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Having had a good look at spearhead I'm thinking that this is just GW trying to get people to spend yet more money.

I may be cynical but can't Imperial guard already field massed mechanised armies, not to mention the armour of other races.

Is a mechanised expansion really needed for 40k?

As a final thought about spearhead, just because you can come up with an expansion that requires massive amounts of money to enjoy properly, should you really spend the time producing rules for it when so many of the codices need rewriting so that they work properly for 5th ed.

honestly its the worst idea IMO so far in an expansion for warhammer. Although I really enjoyed the concpets for the other ones this one just seems like new missions with some new Apoc Formations

Justicar Alaric wrote:As a final thought about spearhead, just because you can come up with an expansion that requires massive amounts of money to enjoy properly, should you really spend the time producing rules for it when so many of the codices need rewriting so that they work properly for 5th ed.

Of course you shouldn't. But they'll do it anyway, because at the end of the day they're only really after you're money.

Da_Mega_Grot wrote:honestly its the worst idea IMO so far in an expansion for warhammer. Although I really enjoyed the concpets for the other ones this one just seems like new missions with some new Apoc Formations

Exactly-all Spearhead needed to be was a special mission in the main rulebook stating that you could use extra vehicles or MC's, with maybe a few formations posted on the web semi-regularly a la Liber Apocalyptica. It didn't need a whole month, including a WD, dedicated to it when that time could have been used to update something that needs it like Dark Eldar, Grey Knights, or Tomb Kings. And Spearhead doesn't seem to be able to go anywhere from here-at the end of the day it's just 'who has more/better tanks'. The reason things like Planetstrike or Apocalypse suceeded is because they have room to grow and for players to add their own matireal, but Spearhead will always seem to be just two lines of tnks facing each other.

Halleluah!! Brother Justicar Alaric, Preach On.

I encourage you you take this message forward, take it to the waiting ears of those whom are participating in the Great Fan Rollback of 2010.

In these times of unchecked corporate greed and declining customer service we need a voice to help us maintain our focus, lest we become distracted by the next new shiny thing.

Its basicly just Apocalypse , there trying to make it look like something completly diffirent

Justicar... view my post about opening times!


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I trhink my opinion is clear!


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I trhink my opinion is clear!

I see it as just another mission option.

I'm new to the game so don't have anywhere near enough to play Spearhead. But it's good to know that there are growing options out there.

I quite liked it

As most people wont play alternative FOC games, it's nice to think that you may be able to use formations in a normal game with only a little fore-warning. I think things like the Outrider rule should have been included in the main rulebook, and I hope that Spearhead gets polished up and put into 6th edition when it comes out (as they did with most of the CoD rules in 5th Ed).

Yeah, it looks like an Apoc component.
But GW want it to be played independently of Apoc just for obvious reasons.

Why didn't GW release a rule book for Spearhead?
Everything is free from the internet.

Whilst Spearhead looks fun to play a couple of times i'm of the mind that Games Workshop is Releasing it with there bennifit in mind. "Give them a free rulebook and they will buy £100's worth of tanks to use our free gift!", Yes i am overly cynical but who has not thought this themselves?

Of course GW is trying to find new ways in which the game can be played. And of course they're trying to sell more models.

They're trying to make us play the game as much as possible without getting bored. I don't see anything bad with that and I prefer to play a game where I see the company is busy trying to keep it going.

"Hah, GW I see what you're doing, you're a company trying to make money!"

...

I'd say that most of the expansions are a bit too much like gimmicks that wont have much viability long term. None of them have really held my interest so far. Ill be surprised if they retain long term support.

I largely agree with Shrubs there; too many people around here think Gouge Workshop is the anti-christ. (See what I did thar?) As a former Mage Knight die-hard that watched Wizkids just give up on one of the most popular game systems in the history of wargaming, I'm willing to take any expansion, or rules addition as a positive sign.

That being said, I also agree with everyone else, insofar as there are way better things they could be working on, like the Tomb Kings or Bretonnian Codex's. You want to generate sales GW? Give us playable armies; how about that?

I like that it's
1.) Completely optional
2.) Reasonably priced, just the cost of a WD and the paper to print off the online-only portion of it.

Really, it's not a shock that a profit based business would like to make money, espescially in an economic downturn. If it was a real cashgrab they would make some of the spearhead rules an errata format that makes the force org modifications mandatory for sanctioned tournaments.

I think its sad that it hasn't lived p to its potential. I think it could have been fun if it had been perceived as more than GW saying "Buy more tanks!" Which it really isn't, since there are Formations for almost every unit type, and I could have played about half of them with models in my only modest collection.

Plus, its not like any of the formations are "Tanks in this formation are half normal base cost." They're all good ways to fill space in a normal game size.

Unfortunately, a combinations of bad advertising from the get-go, GW's bad rap, and the wargamer mindset of bitcinh about anything GW does gave the expansion no chance. I dare say I was the only person at the official GW store that I frequent that actually wanted to try playing it.

I have a friend that bought all manner of tanks for his Guard years ago under the premise of playing an Armoured Company list. At the time, it was pretty much just a game of surviving the onslaught of a ton 'o tanks. Playing Space Wolves in that iteration really gave no recourse to such a list.

Now, it might make him get those models out, and I might be able to compete this time. To make things even better, I won't have to buy Apocalypse. I approve, but I get how this could be construed as a GW money-grab.

I love spearhead..in fact our community here loved it so much we held a fun tourney using modified spearhead rules...and it was a BLAST!

I say kudos for GW for these kind of new stuff....Apocalypse is an interesting ruleset, but ultimately apocalypse games are for a certain subset of gamers, while Spearhead is a much easier way to integrate existing units plus a superheavy into the standard game. In addition, not all spearheads are for mechanised units..the mass attack spearhead makes cheap infantry hordes tank killers by giving them all s7 krak grenades (my brother used hormogaunts, but orks would be another excellent choice to use this spearhead) while the monstrous creature spearhead has obvious implications..

tons of fun gentlemen, without needing to play apocalypse..

Given a choice between Spearhead with the price increase and no spearhead with no price increase, I'll take the latter.

The price increases during this economy is corporate business at its most unrealistic and short sighted worst.

focusedfire wrote:Given a choice between Spearhead with the price increase and no spearhead with no price increase, I'll take the latter.

The price increases during this economy is corporate business at its most unrealistic and short sighted worst.

Ah true, but that is very well out of the hands of us players....besides there will always be price increases..its GW for Pete's sake..

freddieyu1 wrote:besides there will always be price increases..its GW for Pete's sake..

True, but the same cannot be said about customers and players if GW keeps up with the Price increases. They are going to price increase themselves into bankruptcy at the current rate.

focusedfire wrote:True, but the same cannot be said about customers and players if GW keeps up with the Price increases. They are going to price increase themselves into bankruptcy at the current rate.

People have been saying that about GW since the early 90's.


So far as Spearhead goes... yes, of course it's intended to encourage you to buy more models. As is every single other rules book and supplement they have released in the last 20 years.

That's kind of the point of a miniature gaming company.


Where I get confused is where people think that this somehow detracts from what it is, which is simply an alternate way of playing Warhammer 40K. People have been playing tank battle scenarios for as long as there have been tanks in 40K. From time to time, GW release rules or scenarios to make these games easier or more fun. This is simply the latest in a rather long-running tradition.


Yes, you're supposed to look at it and want to buy more tanks. But you wouldn't do that if you didn't like tanks in the first place, or didn't want to play massed tank battles. So yes, it's a marketing vehicle. It's also a new way to play 40K, for those who want it.

insaniak wrote:

focusedfire wrote:True, but the same cannot be said about customers and players if GW keeps up with the Price increases. They are going to price increase themselves into bankruptcy at the current rate.

People have been saying that about GW since the early 90's.

Difference between then and now is that the world economy was steadily improving and their price increases weren't going up by 20% on a year where their material costs have dropped. The current price increase is higher than that of 2008 yet there has been no corresponding spike in costs of petrol or pewter.
I did't complain about the price increases in 2008 but am doing so vehemently in a year where the production costs have been cut.

As far as Spearhead goes, I could care less about how good or bad it is. I refuse to reward GW for over-charging their customers. Until they address some of their current serious short fallings I don't plan on spending any more money with them. Its funny too. When I first got into the game I spent very little. It wasn't unitil I had been playing for a couple of years that I went nuts with my armies. I am the anti-thesis of the current GW sales model, as are many others that GW is chasing away with their current round of price gouging. I haven't been chased off yet but a few more short sighted price hikes just to please the shareholders could change my mind.


Now for a positive, The way that this supplement is being released could be seen as a positive, could be...

insaniak wrote:
So far as Spearhead goes... yes, of course it's intended to encourage you to buy more models. As is every single other rules book and supplement they have released in the last 20 years.

That's kind of the point of a miniature gaming company.


Where I get confused is where people think that this somehow detracts from what it is, which is simply an alternate way of playing Warhammer 40K. People have been playing tank battle scenarios for as long as there have been tanks in 40K. From time to time, GW release rules or scenarios to make these games easier or more fun. This is simply the latest in a rather long-running tradition.


Yes, you're supposed to look at it and want to buy more tanks. But you wouldn't do that if you didn't like tanks in the first place, or didn't want to play massed tank battles. So yes, it's a marketing vehicle. It's also a new way to play 40K, for those who want it.

very well put, totally agree

"Is Spearhead a new way to play 40k or is GW squeezing more money out of gamers? "

Yes.

Seeing player's armies are already mechanized with nice fancy tanks. It is a new way to play 40k.

Thinking they're attempting to squeeze cash out of you is just plain old... =I= Terminated by the inquisition =I=

I love how peopel lambast GW for not putting out more hobby material etc in WD, yet as soon as they do they are soundly condemned for "not focusing on other books" [like, they arent doing that already? It takes a lot more time to write a codex than a free expansion...] or complained at because *shock* you may want to buy some models (why they are in the business in the first place, history fans!) in order to play it.

Even though you dont have to if you have a moderate army anyway. And its optional - noone is exactly forcing you to play.

Yet another GW whinefest thread, sigh....

I like it for one reason: it allows me to field my freaking baneblade. All my gakfeth face fethtard fethgak friends in their bleeping gak hole and their mums who can feth their gak in the gak never let me field my baneblade coz "its apocalylse" now i just bring it in from reserves with an astropath to avoid that nasty turn 1 penetrate on all super heavies, and blow their pathetic army to smithereens. Only thing thats managed to kill it so far are assault terminators and FREAKING deep strike obliterators.

insaniak wrote:Yes, you're supposed to look at it and want to buy more tanks. But you wouldn't do that if you didn't like tanks in the first place, or didn't want to play massed tank battles.

Or played Tyranids.

I think it is definitely about money. Paragraph 5 on the rule page that goes with the formations on the website says that all the tanks in a spearhead have to be the same type. I do not have 3 falcons or 3 fire prisms, etc. I tend to have one of each tank for my armies, possibly 2 different land raiders. So I'd be paying extra points for 1 model...no thanks.