Saw this on Faeit212, if someone has the original link to the posts, please post it and I'll update.

Original Warseer Thread

via Stickmonkey
I have some very early Eldar rumors. First let me start with a very clear disclaimer:
THESE ARE EARLY RUMORS, CODEX ELDAR IS RUMORED MID TO LATE 2013! I EXPECT MUCH OF THIS TO CHANGE OR EVOLVE FROM WHAT I AM HEARING TODAY!

Ok, very small list, so on to what Im hearing:
Aspects all have a way to move to troops. However, some are limited to one unit only. The phoenix Lords are NOT this mechanism supposedly.

Guardians have a slight points reduction.

Tanks ( night spinner, fire prism, falcon) have a point reduction.

Transports are about the same cost.

Storm guardians are an upgrade of normal guardians.

Rumor those units requiring a guide (wraithguard , wraithlord) longer sit idle when out side range and rolling a 1. Instead they can make a move towards a warlock or other guide. Engaging these units in cc while they are outside their guides range will have penalties, treat as ws 1, i 1. However, guides will have "buffs" they can give. Reroll to hit, bonus save, etc. (To me this sounds suspiciously like changes to nids and the tervigon)

via Romanus (note:A little extra salt here)
heard that they have played with Wave serpents Energy Shields becoming weaker, in that they loose there negative effects against melta etc. Still these are playtesting rumors at this stage so subject to a huge variable of change.

From what I have heard and from other sources around the interwebs the first wave for Eldar would look like:

Flyer - Possibly with 2nd wave flyer release (supposedly related to the large vehicle chassis), I have also heard it is the Nightwing but this would contradict what GW has been saying lately that there wouldn't be anymore direct ports from FW

New Plastic Jetbikes (seen Games Day 2010)
New Plastic Vyper
Larger Vehicle Chassis
Guardian Box incorporating Storm and Battle guardians???
Finecast characters

I know that Eldar are being worked on at the moment, but its mostly throwing around Ideas and seeing how they work. I'm not 100% sure on the design sequence that GW follows but this would seem pretty prelim to me. I know that this has been going on for around six months so far, with some pretty nifty ideas being tried. Thats all I'll say on the matter though.

Redemption wrote:Some more information:

eldargal;6220278 wrote:I've been debating whether to post this or not, but I may as well. This is what I've heard is coming in terms of kits:

New Avatar sculpt
New Falcon variants
Entirely new vehicle
New jetbikes and vyper jetbike models
New character sculpts, new special character(s) and new SC sculpts
New versions of Aspect warriors, similar to current models but 'more dynamic'

That is everything, no more details than that, source has been semi-reliable but I've not been able to corroborate this with any reliable rumourmongers as yet.

Stickmonkey;6220572 wrote:Eldargal,
I've hear there have been CAD sculpts seen in the past 6 months for all of the aspects AND wraithguard, just dont know if they will be finecast or get broke out to plastic kits yet.

My newest batch of rumors here is coming from playtest notes, which are notoriously unreliable this far out form codex release, but they do indicate the direction being thought.

Also a bit more on the wave serpent. Couple things have been tried on the shield, from 4+ invul on any penetrating hit, to something similar to the necron shield where the armor drops after its penetrated once. The rumors are all over the board there, but one thing is certain that mechanic is being looked at and will lkely work differently in the final codex.

As far as the phoenix lords go, they are rumored to provide a table wide buff to their aspect units while on the board. For instance Karandras is rumored to grant +1A or +1S to Scorpions.

I'll be adding these two to the Rumor Monger thread.

Nothing too revolutionary, but it's good to know that Eldar are being worked on by trusted rumor sources.

Aspect troops, 'fixed' Guardians, cheaper Falcons, finecast everything, a new flyer, new jetbikes, new vyper, and modified Wraithsight have all been on Eldar players' wishlists for some time now.

Those are almost all such "givens" that they seem like rumors made up just to give their speakers credibility. Finecast characters, plastic jetbikes that we've seen at Gamesday, Storm Guardians just being an upgrade and Guardians getting a points reduction could have been predicted by anybody. Points drops across the board are also something anyone could see coming, considering every codex since Codex; Eldar has had points drops. The only things in here that are at all surprising are the mention of a larger vehicle somewhere (so vague it has to be true!) and moving Aspect Warriors to troops through different means, which is also pretty obvious considering how many codices have similar analogs in them, with Nobz to troops, Wolf Guard to troops, and so on.

I love how the interwebs is making people put a disclaimer on their rumors now.

*****Just in case you didn't know, I am passing these rumors that may, or may not change. Thank you for reading this information that I could of held to myself, and for not blaming me if Games Workshop chooses to in the future change something that was unforeseen.*****

or they could go and just post the definition of rumor.
ru·mor - /ˈro omər/ Noun: A currently circulating story or report of uncertain or doubtful truth:

It's so they can cover their ass when the rumors inevitably don't pan out.

Not buying Romanus' personally; making energy fields weaker for no advertised change in Serpent cost would be nonsensical; larger vehicle chassis would require the vast majority of Eldar vehicles to be re-made and re-boxed, which I would 101% say that GW would not do. The chassis has aged extremely well, and if anything, needs to become a little smaller unless they want to have skimmers larger than Land Raiders.

I cannot forsee them recalling the Serpent, Falcon and Prism kits just to make the chassis bigger, especially since it won't just affect those three, but also the FW Warp Hunter and Firestorm.

The plastic jetbikes and vyper are pretty much common sense, and FC Characters are already implemented across half the range.

Brother SRM wrote:It's so they can cover their ass when the rumors inevitably don't pan out.

I think Fosner1703's point is that you are already covered when you say it is a rumor...implied by definition.

pretre wrote:Saw this on Faeit212, if someone has the original link to the posts, please post it and I'll update.

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?341194-Early-Eldar-rumors

Avatar 720 wrote:larger vehicle chassis would require the vast majority of Eldar vehicles to be re-made and re-boxed, which I would 101% say that GW would not do. The chassis has aged extremely well, and if anything, needs to become a little smaller unless they want to have skimmers larger than Land Raiders.

I'm assuming he's talking about a new larger chassis to coexist next to the Falcon/Fire Prism/Wave Serpent chassis. There has been more more talk about that from different sources.

reps0l wrote:
I think Fosner1703's point is that you are already covered when you say it is a rumor...implied by definition.

Yes, but a lot of people take these rumors as gospel for whatever reason. I remember when the "Summer of Fliers" didn't pan out and there were people raging that GW screwed up again, pushed back this release etc. when there really never was anything to go off of.

@Redemption: Thanks, I updated the first post.

Good news to hear eldar getting treatment hope GW gets it right this time, and hopefully wave serpents get something new otherwise there costly transport get worse ? Can I bet there's going to be some new transport that's super amazing on this New chassis?

Some more information:

eldargal;6220278 wrote:I've been debating whether to post this or not, but I may as well. This is what I've heard is coming in terms of kits:

New Avatar sculpt
New Falcon variants
Entirely new vehicle
New jetbikes and vyper jetbike models
New character sculpts, new special character(s) and new SC sculpts
New versions of Aspect warriors, similar to current models but 'more dynamic'

That is everything, no more details than that, source has been semi-reliable but I've not been able to corroborate this with any reliable rumourmongers as yet.

Stickmonkey;6220572 wrote:Eldargal,
I've hear there have been CAD sculpts seen in the past 6 months for all of the aspects AND wraithguard, just dont know if they will be finecast or get broke out to plastic kits yet.

My newest batch of rumors here is coming from playtest notes, which are notoriously unreliable this far out form codex release, but they do indicate the direction being thought.

Also a bit more on the wave serpent. Couple things have been tried on the shield, from 4+ invul on any penetrating hit, to something similar to the necron shield where the armor drops after its penetrated once. The rumors are all over the board there, but one thing is certain that mechanic is being looked at and will lkely work differently in the final codex.

As far as the phoenix lords go, they are rumored to provide a table wide buff to their aspect units while on the board. For instance Karandras is rumored to grant +1A or +1S to Scorpions.

Thanks, Redemption. Added to the OP.

I think the biggest question for me would be how much of the total range of new models will be Finecast? I think plastic kits for Aspect Warriors might tempt me into starting an Eldar force, but if they made a plastic Avatar kit (given the track record of new plastic kits) that'd almost certainly push me over into the abyss. Aspect Warriors on par with the great Jes Goodyn Dark Eldar Warriors and Wyches kits? Yes, please!

If, however, they put out 5-man, super-expensive, Finecast Aspect Warrior resculpt sets, that would completely extinguish my interest period. If I were to start an Eldar force, I'd want copious Aspect Warriors rather than Guardians, but I generally insist on plastic kits for Troops choices. They did really good on DE and Crons (Immortals/Deathmarks and Praetorians/Lychguard sets), and if they could do that again with Eldar, it'd be super-tempting.

-C6

It seems like the direction they are going. Have they put out a troop model not in plastic in quite some time?

Something's itching me about the Storm Guardian rumour... Storm Guardians are already upgrades for Defender Guardians.

pretre wrote:It seems like the direction they are going. Have they put out a troop model not in plastic in quite some time?

Flayed ones.

There rumours sound good mind.

I so desperatly want this codex to rock. I really want to play my Eldar again.

alphaomega wrote:Flayed ones.

Those are Elites.

Redemption wrote:

alphaomega wrote:Flayed ones.

Those are Elites.

I thought in the OP that aspects all have a way of moving to troops. Implying they are probably elite or such to start with.
I think wracks are a good example of models you can have a as troops in finecast.

Xeriapt beat me to it.

Aspects are Elites, with the exception of Dire Avengers, which are already plastic, and Shining Spears are half plastic(although not Troops), which should be redone with the new jetbikes.

Not saying aspect warriors going plastic isn't possible, but making the argument no recent troops have not been plastic isn't relevant when talking about aspect warriors.

I reckon that the phoenix lords probably won't be HQs. It's more likely that you'll be able to upgrade one character in an aspect squad to a phoenix lord instead of an exarch for just one squad, making that squad a troop choice. Otherwise, how are they going to avoid the Eldar having too many HQs? We already have Eldrad, Farseers, Yriel, Autarchs, the Corsairs Prince, the Corsairs Farseer (forget the name right now), the Avatar and perhaps the Wraithseer. If you also had all of the Phoenix Lords - not forgetting the new Shadow Specters phoenix Lord - then you'd have too many HQs to be viable. The Eldar also have Warlocks.

I can see Warlocks becoming sanguinary priest style 0-3 Elites and the phoenix lords becoming squad leader upgrades. Space Wolves have already set the precedent for having more than 2 HQs so why not Eldar too? Only problem is that the ability to take lots of them on top of other HQs may mean they'd take a nerf which doesn't fit in with their eternal warrior type status. It will be interesting to see what they do with them.

I think it's a definite possibility to do some combined Aspect Warrior kits. The bodysuits for many of them are fairly similar, and it's just the heads, arms, and backpacks that mark them out the most.

Brother SRM wrote:I think it's a definite possibility to do some combined Aspect Warrior kits. The bodysuits for many of them are fairly similar, and it's just the heads, arms, and backpacks that mark them out the most.

Somewhat disagree.

When Dark Eldar got their huge revamp, each "Aspect" from Incubi to Warriors to Wyches to Mandrakes to especially the Hellions and Scourges got their own box.
Necron Flayed Ones, Immortals, and Warriors have slightly similar bodies with marginal differences, but they're separate boxes. Even the Flayed Ones, with otherwise fine old models, got inexplicable remakes (for the worse).
Even the almost-similar Tyranid Gaunts have separate boxes now, but have had them all along.

The only marginally related aspects are Dragons and Avengers, and Avengers already have a plastic kit that works fine.
The 'modern' Aspects are fine and reboxed except for Spiders and Hawks showing age in metal/finecast.

Absolutionis wrote:Even the almost-similar Tyranid Gaunts have separate boxes now, but have had them all along.

They were originally a 'dual kit', in that they were a box of 16, with 8 Hormagaunt bodies, 8 Termagant bodies, and a weapon and biomorph frame.

-Loki- wrote:

Absolutionis wrote:Even the almost-similar Tyranid Gaunts have separate boxes now, but have had them all along.

They were originally a 'dual kit', in that they were a box of 16, with 8 Hormagaunt bodies, 8 Termagant bodies, and a weapon and biomorph frame.

Yes, but you bought the box and there wasn't much of an option to make Hormagaunts or Termagants. You had to do both (or leaping Spinegaunts, I guess).

All the more evidence that GW is trending towards keeping/putting existing models in separate boxes and if there's any dual-kits, it'll be completely new things.

New Aspects and Wraithguard please.

As long as they're not Finecast.

Id settle for some new wraithguard models. Maybe a new wraithlord model would be cool, the current one isnt bad though.

Iv wanted to do a wraith list for a while but in the current book they seem like they would be rather difficult to play.

Avatar 720 wrote:Not buying Romanus' personally; making energy fields weaker for no advertised change in Serpent cost would be nonsensical; larger vehicle chassis would require the vast majority of Eldar vehicles to be re-made and re-boxed, which I would 101% say that GW would not do. The chassis has aged extremely well, and if anything, needs to become a little smaller unless they want to have skimmers larger than Land Raiders.

I cannot forsee them recalling the Serpent, Falcon and Prism kits just to make the chassis bigger, especially since it won't just affect those three, but also the FW Warp Hunter and Firestorm.

The plastic jetbikes and vyper are pretty much common sense, and FC Characters are already implemented across half the range.

I think you are confused the "Larger vehicle chassis" isn't about replacing the Serpent, Falcon, Prism and Spinner chassis it's about adding another one you know like if you compared the chassis for those vehicles to say a Rhino the new one would be like a Land Raider.....

Serpents becoming worse and staying the same price? Yeah, not gonna heppen. They are already ~20pts too expensive.

I think it is a bit too early to whine about the rules released in about a year. Not sure if the book is written at all ATM.
So new jetbike, several point reductions and new finecast characters is not exactly a new and insightful rumour.

Hmmm....they go and release plastic aspects they might get me interested....

I've been out of 40K for years, but Eldar have always been one of those armies that sometimes I want to paint just for the sake of painting them. Late 2013 I could conceivably have the money and free time to start collecting again. So it all comes down to how they do the aspect warriors. If the aspect warriors are Finecast, GW has no hope of getting me back as a customer. If they do them in plastic they might, depending on the quality of the sculpt.

Avatar 720 wrote:Not buying Romanus' personally; making energy fields weaker for no advertised change in Serpent cost would be nonsensical; larger vehicle chassis would require the vast majority of Eldar vehicles to be re-made and re-boxed, which I would 101% say that GW would not do. The chassis has aged extremely well, and if anything, needs to become a little smaller unless they want to have skimmers larger than Land Raiders.

I cannot forsee them recalling the Serpent, Falcon and Prism kits just to make the chassis bigger, especially since it won't just affect those three, but also the FW Warp Hunter and Firestorm.

The plastic jetbikes and vyper are pretty much common sense, and FC Characters are already implemented across half the range.

Why not? They did this all with the Chimera a few years back. Almost no change except to the tracks which were modified, yet this changes the entire sprue. I do not see this as a huge problem from a 15+ year old tank kit.

Red Corsair wrote:

Avatar 720 wrote:Not buying Romanus' personally; making energy fields weaker for no advertised change in Serpent cost would be nonsensical; larger vehicle chassis would require the vast majority of Eldar vehicles to be re-made and re-boxed, which I would 101% say that GW would not do. The chassis has aged extremely well, and if anything, needs to become a little smaller unless they want to have skimmers larger than Land Raiders.

I cannot forsee them recalling the Serpent, Falcon and Prism kits just to make the chassis bigger, especially since it won't just affect those three, but also the FW Warp Hunter and Firestorm.

The plastic jetbikes and vyper are pretty much common sense, and FC Characters are already implemented across half the range.

Why not? They did this all with the Chimera a few years back. Almost no change except to the tracks which were modified, yet this changes the entire sprue. I do not see this as a huge problem from a 15+ year old tank kit.

Track changes =/= Entire chasis enlargement. Changing the tracks, as you said, changed nothing but the sprue, but if you change the entire size of a chassis, then every single kit that uses that chassis has to have everything re-sized to fit. It would be a large ball-ache, especially since the eldar skimmer chassis is absolutely fine as it is, and has aged extremely well.

But, as previously mentioned, it probably refers to the appearance of a larger vehicle, not the resizing of the current chassis.

Just for clarification:
1.) The rules rumours are from different playtests not the Codex, which is not yet written.
2.) The larger chassis is a rumoured new larger skimmer IN ADDITION to the Falcon chassis which doesn't change.

I did meet someone who worked in a mid level capacity for the company, who swore blind he'd seen concept sketches for a plastic wraithguard kit, about 2 years back.

ColdSadHungry wrote:I reckon that the phoenix lords probably won't be HQs. It's more likely that you'll be able to upgrade one character in an aspect squad to a phoenix lord instead of an exarch for just one squad, making that squad a troop choice. Otherwise, how are they going to avoid the Eldar having too many HQs? We already have Eldrad, Farseers, Yriel, Autarchs, the Corsairs Prince, the Corsairs Farseer (forget the name right now), the Avatar and perhaps the Wraithseer. If you also had all of the Phoenix Lords - not forgetting the new Shadow Specters phoenix Lord - then you'd have too many HQs to be viable. The Eldar also have Warlocks.

I can see Warlocks becoming sanguinary priest style 0-3 Elites and the phoenix lords becoming squad leader upgrades. Space Wolves have already set the precedent for having more than 2 HQs so why not Eldar too? Only problem is that the ability to take lots of them on top of other HQs may mean they'd take a nerf which doesn't fit in with their eternal warrior type status. It will be interesting to see what they do with them.

That would be pretty cool. At the moment there really is too many HQs to choose but changes similar to that for the Phoenix Lords would relieve that quite a lot!
Totally agree that it will be interesting to see what happens though because it might be a little bit OP to have 6 Phoenix Lords with each of their aspects as troops choices.

swalker91 wrote:

ColdSadHungry wrote:I reckon that the phoenix lords probably won't be HQs. It's more likely that you'll be able to upgrade one character in an aspect squad to a phoenix lord instead of an exarch for just one squad, making that squad a troop choice. Otherwise, how are they going to avoid the Eldar having too many HQs? We already have Eldrad, Farseers, Yriel, Autarchs, the Corsairs Prince, the Corsairs Farseer (forget the name right now), the Avatar and perhaps the Wraithseer. If you also had all of the Phoenix Lords - not forgetting the new Shadow Specters phoenix Lord - then you'd have too many HQs to be viable. The Eldar also have Warlocks.

I can see Warlocks becoming sanguinary priest style 0-3 Elites and the phoenix lords becoming squad leader upgrades. Space Wolves have already set the precedent for having more than 2 HQs so why not Eldar too? Only problem is that the ability to take lots of them on top of other HQs may mean they'd take a nerf which doesn't fit in with their eternal warrior type status. It will be interesting to see what they do with them.

That would be pretty cool. At the moment there really is too many HQs to choose but changes similar to that for the Phoenix Lords would relieve that quite a lot!
Totally agree that it will be interesting to see what happens though because it might be a little bit OP to have 6 Phoenix Lords with each of their aspects as troops choices.

on the other hand, if as rumoured the FOC goes the way of the dodo and 40K goes (back) to a percentages system the amount of HQ choices wouldn't be an issue per se...

ColdSadHungry wrote:

I can see Warlocks becoming sanguinary priest style 0-3 Elites and the phoenix lords becoming squad leader upgrades.

If they go that route, I see Warlocks going the route of Wolf Guard - you can take several of them and break them off as unit leaders and use the rest as a Seer Council. Make the unit 0-1 and the unit can be 1-10. Count it as an elite unit and move on. Give them the option to get a jet bike, weapon options, psychic powers, and that should do it.

I'm more interested in seeing how they are going to arm the farseers and autarchs. I'd like to see a base farseer be the equivalent of an epistolary librarian and cast 2 spells a turn. The Eldar farseers are supposed to make librarians look like children with their ability to manipulate their psychic abilities.

boyd wrote:
If they go that route, I see Warlocks going the route of Wolf Guard - you can take several of them and break them off as unit leaders and use the rest as a Seer Council. Make the unit 0-1 and the unit can be 1-10. Count it as an elite unit and move on. Give them the option to get a jet bike, weapon options, psychic powers, and that should do it.

I'm more interested in seeing how they are going to arm the farseers and autarchs. I'd like to see a base farseer be the equivalent of an epistolary librarian and cast 2 spells a turn. The Eldar farseers are supposed to make librarians look like children with their ability to manipulate their psychic abilities.

That or the way the Court works for Necrons.

Oh please, please, please let the plastic wraithguard pan out!!! I would do a Wraith army regardless of it's competitiveness. It just isn't affordable right now when a 5-man wraithguard squad is $75.... The fact that the Wraithguard have not been Finecasted yet gives me hope!

DraconicGuardian wrote:

Oh please, please, please let the plastic wraithguard pan out!!! I would do a Wraith army regardless of it's competitiveness. It just isn't affordable right now when a 5-man wraithguard squad is $75.... The fact that the Wraithguard have not been Finecasted yet gives me hope!

From what I was reading on Warseer the use of CAD design for resin models is not really done with any frequency, and resin models are usually sculpted the traditional way. With rumors indicating that aspect and wraithguard CAD designs were seen would indicate plastic kits. Now that is speculation assuming what they were saying about CAD designs is correct. If anyone here knows more about the design process as far as the techniques GW uses these days, i.e. can confirm CAD designs are predominantly for plastic kits, please chime in!

I'm basically in the same boat as you. Eldar were my second army after SMs(of course) back in 2nd Edition and I've wanted to build an army again for some time. The lack of cheap wraithguard has made that too pricey for me until they release plastics.

So predictions...
Current HQs not in Finecast to move there...Pheonix Lords autaurachs and yeah a new Avatar please. FW Avatar FTW here so maybe not.

Some HQ in plastic...Generic Farseer and new Warlocks I'm looking at you. Eldrad and box set prohibitive to starters and somewhat dated. Basing this off of Empire releases not sk much he DE as all their HQ are Finecast...but not only insquaf sized boxes.

Doubt any aspects besides spiders and shining spears will be redone. They were all redone last go around.

Wraithguard are metal 1 per blister and 17$. I could see a complete reimagining along the size of DE grotesques something more akin to a half size Wraithlord.

Viper is old as well as jet bikes could easily agree they will be redone.

As far as guardians go they only need a defender upgrades ie separate sprue or blister...but the lack of variation int he current upgrades sucks so why not add a separate new box with running legs and dynamic poses? Just please isn't have separate halts of the torso...please.

I honestly don't think Eldar will get a flyer. Our codex is congested with barely differing units as is. Where would a flyer go? I think there is a higher likely hood dark reapers get handed an AA role or Exarch upgrade...but greed is good and if eldar need a "legolas class jetcraft" and it will sell Im sure it would hit in a wave. I just don't know how Eldar can expand with new unit which won't overlap...I think Eldar are very close to hitting deminishing returns on new units.

Of course Eldar will get a flyer model. They want to sell you models.

Task and Purpose wrote:I honestly don't think Eldar will get a flyer. Our codex is congested with barely differing units as is. Where would a flyer go? I think there is a higher likely hood dark reapers get handed an AA role or Exarch upgrade...but greed is good and if eldar need a "legolas class jetcraft" and it will sell Im sure it would hit in a wave. I just don't know how Eldar can expand with new unit which won't overlap...I think Eldar are very close to hitting reminiscing returns on new units.

Rumor has it, 6thEd will have models outright classified as fliers or have the ability to act as one at times.

Plus, the Forge World 'base' Eldar flier is a stupidly fast and agile interceptor specialized in destroying other fliers, and failing that, making strafing runs. It'd be nice if the new codex simply has a Hornet knockoff.

The current Eldar vehicles are little more than APC, IFV, Jeep, and Tank except slightly faster than other races because of their Eldarmagics. The entire Eldar vehicle line was originally analogous to the Space Marine vehicles except flying.

Absolutionis wrote:

Task and Purpose wrote:I honestly don't think Eldar will get a flyer. Our codex is congested with barely differing units as is. Where would a flyer go? I think there is a higher likely hood dark reapers get handed an AA role or Exarch upgrade...but greed is good and if eldar need a "legolas class jetcraft" and it will sell Im sure it would hit in a wave. I just don't know how Eldar can expand with new unit which won't overlap...I think Eldar are very close to hitting reminiscing returns on new units.

Rumor has it, 6thEd will have models outright classified as fliers or have the ability to act as one at times.

Plus, the Forge World 'base' Eldar flier is a stupidly fast and agile interceptor specialized in destroying other fliers, and failing that, making strafing runs. It'd be nice if the new codex simply has a Hornet knockoff.

The current Eldar vehicles are little more than APC, IFV, Jeep, and Tank except slightly faster than other races because of their Eldarmagics. The entire Eldar vehicle line was originally analogous to the Space Marine vehicles except flying.

Right, but I don't see a plastic analogue to a FW flyer becoming available...and the Vyper and Falcon which arguably do the same thing...just no missiles like the DE flyer. So redo the Vyper and add some missiles maybe?

wake me up when we get pics of plastic wraith guard and a new Avatar.....untill then

also, I'd like to see plastic rangers but that'll never happen. the finecast ones look too good for now :/

Frankly, we have alot of good minis in the range already, some of the best in the game. It's the rules that i'm mostly interested in.

I'd love to see a change in the way the Vyper is deployed. Once upon a time it was known as the Vyper Jetbike... yes jetbike. Seeing it as an upgrade for a standard Jetbike squad would be heavenly... with the jetbike movement rules included. Imagine a heavy weapons platform supporting a squad that can pop out shoot and jump back with the rest of the unit... and it's a troops choice (addon). I'd suddenly see them being used in games more often. Then promote the Hornet to fullfill the Vypers current Fast Attack role as the new FA light gunship.

Spot on Morachi, couldnt agree more.

I havent had use out of my vypers for years. Having them like an attackbike type upgrade would be great.

Heres hopin.

To add my 2 cents, they changed the Chimera and the Rhino frame a few years back. The rhino now looks amazing and is about 25% larger than the previous frame.

That required a recall and all new sculpts for everything related to them. Whirlwind, Predator, Ba'al, Vindicator, Rhino, Razor back.

When they changed the Chimera they had to redo the Basalisk as well, which was pretty big as it was the only imperial guard artillery choice at the time.

They also changed the Landraider which wasn't as big a deal as nothing else was based on it.

Celtic Strike wrote:To add my 2 cents, they changed the Chimera and the Rhino frame a few years back. The rhino now looks amazing and is about 25% larger than the previous frame.

That required a recall and all new sculpts for everything related to them. Whirlwind, Predator, Ba'al, Vindicator, Rhino, Razor back.

When they changed the Chimera they had to redo the Basalisk as well, which was pretty big as it was the only imperial guard artillery choice at the time.

They also changed the Landraider which wasn't as big a deal as nothing else was based on it.

The Rhino got changed in the late 90s. At the time, Razorbacks, Predators, Vindicators and Whirlwinds were all metal conversion kits for the plastic base model. The Chimera was just changed in the last two or three years, and that was only after the new hull was used in the Manticore/Deathstrike kit. The Basilisk was not redone at all; they just put the old Basilisk gun sprues in the box with the new kit. There was previously a Griffon which had the metal gun and gunshield on top of the plastic base Chimera, but it has since been discontinued. It would work in the current chimera though.

In other words, all of these things were trivial or cheap to produce metal molds. They never had expensive to produce extra plastic sprues that would no longer fit on a newer design, like the Wave Serpent and Fire Prism/Night Spinner kits. In other words, I don't see them changing the base Falcon body because it has aged extremely well and people like the look of it still. I could possibly see a recut like the Chimera kit where the base body assembly is just simplified for the sake of getting more bits on the sprue and cutting complexity of the kit, but if I recall the Falcon goes together pretty easily. So yeah, if there is a larger Eldar vehicle chassis, it would probably be for some kind of new heavy tank.

Kroothawk wrote:I think it is a bit too early to whine about the rules released in about a year. Not sure if the book is written at all ATM.
So new jetbike, several point reductions and new finecast characters is not exactly a new and insightful rumour.

QFT

Excited/Nervous to see what changes comes. The aspect-troop dynamic could be a lot of fun and offer some more list variation potentially. I would love to see a new avatar sculpt and just the esthetic evolution in general will be interesting to see. As anyone thinking about a new codex I'm a little nervous about what kind of nerfs/points changes will effect me but I will pray to Isha that there are some fun and positive changes.

My buddy whoops my Space Wolves with his Footdar list. Wraithguard are silly good especially with Eldrad. While much of the current Codex is underpowered, there is some stuff that could use a nerf as well.

The Rhino got changed in the late 90s. At the time, Razorbacks, Predators, Vindicators and Whirlwinds were all metal conversion kits for the plastic base model. The Chimera was just changed in the last two or three years, and that was only after the new hull was used in the Manticore/Deathstrike kit. The Basilisk was not redone at all; they just put the old Basilisk gun sprues in the box with the new kit. There was previously a Griffon which had the metal gun and gunshield on top of the plastic base Chimera, but it has since been discontinued. It would work in the current chimera though.

In other words, all of these things were trivial or cheap to produce metal molds. They never had expensive to produce extra plastic sprues that would no longer fit on a newer design, like the Wave Serpent and Fire Prism/Night Spinner kits. In other words, I don't see them changing the base Falcon body because it has aged extremely well and people like the look of it still. I could possibly see a recut like the Chimera kit where the base body assembly is just simplified for the sake of getting more bits on the sprue and cutting complexity of the kit, but if I recall the Falcon goes together pretty easily. So yeah, if there is a larger Eldar vehicle chassis, it would probably be for some kind of new heavy tank.

Yeah, that's true, but changing the wave serpent/ Falcon body wouldn't change the turret options if they did it right. Making the base bigger wouldn't necessarily alter the turret. If the plug in point was the same it wouldn't look out of place. I don't really think they will change it but I would like them too, having more realistically scaled vehicles would be rather nice.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

StoneRaizer wrote:My buddy whoops my Space Wolves with his Footdar list. Wraithguard are silly good especially with Eldrad. While much of the current Codex is underpowered, there is some stuff that could use a nerf as well.

Also, if you think Wraithguard are OP at 36 points each you haven't played against them well enough. haha.

Morachi wrote:Frankly, we have alot of good minis in the range already, some of the best in the game. It's the rules that i'm mostly interested in.

I'd love to see a change in the way the Vyper is deployed. Once upon a time it was known as the Vyper Jetbike... yes jetbike. Seeing it as an upgrade for a standard Jetbike squad would be heavenly... with the jetbike movement rules included. Imagine a heavy weapons platform supporting a squad that can pop out shoot and jump back with the rest of the unit... and it's a troops choice (addon). I'd suddenly see them being used in games more often. Then promote the Hornet to fullfill the Vypers current Fast Attack role as the new FA light gunship.

I could see this as very possible, given what the new "Storm Talon" for Space Marines is supposed to do. An "escort" for a Jetbike unit. However, if you want it to function with the "Jetbike" rule....that would probably mean it getting a statline more akin to an attack bike than a vehicle?

More than likely, which I would be fine with. Something like W2 etc would be just dandy. A rule akin to Aerial Assault would be nice to take full advantage of a Shuriken Cannon and Scatter Laser would be great (being able to fire both above St4)... then again that only applies to Vehicles, and for all intents and purposes it wouldn't be one with a toughness stat. Perhaps more akin to the way a Wraithlord functions with dual weapon loadouts.

Aerial Assault for the Falcon would return it back to its former Gunship glory, however it those Hornets sneak into the main 'Dex then there will be some serious competition for the Gunship of choice. I did like the move of the Night Spinner to a FA slot in IA11, opened up some very interesting FOC mixes. As did the introduction of Wasps, giving back that element of speed and "hide & seek" to the Eldar once more. If this became reality we might find Eldar skirmish tactics closely following their equiv BFG playstyle.

Small, Far Away wrote:I so desperatly want this codex to rock. I really want to play my Eldar again.

I for one look forward to more Eldar coming out of the closet.

No plastic Wraithguard? Bah.

Vampirate of Sartosa wrote:No plastic Wraithguard? Bah.

I know that's what I want too!

Although they would be in the dreaded 3 for $54.50 category, I'm sure...

Can someone tell me what is the point of posting a rumor with little to no real information?

Alpharius wrote:

Vampirate of Sartosa wrote:No plastic Wraithguard? Bah.

I know that's what I want too!

Although they would be in the dreaded 3 for $54.50 category, I'm sure...

I somewhat disagree. Raveners were in that category, but they were also originally $20-22 for a single model in metal. Wraithguard are overcosted at $15, and that's only $45 for three.

At worst, it'd be Terminator-prices. Wraithguard are essentially the Eldar analogue to Terminators.

Absolutionis wrote:

Alpharius wrote:

Vampirate of Sartosa wrote:No plastic Wraithguard? Bah.

I know that's what I want too!

Although they would be in the dreaded 3 for $54.50 category, I'm sure...

I somewhat disagree. Raveners were in that category, but they were also originally $20-22 for a single model in metal. Wraithguard are overcosted at $15, and that's only $45 for three.

At worst, it'd be Terminator-prices. Wraithguard are essentially the Eldar analogue to Terminators.

Well, what I do know is that it's the only thing that would prompt me to start an Eldar army.

Absolutionis wrote:

Alpharius wrote:

Vampirate of Sartosa wrote:No plastic Wraithguard? Bah.

I know that's what I want too!

Although they would be in the dreaded 3 for $54.50 category, I'm sure...

I somewhat disagree. Raveners were in that category, but they were also originally $20-22 for a single model in metal. Wraithguard are overcosted at $15, and that's only $45 for three.

At worst, it'd be Terminator-prices. Wraithguard are essentially the Eldar analogue to Terminators.

I want you to be right, but I can't see GW giving us 5 plastic Wraithguard for $50.

Not even Killa Kans are that expensive, and I'm sure they're a lot bigger than a Wraithguard.

Alpharius wrote:

Absolutionis wrote:

Alpharius wrote:

Vampirate of Sartosa wrote:No plastic Wraithguard? Bah.

I know that's what I want too!

Although they would be in the dreaded 3 for $54.50 category, I'm sure...

I somewhat disagree. Raveners were in that category, but they were also originally $20-22 for a single model in metal. Wraithguard are overcosted at $15, and that's only $45 for three.

At worst, it'd be Terminator-prices. Wraithguard are essentially the Eldar analogue to Terminators.

I want you to be right, but I can't see GW giving us 5 plastic Wraithguard for $50.

Those industrious enough will find ways to make Wraithguard affordable:




Given the new Immortals plastics being a little larger and more attractively stanced than Warriors, I'm eyeballing them as the basis for my conversions. Alph and RiTides get a hearty thanks for nabbing a box of them at Adepticon for me.

I'm reserving judgement on any new Eldar rumors. The viability of Ghost Army and Saim-Hann (for my Exodites) as effective army builds and the advent of 6th will determine whether or not my Eldars will see time on the table. I'm not going to buy a whole new army just to cherrypick what's the new hotness. I don't mind old and busted so much.

Gavin Thorne wrote:

Alpharius wrote:

Absolutionis wrote:

Alpharius wrote:

Vampirate of Sartosa wrote:No plastic Wraithguard? Bah.

I know that's what I want too!

Although they would be in the dreaded 3 for $54.50 category, I'm sure...

I somewhat disagree. Raveners were in that category, but they were also originally $20-22 for a single model in metal. Wraithguard are overcosted at $15, and that's only $45 for three.

At worst, it'd be Terminator-prices. Wraithguard are essentially the Eldar analogue to Terminators.

I want you to be right, but I can't see GW giving us 5 plastic Wraithguard for $50.

Those industrious enough will find ways to make Wraithguard affordable:

I'll take 10, or maybe 20, please!

Those are VERY nice indeed!

cgage00 wrote:Can someone tell me what is the point of posting a rumor with little to no real information?

You do know which sub-forum you're in right? Check the top where it says 'News & Rumors'.

My only 2 cents is that i'd welcome a larger chassis for the wave serpent only.

The modified falcon chassis just look too much like a falcon.
If GW wanted it could say make a new wave serpent, something the size of a land raider similar to how the epic model was (essentially an up-scaled falcon), and allow current players to reclassify their current wave serpents as a type of falcon variant, which is what it currently looks like.

DraconicGuardian wrote:

Oh please, please, please let the plastic wraithguard pan out!!! I would do a Wraith army regardless of it's competitiveness. It just isn't affordable right now when a 5-man wraithguard squad is $75.... The fact that the Wraithguard have not been Finecasted yet gives me hope!

I agree completely. I really love the Wraithguard model, and Ive love to have 20 or so (for use with another game system) but the cost is just too much. If they make them in plastic, and stayed pretty faithful to the current look, I would be all over 20+ of them. Even more so if they got some other weapon options as well.

Alpharius wrote:I'll take 10, or maybe 20, please!

Those are VERY nice indeed!

As soon as I get my molds made and get the bits cast up, I'll post pics of my version. If you like them enough, I'd be happy to work out a deal.

Mad4Minis wrote:I agree completely. I really love the Wraithguard model, and Ive love to have 20 or so (for use with another game system) but the cost is just too much. If they make them in plastic, and stayed pretty faithful to the current look, I would be all over 20+ of them. Even more so if they got some other weapon options as well.

That's pretty much where I stand. It would be awesomesauce if you could have one in ten carry a D-cannon over his shoulder ala the Wraithlord. If they gained Relentless, then so much the better, but I'd be happy with T6 3+/5++ troops carrying a 36" S*2+ AP2 Blast.

pretre wrote:

cgage00 wrote:Can someone tell me what is the point of posting a rumor with little to no real information?

You do know which sub-forum you're in right? Check the top where it says 'News & Rumors'.

I understand that but posting "The oldest plastic tank kit in the game will get a new plastic kits" is rather pointless unless you can say what it will look like.

I can run around saying Orks will get a new codex in 6th ed and they will re do the buggie/trak kit in plastic.
Is it true? YES
should I styart a thread on it? No
Are stick monkey's rumors ever true on their own? NEVER!!!

I love the Wraithguard and what they can do (hell I own 60 of them), but i'd much prefer Seers to get a webway gate again so they can be deployed from reserve instead of taking half a dozen turns to get up the field :(

Imagining a Jetseer zipping up and dropping a gate at the enemies front door, only to have two full units of Wraithguard pop out with a bag of rape.

*chuckles*

That'd be cool but I doubt they will give them gates back now that they have given them to DE. Just like I wanted to see a dark avatar for DE but it didn't happen.

DE had them in their ancient dex too, IIRC

A dark Avatar would be pretty cool

I wouldn't be surprised to see one appear out of Forge World.

Id love to see some plastic rangers, I have wanted to make a full ranger force for years and kit bash some aspects, guardians and warlocks out of them, would be nice to field a full unit that doesn't have 5 twin models, or the expensive direct only ranger.

cgage00 wrote:Can someone tell me what is the point of posting a rumor with little to no real information?

I'll second that sentiment. But then most every thread devolves into a bunch of junk with no information after the first post or so. Sadly, there would be no forums without the useless junk. Maybe a few blogs that simply post aggregate rumors and news without pages of junk posts and trolling following the news would be a good idea? Oh, wait, those already exist.

ceorron wrote:My only 2 cents is that i'd welcome a larger chassis for the wave serpent only.

The modified falcon chassis just look too much like a falcon.
If GW wanted it could say make a new wave serpent, something the size of a land raider similar to how the epic model was (essentially an up-scaled falcon), and allow current players to reclassify their current wave serpents as a type of falcon variant, which is what it currently looks like.

I want the return of the Space Marine/Titan Legions Wave Serpent. The one that fit as much as a Thunderhawk and used its forcefield as a weapon. But I guess the current serpent has spent too many years being the equivalent of the original Falcon.

On the slightly more plausible return to previous editions front, I want the Avenger Shuriken Catapult to become the base shuricat statline, and Battle Guardians to carry lasguns instead. Just so my brother will stop complaining about the 12" shuricat and not getting to use his old guardians.

RogueRegault wrote:
On the slightly more plausible return to previous editions front, I want the Avenger Shuriken Catapult to become the base shuricat statline, and Battle Guardians to carry lasguns instead. Just so my brother will stop complaining about the 12" shuricat and not getting to use his old guardians.

Yes, that's the way to fix Guardians, give them worse guns! Just let them have the shame shuriken catapults as DA's.

I'm hoping (somewhat unrealistically) that the various aspect warriors each get their own plastic kits. Unfortunately, those prissy space elves all look so different that its doubtful they could benefit from the usual combined type of kit where you either can make two different squad types from it or use the bits on other models in your army as flair (ala the BA icons in the Death Co box).

Well if they did go plastic, it would be nice to see them sold in full squad numbers rather than in half numbers... meaning perhaps costing a little less. I wouldn't want to see dual kits for aspects, their individual look is what defines them - we don't buy Eldar to have an army with the uniform look of an Imperial Guard force afterall... well I didn't.

Morachi wrote:Well if they did go plastic, it would be nice to see them sold in full squad numbers rather than in half numbers... meaning perhaps costing a little less. I wouldn't want to see dual kits for aspects, their individual look is what defines them - we don't buy Eldar to have an army with the uniform look of an Imperial Guard force afterall... well I didn't.

I'd be shocked if they came out in 10 man kits for all the aspects. They seem to me to be a custom fit for the newer style lots o' bits and options 5 man pack that retails for almost the price of 10 that GW is fond of recently.

Don't worry - i'd be shocked too. But the aspects generally don't have all that many visible options like Smurf tactical squads, they're generally set in stone except for the Exarchs. They did it with Dire Avengers (although they are a staple Troop unit), so it's not completely off the cards, despite the probability being low - a small saving might get more buy in though if GW are looking for sales. It's the "Upsize me" theory... for a few bucks extra i'll go the large which is almost twice the size, even if I may not use them all typically.

If they were to go to multi kits, which aspects would join each other? Warp Spiders and Dark Reapers, Scorps and Banshees, Hawks and Dragons. Seems to make sense to me. Only one that seems odd is Scorps and Banshees, very different armour characteristics. Could you imagine the possibilities for kitbashed Autarchs? Would be some real cool conversions made.

I truly hope there will be new models for the warp spiders. Buffing up their weapons wouldn't be that bad either.

DE wracks, incubi and mandrakes got 5 man finecast boxes. Just saying.
It would be great to see more female models mixed in to all units, a 50% ratio would be nice and well supported by fluff. Again looking at DE, they managed to do some cool and tasteful female models the 40k universe long been lacking.

I think I'd be happy with the two following changes:

-Plastic Wraithguard. Make them 5 per box for the Terminator price.

-Guardian catapults getting the stats of the Avengers, and Avengers going up to 24" range.

Everything else I could live with staying the same.

dæl wrote:If they were to go to multi kits, which aspects would join each other? Warp Spiders and Dark Reapers, Scorps and Banshees, Hawks and Dragons. Seems to make sense to me. Only one that seems odd is Scorps and Banshees, very different armour characteristics. Could you imagine the possibilities for kitbashed Autarchs? Would be some real cool conversions made.

I think this is close to how they may well be done (if and when they get done), going by current trends in GW.

But I would say Scorpions/Dragons, Spiders/Reapers and Banshees/Hawks, the last two because they both have lighter armour and banshees would look good with leaping legs etc.

cgage00 wrote:

pretre wrote:

cgage00 wrote:Can someone tell me what is the point of posting a rumor with little to no real information?

You do know which sub-forum you're in right? Check the top where it says 'News & Rumors'.

I understand that but posting "The oldest plastic tank kit in the game will get a new plastic kits" is rather pointless unless you can say what it will look like.

I can run around saying Orks will get a new codex in 6th ed and they will re do the buggie/trak kit in plastic.
Is it true? YES
should I styart a thread on it? No
Are stick monkey's rumors ever true on their own? NEVER!!!

Hmm, good thing we made a thread to track the accuracy of rumor mongers.

cgage00 wrote:Are stick monkey's rumors ever true on their own? NEVER!!!

September 2010 (a year ahead of release):

stickmonkey wrote:All Immortal based models being redone. Because Destroyers, Lords, etc. were supposedly based on the immortal "chassis" and that has been redone "bigger", its a cascade effect. However, skimmer body base not expect to change.
Immortals possible move to Troops choice.
New Elite options
Pariahs no longer 0-1
plastic Tomb Spyder box to make TS or variant.

He also predicted Necrons released Halloween 2011 at about that time.

November 2010:

stickmonkey wrote:There are currently 7 flyers in development...some complete, some nearing completion.

December 2010:

stickmonkey wrote:Tyrannofex plastic with options to build as Tervigon - unreliable rumor as to the optional build, but I'm throwing it in
Harpy
Tyranid direct only lashwhip bonesword upgrade blister for warriors

I will add his flyer predictions in two weeks

alphaomega wrote:

dæl wrote:If they were to go to multi kits, which aspects would join each other? Warp Spiders and Dark Reapers, Scorps and Banshees, Hawks and Dragons. Seems to make sense to me. Only one that seems odd is Scorps and Banshees, very different armour characteristics. Could you imagine the possibilities for kitbashed Autarchs? Would be some real cool conversions made.

I think this is close to how they may well be done (if and when they get done), going by current trends in GW.

But I would say Scorpions/Dragons, Spiders/Reapers and Banshees/Hawks, the last two because they both have lighter armour and banshees would look good with leaping legs etc.

I think you have it spot on. Would there be any finecast units left if aspects and wraithguard go plastic?

Kroothawk wrote:I will add his flyer predictions in two weeks

Heh. I had to double check that I had all of those in my thread.

Wouldn't Spiders and Scorpions make more sense? Both are semi-sneaky in pose, both have heavy armour, and both rely on weapons that do not require two hands. Spiders posed the same way as Reapers would be rather dull and a Dragon in a crouching sneaking pose would look silly.
I just contributed nothing to the thread

I'll take it with a pinch of salt, Chaos and Dark Angels and 6th ed will be soon, I wouldn't be surprised if we don't see Eldar in 1-2 years at the earliest.

alphaomega wrote:

dæl wrote:If they were to go to multi kits, which aspects would join each other? Warp Spiders and Dark Reapers, Scorps and Banshees, Hawks and Dragons. Seems to make sense to me. Only one that seems odd is Scorps and Banshees, very different armour characteristics. Could you imagine the possibilities for kitbashed Autarchs? Would be some real cool conversions made.

I think this is close to how they may well be done (if and when they get done), going by current trends in GW.

But I would say Scorpions/Dragons, Spiders/Reapers and Banshees/Hawks, the last two because they both have lighter armour and banshees would look good with leaping legs etc.

Heh, weird- I was just talking about this the other day and that's exactly how I'd imagine they would work. I'm sure it could be done and I'd be a very happy chappy if it was! Anything to not have metal or finecast Aspects.

Man i hope the eldar are made better, i have found if i play small battles that i get slaughtered so some cheaper units will help (unless my skill just isn't that great which it may not be) however there are some improvements.

A lot of Eldar Aspect Warriors have similar base body armor, but with helmets and weapons that really set them apart. You could easily make a kit where the bodysuits are shared and give them different arms and heads to mark them as one unit or another, like the Triarch Praetorians/Lychguard box. Even so, there can always be redesigns of Eldar units to make this more viable. I've probably made this point once in the thread already but I think it bears repeating.

new Eldar can only be a good thing as and when they come. Hoping for mucho plastic and minimal FC. Plastic multi-build aspects would seem to be a no brainer but not sure how many you could do as a lot of the armours are very different. Are the Warp spiders and Avatar the oldest 40k models out there? Gotta be close....

The Eldar Jetbike is the oldest plastic kit still in production, i think..

The Avatar and Warpspiders are oldish, but not the oldest AFAIK. Could be wrong though...




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Found a thread :

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/365568.page

DiabolicAl wrote:new Eldar can only be a good thing as and when they come. Hoping for mucho plastic and minimal FC. Plastic multi-build aspects would seem to be a no brainer but not sure how many you could do as a lot of the armours are very different. Are the Warp spiders and Avatar the oldest 40k models out there? Gotta be close....

They go back to Rogue Trader, albeit the tail end shortly before 2nd ed. I know the Warlocks are from RT as well. The sculpts have held up remarkably well, but you know, Jes Goodwin and all that.

Brother SRM wrote:

DiabolicAl wrote:new Eldar can only be a good thing as and when they come. Hoping for mucho plastic and minimal FC. Plastic multi-build aspects would seem to be a no brainer but not sure how many you could do as a lot of the armours are very different. Are the Warp spiders and Avatar the oldest 40k models out there? Gotta be close....

They go back to Rogue Trader, albeit the tail end shortly before 2nd ed. I know the Warlocks are from RT as well. The sculpts have held up remarkably well, but you know, Jes Goodwin and all that.

Aye, lets hope Jes can work some of his magic on the Eldar again. Seriously, where would GW be without Goodwin??