Just went to pick up my hardback copy of Deathwatch: Ignition from my local GW store (1 of 2 in the capital city, btw my flag is messed up im Austria), of course it was approx half hour before closing time (7 p.m.; I went there around 6:30 pm)
There was absolutely nobody in the store except the lone redshirt at the counter. I kinda felt sorry for him.
So anyway, I know GW has switched to one man stores for about 2 or 3 years now, my question is how well are the GW stores doing? I know it varies vastly from location to location, but is it true that there is a general trend of fewer and fewer people coming to GW stores to play?
I remember in the mid and late 2000s (I was introduced to the hobby in 2004) the GW stores were almost packed (we had people playing on almost all available tables, there were dudes painting at the painting station, 2 or 3 customers chatting with the redshirts at the counter etc.)
What led to the fall?
The rise in quality of minis the competition has to offer?
GW's increasing price hikes?
The rise of discount online third party retailers who sell GW stuff so you can just order from the internet?
A new generation growing up even more with video games replacing traditional tabletop as entertainment?
Economic crisis meaning less disposable income for people in general?
The excuse I heard for there being only one staff member in stores from one of my local GW store managers was that there was some restructuring around the time the GFC hit, and one of the big ways they saved money was to bring it down to one staff member per store. I'm sure there are other reasons (such as some of the ones you mentioned) that have also contributed to the situation, but from what I can gather, the GFC was the driving force.
As for how successful these stores are, it really is a store-by-store basis. For reasons of privacy I won't get into the details, but for the two stores I go to: you'd expect one of them to be doing better because it has more parking, it's easy to get to by car and public transport (arguably) and it's a bigger store with more tables (which are also larger) as well as more painting tables and displays. But in fact it's the smaller store that's done better.
So as I said, I reckon it's a store-by-store basis with success, and the one-staff shops have their roots in the GFC.
Letting the in-store community/tournament scene die, is what is killing them, there is no need to go to the store anymore, If GW is just a "miniature" company then the online store will suffice.
I think the success of a GW is dependant on more than having one man operating the store. The problem comes when the store is reasonably busy and there's still only 1 man and he can't keep up with it and they really need to expand to more operators. Also when the store can't stay open late due to lack of support, but that depends on the manager, my local store manages to stay open reasonably late on thursdays and fridays (not super late, but most stores aren't open past 9pm anyway).
My local GW has been revived the past few years, it surprised me but most nights you can go in there and find people at the very least painting stuff and occasionally using the tables.
But the weird hours due to having only 1 person operating the store and also the long wait if he suddenly has to serve multiple customers is quite annoying. It's largely stopped me buying stuff because a couple of times I was just stopping in quickly to grab something on my way to or from work and had to wait ages to get served or the store wasn't even open.
It has been pointed out to me that the question may not be 'Is a one man store better than a fully staffed store?', but rather 'Is a one man store better than no store?'.
That it is the idea of brick and mortar gaming stores, specializing in all GW, all the time, are a viable business.
Cutting the stores down to one man did not make them more successful, it just made them more profitable - or even... just profitable.
I actually think that diversifying their stores might have worked better than eliminating staff....
I actually think that diversifying their stores might have worked better than eliminating staff....
Carrying the merchandise that they license would be a nice start. It's funny because my local GW store manager bemoans how he doesn't have enough space for product and not nearly enough space for tables, but even he (mirroring the schitzophrenic nature of GW in regards to their retail strategy) will then turn around and say, "Well, this is a modeling store, not a gaming store." No wonder they are re-branding the stores to just say Warhammer. "What games?"
It's just a mess and supposedly whatever organized play they have coming down the pipes will not be in GW stores, but independent stores only. I was speechless when he told me that.
I talk to him about the company and store issues all the time as I used to manage that store directly before him, so I get a little bit of "insider" still, but they still don't tell their people squat (hehe) about what is going on. Said really.
The rise in quality of minis the competition has to offer?
GW's increasing price hikes?
The rise of discount online third party retailers who sell GW stuff so you can just order from the internet?
Economic crisis meaning less disposable income for people in general?
I think all of these, plus GW's lack of involvement in the community really hurt them. The ease of finding those discount retailers and competing models online is also a factor, since while a lot of people had the Internet in 2004, it was nowhere near what it is today.
TheAuldGrump wrote: It has been pointed out to me that the question may not be 'Is a one man store better than a fully staffed store?', but rather 'Is a one man store better than no store?'.
I'm not sure anymore. The 1-man stores don't carry anything you can't get from an independent or any other store, and you often need to order in anyway as they keep such little stock. So from that point of view it's minimal value, at best. I reached a point quickly where the capital city GW store didn't stock anything I wanted (mostly metal guard stuff at the time), so it was only of value for paints and everything else needed to be special ordered.
Then there's availability of the store; the 1-man stores can't be open as much as a 2-man store, you can't really play long games in them as you need to get kicked out for lunch and any bathroom breaks. You can't guarantee it's open at any given point, so long trips to it on spec are a gamble (I made a 30 minute drive to buy a new army to find it closed, for instance).
Then there's the availability of the staff; the big advantage is that you have an expert to ask questions and get help with. That's great, but if there is another customer in you have to split time, so you may be waiting ages or keep getting interrupted. Since the 1-man stores seem to be staffed more and more by people who have no hobby experience, the value of that assistance is minimal.
So I guess it's better than no store at all, by a small margin. But it's far poorer than a real store, and doesn't provide anything I couldn't get from an FLGS or a shelf at a craft store.
Would I mourn my nearest 1-man GW closing? To be honest, it'd probably take me months to notice it's so hidden away. I've bought a total of 2 paints from them, and I can get them from a closer independent anyway. At least the multi-man has gaming tables.
What is the real question is .. Why go to a Games Workshop store if your FLGS stocks the same?
I lived just a few hours away from the Memphis battle bunker but never went to it... Why??
There is nothing special there to draw me in.. If they sold Forge World or had a set up like Nottingham,
I would consider going..
One man store is trying to reduce over head... but what about higher sales to make up for over head..
I live in Chicago and I have only been to 1 or 2 stores that really needed more then one person to run.
One was located in a very busy mall (not sure if they are still there or not) and the other was in a strip mall. The one located in a strip mall was busy when I was there, not sure if its like that every weekend, but it could definitely be handled by one person, the only thing I would worry about would be theft especially when having to play cashier.
The other stores I've been to were small enough where if you needed someone to help you... you probably shouldnt be a manager lol
Yes I do see the managers by there lonesome but thats usually during the week, not the weekend when games are going on.
I think you underestimate how hard it is to do *anything* when you're the only one there.
You have to close the store to take a dump
You can't visit the stock room when a customer is in
You can't supervise games whilst dealing with a customer
You can't deal with cash/stock/book-keeping when a customer is in
You can't tidy up or clean when a customer is in
You can't handle more than 1 customer at a time
Basically, you're pinned to the register for all but the briefest intervals. You can't really do much of the above when the store is open, because what happens if a customer comes in whilst you're already in the back rummaging for stock?
Literally the only other stores I've encountered with a single staff member are mall kiosks (where they usually have a neighbour to cover for them), or a sandwich shop that was really struggling and couldn't afford a 2nd staff member.
Genoside07 wrote: What is the real question is .. Why go to a Games Workshop store if your FLGS stocks the same?
I lived just a few hours away from the Memphis battle bunker but never went to it... Why??
There is nothing special there to draw me in.. If they sold Forge World or had a set up like Nottingham,
I would consider going..
One man store is trying to reduce over head... but what about higher sales to make up for over head..
Price isn't the only factor in purchasing. Personally I value availability and convenience more on some purchases as I find I have more money than time. That is not always the case though.
Its a truism but a GW store is going to push 40k/AoS so that's perfect if you want that strongly represented in your group. It is less certain what support an independent will give your particular game system or for how long if something new comes out.
Will one person stores continue - yeah I suppose so. They've been about for a while now and don't seem to have drastically changed anything. ONe person is a perfectly manageable model (hell most small shops have been since time immemorial!) plus I don't imagine GW are so staid that they wont make keytime staff available for store that have busy periods. That's certainly true of the 3-4 GWs near me where you can expect an extra guy at weekends.
TheAuldGrump wrote: It has been pointed out to me that the question may not be 'Is a one man store better than a fully staffed store?', but rather 'Is a one man store better than no store?'.
I'm not sure anymore. The 1-man stores don't carry anything you can't get from an independent or any other store, and you often need to order in anyway as they keep such little stock. So from that point of view it's minimal value, at best. I reached a point quickly where the capital city GW store didn't stock anything I wanted (mostly metal guard stuff at the time), so it was only of value for paints and everything else needed to be special ordered.
Then there's availability of the store; the 1-man stores can't be open as much as a 2-man store, you can't really play long games in them as you need to get kicked out for lunch and any bathroom breaks. You can't guarantee it's open at any given point, so long trips to it on spec are a gamble (I made a 30 minute drive to buy a new army to find it closed, for instance).
Then there's the availability of the staff; the big advantage is that you have an expert to ask questions and get help with. That's great, but if there is another customer in you have to split time, so you may be waiting ages or keep getting interrupted. Since the 1-man stores seem to be staffed more and more by people who have no hobby experience, the value of that assistance is minimal.
So I guess it's better than no store at all, by a small margin. But it's far poorer than a real store, and doesn't provide anything I couldn't get from an FLGS or a shelf at a craft store.
Would I mourn my nearest 1-man GW closing? To be honest, it'd probably take me months to notice it's so hidden away. I've bought a total of 2 paints from them, and I can get them from a closer independent anyway. At least the multi-man has gaming tables.
More 'better from a corporate standpoint' than 'better from a consumer standpoint'.
From a consumer standpoint... I will take the general FLGS over the dedicated GW store - whether corporate or independent.
My area now has two dedicated GW stores, one is independent, doing fairly well... and GW did what GW does, and moved into the area..
Now neither store is doing well.
They did not grow the market, merely split it between two stores.
TheAuldGrump wrote: It has been pointed out to me that the question may not be 'Is a one man store better than a fully staffed store?', but rather 'Is a one man store better than no store?'.
I'm not sure anymore. The 1-man stores don't carry anything you can't get from an independent or any other store, and you often need to order in anyway as they keep such little stock. So from that point of view it's minimal value, at best. I reached a point quickly where the capital city GW store didn't stock anything I wanted (mostly metal guard stuff at the time), so it was only of value for paints and everything else needed to be special ordered.
Then there's availability of the store; the 1-man stores can't be open as much as a 2-man store, you can't really play long games in them as you need to get kicked out for lunch and any bathroom breaks. You can't guarantee it's open at any given point, so long trips to it on spec are a gamble (I made a 30 minute drive to buy a new army to find it closed, for instance).
Then there's the availability of the staff; the big advantage is that you have an expert to ask questions and get help with. That's great, but if there is another customer in you have to split time, so you may be waiting ages or keep getting interrupted. Since the 1-man stores seem to be staffed more and more by people who have no hobby experience, the value of that assistance is minimal.
So I guess it's better than no store at all, by a small margin. But it's far poorer than a real store, and doesn't provide anything I couldn't get from an FLGS or a shelf at a craft store.
Would I mourn my nearest 1-man GW closing? To be honest, it'd probably take me months to notice it's so hidden away. I've bought a total of 2 paints from them, and I can get them from a closer independent anyway. At least the multi-man has gaming tables.
More 'better' from a corporate standpoint than a consumer standpoint.
From a consumer standpoint... I will take the general FLGS over the dedicated GW store - whether corporate or independent.
My area now has two dedicated GW stores, one is independent, doing fairly well... and GW did what GW does, and moved into the area..
Now neither store is doing well.
They did not grow the market, merely split it between two stores.
The Auld Grump
GW will no doubt sink some cash into the crisis to outlive the FLGS... kinda sad to see that sort of behaviour
I'd imagine GW would just close down it's own store due to lack of profts, and re-open in a few years when the other store starts doing well again.
That said, it's entirely possible it's not the GW store that's causing the problems, and the local area is just going off Warhamer.
TheAuldGrump wrote: [More 'better from a corporate standpoint' than 'better from a consumer standpoint'.
Yeah I guess, if you work on the basis that the customer will go to lengths to buy stuff anyway, then it makes sense to pay as little as possible for your sales channel. But then if customers are doing that work why not just point them at the webstore for even more profit?
Herzlos wrote: I'd imagine GW would just close down it's own store due to lack of profts, and re-open in a few years when the other store starts doing well again.
That said, it's entirely possible it's not the GW store that's causing the problems, and the local area is just going off Warhamer.
TheAuldGrump wrote: [More 'better from a corporate standpoint' than 'better from a consumer standpoint'.
Yeah I guess, if you work on the basis that the customer will go to lengths to buy stuff anyway, then it makes sense to pay as little as possible for your sales channel. But then if customers are doing that work why not just point them at the webstore for even more profit?
Of course, there is also the fact that it means that they are treating their retailers as competitors.
Moving a one man store into an area that already has a successful dedicated store, to chisel out that extra 25% profit... is kind of a move.
When it results in both stores going under it is a stupid move.
No because running a successful retail store is a different business than running a game company. Disney sold off all their retail stores to children's place because they didn't want to be in the retail business. Hasbro shut down their games stores too. If two big companies like Hasbro and Disney can't do it, what makes GW think they can?
Having a store that sells one product in a niche market and thinking it can be profitable is insane. What GW needs to do is look at the stores like a marketing tool. If it breaks even then keep it. They will expose new customers to the brand and even if people don't buy at the store they might buy elsewhere.
I would personally shut down most stores except in high profile cities and focus the money and attention on supporting local game stores. Hire merchandisers who travel to local stores, run games and demos for the store owners, help the owners merchandise their products, give out promotional materials. Also hit the conventions and do similar things there.
We wrote: No because running a successful retail store is a different business than running a game company. Disney sold off all their retail stores to children's place because they didn't want to be in the retail business. Hasbro shut down their games stores too. If two big companies like Hasbro and Disney can't do it, what makes GW think they can?
Having a store that sells one product in a niche market and thinking it can be profitable is insane. What GW needs to do is look at the stores like a marketing tool. If it breaks even then keep it. They will expose new customers to the brand and even if people don't buy at the store they might buy elsewhere.
I would personally shut down most stores except in high profile cities and focus the money and attention on supporting local game stores. Hire merchandisers who travel to local stores, run games and demos for the store owners, help the owners merchandise their products, give out promotional materials. Also hit the conventions and do similar things there.
I would agree with this, there isn't really ever a reason to go to a GW store. They don't offer anything a FLGS doesn't offer. Most don't even let you game there.
I wonder though if GW has trapped themselves. A lot of LGS don't like them and have stopped selling their products or supporting their games. It used to be there was always at least one game of 40k or WFB being played with a few stalwarts. It seems like now though, most of the stores I go to are just ex players who are salty as feth. Even the guys throwing dice around pretty much acknowledge being kinda fed up with GW. If they closed all their stores down, I don't know if the LGS would be welcoming them back with open arms. Sure there will always be supporters, but the market opened up to competition now and isn't likely to close.
My thing is: why bother going into a GW when the online store, and indeed discount retailers, have a way better selection? You can also save money.
The only time I find myself going into a GW is when I want a kit asap, and my LGS which is close to me doesn't have it. Then I'll drive the extra 20 mins to buy what I'd like to work on that day.
As far as the gaming goes, imo the staff were pretty strict with what can be done in the store. When my friends and I used to chill at the local GW to use their tables (we always bought something, even if it was a paint pot or whatever), the manager was a douche.
We couldn't use Forge World stuff, if it wasn't 3-paints + based it couldn't be on the tables - even if we assembled and bought it that day we couldn't play it to try it out. Don't dare discuss buying models off eBay or online trading sites/swaps. Other game systems were off-limits as well. Rules clarification? Don't ask, they aren't 'walking rulebooks' as it was put to us one time. Eventually I just bought a realm of battle board, and overnight they lost our attendance in bulk. Jerkoffs.
Anyway, that location closed last year. A new store opened up and it's a one-man operation with a new fellow who seems cool enough. Hours are all over the place though, and they seem to change on a monthly basis (updated often on the FB page).
As far as the gaming goes, imo the staff were pretty strict with what can be done in the store. When my friends and I used to chill at the local GW to use their tables (we always bought something, even if it was a paint pot or whatever), the manager was a douche.
We couldn't use Forge World stuff, if it wasn't 3-paints + based it couldn't be on the tables - even if we assembled and bought it that day we couldn't play it to try it out. Don't dare discuss buying models off eBay or online trading sites/swaps. Other game systems were off-limits as well. Rules clarification? Don't ask, they aren't 'walking rulebooks' as it was put to us one time. Eventually I just bought a realm of battle board, and overnight they lost our attendance in bulk. Jerkoffs.
Anyway, that location closed last year. A new store opened up and it's a one-man operation with a new fellow who seems cool enough. Hours are all over the place though, and they seem to change on a monthly basis (updated often on the FB page).
To be fair, essentially all the stuff you listed is manager dependent, but I understand where you are coming from. I travel 50 minutes to buy/paint/play at a GW store because I can't walk into an LGS and do the same there without someone trying to grind their +1 Axes of GW Hate on me.
A good indy store will blow the pants off a GW store in regards to service and play support. Always support them 1st if able to is my honest opion on the situation. I wouldn't realy be that upset if my local GW store closed down. I would just have to drive a extra 5-10 min to go to the indy. I only shop/play at the GW because it's closer to me.
Herzlos wrote: I think you underestimate how hard it is to do *anything* when you're the only one there.
You have to close the store to take a dump
You can't visit the stock room when a customer is in
You can't supervise games whilst dealing with a customer
You can't deal with cash/stock/book-keeping when a customer is in
You can't tidy up or clean when a customer is in
You can't handle more than 1 customer at a time
Basically, you're pinned to the register for all but the briefest intervals. You can't really do much of the above when the store is open, because what happens if a customer comes in whilst you're already in the back rummaging for stock?
Literally the only other stores I've encountered with a single staff member are mall kiosks (where they usually have a neighbour to cover for them), or a sandwich shop that was really struggling and couldn't afford a 2nd staff member.
Have you ever visited a GW store before?
You have to close the store to take a dump - Hang a sign "Be back in 15 mins" They all do this, or hold it in until lunch.
You can't visit the stock room when a customer is in - 98% of GW's 1 man store inventory is on the shelves.
You can't supervise games whilst dealing with a customer - You dont need to supervise a game. Your job is to sell, you can answer questions when they come up and play judge, but this is not their primary job.
You can't deal with cash/stock/book-keeping when a customer is in - Book keeping is done end of day with no customers in store. Stock is out on shelves already a mention.
You can't tidy up or clean when a customer is in - They are hardware stores, cleaning can be done end of day when everyone leaves.
You can't handle more than 1 customer at a time - Unless its the weekend yuo dont really see to many people in the store at once, and most of the time people are just looking anyways.
Basically, you're pinned to the register for all but the briefest intervals. You can't really do much of the above when the store is open, because what happens if a customer comes in whilst you're already in the back rummaging for stock? You are not pinned to the register, there isnt an overflow of customers piling into GW stores and buying out there stock. The only thing the store manager would need to go to the back room for is Web orders. These should all be labeled ready to go before the store opens. So it should take the manager 30 seconds to grab and go.
I've worked in hardware stores that are easily 100x bigger then small 1 man GW stores with only 3 people. 1 cashier, myself and the manager and have a lot more people to deal with then a GW store. Like i said, a 1 man GW store is just that and shouldnt need more then 1 to run it.
I've been going to GW stores on and off for 20 years. Admittedly the last few I've tried to visit have been closed.
They still need to close the store for lunch, and what if you have people playing a game at the time? a "Back in 15" sign is fine somewhere your customer visits are pretty short, like a newsagent, but pretty terrible if a big part of your business model i that customers can use the space to game/paint.
It's pretty sad that most of the stock is on the shelves, but that just goes to highlight how poor the stock is - there's usually like 1 of everything but the big sellers and new releases, with a weekly restock, so popping in to get something on spec is risky.
Book-keeping and cleaning after hours - in order to do that you have to reduce your open hours further because you're paying the staff to be in when the store isn't making money, or your stretching the working day too far. With cleaning, you may need to reactively clean up during the day - a customer's baby may have been sick (happens with mine all the fething time).
It's easy to run much larger stores with 3 people, the issue isn't with employees per sq foot or per $ in sales, it's about the ability to multi-task. 3 staff members means that if 1 is tied up with something, the other 2 are about to take over and unless you're particularly busy you should be able to manage that without any down time. With a single staff member any distraction at all takes them away from the customers and causes down-time. Did your hardware store have to close for half an hour for lunch, or did you take lunch in turns, for instance?
Edit; I've worked in bars by myself and it's amazing how little you can get done unless it's dead. And I've always had someone in another bar to provide cover.
I think that's the point though, there are long periods of inactivity in the stores anyway. Whenever I go into my local GW, if it's a week day, it's usually just me and the manager, and he's usually painting. Sure sometimes there are a few regulars playing a game, or a random that's wandered in looking for Hornby stuff.
But that's about it. People work on their own in shops all over the world, it's standard practice. It's hardly some Maverick move by GW.
There's large slabs of the day where you can probably get away with only 1 staff, but it's always going to be a liability, there's only so many times a customer will come up to your shop and see a "back in 15 minutes" sign or wait around while the only staff member has to serve 3 other people before getting to them.
And even if you can get away with only 1 staff during the day on a weekday, come the weekend or evenings if 1 staff is sufficient then you probably need to ask yourself why is the store doing so poorly that it only needs 1 staff, lol.
The number of times I have actually shown up at my local GW and found the manager out to lunch (can happen any time between 12 and 3pm since he can't kick random customers out, just the regulars) is worrying. I head down there like... once a month and I swear this happens every other time.
I can see the point though, you don't NEED two employees at 10am on a Tuesday, but the weekend shifts need two, and a second person that shows up at like 2pm thursday and friday, sends the other to a late lunch, and then stays on until like 10pm for late night gaming while the other gets to go home at a reasonable hour, could be a huge benefit.
PrehistoricUFO wrote:My thing is: why bother going into a GW when the online store, and indeed discount retailers, have a way better selection? You can also save money.
The only time I find myself going into a GW is when I want a kit asap, and my LGS which is close to me doesn't have it. Then I'll drive the extra 20 mins to buy what I'd like to work on that day.
As far as the gaming goes, imo the staff were pretty strict with what can be done in the store. When my friends and I used to chill at the local GW to use their tables (we always bought something, even if it was a paint pot or whatever), the manager was a douche.
We couldn't use Forge World stuff, if it wasn't 3-paints + based it couldn't be on the tables - even if we assembled and bought it that day we couldn't play it to try it out. Don't dare discuss buying models off eBay or online trading sites/swaps. Other game systems were off-limits as well. Rules clarification? Don't ask, they aren't 'walking rulebooks' as it was put to us one time. Eventually I just bought a realm of battle board, and overnight they lost our attendance in bulk. Jerkoffs.
Anyway, that location closed last year. A new store opened up and it's a one-man operation with a new fellow who seems cool enough. Hours are all over the place though, and they seem to change on a monthly basis (updated often on the FB page).
The problem with stock is that there is so much of it that they can't possibly hope to stock it all unless they're the size of a small department store. As for discount retailers, that just sounds like some suspicious stuff to me. And save money how? unless you;re going to these "Discount Retailers" how do you save money? Honestly, I find it good to go into a GW store if they have the stock on the shelves and if I want something else, I can easily make an order while I'm there. That being said, if you know you need to make an order to get something, then it is better (purely because of convenience) not to go in-store unless it's not out of your way to do so.
As far as staff being strict, that really depends on the store and the individual staff members. In the GW stores I've been to, we could use FW stuff and use our stuff (whether it was based and had 3 colours or not), so that sounds pretty crappy of the store(s) you went to not to let you do that. As far as talking about buying from eBay and other places, it depends on what exactly you're talking about and how you talk about it in relation to these other sellers. It tends to be a taboo subject in general, but as I said, it just depends. Other games systems being off-limits is a no brainer - you're in a GW store. That's not unreasonable.
As for being a douche about you and your friends using the tables and not clarifying rules for you, that's just being a dick.
As for changing hours all the time for the one-man store, I know of a store which runs into a similar problem. The biggest problem is not having someone to fill in (especially on short notice) if the usual person is sick or away or on holidays or something like that.
Snoopdeville3 wrote:
Herzlos wrote: I think you underestimate how hard it is to do *anything* when you're the only one there.
You have to close the store to take a dump
You can't visit the stock room when a customer is in
You can't supervise games whilst dealing with a customer
You can't deal with cash/stock/book-keeping when a customer is in
You can't tidy up or clean when a customer is in
You can't handle more than 1 customer at a time
Basically, you're pinned to the register for all but the briefest intervals. You can't really do much of the above when the store is open, because what happens if a customer comes in whilst you're already in the back rummaging for stock?
Literally the only other stores I've encountered with a single staff member are mall kiosks (where they usually have a neighbour to cover for them), or a sandwich shop that was really struggling and couldn't afford a 2nd staff member.
Have you ever visited a GW store before?
You have to close the store to take a dump - Hang a sign "Be back in 15 mins" They all do this, or hold it in until lunch.
You can't visit the stock room when a customer is in - 98% of GW's 1 man store inventory is on the shelves.
You can't supervise games whilst dealing with a customer - You dont need to supervise a game. Your job is to sell, you can answer questions when they come up and play judge, but this is not their primary job.
You can't deal with cash/stock/book-keeping when a customer is in - Book keeping is done end of day with no customers in store. Stock is out on shelves already a mention.
You can't tidy up or clean when a customer is in - They are hardware stores, cleaning can be done end of day when everyone leaves.
You can't handle more than 1 customer at a time - Unless its the weekend yuo dont really see to many people in the store at once, and most of the time people are just looking anyways.
Basically, you're pinned to the register for all but the briefest intervals. You can't really do much of the above when the store is open, because what happens if a customer comes in whilst you're already in the back rummaging for stock? You are not pinned to the register, there isnt an overflow of customers piling into GW stores and buying out there stock. The only thing the store manager would need to go to the back room for is Web orders. These should all be labeled ready to go before the store opens. So it should take the manager 30 seconds to grab and go.
I've worked in hardware stores that are easily 100x bigger then small 1 man GW stores with only 3 people. 1 cashier, myself and the manager and have a lot more people to deal with then a GW store. Like i said, a 1 man GW store is just that and shouldnt need more then 1 to run it.
This - this I agree with. A one-man store is generally very well run... right up until games night when all of the local players come out of hiding to swarm the store, but given that's a five-ish hour period on average once a week, that's not bad.
I've never been in a one man GW before my local GW has 3 members of staff. And I see people complaining about staff being restrictive but again I've never had that issue you could walk into my local GW and as long as one of the tables are free at the time you can just go ahead and play. They don't care if you use the models you just bought that are still grey. Forgeworld is 100% allowed. I personally think its one of the best wargaming stores ive been in.
Herzlos wrote: Since the 1-man stores seem to be staffed more and more by people who have no hobby experience, the value of that assistance is minimal.
This is what surprised me about the GW opening in my town. I'm almost certain that the manager has never been exposed to the game before her training meetings, but was rather hired for a "sales"position. I'm not saying that hobbyists necessarily make the best managers, but I just can't imagine someone who is not a gamer running a GW. As far as I can tell, the store (which has yet to open) is following in the footsteps of the others.
I genuinely hope that it succeeds. I really do. But the typical list of reasons why it probably won't is already forming.
Herzlos wrote: I think you underestimate how hard it is to do *anything* when you're the only one there.
You have to close the store to take a dump
You can't visit the stock room when a customer is in
You can't supervise games whilst dealing with a customer
You can't deal with cash/stock/book-keeping when a customer is in
You can't tidy up or clean when a customer is in
You can't handle more than 1 customer at a time
Basically, you're pinned to the register for all but the briefest intervals. You can't really do much of the above when the store is open, because what happens if a customer comes in whilst you're already in the back rummaging for stock?
Literally the only other stores I've encountered with a single staff member are mall kiosks (where they usually have a neighbour to cover for them), or a sandwich shop that was really struggling and couldn't afford a 2nd staff member.
Have you ever visited a GW store before?
You have to close the store to take a dump - Hang a sign "Be back in 15 mins" They all do this, or hold it in until lunch.
This is literally closing the store. Or do they leave the door open and unlocked with the sign on it and trust to the goodwill of the general public not to steal anything?
You can't visit the stock room when a customer is in - 98% of GW's 1 man store inventory is on the shelves.
So, there's still 2% of your inventory you'll need to leave the shop floor unattended for then?
You can't supervise games whilst dealing with a customer - You dont need to supervise a game. Your job is to sell, you can answer questions when they come up and play judge, but this is not their primary job.
Yes, and part of that job is supervising demo games with prospective new customers. Something that is very difficult to do if you keep getting called away.
You can't deal with cash/stock/book-keeping when a customer is in - Book keeping is done end of day with no customers in store. Stock is out on shelves already a mention.
Yeah, unfortunately admin doesn't always wait obediently to be dealt with at the end of the day, sometimes someone from HO calls up or emails and they need that info NOW. Additionally, how do you think the stock gets to the store and out on to the shelves, exactly?
You can't tidy up or clean when a customer is in - They are hardware stores, cleaning can be done end of day when everyone leaves.
Because unpaid overtime is just the bestest!
You can't handle more than 1 customer at a time - Unless its the weekend yuo dont really see to many people in the store at once, and most of the time people are just looking anyways.
This is just so bass ackwards it's laughable. "It's alright guys, just one staff member will do, it'll never get that busy and, even though you're employed as active salespeople, you're expected to just let people wonder around unengaged anyways!"
Basically, you're pinned to the register for all but the briefest intervals. You can't really do much of the above when the store is open, because what happens if a customer comes in whilst you're already in the back rummaging for stock? You are not pinned to the register, there isnt an overflow of customers piling into GW stores and buying out there stock. The only thing the store manager would need to go to the back room for is Web orders. These should all be labeled ready to go before the store opens. So it should take the manager 30 seconds to grab and go.
Right, because 30 seconds has never, in the history of man, been long enough for somebody to out something easily accessible, small and expensive in their pocket? Plus again "the shops aren't that busy" is a terrible (and sort of sad) thing to use as a counter point.
I've worked in hardware stores that are easily 100x bigger then small 1 man GW stores with only 3 people. 1 cashier, myself and the manager and have a lot more people to deal with then a GW store. Like i said, a 1 man GW store is just that and shouldnt need more then 1 to run it.
Then you've worked retail, not retail sales. Retail sales requires a much greater investment of time per customer, and can often take you out of the loop with regard to ongoing procedural stuff for minutes, if not even hours for some high ticket items, at a time.
FMCG like supermarkets etc have a much lower staffing requirement than the sort of shop GW is/is trying to be.
What I'd be furious about if I was managing a gw is all the extra time spent in terms of customer orders, the majority of which the sales and stats don't go to the store, but the online store unless the order was placed in store. That's total horesgak. A store could be in the red based on its in store sales, but in reality millions in stock could have passed through it. When I was in sales, once we started having to compete with our own business's online store it got stupid pretty quick.
I didn't work in a one man, but frequently worked solo days. Serving multiple customers is fine up to 3, after that you know that you aren't giving the till all you could have gotten. After hours restocking and cleaning isn't an issue as they get paid for it, and book keeping is just a part of retail that has to be done, and normally takes 5-10 mins if everything is there. If it isn't, you were the only one working...
Shop lifting was the main problem, especially when you start getting targeted by groups working together to try and distract you. I was always having to ask people to "put it back and don't come back".
How about less speculation, and instead a bit of input from someone who's actually ran a one-man GW store..?
I have ran two different one-man stores, one of them very successfully and profitably for close to 3 years.
When the change happened, I was pretty adamant it wouldn't work; 3 staff and 7 day opening down to just me and 5 days? Crazy! But it did work. With proper training and self-management, it really wasn't an issue running a GW store that worked.
In terms of hours and opening times/lunch breaks, mostly it was just about being clear. Stores have the main GW page, Facebook and Google with which to advertise opening hours- I just made sure they stayed consistent. I took lunch breaks at as close as possible to the same time every single day. And made sure those times were mentioned in the opening hours.
For anyone who was even vaguely regular, there was no issue with opening hours.
Yes, occasionally a 'back in 5' sign goes up on the door for a toilet break. Really I found anyone who wasn't patient enough to wait, or had issue with lunch breaks etc were pretty unreasonable to begin with and were rarely actual customers.
I never once closed for a whole day within normal opening hours- a handful of times a few hours may have been missed here and there over the years for various reasons (I once almost lopped a finger off with a hobby knife...), but never a whole day.
It was just a case of being prepared- having back up and cover in place for when necessary.
For stock, again, be prepared! Using the shelves well meant having a lot of stock on the shop floor- then you just made sure that the you had back up of the best selling stock in easy to get to places that didn't require you going off of the shop floor.
Talking about stock- all GW stores stock the same top 900 best selling product lines (plus hobby supplies). Stock levels adjust automatically based on sales- if something is popular in store, the min stock level for that kit will be raised. Managers can also alter their own stock levels within reason.
Very few FLGS (in my experience) stock anywhere near the same range and amounts as a GW.
What else was mentioned...
Um, customer service. I grew my business. A lot. That stemmed from Customer service and being able to give excellent service however many customers were in the store at a time. 6 or so customers at a time really wasn't an issue. And definitely not the issue I thought it would be before hand. It's amazing what you can do with a bit of confidence and appropriate training. I think it's too easy to get used to being part of a large team that anything less seems crazy hard.
But it's really not. It's just a matter of prioritising- find out who needs what and how fast! It's one of the advantages to greeting and having conversations with everyone who enters the store- you find out their needs.
Cashing handling/cleaning etc has been covered- it gets done at the end of the day as part of contracted hours- really not an issue... Things like dusting stock can be done while open and quiet too.
Reasons to go to a GW store:
-customer service
-conversation/social
-convenience
-learning hobby skills
-brand/store loyalty
There are many! Not everyone needs/wants any or all of these things, but many, many people do. If they didn't then the stores wouldn't exist!
I served people who knew full well they could get a discount from Element/Triple Helix/Dark Sphere etc, but they were happy to pay the difference for convenience, quickness and my customer service.
Always remember that your needs and opinions don't represent 100% of the hobby population!
That is a big old wall of text sorry!
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh quick addition- staffing levels can and will change. There are thresholds for numbers of staff based on store turnover. If you make a bunch of many, you can ask to have staff.
Xca|iber wrote: Every GW store in my area (one of which being the regional battle bunker) went out of business within a year of moving to the 1-man model.
...I'll let people draw their own conclusions.
An over-simplification of the circumstances at best is what you've described. For all the rest of us know (and maybe even you know - depending on how much you looking into the issue), the one-staff model may have been a result of progressively declining business with the closure of all the stores being the end game, with all you've done is assigning death to what was just another symptom of the disease. So my conclusion is that you haven't given us the full picture, meaning the conversion to the one-staff store may not be the cause (may not being among the most important operative words in all that I've said) of the closure of the stores.
Xca|iber wrote: Every GW store in my area (one of which being the regional battle bunker) went out of business within a year of moving to the 1-man model.
...I'll let people draw their own conclusions.
An over-simplification of the circumstances at best is what you've described. For all the rest of us know (and maybe even you know - depending on how much you looking into the issue), the one-staff model may have been a result of progressively declining business with the closure of all the stores being the end game, with all you've done is assigning death to what was just another symptom of the disease. So my conclusion is that you haven't given us the full picture, meaning the conversion to the one-staff store may not be the cause (may not being among the most important operative words in all that I've said) of the closure of the stores.
Fair enough - I'll agree that there's no way to be certain whether the switch to one-man stores caused their closure.
We can say that switching to a one-man model clearly did not provide the necessary increase in cost-efficiency (within the 1-year time frame) to keep the doors open. And now we are left with exactly zeroGW stores in my area; no battle bunker, no one-man storefronts, no nothing. With that being the case, I think it's safe to conclude that a broad reduction of store staff and the mass closure of store locations across the US has nothing to do with whether GW feels that one-man stores are a good future business model, and more to do with GW aggressively cutting costs in a desperate bid to slow their falling profits.
As for my wider opinion on the whole thing, I frankly think that GW should shutter their brick & mortar stores altogether, and move to a more distributor/FLGS-focused model like WotC, perhaps with some incentives for providing table space and the like. From what I've seen, a one-man store doesn't provide any advantages over a fully staffed store other than lower costs. So if GW wants low-cost brick & mortar locations that can recruit new customers at the rate of a fully staffed battle bunker, moving to support independent shops seems like a much better plan than dragging on with a relatively thin net of understaffed storefronts.
Honestly, my local GW is crap for that. They have the beginner level tools and an understanding of the basics, but my FLGS has a couple of slayer sword winning models in their display cases, a tong of golden demon trophies, and the owner has recently gotten an article in.. it might have been the Weathering Magazine, one of those better ones that are a ton more detailed than anything GW puts out. They also do actual classes. In general it's probably aimed more at experienced hobbiests, but I'd say the FLG is MUCH better for that.
I like my local manager, sure, and have some store loyalty because of that. Brand loyalty though... GW has burned all of that. After killing WHFB I've got no brand loyalty left.
Reasons to pick a FLGS over a GW:
- Room to actually play games.
- Much larger range of product.
- More knowledgeable staff.
- Better opening hours.
- Cheaper prices for GW product
Herzlos wrote: I think you underestimate how hard it is to do *anything* when you're the only one there.
You have to close the store to take a dump
You can't visit the stock room when a customer is in
You can't supervise games whilst dealing with a customer
You can't deal with cash/stock/book-keeping when a customer is in
You can't tidy up or clean when a customer is in
You can't handle more than 1 customer at a time
Basically, you're pinned to the register for all but the briefest intervals. You can't really do much of the above when the store is open, because what happens if a customer comes in whilst you're already in the back rummaging for stock?
Literally the only other stores I've encountered with a single staff member are mall kiosks (where they usually have a neighbour to cover for them), or a sandwich shop that was really struggling and couldn't afford a 2nd staff member.
Have you ever visited a GW store before?
You have to close the store to take a dump - Hang a sign "Be back in 15 mins" They all do this, or hold it in until lunch.
This is literally closing the store. Or do they leave the door open and unlocked with the sign on it and trust to the goodwill of the general public not to steal anything?
You can't visit the stock room when a customer is in - 98% of GW's 1 man store inventory is on the shelves.
So, there's still 2% of your inventory you'll need to leave the shop floor unattended for then?
You can't supervise games whilst dealing with a customer - You dont need to supervise a game. Your job is to sell, you can answer questions when they come up and play judge, but this is not their primary job.
Yes, and part of that job is supervising demo games with prospective new customers. Something that is very difficult to do if you keep getting called away.
You can't deal with cash/stock/book-keeping when a customer is in - Book keeping is done end of day with no customers in store. Stock is out on shelves already a mention.
Yeah, unfortunately admin doesn't always wait obediently to be dealt with at the end of the day, sometimes someone from HO calls up or emails and they need that info NOW. Additionally, how do you think the stock gets to the store and out on to the shelves, exactly?
You can't tidy up or clean when a customer is in - They are hardware stores, cleaning can be done end of day when everyone leaves.
Because unpaid overtime is just the bestest!
You can't handle more than 1 customer at a time - Unless its the weekend yuo dont really see to many people in the store at once, and most of the time people are just looking anyways.
This is just so bass ackwards it's laughable. "It's alright guys, just one staff member will do, it'll never get that busy and, even though you're employed as active salespeople, you're expected to just let people wonder around unengaged anyways!"
Basically, you're pinned to the register for all but the briefest intervals. You can't really do much of the above when the store is open, because what happens if a customer comes in whilst you're already in the back rummaging for stock? You are not pinned to the register, there isnt an overflow of customers piling into GW stores and buying out there stock. The only thing the store manager would need to go to the back room for is Web orders. These should all be labeled ready to go before the store opens. So it should take the manager 30 seconds to grab and go.
Right, because 30 seconds has never, in the history of man, been long enough for somebody to out something easily accessible, small and expensive in their pocket? Plus again "the shops aren't that busy" is a terrible (and sort of sad) thing to use as a counter point.
I've worked in hardware stores that are easily 100x bigger then small 1 man GW stores with only 3 people. 1 cashier, myself and the manager and have a lot more people to deal with then a GW store. Like i said, a 1 man GW store is just that and shouldnt need more then 1 to run it.
Then you've worked retail, not retail sales. Retail sales requires a much greater investment of time per customer, and can often take you out of the loop with regard to ongoing procedural stuff for minutes, if not even hours for some high ticket items, at a time.
FMCG like supermarkets etc have a much lower staffing requirement than the sort of shop GW is/is trying to be.
Laugh all you want. GW employees all get 100% of there medical and insurance paid for, multiple managers and a manager from corporate has told me this. For them to put 2 people in there stores they would need to DOUBLE there sales if not more. You want to see more GW stores close?? Then put multiple people working in one store.
Yes a ill be back in 30 mins sign for lunch. Store managers have a designated time for lunch. Most gamers who go there regularly know the time and games are paused. If your lunch time gets interrupted to ring someone up at the register... DEAL WITH IT, they get paid commission.. yes COMMISSION.
They dont get overtime? Boo hoo Managers don't get overtime anyways, any one who cares a bit about the job will put in a few extra/hours in of there own time to do the best they can, if you don't ur a child or just plain lazy, thats whats being a manager is all about.
Yes there 2% of inventory you'll need to leave the shop floor smart guy. A stolen $15-20 blister box here and there is a lot cheaper then hiring a second employee that start at $32k a year !!!!
You will get interrupted judging games.. you dont need to be there 100% of the time.. and if you are not to ring someone up to actually get make money then o well the kids you are babysitting can wait.
You should just shut your mouth before you are embarrass yourself more, read some books and cut down on your forum post time, you obviously have no business sense.
I have been thinking for a while that GW should close all their stores and use the money saved to hit the convention circuit hard, improve relations with FLGS and bring back a proper games day. If done right they could reduce prices and increase profits.
Lorizael wrote: Really I found anyone who wasn't patient enough to wait, or had issue with lunch breaks etc were pretty unreasonable to begin with and were rarely actual customers.
How do you know they weren't "rarely actual customers" simply because they weren't being served in a timely manner? Maybe they're unreasonable because they have somewhere else to be and don't want to be waiting for you?
That's the whole point. No one is arguing it's physically impossible to run a store with only 1 person, plenty of stores outside of GW manage it. The question is whether it's a good idea. There's a reason most stores expand to have multiple staff and the ones that don't tend to stay small and quiet (and sometimes the owner is the only staff and they're happy being small and quiet as long as they're paying the bills and putting food on the table). If you employ 2 staff then you don't have to sell twice as much to be better off and most businesses find the value of being able to engage customers and stay open longer is worth it.
Of the 6 other hobby shops nearby 5 of them employ multiple staff, the guy that doesn't is a small operation and is struggling to pay the bills from one month to the next, even though he's the closest hobby shop to me and I know him well and like to support him, I often go elsewhere because he's not open when I need him to be.
I mean, really, it's not like GW are some sort of innovators for running one man stores, for as long as stores have existed people have been trying to cut costs and asking the question "can I get by with paying less staff, or is it going to cost me more in the long run?".
Snoopdeville3 wrote: For them to put 2 people in there stores they would need to DOUBLE there sales if not more. You want to see more GW stores close??
I'd love to see them close half their stores and move the other half into real stores again, with tables and enough employees to be open for Friday night gaming.
Snoopdeville3 wrote: They dont get overtime? Boo hoo Managers don't get overtime anyways, any one who cares a bit about the job will put in a few extra/hours in of there own time to do the best they can, if you don't ur a child or just plain lazy, thats whats being a manager is all about.
You're really making being a GW employee sound like a really gak job.
You should just shut your mouth before you are embarrass yourself more, read some books and cut down on your forum post time, you obviously have no business sense.
Honestly, you're the one who's embarrassing yourself. Your posts sound like you're getting very worked up over this for no reason.
Snoopdeville3 wrote: Laugh all you want. GW employees all get 100% of there medical and insurance paid for, multiple managers and a manager from corporate has told me this. For them to put 2 people in there stores they would need to DOUBLE there sales if not more. You want to see more GW stores close?? Then put multiple people working in one store.
Yes a ill be back in 30 mins sign for lunch. Store managers have a designated time for lunch. Most gamers who go there regularly know the time and games are paused. If your lunch time gets interrupted to ring someone up at the register... DEAL WITH IT, they get paid commission.. yes COMMISSION.
They dont get overtime? Boo hoo Managers don't get overtime anyways, any one who cares a bit about the job will put in a few extra/hours in of there own time to do the best they can, if you don't ur a child or just plain lazy, thats whats being a manager is all about.
Yes there 2% of inventory you'll need to leave the shop floor smart guy. A stolen $15-20 blister box here and there is a lot cheaper then hiring a second employee that start at $32k a year !!!!
You will get interrupted judging games.. you dont need to be there 100% of the time.. and if you are not to ring someone up to actually get make money then o well the kids you are babysitting can wait.
You should just shut your mouth before you are embarrass yourself more, read some books and cut down on your forum post time, you obviously have no business sense.
Though there is truth buried in this post somewhere, might I direct you here:
Lorizael wrote: How about less speculation, and instead a bit of input from someone who's actually ran a one-man GW store..?
Spoiler:
I have ran two different one-man stores, one of them very successfully and profitably for close to 3 years.
When the change happened, I was pretty adamant it wouldn't work; 3 staff and 7 day opening down to just me and 5 days? Crazy! But it did work. With proper training and self-management, it really wasn't an issue running a GW store that worked.
In terms of hours and opening times/lunch breaks, mostly it was just about being clear. Stores have the main GW page, Facebook and Google with which to advertise opening hours- I just made sure they stayed consistent. I took lunch breaks at as close as possible to the same time every single day. And made sure those times were mentioned in the opening hours.
For anyone who was even vaguely regular, there was no issue with opening hours.
Yes, occasionally a 'back in 5' sign goes up on the door for a toilet break. Really I found anyone who wasn't patient enough to wait, or had issue with lunch breaks etc were pretty unreasonable to begin with and were rarely actual customers.
I never once closed for a whole day within normal opening hours- a handful of times a few hours may have been missed here and there over the years for various reasons (I once almost lopped a finger off with a hobby knife...), but never a whole day.
It was just a case of being prepared- having back up and cover in place for when necessary.
For stock, again, be prepared! Using the shelves well meant having a lot of stock on the shop floor- then you just made sure that the you had back up of the best selling stock in easy to get to places that didn't require you going off of the shop floor.
Talking about stock- all GW stores stock the same top 900 best selling product lines (plus hobby supplies). Stock levels adjust automatically based on sales- if something is popular in store, the min stock level for that kit will be raised. Managers can also alter their own stock levels within reason.
Very few FLGS (in my experience) stock anywhere near the same range and amounts as a GW.
What else was mentioned...
Um, customer service. I grew my business. A lot. That stemmed from Customer service and being able to give excellent service however many customers were in the store at a time. 6 or so customers at a time really wasn't an issue. And definitely not the issue I thought it would be before hand. It's amazing what you can do with a bit of confidence and appropriate training. I think it's too easy to get used to being part of a large team that anything less seems crazy hard.
But it's really not. It's just a matter of prioritising- find out who needs what and how fast! It's one of the advantages to greeting and having conversations with everyone who enters the store- you find out their needs.
Cashing handling/cleaning etc has been covered- it gets done at the end of the day as part of contracted hours- really not an issue... Things like dusting stock can be done while open and quiet too.
Reasons to go to a GW store:
-customer service
-conversation/social
-convenience
-learning hobby skills
-brand/store loyalty
There are many! Not everyone needs/wants any or all of these things, but many, many people do. If they didn't then the stores wouldn't exist!
I served people who knew full well they could get a discount from Element/Triple Helix/Dark Sphere etc, but they were happy to pay the difference for convenience, quickness and my customer service.
Always remember that your needs and opinions don't represent 100% of the hobby population!
That is a big old wall of text sorry!
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh quick addition- staffing levels can and will change. There are thresholds for numbers of staff based on store turnover. If you make a bunch of many, you can ask to have staff.
What period of time where you running these shops? I'm just thinking that what works during boom times might be more difficult when interest in GW has declined significantly. Though that also argues for reducing staff costs, of course.
Three times in the last 3 months I've popped over to GW stores intending to make decent sized impulse purchases (£30+) when I happened to be in town going to job interviews and meeting with agencies and on every occasion said stores were closed due to the weird 1 man opening times.
The impulse to purchase invariably waned by the time I got home to my computer.
You should just shut your mouth before you are embarrass yourself more, read some books and cut down on your forum post time, you obviously have no business sense.
If you know ANYTHING regarding Az's posting history and his prior employment. Just back away. Seriously. There's putting your foot in it and there's this.
Hmm. All I know that 4 out of 5 GW stores were closed within 1 year when they got out of their leases and the last GW store left is a ghost town. The 1 man stores are not really working because 40K is a social game and in those 1 man stores ( at least in my area) this is not happening. They are satellites to GW's internet business.
Wonder how the Spin doctoring is going down in GW Land when they are no longer the Top Dog in the US.
Adam LongWalker wrote: Hmm. All I know that 4 out of 5 GW stores were closed within 1 year when they got out of their leases and the last GW store left is a ghost town. The 1 man stores are not really working because 40K is a social game and in those 1 man stores ( at least in my area) this is not happening. They are satellites to GW's internet business.
It's always hard to say whether GW stores closed because they dropped to 1 man or they were doing poorly before 1 man and dropping to 1 man wasn't enough to stop them closing down.
Even going back well before GW dropped to 1 man stores, there were 3 or 4 GW shops I frequented (depending on which year we are talking about) and they all had different levels of success, the same as they do now. I'm still amazed in the last couple of years the most local GW has really started to thrive in spite of only being a 1 man store, it shows how good the manager is IMO, but also IMO I think they'd do even better with a 2nd person so they can run later on Thurs/Fri/Sat and not have such weird hours.
You should just shut your mouth before you are embarrass yourself more, read some books and cut down on your forum post time, you obviously have no business sense.
If you know ANYTHING regarding Az's posting history and his prior employment. Just back away. Seriously. There's putting your foot in it and there's this.
No, no, let the puppy continue to approach the big, growling dog. It's the only way they learn.
This post may be informed by the addition of a puppy to the household in recent weeks
but it's not only GW running with them, it's pretty much the case for every hobby shop/model shop/gaming store within semi easy reach of me
(with the exception of one store that also sells RC stuff and now drones)
and I'd much rather have a 1 man store that might be closed when I turn up than no store at all
My anecdotal experience is contrary to your anecdotal experience. As I mentioned previously, out of 6 hobby stores near me, 2 of which are purely gaming and the other 4 are general hobby, 5 of them employ multiple people and the 6th one is staffed by the owner and even he occasionally gets his wife or son to help out. Both the dedicated gaming ones run multiple staff.
Staff numbers should be considered on a case by case basis. To just uniformly make all stores 1 man isn't a wise move, but maybe there are some stores that it might be appropriate.
From my own experience, smaller stores are best run with 1.5 FTE.
You have a manager, who opens up, closes down etc etc, and then you have a part time staff member who covers the peak trading hours, lunch breaks for the manger, holidays, days off, sick days etc.
The reality is though, the .5 FTE is a really big ask to recruit. Finding someone competent, with the necessary experience, the desire to only work part time and the availability that suits the store's needs can be extremely tough, to the point of impossible. Finding inexperienced staff that fulfil the other criteria is easier, but they take a long time to bring up to speed (working fewer hours) and are useless for unsupervised work until they get there.
But Skink is right, making unilateral decisions about staffing levels is crazy.
Your mileage may vary...
As I said, many customers want the things I listed, or just generally choose shopping in GW stores over other options.
It may not be for you, that's cool, but it does work for others.
Remember the prime reason GW stores exist is to recruit new customers. If you're new to the hobby and you spend 6 months being taken through the process of building, painting and playing games, being taught all of the skills you need to set you on the path; that breeds a certain level of store loyalty. Genuine customer service will always retain customers.
Lorizael wrote: Really I found anyone who wasn't patient enough to wait, or had issue with lunch breaks etc were pretty unreasonable to begin with and were rarely actual customers.
How do you know they weren't "rarely actual customers" simply because they weren't being served in a timely manner? Maybe they're unreasonable because they have somewhere else to be and don't want to be waiting for you?
That's the whole point. No one is arguing it's physically impossible to run a store with only 1 person, plenty of stores outside of GW manage it. The question is whether it's a good idea. There's a reason most stores expand to have multiple staff and the ones that don't tend to stay small and quiet (and sometimes the owner is the only staff and they're happy being small and quiet as long as they're paying the bills and putting food on the table). If you employ 2 staff then you don't have to sell twice as much to be better off and most businesses find the value of being able to engage customers and stay open longer is worth it.
Not 100%, but from those I encountered frequently, that's what I got. Or when I was on lunch and noticed someone waiting, I often offered to serve them quickly if they knew what they were after- but 9/10 just wanted to look around and were ok to come back later.
As a store manager you encounter a ton of people who just want to come into your store and talk at you for an hour or gripe about something that is out of your control. Generally I found those were the ones who had issue with opening times. It's anecdotal of course, but it was a common theme over nearly a decade in the job.
Generally, as long as you gave good service and were polite, customers had little issue with waiting if necessary.
What period of time where you running these shops? I'm just thinking that what works during boom times might be more difficult when interest in GW has declined significantly. Though that also argues for reducing staff costs, of course.
Staffing and opening hours are flexible. As a store fluctuates (which most do) aver the years then number of staff and 5 / 7 opening days will change. There are thresholds as I said, but even these are flexible- managers run their stores how they wish and may always negotiate these things.
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: Three times in the last 3 months I've popped over to GW stores intending to make decent sized impulse purchases (£30+) when I happened to be in town going to job interviews and meeting with agencies and on every occasion said stores were closed due to the weird 1 man opening times.
Stores should have consistent opening hours, and the vast majority do. Things like manager change overs and illness can make a difference, but usually every care is taken to not be closed when the store should be open.
So if one of my stores had been your local that you tried to visit, the only way you would have encountered a closed store was if every time you visited it was a Monday/Tuesday or an open day but between 2-3 when I would take a 30 minute break.
And that's not beyond the realms of possibility as I've met a customer or two who seem to ignore the opening hours on my door and repeatedly show up on a Monday.!
- - - - -
Also, someone mentioned commission; GW managers are not paid commission in the traditional sense. There is a bonus structure, but it's not like they get a flat percentage of sales.
Lorizael wrote: Not 100%, but from those I encountered frequently, that's what I got. Or when I was on lunch and noticed someone waiting, I often offered to serve them quickly if they knew what they were after- but 9/10 just wanted to look around and were ok to come back later. As a store manager you encounter a ton of people who just want to come into your store and talk at you for an hour or gripe about something that is out of your control. Generally I found those were the ones who had issue with opening times. It's anecdotal of course, but it was a common theme over nearly a decade in the job. Generally, as long as you gave good service and were polite, customers had little issue with waiting if necessary.
The problem is that it's *really* hard to gauge. The people who you think have little issue waiting may actually be annoyed but too polite to say anything... but then the next purchase they make ends up from somewhere else.
The ones who want to gripe for an hour and not buy anything are simply the ones who are going to tell you, it's the ones who walk in and hang around for a few minutes while you chat to other customers then walk out that might have been potential customers that are the problem. Or the ones who drive past and see the "back in 15" or "closed" sign and just keep driving and don't come back.
I've discussed it at length with the owner of the hobby store (non-GW) that runs his own shop by himself and how he knows he's losing sales at times when he's the only one there and can't manage the number of customers, but he doesn't really have the capacity to employ another person. By contrast a big multinational company like GW should be able to handle staff management better (though I know it's still not easy, it's something that should be done if you don't want to be throwing away money).
Especially when you consider wages are only one of many costs in having a store open. Employing an extra person doesn't mean you need to double the number of sales as the wage of 1 full time employee is likely less than the rent and upkeep on the store (much less if it's in a busy area or a city centre).
Two different gw stores. Visited one on a tuesday, and the other on a Wednesday and Friday IIRC. I'm not local to those towns and rarely visit the stores so I can hardly be expected to know their opening times, especially when they were unplanned visits.
My point is that because they have limited numbers of staff and close for 2 or 3 days a week, they missed out on impulse purchases from me on three occasions.
Yeah, "they weren't buying anyway" is the sort of bs excuse (and for clarity, I've been responsible for training people of a similar level in a simlar position to a GW manager) that would get you a strip torn off if you were under my management.
If you didn't have time to engage with them, how did you know? They were interested enough to walk in the door, and, psychologically speaking, that's quite a big deal for a customer. One company I worked for, for instance, forbade having the front door closed during working hours as a closed door is a literal barrier to entry.
Then, as Skink says, you have all the missed opportunities you have no ability to assess because you simply weren't there. Sure, you can plaster your opening hours all over the shop, but Joe Public simply doesn't read that gak. They do however, and, IMO, quite reasonably, expect a retail outlet to be open on Mondays and Tuesdays.
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: Two different gw stores. Visited one on a tuesday, and the other on a Wednesday and Friday IIRC. I'm not local to those towns and rarely visit the stores so I can hardly be expected to know their opening times, especially when they were unplanned visits.
My point is that because they have limited numbers of staff and close for 2 or 3 days a week, they missed out on impulse purchases from me on three occasions.
I can speak to that, twice now I've received a call about an order being in, only to show up and have the place be closed for half an hour to an hour. It's bad enough that once I finally get in the store I get a lecture about not physically driving to the store originally to place the order so the 1 individual can get the sales stat.
That's not a positive customer service experience at all, but in the mind of the higher it's apparently par for the course.
AllSeeingSkink wrote:The problem is that it's *really* hard to gauge. The people who you think have little issue waiting may actually be annoyed but too polite to say anything... but then the next purchase they make ends up from somewhere else.
The ones who want to gripe for an hour and not buy anything are simply the ones who are going to tell you, it's the ones who walk in and hang around for a few minutes while you chat to other customers then walk out that might have been potential customers that are the problem. Or the ones who drive past and see the "back in 15" or "closed" sign and just keep driving and don't come back.
I've discussed it at length with the owner of the hobby store (non-GW) that runs his own shop by himself and how he knows he's losing sales at times when he's the only one there and can't manage the number of customers, but he doesn't really have the capacity to employ another person. By contrast a big multinational company like GW should be able to handle staff management better (though I know it's still not easy, it's something that should be done if you don't want to be throwing away money).
Azreal13 wrote:Yeah, "they weren't buying anyway" is the sort of bs excuse (and for clarity, I've been responsible for training people of a similar level in a simlar position to a GW manager) that would get you a strip torn off if you were under my management.
If you didn't have time to engage with them, how did you know? They were interested enough to walk in the door, and, psychologically speaking, that's quite a big deal for a customer. One company I worked for, for instance, forbade having the front door closed during working hours as a closed door is a literal barrier to entry.
Then, as Skink says, you have all the missed opportunities you have no ability to assess because you simply weren't there. Sure, you can plaster your opening hours all over the shop, but Joe Public simply doesn't read that gak. They do however, and, IMO, quite reasonably, expect a retail outlet to be open on Mondays and Tuesdays.
It isn't an excuse I would make, and I think you're getting the wrong end of the stick Azreal; if they're in the store, then they've been engaged. Being a one-man store doesn't stop you from engaging with everyone who walks in. It has to get to silly numbers before it becomes a serious issue, and even then I can count on my hands the number of people I haven't been able to engage with.
I can't speak for everyone Skink, but I see trends and can generalise from that- it's not 100% but my experience of actually running a one-man store isn't invalidated by others theories and anecdotes of what might be happening.
Yes, opportunities will be missed, but how many? And are those opportunities worth doubling staff or increasing opening hours by 40%?
It's not like GW are doing it ideologically without looking at actual figures and case studies. The one-man store was originally an experiment for new stores, after a few years of several one-man stores opening they were deemed successful and more stores were made one-man. They're profitable and they grow; they may not be making mega-bucks, but they do work.
Do they work everywhere? Of course not. And where they don't work, they invariably close or they're expanded. As I said, things are flexible, hours/staff can and do change.
Do GW one-man stores have a future? Yes, yes they do. From experience, yes they do have a future and a very successful one. They don't work in the same way as GW stores have worked in the past and they may not work in the same way as FLGS do, that doesn't stop them from being successful in the most part.
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: Two different gw stores. Visited one on a tuesday, and the other on a Wednesday and Friday IIRC. I'm not local to those towns and rarely visit the stores so I can hardly be expected to know their opening times, especially when they were unplanned visits.
My point is that because they have limited numbers of staff and close for 2 or 3 days a week, they missed out on impulse purchases from me on three occasions.
I can speak to that, twice now I've received a call about an order being in, only to show up and have the place be closed for half an hour to an hour. It's bad enough that once I finally get in the store I get a lecture about not physically driving to the store originally to place the order so the 1 individual can get the sales stat.
That's not a positive customer service experience at all, but in the mind of the higher it's apparently par for the course.
I agree, not positive. The manager should have been clear with you about when is the best time to collect your mail order.
'Lecturing' you on not ordering from store isn't on either, and definitely isn't par for the course.
It's ok and appropriate to ask a customer why they order from home, but you have to accept their reasons.
I was in a store where the 1 employee was engaged in conversation with someone else. I waited around for a quarter of an hour or more for him to speak to me as I didn't want to interrupt.
When I ran out of patience I interrupted him, and tried to buy something, and he became distracted by something on his computer for a further 3 minutes or so.
I was pretty nonplussed. FLGS staff can be a bit crappy sometimes, but at least a FLGS has a diverse selection of products to browse!
I go to the GW in Kingston occasionally. On the last three occasions, the staff member was out to lunch, or the store was closed. On each occasion, I have gone home and ordered a competing product from a different company as a result.
That GW manager doesn't even know I exist, but has lost about £60 in sales from me as a minimum. How many other customers like me are there? Hard to say. But now I simply don't bother going back. If there's a 20% chance (two days a week and an hour on the remaining ones) it won't be open when I'm in the area and in a purchasing mood, it simply doesn't feel like it's worth the effort of walking over there when doing the rounds. You could say to me, 'Memorise the opening hours', but why should I? GW isn't so great that I can't get a competing product on the internet from the luxury of my house.
The first and cardinal rule of any business is 'Make it easy for people to give you money'. A variety of payment options, a wide range of stock, knowledgeable staff, and so on are all just tools to that end. GW is making it awkward for me to give them my money, so they they're not getting it. It's that simple, really.
Da Boss wrote:I was in a store where the 1 employee was engaged in conversation with someone else. I waited around for a quarter of an hour or more for him to speak to me as I didn't want to interrupt.
When I ran out of patience I interrupted him, and tried to buy something, and he became distracted by something on his computer for a further 3 minutes or so.
I was pretty nonplussed. FLGS staff can be a bit crappy sometimes, but at least a FLGS has a diverse selection of products to browse!
It's unfortunate, but there will be bad staff, it happens. It shouldn't but it does. They generally don't last long.
Ketara wrote:I go to the GW in Kingston occasionally. On the last three occasions, the staff member was out to lunch, or the store was closed. On each occasion, I have gone home and ordered a competing product from a different company as a result.
That GW manager doesn't even know I exist, but has lost about £60 in sales from me as a minimum. How many other customers like me are there? Hard to say. But now I simply don't bother going back. If there's a 20% chance (two days a week and an hour on the remaining ones) it won't be open when I'm in the area and in a purchasing mood, it simply doesn't feel like it's worth the effort of walking over there when doing the rounds. You could say to me, 'Memorise the opening hours', but why should I? GW isn't so great that I can't get a competing product on the internet from the luxury of my house.
The first and cardinal rule of any business is 'Make it easy for people to give you money'. A variety of payment options, a wide range of stock, knowledgeable staff, and so on are all just tools to that end. GW is making it awkward for me to give them my money, so they they're not getting it. It's that simple, really.
GW are going to be aware there will be customers/opportunities that are missed; I guess it will be weighed against the cost to get those opportunities.
If you think that many stores in the UK went from 7 days to 5 days, the figures will show what gets lost (or doesn't). If a 5 day opening, one man store can make as much as it did when open 7 days with 3 staff then it's all good. And to be honest, it doesn't even need to make that much, it just needs to increase in % profit.
GW stores aren't designed to cater to 100% of the collecting community; that's why they have a webstore and a huge number of stockists.
My local GW has been run by two different managers, and both are/ were really great (the former moved to a different, larger store closer to his home.) The thing that gets me going into the competition to buy their product is their hours of operation. They are open something like 11-6 or 12-6 five days a week. I usually work until 4:30 or 5-ish and it takes a half hour at least from my work to get to the store. If anything holds me up at work, if I have another place to go in between or if traffic is particularly bad I miss the opportunity to go. By contrast, there are at least half a dozen stores within a half hour of my house/ work that sell GW products and are open until at least 9 on weekdays. Some are open until 10 or 11.
Da Boss wrote:I was in a store where the 1 employee was engaged in conversation with someone else. I waited around for a quarter of an hour or more for him to speak to me as I didn't want to interrupt.
When I ran out of patience I interrupted him, and tried to buy something, and he became distracted by something on his computer for a further 3 minutes or so.
I was pretty nonplussed. FLGS staff can be a bit crappy sometimes, but at least a FLGS has a diverse selection of products to browse!
It's unfortunate, but there will be bad staff, it happens. It shouldn't but it does. They generally don't last long.
Yeah, that's true. The guy was nice - I was actually charmed by his interaction with the other player as he was really trying his best to genuinely help the guy out. I don't think he was bad exactly - though getting distracted on his computer was poor form. I think he's actually a pretty decent sort and I hope he can hang on in there.
But I figure he'd be better off if he had someone working with him, as he'd be able to do that customer interaction stuff that he was good and enjoys while other customers got served.
I'd love to see them close half their stores and move the other half into real stores again, with tables and enough employees to be open for Friday night gaming.
This is something I miss from my local GW. The store is closed the usual Monday and Tuesday, but the store used to be open 12-8 each day with a 4:30-5:00 break. If you wanted to get in a decent point total game during the week after work you could do it. For league games the only way some people could participate was by getting their game in during the week.
Then the manager shifted hours to a 7pm close each day and a 5:30-6:00 pm break on Wed., Thur., and Friday. It's impossible to get in anything but the smallest games during the week now. The other players who used to be available for weeknight gaming stopped playing at the store as they don't want to play only two or three turns.
The store has become popular enough to where the manager is letting people reserve tables and hobbying table spots on the weekends. I've tried and failed to get a pickup game on a Saturday or Sunday the past four weeks. Forget about grabbing one of the open hobby spots unless you follow the manager in as the store opens.
The manager's a fantastic person and a terrific painter. I've been happy enough paying GW their full retail price in exchange for having this nearby store as an option for painting and gaming. But if I can't play or paint there now, why should I bother shopping there when online sellers are begging to give me 20 percent off my purchases?
I guess the one-man store model has a future as this one is busy enough. I have no idea what their sales are like so I could be wrong.
GW are going to be aware there will be customers/opportunities that are missed; I guess it will be weighed against the cost to get those opportunities.
If you think that many stores in the UK went from 7 days to 5 days, the figures will show what gets lost (or doesn't). If a 5 day opening, one man store can make as much as it did when open 7 days with 3 staff then it's all good. And to be honest, it doesn't even need to make that much, it just needs to increase in % profit.
GW stores aren't designed to cater to 100% of the collecting community; that's why they have a webstore and a huge number of stockists.
Oh, I completely see where you're arguing from. But I think the evidence is against them. What evidence?
The fact that every other shop on the High Street has more than one staff member. I'm not sure you can wave away GW as being so unique a retail experience that somehow they can go against what every other shop does as a matter of basic operation and somehow be making more profit as a result. If it were really that easy, Game would only be open 5 days a week and Waterstone's would have one staff member on the till and close up for lunch. Yet somehow, those two businesses (which if anything, rely less on needing someone in store to sell the product, have no need to push a 'community', and suffer from equal online competition) always have two staff on. If the one man store concept was that great a money saving idea, I'm pretty sure businesses like them would be all over it.
Sir Arun wrote: Just went to pick up my hardback copy of Deathwatch: Ignition from my local GW store (1 of 2 in the capital city, btw my flag is messed up im Austria), of course it was approx half hour before closing time (7 p.m.; I went there around 6:30 pm)
There was absolutely nobody in the store except the lone redshirt at the counter. I kinda felt sorry for him.
So anyway, I know GW has switched to one man stores for about 2 or 3 years now, my question is how well are the GW stores doing? I know it varies vastly from location to location, but is it true that there is a general trend of fewer and fewer people coming to GW stores to play?
I remember in the mid and late 2000s (I was introduced to the hobby in 2004) the GW stores were almost packed (we had people playing on almost all available tables, there were dudes painting at the painting station, 2 or 3 customers chatting with the redshirts at the counter etc.)
What led to the fall?
The rise in quality of minis the competition has to offer?
GW's increasing price hikes?
The rise of discount online third party retailers who sell GW stuff so you can just order from the internet?
A new generation growing up even more with video games replacing traditional tabletop as entertainment?
Economic crisis meaning less disposable income for people in general?
GW are going to be aware there will be customers/opportunities that are missed; I guess it will be weighed against the cost to get those opportunities.
If you think that many stores in the UK went from 7 days to 5 days, the figures will show what gets lost (or doesn't). If a 5 day opening, one man store can make as much as it did when open 7 days with 3 staff then it's all good. And to be honest, it doesn't even need to make that much, it just needs to increase in % profit.
GW stores aren't designed to cater to 100% of the collecting community; that's why they have a webstore and a huge number of stockists.
Oh, I completely see where you're arguing from. But I think the evidence is against them. What evidence?
The fact that every other shop on the High Street has more than one staff member. I'm not sure you can wave away GW as being so unique a retail experience that somehow they can go against what every other shop does as a matter of basic operation and somehow be making more profit as a result. If it were really that easy, Game would only be open 5 days a week and Waterstone's would have one staff member on the till and close up for lunch. Yet somehow, those two businesses (which if anything, rely less on needing someone in store to sell the product, have no need to push a 'community', and suffer from equal online competition) always have two staff on. If the one man store concept was that great a money saving idea, I'm pretty sure businesses like them would be all over it.
Yet for some reason, they're not....
Valid point, but you have to compare similar businesses. My local Waterstones is easily 10 times the physical size of my local GW (and it's one of the bigger GWs), and it's footfall exceeds GWs by vast amounts. Same with Game- their footfall and customer count is huge. They'll deal with as many customers in an hour as a GW does in a day sometimes! And from knowing a Game manager their stores take much more cash.
GW is a niche, destination store, so you would have to think of some more of those on the hIgh street to compare to that have similar customer counts.
Most hobby stores on the high street I've been to over the years (not just in my own city) employ more than 1 person. Even the ones not on the high street usually do. The FLGS that's literally less than 5 minutes walk up the same street from my local GW also employs more than 1 person.
The thing is, if your store is quiet and doesn't get many sales so you think you only need 1 person manning it... it might be that the reason it's quiet and doesn't get many sales is because you only have 1 person manning it
Each store does need to be *carefully* considered in and of itself, which is why I think GW's global policy of 1 man stores is rather moronic. Especially when you see a thriving store in a busy location that obviously needs more than 1 person manning it suddenly drop to 1 staff because GW expects a global policy to be a good idea everywhere.
Valid point, but you have to compare similar businesses. My local Waterstones is easily 10 times the physical size of my local GW (and it's one of the bigger GWs), and it's footfall exceeds GWs by vast amounts. Same with Game- their footfall and customer count is huge. They'll deal with as many customers in an hour as a GW does in a day sometimes! And from knowing a Game manager their stores take much more cash.
GW is a niche, destination store, so you would have to think of some more of those on the hIgh street to compare to that have similar customer counts.
I'll concede that GW tends to be more of a target destination, but I'm not convinced they're all ten times the size (or even five). Certainly, some regional stores are, and there are always flagship branches, but that applies to GW as much as anywhere else (Warhammer World and the big London store for example). Certainly, for every single Waterstone or Game I've seen that's three times the size as a GW, I've seen several about the same size as the average GW branch in terms of square footage.
As for taking more money, well Game hasn't been doing so hot lately. They've had to close a lost of stores, yet still always have that two staff minimum on, as do their competitors like CEX. If it it were that easy to pocket a bit of cash in operating expenses by dropping one, I'm pretty sure Game would have been wielding the scythe quite adroitly by this stage with the pressure they're under.
Even if we presuppose that the till being busier requires stores like Waterstone/Game to have that extra staff member available, that should be countered out by the fact that being in the type of business that they are, GW has the extra burden of having staff need to sell the product (as opposed to just watching people wander in and selecting what games/books they want), not to mention attempt to build a community. These things require a lot of staff time, and those are burdens that places like Waterstone/Game don't need to support.
I'm far more inclined to believe that these other businesses (being in the trade of running smaller specialist retail stores like GW) have done the cost-benefit analysis. And that they have concluded that the loss of trade/potential customer inconvenience of being closed for 20% of standard trading hours is not worth the financial benefit which dropping that 0.5/1.0 employee brings.
I think it is notable that despite having cut so many key costs, GW's turnover and profit level has dropped to it's lowest point in quite some time, so saying, 'If it didn't work they wouldn't be doing it' may also be incorrect. They're quite clearly and measurably selling less product, and turning less of a profit than they did in an era when they had higher staffing levels. Whether you can attribute that decline to lower staffing levels or one of several other factors is arguable, but it is clear that their current sales policy is working less well than that which they had before.
Also, in certain corporate cultures, it is often difficult to tell people up top that a current initiative is not working. Certainly, GW has a strong reputation of a 'Yes-man' culture.On top of that, with such intangible things as 'community' contributing to sales, it would be hard for any GW employee to put together the quantifiable case that would be required to overcome even basic corporate inertia. It is impossible, after all, to count every customer that does not visit your shop or every lost sale when there's no-one in the shop to count them or they stop turning up as a result!
Fair enough - I'll agree that there's no way to be certain whether the switch to one-man stores caused their closure.
I think most likely the stores were already doomed, and the single staffer was left running the place until the leases ran out, as it's a minimal cost and might work.
Laugh all you want. GW employees all get 100% of there medical and insurance paid for, multiple managers and a manager from corporate has told me this. For them to put 2 people in there stores they would need to DOUBLE there sales if not more. You want to see more GW stores close?? Then put multiple people working in one store.
Only if everything else is free. You've got the rent, utility rates, insurance etc that are all fixed regardless of how many staff you have and how much you are open. These are easily more than the staff member costs.
Yes there 2% of inventory you'll need to leave the shop floor smart guy. A stolen $15-20 blister box here and there is a lot cheaper then hiring a second employee that start at $32k a year !!!!
You don't get many blisters as cheap as that, though I've heard of lots of $100 boxes wandering off shelves in 1-man stores. If it becomes known as an easy target, the stock losses could get pretty significant. No stock = no sales.
Azreal13 wrote: If you didn't have time to engage with them, how did you know? They were interested enough to walk in the door, and, psychologically speaking, that's quite a big deal for a customer. One company I worked for, for instance, forbade having the front door closed during working hours as a closed door is a literal barrier to entry.
My wifes last shop didn't have a door for that reason. Onto a main shopping street though, but it sucked a bit in winter. When visiting GW's (less so with FLGSs) I normally stop at the door and actually think "Do I really want to go in?" because it's not a great place to browse, and I'm not sure I'm the only one.
As for opening hours - it's really not my job as a customer to memorize your opening hours. Of my 3 FLGS stores (run by private individuals), 2 are open 7 days a week, 1 only 5. They don't close for lunch (which, incidentally is when you get a lot of customers - hence 1-man stores have lunch at like 2pm), and are pretty much always open when the door says. Several times I've been visiting a town and popped by one (after finding out where they are) to discover they are closed. Even if it's just a back in 15 minutes I probably won't return unless I happen to be passing again. Just seeing the closed sign tends to kill off my motivation.
I think 1.5 staff per small store is perfectly sustainable, if you can find the staff for the 0.5.
In the UK smaller GWs I am familiar with (Oxford, Reading, Windsor, Maidenhead, Chiswick) tend to open five or six days a week, not Mondays, from 11 or 12 until later in the evening. The busiest times are mid to late afternoons, when the schoolboys get out, and special game nights. One man can easily hold the fort during quiet times.
Obviously GW has a mission apart from selling stuff, which is to teach painting and game skills, and this requires more oversight.
The five or six days a week part gets me. I think it was the year before this last one that Christmas Eve fell on a Tuesday, but no GW's around here are open Monday or Tuesday.
Someone told me the GW managers themselves are allowed to pick when they open or close, but supposedly a whole bunch of managers decide they didn't need to be open the two days before Christmas.
Kilkrazy wrote: I think 1.5 staff per small store is perfectly sustainable, if you can find the staff for the 0.5.
Surely that's what the old key timer positions were for? I know its not the fashionable thing, but you could have several people on zero hour contracts (that more than likely work elsewhere) that have said position simply for the discount. I know a couple of people in the past who've done just that with GW. Before they abolished it at our local GW we had both a teacher and an RAF engineer in key time positions just for the discount the job brought.
I know the whole zero hour contract thing is somewhat bad PR for GW, but this strikes me as one of the areas where it is actually appropriate due to their store model.
When I used to work in a store there were 3 of us and a PT guy at weekends, obviously most of the time it was just 2 of you on but sometimes at weekends it was so busy with customers, the phone ringing, prepping stuff for display, running demo games I have absolutely no idea how one person is expected to manage. I suppose ultimately they don't.
I think it also shows a fair amount of naivety on the part of GW and I'm glad it sounds like they are moving away from it. Any situation where you have 1 adult working on their own with kids is leaving both the kids vulnerable to that adult and also the adult vulnerable as well. Having the two adults working in that kind of environment helps to act as a safety blanket for all concerned I think.
You should just shut your mouth before you are embarrass yourself more, read some books and cut down on your forum post time, you obviously have no business sense.
If you know ANYTHING regarding Az's posting history and his prior employment. Just back away. Seriously. There's putting your foot in it and there's this.
No, no, let the puppy continue to approach the big, growling dog. It's the only way they learn.
This post may be informed by the addition of a puppy to the household in recent weeks
A barking dog never bites,
This saying's very true.
For doggy cannot bark well,
When his mouth is full of you.
The math also bothered me - saying that having two employees means needing to more than double sales assumes that payroll is the primary expense with a two man shop....
Which does not hold true for any moderately central location of reasonable size.
The Auld Grump - we also have a recently acquired puppy... he is very well behaved, which worries me.... (Mastiff/retriever cross... he doesn't chew shoes, but he does pick them up and carry them around... we are trying to break him of the habit of using the catbox - the cats won't use it, after he is done....)
As for discount retailers, that just sounds like some suspicious stuff to me. And save money how? unless you;re going to these "Discount Retailers" how do you save money?
Come on, you don't know what a discount retailer is? The stores that offer like 20%+ off, usually comic shops or independent hobby stores. There are two in my town. eBay even has a ton of discount Warhammer sellers who have been consistently selling GW stuff for YEARS. This has been my source recently (not sure if we can link eBay stores outside of the Swap Shop so I won't plug him).
To address your inquiry about how it saves money, well it's simple. They charge less, I spend less. Get it?
You should just shut your mouth before you are embarrass yourself more, read some books and cut down on your forum post time, you obviously have no business sense.
If you know ANYTHING regarding Az's posting history and his prior employment. Just back away. Seriously. There's putting your foot in it and there's this.
No, no, let the puppy continue to approach the big, growling dog. It's the only way they learn.
This post may be informed by the addition of a puppy to the household in recent weeks
A barking dog never bites,
This saying's very true.
For doggy cannot bark well,
When his mouth is full of you.
The math also bothered me - saying that having two employees means needing to more than double sales assumes that payroll is the primary expense with a two man shop....
Which does not hold true for any moderately central location of reasonable size.
The Auld Grump - we also have a recently acquired puppy... he is very well behaved, which worries me.... (Mastiff/retriever cross... he doesn't chew shoes, but he does pick them up and carry them around... we are trying to break him of the habit of using the catbox - the cats won't use it, after he is done....)
Well, it's certainly reasonably true to say that employee costs represent a significant proportion, even the majority, of overhead in most businesses, unless you're talking incredibly prominent sites in very high profile areas, at least.
However, trying to argue that you need to double turnover is blatantly wrong, as the fixed overheads of the store don't increase based on the number of people you employ in it (maybe a tiny % increase per head for having lights on in back room locations, flushing the toilet more often, but nothing really worth accounting for) so all a new employee needs to do to justify their existence is their salary + a little extra for increased admin (not a big deal when it's all centralized in a large company.)
In a GW store, there's even an argument that they don't even need to do that, at least not in every single location, as GW stores are their recruitment centers and their advertising, so an extra staff member making a site more effective at either justifies making a loss on what they cost to employ overall.
But what do I know? I need to go outside and read books or some gak, apparently.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh, and we have our second Sprocker Spaniel. They're entirely too bright, entirely too curious and not nearly cautious enou for their own safety!
WE dont bother with the trip or playing at GW anymore primarily because the store is so small that having more than 4 or 5 people in it makes it a hot crowded mess. then you have 1 staffer who is not very knowledgeable and pushing product you don't want and not having what you do want ( but they will order it for you, which to me is useless as I can do that myself and have it delivered to my own door) then you add that they have 1 table for playing and even that blocks access to shelf space, it just is not worth doing.
Well, it's certainly reasonably true to say that employee costs represent a significant proportion, even the majority, of overhead in most businesses, unless you're talking incredibly prominent sites in very high profile areas, at least.
However, trying to argue that you need to double turnover is blatantly wrong, as the fixed overheads of the store don't increase based on the number of people you employ in it (maybe a tiny % increase per head for having lights on in back room locations, flushing the toilet more often, but nothing really worth accounting for) so all a new employee needs to do to justify their existence is their salary + a little extra for increased admin (not a big deal when it's all centralized in a large company.)
In a GW store, there's even an argument that they don't even need to do that, at least not in every single location, as GW stores are their recruitment centers and their advertising, so an extra staff member making a site more effective at either justifies making a loss on what they cost to employ overall.
But what do I know? I need to go outside and read books or some gak, apparently.
This is my takeaway as well. There's really no future to the "1-man store" model because the whole change was never about "the future" in the first place. It was always about cutting costs in the present (although not the most efficient way to do it, as Azreal and others have pointed out). I can think of nothing that a 1-man store does better than a store with 2+ employees. No matter how competent your one employee is, giving that person a partner (even if just to run the register) is a sure way to improve the efficiency and customer service level at that location. (I mean, unless you hire some horrific, ogre-like, pustule of a person... but in that case you can just replace them).
It's fairly silly to think that GW sat down and said, "You know what? I think closing down a bunch of locations and converting the rest to 1-man storefronts is a great way to improve our ability to reach customers and move product. Yes, this is a business model with a bright future that we would be daft to not integrate into our corporate plan."
It's much more likely that the conversation went something like this: "Finance says we need to cut costs." "Okay, what's the least important thing that we can cut?" "Well, all of our stores are setup as 'hobby centers' to recruit customers... We could reduce them to basic storefronts with 1 employee and our customer interaction levels probably wouldn't drop significantly from where they are now." "But how much would that save us really?" "Well, we can close down a few stores..."
...and so on and so forth.
TL;DR: The move to 1-man stores was nothing but budget cuts, not some new innovation in the industry. It's a sure bet that if GW's financial situation returned to its very comfortable, early-LOTR-bubble levels tomorrow, they'd probably start re-hiring at their brick & mortar locations and call it 'the return of the hobby center' or something like that...
GW are going to be aware there will be customers/opportunities that are missed; I guess it will be weighed against the cost to get those opportunities.
If you think that many stores in the UK went from 7 days to 5 days, the figures will show what gets lost (or doesn't). If a 5 day opening, one man store can make as much as it did when open 7 days with 3 staff then it's all good. And to be honest, it doesn't even need to make that much, it just needs to increase in % profit.
GW stores aren't designed to cater to 100% of the collecting community; that's why they have a webstore and a huge number of stockists.
Oh, I completely see where you're arguing from. But I think the evidence is against them. What evidence?
The fact that every other shop on the High Street has more than one staff member. I'm not sure you can wave away GW as being so unique a retail experience that somehow they can go against what every other shop does as a matter of basic operation and somehow be making more profit as a result. If it were really that easy, Game would only be open 5 days a week and Waterstone's would have one staff member on the till and close up for lunch. Yet somehow, those two businesses (which if anything, rely less on needing someone in store to sell the product, have no need to push a 'community', and suffer from equal online competition) always have two staff on. If the one man store concept was that great a money saving idea, I'm pretty sure businesses like them would be all over it.
Yet for some reason, they're not....
I'd say it's worse - Game doesn't need to spend 30 minutes running intro games to new customers. Waterstones don't need to spend more than a few moments pointing them to appropriate sections.
GW stores (assuming they have customers) should actually require more staff than pretty much anywhere else.
The math also bothered me - saying that having two employees means needing to more than double sales assumes that payroll is the primary expense with a two man shop....
Which does not hold true for any moderately central location of reasonable size.
From what I can gather, unless you're looking at a hole in the wall store in a back street, the rent on any retail unit in the UK will be higher than the staffs salary. I haven't been able to find an equivalent price for our local GW as it's outside a shopping centre in a grubby alley, but a similarly sized internal one in a prominent location 200ft away comes in at about £100k/year in rent.
Herzlos wrote: From what I can gather, unless you're looking at a hole in the wall store in a back street, the rent on any retail unit in the UK will be higher than the staffs salary. I haven't been able to find an equivalent price for our local GW as it's outside a shopping centre in a grubby alley, but a similarly sized internal one in a prominent location 200ft away comes in at about £100k/year in rent.
Well that does appear to be GW's new favourite location.
I was to a GW store in Edmonton about two weeks ago and they had 4 employees working. One may have been the manager. There was a 40k game going on with one player having only half his army painted. Lots of people going in and out. It was good to see. And it wasn't creepy like the 1-man storefront.
There seems to be a majority consensus that they don't work at all and GW are 'very silly' to be running one-man stores in the first place.
Is no one able to accept that they work perfectly well in some locations but not in others? There is a future for them in the right locations.
As I said in the first place, I've ran 2 very successful one-man stores myself, one of which had a higher turnover with one staff than it did with 3 (though of course there's the possibility turnover could have increased more with a second staff member).
GW isn't following blindly along with a blanket "one-man store everywhere!" approach- it gets assessed and looked at regularly (in my experience) and staffing levels will adjust if necessary.
There are 7 GW stores within 30 miles of me, 3 of them are one-man, the other 4 have between 2 and 4 staff.
There are lots of important factors that anyone outside of GW won't really know either, such as transaction count, footfall, overheads etc. These things are going to influence decisions behind the scenes. Yes, cutting staff is a cost cutter, not necessarily a short term one though- GW's aim is always to be successful long term, they're always playing the long game. Somewhere there is a balance between staff levels, turnover and profit. It's going to be different in a variety of locations and it's going to take a bit of fiddling to get right.
In regards to closing down stores, GW open more stores a year than they close, and most are just being moved rather than closed; unsuccessful stores are closed, that happens across high street retail.
I think store closures are more prominent in the USA, but here in the UK they're pretty damn rare- there's a whole host of stores that are 15+ years old.
The question remains - what locations do they work well in?
My guess, educated, but still a guess, is that they work in far fewer places than GW has one man stores.
GW has just opened a one man store within three minutes walk of where I work - open less than three months, and already they are talking about selling their lease. (I had not even realized that selling leases was an option until I heard them talking.)
As for a 'blanket "one-man store everywhere!" - have you bothered reading their (well, Kirby's) own statements in their financial reports?
One man stores was going to be their blanket policy - it is a matter of public record.
That they have started deviating from that plan indicates that it was a short sighted policy, and one that they recognized was not working. (Believe it or not - I view that as a positive development - recognizing a bad policy is much better than refusing to acknowledge a mistake.)
It may work in some locations - but that does not mean that it works in most locations, including many of the locations that they have switched to the one man stores.
I have visited the store twice - once opening week, the other yesterday. This time there was another representative of GW as well as the counter monkey.
That they were talking about selling the lease while there was a customer in the shop does not bode well for that location. (My first GW purchase in five years - a bottle of liquid green stuff.)
As far as I know, the store has been keeping to its posted hours - no mysterious closings while the manager has his gall bladder removed for the second time.
In spite of that, it is not doing well.
On the other hand, most of the customers lost by the older GW-dependent store have returned to their old haunts - there was nothing at the newer store to hold their attention.
A net loss for GW, but if they can sell their lease, not a huge one.
Lorizael wrote:There seems to be a majority consensus that they don't work at all and GW are 'very silly' to be running one-man stores in the first place.
Is no one able to accept that they work perfectly well in some locations but not in others? There is a future for them in the right locations.
As I said in the first place, I've ran 2 very successful one-man stores myself, one of which had a higher turnover with one staff than it did with 3 (though of course there's the possibility turnover could have increased more with a second staff member).
GW isn't following blindly along with a blanket "one-man store everywhere!" approach- it gets assessed and looked at regularly (in my experience) and staffing levels will adjust if necessary.
There are 7 GW stores within 30 miles of me, 3 of them are one-man, the other 4 have between 2 and 4 staff.
There are lots of important factors that anyone outside of GW won't really know either, such as transaction count, footfall, overheads etc. These things are going to influence decisions behind the scenes. Yes, cutting staff is a cost cutter, not necessarily a short term one though- GW's aim is always to be successful long term, they're always playing the long game. Somewhere there is a balance between staff levels, turnover and profit. It's going to be different in a variety of locations and it's going to take a bit of fiddling to get right.
In regards to closing down stores, GW open more stores a year than they close, and most are just being moved rather than closed; unsuccessful stores are closed, that happens across high street retail.
I think store closures are more prominent in the USA, but here in the UK they're pretty damn rare- there's a whole host of stores that are 15+ years old.
This. Yep. 100%. The success or otherwise is very circumstantial and the one-man-store isn't a blanket approach. They can work and their success really depends on the store and the staff member (and their casual who fills in sicks days and whatnot), but as a generic solution to falling profits or an attempt to increase profits, it's unlikely to work.
TheAuldGrump wrote:The question remains - what locations do they work well in?
That, IMO, is an effectively impossible question to answer without actually doing a 'field test'.
Lorizael wrote:There seems to be a majority consensus that they don't work at all and GW are 'very silly' to be running one-man stores in the first place.
Is no one able to accept that they work perfectly well in some locations but not in others? There is a future for them in the right locations.
As I said in the first place, I've ran 2 very successful one-man stores myself, one of which had a higher turnover with one staff than it did with 3 (though of course there's the possibility turnover could have increased more with a second staff member).
GW isn't following blindly along with a blanket "one-man store everywhere!" approach- it gets assessed and looked at regularly (in my experience) and staffing levels will adjust if necessary.
There are 7 GW stores within 30 miles of me, 3 of them are one-man, the other 4 have between 2 and 4 staff.
There are lots of important factors that anyone outside of GW won't really know either, such as transaction count, footfall, overheads etc. These things are going to influence decisions behind the scenes. Yes, cutting staff is a cost cutter, not necessarily a short term one though- GW's aim is always to be successful long term, they're always playing the long game. Somewhere there is a balance between staff levels, turnover and profit. It's going to be different in a variety of locations and it's going to take a bit of fiddling to get right.
In regards to closing down stores, GW open more stores a year than they close, and most are just being moved rather than closed; unsuccessful stores are closed, that happens across high street retail.
I think store closures are more prominent in the USA, but here in the UK they're pretty damn rare- there's a whole host of stores that are 15+ years old.
This. Yep. 100%. The success or otherwise is very circumstantial and the one-man-store isn't a blanket approach. They can work and their success really depends on the store and the staff member (and their casual who fills in sicks days and whatnot), but as a generic solution to falling profits or an attempt to increase profits, it's unlikely to work.
TheAuldGrump wrote:The question remains - what locations do they work well in?
That, IMO, is an effectively impossible question to answer without actually doing a 'field test'.
Glad to know I'm being looked down upon (or so the wording would suggest). Regardless, market research can't give you a definite answer as to whether or not a one-man store will actually work. I feel like it'd be on a short-list of "This might work here", but whether or not it actually works and/or is the best option? Market research isn't likely to definitively tell you that. But what do I know? I'm just some dude you're having an argument with on Dakka...
I believe he is referencing former CEO Tom Kirby's infamous preamble which proudly declared that Games Workshop does no market research as it is "Otiose in a niche hobby".
Glad to know I'm being looked down upon (or so the wording would suggest). Regardless, market research can't give you a definite answer as to whether or not a one-man store will actually work. I feel like it'd be on a short-list of "This might work here", but whether or not it actually works and/or is the best option? Market research isn't likely to definitively tell you that. But what do I know? I'm just some dude you're having an argument with on Dakka...
The guys name is "grump" I wouldnt take his tone personal. Generally I can tell from here, GW used to be in Colorado Mills, now its in a part of town I would call "sketchy"and they are unreliable at best. the store is tiny to the point of genuinely unpleasant to be in.
TheCustomLime wrote:I believe he is referencing former CEO Tom Kirby's infamous preamble which proudly declared that Games Workshop does no market research as it is "Otiose in a niche hobby".
Which is stupid on so many levels.
I was previously unaware of this preamble from the CEO. A reference to that makes more sense haha.
thekingofkings wrote:The guys name is "grump" I wouldnt take his tone personal.
haha fair call. I would generalise that to being the internet
thekingofkings wrote:Generally I can tell from here, GW used to be in Colorado Mills, now its in a part of town I would call "sketchy"and they are unreliable at best. the store is tiny to the point of genuinely unpleasant to be in.
One-man stores need to find the balance of size. IMO if they cant (relatively) comfortably fit two 6'x4' tables, a single display table, and some semblance of a painting table, then the store is probably too small. A store I go to runs into this exact problem.
Having just come back from a 1 man store, I can say that the experience certainly needs some improvement.
Not the dude running the place fault, but I ordered some Wood Elf Glade Riders to the store for pick up seeing as GW had dropped them. He told me to come back and pick them up on Thursday.
So I made my way to the store today and they are not there.
Not a huge deal, but it is irritating. Given my experience there I'm not likely to patronize the place again unless I need to order from GW direct (postal delivery is unreliable where I live - since they deregulated delivery services here, the guys that do it just hand your package off to whoever will sign for it. To me it's not worth the hassle.).
When I consider that the local FLGS has a bigger selection of GW products (they also stock LOTR and have some older models still available) for cheaper (they did a money off deal on starter sets for easter) as well as having a selection of other interesting products (board games, RPGs, CCGs, figurines, comic books, lots of other wargames...) and manage to somehow employ five staff in a much bigger location and still make money - what reason is GW giving me to use their shop?
I've been to the one man stores in Columbus and Birmingham multiple times recently, neither one is ever busy enough to warrant more than one employee. The FLGS' near those GW stores are always far busier and do more revenue. I don't think the one man stores have a future considering even with all the cost cutting, they still lost more money than they made last year. GW seems to think they serve a vital purpose of getting people into the hobby. In my experience, most of the customers at the GW store in Birmingham already played GW games long before that store even existed. Sure, the store has gotten a few new people into 40k. However, if it were my business, a few new customers does not justify the cost of running that store. The rumors are that it will be closed at the end of the third year. They signed a 5 year lease on the space with an option to get out after the 3rd year if business wasn't there. They just can't compete with 3 other stores within a 15 minute drive that stock GW and also comics, MTG, WMH, x wing/armada, infinity, gundam kits, etc.
I'm sure there was a time that GW stores did a good job of enticing new customers in to their games. Back when they were situated in areas of heavier foot traffic and when they had enough staff to engage people who walked in and run an intro game for them. My local GW back in the 90's and early 2000's, if you hung around the store for a while (painting or whatever) you'd see a bunch of people wander in and have intro games run for them. These days you're unlikely to get walk ins because the store is situated a decent walk away from the rest of the shops and even if someone did wander in during a peak time (or often even not in peak times) the manager is far less likely to be able to engage them before they walk out.
Perhaps these days they wouldn't work as well because most people now know that they aren't a video game or general hobby shop, especially since they've rebranded to "Warhammer" now instead of "Games Workshop".
TheCustomLime wrote: I believe he is referencing former CEO Tom Kirby's infamous preamble which proudly declared that Games Workshop does no market research as it is "Otiose in a niche hobby".
Which is stupid on so many levels.
Exactly - and why I suspect that the one man store strategy is not as well planned out as IllumiNini believes - I think that it was more a product of panicked cost cutting than tactical thought.
Kirby's prerambles are also how we know that the one man stores were intended to become universal - and that they were considered a 'success' in spite of a 30% loss from the sales from their retail locations. (The depressing thing - the stores are 'now breaking even' - which implies that the GW/Warhammer stores were previously operating in the red.)
One man stores are not growing the hobby, and cannot be considered a success from that stance, but are no longer losing money.
Which calls back to the question 'Are the stores worth it?'
If we are considering only the one man stores, I very much expect that the answer would be 'no'. (In some locations the answer might well be 'Hell no![/i].)
My own preferred option would be for GW to make their stores more general purpose - bring in complimentary products from other companies, rather than GW attempting a monopoly.
Glad to know I'm being looked down upon (or so the wording would suggest). Regardless, market research can't give you a definite answer as to whether or not a one-man store will actually work. I feel like it'd be on a short-list of "This might work here", but whether or not it actually works and/or is the best option? Market research isn't likely to definitively tell you that. But what do I know? I'm just some dude you're having an argument with on Dakka...
The guys name is "grump" I wouldnt take his tone personal. Generally I can tell from here, GW used to be in Colorado Mills, now its in a part of town I would call "sketchy"and they are unreliable at best. the store is tiny to the point of genuinely unpleasant to be in.
'Grump' literally translates to 'grey haired man', from Scots dialect. The Auld Grump = The Old Grey Haired Man. (But I have had the nickname since my twenties, my first grey hairs started showing up when I was sixteen....)
It was kind of strange, a few years ago my hair started growing in dark at the roots... it looked like I had been dying my hair grey and then stopped....
-- One-man stores aren't all knee-jerk reactions to poor store performance; some of them were planned (speaking only in the broadest sense of them having one staff member).
-- Especially given the testimonials in this thread, a vast majority of them haven't worked, but in my experience, they have. That might be because of where I live (meaning my location may be conducive of the success of one-man stores), but I can't say for sure.
-- With the above two points in mind, the one-man store model was not completely unplanned nor was it very well planned and only seems to work in a sort of Goldilocks Zone of both population levels and levels of interest.
@TheAuldGrump: I never really said they were well planned, I just said they're not all as bad as the experiences and opinions of people on this thread make them out to be.
-- One-man stores aren't all knee-jerk reactions to poor store performance; some of them were planned (speaking only in the broadest sense of them having one staff member).
-- Especially given the testimonials in this thread, a vast majority of them haven't worked, but in my experience, they have. That might be because of where I live (meaning my location may be conducive of the success of one-man stores), but I can't say for sure.
-- With the above two points in mind, the one-man store model was not completely unplanned nor was it very well planned and only seems to work in a sort of Goldilocks Zone of both population levels and levels of interest.
@TheAuldGrump: I never really said they were well planned, I just said they're not all as bad as the experiences and opinions of people on this thread make them out to be.
Please, read the financial reports - there is a reason that so many folks think that the one man stores are such a bad idea. The one man stores really are a 'knee jerk reaction to poor store performance'.
Really, GW's own words are much more damning than what people are saying on this thread - defending GW without reading them is like taking off your armor before battle, and cripples your arguments. Arm yourself with the information - there are ways that the one man stores could have been deployed to advantage, but going by Kirby's own words... that was not the case.
I am certain that there have been district and regional managers that had better and more detailed information than GW's main office, and that those district and regional managers were able to position at least some of those one man stores in strategic locations - but that is not from due diligence by the main office. It is being handed lemons and trying to make lemonade.
At this point I am actually more optimistic about GW's long term chances than I was even a single year ago - Rountree is making some much needed changes - and his actions seem much less to be knee jerk defensive reactions.
A lot of Kirby's actions have been about cost cutting and increasing profit - not growing the industry or even the business.
The result has been ever decreasing sales - wider margins on fewer sales.
In that time, other companies have been making inroads on GW's dominance.
Kirby did a lot of damage over the last decade - and it will take time to repair that damage.
The Auld Grump - you may even enjoy reading the reports, I certainly did. At the very least, you will understand more of the jokes that keep surfacing on Dakka, those objects of gem like magic and wonder....
I'm not necessarily defending GW so much as trying to say that one-man stores aren't as much of a colossally bad idea s it's generally thought of to be. It was still a colossal mistake.
And though I appreciate the suggestion to read the reports in order to become more familiar with the issue, I'm not pulling this out of thin are. All I'm saying is "This is my opinion based on my experience with my two local GW stores - bth of which are successful one-man stores."
When discussing a multi million pound, multi site, global retailer, designer and manufacturer and their performance, personal experience of two sites in one of their smaller territories is as close to thin air as to effectively be a meaningless distinction.
You're entitled to think what you will, of course, but it is important to realize the information you're basing your opinion on is such a small element of the whole as to be near irrelevant.
Well not that there's anything wrong about what you've said, but if my experience exists, then it stands to reason that other such stores exist around the world in other markets. I find it hard to believe that the stores I attend are an isolated occurence.
But if my experience is not enough of a basis for a valid arguement, then I guess that's my cue to back out of this discussion.
I've always found getting better at or better informed about something preferable to just giving up and walking away.
But, no, anecdotal evidence has a place, but if it contradicts the general facts of a situation, then it's fair to assume it's aberrant and not terribly meaningful.
Well reading through financial reports isnt something I have an over-abundance of time to sink into for the sake of one forum discussion on Dakka. If it becomes relevant to me again, I will try to find the time.
And fair enough. I just figured my experiences would at least demonstrate that this one-man store policy isn't as much of a total blanket failure as people seem to think
IllumiNini wrote: Well reading through financial reports isnt something I have an over-abundance of time to sink into for the sake of one forum discussion on Dakka. If it becomes relevant to me again, I will try to find the time.
And fair enough. I just figured my experiences would at least demonstrate that this one-man store policy isn't as much of a total blanket failure as people seem to think
I think it truly matters what else is going on. In my instance, Denver is not a small fry city by any stretch of the imagination, and basically just about the only place you can still get GW products is GW, and with it being so small and unpleasant, it puts GW at a distinct disadvantage against other games. There are alot of FLGS (though not as many as I would like) in the area and most wont carry GW. This would normally mean that GW should do well since nearly noone else carries their products, but since you can barely breathe in the place and certainly dont want to be there after dark, It is more a failure. They will stay in buisiness, likely, but that they had to move to subprime area and into a tiny store makes it not good. I have only been to a few places in Australia (Great folks by the way, love you knuckleheads ) there were not as many game stores, so GW had that going for it.
IllumiNini wrote: Well not that there's anything wrong about what you've said, but if my experience exists, then it stands to reason that other such stores exist around the world in other markets. I find it hard to believe that the stores I attend are an isolated occurence.
But if my experience is not enough of a basis for a valid arguement, then I guess that's my cue to back out of this discussion.
I just realized you're flag says Australia, now I'm really curious where your locals are?
I know mine on the Gold Coast and the battle bunker up at Brisbane always seem to have people in them but outside of the official GW no one on the CG seems to have any interest in GW, so that store could well be considered successful even if GW's wider market share is a lot smaller than it was 5-10 years ago.
I've been into the one in Geelong, and it was HUGE for a one man store, but despite room for 8 or 10 tables they only had 2, plus a painting one and demo tables. It was also empty on the day I went in, Boxing day. I kinda assumed there would be a ton of other people like me who had been dragged to the sales going on in the stores all around it and hiding out there.
I've also heard horrible things about some of the Sydney stores, like the one that apparently opened up directly underneath a well established FLGS and failed miserably to take any of their customers with less gaming space, higher prices, and less product on the shelves.
I think it must be a hard job to be a single-man GW store operator.
You've got to meet really challenging targets, you can't offer any discounts. You've got to stick with the (sometimes completely insane) company line on all sorts of things.
You can't stock tie in games like FFGRPGs or board games. You've actually got a limited supply of your companies own models compared to most independent stores (like, my local non GW still has a pretty complete range of LOTR stuff, whereas the GW store has none. As a LOTR enthusiast, that makes my shopping choices pretty easy.).
You're hamstrung in so many ways if you just compare GW stores selling GW products to a FLGS that sells both GW products and tie in products. Then factor in that the FLGS may have 10 other fully developed wargames on it's shelves, plus other board games CCGs, CMGs, comics and all the rest. They probably have more staff meaning you spend less time waiting to get served and are open more days a week.
I can see GW stores surviving in places where there is no tradition of independent stores, where the independent is a smelly gak hole with unfriendly staff, or in the odd place where the customer base are all GW fanatics. But christ, it must be a tough job in any other area.
I think I know your local though I've forgotten it's name. Huge place over 3 floors with giant tin-tin stuff in the arcade outside and lots of classic comic figurines like Asterix and the likes? Ultra Comix?
I visited it twice on a recent business trip, when the local GW was closed (it was too out of the way to swing by the 2nd time).
Other than gaming tables (if the GW have any), I really can't see how they can compete with a store that can dedicate more floor space to LARP costumes than GW has in it's entirety.
That's the place alright. Pretty decent, though not much gaming space for wargames readily apparent - I think there's a room upstairs but it seems to mostly get used for card games.
Awesome shop though.
I see the local GW guy doing a lot to try and compete and he seems to have carved a niche of fairly dedicated players out, but I feel like he's seriously got his work cut out for him, poor guy. The problems I encountered in using his store were more to do with how GW have structured things than a reflection on him as an employee or worker.
I appreciate that there are some stores and store managers that somehow make the one-man store strategy work, but the entirety of the Western retail economy shows that even one more staff member would be beneficial.
When I was in college, I worked in a tuxedo rental shop, a business at least as dependent on personal salesmanship and customer retention as wargaming, if not more so. It's also very seasonal work. But even in the dead of winter, when the store would be lucky to see more than a half-dozen customers a week, my manager always kept two part-timers on the schedule.
Da Boss wrote: That's the place alright. Pretty decent, though not much gaming space for wargames readily apparent - I think there's a room upstairs but it seems to mostly get used for card games.
Awesome shop though.
I see the local GW guy doing a lot to try and compete and he seems to have carved a niche of fairly dedicated players out, but I feel like he's seriously got his work cut out for him, poor guy. The problems I encountered in using his store were more to do with how GW have structured things than a reflection on him as an employee or worker.
Yeah I should stress that I've got had no problems with the single staffers on a personal level, they've all been good guys trying their hardest.
Da Boss wrote: That's the place alright. Pretty decent, though not much gaming space for wargames readily apparent - I think there's a room upstairs but it seems to mostly get used for card games.
Awesome shop though.
I see the local GW guy doing a lot to try and compete and he seems to have carved a niche of fairly dedicated players out, but I feel like he's seriously got his work cut out for him, poor guy. The problems I encountered in using his store were more to do with how GW have structured things than a reflection on him as an employee or worker.
Yeah I should stress that I've got had no problems with the single staffers on a personal level, they've all been good guys trying their hardest.
With the home office doing their best to make sure that hardest is as hard as possible....
I've always found getting better at or better informed about something preferable to just giving up and walking away.
But, no, anecdotal evidence has a place, but if it contradicts the general facts of a situation, then it's fair to assume it's aberrant and not terribly meaningful.
Anecdotal evidence is most useful in aggregate - and can be used to discern trends.
If fifteen people say that X type of shop is doing better than Y type of shop, and one person states that Y type of shop is doing better, then it is likely that X type of shop is doing better.
Back when Pathfinder came out the game was selling better, locally, than 4e.
I posted about that, thinking that what i was seeing was that my area had better taste than the rest of the country.
Then I started seeing posts from a lot of places that Pathfinder was outselling 4e.
There were plenty of 4e folks denying that was the case, as more and more reports came in that 4e... was not selling as well as Pathfinder.
Then came a report from ICV2, confirming the anecdotal evidence.
And 4e fans were still denying the trend.
And then... WotC announced 5e - 4e, it seems, was not all that.
Right now, we are seeing a lot of people saying that one man stores are not meeting their wishes, and a few that are stating that the one man stores are doing fine.
Herzlos wrote: It's also possible that some one man stores *are* doing fine, whilst the rest aren't.
I don't think anyone has really denied that, just that it's not a good default policy and even if you're doing "fine" doesn't mean you might not do better with 1.5 or 2 staff instead.
Just throwing it out there but I did go into my local GW today to pick up a couple of models that were ordered in for me. When I got them I found one was missing parts and showed the employee.
He had to fill out a form to send off to the warehouse, which he had never had to do before so he had to call the battle bunker where there was an employee who could spend five or ten minutes walking him through it.
It still took him half an hour or so to fill out fully and submit, plus the break he had to take to serve the customer that came in in that time.
Admin stuff can't always just be brushed off as a 'do it after closing, overtime is part of the job' thing. He also made a comment about how he was making progress painting up the stores copy of the Horus Heresy boardgame. Since it released how many months ago he has painted like... two characters and nearly 10 marines.
It's simply impractical for management to expect him to be able to paint up the display models for the store while on the clock, and unreasonable for them to expect him to do it in his own time (which I think I've heard they do in some cases).
I'm not sure my local GW manager has managed to paint much at all for display. I haven't been there for a while, but the AoS stuff last time I was there was mostly just basecoated with a few details picked out, some where still wearing primer, that was several months after AoS came out.
I believe a lot of the stuff in the display shelves are stuff he painted before he actually started the job or stuff painted by customers. It's not always practical to get customers working as slave labour to paint your models Though my local hobby store (not GW) also has a display cabinet full of customer's models, so I guess it's not unheard of (though that's also a bit of an oddity because the owner of the store is good friends with a modeller who has had his models in magazine articles).
Now that you mention it the last time I saw my local's AoS models (I didn't look at them today) they were in the same state as the HH set, the sigmarines were sprayed gold with like 2 of them painted and the Chaos were sprayed black or red with some skin picked out here and there.
I know most of the models in the actual display cases are local painter's models because I have a shelf of random models in there myself. I think the battle bunker has a lot more cases and have a lot of staff projects in them, but have plenty of customer models too. It'd have thought it was just the norm that the display cases were filled with customer stuff.
move.
), fair call, buddy. Sums it it pretty well.
