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Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





Bournemouth, UK

Went into my local GW store the other day and was shown the new Eldar codex, which looked v nice. I was then presented with an unpainted Wraithlord, which again was a v nice model.  I was then told the price... £25.

At this point I said "thank you very much" and walked. Could somebody please explain to me why GW is so set on this crazy path? I mean I can get a metal starter set for most of their rivals, which will include cards and quick rules, for the same price (I'm NOT discussing the quality of rules etc, so please no replies along these lines)!?!

If you look at the physical model in your hand, the pricing just seems to be mad. Surely a GW tank has more plastic and cost about the same?

When I saw the army deal I was seriously going to go for it, but then I realised I had most of the models in it. I then decided I'd what the extra month and get the codex on it's own and buy the models as I needed them. Definately not going to happen now, I mean 3 Wraithlords would cost me £75! That £140 for the army deal is now going to be split between the other game systems now, stupid, stupid company.


Live your life that the fear of death can never enter your heart. Trouble no one about his religion. Respect others in their views and demand that they respect yours. Love your life, perfect your life. Beautify all things in your life. Seek to make your life long and of service to your people. When your time comes to die, be not like those whose hearts are filled with fear of death, so that when their time comes they weep and pray for a little more time to live their lives over again in a different way. Sing your death song, and die like a hero going home.

Lt. Rorke - Act of Valor

I can now be found on Facebook under the name of Wulfstan Design

www.wulfstandesign.co.uk

http://www.voodoovegas.com/
 
   
Made in us
Fate-Controlling Farseer





Fort Campbell

That is the reason that Ebay has been my only method of purchasing GW products anymore. Eventually GW will learn that constantly raising their prices like they are will only drive there profit down. Until then, Ebay will be where I get my models.

Full Frontal Nerdity 
   
Made in us
Plastictrees



Amongst the Stars, In the Night

Aside from the Battle For Skull Pass box (which I got at a steep discount and in US dollars), I stopped buying GW products all together. Their pricing, more than anything else, is whats running them into the ground.

OT Zone: A More Wretched Hive of Scum and Villany
The Loyal Slave learns to Love the Lash! 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




The title of this thread is somewhat confusing i found.

I thought originally that it was discussing a new price for the Wraithlord (ie GW price change) however its talking about the price of the new wraithlord. Maybe if you can edit the title move the wording around a bit?

Back to topic though, why were you so suprised on the price? Come on a Space Marine Dreadnought is 20 or 25 pounds now i believe and theres naff all plastic in that. Also squads are 18 pounds basic. 25 was to be expected.

GW constant increase in prices is ridiculous and very short sighted. And the companies incessant denial that it is doing so is also laughable.

For example I recntly brought the Tau Battleforce set (which isn't too bad actually considering whats inside). However when i realised that under the recent tank price hike I'd have to spend £90 on the transports and 2 heavy support choices I needed to finish the army (firewarriors on foot anyone? thats not practical in game terms and pathfinders are forced to buy a devilfish by rules) it was just stupid.

How can i compare the 50 pounds i spent on the bulk of my army (troops, crisis suits, stealth teams, and a transport) with the 90 pounds for just 3 or 4 tanks....

Suffice to say I bought the sprues from somewhere else for more than half the price.

When i questioned this to a GW employee I was told that "you earn a lot more now than you did when you were a student so its alright." Just because I may earn more now as a graduate does not mean that A) I have disposable income or B) that I'd be either dumb enough or happy to throw money away. If a company see's things like this then its a seriously bad omen for the future.

I (now that i have everything i need) like Narly will refuse to buy anything from a GW store. Although I love the new eldar models and have considered buying the army set, Ultimately the excess cash i would need to complete the army in a decent or workable way is totally prohibative.

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




25 pounds is what, $40? For the one model? Its cool and all, but its not that cool.

*shrug* GW is running with the idea of high prices, low sales. Thats it. Their individula unit sales are low, and have been decreasing for years, at least in the US. So they make it up in high prices. Its the only way they'll stay afloat.

Not much else to say. I'm so done with GW. Bartertown and ebay are the only ways I bother getting any models. I havent even bothered getting the 7th fantasy rules....

Hope more old fools come to their senses and start giving you their money instead of those Union Jack Blood suckers...  
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut



Westchester, NY

Like Carmachu, I tend to get my most of my items from Bartertown and ebay also. The pricing on GW items wouldn't be half as bad if buyers stopped buying and used their old figures instead. Sure the new Wraithlord looks good as do all the new castings whether metal or plastic. That doesn't mean we have to trade up all the time.

Recycling the older models or rebasing them for rules purposes are just as effient and less costly. GW thrives on gamers buying newer models of the same type after the release of a new codex. If sales dropped on the newer figure lines "maybe" they would wise up. Then again so to should players/buyers do the same.

RB

Word Bearers--5000 W1 L1 D0
Grey Knights--7000 W13 L8 D1
Thousand Sons---W8 L3 D0
Adeptus Mechanicus--WLD
"We own the Night" 
   
Made in us
Foul Dwimmerlaik





Minneapolis, MN

After taking a phenominal nose dive earlier this year in the stock market (they almost hit 200 out of nearly 500) they have made a remarkable recovery back to 400.

Somebody must think this company is doing good.

   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





dakka-ites can whine, but if people weren't buying them then they'd do something about it. The public is supporting the prices obviously, so for GW its all good. personally, $40 is about what anything similar to a Wraithlord costs, so its not out of line with the rest of thier pricing for the most part.

I think we need a seperate GW prices rant forum

Golden Demon standard?? I can barely paint Great Unclean One standard! 
   
Made in jp
[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer






Somewhere in southern England.

How many people have bought Space Pope at £20?

Petition to stop ratification of EU Article 13 on Internet Copyright

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




dakka-ites can whine, but if people weren't buying them then they'd do something about it. The public is supporting the prices obviously, so for GW its all good. personally, $40 is about what anything similar to a Wraithlord costs, so its not out of line with the rest of thier pricing for the most part.



Ah, but the real question is, are people buying them? The number of people buying, at least in the US has been steadily going down, not up.

The only thing up is the price....

Hope more old fools come to their senses and start giving you their money instead of those Union Jack Blood suckers...  
   
Made in eu
Infiltrating Broodlord





Mordheim/Germany

I rather buy the new one for the 25 pounds instead of the old one for less (dunno exactly how much). Imo, it's totally worth it, especially because similar models are the same price (Dreadnaught, Carnifex...)

I'm considering how I'm gonna build my Eldar army up. 300? (200 pounds,380$) will give me a very decent army. Don't know if this is worth it.
Sure thing I'm roaming Ebay and trying to get discount prices. But I guess the best way to earn money is to keep the prices down. How knows how many Armies I would have bought if prices were lower?

Greets
Schepp himself

40k:
Fantasy: Skaven, Vampires  
   
Made in au
Been Around the Block




Rockhampton

I am not rich by any stretch of the imagination but I prefer to buy all my minis new unassembled. I do check on ebay and now and then there is something that piques my interest but its just not the same. In saying this I do agree the pirces are too high but when you look at the cost of cigarettes and what they do to you, its a better way to spend your money.

The leprechaun tells me to burn things. 
   
Made in ca
Drew_Riggio






I guess it will be of great consolation that no one is going to put a gun to your head and force you to buy it.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





Bournemouth, UK

dakka-ites can whine, but if people weren't buying them then they'd do something about it. The public is supporting the prices obviously, so for GW its all good. personally, $40 is about what anything similar to a Wraithlord costs, so its not out of line with the rest of thier pricing for the most part.

You're right in this, it's not out of line with their pricing, however please cast your eyes over the information below (again I ask people to not pass comment on the rules / models or whether you like them, it's about the physical product).

Urban War Gamebox £30

This set contains everything you need for two players to play a game of Urban War. The box includes: 12 white metal
miniatures, Plastic clip together Hexagon Construction set, Urban War 48 page rulebook and 2 D10 dice.

Confrontation starter set £18

A special STARER SET containing armies for Wolfen Vs Dirz

Contains over £35.00 worth of models! (3 Wolfen & 4 Dirz!!!) A special STARER SET containing armies for Wolfen Vs Dirz . Includes stat cards and mini rule book.

or for £35

The set gives you the Full softback rule book, plus counters & Cards needed to start you off, plus 9 Miniatures 4 for wolfen and 5 for Dirz models.

Warmachine Menoth Battle Group £25 (in fact all battlegroups)

This box set contains 4 miniatures, other factions are 3 / 4 / 5

GW Wraithlord £25

No rules, single model... no contest


Live your life that the fear of death can never enter your heart. Trouble no one about his religion. Respect others in their views and demand that they respect yours. Love your life, perfect your life. Beautify all things in your life. Seek to make your life long and of service to your people. When your time comes to die, be not like those whose hearts are filled with fear of death, so that when their time comes they weep and pray for a little more time to live their lives over again in a different way. Sing your death song, and die like a hero going home.

Lt. Rorke - Act of Valor

I can now be found on Facebook under the name of Wulfstan Design

www.wulfstandesign.co.uk

http://www.voodoovegas.com/
 
   
Made in ca
Tail-spinning Tomb Blade Pilot






why compare apples and oranges
in your comparison list, you should be comparing the Battle for Macragge set, not the wraithlord
compare a similarly sized model from the other games to do a fair comparison
   
Made in us
Foul Dwimmerlaik





Minneapolis, MN

Look, no one likes the prices. NO ONE. I know I am sure as hell not pleased.

But if you want the models, you gotta pay the price. End of the line.

Comparisons to other games are ok, and I agree that GW should be more competitive, but thats not stopping GW from pricing things this way.

There are plenty of online discount places that you will be able to buy a new wraithlord for the the price it was before remodelling. Maybe even less.

I hate it when people say this, but in some circumstances it is true. "If you dont like the prices, dont play the game."

   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





Bournemouth, UK

You're absolutely right, if you don't like it, don't buy it. It's just being 38 and realising that I've been gaming for 23... years ... now (oh my God, I'd not added up before!), you get a little annoyed when you see this and you're supposed to be grateful for it.

As to McGragge, it's still steep, when plastic is supposed to be cheaper. The other thing is I'm not an anti GW'er, I cut my gaming teeth on their stuff. However, having worked in a store for a short while, it stopped me in my tracks with regard to buying their stuff any more.


Live your life that the fear of death can never enter your heart. Trouble no one about his religion. Respect others in their views and demand that they respect yours. Love your life, perfect your life. Beautify all things in your life. Seek to make your life long and of service to your people. When your time comes to die, be not like those whose hearts are filled with fear of death, so that when their time comes they weep and pray for a little more time to live their lives over again in a different way. Sing your death song, and die like a hero going home.

Lt. Rorke - Act of Valor

I can now be found on Facebook under the name of Wulfstan Design

www.wulfstandesign.co.uk

http://www.voodoovegas.com/
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





I probably would have bought a Cryx Deathjack if it wasn't $50. That's about the same as the new wraithlord or maybe more. All minis are expensive.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Except that the Cryx Deathjack is a half a ton of steel ,err, well maybe a half a pound of pewter. You get the idea.

On the other hand, how much is a Juggernaught? IIRC it is about $35.

How much was Archaeon?
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




I probably would have bought a Cryx Deathjack if it wasn't $50. That's about the same as the new wraithlord or maybe more. All minis are expensive.


Except the HUG difference is, the death jack is unigue character type jack thats almost 1/3 of your force in 500pts and 1/5 in 750pts......you will only ever have one.

Wriathlord is not anything like that, you'll buy 2-3 .....

 

Add in one is metal and the wraithlord is probably plastic....

But yhey whatever floats your boat.


Hope more old fools come to their senses and start giving you their money instead of those Union Jack Blood suckers...  
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




why compare apples and oranges
in your comparison list, you should be comparing the Battle for Macragge set, not the wraithlord
compare a similarly sized model from the other games to do a fair comparison


Both the battle for macragge and battle for skull pass are good deals. That cant be disputed.

HOWEVER.

Its what comes after that thats no good. Yeah both starter sets are good deals, IF and ONLY IF, you play marines, tyranids, dwarves, goblins. Ifyou dont, sorry they suck.

Warmachines got starters that are good to go for any faction, rather than a select few.

If you want to expand....well, then GW loses out. Bigger forces, higher prices, no real chance for discounts.

Hope more old fools come to their senses and start giving you their money instead of those Union Jack Blood suckers...  
   
Made in us
Maddening Mutant Boss of Chaos





Boston

My general impression is that GW ties its prices more to the figures' point costs and role in their armies, than it does to the raw material going into the box. So essentially, you're paying the equivalent of dreadnought prices for the equivalent (roughly speaking) of a dreadnought.

   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




"Yeah both starter sets are good deals, IF and ONLY IF, you play marines, tyranids, dwarves, goblins. Ifyou dont, sorry they suck."

I would disagree. If you wanted to play 40k or WHFB, and you didn't know which one of the dozen or so races you wanted to be, the starters are great because they offer you two armies, the ruleset, dice, templates, rulers, and some terrain. If you had a friend who was interested in gaming, you could start playing that night from one box.

Can PP offer the same thing? Do the quickstart rules offer a pitched battle-like scenario (I can't remember, I threw them out since I got Primal anyway.) Do I get terrain? What about dice? What if my Carnivean wants to use his spray attack - where's the template?

In terms of models, I like the PP starter boxes too, though they are also merely a starting point. After seeing what Hexeris can do compared to Morghoul, I doubt I'll ever go back and use that Freddy Krueger wannabe.

The reality is, starter kits are designed to be starting points only. No wargaming company wants you to end at merely the starter box, which is why no starter box is competitively ideal. Anyway, I didn't really buy into Ghaz's disdain on people slamming GW from being imperfect but then turning a blind eye to other companies out there that do the same thing...but the idea is starting to rub off...good gaming!

Zoned

   
Made in fi
Been Around the Block




Posted By deitpike on 10/10/2006 1:32 PM
why compare apples and oranges
in your comparison list, you should be comparing the Battle for Macragge set, not the wraithlord
compare a similarly sized model from the other games to do a fair comparison

Here's Rackham's big bad in plastic: http://www.rackham-store.com/boutique_us/liste_produits.cfm?type=719&code_lg=lg_us&num=4

25 euros, or 17 pounds.

That's 68% of the price of the Wraithlord, and a bigger model.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





Plano, Texas

I don't remember this many people complaining about the new Carnifex being $45...

What has changed?
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




I would disagree. If you wanted to play 40k or WHFB, and you didn't know which one of the dozen or so races you wanted to be, the starters are great because they offer you two armies, the ruleset, dice, templates, rulers, and some terrain. If you had a friend who was interested in gaming, you could start playing that night from one box


You can disagree all you want, but the fact remains: unless you want to play marines/tyranids or dwarves/Goblins, no it is NOT a good deal. Yeah, you ahve two armies to play against yoru friend, but they DONT come with the stats, do they? Army book? Point costs?


Can PP offer the same thing? Do the quickstart rules offer a pitched battle-like scenario (I can't remember, I threw them out since I got Primal anyway.) Do I get terrain? What about dice? What if my Carnivean wants to use his spray attack - where's the template?


I have mine. No scenario, but if pitch battle scenario is the best you got, its not worth it. You get no worth while terrain with fantasy, the crashed plane is kinda cool, but not great thing either.

Spray attack: it explains it for the quick start: 1" wide, 8" long, just measure till you get the templates. Fantasy and 40k dont come with templates either, unless you cut your book up.


In terms of models, I like the PP starter boxes too, thought they are also merely a starting point. After seeing what Hexeris can do compared to Morghoul, I doubt I'll ever go back and use that Freddy Krueger wannabe.


Going with you there. Ordered mine today. Cant wait to try him out. I stiull love mougurl, but the needed models to make him work arent released yet.

They are justa BETTER starting point, for the game as a whole. You get more with GW, but you forefit the right to get what you WANT with them, for a trade off of more models.


The reality is, starter kits are designed to be starting points only. No wargaming company wants you to end at merely the starter box, which is why no starter box is competitively ideal. Anyway, I didn't really buy into Ghaz's disdain on people slamming GW from being imperfect but then turning a blind eye to other companies out there that do the same thing...


PP's starter kits are better, as a whole, than GW's. YOu get what you WANT in a faction starter, for the game. So there's no loss to you. If you play tyranids/marines or dwarves/gobbos then you have a GREAT start. Want to play anything else? Your screwed.

PP gives me models I'll be using right off: you KNOW you are going to use both cyclopes, no matter what. You arent going to use the worlock, and the titan is a maybe....But you have a GREAT start.

The thing is: its not quite the same. GW's burned alot of bridges. They arent going to be cut any slack by most anymore.

PP's screwed up on occassion, BUT, they are for the most part, forerigth and come right out and tell you, the consumer, whats what. They LISTEN to the customers, something GW doesnt do.

Similar, but vastly different.



Hope more old fools come to their senses and start giving you their money instead of those Union Jack Blood suckers...  
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




To Caramachu:

I bought the Macragge box and the Skull Pass box, so I know the contents. No, you don't get points or stats for either starter armies. That isn't too important, since each side is pretty close to equal in points anyway. And the boxes come with...erm...quickstart rules, I guess you could call them, that tell you what you need to roll to hit, wound, save...and such. So without armybooks, points, and such, you can still play the game.

Of course, if you want to expand on a Dwarf or Goblin army, you'll have to buy the armybooks.

My point about scenarios is that the GW starter sets for each game gives you some basic instruction on how to get started - there is no such guindance from the PP starters. How far apart should our armies start? If we're going to proxy books and shoe boxes as terrain, roughly how much should we use?

BTW, the 40k and WHFB starters do come with the plastic templates.

I will agree that if you know what you want, the PP boxes are generally better for practical models.

But if you don't know what you want, (and there is more choice of armies in 40k and WHFB,) GW provides better starter boxes to sample the game, along with basic gaming supplies like rulers, dice, templates, and a little terrain. Not to mention the actual rulebook.

Anyway, to each his own opinion. Good gaming!

Zoned


   
Made in us
Hangin' with Gork & Mork






It's closer to $50 then $40.

Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






My point about scenarios is that the GW starter sets for each game gives you some basic instruction on how to get started - there is no such guindance from the PP starters. How far apart should our armies start? If we're going to proxy books and shoe boxes as terrain, roughly how much should we use


Its obvious you HAVENT bought the starter boxes for PP. Because your talking out your rectum.

Under starting the game, it explains deployment and how far apart you can be.....

Hope more old fools come to their senses and start giving you their money instead of those Union Jack Blood suckers...  
   
Made in ca
Buttons Should Be Brass, Not Gold!






Soviet Kanukistan

Posted By The Happy Anarchist on 10/10/2006 4:39 PM
Except that the Cryx Deathjack is a half a ton of steel ,err, well maybe a half a pound of pewter. You get the idea.

On the other hand, how much is a Juggernaught? IIRC it is about $35.

How much was Archaeon?

The Wraithlord is better compared to say - a Destroyer warjack which you'll end up buying multiples of.  It is 15 GBP.  Even the Centurion Warjack (which is more in line with current pricing) is 19 GBP.  That's a 25% difference.

Finally, each of these represents 20-25% of your 500 point army, where as Mr. Wraithlord is at best a 8-10% of your tournament size army.

The Unique Jacks are more in line with say, Asdrubael Vect, Galruch, Casket of Souls or Space Pope... (only more useful in game terms).  As far as that comparison goes, they don't seem any worse than GW's pricing... 

At least your getting a very large and complex model for your money.  Compare GW's pricing between stock lictor and death-leaper.

   
 
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