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Jet bikes can turbo boost, and move between 18 and 24 inches, while gaining a 3+ invulnerable save. Great. Here is my question:

The BRB states that a jetbike that is using turbo boost cannot move through difficult terrain. Through. Does that mean jetbikes can still move OVER difficult terrain, so long as they are not stopping in it? What about enemy or friendly units, which count as impassible terrain. Can turbo-boosting jetbikes move over/through them?

Thank you for your time.

Nyhil wrote:Jet bikes can turbo boost, and move between 18 and 24 inches, while gaining a 3+ invulnerable save. Great. Here is my question:

The BRB states that a jetbike that is using turbo boost cannot move through difficult terrain. Through. Does that mean jetbikes can still move OVER difficult terrain, so long as they are not stopping in it? What about enemy or friendly units, which count as impassible terrain. Can turbo-boosting jetbikes move over/through them?

Thank you for your time.

1) It's a 3+ Cover save. Invulnerable save was 4th edition.

2) Yes, Jetbikes can turbo OVER Terrain just fine. They just cannot start or end in it.

3) Yes, you can go over Impassible too. You can't begin or end on it though.

4) You're Welcome. That'll be $7.95 please.

But the rulebook specifically says that jetbikes and bikes cannot move THROUGH terrain when turboboosting. You cant really then argue that Jetbikes are moving OVER, not THROUGH terrains, can you?
My interpretation is the section was meant to include BOTH the jetbikes + bikes as part of their restriction.

striderx wrote:But the rulebook specifically says that jetbikes and bikes cannot move THROUGH terrain when turboboosting. You cant really then argue that Jetbikes are moving OVER, not THROUGH terrains, can you?
My interpretation is the section was meant to include BOTH the jetbikes + bikes as part of their restriction.

Erm... yes, you can. Mainly because Jetbikes move OVER all terrain. They never move through it.

Gwar! wrote:Erm... yes, you can. Mainly because Jetbikes move OVER all terrain. They never move through it.

I see no reason they can't choose to move through it. But they have the option of moving over terrain if they wish.

insaniak wrote:

Gwar! wrote:Erm... yes, you can. Mainly because Jetbikes move OVER all terrain. They never move through it.

I see no reason they can't choose to move through it. But they have the option of moving over terrain if they wish.

My reasoning is this:
1) The rules for Jetbikes say that "In the Movement phase, jetbikes can move over all other models and all terrain freely."
2) The rules for Jump Infantry state "they can choose to move as normal infantry if they wish." (Not actually relevant, just using them as an example of one unit type referencing another).
3) Nowhere in the rules for Jetbikes does it say "they can choose to move as normal bikes if they wish." The only time this is allowed is in the assault phase when assaulting, in which case they "are treated like normal bikes".

Therefore, I conclude that Jetbikes will ALWAYS move over all terrain and other models. This means the only time they move "through" Terrain is when they begin or end their move in it, as they must take a Dangerous Terrain test when doing so.

Gwar! wrote:3) Nowhere in the rules for Jetbikes does it say "they can choose to move as normal bikes if they wish."

That would be covered by the line that says "Jetbikes are the same as bikes, with the following exceptions:"


It then says that they can move over terrain. It doesn't say that this option replaces the option to move through it like everyone else does...

I would read it that the Can move over is an exception, and that it does replace the normal movement, as "can" is not equal to "may".

But I Digress, there is no need for Jetbikes to ever move through terrain anyway.

There is if you are trying to contest an objective that's in the middle of a terrain feature.

Gwar! wrote:But I Digress, there is no need for Jetbikes to ever move through terrain anyway.

That would depend on how you measure their movement... If you measure top down, only on the horizontal plane (which from my experience is how the majority of players do it), then no, there is no reason to ever move through the terrain.

If you measure the model's actual path, which I believe is what the movement rules as written actually lean towards in their rather vague fashion, then moving through the terrain can potentially gain you a bit more distance.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Sarigar wrote:There is if you are trying to contest an objective that's in the middle of a terrain feature.

That would be a reason to move into the terrain (which they are explicitly allowed to do), not to move through it.

Bikes need to make a dangerous terrain test when they move through terrain, and can not move through any terrain when they turbo boost. If they would normally have to make a terrain check it's moving through terrain.

Jetbikes ignore terrain, thus they can ignore it during a turbo boost. If they would normally have to make a terrain check it's moving through terrain.

schadenfreude wrote:Bikes need to make a dangerous terrain test when they move through terrain, and can not move through any terrain when they turbo boost. If they would normally have to make a terrain check it's moving through terrain.

Jetbikes ignore terrain, thus they can ignore it during a turbo boost. If they would normally have to make a terrain check it's moving through terrain.

This is how I would play it. Just adding it to the fire

I'm going to add a more difficult rules question to this debate.

Define the minimum 18" movement for the turbo boosting unit to gain the cover save.

Does every single model need to end 18" away from the unit's starting point, or just 1 model?

If a model ends >18" from it's starting point but <18" from another member of it's unit's starting point did the unit move >18"

The way my store has been playing has been 1 model from the unit must end >18" from the starting point of any of it's squad mates.

schadenfreude wrote:I'm going to add a more difficult rules question to this debate.

Define the minimum 18" movement for the turbo boosting unit to gain the cover save.

Does every single model need to end 18" away from the unit's starting point, or just 1 model?

If a model ends >18" from it's starting point but <18" from another member of it's unit's starting point did the unit move >18"

The way my store has been playing has been 1 model from the unit must end >18" from the starting point of any of it's squad mates.

My thought process is as follows: 1) it's a cover save; 2) in order for a unit to claim a cover save, at least 50% of the models must be in cover; 3) therefore, at least 50% of the models must have moved 18"+.

There's certainly room for debate in step 2.

I'd agree with Janthkin.

That seems fair and sensible, which means it'll get shouted down...

Janthkin has it absolutely spot on.
If 50% or more of the unit ends up 18" away, the whole unit benefits, since half or more of the unit has a cover save.

Quick note, jetbikes are not prevented from moving into difficult terrain by stopping thier movement in the terrain itself. They just have to take the dangerous terrain test if they start or end their movement in terrain. They do skip over everything between those two points.

Given the statement "A unit using turbo-boosters must end its move at least 18" away from its starting point to claim this cover save ..." and the fact that the rules define how to measure the distance between two units, a person could also claim that the proper procedure is:

1. Mark the initial position of the models in the unit.
2. Move the models to their new position.
3. Measure the distance from the initial position of the unit to the final position of the unit. See the rules for measuring distances between units for details.
4. If the distance in step 3 is less than 18", then the entire unit is disqualified.

Not that I can imagine anyone wanting to make a fuss unless Eldar jetbikes, Fortune, and an IC joining the unit would be involved....

So, I was re-reading the turbo booster rule and the rule references both bikes and jetbikes in the instance of talking about not being able to move through difficult terrain when boosting. I know that jetbikes state they can pass freely over terrain but is this not counter-acted by the turbo boosting rule stating that bikes and jetbikes can not pass through difficult terrain when boosting?

Kevin949 wrote:So, I was re-reading the turbo booster rule and the rule references both bikes and jetbikes in the instance of talking about not being able to move through difficult terrain when boosting. I know that jetbikes state they can pass freely over terrain but is this not counter-acted by the turbo boosting rule stating that bikes and jetbikes can not pass through difficult terrain when boosting?

Except Jetbikes never move THROUGH terrain. Ever. They move OVER it or INTO or OUT OF it. They never ever move THROUGH it.

solkan wrote:Given the statement "A unit using turbo-boosters must end its move at least 18" away from its starting point to claim this cover save ..." and the fact that the rules define how to measure the distance between two units, a person could also claim that the proper procedure is:

1. Mark the initial position of the models in the unit.
2. Move the models to their new position.
3. Measure the distance from the initial position of the unit to the final position of the unit. See the rules for measuring distances between units for details.
4. If the distance in step 3 is less than 18", then the entire unit is disqualified.

Not that I can imagine anyone wanting to make a fuss unless Eldar jetbikes, Fortune, and an IC joining the unit would be involved....

I kinda agree with this. The 'unit' must move 18", not the individual modelsss....

Kevin949 wrote:So, I was re-reading the turbo booster rule and the rule references both bikes and jetbikes in the instance of talking about not being able to move through difficult terrain when boosting. I know that jetbikes state they can pass freely over terrain but is this not counter-acted by the turbo boosting rule stating that bikes and jetbikes can not pass through difficult terrain when boosting?

Why are you asking the same exact question as the OP?

MasterSlowPoke wrote:

Kevin949 wrote:So, I was re-reading the turbo booster rule and the rule references both bikes and jetbikes in the instance of talking about not being able to move through difficult terrain when boosting. I know that jetbikes state they can pass freely over terrain but is this not counter-acted by the turbo boosting rule stating that bikes and jetbikes can not pass through difficult terrain when boosting?

Why are you asking the same exact question as the OP?

Perhaps because I don't agree with what others said considering the turbo boost rule does not exclude jet bikes from the limitations of turbo boosting. And as gwar has said multiple times in many YMDC threads, if the book does not say you can, then you cannot.

Except it says you can fly over terrain?

MasterSlowPoke wrote:Except it says you can fly over terrain?

Aaand, the turbo boost rules says bikes and jetbikes can't go through terrain when they boost.

Thus the circle is complete.

But you're not going through terrain. You're going over it.

And as I have also said in this thread, Jetbikes don't go through terrain. Ever. They go OVER it.

Kevin949 wrote:

MasterSlowPoke wrote:Except it says you can fly over terrain?

Aaand, the turbo boost rules says bikes and jetbikes can't go through terrain when they boost.

Thus the circle is complete.

Brilliant, accepted.

I will just choose to go OVER the terrain, as the rules for jet bikes allow, and therefore I have not broken the rule.

Circle broken, /thread.

So you're just going to gloss over the fact that jetbikes aren't excluded (and actually specifically included) in the turbo boost rule and its restrictions. Ok, cool.