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2012/01/20 20:57:35
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
By Edwin Mora
January 18, 2012
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More than 47,000 people have been killed in drug violence in Mexico since President Felipe Calderon launched a military crackdown against drug cartels. (AP Photo/Felix Marquez)
(CNSNews.com) – Organized crime-related deaths in one Mexican border state during the first nine months of 2011 exceed the number of Afghan civilians killed in roughly the same period in all of war-torn Afghanistan.
According to the Mexican government, from January through September 2011 2,276 deaths were recorded in the Mexican state of Chihuahua, which borders Texas and New Mexico.
A Nov. 2011 Congressional Research Service (CRS) report states that over nearly the same period – January through October 2011 – 2,177 civilians were killed in Afghanistan, where a U.S.-led war against the Taliban is underway. It did not provide a breakdown of responsibility for that period, but said that in 2010, 75 percent of civilian deaths were attributed to the Taliban and other “anti-government elements.”
Per capita, a person was at least nine times more likely to be murdered in Chihuahua last year than in Afghanistan. (Chihuahua has 3,406,465 inhabitants, according to Mexico’s 2010 census; the CIA World Factbook reports that in July 2011 the estimated population of Afghanistan was 29,835,392.)
According to the reported numbers, the drug-related murder rate was about 67 for every 100,000 inhabitants in Chihuahua last year, while in Afghanistan the civilian killing rate was an estimated seven for every 100,000 people living there.
There were more drug-related killings in Chihuahua than in any other Mexican state, according to the government figures. Chihuahua, the largest state in Mexico, includes Ciudad Juarez, a border city located across from El Paso, Texas. It is the deadliest city in Mexico and is considered one of the most dangerous places in the world.
According to the government tally, Juarez accounted for 1,206 (about 53 percent) of the 2,276 drug cartel-related murders in Chihuahua during the fist nine months of 2011.
The state capital, the city of Chihuahua, was also among the five deadliest cities in Mexico over that period, with 402 homicides reported.
The organized crime-related deaths in Mexico – officially referred to as homicides due to rivalry between delinquent organizations – include executions, deaths from encounters with authorities, direct aggression attacks, and killings stemming from violence between organized trafficking groups, according to the country’s government.
Its figures show that a total of 12,903 drug-related homicides took place across the country during the first nine months of 2011, taking Mexico’s drug-war death toll to 47,515 since President Felipe Calderon began a militarized crackdown on organized crime in December 2006.
Again comparing the Mexican and Afghanistan figures, the CRS report shows that 11,007 Afghan civilians were killed from 2007 through October 2011. That is about 80 percent fewer deaths than the 47,515 drug-related murders in Mexico over roughly the same period (December 2006 through September 2011).
Even if Afghan National Army (1,933) and police (3,834) fatalities are added to the civilian death toll the total number of deaths in Afghanistan over that period – 16,774 – is still almost three times smaller than the Mexican figure.
A total of 1,757 U.S. soldiers have died in and around Afghanistan since U.S.-led forces invaded in Oct. 2001 to topple the Taliban after its al-Qaeda allies attacked the U.S. homeland the previous month.
According to CNSNews.com’s detailed tally, which is derived primarily from Department of Defense reports, there were 399 U.S. military fatalities in Afghanistan during 2011, the second deadliest year of the war. (There were 497 deaths in 2010.)
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2012/01/20 21:04:43
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
Powder Burns wrote:what they need to make is a fullsize leatherman, like 14" long folded, with a bone saw, notches for bowstring, signaling flare, electrical hand crank generator, bolt cutters..
2012/01/20 21:05:27
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2012/01/20 21:48:24
Subject: Re:One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
2012/01/20 21:58:03
Subject: Re:One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
CT GAMER wrote:Then we should certainly give amnesty to all the "refugees" that flee across the border to the US. Can't expect them to stay ina warzone.
Agreed, after the criminals are sifted out and we guard our border appropriately, like any other country.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2012/01/20 22:00:42
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
Decriminalize marijuana. Hell, decriminalize cocaine, for that matter. You instantly stop spending billions on the drug war - which we're funding both sides of, by the way - and make a huge dent in the profits of the various south-of-the-border cartels, not to mention homegrown gangs.
2012/01/21 08:11:06
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
There is actually a really easy process for Mexican citizens to flee to the USA legally now. They have two options. make it to a US consolate, or make it to the USA border, and beg mercy, seeking asylum, refugee status, what have you.
Having a real and reasonable threat to their lives in Mexico, they could easily get into the USA this way, rather than the usual wait in line, or violate law and sneak in.
Legal, some hassle, but relatively easy in comparison.
Mexico is an awful place and it has as much or more corruption than Illinois politics. wow.
I personally advocate that we take Mexico over. They will all become citizens as so many want. Thier oil will become our oil (#1 supplier to the USA several years running), living conditions would improve, as wages would automatically increase, and health and sanitation regulations would come into affect.
We would also have a much smaller and easier to guard southen border to protect.
Sounds like a win win.
2012/01/21 08:32:04
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
Shadowseer_Kim wrote:There is actually a really easy process for Mexican citizens to flee to the USA legally now. They have two options. make it to a US consolate, or make it to the USA border, and beg mercy, seeking asylum, refugee status, what have you.
Having a real and reasonable threat to their lives in Mexico, they could easily get into the USA this way, rather than the usual wait in line, or violate law and sneak in.
Legal, some hassle, but relatively easy in comparison.
Assuming the US government is cooperative about allowing them in in such a way.
Hint: we aren't.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/01/21 14:43:28
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
2012/01/21 16:47:46
Subject: Re:One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
Frazzled wrote:
Agreed, after the criminals are sifted out and we guard our border appropriately, like any other country.
Most countries don't have debates about militarizing border security.
Exactl;y. they already have the military on the border, when they are bordering another nation that is in the middle of a war.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Joey wrote:Not sure what your point is.
The Mexican government wouldn't allow US troops to fight drug cartels on Mexican soil. Not that they wouldn't be useful.
I don't want to put troops on Mexican soil. I want US troops on US soil to keep the cartels and paid Mexican troops from crossing to HERE.
Of course, if Mexico starts something they could be the next ten states of the US...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/01/21 16:49:22
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2012/01/21 17:20:58
Subject: Re:One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
Mr Hyena wrote:Considering how many get in illegally each year...its probably not a problem.
I think you misunderstand the question.
People coming across the border do not create 62 new US senate seats and radically shift the balance in the house. Unless 25% of the US population is illegals, mexico joining would be somewhat more of a big deal than illegal immigrants are now. So yes, it definitely would be a problem.
2012/01/21 20:40:53
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
If the addition of 10 states of Mexico were added to our system, that would only be 20 new senators, as there are two per state.
I am not sure how many more House of Rep seats would be added, but I am sure we would hear no end of it from the non voting Reps from Puerto Rico, about why they are not made a state first.
I am not saying it wouldn't be problematic, just that it would be in everyones best interest. There would of course be some serious transitional period, while everyone gets used to the new arrangement.
Maybe it is not an overnight thing, but maybe a state at a time basis.
2012/01/21 20:47:05
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
Shadowseer_Kim wrote:If the addition of 10 states of Mexico were added to our system, that would only be 20 new senators, as there are two per state.
I am not sure how many more House of Rep seats would be added, but I am sure we would hear no end of it from the non voting Reps from Puerto Rico, about why they are not made a state first.
I am not saying it wouldn't be problematic, just that it would be in everyones best interest. There would of course be some serious transitional period, while everyone gets used to the new arrangement.
Maybe it is not an overnight thing, but maybe a state at a time basis.
Mexico has 31 states currently and if it happened. Trying to combine some of them to reduce their political power would be difficult to say the least.
House seats are locked in. Additional states will not add new seats, only adjust the ratios, meaning a large number of house members would magically lose their seats. They might be important ones even. If all of mexico got added, every state would lose around 1/3 of their seats.
Having a huge language and cultural divide in the middle of the country isn't working out too great for belgium. How do you think it would go here? There would be 2 americas. It would be instant civil war.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Trying to bring them in one at a time would result in the parts not coming in descending into lame duck chaos as they would be part of a national government with no legitimacy.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/01/21 20:59:57
2012/01/21 21:03:14
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
Shadowseer_Kim wrote:
I personally advocate that we take Mexico over. They will all become citizens as so many want. Thier oil will become our oil (#1 supplier to the USA several years running), living conditions would improve, as wages would automatically increase, and health and sanitation regulations would come into affect.
We would also have a much smaller and easier to guard southen border to protect.
Sounds like a win win.
RIght here
2012/01/21 21:53:02
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
It would be most beneficial to Mexico at any rate.
My guess is that if it happened (which is unlikely) Mexico would enter the same state as Puerto Rico for a while before they'd worry about anything regarding representatives or senators.
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
2012/01/21 22:28:19
Subject: Re:One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
It seems only Americans can come up with the idea of annexing countries in trouble as a rather regular mode of operation. Imagine what an outrage it would be if Germans contemplated annexing Greece to improve their economy...
2012/01/21 22:43:56
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
Shadowseer_Kim wrote:There is actually a really easy process for Mexican citizens to flee to the USA legally now. They have two options. make it to a US consolate, or make it to the USA border, and beg mercy, seeking asylum, refugee status, what have you.
Having a real and reasonable threat to their lives in Mexico, they could easily get into the USA this way, rather than the usual wait in line, or violate law and sneak in.
That's not really how it works. Asylum isn't simply a question of "Can you demonstrate an existential threat?", rather, you're basically placed before an immigration judge who hears your case.
Shadowseer_Kim wrote:
Legal, some hassle, but relatively easy in comparison.
Not really. Immigration hearing are serious, and potentially multi-year processes that will very likely end in deportation, without the money associated with immigrating illegally.
Shadowseer_Kim wrote:
Mexico is an awful place and it has as much or more corruption than Illinois politics. wow.
My definition of corruption is fairly flexible, but are you really under the impression that conventional corruption in Illinois was at any point equivalent to the state of Mexican politics? That its that way now?
Shadowseer_Kim wrote:
I personally advocate that we take Mexico over. They will all become citizens as so many want. Thier oil will become our oil (#1 supplier to the USA several years running), living conditions would improve, as wages would automatically increase, and health and sanitation regulations would come into affect.
We would also have a much smaller and easier to guard southen border to protect.
Sounds like a win win.
Until you consider how costly, in terms of money and life, that the invasion and occupation of a country the size of Mexico would be.
Also, Mexico is the number 2 supplier of the US, slightly ahead of Saudi Arabia, and far outstripped by Canada.
Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh.
2012/01/21 22:46:22
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
Indeed, if this were to happen, it'd be more likely that it would be a form of peaceful annexation than an invasion.
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
2012/01/21 22:46:29
Subject: Re:One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
Frazzled wrote:
Exactl;y. they already have the military on the border, when they are bordering another nation that is in the middle of a war.
Mexico isn't in the middle of a war, that's equivocation. Extreme criminal violence is not the same thing as a civil war, no criminal cartel is vying for formal control of any part of Mexico.
Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh.
2012/01/21 23:02:05
Subject: One Mexican State Bordering The US Was Deadlier Than All of Afghanistan Last Year
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
3000+
Death Company, Converted Space Hulk Termies
