. How long did the pledge manager remain open for, and when were you asked to pay the additional funds?
Hey I did change pledge level in the pledge manager - I went through my emails and found this:
5/10/13
"Thank you for your $260 pledge. You selected "2 Sets (Dungeon Gray) Game Tiles" as your reward on Kickstarter."
This was a 2 set pledge with add ons.
Then after the pledge manager on fundafull I rearranged it to this and added a few dollars:
5/22/13
"Here are the rewards and add-ons you selected:
- Special Forum Account Graphic (you will be contacted later on how to enable this)
- Tote Bag
- 3 Sets (Dungeon Gray) Game Tiles
- 3 x 1 Set (Dungeon Gray) Stretch Goals
- Floor Pack (Dungeon Gray)
- Dungeon Dressing Pack (Dungeon Gray)
- Castle Wall Pack (Dungeon Gray)"
RiTides wrote: Hey guys, so for those of you who were in on the first campaign, can you tell me:
1. Were you able to change pledge levels during the pledge manager (for instance, bump up to a 3 or 5 set pledge level from a 2 set pledge level)? Or were you locked in to your original pledge level and could only add add-ons / new pledges?
2. How long did the pledge manager remain open for, and when were you asked to pay the additional funds?
Hey I did change pledge level in the pledge manager - I went through my emails and found this:
Spoiler:
5/10/13
"Thank you for your $260 pledge. You selected "2 Sets (Dungeon Gray) Game Tiles" as your reward on Kickstarter."
This was a 2 set pledge with add ons.
Then after the pledge manager on fundafull I rearranged it to this and added a few dollars:
5/22/13
"Here are the rewards and add-ons you selected:
- Special Forum Account Graphic (you will be contacted later on how to enable this)
- Tote Bag
- 3 Sets (Dungeon Gray) Game Tiles
- 3 x 1 Set (Dungeon Gray) Stretch Goals
- Floor Pack (Dungeon Gray)
- Dungeon Dressing Pack (Dungeon Gray)
- Castle Wall Pack (Dungeon Gray)"
I had to drop out during the last couple of days and speificly asked 'Hey if I drop down to the 1 set level, can I raise it back up to the 5 set level during the pledge manager stage?' and was told No... so I dropped completely. :/
I got this response from someone in the comments saying it wasn't possible last time either, interesting:
@RiTides
1.) last KS I remember that you were not allowed to go up in pledge level. Meaning you can't pledge 2 sets and then pledge for 10 during the pledge manager. You can however pledge for 10 and add another 2 sets. I am assuming this is to get a number estimate of total sets for production.
2.). I remember you had to pay right when you finished the pledge manager but can't remember what how long it was open.
You're probably right though judgedoug, and thanks for checking on that!
The pledge manager isn't very long at all after the campaign, though, and not open very long... so I'll likely stick to the level I select now and just add add-ons then, if I decide to go for any (they're still working out what they're going to offer, I think the fast start was better than they expected!).
Thanks, judgedoug... I'm wondering if perhaps they weren't planning to allow that, but with the KS crash on their final day and people not being able to adjust their pledges, decided to afterwards.
What do you think of the floor pack, since I see you got it? Was it worth it? Seems like it would've been nicer without the center motif and just blending in with the other floor tiles more... but I think larger floors will be needed so I'm hoping they add a floor pack to this campaign, too.
That's my least favorite add-on, though . If I do go for some in the pledge manager, I'd like a floors pack and an accessories one, if they do any similar to the prior campaign (but cavern themed, of course).
A not insignificant amount more if international, and the cost per set drops as you get into the higher tiers (eg: $72.50/set at 2 sets, $70/set at 3 sets).
At 2 sets painted, I'm looking at $3.41 per tile, or nearly twice the price.
Note, that's simply for comparison.
Obviously I could go unpainted and lop $60 off that total, but considering the cost of paints and brushes (both of which were excellent in the first campaign), it seems far more cost effective to have the pros do it for me.
No problem RiTides, happy to help. The floor pack was most definitely worth it if you want rooms larger than a standard 3x3.
I'm just pledging for sets now and I'll let the campaign run it's course and then be pleasantly surprised with the amount of stuff I'm getting. Then in the pledge manager I'll figure out what addons i want. Too much work to have to go back and keep recalculating and adjusting my pledge, etc.
i did NOT buy the paints last campaign and i'm definitely getting them this time around.
RiTides wrote: That's my least favorite add-on, though . If I do go for some in the pledge manager, I'd like a floors pack and an accessories one, if they do any similar to the prior campaign (but cavern themed, of course).
Dwarven Forge has always seemed to have an aversion to big rooms. All their sample lay-outs and sets for as long as I can remember have featured narrow corridors and small rooms. Most 3-D dungeon terrain leans the same way, and that is a big reason why for years I didn't bother with it in my games.
Funny, early in the campaign someone in the comments was begging them to not drown the stretch goals in floor tiles, and though it's been a while since I built a floor plan out, with 3 dungeon sets from the last KS, building some wide open spaces hasn't really taxed me thus far.
Hell, with 5 sets total (probably) once this is done, I think I'll be able to cover some good sized tables without cheating on the 'super thick walls'.
Dear god if they make this yearly I'm going to need one of those blueprint storage cabinets...
I just want larger floors (and Maybe some accessories), but of the other sets, the mine cart and the cracks / chasm (or even better, underground lake) sounded the best to me.
Big picture, but I think most of it has already been shown (no new pieces except the boulder / ramp). I think they're still planning the rest of the add-on packs.
Yeah, that's the same for me- I might have been interested in the boulder/ramp alone for less cost, but since that's the only new piece, it's not tempting.
They did just post in the comments that they've dropped the international shipping cost on this add-on from $35 to $20, so that's more reasonable at least.
But as it's up to $877K already, I'm looking forward to hopefully more interesting add-on packs, or even better more pieces in the base set, as the next stretch goal after hitting $900K.
Definitely passing on this one. The extra $20 for S&H and $15 for having them painted puts it up to $75. Sure, I could get them unpainted, but even $60 for 17 pieces isn't really grabbing me.
Hell, due to some recent developments it might be necessary to drop my pledge altogether, sad as that would be. But I might have a massive expense looming in the next few months, so that might just have to take priority.
Darn it Forar, how did you transfer your rabidness to me . This is why I'm so cautious about dipping my toe in to a campaign- too easy to commit more after that
My pledge is pretty much set in stone for just the basic sets, but assuming the pledge manager runs into late April (which seems reasonable, since this ends a week into April) I'll be considering 1 - 2 addon sets then, depending on what they offer.
Well, last time the pledge manager went live roughly 3 weeks after the campaign ended, and lasted for 10 days, so depending on how they plan to run this one, there might be an entire month (and hopefully at least a pair of paycheques within) to pay off any extras we might decide to snag.
But, yeah, a little rabid enthusiasm can be contagious. Hell, in some KS comment sections it can become almost cult-like. "Oh yeah, 2 sets is good, but you know what's even better? 3?! No no, 5 and add ons!! YAY!" and suddenly you've committed half a grand or more to a project you only wanted to put a couple hundred down on.
Robotech Tactics got a bit... overzealous at this for a while.
For all my enthusiasm, I totally recommend acting responsibly to people. No point going deep into debt, even if it's an awesome deal.
Someone just linked to a thread on the Dwarven Forge forums where Stefan was showing the backside of some tiles and the gold he's using. Personally, these pics make me less tempted to buy the painted version, but I'm very happy with the look of the sculpts. (He does say the pics don't do the paint jobs justice, see quote below)
just a quick post showing the backsides and some close ups of the glittering mineral deposits that some of the pieces have.....I used metallic paint to create what looks like viens of something....maybe iron ore? Looks awesome in the flesh....pics don't really do justice....
Alpharius wrote: A question for anyone who went with "Expertly Hand Painted" sets last time around - what did you think?
Reports said basically it was hit or miss, with some people saying that steps were omitted on their pieces, creating a stark contrast between paint layers. Others had nothing but praise, claiming they could never have done the painting on their own. Personally, I think the overall result was good for a first effort by DF. I'm sure the caverns will prove a bit more complex in terms of painting QA, but should follow the same process of basecoat, highlight a few areas with some color, then drybrush a couple coats on top.
900K was broken briefly (and will be broken again soon I think) so the next stretch was posted: spider webs, 1 free in each set when 1 million is hit.
That's a bit of a bummer for me because it's a freebie, thus making less room in the sets for other freebies, but I think totally useless to me
Yeah, as a $1 million stretch, it seems lackluster, but I think we're only just now starting to get into the real meat of this campaign. The sample spider web pics had some amazing elevated pieces. I can't imagine for a second DF will fall short on getting those pieces to production.
I've been critical of everything about this campaign so far (rate of stretch goals, having the tile program to stretch it to $200k between actual physical rewards).
That said, for another 100k, it's certainly not an optimal option, but it's a decent choice at least in my personal opinion.
With what we've seen of the campaign so far, and where we are (in the middling section), unless something jaw dropping gets added to really drive home some people on the fences or get a whole heap of new blood, I think we're going to see some simple stuff as we sort of plod along for the next 3 weeks.
Some decent goals hopefully, some stuff that elevates the value, but I suspect it'll be the last few days when things really take off again and the momentum sweeps people up.
42-45k for days 3 and 4 on Kicktraq are very solid, but I imagine this 100k will take us at least 3 days, if not longer. There'll be a little restlessness among the comments, but with 3 weeks remaining, I have no problem with things settling into a bit of a holding pattern.
To drive a little interest, I could see having a minor stretch goal based on things other than just funding. Hitting 3,000 backers, for example. Or getting X shares/likes on some Facebook stuff to help get people spreading the word (above and beyond what's already being done here and on other forums).
But yeah, not exactly a crazy 1m stretch goal, but I hope we start seeing some smaller goals soon, things that can be achieved even during the waffling middle of a campaign (as is commonly the case).
Well, I fought the good fight with the fanboys in the comments lol. Obviously, this was a lackluster goal- and worse, one that costs them money for something many won't want!
However, I'm over it and will just look forward to the next goal, which they'll hopefully show as an on-deck one instead of waiting 3 - 5 days for this one to be hit (it would likely help this one be hit faster, too).
The fact that they've delayed posting a "goal hit" update makes me hope they've taken the constructive criticism and have better add-ons / free pieces (likely alternating goals) in store.
Automatically Appended Next Post: This pic showing possible future pieces was taken down soon after the campaign was put up, but luckily one of the backers saved it!
There's not a lot to see, but still, it's something . And looks a helluva lot better than symmetrical plastic webs . Actually puts my mind at ease a lot- there's apparently quite a bit to look forward to, they're just being extremely cagey about revealing it for some reason.
Stefan posted that he's sculpting now and that there will be a "cool update" tomorrow... looking forward to it.
I think the sculpts are done. Their marketing is a spoon-feed tactic. Seems effective.
BTW I love my dungeon tiles. They looked beautiful, prepainted, and arrived on time.
judgedoug wrote: Yup, I just logged into the DF fundafull and it confirmed that I pledged for for 2 sets but bought 3.
I have finally discovered how you did this! From the comments:
Jenney O'Callaghan wrote:@ peer you can continuously move around. Last time you were capped at base sets in the pledge manager for total $ spent not your actual pledge level. You could not add additional base sets beyond your pledge total $.
.
Ex if your total pledge was $500 you couldn't upgrade to 10 sets in the manager
.
But the manager did allow you to add add-ons beyond your total pledge $ and then they asked for additional payment in the pledge manager.
.
There is a good chance this KS will be the same... Unless someone else has heard differently.?.?
In the picture you posted, judgedoug, you had originally pledged enough money in the Kickstarter to cover 3 sets worth of terrain, even though you had selected the pledge level for 2 sets.
So that is what matters- how much money you've pledged during the campaign is equivalent to what pledge levels you're able to select in the manager. You can then add on add-ons (or even more sets at the add-on price, I think) but not go to a higher pledge level in the manager, if you didn't have enough money to cover that pledge level during the campaign.
So it looks like what they told Cyporiean last time was actually accurate, you just kind of found a loophole .
This means I'll definitely keep my pledge for the higher number of sets during the campaign, and just pick any add-on packs I'd like afterwards, rather than the other way around.
It's funny, but unless I've missed something, money received during the pledge manager is more valuable than money received during the Kickstarter.
When the campaign ends, KS and Amazon payments take their cut, which for a large campaign like this will end up being around 10%.
Whereas the money that comes from paypal or a credit card (if the latter option exists) takes, as far as I'm aware, vastly less than 10%. More like a small transaction fee, maybe 1-3% or something.
So $100 from Kickstarter is worth less to them than $100 from the PM.
Now, granted, money earned during the KS and unlocking stretch goals by having that guaranteed funding and being able to entice more and more backers for more and more money can be a nicely snowballing/avalanche of funding, and the community spirit can be hard to beat, and any other number of reasons to focus on the KS campaign itself. It's just interesting when a campaign writes in restrictions like that. Surely someone realizing during the PM that they can justify buying 3 sets instead of 2 is a net good thing for all involved?
Not a complaint, just an observation from a KS veteran.
Stefan Pokorny 41 minutes ago
Now I'm back to sculpting! sorry if I'm rough around the edges this morning...was up really late painting something that you will see tonight!
Forar wrote: It's funny, but unless I've missed something, money received during the pledge manager is more valuable than money received during the Kickstarter.
When the campaign ends, KS and Amazon payments take their cut, which for a large campaign like this will end up being around 10%.
Whereas the money that comes from paypal or a credit card (if the latter option exists) takes, as far as I'm aware, vastly less than 10%. More like a small transaction fee, maybe 1-3% or something.
So $100 from Kickstarter is worth less to them than $100 from the PM.
Now, granted, money earned during the KS and unlocking stretch goals by having that guaranteed funding and being able to entice more and more backers for more and more money can be a nicely snowballing/avalanche of funding, and the community spirit can be hard to beat, and any other number of reasons to focus on the KS campaign itself. It's just interesting when a campaign writes in restrictions like that. Surely someone realizing during the PM that they can justify buying 3 sets instead of 2 is a net good thing for all involved?
Not a complaint, just an observation from a KS veteran.
i think thats more or less the reason why bigger companies use there own PM vs the stock kickstarter one. For the dreamforge and bones (i believe) it ported in your pledge amount which put your balance into the negative and it then allowed you to pick the stuff you want, if your stuff zeros out your balance great, if you end up having to pay more then its KS fee free money
Update: 45 degree pieces, just sculpted yesterday! What a great idea. 2 included in the narrow passages add-on, but I'm hoping for some for the main set as a later stretch goal, since it has none currently.
Looks awesome, though . Pretty excited by this update!
More new free stretch goals and add-ons are also coming. In fact, many are being adapted based on recent backer input, so they are still in development. But here’s a quick preview of a few items coming very soon: Lava, Elevations, Stalagmites, 45-degree Floors. And if you thought we might be holding back, well, we are saving some great ones for later in the campaign. We think you’ll love those, too.
i think thats more or less the reason why bigger companies use there own PM vs the stock kickstarter one. For the dreamforge and bones (i believe) it ported in your pledge amount which put your balance into the negative and it then allowed you to pick the stuff you want, if your stuff zeros out your balance great, if you end up having to pay more then its KS fee free money
There is no 'stock one', just a terrible one shot survey form builder.
Hopefully the update from yesterday carries some momentum into this week as people wake up and see it . Should break 3000 backers late today. I do think they'd do better to just lay all their cards on the table, at least a little bit, but they're going to reveal things very piecemeal... seems to be their style!
That said, they responded really quickly to the suggestion of 45 degree pieces from the backer survey, so I am pretty happy with how they are listening to backers.
Would've be nice to have an indication of whether or not there will be a floor add-on pack (since apparently they're not going to do a larger floor piece this time, according to comments from folks, although I haven't seen the source). If there isn't one, I guess that will save me some money, though and I should have a decent number of floors just from the sets / unlocks so far.
Edit: New pic of 2 sets with all stretch goal tiles unlocked so far:
Dwarven Forge wrote:Creator Dwarven Forge 9 minutes ago
We just hit 3,000 backers! We will have an Update Wednesday morning that shares some info to mark this occasion. Thanks for all the support!
-- Jeff
Creator Dwarven Forge 7 minutes ago
Hint: It will be some "hot" news...
-- Jeff
Yeah, I dislike the lava paint job, personally... also preferred the arctic look. I'm hoping there's another piece but it's probably just the paint job.
Still, will be cool too see another update regardless
Agreed. And given some of the crazy folks who go in for 10-20+ sets, every add on increases the chances of seeing a bunch of people up their pledges accordingly.
Even if the add ons aren't really for me, I totally love seeing the new ones, and hope there are backers who want to put them on the table.
2 free 45 degree pieces in each set is the 1.1M stretch goal
The update also shows the alternate lava scheme, but what's most interesting to me is the new piece they've shown: Floor D (so far there have been walls A-C, corners A-C, and floors A-C). It's the piece in the bottom right of the below pic:
I would really like to see that piece painted up in the normal scheme, I think it would look really good! Hopefully, it will be added to the base set as a future stretch goal (1.3M?)... more floors would be most welcome
I'm wondering if it would be better to go for a painted 3x set, or a painted 2x set and get some of the add ons? There's not alot of painted 2x set pledges left.
Go for as many sets as you can. If you go 5 sets, you don't need the add ons because you'll be getting the passage pieces and 45 degree pieces in the free stretch goals.
It all boils down to how big of a layout you want to make.
A tile is 2"X2". A ten x ten tile layout makes a 20" square, and uses 100 tiles.
What about things like the lava scheme or eventual frost scheme? Don't you need to add them on if you want them, or do they come as part of the pledge eventually as well?
How many sets would allow one to densely populate a skirmish game, sized table? Lets say 3x3, or 3x2?
My '2 sets' from the last KS with all the stretch goals covers a solid 3 tiles of 12"x12". Every 36 tiles is enough to cover a 1foot by 1foot area of play.
So 5 sets currently has 205 2"x2" tiles, which can cover a total of 5.69 12"x12" tiles (your 3x2)
NTRabbit wrote: I'm wondering if it would be better to go for a painted 3x set, or a painted 2x set and get some of the add ons? There's not alot of painted 2x set pledges left.
The add ons are unlikely to improve much, whereas the tiers will get better and better with each stretch goal. While awesome, the cost (plus getting them painted, plus getting them shipped for those of us outside the US) reduces their value, in my eyes.
If there ends up being a paint scheme or some specific pieces you simply must have (or want more of in an amount that a 3rd set won't help with), 2 and some add ons is a fine start, but I'd lean towards 3 sets myself. I'm only in for 2 currently, but that's due to funding; trying to knock out some debt these days, so I'm trying to show restraint here. But it's not easy.
How many sets would allow one to densely populate a skirmish game, sized table? Lets say 3x3, or 3x2?
The answers above are good, and accurate, but remember that you don't have to cover every single inch of that board with those tiles, so 2 or 3 sets can stretch to cover more terrain than they represent by their base footprint alone. I've got 3 sets from the Dungeon KS, and have built 3x3 tables I've been very happy with using those and a handful of other terrain pieces (streetlamps and assorted odds and ends).
Now, granted, the Dungeon sets were larger than the ones we're seeing now, and we've got weeks left to go and hope for some impressive stretch goal based improvements, but I'd think that with some creative work you could get a hefty chunk of the 3x2, even if it didn't include going right to the edges on all corners, if you see what I mean.
NT, they'll likely add more pledge spots for 2x sets, as they've bumped it up a few times already for several of the levels, I think.
It's true that you can only get the lava paint scheme via the add-ons, but it's not as good of a deal as the base sets, imo. When the 45 degree piece gets added to the base sets with the next stretch goal, the only piece missing from the base sets will be "Floor D". And I'm hoping that will get added in as a later stretch goal (seems likely, since they're molding it).
Edit: Whoops, page rollover! Yeah, sticking with 3 sets is the right call, imo
Those are add-ons. They are basically the same tiles with a different paint job, and a few special pieces thrown in.
Or
You could buy unpainted sets and make them yourself.
As an admittedly terrible painter, while I find the cost of add ons painted+shipped internationally to be prohibitive, if the right one came along I could see myself snagging one.
Sure, I *could* do it myself.
If I wanted it to look like a 6 year old got ahold of them.
Forar wrote: As an admittedly terrible painter, while I find the cost of add ons painted+shipped internationally to be prohibitive, if the right one came along I could see myself snagging one.
Sure, I *could* do it myself.
If I wanted it to look like a 6 year old got ahold of them.
Honestly, though, with the amount of detail on the tiles, basecoats and drybrushing is really all that's needed to bring out the details. I'd argue a six-year-old could produce the same quality as the factory paint jobs if you showed them how to do it. Painting the small dungeon bricks might be hard to stay "in the lines" - or on the brick - but for the caves, I imagine just some random blotches of browns, tans, and greys, all brought together with a few drybrush coats, will be plenty enough to get the feel of caverns.
The only time I paid attention when painting my dungeon pieces was for the bricks, which coincidentally took the longest amount of time (2 brick colors took ages, and I really wish I'd done a third). The rest I just zoned out and let drybrushing do the work. I imagine the caves will go much quicker without the need to paint small bricks on each piece.
For the 'normal' paint job on the dungeon tiles? Sure, they're fine. I got 3 sets of grey and the paint set and feel thejob went pretty well, and I haven't even done the final 'white stone edge super dry brushing' layer.
But the job they've shown on the caverns? Eh. The finer blending job done with the magma tier? No, I'd rather pay someone $15 to do that than spend around that much on paints I lack and who knows how much time and effort failing to recreate the effect.
I applaud the whole "teach a man to fish" aspect of the hobby, but with finite hours available outside of work, sleep and personal obligations, they're not exactly asking a ton of cash to have better painters do it for me.
The cost is definitely a factor in my lacking interest in the add ons, but if I was to splurge on one or two, I'd be hard pressed to not just have them to the painting as well.
So I'm still debating how much use I will actually get out of these tiles. I use grid maps for all of my D&D 4E combats, but with the Next edition coming out this year I won't be pulling tiles out every session. They might get some use in my Endless Fantasy Tactics games, but I lean towards more open maps when I play right now.
My question to everyone is what games do you intend to use DF cavern tiles for?
I intend to use them as a display for my armies, and then if I ever get into dungeon crawling games, for that too of course . There's also possibilities of using them for board games to replace cardboard tiles, there's a thread on BGG listing possible games for this.
We use them for Castles and Crusades, Descent, Mordheim, and plans are in the works for a modded WHFB 500 point game.
I use my older resin stuff as a display background for my painted figures too.
Also used them to help visualise the floorplan for a Haunted Attraction we built last summer.
By the way, the current KS just went over the Million Dollar mark. Updates expected later tonight.
Had this response to a PM, very hopeful for a floors add-on now
RiTides wrote:Glad to support! And if you make a larger floor sculpt or even just normal floors add-on pack, you will get even more of my money and I'm sure a lot of other peoples', too!
Dwarven Forge wrote:Noted! You might be happy soon!
Yeah, but I'll just ignore that part... see my comment above. It may help the total and thus unlock more caverns... but yeah, not my preference either.
Still, floors pack is coming eventually, I guess! Off that they seem to still be working these things out, but they're pretty open and just looking to find out what people want.
I don't see the problem. 1 pack of 20 pieces to flesh out some of the old sets with new stuff might attract some more of the missing KS1 backers.
It's not for me either, falling far below my "it'd have to be damned awesome to get me to shell out for more dungeon tiles" threshold, but I can see the appeal for others (with better funding and preferably located in the US).
Y'know, one day, I hope there's a Canadian KS that is super amazing awesome and I save like $200 because I live there.
Getting one of those 'receive items at the border' services is looking more appealing by the campaign.
Yeah, that's been asked for a few times, and I recall them agreeing that'd be pretty sweet.
I think it'd make a nice stretch goal, as a piece that transitioned from finished rock to roughly hewed stone would also make for good entrances in some cases, so they could work even people without dungeon tiles.
Silly question...do they allow one to add the add-ons with their pledge calculator following the KS, or do you need to add the money in to your pledge before? Thanks.
You can definitely pay for add ons following the Kickstarter (but probably not for much longer than a month afterwards, given how quickly their pledge manager closed last time). However, you cannot increase to a higher pledge "level" as far as I know.
So, if you pledged for 3 sets, you could add on the lava add-on, or a set of 2 more base set caverns... you could not, however, adjust to the 5-set pledge level, unless you pledged enough money to cover that level to begin with ($325 unpainted).
So adding things "a la cart" during the pledge manager, yes, changing pledge levels, no.
Is it me or does this ks not feel as well ran as the first one.. Granted I wasnt able to get in on the first one due to me dropping an obscene amount of money on hirstarts molds.. But I did follow it closely, and it seemed really well ran.. This one seems kinda slapped together once we hit 900k.. Either way I think I am keeping my pledge at the moment and will see how it plays out..
It does seem they hadn't planned past a million really, or worked out the add-ons... but I don't think they had in the first campaign, either (they do so based on community feedback).
Also, the sculptor (Stefan's) Mom seems to be in very poor health, which is complicating things (I'm assuming something developed after the campaign was launched regarding that, and from what he mentioned ab out it).
But, I'm hopeful they'll be including the floor add-on, and that and more free additions to the core is really all I'm concerned about... if they want to put in a dungeon add-on to entice in backers of the first campaign for that, it's not an issue for me.
I didn't pay terribly close attention to it during the lead up, but I imagine right now is just a holding pattern. Slow trickle of cash and backers, a bit of time to assess the interests of those contributing, now is just the setup for the main event in the final days.
Plus, yeah, life seems to be interfering (we're all lucky it doesn't more than it already does), but they've teased some fun stuff, and considering the general reputation of Dwarven Forge from their previous works (and particularly the first campaign), I still think the last few days will be a roller coaster ride.
And y'know what, even if they aren't, they've earned a lot of leeway with me based on delivering a quality product AND on time, which is practically unheard of in Kickstarterland.
Really for me, I pledged for this KS based on the success, quality of product and on time shipping, of the first one. I know DF will put out an awesome product and I'll get it close to when they say I will. Knowing how the first one went, I made my pledge for 2 sets, with the understanding that with all the free add ons I will be getting a lot more then just the 2 sets. I really wont pay much attention to how this KS is going till the last few days, at that point I'll start looking into it more closely to see how much extra stuff is included and at that point make the decision on whether I really need the sets or not. My first day pledge is really more just to hold one for me in case I decide I do want it
There's still a 38% difference between Dungeons and Caverns at their current funding level. I may potentially drop my pledge on the grounds that the absolute area sits around 150" in terms of footprint, but actual playing area is only around 85".
I understand than DF products are of a certain quality, however in terms of sheer volume, it's not working out at $110AUD a set shipping included compared to $85AUD a set shipping included for 150" of absolute area which is also gaming area on the Iron Rings Kickstarter.
I'll hold out until the end, but they really need to pick up their game.
ironicsilence wrote: I dont think I'd be in this KS at all if I was outside the US, that shipping cost stinks!
Well unfortunately there are no real existing 3d dungeon tile casters in Australia (at least that I know of) at the moment, only Hirst Art mold suppliers. Unfortunately I don't have the time nor space to do plaster casting (not that I wish to sound lazy). So the options open to us in the land down under to buy pre-casted pieces are pretty much: buy from overseas at exorbitant shipping costs and hope that the plaster survives transit (and that you don't end up with a box of powder going through customs) or go through one of these kickstarters and hope to make a saving on sheer volume or because it is a different material (mainly resin).
Unfortunately, over $500AUD for 5 sets isn't working out unless it pretty much closes the gap on value to the previous KS. Unfortunately that's a near impossibility as they have set themselves a ceiling on volume due to costs (whatever difference in margin there is between the dungeon and cavern KS). Even if this KS raised $3mil I'm pretty sure they'd still find a way to ship less pieces than their last one.
You're exactly right, Ehsteve, but they've said as much from the start- these pieces are going to be more expensive to tool, and thus you won't get as many as in the first campaign.
I think the value will only get better, of course, but if you're comparing it to the first campaign it is never going to be equivalent. The Iron Rings one you mention is cast by hand or the like, I believe... so pieces would cost the same. But at this volume, getting tooling done in China, it's not going to be equivalent for the more complex cavern pieces.
But yeah... shipping on something heavy like this is a killer! Heck, I even just received some MDF sheets of laser cut terrain from CNC Workshop in Australia, and even shipping on something that light was rough.
Awesome update: free piece, and underground lake pieces coming!
Dwarven Forge wrote:Update #8 Mar 25 2014
Free Stalagmite Coming at $1,050,000!
18 comments Like 26 likes
Dear All Backers,
I hope you all are having a good week. With Stefan working 110% to prepare the upcoming add-on offers, he wants to throw a little curve at everyone:
An additional free stretch goal at $1,050,000!
In addition to our $1.1 million dollar stretch goal (two free 45-degree pieces ), we are adding a free Narrow Stalagmite (one for every set backed, applicable to all 2+ set pledges) as soon as we hit $1.05 million.
And get ready for some great add-ons, coming soon!
A "watery" sneak preview is now showing on Kickstarter -- click here
I think the still image above shows a later version of the water pieces... but there was a floor piece shown right near the end that I don't think we've seen. Here are two screen captures of it:
So we can fill our own clear resin in on those lake pieces, right? Those look great. I've been waiting for them to restock the water pieces forever, but apparently theres some kind of issue and I guess they canned them.
After considering how much room I need to clear out for the tile sets and moving next year for school.. I think I am going to pull out of the ks.. Coming to ones sense kinda sucks lol..
Yeah, realizing other things need to take priority is never easy, but good of you to make that call now, rather than realize it after the money is already gone.
Looks like both a new 45 degree piece and a 10' to 5' converter piece way in the back there.
Edit: Found another pic:
Also:
Stefan wrote:those who want only the double sided bevel pieces passage: you will be able to pledge for only those pieces in it's own 10 pack....also a straight passage 10 pack and a corner , T pack.....
Eh, they tossed us the stalagmites at 1.050m as a little bonus to keep things along, we know we have 45 degree pieces at 1.1m, and I'd be surprised if 1.2m wasn't another 'free'/bonus piece as well.
The add ons work for some people who have the funding to blow a couple hundred extra on a type they want to round out. They're not for me, but I don't fault them for loading a few up.
Can't fault someone for wanting to withdraw before the end, that's a choice we all have to make, but I still think it's sort of pointless to worry much about this until the last 12 hours or so, when things are in full swing and we're hopefully unlocking a new goal every hour or two (or even less).
The middle point is a holding pattern. Even 'good' and successful campaigns would often kill to be doing a steady 10k a day or so in the middle.
If a week goes by, the final surge starts and by 1.5m we've only gotten another handful of add ons I could see a little frustration growing to more widespread concern, but honestly, I think right now is just something campaigns have to put up with.
Wow, that water set is attractively priced (to me). I can't add any during the campaign, but might get up to 3 of those during the pledge manager. I'm doing an icy cavern and so will just model them iced over, so can use for large rooms if needed... but they look sweet!
Edit: Looks like that's the only way people will be allowed to go anyway- pledge manager is for add on packs only, no base sets:
. . . IMPORTANT ! ! ! ! . . @Simon - It has been decided today that we will NOT allow backers to add extra funding for base Cavern sets during the Pledge Manager phase of the project. You will be able to add funding for extra Add-On Packs, however. We are doing this because of the tight deadlines with the factory. We need to make a firm order with them ASAP after the project ends in order to get the base Cavern sets shipped on time. The Add-On Packs will take less time to produce, so we can delay that part of the order for a few weeks. -- Jeff . . . .
Mar 29 2014 on Dwarven Forge's Caverns - Dwarvenite Game Tiles Mini Terrain.
That's a reasonable stance to take. Get the big, time consuming (at least comparatively) orders lined up, let people pick and choose add ons for a few weeks afterwards.
I mean, the piece count difference isn't huge between some of them currently, but the time it'll take to punch hundreds of thousands (millions?) of copies of some pieces will add up right off the start.
And considering how quickly (and on time, can't mention that enough) they delivered the last campaign, if that's what they need to do to meet their objective again, I'm not one to argue with the experts.
Free piece coming at 1.2M! This is starting to pick up as the final week starts, which is great (27K yesterday, and almost to that number already today!).
Also, you can make this with 5 cavern sets and 3 water sets, which a backer just linked to. Looks pretty sweet to me
Kicktraq has us over $37k today, the best day they've had since the first 4 days of the campaign, and it's not over yet.
Seems people love their river pieces.
Breaking 1.2m today to get that next piece unlocked would be nice, but even with a lackluster day we should see it tomorrow, so either way it should be here shortly.
Oh man, that is sweet! But will force me to choose . Likely 3 water and 1 floor pack, or possibly 2 of each. Will depend on cost, as the water pack is fantastically priced for an add-on.
And here I thought Lava/Arctic paint jobs were going to test me.
Water? Elevation?
Man, I was doing so well this month putting a dent into the old credit card. April 8th (and whenever their pledge manager ends) are not going to go well.
Well, you probably won't be able to ever get a better deal.
Expensive, yes, but cheaper than their older resin stuff.
I know where you're at though. I'm considering dropping a few sets to be able to afford more add ons. Decisions.
Word of advice from last time: Do not wait until the last day to manage your pledge.
Oh, I was there, I saw how Amazon payments screwed them over. I'm pretty happy with the tier I'm at, and if they're saying the pledge manager is pretty much for add ons only, I'm okay with that.
Assuming it's like last time around, and the manager opens a week or two after the campaign, and is open for another week or two, that extra paycheque might help justify an add on or two beyond what I'm getting.
But painted and international S&H? Damn those things add up. $35 for rivers is great. $70 for rivers, awesome as they are, isn't quite as easy to justify.
I just have to try to get my ratio right- trying to weigh if four add-ons that are basically floors (3 water and 1 normal floor add-on, when they offer it) will be too much real estate. I think not, as I want Really big rooms, and their normal ones seem claustrophobic to me.
I'll be planning to add those on to my 5-set pledge in the pledge manager... so I just have to be sure I have enough sets pledged for to match it, since we can't add those on. But since I don't think there's any way to really pledge for 6 sets (two sets of 3, I guess, but not as good of a deal?) I'll likely lock it down at 5 and then just hope I'm not adding too many floors for the amount of walls I'll have
Query: How much difference in price is there between getting the add ons in the KS/post-KS pledge manager, and picking up the add ons or their constituent parts later on through regular retail?
I think in the last campaign, there was a much smaller difference in add-on price between the campaign and retail (although shipping is still a killer at retail). I'm still shocked that the water set is only $35 for 30 pieces, though- that seems really good and I can't imagine they'll be able to hit that at retail, even if the pieces are smaller / easier to make due to being all floors.
Edit: Elevation pack details are revealed, it will be $50 for 18 pieces... which is why I think the water pack is such a smoking deal! Granted, these are a lot bigger pieces:
RiTides wrote: But since I don't think there's any way to really pledge for 6 sets (two sets of 3, I guess, but not as good of a deal?) I'll likely lock it down at 5 and then just hope I'm not adding too many floors for the amount of walls I'll have
They've said you can't increase your tier post KS (IE: can't pledge 5 now and add a 6th with the pledge manager), but at least early in the campaign they were saying you could get an odd number by doing that. I imagine a 5 + 1 would be a better price per set.
Hrm, to the campaign!
5 + 1 = $400.
2 x 3 = $420.
5+1 is the way to go. I figured that would be the case; the more sets you get in one shot, the cheaper they are per set, so the savings found in the 5 tier far outweighs the extra you're paying for the single.
Edit: very nice, but 18 pieces (awesome as they are) for $90 after painting and shipping is definitely out of my range. Water has my attention, but that's 30 pieces for like $70. I'm sure the 'elevation pieces' are hefty as hell, and it's probably way more expensive at retail, but I simply can't justify that.
I think if you did 5 + 1, you wouldn't get stretch goals for the "1", though... I'll just stick to 5 so it won't matter anyway
What do you think of the elevation pack? Too pricey for me, and also too square- I want a natural looking cavern. But if others go in for it it will only help the campaign progress, which is really starting to take off even just starting into the last week here.
RiTides wrote: I think if you did 5 + 1, you wouldn't get stretch goals for the "1", though... I'll just stick to 5 so it won't matter anyway
I don't think that's true. They say that any backer getting 2 or more sets gets stretch goals. I don't see why they wouldn't apply that for the 6th set for someone giving them $400. I guess it's worth asking, but worst case scenario, $20 for the extra set of goals isn't a terrible burden at that level.
What do you think of the elevation pack? Too pricey for me, and also too square- I want a natural looking cavern. But if others go in for it it will only help the campaign progress, which is really starting to take off even just starting into the last week here.
Yeah, as noted in my edit, it's nice, but I could see it really shining in larger numbers. Painted and shipped it's $90 for 18 tiles. No, not all tiles are made equal, but something like the water ($70 for 30 tiles) seems like it'd give me more options. If I want to build 'up' I suppose I can already do so in a fashion with some floor bricks, the right size book/box, and some sticky tack. Not ideal, but $350 is probably the limit I can justify at this time, and that's already $70 over what I was considering my limit to start with. $370-440 would likely be... unwise.
Elevation pack is functional, but priced at a point where I can't see myself getting more than 2 unpainted. The pics of the deep ravines with 3-4 layers of tiles stacked up looks cool, but is prohibitively expensive if you use the elevation pieces and stack them. I'd probably use insulation foam painted black as a filler, then cover the walls with normal cavern tiles. Create some sort of filler for the walls so you could stack them without them collapsing in on themselves.
The cavern elevation pack is probably great for adding a centerpiece elevation area to a large cavern room (especially with the semi-elevated floor pieces to create some varied elevation leading up to them), but I wouldn't want to run the risk of 3-4 layers of pieces toppling over if they're bumped because they're all stacked on top of one another.
~iPaint
Automatically Appended Next Post: From the KS comments, a bit of insight into the photo gallery setups:
Nate Taylor wrote:Hello fellow backers,
I'd love to chime in and shed some light on the Elevation pieces and the pictures of the large set-ups featured in the photo gallery.
I'm a DF backer, collector, and long-time gamer. I'm also a filmmaker and volunteered my services to help Stefan & Jeff make a cool finale video for this project. We just released the teaser for it today.
One of the best parts of the project was getting a solid week of hands-on time with these tiles. They are even cooler in person than I'd hoped.
After a week of experimenting with the prototypes, I spent this last weekend in Stefan's studio, with a the full collection of tiles where I built all the big set-ups you've seen pictured in the last few days.
Here are the pieces we had available:
- Approximately 10 sets of the Basic tiles (Walls A-C, Floors A-C, Corners A-C)
- 1 complete Lava Set
- 8 Floor D in the "standard" paint style (these weren't completed until Sunday so they're only in a few of the builds)
- Roughly 5 Narrow Passage Sets (but only 10 of the 45° passages, and 2 boulders)
- Roughly 5-6 Water Sets (the set composition wasn't finalized at that stage - we had a ton of Straight and Curve tiles, but only a few Full Water, Diagonal, and Little Corner tiles, and the cave opening pieces)
- 40 of the Elevation 2x2 pedestals
- 20 or so of both types of Elevation stairs
- 2 Elevation narrow bridges
- A dozen of each stalagmite (all three types)
- A handful of free-standing walls
- A variety of the incomplete Ledges & Crevices pieces
- 3 of each mushroom type (we also didn't get these until Sunday, hot off the presses)
- A handful of some other specialty pieces which haven't been seen yet (well I guess the Mine door is in the photo gallery, and you can see one of the pieces in the opening video)
General Build Facts:
- We didn't use up all the pieces for any of the builds (we tended to have walls and corners left)
- We did tend to run out of floors. Luckily Stefan is hard at work on a 4x4 floor which will certainly help in that area.
- We tended to use all the 2x2 Elevation Pedestals. I really love those pieces. It's amazing how quickly they can make a build get very interesting and 3D.
- When working with the water we tended to run out of the little corner pieces (we had very few in relation to the other tiles)
- We almost always used up the stalagmites
- I wished we'd had more 45° pieces, they really make for interesting builds.
Elevation Builds:
- For a almost all of the vertical work we used boxes or foam for a base structure and then built up and over it with the tiles. These were really nothing fancy - literally old cardboard boxes Stefan had lying around which we cut to a height to match the tiles.
- Next time I think I'd pre-cut several sheets of 2" foam/insulation into various size squares and rectangles so my interior backing pieces could be more modular. The boxes were very, well, boxy.
- We used a mixture of the 2x2 pedestals and the regular wall/corner pieces to make the tall sections. Wall A, Wall B, Corner C, and the Passage End Cap were the most useful for building high. We used Pillars from the Dungeon Dressing Pack/CoS to support the tiles above when stacking on most of the Wall sections.
- For the extended bridge over the chasm, we stuck two Narrow Bridges together with an as-of-yet-unrealeased Ledge piece and some blu-stik.
Summary:
Don't be intimidated by those massive builds. They aren't that difficult and were incredibly fun. Anyone could build those with enough tiles. I'm sure if anyone in this KS could spend a weekend in Stefan's studio they could come up with even cooler ones.
The organic shapes and textures you can configure with these tiles (compared to the dungeon ones) are just staggering. My cameraman had never laid eyes on and DF products and by the end of two days was addicted.
I hope this gives clarity to some or your questions and speculations. I'll try to answer more questions as they come, but I really should be working on the finale video.
In parting I have to say that with everything I have seen, I can confirm that Stefan & Jeff are working very hard to make everyone happy and provide you with the Caverns tiles of your dreams. There is a ton of behind-the-scenes effort that goes on to keep this Dwarven juggernaut trudging forward, and they are in the thick of it.
You might think I'm lucky to have had such an epic hands-on preview of the new tiles. But now that I've had a taste, I think it makes the wait until November even worse. I want my tiles NOW! It's going to be a long 7 months, but certainly worth it...
NTRabbit wrote: Query: How much difference in price is there between getting the add ons in the KS/post-KS pledge manager, and picking up the add ons or their constituent parts later on through regular retail?
Is Dwarven Forge available retail? AFAIK, It's not available US retail, except eBay.
Anyway, if you bought a three-pack of add-ons on the US site, it would cost about the same as on the KS, but that's before shipping.
Caverns is too pricey for me, especially since I'm interested in the add-ons. I think with their first KS, we got a *really* good price for the base set.
NTRabbit wrote: Query: How much difference in price is there between getting the add ons in the KS/post-KS pledge manager, and picking up the add ons or their constituent parts later on through regular retail?
Is Dwarven Forge available retail? AFAIK, It's not available US retail, except eBay.
Anyway, if you bought a three-pack of add-ons on the US site, it would cost about the same as on the KS, but that's before shipping.
Caverns is too pricey for me, especially since I'm interested in the add-ons. I think with their first KS, we got a *really* good price for the base set.
By retail I meany outside of the Kickstarter, since I'm presuming they actually continue to make these tiles after backer fulfillment.
The shipping is going to be horrific in any event, because the US apparently can't even manage a postage system effectively.
I ask because my budget is finite, there are some add ons I like the look of, but the consensus seems to be "get as many base sets as you can afford" so you make the most of free stretch additions. Still not sure whether or not I can afford it at all, with the postage prices so off the wall insane.
Honestly, we're having better days earlier than I anticipated. Glad to see it. I'd settled in to expect another week of drudgery, but there's definitely been an uptick in the last few days. Here's to hoping it continues!
NTRabbit wrote: Query: How much difference in price is there between getting the add ons in the KS/post-KS pledge manager, and picking up the add ons or their constituent parts later on through regular retail?
Well, a couple of things: the KS had a discount for multiple add ons and free shipping in US. At retail, they have the "buy 3" deal which is close to the KS price. But they also split one of the add ons into two packs.
It's tricky. The best deals in terms of bang for your buck are the main sets bc the postKS packs don't have stretch goals. But the add ons make the regular sets come to life. You have to find a balance.
Yeah, as much as I adore the add ons this time around, I'm thinking the river one is the only one I should even think about getting. That's a lot of floor space to play with, and can be used to change things up with both the caverns set and my dungeon sets without much imagination.
But man, if we were all independently wealthy... all the add ons. All of them.
What do you think of the elevation pack? Too pricey for me, and also too square- I want a natural looking cavern. But if others go in for it it will only help the campaign progress, which is really starting to take off even just starting into the last week here.
Yeah, as noted in my edit, it's nice, but I could see it really shining in larger numbers. Painted and shipped it's $90 for 18 tiles. No, not all tiles are made equal, but something like the water ($70 for 30 tiles) seems like it'd give me more options. If I want to build 'up' I suppose I can already do so in a fashion with some floor bricks, the right size book/box, and some sticky tack. Not ideal, but $350 is probably the limit I can justify at this time, and that's already $70 over what I was considering my limit to start with. $370-440 would likely be... unwise.
You can also get decent elevation effects by using walls in the middle of the room and laying floor tiles over them. Its how I've used my existing cavern sets. Though they need bigger tiles than just 2"x2". They said something about a floor pack, so a 4x4, 6x4 and 6x6 would help a lot.
Narrow Dungeon add-on got even better, actually. Now includes two transition pieces for going "2 square wide corridor" to "one square wide". Same price.
Damn, nice to see the add on get an upgrade. One off would be understandable, but if the add ons saw upgrades as well as we skyrocket in the next 3 days, that'd be fine too.
Bit the bullet for one add on. Unless some friends hook me up with birthday cash (unlikely, as most of them are poor), I think that's all I can manage. Maybe, MAYBE a second add on if the right one comes along, but I really need to show some restraint here.
The regular river add on seems far more useful for my purposes, but I've gotta say, that lava river alt paint scheme is pretty sexy.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Gotta say, I'm really liking the freebie chasm pieces they're including. My game table is innately black, so I won't even need to find cloth or paper to put under it to have some 'you really don't want to fall or get pushed down here' spaces.
At a glance, the KS sets were 74 pieces each, but they also had a bunch of non 2 x 2 tiles in there (the little barrels, doors, etc). While this one has a few stalagmites and the webs, it doesn't seem to have quite as many 'dressing bits' as it were. This one is up to (at a rough count) 51 pieces per set, and hopefully the next day and change sees that fire up a bit, but I've gotta say I'm pretty happy with our progress. The sets are indeed a bit more expensive, and sure we might not end up at the same piece count, but accounting for the more complicated pieces and some of the really impressive and imaginative/evocative options we're getting, I'm feeling pretty good about where we are, and consider the remainder gravy.
Obviously it's not a perfect apples to apples comparison, but I know people were a bit concerned at the start, and think we're doing pretty well as we approach the finale.
Edit: Also, turns out there's an answer to a question I've seen crop up; according to their FAQ at the bottom of the campaign, they plan to use Fundafull again (which was a smooth experience) and intend to launch the Pledge Manager 2 weeks after the campaign ends. The last one was open for 10 days or so, based on a glance at the first campaign's updates, so assuming they go with 1-2 weeks again, we'll probably have a month at most to choose and find funding for any extra add ons once the campaign ends, for those who are on the edge currently and decide to pull the trigger post campaign.
Edit 2: Also in the FAQ:
Do Canadian backers need to add the International shipping charge?
Yes. But for Canadian recipients, we will cover all import duties and paperwork.
According to the comments (I haven't been watching terribly closely), they cut out 6 floor tile A's to include 2 more C's and a 4th 4x4, keeping the exact same 'footprint' on the table but with more big tiles and fewer of the tiles we already have a pile of.
Excellent! Upped my pledge and will likely put in some during the pledge manager... absolutely love the final offerings. Between larger floor pieces, chasms, and water, open spaces can be really varied. Sweet
Muhuhahahaha. I haven't been keeping up with the thread, but I've definitely been watching the KS since I made my early pledge. But I am definitely going to have to get off my butt and paint up the dungeon sets I've already got from the last go 'round.
So...much...to...paint.
I just hope I can make it match the older Master Maze sets I've got (I've been a fanatic for DF for many, many years) with the paints.
1.83M with 12 hours to go! The last chasm piece is up next as a freebie, so all 4 chasm pieces are going to be in the set for free.
The total was 70K lower when I went to bed, so it has a legitimate shot at 2M. It should definitely pass the first campaign's 1.9M total, which is sweet
~$15k from the next stretch goal, ~$48k from matching the last campaign, and roughly $140k from 2m.
Over 10 hours remaining?
Keeping the faith strong.
Also keeping my expectations reasonable, but I am kind of hoping we see something awesome unlock around 1.908m (their last KS finale) and 2m (it's a big milestone to cross).
I actually preferred the Floor E goal that was briefly posted by mistake instead but most people seem to like this. I figure it should be easy to trade mine when the time comes, since I want an all-natural / no man-made objects cavern.
Under 5 hours left, and we're only 40k or so from 2m (the next stretch goal, and also a solid milestone)!
Supposedly there'll be one more add on unveiled tonight.
No idea where we'll finally end up, but depending on how many more backers/people find deeper pockets available, 2.1-2.2 doesn't seem impossible. 50k per hour would be a hell of a pace, but I suspect the last hour will be bat-gak insane, so I'm not counting it out.
On the one hand, if we're talking mines, you'd really want a bunch of shored up mine tunnels to go with it, which we don't have.
On the other hand, it's a good transition piece for those with both dungeons and caverns, who don't have the older MM cavern to dungeon conversion pieces.
Automatically Appended Next Post: 1,994,773, with four hours yet to go...geez, that's close to the 2M mark.
And it's already over 2M! Still 3 hours to go yet. They posted a 2.1M goal of a special add-on that will be sculpted this coming week. No price yet, it will be based on backer input and probably depends on what is sculpted.
There are still spaces on the stretch goal chart after 2.1M, would've loved one more free piece (Floor E). It's already 10K past the 2M mark though, so it's certainly possible.
Fugazi wrote: $2.1m. Can't wait to see what the mystery add-on becomes.
@shade: fair point about the mine entrance, but like you said, good transition piece.
Actually, I thought of a suggestion for Stephan about the mine stuff, that would take minimal effort...sadly I didn't think about it earlier in time to maybe prod another stretch goal idea.
Still worth mentioning to him, though.
Yup, very impressive. Wish I could've splurged all out, but I'm already in for about 50% more than KS1, and am feeling pretty good with what I'll have coming.
In case you hadn't seen, they have said that the PM should be in the next 2 weeks or sooner. I don't believe they've said how long it would be open for, but last time it was 10 days, so you might have 3 weeks+.
It appears that with the Backer Input based add on, it might go for a little longer, as that one does say it would be available in the pledge manager for "the next month", but that could be including the 2 weeks of set up time as well.
Long story short, you should have at least 3 weeks until the Pledge Manager closes (I can't see it being open for less than a week or two), maybe as much as a month, but I wouldn't count on much longer.
I got mine, too, and a WIP is up of the wicked add-on pack. Now that I see it I realize it's not what I'm looking for after all. So, I'll stick to the "higher value" add-ons (which to me are water and floor packs, with one chasm just because I love the utility it adds).
Got mine; you can change your base level insofar as it looks at the total you pledged in the campaign, and lets you select any base pledge of sets that fits underneath that, ie I backed for 3 painted sets, but because my backing amount also included postage, I could if I wanted to change up to 5 unpainted sets, but no further.
You also can't be clever and add multiples of the set reward levels that exceed the initial pledge amount you made, because it spits a rejection back at you. Add ons are the only things you can add more funds to cover.
Now, do I stick with 3 painted sets, or go for 5 unpainted, buy the paints, and then hope I'm not too lazy to paint and can match the colours on the prepainted lava and water extras I want. Pledge manager time is always difficult!
Yeah, due to S&H and an add on, my 2 Painted sets can go as high as 3 Painted or 5 Unpainted.
Another round of temptation to fight off, it appears. Assuming the manager remains open for extra funding for at least a week or two (I think their last one was 10 days, so I'm not expecting it to be open for long), I'll have time to ponder that out. Another paycheque and possibly a tax return could make justifying stretching a little further more feasible than I originally anticipated.
Don't try to say that in the comments, Bossk, I've given up . The wicked addition makes no sense for me as someone who wants a grand cavern, but for RPGers I guess all these bits are like Christmas. Really glad they put up pics because those burrowing pieces are tiny and I don't need them at all!
I don't think an update has gone out regarding the pledge manager links being sent, has it? I'd like to know how long I have to add funds
I just messaged them and got a reply back saying that the pledge manager will be open until May 3rd at 11pm EDT. That's a week from tomorrow, so plan accordingly!
This would be a whole lot easier if there were pictures of "this is 3 sets with stretch goals", and "this is 5 sets with stretch goals", just assembled randomly, so that I could see what kind of area each lot covered.
If I had had more funds available when the campaign closed, it would have been tempting to get an extra caverns set instead of 2 of the add-ons, but I was scraping the bottom of the barrel when it closed as it was (and you can't add on caverns sets in the pledge manager beyond what you already put in enough funds for). Mine is now locked in, so here's hoping it will be worth it
Forar wrote: Yeah, just locked mine in too. Wish I could've added to my paltry 2 sets/1 add on, but hopefully I'll be in a better position to do so next year.
I nearly doubled my pledge amount from KS1...the caverns are just too cool, and the Dungeon Passages could have merited a campaign for themselves. Will probably sell off a few caverns sets to help recoup some expenses...though the idea of having a set or two extra for different paint schemes may be worth holding on to a few.
I've been stripping all of my dungeon tiles and repainting them in a much more natural paint scheme, and I'm really happy with the changes.
Before, the grey was too blue, and the stone contrast was too high. It did not look natural. Also, I was very heavy handed with the basecoat on a few batches of tiles, so a lot of the depth between stones was lost.
Here's the latest paint scheme. Used a more brown grey for the basecoat, then highlighted with a few light tan and gray colors. Washed the stones using several different Secret Weapon Miniatures washes, then re-drybrushed the highlights with the tans and grays. Will probably wash more bricks per tile once I get into the full production line painting.
Now to repaint everything before caverns show up...
Yeah, I went with 2 painted sets and the river set like I've been pondering for ages now. Long story short, I've got a couple of hefty (read: 4 figure) expenses lined up in the next month or two, and despite a rather convenient windfall last week, I had to clench my teeth and go with the base sum.
But next year, and I do sincerely hope there is a campaign #3, it should start just after my work bonus comes through. And that one will hopefully be an epic contribution. Doubly so if they keep up on delivering amazing product in a timely fashion. The first campaign made me a fan and a follower. Pull off another home run like that and they'll have my life long loyalty (as long as they don't, like, ship me a box of poop, I mean, I'd be a enthusiastic, not a blind zealot).
did any of you successfully change your backer level? I'm trying to submit with 5 unpainted instead of the 3 painted I backed, but the submit button refuses to appear unless I switch back to 3, and the add funds button gaks itself and keeps trying to get me to add $165
If you backed for $X and included $Y for add ons, I believe the idea was that you'd be able to enhanced your level at least as high as the combined amount for X+Y. Like, I only paid in for 2 painted sets and 1 add on, but the drop downs gave me options up to 5 unpainted sets (which would've fallen within that amount, since I had S&H added as well).
Maybe they fixed it or tweaked something, but I seriously pondered for a while going to 3 painted sets before I found out I'd need to be getting a new apartment (or start paying for the one I have solo) in the coming months.
From Stephan's Facebook: "Even though we plan to do our own Castle, wall and tower Pieces in our upcoming 3rd kickstarter, I am supporting these guys at Miniature Building Authority...they are nice decent guys and we have been trading and collecting each others products over many years...good luck to them! These will be a great add on to my existing Castle!"
From DF forums: "My modular Castles and Towers will be my own designs, drawn out years ago...they will not be similar to anything else out there.....as you might know I am a perfectionist...so when they are released they will be as perfect as I can with all my powers imagine... They will take into account gaming and ease of use, they are for my own gaming after all...and they will take into account a lifetime of traveling around the world marveling at ancient wonders...they will be full of wondrous details and devious trappings...above all they will be beautiful, because I feel beauty is important in the world, not just function..."
Moved to Dakka Discussions, although please feel free to make a new thread for KS3 at the appropriate time
I got an email on Friday saying my order had shipped, but the tracking numbers still don't work - I think maybe they just uploaded shipping information but didn't actually hand off the package to FedEx yet.
I just received my tracking number this afternoon. This company has a great track record of delivering quality product, on time. I have backed both of their kickstarters now, and couldn't be happier.
Yeah, Stefan seems pretty hyped to make it their biggest and best yet. I'm sure the personnel issues have taken a toll, but I've been impressed with their ongoing enthusiasm and professionalism. Can't wait to get my 2 painted Caverns sets in, and am already planning to back for a couple of sets in the next one as well.
Mine probably won't arrive for 2-3 weeks, but I really can't wait to have them in hand.
Went with 3 sets unpainted (plus a paint/brush set) with the first campaign, went with 2 sets painted, plus a River add on and an Ice Caverns add on, looking forward to seeing what they did with those. I mean, happy as I am with the amateur job I did on the first ones, the caverns felt like something that'd be better done with more professional skills.
Also, going for fewer, higher quality sets struck me as a good idea, since having enough room/carting them around can be a consideration, and if they're going to make this a yearly thing, the collection is going to grow pretty significantly even at 2-3 sets per campaign.
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