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Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 18:12:20


Post by: Brother SRM


Howdy! I don't know about you guys, but I've always loved giant robots. I played Battletech and the Mechwarrior games quite a bit as a kid, but haven't really seen much of them in a long time. However, a 25th anniversary starter set is dropping at the end of March:
http://battletech.catalystgamelabs.com/2011/02/26/25th-introductory-box-set-street-date-also-available-for-pre-order/
The following product has a Street Date of MARCH 30TH, 2011:


BattleTech 25th Anniversary Introductory Box Set ($49.95)

Strap yourself into the ultimate suit of armor: the BattleMech. Thirty feet tall and weighing up to a hundred tons, this humanoid engine of destruction is a walking arsenal with enough firepower to level a city block. The BattleTech game system takes you into the world of the 31st Century, where war has become a way of life. You are a MechWarrior. You are in command of the most powerful machine on the battlefield, and hold the fate of empires in your hand!

The BattleTech 25th Anniversary Introductory Box Set thrusts you onto the battlefields of the 31st century. This box contains everything needed to play:

24 unpainted, ready-to-play plastic BattleMech minis
2 unpainted, premium-quality plastic BattleMech minis
One 12-page full-color quick-start rulebook will have players into the action in minutes
36-page book of pre-generated BattleMech Record Sheets
One 80-page full-color rulebook
Inner Sphere at a Glance, a 56-page full-color book of universe
background and BattleMech technical data

One 16-page full-color Painting and Tactics Guide
Two heavy-duty cards of compiled tables
Two 18″ x 24″ game-board quality maps
It’s been a long wait for this much anticipated return of the best-selling Introductory Box Set to the perennial BattleTech game line. With product in transit to the warehouse, the wait for the best version yet of the box set is almost over!


After asking on the official forums, the set is confirmed to have the following mechs:
COM-2D Commando
SDR-5V Spider
JR7-D Jenner
PNT-9R Panther
ASN-21 Assassin
CDA-2A Cicada
CLNT-2-3T Clint
HER-2S Hermes II
WTH-1 Whitworth
VND-1R Vindicator
ENF-4R Enforcer
HBK-4G Hunchback
TBT-5N Trebuchet
DV-6M Dervish
DRG-1N Dragon
QKD-4G Quickdraw
CPLT-C1 Catapult
JM6-S JagerMech
GHR-5H Grasshopper
AWS-8Q Awesome
ZEU-6S Zeus
CP-10-Z Cyclops
BNC-3E Banshee
AS7-D Atlas
Thor
Loki


The Thor and Loki are the premium mechs if I recall, and will have swappable arms. Unfortunately, there's no Madcat/Timberwolf in here, as it's always been one of my favorites. Most of the plastics from this set are from the previous Battletech starter, so they won't be of Assault on Black Reach quality, they'll be servicable. Either way, it's two companies worth of battlemechs for $50 plus all kinds of other cool stuff, so I can't complain!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 18:16:10


Post by: Death By Monkeys


That is the hawtness. Just wish my old Battletech group was still around to play with. Wish there were better pics of the models.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 18:51:05


Post by: Brother SRM


Well, for just 50 bucks you can probably get some friends into it. Just pool your money to get it, or buy it yourself and let your buddies play with your models.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 18:54:08


Post by: Morathi's Darkest Sin


Now that is a tempting buy.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 19:02:25


Post by: AuroraFan


That might have just turned into a must purchase because of the free PDFs about the Rules and Background. I've been interested in checking out BattleTech, and that definitely stoked my interest further. Other companies would be wise to use a similar strategy.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 19:07:32


Post by: NecronLord3


What an incredible let down. This is just a rehash of the last box set with very little in the way of new and interesting product. Catalyst is really doing very little to gain market share in the mini wargaming community. A intro box set that basically only caters to the existing player base is kind pointless, IMO. How about more of those new premium mechs, not just a repackaging of the 2 that are already available. Catalyst has had 2 years to make a decent 8-10 pack set of the new Premium Plastic mechs and they have done nothing with it. To top it of IWM is archiving more models and making very little in the way of new mech. Battletech is really showing its age, and don't expect to ever see a 30 year anniversary for the game.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 19:30:39


Post by: Necros


Looks cool but I woulda liked to see worthwhile pics of the minis, painted of course.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 19:33:07


Post by: BrookM


Awww, no Madcat.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 19:35:14


Post by: UltraPrime


Not played in years. Might pick this up and get the kids interested.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 19:39:33


Post by: TCWarRoom


Awesome!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 20:14:50


Post by: warboss


eh... the same overly complex rules and simplistic looking minis that kept me from playing the game 20 years ago when i got excited because of the comutergames rereleased to the same effect now. battletech needs to spin off a completely different game with non-compatible rules and minis that have no visual relationship to the current ones for me to sink money into the system.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 20:38:14


Post by: Brother SRM


warboss wrote:eh... the same overly complex rules and simplistic looking minis that kept me from playing the game 20 years ago when i got excited because of the comutergames rereleased to the same effect now. battletech needs to spin off a completely different game with non-compatible rules and minis that have no visual relationship to the current ones for me to sink money into the system.

They did with the clix game they had. They were even in a different scale.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 20:40:48


Post by: John


I still have the original boxed set, with the old Warhammer (taken from Robotech) on it.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 21:00:57


Post by: gannam


Battle Tech is such an awesome game. You can learn to play it in 30 minutes, and the rules are never in dispute. GW could learn a thing or 2 from this game.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 21:08:00


Post by: warboss


Brother SRM wrote:
warboss wrote:eh... the same overly complex rules and simplistic looking minis that kept me from playing the game 20 years ago when i got excited because of the comutergames rereleased to the same effect now. battletech needs to spin off a completely different game with non-compatible rules and minis that have no visual relationship to the current ones for me to sink money into the system.

They did with the clix game they had. They were even in a different scale.


true.. i didn't think of that as i consider the prepainted plastics as totally separate. maybe they should make some metal more detailed versions of those and incorporate them into battletech?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 21:10:20


Post by: Lovepug13


Anyone know where I might pick this up in the UK.....used to love Battletech!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 21:14:57


Post by: Brother SRM


Lovepug13 wrote:Anyone know where I might pick this up in the UK.....used to love Battletech!

I'm sure they ship to the UK; can't think of any reason they wouldn't!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 21:21:45


Post by: Lovepug13


Was hoping to pick it up local lol .....I am going to Florida soon so may pick it up then :-)


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 21:50:57


Post by: lasgunpacker


I am fairly excited about this as well (mentioned previously here), and anticipate getting a set at some point.

However, since this is actually the 27th anniversary, why not just wait for a 30th edition, and keep printing the previous box until then?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 21:52:33


Post by: misterfiveseven


warboss wrote:eh... the same overly complex rules and simplistic looking minis that kept me from playing the game 20 years ago when i got excited because of the comutergames rereleased to the same effect now. battletech needs to spin off a completely different game with non-compatible rules and minis that have no visual relationship to the current ones for me to sink money into the system.


Battletech has some of the best fluff I've run across; if you like beer and pretzel sci-fi, this is where to look. The mechs look boxy and simplistic because... wait for it... THEY ACTUALLY LOOK LIKE WAR MACHINES. I love 40k, but sometimes a dose of asthetic realism is refreshing.

Also, these "overly complex rules" don't need errata/FAQ/fist-fights like GW rules do, and the fact that they've made it 25 years must mean something good. I started wargaming with Battletech when I was 8, so it clearly can't be too tough


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 21:54:48


Post by: lasgunpacker


NecronLord3 wrote:What an incredible let down. This is just a rehash of the last box set with very little in the way of new and interesting product. Catalyst is really doing very little to gain market share in the mini wargaming community. A intro box set that basically only caters to the existing player base is kind pointless, IMO. How about more of those new premium mechs, not just a repackaging of the 2 that are already available. Catalyst has had 2 years to make a decent 8-10 pack set of the new Premium Plastic mechs and they have done nothing with it. To top it of IWM is archiving more models and making very little in the way of new mech. Battletech is really showing its age, and don't expect to ever see a 30 year anniversary for the game.


A few points: The previous boxed set is out of print. This boxed set does cater to a new player, because existing players will not want most of the contents. Monopose plastic 'mechs may not appeal to you, but recall that most of the hobby is not particularly enamoured by multi-pose figures. Sure, here in GW land, people expect that, but there are also people who complain about "all those parts". This box allows you to open it up and get to playing. (personnally I love to build models, but YMMV)

Also, only three more years until the 30th anniversary (this box is late), so reaching 30 seems pretty reasonable.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 21:57:42


Post by: paulson games


I am disappointed with the crappy new warhammer on the cover and that there is no warhammer or marauder in the mech list as those are the two greatest battletech mechs ever. My local store has had a display box for the 25th an up on it's shelf for months and it has the classic warhammer on the cover. I was jazzed hoping to get a copy but being that they are shackled with the "unseen" art I think I'll pass and see if I can just dig out my old box. The new warhammer makes me an incredibly sad panda.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 22:11:26


Post by: Grot 6


Pfft, whatever.

Last time I really got into this one we had a box of cardboard cutouts and they were a full boot of kickass.

Now If I remember correctly, I thought THIS was a 30 Year release, based on that Roboteck/ Mechwarrior fiasco back in the early days of FASA.

As to the "Crappy" warhammer picture? Thats the same picture that was on the old box. You really want it theres a boatload of this stuff over on feebay if you are so inclined.

It is funny though, that even after all of that drama, the trainwreck that happened with Wizkidz, and the whole changing of the guard thing that THIS is what comes back to full circle.

!!@#$ you, clicks games, you should have stuck with a good thing when you started.

Was a rabid fan in the beginning, and loved every minute of that. easiest game to learn in an hour and years of fun after the fact, off and on.

My only question is that what happens after the nastalja wears off, are there any serious plans to continue to support the game, or is this just a grognard one off?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 22:17:16


Post by: Magister187


paulson games wrote:I am disappointed with the crappy new warhammer on the cover and that there is no warhammer or marauder in the mech list as those are the two greatest battletech mechs ever. My local store has had a display box for the 25th an up on it's shelf for months and it has the classic warhammer on the cover. I was jazzed hoping to get a copy but being that they are shackled with the "unseen" art I think I'll pass and see if I can just dig out my old box. The new warhammer makes me an incredibly sad panda.


Not really their fault: they used a design they had no long term rights to; the new owners of those rights got upset and told them to stop making/marketing their deign; they did so.
It does suck, as many of those designs are great, but its like being upset that gas isn't .50 a gallon anymore. Valid complaint, but not realistic.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 22:28:48


Post by: Mattlov


NecronLord3 wrote:What an incredible let down. This is just a rehash of the last box set with very little in the way of new and interesting product. Catalyst is really doing very little to gain market share in the mini wargaming community. A intro box set that basically only caters to the existing player base is kind pointless, IMO. How about more of those new premium mechs, not just a repackaging of the 2 that are already available. Catalyst has had 2 years to make a decent 8-10 pack set of the new Premium Plastic mechs and they have done nothing with it. To top it of IWM is archiving more models and making very little in the way of new mech. Battletech is really showing its age, and don't expect to ever see a 30 year anniversary for the game.


Wow, that is ridiculous.

It is an INTRO BOX, it isn't designed for veteran players. As for new content, they got away from the crappy paper maps with this box set and the maps are board game quality cardboard. BIG upgrade. And more universe fluff than before.

Those premium 'Mechs are in limbo right now. They aren't made by IWM, so there is the potential of destroying a business if they start producing them, along with other issues I'm not at liberty to discuss.

IWM puts out DOZENS of new sculpts every year. Archiving is a necessity because they don't have a lot of space. They have thousands of molds for Battletech and other product lines that take up space. I doubt you've been to IWM (I have), it isn't a big building. The "Archiving Fee" helps recoup the cost of additional OFF SITE storage space that holds a metric buttload of molds.

Battletech will reach a 30 Year anniversary without difficulty. The game is bigger than it has ever been. If it wasn't there, wouldn't be fan funded sculpts contributed by hundreds of loyal players. The BT fanbase is willing to pay money out of pocket to get new sculpts outside of the scheduled sculpts for Battletech released. It had to be temporarily halted due to back log. I can't see GW ever deciding to do that. The BT fans are strong, and the BT universe is rock solid. The game is more sound and well made than anything GW has every put out. If it can last while GW is in their heyday, I don't see a problem with them continuing for quite some time.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
paulson games wrote:I am disappointed with the crappy new warhammer on the cover and that there is no warhammer or marauder in the mech list as those are the two greatest battletech mechs ever. My local store has had a display box for the 25th an up on it's shelf for months and it has the classic warhammer on the cover. I was jazzed hoping to get a copy but being that they are shackled with the "unseen" art I think I'll pass and see if I can just dig out my old box. The new warhammer makes me an incredibly sad panda.


That isn't a Warhammer if that makes you feel any better. By universe it is a Hammerhands, a precursor to the Warhammer.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 22:40:38


Post by: megatrons2nd


I was hoping for a bit of new in the release as well. As a intro it is great. As a 20th anniversary must have(for me anyway) a pass. Battletech is pretty dead in Necronlord3 and My area. I can't seem to get any interest.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 22:43:08


Post by: Mattlov


megatrons2nd wrote:I was hoping for a bit of new in the release as well. As a intro it is great. As a 20th anniversary must have(for me anyway) a pass. Battletech is pretty dead in Necronlord3 and My area. I can't seem to get any interest.


Have you checked the Demo Agent site just to be sure it's dead?

http://www.catalystdemos.com

Might have to sign up, but you can then search for players and Agents (like me) nearby.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 22:59:38


Post by: Marauder


Love Classic BattleTech have played from the very beginning.

Then the clan crap and click crap came out and the game went downhill.

Found a bunch of like minded people and we are now playing a 3025 campaign and are having a blast. Fast simple rules and quick games.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 23:14:06


Post by: yournamehere


Hmmmm....

I know some people that play this, and the price is pretty good, might have to pick it up.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 23:15:13


Post by: Grot 6


I'm in total agreement.

As for the net's, RPGnet has a batch of great looking stuff for the game for free. I'm going to check out that Catylist stuff in a few minutes.

All it takes is a couple of guys and your set.

The game isn't dead, but in hiatus. There are LOADS of players out there and most agree that Clicks, and the Clans didn't do the game any service. It was that little "Pulling out this and that high speed new mech that is the be all end all" thing that ran alot of die hard players off.

Compound that with the fact that you could run a gakload of power armored infantry one man mechs in and pretty much own a big guy with half of the trouble. It ended up slaging the game, the fluff, and the whole desire to keep up with the joneses.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 23:19:13


Post by: warboss


misterfiveseven wrote:Battletech has some of the best fluff I've run across; if you like beer and pretzel sci-fi, this is where to look. The mechs look boxy and simplistic because... wait for it... THEY ACTUALLY LOOK LIKE WAR MACHINES. I love 40k, but sometimes a dose of asthetic realism is refreshing.

Also, these "overly complex rules" don't need errata/FAQ/fist-fights like GW rules do, and the fact that they've made it 25 years must mean something good. I started wargaming with Battletech when I was 8, so it clearly can't be too tough


i can't comment on the fluff because the rules and minis turned me off enought that i didn't get into battletech. some people like the rules but others find them cumbersome and clunky; if they want to *GROW*, that requires new players and most rulesets in the past 20 years have moved to a faster abstracted (and IMHO elegant) style. while i completely understand that there is plenty of nostalgia regarding battletech after all these years/minis/books/videogames/novels/movie, nostalgia doesn't attract new players. also, are you really... "wait for it"... TELLING ME THESE LOOK LIKE A REAL WAR MACHINES?



considering that there is *NO* reference to determine what a real 40ft and up tall bipedal warmachine actually looks like (and frankly the trojan horse is the only quasi-historical reference i can recall at the moment and we have no images of it)... i don't consider any toy soldier variant to be a *real* war machine. what i was commenting on is the simplistic design (classic btech minis and their concept drawings look like they were designed by a 1st year engineering student doodling during his intro to technical drawing class) which hasn't changed in 20+ years despite the rest of the industry/scifi changing. brotherSRM brought up an interesting point that i hadn't considered in that there are plenty of designs in the clix version of the game that do have the newer styling/feel that they could use but it doesn't seem like they are. i just don't know if catalyst/battletech team is falling into the palladium trap (where they don't want to risk alienating their small but loyal player base by changing up things in order to *possibly* gain new ones) but this starter set seems to me to be aimed more at double-dipping old veteran players more than a complete style reboot that one aimed at new players would be.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/02/28 23:24:45


Post by: NecronLord3


Mattlov wrote:
megatrons2nd wrote:I was hoping for a bit of new in the release as well. As a intro it is great. As a 20th anniversary must have(for me anyway) a pass. Battletech is pretty dead in Necronlord3 and My area. I can't seem to get any interest.


Have you checked the Demo Agent site just to be sure it's dead?

http://www.catalystdemos.com

Might have to sign up, but you can then search for players and Agents (like me) nearby.



Yeah woo-hoo maximum search of 150 miles and we get a whopping 2 events.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 00:14:44


Post by: Mad4Minis


Necros wrote:Looks cool but I woulda liked to see worthwhile pics of the minis, painted of course.


All but 2 of the minis are pretty low quality. They are better than the cardboard, but no where near the metals or the 2 "premium" minis that come in the box.

This is basically a rehash of the Introductory box set. It has the 2 premium mechs, and the books have some extra content and artwork.

It is also worth noting that this is replacing the current intro box set.

For all its faults Ill always have a soft spot for battletech. It not for it I wouldnt have ever gotten into gaming. I know Ill be picking up a copy of this.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 00:25:20


Post by: Marauder


The rules for battletech are simple for most people to learn and play. Streamlining rules AKA dumbing them down for the masses has never appealed to me. While honestly the mechs are not the best looking and the weapon ranges are laughable I still enjoy the game better than warhammer.

But as with anything 25 years plus old it could use some updating and new mini's as long as they keep the same feel of the classic game.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 00:41:51


Post by: narceron


paulson games wrote:I am disappointed with the crappy new warhammer on the cover and that there is no warhammer or marauder in the mech list as those are the two greatest battletech mechs ever.



I thought the original locust was pretty sweet.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 03:20:56


Post by: DarkTraveler777


I have two of these box sets on pre-order so it is nice to see a finalized date for release.

The vitriol in this thread makes me chuckle. While I am not a big fan of Catalyst and their business practices or how they have handled their stewardship of the license, some of their contributions to the Battletech line have been very positive. The 25th Anniversary Art book is a prime example of the kind of high quality product they are capable of producing and from everything I have read about this boxed set it will be a wonderful tool for capturing the attention of new players due to the premium quality materials inside (the 24 plastic minis excepted).






Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 03:27:20


Post by: Melissia


Woah, that's a large set. A pity I won't be able to afford it :(


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 03:28:55


Post by: yeenoghu


I'm stoked, even though that mech list looks identicle to the last box set I had. Plastic is nicer than cardboard standups though.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 03:31:46


Post by: DarkTraveler777


yeenoghu wrote:I'm stoked, even though that mech list looks identicle to the last box set I had. Plastic is nicer than cardboard standups though.


Just a playful jab, yeenoghu, but if you think the Hammerhands looks identical to a Warhammer then your avatar is extremely appropriate.


Similar sure, but identical?





Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 03:39:33


Post by: kenshin620


Good to see BT somehow still getting releases. Its like a curse or something on whoever picks up BT. /tg/ I know are frothing at their mouths to get this set. Maybe I should look into it


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 04:06:04


Post by: kronk


I'm holding off until I see pictures of the mechs. But I am excited about the news.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 04:13:01


Post by: H.B.M.C.


The 'Mechs are very simple cheap plastics (other than the two Clan ones, which are multi-part plastics of a much higher quality). They can look pretty decent when painted, but we're not talking 40K starter-set level detail.

Catalyst are not a miniature company. If anything, they're the opposite of GW - caring more about the rules and the universe than the models and how they can write rules to sell them.

It's a refreshing difference.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 04:14:18


Post by: NecronLord3


kronk wrote:I'm holding off until I see pictures of the mechs. But I am excited about the news.

This is a pretty good review of the original box set and the new one is nearly identical: http://www.tabletopgamingnews.com/2008/01/02/11742


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 04:17:32


Post by: yeenoghu


DarkTraveler777 wrote:
yeenoghu wrote:I'm stoked, even though that mech list looks identicle to the last box set I had. Plastic is nicer than cardboard standups though.


Just a playful jab, yeenoghu, but if you think the Hammerhands looks identical to a Warhammer then your avatar is extremely appropriate.


Similar sure, but identical?





Haven't seen the figs, I was talking about the list of which designs are featured as the standard mechs.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 04:20:16


Post by: cygnnus


Brother SRM wrote:
After asking on the official forums, the set is confirmed to have the following mechs:
COM-2D Commando
SDR-5V Spider
JR7-D Jenner
PNT-9R Panther
ASN-21 Assassin
CDA-2A Cicada
CLNT-2-3T Clint
HER-2S Hermes II
WTH-1 Whitworth
VND-1R Vindicator
ENF-4R Enforcer
HBK-4G Hunchback
TBT-5N Trebuchet
DV-6M Dervish
DRG-1N Dragon
QKD-4G Quickdraw
CPLT-C1 Catapult
JM6-S JagerMech
GHR-5H Grasshopper
AWS-8Q Awesome
ZEU-6S Zeus
CP-10-Z Cyclops
BNC-3E Banshee
AS7-D Atlas
Thor
Loki


The Thor and Loki are the premium mechs if I recall, and will have swappable arms. Unfortunately, there's no Madcat/Timberwolf in here, as it's always been one of my favorites. Most of the plastics from this set are from the previous Battletech starter, so they won't be of Assault on Black Reach quality, they'll be servicable. Either way, it's two companies worth of battlemechs for $50 plus all kinds of other cool stuff, so I can't complain!


If it doesn't have a Wasp, Stinger, Locust, Phoenix Hawk, Griffin, Wolverine, Shadowhawk, Rifleman, Thunderbolt, Warhammer, Archer, Marauder, and Battlemaster, it ain't Battletech (Battledroid, anyone? ) to me!

Valete,

JohnS


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 04:22:51


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Most of those 'Mechs would be in there, but sadly a SNAFU happened with the liscending rights last year (again) and while the Unseen became Reseen, then became Unseen again (well, most of them did - some stayed this time).


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 04:24:11


Post by: Kanluwen


Is it too much to ask for 28mm scaled Elementals? The Grey Death Suits call to me


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 04:55:12


Post by: Puscifer


No Madcat for the premiums??? Strange, that is like the most recognisable mech.

I still have all my books from when I played, but no models as some bastard stole them all.

Anyone know where I can get models in the UK???


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 05:29:56


Post by: Capt_Bowman


Ral Partha Europe still does mail order for BT products as do Leisure Games and Keep Wargaming. All have online stores to order from. As for big, B&M stockists... I'm a tad out of touch. With Close to 300 battlemechs on my shelves it's been a while since I bought any. The more recent releases just haven't grabbed me with their aesthetic.

Disclaimer before the next bit. I'm a Mod on the Battletech forum and an on again / off again playtester for Catalyst. So there may be some bias.

As a 20 year player I'll just add that Battletech has a very strong following, not GW levels of course and not without our hotheads and TFGs, but a generally mature and helpful crowd. I know for a fact that Catalyst have big plans for the future of the game. Heck, they're still enacting a grand plan that was started back in the FASA days. The Jihad storyline was first dreamed up back in the halcyon days of FASA and you can see the early threads in some of the FASA published materials and novels.

As for complains about the clans, the Word of Blake etc... Battletech is a progressing timeline. It's not static like a lot of other games. The universe goes on, factions wax and wane and characters die. It's part of what attracts me to the game. I can understand the people the hanker back to the simplicity of a water raid on some backwater planet in the depths of Liao space, I'm a 3025 player more than a clan era player myself. But I love the progression of the universe too. I used to love the idea of worldwide events played by the fans of the game that actually had an effect on the way the universe progressed and Battletech had those for a while.

Right, rambled long enough, work calls. TL/DR - Battletech is alive, thriving, progressing, and well worth dropping a few bucks on.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 05:30:27


Post by: megatrons2nd


I did have a Ral Partha Europe link in my favorites, but it is doing some weird link/asking for a login. NecronLord3 has the website address and better luck with online stuff.



On a side note: I do spend money on Battletech material both online and off when I can, and I think it will get bigger, and better as time goes on. I just felt the 25th anniversary edition box set should offer a bit more "new" than it does.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 09:33:34


Post by: Ouze


I've been keeping an eye on this. I've never played battletech EVAR (although I did play the hell out of the MW Clix game, which I adored).

If the minis are as poor as people say, and the PDF of the rules are free, perhaps it might make sense to make my own box with the ironwind metal minis? Not sure how much is really in the box other then a bound copy of the rules and the plastic minis. I'm waiting till this is on Amazon before ordering.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 12:19:50


Post by: Mattlov


Ouze wrote:I've been keeping an eye on this. I've never played battletech EVAR (although I did play the hell out of the MW Clix game, which I adored).

If the minis are as poor as people say, and the PDF of the rules are free, perhaps it might make sense to make my own box with the ironwind metal minis? Not sure how much is really in the box other then a bound copy of the rules and the plastic minis. I'm waiting till this is on Amazon before ordering.


It is worth it to get the box. The minis can paint up pretty well if you put some work into them. And it is a hell of a lot cheaper than getting them in metal.

Box should contain:
26 'Mechs
2 Board Game quality Mapsheets
Quick Start Rules
Quick Start 'Mech stat cards/sheets
Universe Fluff book

I think that's it. There might be another book in there. It is a great deal.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 12:22:49


Post by: olympia


All these posters hating on non-GW products! What is this, warseer? Personally I can't wait to get my hands on this thing.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 12:25:53


Post by: JOHIRA


I played a couple of games of someone's Battletech set once. I remember really enjoying it, despite thinking the plastic minis were really, well, pants. About half of the problem was just bad robot design and the other half was just sloppy execution. But for that price I think I can live with that.

In fact, Battletech may be pretty much what I'm looking for at the moment. A small, fun, very detailed game that would allow future expansion but doesn't require hundreds or even thousands of dollars to get a decent starting force.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 12:31:11


Post by: Ouze


What kind of terrain would work with this sort of scale?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 12:38:15


Post by: BrookM


Just pre-ordered mine, there goes my hobby fund for the month April.

How well does this game work with say, three or four players?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 12:53:25


Post by: Mad4Minis


cygnnus wrote:

If it doesn't have a Wasp, Stinger, Locust, Phoenix Hawk, Griffin, Wolverine, Shadowhawk, Rifleman, Thunderbolt, Warhammer, Archer, Marauder, and Battlemaster, it ain't Battletech (Battlemech, anyone? ) to me!

Valete,

JohnS


You do realize that all the original versions of those, the ones that were taken from Japanese anime, are no longer allowed to be made right?

They are the whole reason FASA went out of business, they got sued, lost, and the original versions of those mechs lost as well. There are new versions, but most arent as cool as the old ones.





Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 13:10:47


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Mad4Minis wrote:They are the whole reason FASA went out of business...


The unseen thing didn't put them out of business. FASA closed down because those in charge (foolishly) saw no future in miniature wargaming.



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 13:16:28


Post by: Brother SRM


Ouze wrote:What kind of terrain would work with this sort of scale?

Some people actually use Heroscape, the hex-based prepainted miniatures game that Hasbro put out. I'm pretty sure the game isn't supported anymore, but the starter comes with a ton of hexes you can use to make your own maps.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 13:19:23


Post by: misterfiveseven


Ouze wrote:What kind of terrain would work with this sort of scale?


You actually don't need terrain. The boards are hex-grid 2d maps, making it pretty straight foward (and lord knows i have like 200+ of them).

However, you can use scale terrain. Problem is, a battlemech is 10 meters, while a hex is actually 30 meters wide; the mini is more a placeholder than a scale model. That means when you're using scale terrain and TLOS, you have to multiply everything by 3 (ranges movement, etc.). This makes for a very large game table.

However, I haven't played with the rereleased rules, so they may be different...

ninja'd by 2 min :(


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 13:50:19


Post by: yeenoghu


JOHIRA wrote:I played a couple of games of someone's Battletech set once. I remember really enjoying it, despite thinking the plastic minis were really, well, pants. About half of the problem was just bad robot design and the other half was just sloppy execution. But for that price I think I can live with that.

In fact, Battletech may be pretty much what I'm looking for at the moment. A small, fun, very detailed game that would allow future expansion but doesn't require hundreds or even thousands of dollars to get a decent starting force.


Part of the charm of 3025 was that all the designs had flaws. Not to go into detail, but 2 tons on a Stinger or Locust taken up for a machinegun system? mechs with crippling heat problems all over the place, ammo in the CT on many mechs just begging for a crit? The existance of the Jagermech? some had more flaws than others but in general, none of them were the most efficient as they could be. I can count on one hand the number of mechs I would take from tech readout 3025 without wanting to swap something or other out for something else.

THose pinkish mechs in Warboss' post above look like the sculpts from the old Ral Partha line, I have 2 of them. They might be plastic instead of metal, so not as crisp, but that Whitworth is in exactly the same pose as my old lead figure.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 13:59:49


Post by: CT GAMER


Nostalgia will force me to buy this as Battletech was the first miniatures -based wargame I ever played.

Seeing as I have not played a game of Battletech in about 20+ years I'm looking forward to revisiting it with my sons.



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 14:08:24


Post by: whitedragon


Anybody have a comparison of how the different miniature lines throughout the years measure up to each other? IE, if I have a bunch of old school plastic mechs from the starter, and old reaper figs, are they the same molds as the new Iron Wind Metals stuff?

Also, for people wanting different minis to use, ever thought of kitbashing Heavy Gear and CAV minis?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 15:01:05


Post by: warboss


whitedragon wrote:Anybody have a comparison of how the different miniature lines throughout the years measure up to each other? IE, if I have a bunch of old school plastic mechs from the starter, and old reaper figs, are they the same molds as the new Iron Wind Metals stuff?

Also, for people wanting different minis to use, ever thought of kitbashing Heavy Gear and CAV minis?


i'd be interested in that comparison too (i.e. pics of the same mech over the 25 years of production). as for the last part, i've never seen heavy gear minis used in battletech games (there used to be a bit of a friendly rivalry back in the day... with the gencon booth giant life size gear's bazooka purposely pointed at the old fasa booth!) but i have seen a CAV mech or two in various con games. Most of my experience is from looking at convention showpiece games and they tend to be put on by superfans who don't need/want to substitute minis but i'm sure some people do use them as stand-ins or homebrew mechs.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 16:03:02


Post by: megatrons2nd


Ouze wrote:What kind of terrain would work with this sort of scale?


misterfiveseven wrote:
You actually don't need terrain. The boards are hex-grid 2d maps, making it pretty straight foward (and lord knows i have like 200+ of them).

However, you can use scale terrain. Problem is, a battlemech is 10 meters, while a hex is actually 30 meters wide; the mini is more a placeholder than a scale model. That means when you're using scale terrain and TLOS, you have to multiply everything by 3 (ranges movement, etc.). This makes for a very large game table.

However, I haven't played with the rereleased rules, so they may be different...

ninja'd by 2 min :(



I believe the rules have changed a bit for the hexless terrain. I think they are in the Strategic Operations rule book. The best thing about this game is that you can use as little or as much rules as you want. Adding more rules does make the game more complex. You can literally fight a battle on a heavy gravity world in/on a sinking mega-ship, while a storm is raging, and have your units pick up and toss opposing units overboard. Or just a basic game using the printed mapsheet, and basic equipment.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 16:42:42


Post by: KaloranSLC


For those of you that might be interested in the rules set of Classic Battletech, but don't like the plastic minis, check out Iron Wind Metals:
http://www.ironwindmetals.com/store/index.php

I've ordered from them in the past, and while they don't have EVERY 'mech, they do have a large selection.

::Edit:: Space bar fail


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 16:45:58


Post by: kronk


If you can't find a particular mini there, I've found many mechs on ebay.

Our gaming group plays battle tech twice a month. Fun game. If these are just re-released minis from the last boxed set, we'll probably pass. We have those already.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 17:32:16


Post by: NecronLord3


olympia wrote:All these posters hating on non-GW products! What is this, warseer? Personally I can't wait to get my hands on this thing.


There is no hate for Battletech from me. There is just disappointment from a good majority of the product releases that Catalyst puts out. I want to give them money and I want Battletech to grow. But putting out crap products like the 25th anniversary box set gives me no incentive to buy their products. They need to concentrate on growing a quality product line such as miniatures that are able to keep up with the releases of each Technical readout. And/or producing quality miniatures products like the Premium Mechs in addition to or as a replacement for the existing miniatures available.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 18:40:48


Post by: aka_mythos


While I agree with the sentiment its better than cardstock minis that the original was reissued with and this helps to break down the biggest barrier for new people getting into the game.

We'be been spoiled and the reality is simply Catalyst, unlike other miniature game companies doesn't have the resources to capatilize by internally producing a miniature range.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 20:19:09


Post by: NecronLord3


aka_mythos wrote:While I agree with the sentiment its better than cardstock minis that the original was reissued with and this helps to break down the biggest barrier for new people getting into the game.

We'be been spoiled and the reality is simply Catalyst, unlike other miniature game companies doesn't have the resources to capatilize by internally producing a miniature range.


That is true. Having one of their owners embezzle 3 million dollars probably did put a dent in their miniatures producing ability.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 20:40:35


Post by: H.B.M.C.


They've never had an in-house miniature producing capability, nor have they ever tried to have such a thing. They are not a miniature war-gaming company.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
yeenoghu wrote:Part of the charm of 3025 was that all the designs had flaws.


That didn't stop after 3025. Flaws and bad designs are part of the game and even in the most recent releases they still have 'Mechs with serious flaws.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 21:01:33


Post by: pombe


The minis aren't the best, but seriously, for 2 companies worth of 'mechs, it is a bargain. If I were to purchase all 24 'mechs from Ironwind Metals, that would cost me around $200. And sure, they aren't the minis that you would enter in a painting contest, but for tabletop play, they paint up well enough. And from couple feet away, they are indistinguishable from their metal counterparts.



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 21:38:18


Post by: NecronLord3


H.B.M.C. wrote:They've never had an in-house miniature producing capability, nor have they ever tried to have such a thing. They are not a miniature war-gaming company.
No one ever said they did but the premium mechs were produced under the direction of Catalyst and then very shortly after the finical troubles came to light.

Catalyst isn't a miniatures, that is true and that is also much of the problem.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 21:38:53


Post by: Mattlov


Puscifer wrote:No Madcat for the premiums??? Strange, that is like the most recognisable mech.

I still have all my books from when I played, but no models as some bastard stole them all.

Anyone know where I can get models in the UK???


Ral Partha UK. Licensed BT producer across the pond. They don't have some of the super newest stuff, but they don't have an archiving fee either, IIRC.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
NecronLord3 wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:They've never had an in-house miniature producing capability, nor have they ever tried to have such a thing. They are not a miniature war-gaming company.
No one ever said they did but the premium mechs were produced under the direction of Catalyst and then very shortly after the finical troubles came to light.

Catalyst isn't a miniatures, that is true and that is also much of the problem.


Not a problem. They are a bunch of writers. Battletech is a simulation board game more than a minis game. The people in charge know that. They stick to what works. The Battletech people make sure the universe, game, and minis all stay in conjunction with each other for the utmost consistency. IIRC there are only MAYBE a dozen full time Catalyst employees. The rest are freelancers who happen to spend a lot of time doing Battletech and Shadowrun.

They know their limits. Imagine if GW had truly separate departments for rules and miniatures. Don't you think the quality would go up for both?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 22:29:18


Post by: NecronLord3


Mattlov wrote:
Puscifer wrote:No Madcat for the premiums??? Strange, that is like the most recognisable mech.

I still have all my books from when I played, but no models as some bastard stole them all.

Anyone know where I can get models in the UK???


Ral Partha UK. Licensed BT producer across the pond. They don't have some of the super newest stuff, but they don't have an archiving fee either, IIRC.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
NecronLord3 wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:They've never had an in-house miniature producing capability, nor have they ever tried to have such a thing. They are not a miniature war-gaming company.
No one ever said they did but the premium mechs were produced under the direction of Catalyst and then very shortly after the finical troubles came to light.

Catalyst isn't a miniatures, that is true and that is also much of the problem.


Not a problem. They are a bunch of writers. Battletech is a simulation board game more than a minis game. The people in charge know that. They stick to what works. The Battletech people make sure the universe, game, and minis all stay in conjunction with each other for the utmost consistency. IIRC there are only MAYBE a dozen full time Catalyst employees. The rest are freelancers who happen to spend a lot of time doing Battletech and Shadowrun.

They know their limits. Imagine if GW had truly separate departments for rules and miniatures. Don't you think the quality would go up for both?
Obviously not. Battle tech is a prime example of how NOT having all your eggs in one basket leads to financial instability, poor coordination, and stagnation. Catalyst needs to concentrate on one thing growing it's consumer base. The box set is a good attempt at doing just that, however it could be done in such a better way that it would grow the consumer base, attract players from other games, bring old players back AND have something for the existing player base. 10 high quality plastic minis would do just that instead of 24 rereleased poor quality miniatures. Or they simply could have labeled this set a second printing of the box set and not have undue expectations for an anniversary boxed set.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 22:40:28


Post by: cygnnus


Mad4Minis wrote:
cygnnus wrote:

If it doesn't have a Wasp, Stinger, Locust, Phoenix Hawk, Griffin, Wolverine, Shadowhawk, Rifleman, Thunderbolt, Warhammer, Archer, Marauder, and Battlemaster, it ain't Battletech (Battlemech, anyone? ) to me!

Valete,

JohnS


You do realize that all the original versions of those, the ones that were taken from Japanese anime, are no longer allowed to be made right?





Of course... And that has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on my opinion. You can count the "good-looking" mechs after those original Robotech ones on one hand, and probably have some fingers to spare!

Cruddy designs aside, the whole Clan deal is my exhibit A in why GW should not advance the 40k timeline...

But, hey, that's just one grognard's opinion.

Valete,

JohnS


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 22:54:16


Post by: JOHIRA


yeenoghu wrote:
JOHIRA wrote:I played a couple of games of someone's Battletech set once. I remember really enjoying it, despite thinking the plastic minis were really, well, pants. About half of the problem was just bad robot design and the other half was just sloppy execution. But for that price I think I can live with that.

In fact, Battletech may be pretty much what I'm looking for at the moment. A small, fun, very detailed game that would allow future expansion but doesn't require hundreds or even thousands of dollars to get a decent starting force.


Part of the charm of 3025 was that all the designs had flaws. Not to go into detail, but 2 tons on a Stinger or Locust taken up for a machinegun system? mechs with crippling heat problems all over the place, ammo in the CT on many mechs just begging for a crit? The existance of the Jagermech?


I'm not talking about technical design flaws, I'm talking about visual design flaws. Some of them just plain look ridiculous (see the photo in pombe's post, the 'mech with long, spindly legs on tiny hip joints that pop outside its torso and a freaking helmet.)

But then as I understand things I can just not use that mech in most games, right? How does choosing a force work for Battletech anyway? Is it possible to assemble a collection of all the mechs you like and only use those mechs for every battle?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 23:10:22


Post by: Grot 6


I played a game one time where you could go in after the battle and scrounge up mechs, and whoever held the land, and the ability to transport the dead mechs got them back to thier base and could use them again, or for spare parts.

As to making up your lances and companies, you could either make up your own, or get the mechs that corrisponded to a comparable "Fluff" company.

They had a bunch of historical units, and other ones were just run of the mill, ( some were heavy mech lances, some were recon lances, some were fire support, etc.)

What you do is just pick a couple of mechs, make up some fluff for your unit, and just go in and play. Some people put the little patches on them, others paint them all the same colors, still others play it with Book related content, and play campaigns including thier RPG characters, and other stuff from the game universe.

Good stuff, I'm checking out some of the material, and pricing a few lances. I've been sold on that 25th set, and I'll be picking up a couple more lances and relearning about my House Stiener stuff.

Do they still have those hybrid mechs, like the Phenox Hawk? Those remind me of Transformers.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 23:10:54


Post by: NecronLord3


JOHIRA wrote:
yeenoghu wrote:
JOHIRA wrote:I played a couple of games of someone's Battletech set once. I remember really enjoying it, despite thinking the plastic minis were really, well, pants. About half of the problem was just bad robot design and the other half was just sloppy execution. But for that price I think I can live with that.

In fact, Battletech may be pretty much what I'm looking for at the moment. A small, fun, very detailed game that would allow future expansion but doesn't require hundreds or even thousands of dollars to get a decent starting force.


Part of the charm of 3025 was that all the designs had flaws. Not to go into detail, but 2 tons on a Stinger or Locust taken up for a machinegun system? mechs with crippling heat problems all over the place, ammo in the CT on many mechs just begging for a crit? The existance of the Jagermech?


I'm not talking about technical design flaws, I'm talking about visual design flaws. Some of them just plain look ridiculous (see the photo in pombe's post, the 'mech with long, spindly legs on tiny hip joints that pop outside its torso and a freaking helmet.)

But then as I understand things I can just not use that mech in most games, right? How does choosing a force work for Battletech anyway? Is it possible to assemble a collection of all the mechs you like and only use those mechs for every battle?


There are no restrictions on what you can take. Players generally will get together and come up with a limit. So some groups will play an era specific battle, for example you will only play mechs from 3050 or earlier. Some groups will play a tonnage level, for example any units you want with a total tonnage not to exceed 1000 tons. But the most common way to play is based on battle value, for example any units you want not to exceed 8,000 BV points. And there are many combinations and limitations that are used as well.

Now visually there are allot of very cool and very exciting designs as well as allot of outdated visually unappealing designs. IMO, what Dark Ages brought to the battletech universe was a change in the aesthetic appeal of mech designs. More and more mechs have more visually appealing designs while possibly having lack luster weapons and armor layouts or simply just being repackaged designs of older units.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/01 23:11:52


Post by: pombe


JOHIRA wrote:Some of them just plain look ridiculous (see the photo in pombe's post, the 'mech with long, spindly legs on tiny hip joints that pop outside its torso and a freaking helmet.)


The Catapult is a personal favorite of mine.

However, yes...that was not the greatest sculpt. If you prefer a better version, you can buy the resculpted version here:

http://www.ironwindmetals.com/store/product_info.php?products_id=1955


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 00:03:20


Post by: kronk


Grot 6 wrote:I played a game one time where you could go in after the battle and scrounge up mechs, and whoever held the land, and the ability to transport the dead mechs got them back to thier base and could use them again, or for spare parts.

As to making up your lances and companies, you could either make up your own, or get the mechs that corrisponded to a comparable "Fluff" company.


For our game, our group is a Mercenary Company assigned to planetary defense. Part of our payment is salvage rights from the enemies mech and vehicles. You can amass quite a collection of spare parts and extra ammo this way. It's a bit of a logistical/book-keeping nightmare to keep up with it, but one of our players just loves that stuff.

If you recover a mostly intact vehicle, you can repair it then sell it. Or, keep it as a back-up in case one of the primary units is destroyed or damaged.

For lances, we picked similar speeds or weapon ranges to divide up the mechs. There are 6 players with PC's and about the same # of NPC's, so our battles can get rather large.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 00:04:57


Post by: Mad4Minis


cygnnus wrote:

Cruddy designs aside, the whole Clan deal is my exhibit A in why GW should not advance the 40k timeline...

But, hey, that's just one grognard's opinion.

Valete,

JohnS


Ill agree. When I first started Battletech (around 18 yeas ago) I played clans...simply because they womped my buddies IS stuff with ease. However, after a while I learned that the older stuff was more fun. 3025-3050 IS vs IS is the most fun overall.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 02:21:56


Post by: NecronLord3


kronk wrote:I'm holding off until I see pictures of the mechs. But I am excited about the news.


Here is a better link to a higher quality pic of the 24 sub-par mechs from Boardgamegeek.com: http://cf.geekdo-images.com/images/pic247121_lg.jpg


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 03:10:37


Post by: JOHIRA


pombe wrote:
JOHIRA wrote:Some of them just plain look ridiculous (see the photo in pombe's post, the 'mech with long, spindly legs on tiny hip joints that pop outside its torso and a freaking helmet.)


The Catapult is a personal favorite of mine.

However, yes...that was not the greatest sculpt. If you prefer a better version, you can buy the resculpted version here:

http://www.ironwindmetals.com/store/product_info.php?products_id=1955


Don't get me wrong, I guess the Catapult (don't know the names) is the one I like. In principle any robot chicken-walker gets a big from me. It's the more humanoid 'Mechs where I think the designs get silly.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 03:58:16


Post by: sennacherib


Did i really first play battledroids 25 years ago. wow i am so old. hmmm. this might be a new purchase.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 06:13:30


Post by: Nurglitch


Why would anyone spend more precious hours of their life playing Battletax? I have to do my taxes more than once this year? Oh Khorne, why?

More to the point, why would people play this when games like Heavy Gear exist? A better, more realized universe, quicker and more intelligent gameplay, and way better art. I mean, I was raised on Battletech novels, but that just served to underline the deficiencies of the game as a simulation.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 06:46:28


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Wow. Whole lotta hate going on this this thread. If you don't like BattleTech, that's cool. But please, let you're opinion-as-fact bull-gak at the door.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 06:54:58


Post by: Tacobake


mm Battletech so yummy.

<-- must buy


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 07:20:24


Post by: sennacherib


AHHHHHHH no Battlemaster model, no Archer, no Warhammer. GAK.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 07:57:16


Post by: Brother SRM


sennacherib wrote:AHHHHHHH no Battlemaster model, no Archer, no Warhammer. GAK.

Grab em on eBay or Iron Wind Metals?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 08:25:05


Post by: Reecius


Did Robotech finally tell the Battletech guys to stop copying their stuff? I don;t see any of the Mechs I loved. BT was my first Minis game way back when but the cool mechs are gone and replaced with some really ugly ones.

Warhammer
Archer
Phoenix
Rifleman
Marauder
etc.

Bummer that the coolest ones are gone. Oh well, still might be a fun game to play as I loved the original as a kid.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 10:30:41


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Reecius wrote:Did Robotech finally tell the Battletech guys to stop copying their stuff?


I really do wish people would get their facts straight before spouting crap like this... honestly...


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 12:15:52


Post by: aka_mythos


Last I heard, that whole mess basically happened because the Japanese owners of those mech designs believed they could license the rights for games and models separate from the art work and animation distribution rights. Harmony Gold got the animation distribution rights and FASA got from a broker working with the Japanese animator the rights to use the mech designs for their books and games. Harmony Gold has asserted that their rights include the derrivative rights to those designs, and thus the broker FASA used had no right to sell the mech designs. This confusion comes from ongoing disputes over who the proper Japanese owner is. Stateside the in court end result was denial of motions, a very quiet settlement and FASA choosing not to use those mechs for the sake of avoiding further legal issues.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 12:19:42


Post by: BrookM


That's a lot more helpful and explains a lot.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 14:26:34


Post by: Mad4Minis


For those who want to speed up their Battletech games a bit try this...reduce every to hit modifier for targets movement by half, rounding up. It may not seem like much but it will result in many more hits, quicker damage, and an overall quicker game. It also makes long range shots far more worthwhile.

Another one of my home rules is no to hit modifiers for the attackers movement. I figure that a unit as advanced as a mech should at least be able to adjust fire and compensate for its own movement.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 14:47:41


Post by: yeenoghu


I like the rules exactly as they were written, but it's an interesting idea. Difficult to-hit mods is what kept my beloved Spider and Assassin team alive. It would work if everyone was riding around in huge lumbering armored PPC platforms, but not for the jumpy dodgey mechs.

One of the things that makes Btech so cool to me is the 2d6 +/- modifier system. This means stacking +1s and -1s has a greater cumulative effect than it would on a single die system. Knowing how to exploit your jump speed, the right cover to land in, the optimum weapon range for your mech compared to your opponents, when to time your attack based on heat, can lead to you shooting your main weapons at short range with a -3 to hit and him shooting at medium range with -5 or -6 to hit. It's the only way lightly armored mechs can last.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 14:49:38


Post by: deleted20250424


The easiest way to speed up Battletech is to remove Heat buildup and Ammo counts.

Then you can fire all day and pop mechs like crazy.



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 14:57:37


Post by: Mad4Minis


yeenoghu wrote:I like the rules exactly as they were written, but it's an interesting idea. Difficult to-hit mods is what kept my beloved Spider and Assassin team alive. It would work if everyone was riding around in huge lumbering armored PPC platforms, but not for the jumpy dodgey mechs...


It still keeps the small fast mechs fairly hard to hit, just not as hard as they used to be. Making it an even reduction keeps it from favoring anything more than it did before. It doesnt change the balance of the game at all, just ups the hit percentage.





Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 15:18:51


Post by: Puscifer


Mad4Minis wrote:For those who want to speed up their Battletech games a bit try this...reduce every to hit modifier for targets movement by half, rounding up. It may not seem like much but it will result in many more hits, quicker damage, and an overall quicker game. It also makes long range shots far more worthwhile.


LMAO - I thought I was the only guy who played like that.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 15:23:57


Post by: yeenoghu


TalonZahn wrote:The easiest way to speed up Battletech is to remove Heat buildup and Ammo counts.

Then you can fire all day and pop mechs like crazy.



or you can just play the first person shooter


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Mad4Minis wrote:
yeenoghu wrote:I like the rules exactly as they were written, but it's an interesting idea. Difficult to-hit mods is what kept my beloved Spider and Assassin team alive. It would work if everyone was riding around in huge lumbering armored PPC platforms, but not for the jumpy dodgey mechs...


It still keeps the small fast mechs fairly hard to hit, just not as hard as they used to be. Making it an even reduction keeps it from favoring anything more than it did before. It doesnt change the balance of the game at all, just ups the hit percentage.





It does change the balance of the game. Some mechs cannot be hit as much as others. ergo a higher hit percentage means the lumbering armored weapons platforms overpower the lighter maneuver mechs. Skilled battletech players don't like to give their opponents easy shots. When we were kids, we would just run up on each other and blaze away, but as we got older, finesse became important. This way of making it easier to hit reminds me of the 5th grader mentality we started playing with a couple of decades ago. I enjoyed battletech for the finesse. It is far less blatant and oafish than 40k rules if it's played right. It's not meant to be a fast action game, it is meant to be calculating and thoughtful.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 15:42:10


Post by: deleted20250424


yeenoghu wrote:
TalonZahn wrote:The easiest way to speed up Battletech is to remove Heat buildup and Ammo counts.

Then you can fire all day and pop mechs like crazy.



I'm so old that I played MPBT Online and was a Beta Tester for MPBT 3025.

I actually remember Battledroids on the shelf at the store.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 16:04:17


Post by: Mad4Minis


yeenoghu wrote:
It does change the balance of the game. Some mechs cannot be hit as much as others. ergo a higher hit percentage means the lumbering armored weapons platforms overpower the lighter maneuver mechs. Skilled battletech players don't like to give their opponents easy shots. When we were kids, we would just run up on each other and blaze away, but as we got older, finesse became important. This way of making it easier to hit reminds me of the 5th grader mentality we started playing with a couple of decades ago. I enjoyed battletech for the finesse. It is far less blatant and oafish than 40k rules if it's played right. It's not meant to be a fast action game, it is meant to be calculating and thoughtful.



Eh, to each his own I guess. I always found the light mechs running around racking up 13 or 14 to hit numbers in a 2d6 system to be a bit silly. Though i must admit it was never really an issue, as Ive never played with or against light mechs in anything other than scenarios specifically set up for them, or very large multi player games. Only done one of those, it took forever but was really fun. IIRC it was 8 players per side, 2 mechs per player.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 16:13:30


Post by: DarkTraveler777


H.B.M.C. wrote:
Reecius wrote:Did Robotech finally tell the Battletech guys to stop copying their stuff?


I really do wish people would get their facts straight before spouting crap like this... honestly...


I agree with you H.B.M.C. There is a lot of just plan wrong information out there which it seems like some people doggedly cling to in this age of instant information. The joke that FASA stole anything seems to be troll bait for people who enjoy causing grief. it is like a bad dated punchline that people keep insisting on using at parties. It wasn't clever when new and now it is just stale and old hat.

Like remember guys when Harmony Gold got an idea for an Exo-Squad toy and they were like "Schwing!This is totally awesome!!!" And then FASA was like, "Fool! That toy looks like a MADCAT, Homey Don't Play That!" and slapped a lawsuit on them AND THEN Harmony Gold was like, "Oh yeah, you know those licensed designs you are using well you licensed them from the wrong company so BOO YA counter-suit!" Which made FASA go, "OOPS! DID I DO THAT?"

Totally stale man.




Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 17:28:07


Post by: Kalamadea


All the hate on this set amuses me greatly. When the last version of this came out a couple years ago, we sold a metric crap-ton of em at the store I worked at. Most of the gamers were warhammer players that either hadn't played the game in years( many didn't realize it was still around) and lots of newer, younger players that had never heard of it or never seen it. $50 got you everything and more that you needed, enough for a few people to play out of the same box even. For the first time since 2001 we actually had people playing Btech regularly, even a league going. And having fun with it too, it's a VERY differant style of game than what is now made. Of course the plastics suck compared to the metals, this box obviously isn't for people that care that much about the minis, but for people getting into it or back into it, it's an amazing set and one helluva step up from carboard cutouts.

Besides, a decent coat of paint on those mechs makes all the differance in the world. A camo scheme, a few highlights, and a heavy coat of GW wash and they look just fine. My only problem with the minis is the bases aren't regular hexagons, the sides are not the same length as the front.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 17:43:41


Post by: CCotD


I purchased this boxed set just last year (not understanding their post about pre-ordering it) while the rules have little changed in them, the "missing due to IP theft" Mechs makes the game "blah" and the plastic mini's that come with it suck balls. I've seen some poorly done plastic mini's in my 40 years as a hobbiest, but these are absolute rubbish. I cut mine up and made wreck markers out of them. They are of the quality of the green army men you can buy a bag of 500 for a buck (USD) at the Dollar General store. Bendy, covered with some oil that comes back after cleaning them with dish washing detergent so any paint won't stick.

I know that Catalyst Labs probably spent a ton on the license, but the quality of the MINI's is unacceptable. I'm glad I had a 40% off coupon for Borders where I found it. Paying full retail for such mini's would have made me go postal.

The cardboard standees I got in my original BattleDroids box (re-released as Battletech) are a better value.

All other items in the box are TOP quality. A real shame though because if the Mini's hadn't been such shitte I'd have raved about this product. Card board standees would have made me rave about this product. But the fact that the company tried to pawn off those <insert every explicative you can think of> miniatures almost seemed like they were giving me the Middle Finger as they laughed that they got my $$$.

Yea, I'm pretty pissed that the quality of everything else in the box was absolutely great but the important part (to me) was crap. Even a year later.




Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 18:21:45


Post by: aka_mythos


TalonZahn wrote:The easiest way to speed up Battletech is to remove Heat buildup and Ammo counts.

Then you can fire all day and pop mechs like crazy.

You don't have to deal with as many units in a game of Battletech as it is, so you can afford spending more time on each unit.

On a tangential note, I always thought people would have been more open to the book keeping aspect if the models were larger.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 18:28:00


Post by: blood angel


I did boycot Battletech as a child for two reasons.

One, I told my mother i wanted a robotech rpg for my birthday. She brought home battle tech.

Two, battletech did totally rip of the Robotech mechs.

I only played the first battletech computer game on my commadore 64 because if you beat the game and found the code at the end you could send off for a Phoenix.. eerrr Veritech fighter.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 18:29:19


Post by: deleted20250424


aka_mythos wrote:You don't have to deal with as many units in a game of Battletech as it is, so you can afford spending more time on each unit.

On a tangential note, I always thought people would have been more open to the book keeping aspect if the models were larger.


You really don't have to convince me about anything concerning Battletech.

I have almost every book ever made for it (including many BattleTechnolgy mags) on a shelf right next to me and somewhere near 1000 mechs (not one beyond the year 3039 and most are OOP Originals), over 40 Aerospace mech scale fighters, and 2 cases full of tanks/vees.

From personal experience, somwhere in the 20+ years range, the absolute fastest way to speed up the game (IMHO), is to remove counting ammo and remove heat build up. Then people can always move at max and always fire every weapon they want. Modifiers are easy to track by putting a die by the mech indicating the Modifier number.

Just one mans thoughts.

[Edit] Just for fun, I dropped my Grey Death Legion (according to their book TO&E) Company pictures into my gallery. Long live nostalgia!!



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 18:42:04


Post by: aka_mythos


I'm just saying there is no need to rush the game. Its meant to be more of a sim game... and removing those elements removes some of the inherent disadvantages with certain armaments and unit choices. At that point you might as well just delete those things from the game. Its the equivalent to taking chess and reducing it down to checkers.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 19:06:26


Post by: NecronLord3


I think you guys are bringing up some good points. The sum of which is that Battletech needs some stream lining and I for one would like to see an updated version of the game that is more balanced and runs faster and smoother. There is never a game of CBT when you don't end up page flipping for 15min to an half hour just trying to work out how to do some simple maneuvers. To top it off the core rule books are poorly organized and often pages are mismarked. I'm glad to have PDFs of all the books now so that I can do key word searches using my iPad but the game design can be a major turn off for new players.

Battletech really has not changed in 25 years which is a plus and a minus as they have generally just added more and more to the game making it more and more complicated without doing much in the way of fixing problem areas or streamlining the existing system. One member of the CBT forums had brought up a really good point about how Total Warfare does in almost 400pages what the previous edition of the rule book did in like 70 pages or something to that effect but Total Warfare does it even more poorly. More is not always better.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 19:15:29


Post by: Kalamadea


I had to delete this post 3 times as I was geting too heated. My main point of those delted posts is that if you got offended this set has cheap mechs, you're not at all the target audience for it, and there's far better options for you to get into the game with. If you ARE the set's intended audience, the intro set is absolutely AMAZING. Full, complete game for an affordable price that has high-quality components with a good art design? And it actually comes with figs and costs the same amount as a game that didn't come with any figs, even if they're cheap supermarket quarter-machine quality? AND, for those modeling enthusuasts, they license a complete line of high quality metal figs to replace your cheapo plastics with? AND they make a large series of expansion books that allow you to add as much or as litle extra detail as your gaming group could possibly ever want? Phenominal.

As for speeding up play, we used to just give everyone veteran pilots. Anything more than that and you really started to lose out on what makes it battletech over any of the other miniature games out there: a small scale duel between pilots using machines that are meant to dish out and take an enormous amount of punishment, with the victor decided by the beter strategist (or who could get luckier on the crit chart, that too). Gunnery 2 instead of a 4 makes a HUGE differance, although it did tend to favor the mechs with bigger guns. Personally, I was super excited to hear about BattleForce, thinking it would be a trimmed down batletech so you could use more figs per side, until I saw the preview that showed each "mech" was a lance. I still think something like that it has potential, but I hate rulesets that aren't 1:1 for vehicles/mechs. I'm all for streamlining the game, so long as it's a differant game, keep classic Btech super-detailed, couple mechs per side.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 19:38:33


Post by: H.B.M.C.


blood angel wrote:Two, battletech did totally rip of the Robotech mechs.


Of FFS... no they didn't. Jesus...


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 19:52:16


Post by: Balance


blood angel wrote:Two, battletech did totally rip of the Robotech mechs.


Not really. It's more that Battletech licensed designs that Harmony Gold also licensed when they turned Macross into Robotech. neither was the initial designer, and both had some limits to the license, although very different limits. This is a massive oversimplification of the whole kerfluffle.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 19:54:53


Post by: Kalamadea


I'm curious, how many people would have completely skipped over battletech altogether if it weren't for fasa "ripping off" robotech? I know the only reason i ever grabbed any of the mechs or looked at the game is becuase it had an Excalibur blasting away on the cover, complete with RDF symbol (I was super into the robotech novels and rpg at the time, the show was long off the air). Later I found out it was macross they "ripped off", but the important thing was inch-tall robotech figures! OMG! Mom, buy me that one! Wasn't till the latter 90s i actually played the game. I can't for a moment believe I'm the only one that only looked twice becuase it WAS robotech.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 19:57:38


Post by: Balance


Kalamadea wrote:I had to delete this post 3 times as I was geting too heated. My main point of those delted posts is that if you got offended this set has cheap mechs, you're not at all the target audience for it, and there's far better options for you to get into the game with. If you ARE the set's intended audience, the intro set is absolutely AMAZING. Full, complete game for an affordable price that has high-quality components with a good art design? And it actually comes with figs and costs the same amount as a game that didn't come with any figs, even if they're cheap supermarket quarter-machine quality? AND, for those modeling enthusuasts, they license a complete line of high quality metal figs to replace your cheapo plastics with? AND they make a large series of expansion books that allow you to add as much or as litle extra detail as your gaming group could possibly ever want? Phenominal.


I've mostly held my tongue as I do work for a company that makes another mecha game but keep in mind that a lot of people on the thread are looking at this boxed set as an introduction to the setting. I have some background with BT, so I know that weird designs are a core of the setting. You know that. New people don't, and they're seeing not-great plastics (but as you said, they're priced right, and look reasonably faithful to some of the original source art) combined with not-great mechanical designs (I'm talking spindly legs, not how many SRMs or heat sinks a design has) and the combo is unappealing. It's not putting the best front forward, unfortunately.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 20:11:03


Post by: Nurglitch


Mind you, the awful mechanical designs reflect the clunkiness of the rules.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 20:19:32


Post by: Balance


Nurglitch wrote:Mind you, the awful mechanical designs reflect the clunkiness of the rules.


They're not my style but some people like them. I find they make a bit more sense if you think of the Mechs as more land battleships than dueling knights/samurai.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 20:25:35


Post by: Nurglitch


Balance:

I know some people like them, but I'm not really clear on why. I don't think they work well as land battleships either: at least they're not like any battleships in naval games I've played.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 20:37:52


Post by: ThirdUltra


As a veteran Battletech player since 87, this looks interesting enough.

Like many have mentioned already, it's a simple system and in 30 min, you know how to play. I've always liked the rules, but they expanded them throughout the years, and you could always build/modify your own mechs easily enough if you didn't like running the stock designs.

I have almost every battletech supplement or source book and own several hundred mechs up to the 3060 era (inlcuding every novel...lol!).

I liked the old classic designs, however, as has been mentioned before with the Robotech thing, I think it's been put properly in its place (thanks to HBMC and others), so enough about that.

The good thing about the game though, is you can use the rules you want, so it is a bit customizable on what kind of game you want to play. Though I must admit, since the Total War core rulebook came out, sometimes it has been difficult to look up some things. A few things did change in Total War, ie partial cover no longer is a +3 mod now with hits going on the punch-table. Now it is a +1 mod with any hits hitting the legs totally ignored.....interesting rule change there....lol!

But anyway, with some of their other books like Tactical Operations and Strategic Ops, you can make it as complicated or easy as you want to....even cherry-pick the stuff you like for your gaming group. I'll admit, they can complicate stuff with all the tables and charts for engineering and cost-formulas, but it's there if you want it.

Great game and it was one of the first miniature wargames I ever played......still play it today, but more retro, circa 3025 to 3039.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 20:50:13


Post by: Mattlov


H.B.M.C. wrote:Wow. Whole lotta hate going on this this thread. If you don't like BattleTech, that's cool. But please, let you're opinion-as-fact bull-gak at the door.


I know. Especially the "OMG it is so hard to play!" people.

It is simple math. Can you add from 0-14? And read a page of charts? That is really all Battletech takes. It isn't hard.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 21:07:32


Post by: Grot 6


I'm not seeing that.

The rules do what they are supposed to, they arn't anything special, but they are what came with the FASA set at the time. As for the talk about "Ripping off..." I don't see you as knowing what your talking about when they were BOTH going at it the same way that mech models did and still do in Asia.

Predominatly in China and Japan, the giant robot thing is almost part in parcel with the setting. Maybe its the Magna thing, maybe its the loose copywrite laws there in general, but I was building THOSE SAME MODELS almost six or eight months before robotech even came out, they came with US SPACY decals and everything. They came in later in both the robotech boxes, and the REVELL line.

I've seen these models in many a market all over the world, and they really don't have a stable "ROBOTECH" home. From near as I can tell, the bottom line goes to whoever has the molds, has the models. I've seen this sort of thing from everything from Hot-wheels, to G.I.Joes, to the giant Gundam robots. when a company loses control of the item, it gets snatched up from third and fourth string company types who then squeeze the thing a little more for extra cash. When the revell models came out, they were in this status. The robotech stuff IIRC was in hiatus, and the FASA guys popped this game out along the same time that Pallidium was putting out it's own Robotech game alongside RIFTS.

http://www.toysnjoys.com/macross_models.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robotech_Defenders

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robotech

http://www.purplepawn.com/2010/03/the-convoluted-story-of-iron-wind-metals-ral-partha-and-battletech-miniatures/

The appeal of the system is that it is simple, and the mechs were for all intensive purposes running on thier last legs, combining the road warrior aspect with the giant robots, and there you go. The game was an instant success at the time. Along with that, the ROBOTECH thing came about and wasn't like front page news.

The difficulty with the copywrite issue is that these robots were THE SAME. They didn't even have the courtesy to remove all of the robotech marking from the models, or even do the courtesy of the robotec fans to even agknowledge the idea. So in that respect, I can understand the responses.




Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 21:17:11


Post by: Balance


Grot 6, to my understanding at least for a while FASA had a definite claim to the designs as they had actually licensed them from the original designers. Then things got weird, but others have explained that better than I. I think the 'ZOMG! They stole from Robotech!' issue is a dead horse, at least for this thread. We should probably try to keep the discussion on the box set. (And it is cool to see an old-fashioned box set like that.)


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 21:24:26


Post by: Kalamadea


Balance wrote:
Kalamadea wrote:I had to delete this post 3 times as I was geting too heated. My main point of those delted posts is that if you got offended this set has cheap mechs, you're not at all the target audience for it, and there's far better options for you to get into the game with. If you ARE the set's intended audience, the intro set is absolutely AMAZING. Full, complete game for an affordable price that has high-quality components with a good art design? And it actually comes with figs and costs the same amount as a game that didn't come with any figs, even if they're cheap supermarket quarter-machine quality? AND, for those modeling enthusuasts, they license a complete line of high quality metal figs to replace your cheapo plastics with? AND they make a large series of expansion books that allow you to add as much or as litle extra detail as your gaming group could possibly ever want? Phenominal.


I've mostly held my tongue as I do work for a company that makes another mecha game but keep in mind that a lot of people on the thread are looking at this boxed set as an introduction to the setting. I have some background with BT, so I know that weird designs are a core of the setting. You know that. New people don't, and they're seeing not-great plastics (but as you said, they're priced right, and look reasonably faithful to some of the original source art) combined with not-great mechanical designs (I'm talking spindly legs, not how many SRMs or heat sinks a design has) and the combo is unappealing. It's not putting the best front forward, unfortunately.


I'm coming from the other side of it, as I worked in a FLGS at the time this set originally released, and it was a MAJOR hit, especially amongst the newer, younger (high school and early college) gamers for whom it was literally the intro set to battletech, they either hadn't seen it before or had only heard it referanced by the veterans. It was perfect for them, gave them everything they needed for them and their friends to try it out and really play it. Many of them ordered a lot of the expansion rulebooks and mapssets and ordered IWM mechs, some got into clan era, some into jihad stuff. For a lot of the veterans, it was pure nostalgia bringing them back, and the original plastech mechs were just as bad. Many of those gamers still had a few mechs in their closets that finally got to see light of day again, sometimes with fresh coats of paint.

And the fact that the set sold out so quickly shows that my shop wasn't alone in that reaction. You may hate the figs (they're pretty bad by other miniature standards) but the value of the set as a whole, especially considering it has so many figs and how much those figs would have cost in metal makes it an incredible starter. So I can understand if you hate the figs. I can understand if you hate the mechanical designs (I tend to dislike about 2/3s of them myself). I can understand if you don't like how the rules play. I can understand if the starter set as presented isn't your cup o tea for any of those reasons and more. But saying it's a terrible set, just becuase YOU don't like that (and I'm speaking to everyone, not a specific poster)? Thats just flat out wrong, it's one of the best starters ever released becuase it does EXACTLY what it's meant to do, and it does it well. For a retail store, it's perfect becuase you can carry the box and the main rulebook and the people that want anything beyond that are usually the kind of people willing to special order it, and the kind of people that are just fine and dandy with the starter as is probably wouldn't have picked up the rulebook AND the mapsets AND the miniatures for $10 a pop. For those gamers who just want it as a side game to break out every once in a while it's perfect becuase everything fits back in the same box and can get shoved in the back of the closet till you feel like playing it again. Thats whats upsetting to me, is the inability to recognize that for a lot of people it's a really good set, even if you personally despise it.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 21:52:35


Post by: yeenoghu


Just a side thing I noticed, as people are all talking about the flaws in battletech rules and needing an update:

I have played Warhammer 40k for a while, Battletech for eons. I have noticed that competative 40k players are often very dickish about interpretation of rules, nudging figures or distances, arguing the win, getting nitpicky over milimeters and LOS vagueness when it helps them, while paying little attention to such details when it doesn't, cheesy list building , etc.

None of that ever happens in battletech. Being a winning battletech player had nothing to do with being an argumentative ass to get an advantage. If anything that says it is a much better set of rules than our beloved 40k, because you don't get stupid arguements about RAI vs RAW and 'roll a dice for it if you cannot agree' gak that favors whoever has the loudest mouth and splits the most hairs.

Incidentally, I know some good 40k players who also play btech occasionally, and are convinced their wins are purely result of great tactical genius at 40k, not cheesy army lists, luck, or any of that. Funny how when on a hex map with precise rules and forces that cannot be minmaxed with the latest flavor of codex creep, their tactical genius looks like a bunch of smoking heaps of salvage rights.

unrelated thought: part of the speed problem and hit rolls in btech was the new technology making ridiculously fast mechs easy to build. The hit charts and modifiers were written with 3025 technology as the only thing that existed. A lot of oldschool btech players still only play 3025 because a 7/11/7 mech is a rare thing and at the time, there were no XL engines, ferro armor, MASC, double sinks, and such to save weight and go faster anyway with more armor. If you wanted to go that fast or be heat-efficient it meant you were very undergunned and underarmored. Clans and lostech made it a lot more common. A 75 ton mech moving at 5/8 like a MadCat was unheard of. I have played at all levels and I still think good ol' 3025 technology is a much more fun game. The newer technology can be gimicky fun, but it can make for some ridiculous overkill and mishap. It's more fun and balanced when everyone is flawed and less than optimal.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 22:05:03


Post by: Mad4Minis


yeenoghu wrote:Just a side thing I noticed, as people are all talking about the flaws in battletech rules and needing an update:

I have played Warhammer 40k for a while, Battletech for eons. I have noticed that competative 40k players are often very dickish about interpretation of rules, nudging figures or distances, arguing the win, getting nitpicky over milimeters and LOS vagueness when it helps them, while paying little attention to such details when it doesn't, cheesy list building , etc.

None of that ever happens in battletech. Being a winning battletech player had nothing to do with being an argumentative ass to get an advantage. If anything that says it is a much better set of rules than our beloved 40k, because you don't get stupid arguements about RAI vs RAW and 'roll a dice for it if you cannot agree' gak that favors whoever has the loudest mouth and splits the most hairs.

Incidentally, I know some good 40k players who also play btech occasionally, and are convinced their wins are purely result of great tactical genius at 40k, not cheesy army lists, luck, or any of that. Funny how when on a hex map with precise rules and forces that cannot be minmaxed with the latest flavor of codex creep, their tactical genius looks like a bunch of smoking heaps of salvage rights.


Amen brother. For all its flaws at least they never fell to super powered options like many other games. Even the most powerful weapons are restricted by the construction rules. Building custom mechs was always my favorite part. IMO Heavy Metal Pro is one of the best things a battletech player can have. Full mech construction right on your PC.


As far as the new tech...after a game or two its kinda meh. I like either 3025 or 3050.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 22:37:16


Post by: Balance


Couldn't the whole 'Clan' thing be a rather monumental (and divisive) example of Codex Creep?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/02 23:53:51


Post by: yeenoghu


Not really. Btech wasn't about collecting miniatures. In 40k you invest a lot of $$$ into a specific army, only to have something else come along and make it obsolete by comparison. Clan stuff upped the power level of the entire game, not just some specific players. If Btech could have codex creep, it would be like saying only Clan Wolf gets pulse lasers while clan bear gets ultra cannons or something like that. The technology and the rules are available to all players of all factions. Through inventive roleplaying 'fluff' plenty of IS forces had clan technology, even if fluffy it was rare, if you wanted a good game you don't just say 'you get 4 mechs and I get 4 mechs, you look at the BV of those mechs for an even match. Clan will always be outnumbered because their mechs are worth more.

The huge difference is in the investment. GWs WYSIWYG does not apply to a game that is more rules focused and less miniatures focused. Any player can play any mech. Scenarios dictate the mechs, not which figure collection you have. There is no codex creep in btech, just a choice of which rules you like to play. If you play 3055, double HS and XL engines exist and clan weapons are lighter and better than IS versions, if you play 3025 they haven't arrived yet, if you play 3065+ all sorts of other goodies are available, to anyone. This is not an option for someone with $2000 worth of figures having to say their Necrons are now Space Wolves because they like those rules better.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 00:28:40


Post by: deleted20250424


yeenoghu wrote: This is not an option for someone with $2000 worth of figures having to say their Necrons are now Space Wolves because they like those rules better.


I'll have to introduce you to Goatboy on BoLs.

I agree completely though on that line of thought yeenoghu.

Which is why my BT timeline stops at 3049.



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 00:44:14


Post by: Mad4Minis


No WYSIWYG is a fun aspect of Battletech. Ive been on both sides of a surprise Gauss Rifle. Its also nice since you can use one mini to represent several variants, keeps from spending a bunch on extra minis.

However, if I build a variant mech and it turns out to be something I use regularly Ill convert a mini to represent it. Thats mostly just because I like doing conversions to things.


Man, all this BT talk is making me want to play.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 00:48:33


Post by: yeenoghu


I agree Mad4Minis. But an Archer is still an Archer on the outside, despite the countless variants. I liked modelling my custom mechs too, but it isn't a game rule in btech. an Archer is still an Archer whether it is working for Davion or Hendrik of Oberon. Still represented by the same counter/figure/cardboard standup. still accesses the same rules whether its shooting a LRM built by Liao or Kurita. It's nice that there's only a few figs on the board so it is reasonable to keep track of. If anybody has ever played a btech game with even close to the number of figs as a 500 point 40k game, I'd love to hear about it, and find you a therapist.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 01:09:08


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Grot 6 wrote:The difficulty with the copywrite issue is that these robots were THE SAME. They didn't even have the courtesy to remove all of the robotech marking from the models, or even do the courtesy of the robotec fans to even agknowledge the idea. So in that respect, I can understand the responses.


What are you blithering about? You’re making it out that FASA simply took the designs from Macross (and a few other places) wholesale, didn’t tell anyone that they did, and then started using them in the hope that no one would notice. That couldn’t be further from the truth.

As for the comparison between the box-art... yeah, that’s intentional. Isn’t that obvious? It’s a homage to the classic box art of the game. The ‘Mech that’s being used there on the new box, the Hammerhands, is described in the fluff as the forerunner to the venerable Warhammer (the ‘Mech on the original box). It’s designed as a piece of nostalgia, not some sneaky attempt to rewrite history or pretend that what happened with the Unseen didn’t happen.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 01:18:14


Post by: Hordini


Personally, I'm pretty pumped about this. Of course, the miniatures are not the highest quality, but Battletech's miniatures have always been a bit more utilitarian. As others have said, with a decent paint job, they are almost as good as the Iron Wind Metals.

Also, in case anyone missed it, not only does this boxed set come with the mechs, it also comes with game-board quality maps, which is a really big step up from the previous boxed sets and map packs. I'm pretty sure I'll be buying this one.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 01:32:23


Post by: Davor


What is with all the Battletech hate here? It is a great system. It's a bit too slow some people say? Well 40K and Fantasy can bog down as well and become really slow as well.

Rules are clear, concise and with a hex board, you can't really cheat, like there goes on in 40K. As someone said already, there is no nudging millimeters to get an edge, no arguing about 40K rules and RAI or RAW.

You can even get all the introductory rules for free if you want from the Catalyst web site. They even give you paper cut outs like we used 27 years ago, all for Free. I don't see GW giving anything for free.

So again, why all the hate?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 01:47:40


Post by: yeenoghu


Checker players can't handle Chess either.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 01:49:25


Post by: Mad4Minis


Another note for the fans...if you want 3D terrain but the simplicity of the hex movement and measurement try using Heroscape terrain. its 3D, hex based, and the hexes are just a bit bigger than the BT hexes. Also it can be had relatively cheap on ebay for those who dont already have some.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 01:52:54


Post by: kenshin620


I think we already mentioned the wonderful Heroscape terrain

But that just shows its awesomeness!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 01:54:13


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Davor wrote:What is with all the Battletech hate here?


Who knows? I mean, War Machine, Hordes, Infinity, Malifaux and half a dozen other games get the focus here all the time without so much vitriol levelled at them. But mention Battletech and we get a veritable shitstorm of negativity what with all the clueless people making statements about FASA ‘ripping off’ Macross (they didn’t), or how they went out of business because of it (they didn’t) and then all the Heavy Gear trolls crawl out of the woodwork to try and tell us that their big smashy robot is game is better than this big smashy robot game.

It is quite perplexing.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 01:58:00


Post by: Hordini


Well, some of us still appreciate the Battletech action, H.B.M.C. It is interesting though how fast the misinformation can spread until people start acting like it's public knowledge that FASA ripped off Macross or Robotech (which as you said, is not the case).


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 02:11:30


Post by: warboss


Kalamadea wrote:Besides, a decent coat of paint on those mechs makes all the differance in the world. A camo scheme, a few highlights, and a heavy coat of GW wash and they look just fine.


lol, that technique doesn't work with really ugly women nor does it work on really ugly minis. i realize that nostalgia is a powerful thing but wow... battletech needs to incorporate modern sculpting styles into their minis (like some of the plasticrack ones broSRM mentioned) if they want to attract new players and not just double dip their old ones.



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 02:41:46


Post by: yeenoghu


I liked the ral partha figs long ago. They existed long before the standard became all exaggerated like modern figs, so we don't get gun barrels the size of heads or anything like that, but the old ral parthas had decent sculpting I thought, they just weren't flamboyant or action posed or anything like we are used to.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 02:42:46


Post by: Mattlov


warboss wrote:
Kalamadea wrote:Besides, a decent coat of paint on those mechs makes all the differance in the world. A camo scheme, a few highlights, and a heavy coat of GW wash and they look just fine.


lol, that technique doesn't work with really ugly women nor does it work on really ugly minis. i realize that nostalgia is a powerful thing but wow... battletech needs to incorporate modern sculpting styles into their minis (like some of the plasticrack ones broSRM mentioned) if they want to attract new players and not just double dip their old ones.



Key thing is, those minis are just candy. You don't like them? You don't need minis at all to play Battletech on a hex map. Just a counter to identify it, and a way to tell what way it is facing. Battletech is really one of the easiest high quality games to get into.

Intro Box, which you don't even need! You can download Quick Start rules for free!

The only thing you HAVE to spend money on is mapsheets. That's it. And there is a program called Heavy Metal Map which lets you print your own!

Solaris Skunk Werks is free 'Mech creation software.

Say you want the full Tournament Rules. You buy Total Warfare.

So a Mapsheet compilation you can find on Ebay, and Total Warfare. $70 is all you need to invest and play this game forever. You already downloaded Quick Start for free to get used to the game.

That doesn't even get you a starter box for 40K, let alone a playable army with a codex. Battletech wins.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 03:01:26


Post by: warboss


Mattlov wrote:Key thing is, those minis are just candy. You don't like them? You don't need minis at all to play Battletech on a hex map. Just a counter to identify it, and a way to tell what way it is facing. Battletech is really one of the easiest high quality games to get into.

Intro Box, which you don't even need! You can download Quick Start rules for free!

The only thing you HAVE to spend money on is mapsheets. That's it. And there is a program called Heavy Metal Map which lets you print your own!

Solaris Skunk Werks is free 'Mech creation software.

Say you want the full Tournament Rules. You buy Total Warfare.

So a Mapsheet compilation you can find on Ebay, and Total Warfare. $70 is all you need to invest and play this game forever. You already downloaded Quick Start for free to get used to the game.

That doesn't even get you a starter box for 40K, let alone a playable army with a codex. Battletech wins.


first off, it's not a contest so battletech doesn't "win" anything. the two games are completely separate subgenres (large mechs with occassional infantry vs lots of infantry with occasional mech) that aren't really in competition with each other except in your own post. heavy gear.. sure.. that's a competitor. cav.. sure assuming its still in print (haven't seen or heard about it in years). epic is the closest thing in the GW series of games to it and that comparison is a stretch.

what you described is possible but the VAST MAJORITY of players will spend alot more as one of the biggest draws to playing a tabletop game is to see pretty minis on an actual table with terrain. you can technically play 40k with a $15 small rulebook, some paper terrain, and a bunch of skittles vs m&m's as armies but that doesn't mean the vast majority of people want to. those of us who are NOT battletech players are generally saying that this anniversary set fails to interest us in the game and are giving the reasons why. you can disagree with those reasons but the game you are obviously so passionate about isn't going to grow unless new players replace the vets who die or move on to other games. battletech has gone from the number one minis game with a lucrative videogame and book license to a game that is usually referred to in the past tense as an inspiration for the current popular ones.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 03:08:54


Post by: thefiddler


The minis can look decent with paint. For examples go to http://www.camospecs.com/MiniList.asp and search for "Beginners Set". As others have said, the Loki and Thor mechs that come in the set are high quality. Here is a picture of the plastic Thor painted up on camospecs: http://www.camospecs.com/Miniature.asp?ID=5042


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 03:23:02


Post by: H.B.M.C.


warboss wrote:battletech needs to incorporate modern sculpting styles into their minis (like some of the plasticrack ones broSRM mentioned) if they want to attract new players and not just double dip their old ones.


Except that they don’t, because Catalyst are not in the business of making miniatures. The aim of the StarterBox the same as it has always been since the very first ones that came with miniatures – to get people started with some very simple plastic ‘Mechs to represent the 24 types in the box. These are cheap and cheerful one-piece (in some cases two-piece) plastic ‘Mechs to get players started. And what has been said about them not being required is true. Two different versions of the 4th Ed box had card-board stand-ups, and I’ve played many a’game with them as my ‘miniatures’.

For some of it they are victims of circumstance. The two ‘premium’ plastic ‘Mechs are far more advanced than the basic ones, but they are only in the box as a sort of conciliation prize. We would have got new plastics of the old classics had the 25th anniversary Unseen-to-Reseen thing not been messed up at the last moment.

The actual miniature manufacturer is Iron Wind Metals, who do all the ‘Mechs/Vehicles/Aerospace Fighters/Star Ships/etc. in metal. Now they don’t have the world’s greatest quality control in the world, and there’s a decided ‘scale creep’ that has permeated releases over the past couple of years, but they are the ones to talk to about this. Catalyst has done the ‘premium’ plastics as a test, and that’s as far as it’s gone – a test. Whether it amounts to anything in the future, such as a full range of multi-part plastics, has yet to be seen.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 03:30:08


Post by: warboss


thefiddler wrote:The minis can look decent with paint. For examples go to http://www.camospecs.com/MiniList.asp and search for "Beginners Set". As others have said, the Loki and Thor mechs that come in the set are high quality. Here is a picture of the plastic Thor painted up on camospecs: http://www.camospecs.com/Miniature.asp?ID=5042


while there are some truly nice paintjobs shown there that display alot of skill and effort, there is no amount of polishing that will take the stink of the turd design that is the mech below...



this one is included in the starter (and so included in the anniversary set). is this really one of the first impressions you want the company to make on prospective new players?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 03:30:30


Post by: Kalamadea


warboss wrote:
Kalamadea wrote:Besides, a decent coat of paint on those mechs makes all the differance in the world. A camo scheme, a few highlights, and a heavy coat of GW wash and they look just fine.


lol, that technique doesn't work with really ugly women nor does it work on really ugly minis. i realize that nostalgia is a powerful thing but wow... battletech needs to incorporate modern sculpting styles into their minis (like some of the plasticrack ones broSRM mentioned) if they want to attract new players and not just double dip their old ones.



Far from my best minis, but they were quick and look fine from 2 feet away. All I did was prime grey, paint them vallejo buff, paint some vallejo medium green and gw calthan brown cammo patterns, light drybrush of dheneb stone then heavy wash of devlan mud, base and g2g.


http://www.pbase.com/emberviii/image/132904519/original

These I spent a little more time on mostly becuase they were done before GW washes. Not gonna win any contests, but even the old plastics look ok with a coat of proper paint, which is my point. Maybe it's just polishing a turd, but it turns out you can make it a bit shiny after all.


http://www.pbase.com/image/132904521

Again, nothing outstanding but they like just fine 2 feet away on the table.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 03:47:17


Post by: warboss


Kalamadea wrote:[
http://www.pbase.com/image/132904520

Again, nothing outstanding but they like just fine 2 feet away on the table.


my problem isn't with the battletech paint jobs (which are nice, both yours and the camospec ones) but the actual mini designs which i find ugly. you've posted the only ones other than the madcat that i like (namely the ones that were macross designs and NOT created by FASA/battletech originally). i'm not actively trying to dislike the game (i've given it two separate tries in two separate decades and absolutely loved playing the mechwarrior 1 and 2 PC games as a kid) but the minis and rules have stayed *roughly* the same over that 20 year time span. i think they'd do better in attracting new players by included some of the prepainted plastic designs which seem like more modern designs from a quick look on google images... but then they'd risk alienating those who have stuck with them over the years. it's a double edged sword and no one knows which method would be more successful over the long term. catalyst have chosen the safe route (catering to existing players) much like palladium books does with their rpgs.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 04:16:54


Post by: thefiddler


The designs actually are evolving. If you look through the newer Technical Readouts, like 3085 for instance, you see that the aesthetic is sort of moving in that direction (though some clicky tech stuff is pretty ridiculous, like designs with exposed ammo belts, horrible idea...). The reason these designs that come in the box are still the same, is because during that time period (3025) the technology was simpler, and thus easier for a new player to learn the game with. IWM also does make lance packs with newer mechs that have pretty paint jobs on the covers, though these go for about $40, which is steep for a new player and you only get 4 mechs.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 04:40:33


Post by: Kalamadea


@Warboss: then you're having a completely seperate argument. There's no arguing against personal preferance, beauty and eyes and beholders and all that jazz. If you don't like the actual designs of this line of giant space robots then you don't like the designs, and there's plenty of other giant space robot games that should better suit your preferred aesthetics. But, you're arguing your opinion as fact instead of opinion when you say "that stink of a turd design", when the miniature that follows that design is actually not that bad, and the paint on it is prety darn nice. The design is neither here nor there, we're discussing how well the models follow that design and my point was that while the miniatures aren't that great, the models can look passable with a little love.

What you just described as the direction Btech should go is exactly what they already did with Mechwarrior: Dark Ages that wizkids made. They redesigned a lot of the mechs and vehicles for a more modern, often anime-inspired look, the models were prepainted just like you said, and the game was heavily streamlined to play much, much faster. And some of the new desings were awesomely cool (insert an IMHO here). It worked, it was pretty popular especially in some gaming circles, but it was a differant game entirely.

Which is exactly where this intro set comes into play. There is a reason the website is called classicbatletech.com, it was named that after the prepainted line came out becuase a lot of the older players still enjoyed the original game as it originally existed. It would be like GW (or actually, licensing it off and another company) rereleasing the old Rogue Trader. Some people would love it, some would complain that the rules were clunky and the designs outdated and should be modernized, but thats not what Rogue Trader was. They released new editions of 40k, with newer models and streamlined rules. But it's not the same game. Nor is it meant to be. Nor is classic battletech meant to be mechwarrior: DA either.

So is Battletech a good game and more importantly a good set? I argue yes, not becuase I like the game (I obviously do) but based on the numbers of sets I have seen people buy, seen people try out, and seen people stick with and continue to play and enjoy. I personally thought mechwarrior: DA was a terrible game, but enough people played it and had fun with it that I can't really say it was a bad game, just not a game i enjoyed playing.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 05:18:28


Post by: warboss


a much better reasoned post than the last and i agree with most of your points (the mini design i posted IS a turd though.. ). the thing for me is that i WANT to like battletech as i do have some nostalgia for it (specifically the novels and pc games on floppy discs!) but each new version of it just feels to this particular outsider as more of the same stuff that i didn't like in the first place. i keep hoping for a meaningful change to the tabletop minis game but i agree that the change i'm looking for would cease any claim to still be "classic" btech.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 05:25:54


Post by: megatrons2nd


I believe newer products are removing the "classic" from the title. The last I remember hearing was that the death of Clickytech somehow freed up the Battletech title again so the Classic could be axed. I would have to do a bit more searching to be sure.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 05:56:27


Post by: paulson games


As far as the game play I think battletech is one of the best miniature games ever printed. I only bashed the new cover as they are trying to repackage classic battletech when all of the original "classic" mech designs have been removed. Other than being a flavor change it doesn't impact the games playability at all, the rules are still great and don't fall into the traps that other game systems suffer from. As all mech follow standard construction rules there's no codex creep, or tons of specialty rules that bog it down like 40k or WM/hordes.

I love the old macross/robotech mecha and wish they could have kept them, but that out of their hands to control.

Some of the models may look a bit dated but many of them are between 20-25 years old. In compairision those rogue trader era marines don't look so hot either, the differance is that GW has updated marines a few times since, where many of the classic BT models have never seen a revised model. The clan mechs which were released in the 90s are usually much better sculpts. Some of the new ironwind metal models are good, the majority are hit and miss.

The upside is the minis are much cheaper than GW or PP, I was looking over battletech stuff at the local store and could find plety of models in the $8-10 range, hell will freeze over before you find those type of prices at the GW bunkers.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 06:05:03


Post by: thefiddler


My point was that some of them have seen redesigns. Pretty much all of the unseens have (for legal reasons) and even some of the other old ones. For example take the Panther, one of the mechs that come in the box set.

Here is the version from TRO 3050 (looks almost exactly the same as the 3025 version):

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/File:3050U_Panther.jpg


And then the version from 3085:

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/FileNT-13K_Panther.jpg


Or the Wolfhound:

Old (3025)
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/File:Wolfhound.jpg

And new (3085)
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/File:WLF-5_Wolfhound.jpg


There is a very noticeable difference and change in aesthetic. Many designs got similar treatment in 3085 and now it just comes down to IWM making new sculpts for these. Though Catalyst, as you can see, is moving the aesthetic forward.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 07:25:24


Post by: NecronLord3


Mattlov wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:Wow. Whole lotta hate going on this this thread. If you don't like BattleTech, that's cool. But please, let you're opinion-as-fact bull-gak at the door.


I know. Especially the "OMG it is so hard to play!" people.

It is simple math. Can you add from 0-14? And read a page of charts? That is really all Battletech takes. It isn't hard.


Many aspects of Battletech are hardly 'simple math'. The math may be easy but making sure you are doing it correctly, can be tricky. Not to mention if you actually wanted to build a mech using the Tech manual. There is so much errata on that book that is pretty much impossible for the average person to every think about doing themselves.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 08:34:58


Post by: H.B.M.C.


There are free programs that take that problem away, and the TechManual isn't required to play the game.


Really, it must be some sort of unspoken Dakka Lore that makes BattleTech a pariah that cannot be enjoyed by anyone, lest they have picked nits thrust upon them...


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 09:10:55


Post by: yeenoghu


The mini you posted is called a Jagermech, and that's an excellent representation of a mech that really is that ugly. Nobody I ever played with could stand that thing, and not just on an aesthetic level. It's performance in a game is about as attractive as how it looks. Still, for every one like that, there's a lot of extremely slick looking designs.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 09:29:33


Post by: Brother SRM


H.B.M.C., I thank you for being the recurring voice of reason in this thread, righting wrongs and doing good, like the half brother of a certain chapter master we know

I'm honestly looking forward to this, even if I know the models won't be of the best quality. Worst case scenario I buy metal replacements from IWM. Battletech was simple enough for me to play as a 10 year old, and I'm sure now that I'm twice that age I'll enjoy it even more.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 09:45:01


Post by: outriderhobbies


Well, I had to chime in on this. I found Battletech in '88 because I loved Robotech. This was a game that used the same figures, but was easier to figure out than an RPG.

I haven't played in years, but I did play a lot of MechWarrior Dark Age. It's still in my garage too.

Anyways, my point being, a friend of mine and I are working on making cloth maps with 2" hexes (the size of a MW mech base), some acrylic hexes to transfer the figures to, and some terrain tiles to modify the playing area similar to the hex pack map tiles.

Who knows, if others are interested I may be willing to make some extras.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 10:34:39


Post by: Iandroid


I can't believe they wouldn't put the Madcat there.... it's like the most trademark mech period.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 10:39:39


Post by: yeenoghu


I like the mech, but I never liked the way it looked. I will always think of the Atlas as the most trademark mech, but I started playing before madcats existed, so I have old-dude bias. It has a skull head that looks like a pool cue, how cool is that?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 11:20:19


Post by: BAWTRM


warboss wrote:
while there are some truly nice paintjobs shown there that display alot of skill and effort, there is no amount of polishing that will take the stink of the turd design that is the mech below...





Yes it's a turd, a beautiful glorious turd!! What more may you expect from a mech that's basically a walking AA-turret and shouldn't find itself in a mech vs mech fight ever?

It's hideous and I love it for that.

As for iconic mech, yeah the Timberwolf is very iconic but wouldn't be right on the front of a box containing mostly Inner Sphere 3025 mechs. The Warhammer is an icon for me (but for obvious reasons not featured) and it wasn't even on the cover of the edition I first bought (there was just an edition transition because I remember the Warhammer box lying in the store, maybe we're just GW brainwashed to like anything with the name 'Warhammer' ). Can't really remember what was on the front of that box though, a Zeus maybe?

So what more is iconic and not unseen or clan? Atlas (love the description Yeenoghu), Zeus, Commando, Catapult, Jenner for me. They'd fit well on any cover I think.

Something a bit related. Weren't there plans on producing a box containing the 3050 Clan Mechs (with apparently no Fire Moth but an Elemental point instead), what has become of this?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 11:32:35


Post by: yeenoghu


Its got nothing on the Stalker though. Big dildo with legs. They should have made that one of the premium mech figures just for laughs.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 11:34:06


Post by: BAWTRM


Or the Imp because it looks like some kind of 'dark place' plug.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 12:00:35


Post by: Capt_Bowman


The Mad-Cat is only a recognised mech because the computer games made it so. Pre-Clan you're looking at Warhammers, Marauders, Atlases (Atli?) and BAttlemasters. The old school heavy hitters.

That being said every one has their favourite mech and for different reasons. I love the unseen, 3025 Shadowrhawk as it as the first mech I ever piloted. It's a hunk of junk compared to other mechs. Under armed, under armoured.... but it was a still a viable unit in a 3025 game. The Battlemaster ranks highly as well as it is what I moved on to after the Shad.

From a fluff / universe POV you can't find many other games that rival BattleTech for the scope of the universe. You can follow the characters, plot on a map where the battles take place and watch as it expands from petty border raids to galaxy spanning wars and back again.

Do I think the game is without fault? No. The latest books have become a bit clunky, the new technology perhaps a little over powered. But, and it's a big but, it has lasted 25+ years without a significant change to the game mechanic (I still calculate the to hit rolls using the method I learned 20ish years ago). It's not as complex as some people make out if you play the basic game rules to start with. If you're crazy enough to jump into the expert rules on day one you deserve to struggle. But working from the basic game mechanic...

A Wasp is shooting at an Atlas (one of the smallest mechs firing at one of the heaviest in existence)

The wasp (gunnery skill 3) fires it's medium laser. He is at 4 hexes from the target (medium range), He moved 7 hexes (running) and the atlas moved 3 hexes forward.

The hit number is Base 6 (medium) +2 for running, +1 for the target movement (taken from a table) and -1 for each point the gunnery skill is below 4. For a total of 8... It's as simple as that. Roll 2D6, get 8 or more and you hit the target. (the other way to calculate is Base = gunnery skill, + 2 for medium rage, + 2 fore running, + 1 for target movement =8 )

Heat is just as easy. Each weapon has a heat value, each movement mode has a heat value, and each mech has a heat capacity. you add up all the heat you generate, you subtract the heat you can dissipate.... anything left over carries over to the next turn.

Yes, some mechs are more complex, weapons with multiple modes, technology that lets your mech do something that will affect your ability to hit / move / dissipate heat. But those are in the advanced rules in a lot of cases. just don;t play them until you're comfortable with the basics and you're fine.

Best way to learn to play? Pick up the box set, better yet pick up an old copy of the old edition with 3025 only and play a bit with the basic rules and don't be seduced by the shiny clan / 3050 / WOB tech.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 14:45:43


Post by: ToBeWilly


What is the unseen? I haven't played a game of Battletech since '91, so I'm a little out of the loop. I loved it though, I'm looking forward to picking this up and playing again.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 14:47:51


Post by: deleted20250424


I love the Imp!

The fact it looks like a basketball with arms is 50% of the charm.

Intersting Note: I used to game with Chris Lewis, the guy that drew many of those mechs, out in Los Angeles at Brookhurst Hobbies.

Great guy. Although he took a lot of community flak during Project Pheonix. I still think his art is amazing.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 15:23:21


Post by: Balance


ToBeWilly wrote:What is the unseen? I haven't played a game of Battletech since '91, so I'm a little out of the loop. I loved it though, I'm looking forward to picking this up and playing again.


Designs FASA is no longer allowed to use as the licensing is 'confused.' There's about thirty versions of it up-thread, but basically they licensed designs, then something went wrong (quite possibly not really FASA's fault) and lawsuits were initiated, sot hey can't show these designs any more. These were primarily the designs that were licensed from Macross and a few other anme shows. Some have had the licensing worked out, some have been re-designed to be uninfringing.



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 15:49:19


Post by: ToBeWilly


Balance wrote:Designs FASA is no longer allowed to use as the licensing is 'confused.' There's about thirty versions of it up-thread, but basically they licensed designs, then something went wrong (quite possibly not really FASA's fault) and lawsuits were initiated, sot hey can't show these designs any more. These were primarily the designs that were licensed from Macross and a few other anme shows. Some have had the licensing worked out, some have been re-designed to be uninfringing.


So all those 'Mechs are referred to as 'unseen'. Got it, thanks!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 17:16:06


Post by: Mad4Minis


NecronLord3 wrote: Not to mention if you actually wanted to build a mech using the Tech manual. There is so much errata on that book that is pretty much impossible for the average person to every think about doing themselves.



There is a program called Heavy Metal Pro. Its an offical licensed product for BT so everything is 100% rules proper. It is a complete mech design workshop. You can choose tech base (IS or clan), tech level by year (3025, 3055, etc), and also by game play level (1,2,3). You have complete control of tonnage, weapons, crit locations, armor, everything. It can be expanded to add in vehicles, battle armor, and infantry. You can print the record sheet right from the program, and they look exactly like Battletech sheets. As a bonus it comes with 500 standard mech designs already loaded.

The base program CD is a whopping $22, so not much excuse for at least 1 person in any BT group to have it.

Heres a link: http://www.heavymetalpro.com/index.html


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 17:16:12


Post by: Kalamadea


And the redesigned versions of those mechs are called "reseen", some of which are stinkers, some are quite cool in their own right, but all are differant enough from the originals that you usually need to be told what they are, and only then you start recognizing weapon layouts. I'm particularly fond of the new marauder and variants, and the new warhammer is very nice (though nowhere near as cool as the original.

I rather like the new box art, myself. Pays homage to the older editition but is recognizably differant. I find it interesting they chose the hammerhands mech instead of the reseen warhammer, although the hammerhands does have more design features in common than the reseen warhammer does for the reasons I mentioned.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 17:36:47


Post by: Balance


yeenoghu wrote:Not really. Btech wasn't about collecting miniatures. In 40k you invest a lot of $$$ into a specific army, only to have something else come along and make it obsolete by comparison. Clan stuff upped the power level of the entire game, not just some specific players. If Btech could have codex creep, it would be like saying only Clan Wolf gets pulse lasers while clan bear gets ultra cannons or something like that. The technology and the rules are available to all players of all factions. Through inventive roleplaying 'fluff' plenty of IS forces had clan technology, even if fluffy it was rare, if you wanted a good game you don't just say 'you get 4 mechs and I get 4 mechs, you look at the BV of those mechs for an even match. Clan will always be outnumbered because their mechs are worth more.


That still seems a bit awkward. When I played BT many years ago the BV system was either unavailable or not used: everyone seemed to go by raw tonnage. As such, there was no real balancing for the Clan vs. IS stuff. Every time I look in on the BT community, the Clans seem to be a very divisive issue. It's not Codex Creep in the way GW does it, and not quite in the way Warmachine gets complaints about (new books favoring new unit types, but it's a little better since generally everyone gets new stuff), but there is a lot of evidence that it is a very big divisive junction for the community.

yeenoghu wrote:
The huge difference is in the investment. GWs WYSIWYG does not apply to a game that is more rules focused and less miniatures focused. Any player can play any mech. Scenarios dictate the mechs, not which figure collection you have. There is no codex creep in btech, just a choice of which rules you like to play. If you play 3055, double HS and XL engines exist and clan weapons are lighter and better than IS versions, if you play 3025 they haven't arrived yet, if you play 3065+ all sorts of other goodies are available, to anyone. This is not an option for someone with $2000 worth of figures having to say their Necrons are now Space Wolves because they like those rules better.


Fair enough.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 17:40:15


Post by: NecronLord3


Mad4Minis wrote:
NecronLord3 wrote: Not to mention if you actually wanted to build a mech using the Tech manual. There is so much errata on that book that is pretty much impossible for the average person to every think about doing themselves.



There is a program called Heavy Metal Pro. Its an offical licensed product for BT so everything is 100% rules proper. It is a complete mech design workshop. You can choose tech base (IS or clan), tech level by year (3025, 3055, etc), and also by game play level (1,2,3). You have complete control of tonnage, weapons, crit locations, armor, everything. It can be expanded to add in vehicles, battle armor, and infantry. You can print the record sheet right from the program, and they look exactly like Battletech sheets. As a bonus it comes with 500 standard mech designs already loaded.

The base program CD is a whopping $22, so not much excuse for at least 1 person in any BT group to have it.

Heres a link: http://www.heavymetalpro.com/index.html


Which hasn't been updated since BV2 was designed so the new equipment is incompatible with the program. Rick Raisley and his HM programs is one the biggest problems with Battletech to date. He hasn't come out with a fully updated program in 6 years. Hence why Solaris Skunk Works was developed by fans because Heavy Metal is so worthless and Raisley completely dropped the ball.

HBMC you still fail to realize that it is a big problem when you have to use an unofficial product just to use one element of the game. Mech design is one major element of the game that if it wasn't done for you by other people the game would be pretty screwed.

Balance wrote:
That still seems a bit awkward. When I played BT many years ago the BV system was either unavailable or not used: everyone seemed to go by raw tonnage. As such, there was no real balancing for the Clan vs. IS stuff. Every time I look in on the BT community, the Clans seem to be a very divisive issue. It's not Codex Creep in the way GW does it, and not quite in the way Warmachine gets complaints about (new books favoring new unit types, but it's a little better since generally everyone gets new stuff), but there is a lot of evidence that it is a very big divisive junction for the community.


The game is still horribly unbalanced. Just play a Hellion C(light) Vs a Sagittarire(Assault), both have damn near the same BV and the Hellion will lose everytime. And on the flip side if you play tonnage a Hellion will usually beat another light mech everytime.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 17:49:15


Post by: deleted20250424


I wasn't aware that people went 1 v 1 in Battletech, outside of playing a Solaris match.

No system is perfect.

Some just have less flaws than others.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 17:57:02


Post by: kronk


My current character runs around in a Stealth STH-1D

It doesn't have a lot of firepower, but my job is to scout and find hidden enemy units, pick off stragglers, and try not to get killed. The third part is important.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 18:08:35


Post by: Mad4Minis


NecronLord3 wrote:
Mad4Minis wrote:
NecronLord3 wrote: Not to mention if you actually wanted to build a mech using the Tech manual. There is so much errata on that book that is pretty much impossible for the average person to every think about doing themselves.



There is a program called Heavy Metal Pro. Its an offical licensed product for BT so everything is 100% rules proper. It is a complete mech design workshop. You can choose tech base (IS or clan), tech level by year (3025, 3055, etc), and also by game play level (1,2,3). You have complete control of tonnage, weapons, crit locations, armor, everything. It can be expanded to add in vehicles, battle armor, and infantry. You can print the record sheet right from the program, and they look exactly like Battletech sheets. As a bonus it comes with 500 standard mech designs already loaded.

The base program CD is a whopping $22, so not much excuse for at least 1 person in any BT group to have it.

Heres a link: http://www.heavymetalpro.com/index.html


Which hasn't been updated since BV2 was designed so the new equipment is incompatible with the program. Rick Raisley and his HM programs is one the biggest problems with Battletech to date. He hasn't come out with a fully updated program in 6 years. Hence why Solaris Skunk Works was developed by fans because Heavy Metal is so worthless and Raisley completely dropped the ball.

HBMC you still fail to realize that it is a big problem when you have to use an unofficial product just to use one element of the game. Mech design is one major element of the game that if it wasn't done for you by other people the game would be pretty screwed.

Balance wrote:
That still seems a bit awkward. When I played BT many years ago the BV system was either unavailable or not used: everyone seemed to go by raw tonnage. As such, there was no real balancing for the Clan vs. IS stuff. Every time I look in on the BT community, the Clans seem to be a very divisive issue. It's not Codex Creep in the way GW does it, and not quite in the way Warmachine gets complaints about (new books favoring new unit types, but it's a little better since generally everyone gets new stuff), but there is a lot of evidence that it is a very big divisive junction for the community.


The game is still horribly unbalanced. Just play a Hellion C(light) Vs a Sagittarire(Assault), both have damn near the same BV and the Hellion will lose everytime. And on the flip side if you play tonnage a Hellion will usually beat another light mech everytime.



Ok, then let me modify my comment a bit...for anyone who wants to use 3025-3055ish tech Heavy Metal pro is great. If you want the latest most up to date stuff then its not that good. However, since most seem to like the 3055 or earlier era, HMP will do them just fine and is a great value for those who want to do a lot of designing and tweaking.


On the BV note...it has always sucked. Almost no one uses BV more than once. It is easily the most flawed part of the game system, and a good thing its optional. Besides, balanced battles are for tournaments. Regular BT games are the most fun when the mechs (on paper) are unbalanced and the scenario conditions are used to balance the fight. Those are the most fun games.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 18:37:23


Post by: yeenoghu


Balance wrote:
yeenoghu wrote:Not really. Btech wasn't about collecting miniatures. In 40k you invest a lot of $$$ into a specific army, only to have something else come along and make it obsolete by comparison. Clan stuff upped the power level of the entire game, not just some specific players. If Btech could have codex creep, it would be like saying only Clan Wolf gets pulse lasers while clan bear gets ultra cannons or something like that. The technology and the rules are available to all players of all factions. Through inventive roleplaying 'fluff' plenty of IS forces had clan technology, even if fluffy it was rare, if you wanted a good game you don't just say 'you get 4 mechs and I get 4 mechs, you look at the BV of those mechs for an even match. Clan will always be outnumbered because their mechs are worth more.


That still seems a bit awkward. When I played BT many years ago the BV system was either unavailable or not used: everyone seemed to go by raw tonnage. As such, there was no real balancing for the Clan vs. IS stuff. Every time I look in on the BT community, the Clans seem to be a very divisive issue. It's not Codex Creep in the way GW does it, and not quite in the way Warmachine gets complaints about (new books favoring new unit types, but it's a little better since generally everyone gets new stuff), but there is a lot of evidence that it is a very big divisive junction for the community.

yeenoghu wrote:
The huge difference is in the investment. GWs WYSIWYG does not apply to a game that is more rules focused and less miniatures focused. Any player can play any mech. Scenarios dictate the mechs, not which figure collection you have. There is no codex creep in btech, just a choice of which rules you like to play. If you play 3055, double HS and XL engines exist and clan weapons are lighter and better than IS versions, if you play 3025 they haven't arrived yet, if you play 3065+ all sorts of other goodies are available, to anyone. This is not an option for someone with $2000 worth of figures having to say their Necrons are now Space Wolves because they like those rules better.


Fair enough.


The clan thing is divisive because when the rules for better, heat efficient longer range guns on faster mechs with more armor piloted by genetically engineered super-pilots - it changed the way the game was played. moving 10/15/0 was unheard of before XL engines and such showed up. It isn't divisive like SMs complaining that SWs are more powerful. Everybody know the clans have a sloped technological high ground, there is no farcical claim that 'points value equal means evenly matched' like in GW codex creep. They have a rating for mechs called BV (battle value) which incorporates size, movement, armor, weapon systems, and heat efficiency for an overall view of a mech's performance. Many mechs of less tons have higher BV than some of the really poorly designed heavy mechs (That 65 ton Jagermech from earlier in this post has a lower BV than most mechs at 50 tons for instance, because it is such an unwieldy design). Clan technology weapons have a higher BV rating than IS weapons of the same class, so it is easy to set up 'even' matchups (usually involving about a 2-1 numerical advantage for the IS).

The divisive thing among the community is that many people did not like the game-on-steroids of clan tech rules. It isn't a complaint that clans have better stuff, it's that they don't like playing the cheesey glass-cannon style quick fix style of clan games, and like myself, prefer the clunky imperfect mechs for a longer, more interesting game. Clan games are not as tactically interesting because everyone is so damn good that things like careful management of heat problems, optimized weapon ranges, cover, use of water holes or buildings and so on play less important roles, and you may as well just be running around and around in circles trading dice rolls at each other (similar to the way MW video games are played).


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 18:58:54


Post by: Necros


I'd love to see an all new battletech update.. well maybe the rules could stay similar but all new models. Make em multi part where the model is just the legs and body, and all different arm weapons to choose from. New, modern sculpts by people who are good at sculpting and all that stuff.

Some of the iron wind models look ok but the old stuff really shows it's age. Make some awesome looking models and nerds like us will buy lots of em.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 20:35:14


Post by: aka_mythos


Necros wrote:I'd love to see an all new battletech update.. well maybe the rules could stay similar but all new models. Make em multi part where the model is just the legs and body, and all different arm weapons to choose from. New, modern sculpts by people who are good at sculpting and all that stuff.
The "2 unpainted, premium-quality plastic BattleMech minis" are exactly that. It was a test to see how viable what you're saying was. This will only really work with the Omni-mechs and not so much with the more rigded innersphere designs.

Necros wrote:Some of the iron wind models look ok but the old stuff really shows it's age. Make some awesome looking models and nerds like us will buy lots of em.
I don't believe they created the original sculpts for all of these.... and I know they've been working their way through the range redoing some of the fuglier sculpts.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 20:55:26


Post by: robertsjf


aka_mythos wrote:This will only really work with the Omni-mechs and not so much with the more rigded innersphere designs.


Wha? Are we talking about the same inner sphere mechs that have like a bajillion variants?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 21:10:07


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Mad4Minis wrote:There is a program called Heavy Metal Pro. Its an offical licensed product for BT so everything is 100% rules proper.


Well... was. It's been a while since it was updated. Better to stick to Solaris Skunk Works, which is free and more up-to-date.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
NecronLord3 wrote:HBMC you still fail to realize that it is a big problem when you have to use an unofficial product just to use one element of the game. Mech design is one major element of the game that if it wasn't done for you by other people the game would be pretty screwed.


I've never heard of anyone having a problem designing 'Mechs, and people have been doing it for decades now. More and more homebrew 'Mechs appear all the time. You are exaggerating this problem.

NecronLord3 wrote:The game is still horribly unbalanced. Just play a Hellion C(light) Vs a Sagittarire(Assault), both have damn near the same BV and the Hellion will lose everytime. And on the flip side if you play tonnage a Hellion will usually beat another light mech everytime.


BV was invented because the fanbase called for it. The powers that be still don't like it, and while they're attempting to fix it with BV2, they still don't like it as a concept because they'd rather no boil everything in the game down to a points value. BattleTech fiction is all about uneven match-ups, white washes and underdogs. Crow-barring a points system into the game at an attempt at creating 'balance' was a bad idea to begin with, and remains so.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 21:22:24


Post by: Lord_Astaroth


I'm gonna have to cut you off on that one H.B.M.C. It is getting updated as we speak. My father is the developer of the program, and he's been working on it quite a bit. Real life tends to put things on hold for a little bit sometimes. SSW is alright, of course I'm biased to HMPro. HeavyMetal Pro 6 shouldn't be too much longer really. Lots of red tape getting everything correct. He and I have been playtesters for Battletech since about 1995 in the days of FASA, and we've been playing since 1989.

Alot of work goes into those programs, and the code doesn't always come quickly. HMPro6 will be the basis for the new series of programs that are planned to be released, such as Vee, Lite, Aero, and Battle Armor. Much of the code of those progams comes from the original.



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 21:28:20


Post by: Mattlov


We know Rick Raisley works hard on the HM stuff (and I fully accept your bias) but we can't believe "shouldn't be too much longer" anymore.

I like HMP better than SSW myself, but TW came out on 2006. He's almost FIVE YEARS behind the curve. I can appreciate life getting in the way and all, but the job should have been passed to someone who could dedicate to it full time.

I look at it this way: If you were behind that far for a project at work, do you think your company should still keep you on the job, or even keep you employed?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 21:29:30


Post by: ThirdUltra


H.B.M.C. wrote:
Mad4Minis wrote:There is a program called Heavy Metal Pro. Its an offical licensed product for BT so everything is 100% rules proper.


Well... was. It's been a while since it was updated. Better to stick to Solaris Skunk Works, which is free and more up-to-date.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
NecronLord3 wrote:HBMC you still fail to realize that it is a big problem when you have to use an unofficial product just to use one element of the game. Mech design is one major element of the game that if it wasn't done for you by other people the game would be pretty screwed.


I've never heard of anyone having a problem designing 'Mechs, and people have been doing it for decades now. More and more homebrew 'Mechs appear all the time. You are exaggerating this problem.

NecronLord3 wrote:The game is still horribly unbalanced. Just play a Hellion C(light) Vs a Sagittarire(Assault), both have damn near the same BV and the Hellion will lose everytime. And on the flip side if you play tonnage a Hellion will usually beat another light mech everytime.


BV was invented because the fanbase called for it. The powers that be still don't like it, and while they're attempting to fix it with BV2, they still don't like it as a concept because they'd rather no boil everything in the game down to a points value. BattleTech fiction is all about uneven match-ups, white washes and underdogs. Crow-barring a points system into the game at an attempt at creating 'balance' was a bad idea to begin with, and remains so.



Agree with all of your points HBMC; since '87, when I began playing Battletech, mech design was pretty simple and formulated well enough that anyone could do it. Come circa '90 with the 3050 release with new equipment, it was updated a bit, but still easy enough.

As far as HMPro goes, I use it, but only for the periods it has listed in its databse. It's good if you want to run from 3025-3060 roughly, but that's about the extent of the program as others have mentioned, it hasn't been updated in roughly 6 years.

The BV 2.0 system isn't so bad, if that's what you're looking for in a tourney setting, but you're right-on with the square-peg/round-hole idea of trying to jam a 'balance' style system into it.
The game is exactly how you describe it; uneven matchups where skill (reg, vet, elites) and maneuver decides some of the outcomes. Additionally, the system allows for 'lucky' shots that are disabling to an opposing mech. This is something other game-systems do not allow for. I can't count the times where an outclassed mech got the 3-crit 'lucky' hit on a center-torso of an opposing mech which shutdown to those 3-engine hits or some cooked-off ammunition cassette that was slotted there...lol!

A group of players can easily pick the rules they want to run with in their system, so like I've mentioned before, it is what you make of it.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 21:37:38


Post by: yeenoghu


Regarding the designers not wanting BV. I agree. I think it's cool that Jaime Wolf piloted an Archer of all things. Not a horrible mech but not exactly the most flashy mech either. Rhonda Snord and a Shadowhawk, Natasha K in a Warhammer. Not top of the line state of the art elite technology, just mechs.

The game was created during the classical age of tabletop and paper and pencil games. Advanced Dungeons and Dragons era, when gameplay, scenarios, and balance were up to a DM or referee. U.S. Civil War battles refought with miniatures (yeah the south and the north both had the same number of points for their armies, right?)

This concept escapes people who have to play competatively by precise rules, and need a system to spell out what 'sportsmanship' points are awarded for. The idea of scenario/situational gaming is kind of lost on the newer generation of win/loss ratio competative matchup thinking gaming.

Since there was no such thing as a tournament circuit that needed specific points balance from one game to the next to keep the anal competition bureaucrats from whining, a scenario was how you played. Barring that, players just agreed on what would make for a fun matchup.

The BV thing emerged around the same time as MtG became popular in its first inception. Suddenly, competative win/loss ratio became the only way to play at cons. and BV was a wayto attempt to standardize matchups. Coincidence?

Tonnage is nowhere near as good a way to express a mech's value. The poor 65 ton Jagermech (I know I'm beating this guy to death) doesn't stand a chance against a 65 ton Crusader or Thunderbolt, not even with extreme luck or skill.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 21:41:19


Post by: H.B.M.C.


No, you're right, there's nothing 'wrong' with BV2. As far as systems go it works well enough. It's just not required IMO, and I tend to ignore it.

Lord_Astaroth wrote:I'm gonna have to cut you off on that one H.B.M.C.


Cut me off all you like, but I've heard everything you've said before, and years ago. As Mattlov said, I can appreciate 'Real Life' getting in the way of such things, but we have all heard the 'Coming Soon' speech before.

HMP is in a situation where it is now put up or shut up. Telling us for the 5th year in a row that it isn't far away does not fill us with confidence, it just re-fills our scepticism.

And if course you favour HMP. I don’t. I always found HMP’s interface to be needlessly complex and clunky. I was always a child of The Drawing Board, of which Solaris Skunk Works is the spiritual successor (in both method and form). But that’s a personal preference, and not a statement of fact.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 21:44:53


Post by: Buckybits


H.B.M.C. wrote:
Davor wrote:What is with all the Battletech hate here?


Who knows? I mean, War Machine, Hordes, Infinity, Malifaux and half a dozen other games get the focus here all the time without so much vitriol levelled at them. But mention Battletech and we get a veritable shitstorm of negativity what with all the clueless people making statements about FASA ‘ripping off’ Macross (they didn’t), or how they went out of business because of it (they didn’t) and then all the Heavy Gear trolls crawl out of the woodwork to try and tell us that their big smashy robot is game is better than this big smashy robot game.

It is quite perplexing.


Most HG gamers are fairly nice. The ones that aren't are real pieces of work, but there is exactly one instance in this thread of a guy being a douche in regard to Btech and suggesting HG instead. The others who have mentioned HG in passing (or are affiliated with dp9) are talking about conversion possibilities, or are concentrating on making sure people know FASA didn't rip people off. Suggesting they are trolls only does disservice to yourself and to the thread.

Back on topic: anyone seen the sprues/pieces for the two multiparts in the box? I keep hearing about them, but have no reference.


-John



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 21:51:51


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Jbuckmaster wrote:Most HG gamers are fairly nice. The ones that aren't are real pieces of work, but there is exactly one instance in this thread of a guy being a douche in regard to Btech and suggesting HG instead. The others who have mentioned HG in passing (or are affiliated with dp9) are talking about conversion possibilities, or are concentrating on making sure people know FASA didn't rip people off. Suggesting they are trolls only does disservice to yourself and to the thread.


Down boy! I was referring to that particular troll in my post, however obliquely, and not all Heavy Gear players.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 22:11:20


Post by: Mad4Minis


I dont see HG as a alternative to BT. First, the gears are sized more like large battlesuits than mechs. second, it is a far more combined arms game. BT is primarily about mechs. The flavors of the games are very different.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 22:14:29


Post by: Grot 6


H.B.M.C. wrote:
Grot 6 wrote:The difficulty with the copywrite issue is that these robots were THE SAME. They didn't even have the courtesy to remove all of the robotech marking from the models, or even do the courtesy of the robotec fans to even agknowledge the idea. So in that respect, I can understand the responses.


What are you blithering about? You’re making it out that FASA simply took the designs from Macross (and a few other places) wholesale, didn’t tell anyone that they did, and then started using them in the hope that no one would notice. That couldn’t be further from the truth.

As for the comparison between the box-art... yeah, that’s intentional. Isn’t that obvious? It’s a homage to the classic box art of the game. The ‘Mech that’s being used there on the new box, the Hammerhands, is described in the fluff as the forerunner to the venerable Warhammer (the ‘Mech on the original box). It’s designed as a piece of nostalgia, not some sneaky attempt to rewrite history or pretend that what happened with the Unseen didn’t happen.


Put it back in your pants there, highspeed.

If that's what you got out of what I wrote, your missing it, entirly, but thanks for saying the same thing. I wrote that the rules were good for the game and part of why people liked it. The robots themselves were meh, but they were what was going on at the time and that they were nothing to do with ripping off anything.

You might have missed the part where I put in the obligatory references, which pretty much said the same thing. You also must have missed it when I wrote that I like the game. I liked it then, and I like it now. I haven't played it in ages, but it was a pretty cool game, even with the cardboard cutouts...

Even after reading, rereading and reading what you wrote in response, you are already entrenched, so everybody else must be wrong but you. Nevermind that we're saying the same thing.

As to the robots themselves, I was building those SAME ROBOTS, regarless of the fact that they had ROBOTECH, BATTLETECH, SHOGUN WARRIORS, TRANSFORMERS, MACROSS, BEETRASS, etc... on them.

If you missed it again, I was playing with those models well along a year or so prior to either the ROBOTECH, or the Battletech thing. They had some other name that didn't have anything to do with either of those brands, and... AGAIN... Giant robots were what SOLD at the time. Want to remember about those horrible transformer rip offs, the GO-BOTS? How about MIRCONAUTS/ COSMO-MAN, and the other myrid of preanime things that were all over the market. Robots were the thing, and the game was snatched up like candy, even before the minis started even seeing the light of day.
MY memory serves me pretty good, I even remember when the mini's came in the blue blisterpacks, and were exactly like the ones in the book.

good times, man.... good times.

Forget it, man, we're saying the same thing about the same thing, I'm writing my stuff from how I saw it, which might have been a little different then alot of you.

Here, for postarity, out of my posterior.....

http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=319060&page=2

My post was for Mr Haterade, anyway, who was !@#$'n about the models being robotech and posting about his one man boycott.

Bottom line up front, those robots at the time were just generic toy giant robots.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 22:15:26


Post by: Balance


Mattlov wrote:We know Rick Raisley works hard on the HM stuff (and I fully accept your bias) but we can't believe "shouldn't be too much longer" anymore.

I like HMP better than SSW myself, but TW came out on 2006. He's almost FIVE YEARS behind the curve. I can appreciate life getting in the way and all, but the job should have been passed to someone who could dedicate to it full time.

I look at it this way: If you were behind that far for a project at work, do you think your company should still keep you on the job, or even keep you employed?


I disagree. If it's a free project that is done by the developer as a give-back to the community then it's hard for me to feel that there's any one real onus. I doubt there's anything legally binding to make it the 'only' allowed design application, so the Solaris Skunk Works can compete on an even field and everyone is cool. If Catalyst was paying dev costs, there might be expectations, but from the sound of it it's a labor of love.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 22:19:07


Post by: Mattlov


Balance wrote:
Mattlov wrote:We know Rick Raisley works hard on the HM stuff (and I fully accept your bias) but we can't believe "shouldn't be too much longer" anymore.

I like HMP better than SSW myself, but TW came out on 2006. He's almost FIVE YEARS behind the curve. I can appreciate life getting in the way and all, but the job should have been passed to someone who could dedicate to it full time.

I look at it this way: If you were behind that far for a project at work, do you think your company should still keep you on the job, or even keep you employed?


I disagree. If it's a free project that is done by the developer as a give-back to the community then it's hard for me to feel that there's any one real onus. I doubt there's anything legally binding to make it the 'only' allowed design application, so the Solaris Skunk Works can compete on an even field and everyone is cool. If Catalyst was paying dev costs, there might be expectations, but from the sound of it it's a labor of love.


Heavy Metal is NOT a free program, though. It is still the "official" software for Battletech unit creation, and is that far behind. That is an issue.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 22:23:10


Post by: Balance


Mattlov wrote:Heavy Metal is NOT a free program, though. It is still the "official" software for Battletech unit creation, and is that far behind. That is an issue.


Then I withdraw a bunch of my comments. I'm used to the HG scene, where the Gear Garage army construction tool is fan made and free, and pretty cool (But it's definitely a work-in-progress). Still, if it's outdated, use Solaris Skunk Works and try to get that made official, if that really means anything...

(Note: GG is not a vehicle designer, more of a tool to calculate army point values and list compliance.)


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 22:25:02


Post by: Lord_Astaroth


H.B.M.C. wrote:No, you're right, there's nothing 'wrong' with BV2. As far as systems go it works well enough. It's just not required IMO, and I tend to ignore it.

Lord_Astaroth wrote:I'm gonna have to cut you off on that one H.B.M.C.


Cut me off all you like, but I've heard everything you've said before, and years ago. As Mattlov said, I can appreciate 'Real Life' getting in the way of such things, but we have all heard the 'Coming Soon' speech before.

HMP is in a situation where it is now put up or shut up. Telling us for the 5th year in a row that it isn't far away does not fill us with confidence, it just re-fills our scepticism.

And if course you favour HMP. I don’t. I always found HMP’s interface to be needlessly complex and clunky. I was always a child of The Drawing Board, of which Solaris Skunk Works is the spiritual successor (in both method and form). But that’s a personal preference, and not a statement of fact.


Of course, and everybody is entitled to their own opinions. That's why there are choices in life. I for one was never a Drawing Board fan as it was too basic and did not do the job for people that wanted the more complex things out of a what can be extremely complex game.

I'm not here to make excuses, but without putting personal life info in the internet for people to judge and ridicule, they will have to take the explanation for what it is worth. I'm not trying to start a flame war in any way shape or form. It is not my intent. I just know all the blood and sweat that goes into those programs. As for the "Telling us for the 5th year in a row that it isn't far away does not fill us with confidence, it just re-fills our scepticism." I do understand. But it is completely true. Many books have been added since he has started writing HMPro6, and the developers want the new rules that are included in these books in the new version of the program. Being playtesters, we have access to addition information on new books coming out that they are wanting added, and it keeps stacking up and is difficult to keep up. I'd do some programming myself, but my programming skills are next to none.

Also Mattlove. Regarding the "I look at it this way: If you were behind that far for a project at work, do you think your company should still keep you on the job, or even keep you employed?"
Perhaps you are not aware, but he actually had a full time job and just recently retired (less than a couple months ago).

That's my two cents, and take it for what you want. The purpose of my post was indeed to inform that the program is being worked on, and that's a fact. The main thing I wiould like to add is that I'm very pleased at the intrest in Battletech that so many people still have, and that's what it's really about. The hobby.

Thanks!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 22:42:33


Post by: deleted20250424


Grot 6, that link was great. I'll have to spend some more time over there looking around.

I love all things Mecha. So I have all the Robotech novels and movies, but this is my Holy Grail.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/192191-Robotech%20Factory.html

Everything inside is still sealed. I only removed the wrap to make sure it was complete.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 22:44:26


Post by: Balance


TalonZahn wrote:I love all things Mecha. So I have all the Robotech novels and movies, but this is my Holy Grail.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/192191-Robotech%20Factory.html


As a heads-up, there's some kits from various companies that do 'bays' kind of like that if you ever want any for modeling. They're not the same, but if yo don't want to open a collectible, they're pretty cool.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/03 22:52:15


Post by: deleted20250424


Balance wrote:As a heads-up, there's some kits from various companies that do 'bays' kind of like that if you ever want any for modeling. They're not the same, but if yo don't want to open a collectible, they're pretty cool.


I have the 4 smaller ones made by ARII, MISB on the shelf also.

ARII also makes that large kit and 2 half kits of pretty much the same thing. Someday, they will be mine.

Go to EBay and lookup "Robotech Factory". There's one in the UK, but I didn't spend quite that much for it.



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 01:52:21


Post by: aka_mythos


robertsjf wrote:
aka_mythos wrote:This will only really work with the Omni-mechs and not so much with the more rigded innersphere designs.


Wha? Are we talking about the same inner sphere mechs that have like a bajillion variants?
I was trying to emphasize where the greatest value in these types of kits while contrasting it with the biggest weakness to the type of kit. I was being more specific than just to say "innersphere" mechs... I meant the ones that don't have real variants or where the variants are almost too different to fit in a suitably sized kit relative to other mechs in the same class.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 09:11:07


Post by: Mick A


TalonZahn wrote:Grot 6, that link was great. I'll have to spend some more time over there looking around.

I love all things Mecha. So I have all the Robotech novels and movies, but this is my Holy Grail.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/192191-Robotech%20Factory.html

Everything inside is still sealed. I only removed the wrap to make sure it was complete.


I remember building and painting that many years ago...


I've played Battletech since the original 'Battleddroids' game was released. I used to play every week for a few years but interest fizzled out with the guys I used to play against when the Clans appeared. Up til then we used to design our own mechs (very few standard designs were ever used) and just decide on a tonnage for the next battle, no need for a points system. With the emergence of the Clans and their super mechs and weaponry tonnage didn't work any more...

This anniversary set could be a re-introduction for me but I will be using only pre-Clan tech

Mick


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 12:46:41


Post by: jmw23


I always liked Battletech, but there are only so many hours I can devote to minis gaming, and I haven't played in years. Ironically this is the same issue that keeps me from getting into Heavy Gear, which also looks pretty good. In any case I don't think there's anything wrong or bad about either game. A little streamlining here or there with stuff picked up over 25 years probably wouldn't hurt though.

I did pick up the excellent Sword and Dragon campaign. I was impressed, though there were a bunch of editing problems and some left out stuff, it did inspire me. Catalyst ought to focus more on stuff like that.

I never cared for the Clan plotline. Give me 3025 and 3050 any day!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 12:49:00


Post by: CT GAMER


yeenoghu wrote:

The game was created during the classical age of tabletop and paper and pencil games. Advanced Dungeons and Dragons era, when gameplay, scenarios, and balance were up to a DM or referee.

This concept escapes people who have to play competitively by precise rules, and need a system to spell out what 'sportsmanship' points are awarded for. The idea of scenario/situational gaming is kind of lost on the newer generation of win/loss ratio competitive matchup thinking gaming.

Since there was no such thing as a tournament circuit that needed specific points balance from one game to the next to keep the anal competition bureaucrats from whining, a scenario was how you played. Barring that, players just agreed on what would make for a fun matchup.


Quoted for truth.

I think wargaming in general suffers from the "mathahmmer/sportshammer" mentality too much these day...


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 17:53:24


Post by: aka_mythos


I think in those days they just had a realistic sense that in a competitive atmosphere its unrealistic to expect players to self regulate themselves all the time. Just imagine a football game without a referee... where every dispute is settled with a coin toss it could only work for so long.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 18:12:19


Post by: sourclams


So uh.. if it's okay with you guys, my buddy pre ordered a box from the Warstore ($40!) and we intend to play the game and have fun.

If that's alright.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 18:18:14


Post by: blood angel


As long as you pour a little booze out for my homey's over at robotech.com


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 18:20:14


Post by: Balance


sourclams wrote:So uh.. if it's okay with you guys, my buddy pre ordered a box from the Warstore ($40!) and we intend to play the game and have fun.


Enjoy!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 18:44:26


Post by: Logan's World Expatriate


I'm an old gamer, who can't part with anything. I still have my boxed Battletech. Citytech, Areotech, and Battleforce. We played the hell out of these games when I was a kid.... mainly Battletech and Citytech. Never got into Aerotech or battleforce.

I also prefer the earlier mechs. The later mechs looked like potatos with cannons.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 20:48:37


Post by: Mad4Minis


sourclams wrote:So uh.. if it's okay with you guys, my buddy pre ordered a box from the Warstore ($40!) and we intend to play the game and have fun.

If that's alright.


Double for you guys. I love the Warstore. Sometime over the weekend Im going to preorder both the 25th battletech box and Mantics Dwarf Kings HOld, they have both up for preorder. $47.99 for the mantic game, $39.99 for battletech.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 20:53:17


Post by: kronk


sourclams wrote:So uh.. if it's okay with you guys, my buddy pre ordered a box from the Warstore ($40!) and we intend to play the game and have fun.

If that's alright.




We play twice a month. It's a fun game. I'm just debating the purchase because my friend has the old boxed set. It's been said so far that many/most of the models are the same. I want to see the set before I make the call for me.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 22:23:17


Post by: yeenoghu


Logan's World Expatriate wrote: The later mechs looked like potatos with cannons.


I have never heard it said like that. Never knew how to express why aesthetically I didn't like the newer mech looks and you pretty much nailed it.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 22:45:02


Post by: Mick A


The thing I really liked about the 3025 setting was that your mech was normally a heirloom handed down from generation to generation and was a mechwarriors livelyhood. Without a mech you were dispossesed and possibly shunned. When you play the game along those lines it becomes so much more tactical and enjoyable, do you risk another round of combat with half the armour missing or do you pull out while you still have a chance?

Try it, you might enjoy it...

Mick )


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 22:48:18


Post by: yeenoghu


It also works with many players, each having their own mech. 4 on 4 battle with one or two mechs per player is a good evening long game and you actually care about your mech because when it dies, you're out, even if your team wins the game, you don't want to risk losing your mech doing so.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/04 22:49:40


Post by: Lord_Astaroth


Mick A wrote:The thing I really liked about the 3025 setting was that your mech was normally a heirloom handed down from generation to generation and was a mechwarriors livelyhood. Without a mech you were dispossesed and possibly shunned. When you play the game along those lines it becomes so much more tactical and enjoyable, do you risk another round of combat with half the armour missing or do you pull out while you still have a chance?

Try it, you might enjoy it...

Mick )


Absolutely! I've been running Mechwarrior games since about 1997 or so. That's how my players always played and it was well worth it. They'd throw caution to the wind, while still be aggressive (or at least looking the part). All my players knew the fluff by heart so I had to mix things up a bit. I for one had the Clans invade in 3030, 20 years before they did historically. I also called the Omnimechs that they were fighting "Omnimech A, B, C, ect.." They'd recognize it as a new variant of the same old 'Mech, but didn't know if it was a Madcat or Vulture, or what. I also included a bunch of custom designs as well. It was TONS of fun.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 01:33:13


Post by: Mad4Minis


I always liked doing actual missions. Rescue, raid, etc. It gave players something to do other than just "kill the other guy".

Its also fun when each player/team has its own mission and objective, without the opponents knowing what it is. It lead to some great "WTF are they doing?" moments.

Say team A is assigned to scan a building (must get a unit within 4 hexes, then make it back to starting map side) and team B is assigned to destroy the 2 heaviest mechs on team A.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 01:56:48


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Missions are far more fun. Actually having an in-universe reason why you're playing, rather than just a brawl (not that the odd brawl can't be fun).


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 02:32:29


Post by: NecronLord3


yeenoghu wrote:Regarding the designers not wanting BV. I agree. I think it's cool that Jaime Wolf piloted an Archer of all things. Not a horrible mech but not exactly the most flashy mech either. Rhonda Snord and a Shadowhawk, Natasha K in a Warhammer. Not top of the line state of the art elite technology, just mechs.

The game was created during the classical age of tabletop and paper and pencil games. Advanced Dungeons and Dragons era, when gameplay, scenarios, and balance were up to a DM or referee. U.S. Civil War battles refought with miniatures (yeah the south and the north both had the same number of points for their armies, right?)

This concept escapes people who have to play competatively by precise rules, and need a system to spell out what 'sportsmanship' points are awarded for. The idea of scenario/situational gaming is kind of lost on the newer generation of win/loss ratio competative matchup thinking gaming.

Since there was no such thing as a tournament circuit that needed specific points balance from one game to the next to keep the anal competition bureaucrats from whining, a scenario was how you played. Barring that, players just agreed on what would make for a fun matchup.

The BV thing emerged around the same time as MtG became popular in its first inception. Suddenly, competative win/loss ratio became the only way to play at cons. and BV was a wayto attempt to standardize matchups. Coincidence?

Tonnage is nowhere near as good a way to express a mech's value. The poor 65 ton Jagermech (I know I'm beating this guy to death) doesn't stand a chance against a 65 ton Crusader or Thunderbolt, not even with extreme luck or skill.

Except that competitive play, tournaments, and a stream lined set of rules geared toward playing with a point value is what makes wargames successful. 40k, clixgames, Magic, Warmachine/Hordes etc... are all financially successful and that success translates into more product and a fuller richer universe for all to enjoy in many multi-media formats. Battletech is suffering and has suffered for years precisely because the game does not focus on actually playing the game. In fact Battletech fails to focus on anything at all, pretty much all aspects are done half assed in one way or another. The fiction is often contradictory, the game products are poorly managed and full of flaws, the PC programs are a failure in most respects(not referring to the Mechwarrior combat games of the past), the miniatures produced by IWM are hardly high quality and are sporadically released.

The entire system needs a good reboot along the lines of the failed game that Jordan Weisman's company was working on putting out.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 02:47:28


Post by: H.B.M.C.


NecronLord3 wrote:Except that competitive play, tournaments, and a stream lined set of rules geared toward playing with a point value is what makes wargames successful.


What do you call being around for 25 years? Failure?

And tournament rules need not be 'stream lined'. There have been BTech Tournaments for a very long time, and they appear to work fine.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 04:24:00


Post by: NecronLord3


H.B.M.C. wrote:
NecronLord3 wrote:Except that competitive play, tournaments, and a stream lined set of rules geared toward playing with a point value is what makes wargames successful.


What do you call being around for 25 years? Failure?

And tournament rules need not be 'stream lined'. There have been BTech Tournaments for a very long time, and they appear to work fine.


Considering the financial difficulties it has suffered through for the majority of those 25 years, and the success of much younger games, yes that looks like failure to me.

No those tournies do not run smoothly they are generally riddled with issues and or simply use B.S. randomly generated units.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 14:07:56


Post by: aka_mythos


NecronLord3 wrote:
Considering the financial difficulties it has suffered through for the majority of those 25 years, and the success of much younger games, yes that looks like failure to me.
That may just be the difference between success and a big success. If we measured a games success purely by that metric a lot of classic games even older than Battletech that are still played have been failures.

What you're talking about is the success of the business and while the goal of all business is to be financially viable, the purpose of a business is to provide a service. For a game company its providing a game people enjoy playing; in that way they have been successful.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 14:24:25


Post by: yeenoghu


Btech was not a collectable game. It could have been, if you liked collecting miniatures, but it didn't have to be. When I think of "big success" games financially, specifically MtG and 40k stand out. Both of these require re-investment over and over on the part of the player to keep up with constantly upgraded rules and new releases.

There have been a couple of rules updates to Btech, but all they required to fit into the game for someone who had already invested in it was to get another book, not to overhaul an entire miniatures collection, a new edition rulebook, Codex, and (for some players) all of the opponent new edition Codex too. In the case of MtG, every time a new edition came out, older cards became one-upped by newer ones, so in order to stay in the game with a deck that wasn't a joke, most players felt pressured to expand their collection with newer cards.

Some people I have heard of in myth and legend still play 40k at a Rogue Trader or 2nd edition level, just like some people still play TSR's AD&D instead of its modernized watered down hasbro version (or whatever company it is). The existance of a tournament circuit provides a standard of expectations for entering your 40k army at a con. This means if 1850 is the bar to meet, then you need 1850 worth of models, updated rules, updated WYSIWYG figures, and the like - reinforcing the need to reinvest. This becomes a standard for home-games too as some players (most that I have played) also participate at FLGS games, where a standard is also kept in order to find other players easily and also allow people to "practice" (which I find absurd) for competative events.

Battletech does have tournaments. I entered the Battletech tournament at gencon 3 years in a row in the early 90s (got 4th place in the freeforall one year and 3rd in lance vs lance! Irregulars represent woot!) ahem anyway sorry about that... but anyway, the battletech tournament did not involve competative figures collections, competative millimeter nudging, dice offs, anything of the sort. You can't fudge anyting in battletech, as has been discussed earlier, and there is no codex creep. If there were any complications at a btech tournament that was not on the part of the game design itself, but a poorly organized tournament structure.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 15:35:20


Post by: Mick A


Only a fanatic fanboy would update his complete figure collection to go with a new codex. I started a new IG army three weeks ago, I'm up to 1750 points now just in infantry and every figure is an original metal Catachan. They still work with the latest edition and look a lot better than the mutated current plastic ones, plus its costing me less than half what it would for new figures...

Mick


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 15:39:22


Post by: samwellfrm


I think I'm going to start playing Battletech because of this.

I've always been a Mechwarrior enthusiast, but I've never played this game.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 16:59:10


Post by: yeenoghu


Mick A wrote:Only a fanatic fanboy would update his complete figure collection to go with a new codex. I started a new IG army three weeks ago, I'm up to 1750 points now just in infantry and every figure is an original metal Catachan. They still work with the latest edition and look a lot better than the mutated current plastic ones, plus its costing me less than half what it would for new figures...

Mick


Can we assume all your vehicles also date back to 2nd edition? Not at all tempted to get any of the newer tanks or dropships when the Codex put them in?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 17:31:51


Post by: Kalamadea


Even if you don't buy new models, you often have to update your existing ones to remain current and competative. 5th ed 40k relased, and the new rules made blood claws AMAZING for SW players, and I built a 2nd squad, while I had to rip off power fists to replace with power weapons and swap out plasmaguns for meltas and whatnot. New codex came out and suddenly blood claws sucked, and I needed to add wulfen to my grey hunters, give them banners, rip off even more powerfists to make them legal, add scouts to bring the squad up to a new minimum size. Discounting actual new units I picked up, I spent a fair amount just on new bitz for an army that I had woned for years.

Battletech, all you need is a new book. Update models? I could, there's new sculpts for a lot, but they're more like warmachine's alternate sculpts than anyhting else. All my stuff is still good, even the unseen mechs are still official and useable in any tournaments, the company isn't allowed to use those IP rights but the players are always welcome to, even allowed to post paintjobs on the official forums.

To change gears, I do wish they had made the models for the japanese version of the game. Since they had liscensed the desings that were already well known in Japan, they had to have Studio Nue redesign all the mechs, and they used some of the macross mechanical designers to do the artwork. The game tanked in Japan and only the carboard standees were ever made, but there's scans of them online and they're pretty cool, I must say

http://www.gearsonline.net/btech/mechs.php


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 17:42:21


Post by: Murrdox


NecronLord3 wrote:
Made in us In fact Battletech fails to focus on anything at all, pretty much all aspects are done half assed in one way or another. The fiction is often contradictory, the game products are poorly managed and full of flaws, the PC programs are a failure in most respects(not referring to the Mechwarrior combat games of the past), the miniatures produced by IWM are hardly high quality and are sporadically released.

The entire system needs a good reboot along the lines of the failed game that Jordan Weisman's company was working on putting out.


You're nuts! How much Battletech have you played? The core Battletech game was and is a really great miniature wargame at its core. The rules are REALLY well balanced. We haven't even had a "Battletech: 2nd Edition"! It's still the original rules for the most part, with a few subtle tweaks, and new Mechs and equipment added over the years.

I've read a LOT of Battletech fiction. Some authors are clearly better than others, but I'd hardly say that it's contradictory. The new IWM miniatures are incredible, especially compared to some of the older RalPartha miniature lines! Okay, maybe they aren't as detailed as Warmachine miniatures... but Battlemechs are also on a MUCH larger scale. Warhammer 40k Epic minis look pretty crappy in comparison to your average Mech from IWM.

I'll admit the PC Programs could use an update and are a bit clunky... but is that even the game designer's fault? Games Workshop doesn't make a 40k PC Program.

Battletech is getting to be HIGHER quality not LOWER! The new Mechwarrior Role Playing Game is fantastic - "A Time of War" not sure why they didn't just call it Mechwarrior 4th Edition, but hey what can you do.

Battletech's biggest crimes over the years were ProtoMechs and Land-Air-Mechs which I wish could just be written out of Cannon. Of all their rules, the Mechwarrior rules were the most problematic, but the game was still VERY playable and fun. The new edition of Mechwarrior is great. The Battle Value system was written to attempt to equalize Mechs for tournament or competitive play. I'd argue that Battletech wasn't a game designed for tournaments. I don't think it's a flaw in the game.

That being said, just like any game, Battletech isn't for everyone. Maybe it's just not your game.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 19:13:36


Post by: Wildstorm


Sigh, no Warhammer, Archer, or Battlemaster. Yes, yes, I know why we will never see them again (dang copyright wars) but those were always my favorite Mechs.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 22:03:22


Post by: Mick A


yeenoghu wrote:
Mick A wrote:Only a fanatic fanboy would update his complete figure collection to go with a new codex. I started a new IG army three weeks ago, I'm up to 1750 points now just in infantry and every figure is an original metal Catachan. They still work with the latest edition and look a lot better than the mutated current plastic ones, plus its costing me less than half what it would for new figures...

Mick


Can we assume all your vehicles also date back to 2nd edition? Not at all tempted to get any of the newer tanks or dropships when the Codex put them in?


I have two standard Leman Russes, one Demolisher and three Chimeras. I like the new vehicles but I don't 'need' them. My point was you don't have to update all your figures each time a new codex comes out, every one of my Catachan figures is 'legal' with the latest IG codex even though they are 10+ years old.

Mick


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wildstorm wrote:Sigh, no Warhammer, Archer, or Battlemaster. Yes, yes, I know why we will never see them again (dang copyright wars) but those were always my favorite Mechs.


Don't forget the good old Marauder, that was a great looking mech...

Mick


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 22:28:57


Post by: Marauder


I still have about 14 Marauders 8 archers, 10 or so locusts and several each of the rest of the unseen mechs. I love the 3025 timeline


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/05 23:00:24


Post by: Mick A


All this talk of Battletech got me thinking about the original novels leading up to the Clan invasion so I checked out the kindle store. I now have plenty of reading...

Mick


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/06 08:11:04


Post by: willydstyle


I'm surprised that nobody has really talked about the "reseen" sculpts. There *are* still Warhammers, Marauders, Phoenix Hawks, etc, they just don't quite look like the original art. Compared to the original sculpts, however, they are *far* superior.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/06 09:17:38


Post by: H.B.M.C.


In some cases. Not everyone likes the new Marauder and Warhammer, although the new Rifleman and Battlemaster look great (Battlemaster is actually an improvement IMO). New Thunderbolt is a massive improvement as well, as the old one was a joke.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/06 13:32:51


Post by: Sidstyler


NecronLord3 wrote:Considering the financial difficulties it has suffered through for the majority of those 25 years, and the success of much younger games, yes that looks like failure to me.


Almost sounds like you're talking about GW there.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/06 13:34:20


Post by: Mad4Minis


H.B.M.C. wrote:In some cases. Not everyone likes the new Marauder and Warhammer, although the new Rifleman and Battlemaster look great (Battlemaster is actually an improvement IMO). New Thunderbolt is a massive improvement as well, as the old one was a joke.


I dont like the new Marauder scuplts, the IIc is good, but the others are meh. I prefer the old Battlemaster. New rifleman is good. My all time faves are the original Mad IIc and the behemoth. Always been a fan of the original Archer too.


For those that like the original "unseen" mechs...keep an eye on ebay. Sometimes you can get real ones, sometimes recasts, either way they are still out there.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/06 21:29:28


Post by: megatrons2nd


Murrdox wrote:
Battletech's biggest crimes over the years were ProtoMechs and Land-Air-Mechs which I wish could just be written out of Cannon. The Battle Value system was written to attempt to equalize Mechs for tournament or competitive play. I'd argue that Battletech wasn't a game designed for tournaments. I don't think it's a flaw in the game.



I like the LAM's, but could do without superheavies and protomechs. The issue I have with the current state of the game is that the BV2 rules in the Techmanual are out of date(in the new book) and don't work out right. You can(using those rules) give 3 people the same mech and those rules and get 3 different BV2 answers. The lack of an update to the players hampers any balance for homebrew units. Also, as there is no master BV2 list, it is difficult for non-Catalyst employees to balance a fight.


Overall I love the Battletech universe and the game. I just want some of the issues fixed. The boxed set is great for a new or returning player, but I thought it needed more for being the 25th Anniversary Edition.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/06 22:18:36


Post by: aka_mythos


H.B.M.C. wrote:In some cases. Not everyone likes the new Marauder and Warhammer, although the new Rifleman and Battlemaster look great (Battlemaster is actually an improvement IMO). New Thunderbolt is a massive improvement as well, as the old one was a joke.

The old battlemaster always struck me as almost flimsy looking especially compared to some of its art work. The newer minis and variants I think filled out the limbs to make it look more proportional. The newer rifleman though I think emphasized some of the wrong details and though more interesting made it seem a little misblalanced. The thing I like most about the updated Marauder is that mechs that a number of newer mechs after the original were clearly influenced by it; so when they redid it I thought they did an excellent job of taking some of the details off those older designs and carrying them back into the Marauder. It gave it a better sense of continuity in fitting in with the overall aesthetic better.

I always loved the old Warhammer, so I don't think I can give in my mind a fair look at the newer one. To me it was just the right balance of aesthetic and utilitarian design.


Maybe this is a bit of the 40k junkie in me, or maybe its what drew me to 40k, but to me the biggest flaw of Battletech was that compared to 40k it didn't do enough to establish factions in a way that was immediately identifiable on the tabletop and for people trying to establish identity when breaking into the game. They had source books and color schemes, but aside from a player just saying so, there was very little establishing who's who. The game presented mechs that could be clustered in distinct aesthetic groups and that could have been the basis, instead its a bit of a big free for all. In terms of battlemech selection it wouldn't have had to been any more drastic than to just state that different armies have a distinct preferences for particular families of mechs with little or no exclusive use and give the slimmest of advantage for it, otherwise leaving it upto the player to decide if they wanted something rank and file or more purpose built. I think its a great game and I always enjoyed it, but that aspect of it made the games background too "history book" and not enough of a setting I was participating in.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sidstyler wrote:
NecronLord3 wrote:Considering the financial difficulties it has suffered through for the majority of those 25 years, and the success of much younger games, yes that looks like failure to me.


Almost sounds like you're talking about GW there.
GW hasn't suffered any financial difficulties and anyone who's told as much is wrong. GW has done well. Any reference to difficulties, comes from them financing their current infrastructure that's allow them to grow their business. The LoTRs game ballooned and has faded, but believing that was indefinitely sustainable would be delusional and maybe gave a sense of diminishing profitability. It was however a temporary added profitability that they otherwise would have never had. GW without it would have been worse of than they were with it. Otherwise for the last 20 years GW's grown ahead of inflation or at inflation, in terms of profitability, while growing their market base and revenue flow.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/06 23:02:30


Post by: yeenoghu


@aka_mythos:

Regarding the 'flimsy' Battlemaster. It was described as the tallest of all battlemechs. While not as heavy as the Atlas, it still stood a head taller. It only looks flimsy proportionate to itself because it is so tall. I think the miniature depicts this pretty well actually, and it is actually towering over all the other btech miniatures, at least the ones I had. My Stinger miniature comes up to its belly. The design in the book was kind of stumpy looking I think. Well, no accounting for taste either way though.

regarding faction identity in force organisation:
Tech Readout 3025 has extensive historical accounts of different mechs used by different factions (for instance, Hanse Davion's fascination with Autocannon technology leading to Davion heavily favoring designs that utilize it is mentioned in many of the mech's listings). His preferential treatment of newer autocannon technology mechs like Jagermechs, Enforcers, Victors, and so on led them to be more common amongst Davion units and Federated Suns mercenaries, as well as often ending up on the Liao border changing hands.

Every faction had a couple of mechs exclusive to them, such that a Kurita Force was rarely without Dragons and Panthers, Liao Vindicators, Steiner Commandos and Zeus.

Additionally there are variants of the most common designs that make them very different from one house to the next (Marik Wolverines being far superior to the others for instance). Minor powers and periphery states St.Ives or the Rassalhague Republic often had cheapper older mechs or hand-me-downs from the house that sponsored their independance, while Pirate kings usually had horribly ramshackle assortments of pawn shop mechs. I actually did a pieced together company of all of Redjack Ryan's mechs listed in the 3025 readout and it comes out to be a full company of some really odd, rare mechs. That's pretty thematic to me.

If you do the old reading you will find that although many mechs are common accross the board, each house has enough distinctive mechs of its own that are in abundance.

This is purely up to the roleplay side of the game to enforce though, as mechs change hands so frequently in the early succession wars that they did get spread all over. Later tech readouts are usually just a brief overview of mech capabilities, because post clan invasion, mech production surged and mechs became less rare, hence their relative rarity and historical significance became unimportant (another reason why 3025 is cooler)


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/06 23:07:40


Post by: aka_mythos


I realize that but it wasn't something that was really emphasized as much as it should have been. Maybe its simply a case of dilution through saturation of different books.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 01:53:23


Post by: Mad4Minis


I always found the "you can use any mech" thing to be a draw. You dont get locked into using certain things just because you want to use others. Thats my biggest complaint of the pre drawn army list games. Most of the time I only like some of the models in an army, but Im stuck buying, painting and using ones I dont like just to make the army work.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 02:25:29


Post by: ThirdUltra


Well, actually, any Successor State would use what they had, or captured, so you're not really 'penciled-in' to run particular mech forces.

Mercs are kind of the other bonus; they run anything because some of their personnel might be from different areas of the Inner Sphere.

With the Rim World areas, such as the Tauren Concordat, Outworlds Alliance, Magistracy of Canpopus, etc.....they run the older designs, but can a run a few newer ones on what they can capture or raid for. They flavor heavily on the Successot State they border, so if anything, they're still a mixed force of all kinds of designs.

If anything, the Clans may be more restrictive in this area; they fight for resources and mech design rights, so some clans have a preponderance for certain omni-mechs and second-line designs than others.

But, that's the cool thing about battletech; you can pretty much do what you want, so if you really like Steiner-only designed mechs by Defiance Industries or Coventry Metal Works, than by all means, you can run that stuff...


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 08:51:24


Post by: Ouze


Mick A wrote:Don't forget the good old Marauder, that was a great looking mech...


Ah, such fond memories of the Marauder IIc from the video games...


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 11:13:06


Post by: BrookM


I just looked up the term protomechs on the Battletech Wiki and I've got to ask: why? Why give them stupid animal heads?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 12:10:27


Post by: aka_mythos


BrookM wrote:I just looked up the term protomechs on the Battletech Wiki and I've got to ask: why? Why give them stupid animal heads?
Well somethings just can't be unseen! (I did that).

Protomechs, a sub-light mech/plus size power armor was a decent idea, sans stupid animal heads. Its a shame they haven't fixed those.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 12:16:52


Post by: BrookM


aka_mythos wrote:
BrookM wrote:I just looked up the term protomechs on the Battletech Wiki and I've got to ask: why? Why give them stupid animal heads?
Well somethings just can't be unseen! (I did that).

Protomechs, a sub-light mech/plus size power armor was a decent idea, sans stupid animal heads. Its a shame they haven't fixed those.
My thoughts exactly.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 12:22:45


Post by: Bonegrinder


Cool, big robot fights are awesome. Is there any shots of the minis?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 12:28:07


Post by: aka_mythos


Its been said that all but two of the minis are a reissue of the old plastics... which looked like these:
The two deluxe minis are newer miniatures:


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 12:32:34


Post by: BrookM


Hmm, no complaints from me, just means I've got to claim those two exclusives for myself when the time comes for battle.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 12:34:54


Post by: aka_mythos


The two deluxe minis are just plastic versions of the Iron Wind Metals, minis. They sell all the other weapon options for these two loose as well as these two in metal.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 12:39:04


Post by: BrookM


Okay, newbie question: If I want to field a Madcat or Timberwolf or whatever you grognards call it, besides owning the proper mini, do I need a source book or something to field it in games?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 12:44:03


Post by: aka_mythos


Well their are a number of techinical books with mechs from different periods... and several mechs appear in different books with different variants. So you just need any one of those books. This is part of my "problem" I stated above about the organization of game.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 13:03:38


Post by: BrookM


I've got the feeling I'm in for quite a journey then. Oy vey!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 13:10:22


Post by: Lord_Astaroth


BrookM wrote:I just looked up the term protomechs on the Battletech Wiki and I've got to ask: why? Why give them stupid animal heads?


We playtested them. But of course, when we playtested them in the 3060 book, they didn't have the artwork for them. We liked the idea, but they still look awful. In fact, I think that whole book looks awful personally. Doug Chaffee is a fine artist, but I wonder what happened with them.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 13:31:37


Post by: Bonegrinder


aka_mythos wrote:Its been said that all but two of the minis are a reissue of the old plastics... which looked like these:
The two deluxe minis are newer miniatures:


hmmmm, when I heard mech I was thinkin' more along the lines of this


not of that quality but design.

Battletech's remind me more of Japanese manga mechs,
not a bad thing just not to my taste.

Tho the one with the 07 on its leg is cool.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 13:39:15


Post by: aka_mythos


The one on the left in that first picture is one of the "unseen" that was just a licensed design from the anime Macross/Robotech.

I think its funny you say "more japanese" because at the time the look of battletech is what distinguished American mecha from Japanese mecha, both here and there, with the exception of those licensed designs. At the same time I think the Madcat is a better example of a identifiable design and probably would have made for a better kit paired up with the Vulture which has the bottom half and arm weapon mounts in common just as the Loki and Thor do.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 13:53:13


Post by: Bonegrinder


Well its "more japanese" to me.

Maybe thats a bad choice of words so I'll say more "humanoid" instead.

I grew up on the Mechwarrior games and tho they did have the humanoid design in it I liked the look of the other mechs,
the ones with the inverted knee and sort of airplane shaped cockpit.

I don't think I'll be buying this but I will be keepin' an eye on battletech in the future.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 13:55:58


Post by: aka_mythos


The thing about battletech is there are so many diverse designs it is easy enough to avoid the ones you don't like. For every humanoid design there are almost as many chicken-legged and four-legged designs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
BrookM wrote:Okay, newbie question: If I want to field a Madcat or Timberwolf or whatever you grognards call it, besides owning the proper mini, do I need a source book or something to field it in games?
Just to come back to your question in a more helpful way...

Look into... the "Technical Readout 3050 Upgrade" book. They sell the PDF for $25: http://www.battlecorps.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1915
Or you can get a paper copy off amazon "new" for ~$30.

Edit: For better advice see Mad4Minis advice below.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 15:49:13


Post by: NecronLord3


aka_mythos wrote:Its been said that all but two of the minis are a reissue of the old plastics... which looked like these:


This is is not true. These are the crappy plastic mechs that are being reissued:



The Unseen you picture where a much higher quality plastic miniature than Catalyst has ever produced.


aka_mythos wrote:The thing about battletech is there are so many diverse designs it is easy enough to avoid the ones you don't like. For every humanoid design there are almost as many chicken-legged and four-legged designs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
BrookM wrote:Okay, newbie question: If I want to field a Madcat or Timberwolf or whatever you grognards call it, besides owning the proper mini, do I need a source book or something to field it in games?
Just to come back to your question in a more helpful way...
Look into one of these:
Technical Readout 3039:
http://www.battlecorps.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=27_176_207&products_id=2037

Technical Readout 3050 Upgrade:
http://www.battlecorps.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=27_176_181&products_id=1916

Technical Readout 3060:
http://www.battlecorps.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=27_176_181&products_id=2380

The later period of the Jihad isn't as interesting (my opinion), and the stuff from the earliest books that preceeded these were included into the 3050 book as an update... which unfortunately is sold out from Catalyst. The 3039 book is what Catalyst recommends for getting started, beyond the core rulebook and starter set... but it doesn't have the Clan mechs you want, nor would anything preceeding it.

So in summary... the "Technical Readout 3050 Upgrade" book. They sell the PDF for $25: http://www.battlecorps.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1915
Or you can get a paper copy off amazon "new" for ~$30.


Also entirely unnecessary. To answer BrookM's question, to field a Madcat mini you need only a counter(any) to represent the Madcat(preferably a Madcat mini) and the record sheet for the design you wish to use. Technical readouts are loads of fun and I recommend them over buying any other battletech product, however they basically are the fluff of the Battletech universe except that you can make designs yourself when a Record sheet is unavailable but exact cannonzied placement of equipment requires an official record sheet to be 100% accurate.

You also do not need to spend a dime to field the Madcat as you can download the program to print the record sheet for FREE from here: http://www.solarisskunkwerks.com/


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 16:44:17


Post by: aka_mythos


NecronLord3 wrote:
Also entirely unnecessary. To answer BrookM's question, to field a Madcat mini you need only a counter(any) to represent the Madcat(preferably a Madcat mini) and the record sheet for the design you wish to use. Technical readouts are loads of fun and I recommend them over buying any other battletech product, however they basically are the fluff of the Battletech universe except that you can make designs yourself when a Record sheet is unavailable but exact cannonzied placement of equipment requires an official record sheet to be 100% accurate.

You also do not need to spend a dime to field the Madcat as you can download the program to print the record sheet for FREE from here:.../

I'd be careful with that. By virtue of the old game not being available for some time people have been kinda lax about Battletech source material, but they have as much right to protect theirs as GW. While not all companies are tyrants like GW, yes, you can find all the things needed to play, floating around online for no cost, but Catalyst is not as large a company, so it hurts them disproportionately more to take liberties with their copywritten material. But yes you can play with just the Record sheets which are also sold by Catalyst in their webstore in a PDF format, with rights to print yourself as many duplicates for personal use as you like.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 17:36:54


Post by: BrookM


I'm no cheapskate, nor a thief. If I'm getting into something I do it proper, with actual books and minis where possible.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 17:39:02


Post by: Mad4Minis


BrookM wrote:Okay, newbie question: If I want to field a Madcat or Timberwolf or whatever you grognards call it, besides owning the proper mini, do I need a source book or something to field it in games?


Not really. All you really need is the proper record sheet for the variant (weapons/equip load) you want to use. It falls under all the normal game rules.

All you need for battletech...a main/core rule book, and a few minis or counters, record sheets, and dice.



EDIT: Most of the Battletech books are fluff books. There is a main rule book, now and then they put out a book with supplemental/optional rules. Eventually they update the main rule book and include some/all of the rules.

The nice part of Battletech is anything outside the core rules is optional. The core rules have remained almost unchanged for many, many years. No worries of a new edition making everything you own useless.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
BrookM wrote:I'm no cheapskate, nor a thief. If I'm getting into something I do it proper, with actual books and minis where possible.



Solaris Skunk Works is a widely accepted design program, and possibly the most up to date.

The official design program is Heavy Metal Pro. Its a bit out of date, but if you arent going to be playing the newest/highest tech stuff (and most dont) then you can use HMP with no problem. Its only like $22, comes with 500 mechs already loaded, and you can design your own versions of existing mechs or completely new ones. You can print record sheets directly from the program. Theres a bunch of other little things it does as well. Its gotten some flack in this thread, but I recommend it.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 18:58:19


Post by: yeenoghu


You don't actually need record sheets either if you know how to use a pencil and paper.

Mine look something like this:

MECH: "silly mech name"
PILOT: "John Doe" (Green, 6/4)
DAMAGE:
H: 9/3 --- : C/S/L/
CT: 20/8 ----- / -- : Ex3/Gx2/ am20(AC5)
RT: 18/5 --- / - : AC5x4/LLx2/HS/HS/HS
LT:....

MOVE: 5/8/5
HEAT: 12
AMMO: AC5 (20): ----
: SRM6 (15): --
: MG (200): ------


and so on, with the numbers being armor/structure, "-" being hash marks for damage taken or ammo spent and the letters being shorthand for components in critical hit location, to be marked out when damaged.

Whatever system works for you. All you really need is the game data for the mechs and a rulebook. Record sheets are nice and flashy looking, and okay for organization if you can't do it yourself, like a D&D character sheet, but hardly necessary if you know how to translate game data into your own shorthand. handmade counters for mechs and whatever way you make your map (we have used notebook paper with hand drawn hexes before). It's nice to have a pretty map, pretty miniatures, and pretty record sheets - but just to play the game, the only absolute need is a rulebook and D6, everything else can be DIY'ed. I learned this when working overseas with nothing to do, and found an old battletech rulebook and tech readout at a used bookstore with no other associated playing aides.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 19:02:25


Post by: pombe


Mad4Minis wrote:
Solaris Skunk Works is a widely accepted design program, and possibly the most up to date.

The official design program is Heavy Metal Pro. Its a bit out of date, but if you arent going to be playing the newest/highest tech stuff (and most dont) then you can use HMP with no problem. Its only like $22, comes with 500 mechs already loaded, and you can design your own versions of existing mechs or completely new ones. You can print record sheets directly from the program. Theres a bunch of other little things it does as well. Its gotten some flack in this thread, but I recommend it.


How about for a Mac?

I've been needing a good 'mech designer/records sheets program.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 19:28:01


Post by: H.B.M.C.


BrookM wrote:I'm no cheapskate, nor a thief.


Don't think of it this way. Solaris Skunk Works and MegaMek are both discussed openly on the official forums. MegaMek (which is a computerised version of the tabletop game) even has its own sub-forum, despite being a free game that Catalyst has nothing to do with. That'd be a bit like GW having their own forums and having a sub-forum for Vassal.

The Catalyst guys are far more into supporting the community rather than shutting it down. They embrace the internet rather than treating it as some strange passing curiosity.


Get Solaris Skunk Works - it's one of the best 'Mech Design programs ever released - and it comes with all the record sheets. You only need print one and you can use the 'Mech. I prefer the miniatures, but you don't need them. I like having the Record Sheet PDF's, which you can print to play with if you want, and the TRO's (thought, as was said, the TRO's are unnecessary to play the game - they are mostly fluff only), but none of these things are needed, and using SSW isn't 'illegal'.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 20:08:49


Post by: Mad4Minis


pombe wrote:
Mad4Minis wrote:
Solaris Skunk Works is a widely accepted design program, and possibly the most up to date.

The official design program is Heavy Metal Pro. Its a bit out of date, but if you arent going to be playing the newest/highest tech stuff (and most dont) then you can use HMP with no problem. Its only like $22, comes with 500 mechs already loaded, and you can design your own versions of existing mechs or completely new ones. You can print record sheets directly from the program. Theres a bunch of other little things it does as well. Its gotten some flack in this thread, but I recommend it.


How about for a Mac?

I've been needing a good 'mech designer/records sheets program.


Im not sure, but Id imagine they have a mac version. Ive never used one so I dont pay attention to mac stuff.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 20:29:22


Post by: NecronLord3


aka_mythos wrote:
NecronLord3 wrote:
Also entirely unnecessary. To answer BrookM's question, to field a Madcat mini you need only a counter(any) to represent the Madcat(preferably a Madcat mini) and the record sheet for the design you wish to use. Technical readouts are loads of fun and I recommend them over buying any other battletech product, however they basically are the fluff of the Battletech universe except that you can make designs yourself when a Record sheet is unavailable but exact cannonzied placement of equipment requires an official record sheet to be 100% accurate.

You also do not need to spend a dime to field the Madcat as you can download the program to print the record sheet for FREE from here:.../

I'd be careful with that. By virtue of the old game not being available for some time people have been kinda lax about Battletech source material, but they have as much right to protect theirs as GW. While not all companies are tyrants like GW, yes, you can find all the things needed to play, floating around online for no cost, but Catalyst is not as large a company, so it hurts them disproportionately more to take liberties with their copywritten material. But yes you can play with just the Record sheets which are also sold by Catalyst in their webstore in a PDF format, with rights to print yourself as many duplicates for personal use as you like.


Solaris is an approved program for Battletech. Though HMpro has the license to design the official record sheet software, that license is with the Battletech license owner Topps and not Catalyst. Considering HMpro is so out of date and Rick Raisley has done such a pointless job on that project Catalyst sanctions Solaris Skunk Works by featuring a forum on their own official Classic Battletech website and the free computer program MegaMek for playing Battletech by yourself or with others on your PC.

However if you want pirated PDF's those are readily available as well though I'm not going to instruct you on how to obtain those either.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 20:50:31


Post by: Lord_Astaroth


That isn't true actually. There is no "pointless job" that's being done. My father, Rick Raisley, is working on it, and working hard I'll add. When last I spoke with him, he was working on additional equipment, and working on a way to better integrate Omni Support. As said before, I am biased to HMPro of curse, but others are good too I've heard. With HMPro, you can actually design your own weapons and it will calculate the BV for them, so many of the new weapons aren't a problem. Also, Catalyst "sactions" any groups that further the development and intrest of Classic Battletech.

I'd have to say one more thing. No more bashing people you don't personally know, interact with, or understand. It infuriates me to no end when people bash another person on how long something is taking when they do not understand what has happened to him and our family in the past 5 years. I do not want to go into details as it is not anybody's business aside from our friends and family, but it is indeed being worked on.

So please, watch the bashing, and consider for once that others on the other end of the computer are human beings as well.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 22:27:23


Post by: NecronLord3


Actually I am very well aware of Rick Raisleys problems. And I'm quite up to date on his excuses. Everyone has given him more than his fair share of slack regarding those personal issues and enough is enough.

As has been mentioned before, if I was to take as long doing my job and giving excuses, my employer would have found someone else to do it for me long ago. Regardless of anything I have going on in my personal life. Its business not personal and when confronted with a reasonable request that was posed to Rick, he became a beligerent A-hole and was entirely rude and unprofessional. So you can tell him again from me exactly what he can do with himself and HMworthless.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 23:02:17


Post by: Lord_Astaroth


I somehow doubt that he was beligerent, and I'm not going to stoop so low as to name call, and the like. As you said, if you failed to give results, you'd be fired. You are most likely correct on that, however this is his own business, of which he has made many successful programs and is working on the update for the newest one. He understands more than ANYBODY about the need for this to be updated. He isn't making money on a program that does not exist and he is excited to sell this one when it is finished. Regardless of what transpired, this topic has gotten off track. Though I am no mod, I can see this. The original post is regarding the new box set for Classic Battletech. Let's get back to that point please.

I am excited to see the new box set on the shelves as I'm sure many others are, so let's get back to that.

Thank you.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 23:09:26


Post by: Mad4Minis


Lord_Astaroth wrote:Let's get back to that point please.

I am excited to see the new box set on the shelves as I'm sure many others are, so let's get back to that.

Thank you.



I pre ordered mine yesterday, along with Mantics Dwarf Kings Hold. Not sure of the exact release dates, but Im pretty sure both are slated for late March.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 23:12:05


Post by: BrookM


Conveniently I'm having my birthday in April, so this one might just make it onto the list alongside Mantic's dungeon crawler. Can't complain about good releases now.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 23:14:43


Post by: Lord_Astaroth


Heh, isn't it funny that everything you want comes out around the time of one's birthday? And as always, you never get all of what you want, so you have to spend some of that birthday cash to do so!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 23:17:30


Post by: BrookM


Chances are Battletech, Mantic's Game, Battlefleet Koronus and my big Dust Tactics order all pop up around the same time. Choices, choices..


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 23:18:16


Post by: yeenoghu


NecronLord3 wrote:Actually I am very well aware of Rick Raisleys problems. And I'm quite up to date on his excuses. Everyone has given him more than his fair share of slack regarding those personal issues and enough is enough.

As has been mentioned before, if I was to take as long doing my job and giving excuses, my employer would have found someone else to do it for me long ago. Regardless of anything I have going on in my personal life. Its business not personal and when confronted with a reasonable request that was posed to Rick, he became a beligerent A-hole and was entirely rude and unprofessional. So you can tell him again from me exactly what he can do with himself and HMworthless.


Funny how you seem to have problem with someone being a beligerent A-hole.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/07 23:23:18


Post by: Lord_Astaroth


Come on now, that isn't necessary. We don't need to get a thread locked because of flame wars. Battletech threads on this site are few and far between. It's nice to see them, though it would be nicer if it didn't involve who said what to who. I appreciate the defense, we don't want this thread locked.

Thanks!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 01:32:30


Post by: Manchu


This thread has drawn a lot of bad behavior. I would second Astaroth's appeal for polite discussion and am willing to leave this thread open as it is rather rare to get Battletech news around here. But the thread is on warning and those of you who have been stirring it can consider yourselves warned as well.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 05:00:05


Post by: yeenoghu


Apologize. I didn't like seeing someone attacking someone else's dad, but I guess I didn't have to be rude as a response to rudeness either...

anyways back to battletech, i looked close at the figs in the above pictures and some of them don't seem bad at all. I don't like the Atlas it looks spindley, and the panther's head is kind of huge, clint and dervish are on the small side next to mechs that are supposedly smaller than them, but most of the others look pretty good to me. last btech minis i got in a box were the 14 unseens back in the mid 90s, and the 8 horrible ones that came in citytech.

Does anyone remember 'plastech'.. FASAs own attempt at plastic minis. I still have some of those and I have pulled them out for a laugh at games.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 05:46:55


Post by: Logan's World Expatriate


yeenoghu wrote:Does anyone remember 'plastech'...


One painted conservatively, the other in checker-tastic 1980's GW style. Totally rad.




Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 05:57:51


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Friend of mine has a few of those floating around. The Catapults are HUGE. They're good for filling in the last few slots if you need a lot of the same 'Mech and have already used your two plastic, and both your old metal and new metal Atlases.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 06:36:36


Post by: yeenoghu


I actually like the Plastech Atlas better than the Ral Partha one. The Catapult is pretty damn funny though. Yeah it's pretty obvious what it's supposed to be.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 07:02:46


Post by: DarkTraveler777


yeenoghu wrote:

Does anyone remember 'plastech'.. FASAs own attempt at plastic minis. I still have some of those and I have pulled them out for a laugh at games.


My friends and I used to love the old Plastech boxed set. Our little middle school group of 5 players each bought a set for use in our games. A couple of us even bought additional sets from Virtual World when they ran a sale on slow moving Btech merchandise.

The Panther was my favorite from that set. It certainly beat the pants off the crappy jumping Panther currently for sale from IWM.



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 07:10:28


Post by: H.B.M.C.


yeenoghu wrote:I actually like the Plastech Atlas better than the Ral Partha one.


You mean the original Ral Partha metal right, not the re-sculpt that IWM sells now. The current one, while being a bit of a pain to put together (then again, most IWM models are designed about as illogically as some of GW's models), looks great and is nice and tall.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 12:13:07


Post by: Mattlov


Ah PlasTech. Home of the Fatlas and Fatapult. I remember them well. I sold off mine with the rest of my plastics a couple years ago.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 12:16:44


Post by: H.B.M.C.


You sold off your plastics? Even the CityTech 2 stuff? Even the plastic unseen (of which I only have one... a Warhammer... )?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 12:29:29


Post by: Lord_Astaroth


Heh, on the Plastech 'Mechs, anybody else remember the Valkyrie that wasn't even on the base correctly? It was facing one of the points of the hex it was on rather than the flat edge. How in the world did that one make it passed inspection? I seem to have misplaced one of my "Fatlas" plastics. I've got all of those back in '90. A buddy of mine turned most of those into conversions, and good ones at that. Much easier to hack at plastic than metal.

Back then, 89-90 we didn't know how to play really, and though that LRM20s always hit with all the missiles, and in the same location! Dad heard my buddy and I play, and the construction aspect of the game sounded pretty cool. My first real game was with Dad. he and I played with the two cardboard pink Locusts, with 4/6 pilots and neither one of us had the guts to close in with our machine guns. That game lasted almost 3 hours as we never hit each other and kept referring to the rulebook. Oh those were the days!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 15:09:06


Post by: FacelessMage


How did I miss this thread?

I totaly have to buy a set. I have a pile of old rules and models from what feels like 2 different versions. This would actually let me play using consistant rules.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 15:35:51


Post by: rich1231


One of my fave all time games, I have all my Battletech stuff on the shelf next to my as I type this. Though a painter I never played Btech with miniatures only with the cardboard.

Also play Battleforce a bit as well.

This thread has made me get in touch with my old Btech buddies to sort a game, so thanks!



Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 16:02:44


Post by: Mick A


Hopefully there might be more threads about Battletech now...

Mick )


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 16:33:39


Post by: Tacobake


Battletech iz r0XX0R


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 17:12:35


Post by: Mad4Minis


The ones that come in the Intro box and 25th Aniv Intro box (yes its the same ones except for the 2 premiums) arent very good, but they are useable. For the money you get a great selection of mechs to get started with, along with the rule/fluff books. A basic paint job and the plastics arent too bad. Gives a good rank and file set, allows you to spend your $$ on the cooler metals to fill it all in.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 17:46:08


Post by: Lord Scythican


Wow I am pretty stoked about this. I just sent some text messages to some buddies of mine that used to play Battletech with me. This is going to be sweet!


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 21:46:04


Post by: Mick A


Started a Battletech thread on the mech part of the forum...

Mick


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 22:04:28


Post by: Earthbeard


This thread made me hunt out some old stuff - including the first edition battletech and citytech boxsets, man that was a blast from the past.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/08 22:41:59


Post by: Mattlov


H.B.M.C. wrote:You sold off your plastics? Even the CityTech 2 stuff? Even the plastic unseen (of which I only have one... a Warhammer... )?


Yeah. When I have metals of all of them, I didn't need the plastics any more.

They went to a group of new players, so don't feel bad. They got 80 some plastic 'Mechs for $100 or something similar.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/09 01:32:07


Post by: Arionel


I used to play BattleTech WAAAY back when, with the cardboard figures and played the different varients, (Battletech, Mechwarrior RPG, Mercenaries, Aerotech) had a good time, awesome stories and fluff. Then the Clans invdaded. I didn't play too much after that, and now at the game store, a very few people play it, and I'm tempted to go back. But, since I've dropped over $200 on WH40k stuff, it's going to be a while before I make another game purchase.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wildstorm wrote:Sigh, no Warhammer, Archer, or Battlemaster. Yes, yes, I know why we will never see them again (dang copyright wars) but those were always my favorite Mechs.


My favorites were the Warhammer, Thunderbolt, and Rifleman...I was a distance player.

As far as LAMs go...that should be a no brainer...they need to stay in Robotech.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/09 02:39:36


Post by: Lord_Astaroth


Still have my Plastech 'Mechs, the plastic unseen ones that came in a box set by themselves (Warhammer, Maruader, ect...) The same exact ones also came in the 3rd ed box set. I got the ones that came in the 4th box set with the Clan and Inner Sphere too. I've also got DOZENS of 'Mechs, many unseen and lead still in blister packs. Haven't painted half of my other ones I've built and converted too. It's just multiple shelves in my game room full of gleaming metal. Pretty depressing really.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/15 18:46:36


Post by: aka_mythos


Purple Pawns has a nice breakdown of the box contents and a unboxing video: http://www.purplepawn.com/2011/03/hands-on-battletech-25th-anniversary-boxed-set/

Sounds even better! 15 days and counting.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/15 18:57:46


Post by: carmachu


I'm gonna have to get the box. Brings back alot of memories.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/15 18:58:07


Post by: UltraPrime


Anywhere in UK selling this?


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/15 19:03:42


Post by: Noir


UltraPrime wrote:Anywhere in UK selling this?


Any non-GW game store should at the least be able to order it for you.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/15 19:27:42


Post by: aka_mythos


In the least there are UK websites that will have it. For example Amazon UK, is supposed to eventually have it.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/15 21:17:19


Post by: Mad4Minis


Lord_Astaroth wrote:I've also got DOZENS of 'Mechs, many unseen and lead still in blister packs. Haven't painted half of my other ones I've built and converted too. It's just multiple shelves in my game room full of gleaming metal. Pretty depressing really.



You could probably make a quite large amount on those...esp the unseens like Marauder, Battlemaster, Griffin, Shadowhawk, etc.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/16 00:38:54


Post by: lokilokust


Not having played in... the better part of two decades, I have to say I'm pretty excited about this and will probably pick up two of them, next month.


Battletech Classic 25th anniversary introductory box set @ 2011/03/16 04:51:57


Post by: Ouze


I'm really excited about getting this when it comes out. I already have friends who have played it before, too, so double exited I guess.