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For example, i bike guy has the TL bolters on his bike, and a melta on one hand, can he shoot both at the same time in the shooting phase?

yay post number 666

a bike can shoot one weapon for each rider displayed on the bike, meaning most can fire 1 a turn, while attack bikes may fire 2 a turn.

ahh i see, so they guy chooses whether to shoot his melta or his TL bolters on the bike. thanks for that.

Yes im aware of the attack bike, thank you, just asking about the bike.

But if you model another rider on the bike than it can shoot both

I don't advocate such blatant "modeling for advantage" but I just think that the RAW here is silly.

Always watch out for the siamese bike marines.

I agree that it's a silly rule.

Rather than a rule in the BRB it should have been a part of the marine codex as an exception specifically for attack bikes. But whatever, they make the rulez.

... I don't like the bikes may fire as many weapons as there are people ... as it lets you for example

SM Captain + stormbolter +Combie melta + bike and then model on 2 more space marines ... yes you may now shoot the TL bolter, the storm bolter and the combi-bolter ...
or
SM Chapter Master +stormbolter+combi-melta+ Auxiliary grenade launcher + bike
and then model on 3 SM ... then you can fire all weapons and call in an Orbital bombardment ...

No people, you can't.

There is a rule that you shoot one per rider, there is no rule that lets you add riders.

coredump wrote:No people, you can't.

There is a rule that you shoot one per rider, there is no rule that lets you add riders.

But it's never specified that attack bikes have 2 riders while normal bikes have one, The only demonstration of this fact that we have is that the models are this way. So whos to say you couldn't have two riders on a standard attack bike, I know the rules are meant to explicitly say things for you to be able to do them, but my point is they never explicitly say attack bikes have 2 riders, it's just most people model them that way.

Drunkspleen wrote:So whos to say you couldn't have two riders on a standard attack bike, I know the rules are meant to explicitly say things for you to be able to do them, but my point is they never explicitly say attack bikes have 2 riders, it's just most people model them that way.

GW's rules are permissive. You need to find something that says you CAN model more than one rider on a bike. An IC can purchase a bike from his options. Where does it say that it's a bike and a chauffeur?

And I belive that the fact that GW's model for the Attack Bike has two riders is quite explicit.

But you are aloud to scratch build if there is no GW model availible ...

In fact you could get really weird and model a Farseer on to a Viper and call it a jetbike...why? well he can now use two shotting attacks per turn

But all of this is just a piss take and no one would try it (well TFG would but i have a hard back rule book for that very reason)

And there is a GW model available for the Attack Bike. There's still no option to take a bike and a chauffeur and a Vyper is not a jetbike.

I would let an opponent field a well converted bike with two riders. Just as long as it was fielded as an attack bike.

My SM Bike captain model has two models on it. They still only fire one gun ( the only gun it's equipped with are the bike bolters).

Well a Space Marine Captain has no Model, you have to convert it.

if I convert a SM on bike with 3 riders on it can I fire 3 weapons? It never says either way how many riders are on a bike.

Waaaaaaagh! wrote:Well a Space Marine Captain has no Model, you have to convert it.

if I convert a SM on bike with 3 riders on it can I fire 3 weapons? It never says either way how many riders are on a bike.

No. You're equipping the Captain with a Space Marine bike. The description under 'other equipment' in the marine codex clearly explains what this includes, and an additional rider is not included.

Waaaaaaagh! wrote:Well a Space Marine Captain has no Model, you have to convert it.

if I convert a SM on bike with 3 riders on it can I fire 3 weapons? It never says either way how many riders are on a bike.

There are some things that clearly go against the intent of the rules. This is one of them.

Well for me its not "clearly against the intent".

Show me a passage in the rulebook to support your case, as has been shown to support my case.

willydstyle wrote:But if you model another rider on the bike than it can shoot both

I don't advocate such blatant "modeling for advantage" but I just think that the RAW here is silly.

Nob Bikers are even more unfair! Just start modeling dozens of Grots on them!

Id say no friggin way. You wouldnt be paying for the EXTRA riders as far as points go. Thats cheating simply because your fielding more marines then you paid for. Attack bikes have 2 riders mainly because it has 2 wounds. Says so in the book.

Waaaaaaagh! wrote:Well for me its not "clearly against the intent".

Show me a passage in the rulebook to support your case, as has been shown to support my case.

You haven't supported your case, not by a long shot. You've not once shown where a Space Marine Captain gets as many extra Marines as he wants when all he buys is a bike. He purchased a bike, period.

Sure it might not specify that in the bikes section of the rule book(I dont have it in front of me) but clearly this is one of those look at the big picture things. You CANNOT have marines or any mini for that matter that you havnt paid for. Thats ever worse then people pulling the "oh thats why my force was so badass, I "forgot" to add the points for my force commanders wargear" at the end of a game. Putting marines on a bike just so you can fire everything youve paid for is cheating beyond cheating. I wouldnt care if you converted your bikes to look cool, just dont pull that crap its blatantly cheating. After the well theres 3 minis on that bike so everygun can be shot, your going to say well since they are there it has 3 wonds too

Waaaaaaagh! wrote:if I convert a SM on bike with 3 riders on it can I fire 3 weapons? It never says either way how many riders are on a bike.

And if you model him in a red and blue spandex suit will you claim that he can fly around the table, shoot lasers from his eyes an be vunerable only to models that are equiped with Kyronite? (good luck finding a codex with that as a weapon option).

In short no.

There is no rule allowing you to put extra guys on a bike, therefore you can't. Simply announcing you can make a model for something you make up is nothing more than declaring an intention to cheat, not a proof of possiblity.

Hymirl wrote:

Waaaaaaagh! wrote:if I convert a SM on bike with 3 riders on it can I fire 3 weapons? It never says either way how many riders are on a bike.

And if you model him in a red and blue spandex suit will you claim that he can fly around the table, shoot lasers from his eyes an be vunerable only to models that are equiped with Kyronite? (good luck finding a codex with that as a weapon option).

In short no.

There is no rule allowing you to put extra guys on a bike, therefore you can't. Simply announcing you can make a model for something you make up is nothing more than declaring an intention to cheat, not a proof of possiblity.

There is a rule allowing you to put extra guys on a bike it's the rule which almost everybody plays buy which says "you are allowed to convert". Your example is a terrible terrible straw man argument that I have seen you use in the exact same way before and it was just as poorly applied then.

There's no rule that says that "models shown wearing red and blue spandex suits gain the following bonuses:" there IS however a rule that says that a bike model shown to have 2 riders get to shoot an extra weapon.

And exactly where in the rulebook is this 'conversion' rule that allows you to add extra Marines to the Captain's bike? Page number and quote please. The only one here with the strawman argument is you, claiming a modelling rule allows you to claim an in-game advantage.

"claiming a modelling rule allows you to claim an in-game advantage. "

It sure does. I'm sure I'm not the only one to see a Nid Army converted so they are all hugging their bases like its going out of fashion.

If that's Allowed why wouldn't Adding Extra Riders be? The problem is here the BRB states, and I'll quote "Each bike in a unit may fire one weapon for each rider on the bike". The SM Codex doesn't say that each Bike only has 1 Rider, nor does it even say the Attack Bike has 2. Therefore, Bikes should never be able to fire!

Yes, you are one of the few who've seen somebody actually go to the time and expense to convert their models for a slight in-game advantage that usually ends up meaning the player has no opponents after a while.

Line of sight works on how the model is actually, physically modelled. That's an actual rule. How many riders it has is not. Claiming it is is a load of BS. That's the difference.

This thread is a prime example of why I hate this forum.

C'mon people it's quite obvious that a bike has one rider. No matter how many models are on it, no matter the crazy stupid conversion you make. Unless it's an attack bike.

I don't need to show you any rules that point one way or another. It's just asinine.

It's not a RAW vs RAI argument, it's just some people being stupid.

Why aren't there any examples of battle reports or anywhere else of ANYONE saying "hey, a good tip is to model two people on a bike so you can shoot both weapons!"

Waaaaaaagh! wrote:"claiming a modelling rule allows you to claim an in-game advantage. "

It sure does. I'm sure I'm not the only one to see a Nid Army converted so they are all hugging their bases like its going out of fashion.

If that's Allowed why wouldn't Adding Extra Riders be? The problem is here the BRB states, and I'll quote "Each bike in a unit may fire one weapon for each rider on the bike". The SM Codex doesn't say that each Bike only has 1 Rider, nor does it even say the Attack Bike has 2. Therefore, Bikes should never be able to fire!

show me an actual instance in gaming where your opponent moded 2 guys on a NORMAL bike and claimed he can shoot both his weapons. can you name an example? if not, then there's no point for anyone to argue with you because all your talking about is BS and you're never gona do it without actually losing some opponents to play with.

If the ensuing bout of "taking the idea seriously" weren't so hilarious, I'd almost feel bad for suggesting modeling extra riders in the first place