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Hello people, first poster and tentative 40k beginner here! I

So a buddy of mine got super excited about Lightning Claw Terminators from playing DoWII and comissioned me to paint up some Space Wolf Terminators. Before i had time to pull the sprues from the box, he has already sent me a Wolf Pack box, Logan Grimnar and told me he was ordering a dreadnaught...A few figures for display is turning into an army that he previously had no intrest in playing. It looks like we are being sucked into the 40k universe. My buddy says he only wants to play with the people he is already friends with, but none of us play 40k or wargames. I've been eyeballing the oft mentioned Toughest Girls in the Galaxy KS as a base for an Imperial Guard army but have no idea what would counter his rapidly expanding army. I like the idea painting and fielding a lot of troops with maybe some tanks. What would you guys suggest i kick up from the TGG kickstarter(im considering $500 budget for this) and what supplemental models from GW/FW should i consider?

I am sure a few weeks of research and rule book purchases would answer this question, but the KS for one, will be over by then. I'd aprpeciate your input and i will continue to read the forums for information

The current TGG is not a good stand-in for SOB, as the Sisterhood is a power-armored, mid-range shooty army, and the TGG line seems to lack a number of units that the Sisterhood take for granted (or as core components to their army)... though this might have changed, as I've not looked at the updates over the weekend. TGG is a good stand-in for the IG, though, in some regard.

... also, realize that the TGG army will not actually exist until sometime next year. The models for it haven't been cast yet.

As to what the IG offers that is a counter to Space Wolves?

Dakka, and lots of it. Lots of tanks. Mostly, though, the dakka.

The SoB from TGG is probably going to be their next KS(from what i've heard on here) and I can play pure IG until then. My SW friend and I will likely be playing Wild West Exodus until the TGG models come in. Since he is going to have me paint all his Enlightened WWX models as well as my own on top of making all the terrain and gameboard, I will be pretty busy until say mid 2016!
So more Dakka is guardsmen with a particular weapon? machine gun nests? vehicle mounted automatic weapons? Please forgive my ignorance of the very basics. We'd be looking to play fun casual games with some flexibility. I would like to throw a ton of units on the field maybe 3 tanks tops. When watching starwars i was always more interested in the storm/scout troopers than the jedi.

-also, should i wait until 6th edition comes out for IG or just buy 5th now?

The Toughest Girls in the Galaxy series isn't really very good for an army like this. None of them have any proper armor on, for example.

I'll wait and see about their supposed space nuns series, but I don't have very high expectations given the current "quality" that TTGG offers.

Twig 6ed codex guard isnt going to happen for a long time so get the codex, what youre going to want to do is decide whether you youwant a foot list or a mechanized list. both put out lots o dakka but you have to determine what playstyle you like best

Why the bright yellow? I feel like I have scotopic sensitivity syndrome reading it.

 Somedude593 wrote:
Twig 6ed codex guard isnt going to happen for a long time so get the codex, what youre going to want to do is decide whether you youwant a foot list or a mechanized list. both put out lots o dakka but you have to determine what playstyle you like best

Foot list for sure! More dynamic in my opinion. I'd add as many tanks as i need to survive what cannot be killed by infantry, but i prefer my oppnent being whittled down and swarmed
@Melissia I think the Kurganova troops are as close to proper IG armor as you can get without insta lawsuit, right? I dont think it bothers me at least. Yeah, I'd rather have more subtle feminine assets...but maybe that reads better at range?

Is it very important for the troops to be modeled with the actual weapons they are using? I imagine i could just convert the heavy weapons or something if i had to.

Orange better? i prefer orange, i think

The standard white is the preferred posting color.

Well if you want a stopover until all the kick starter stuff happens, you could start with various vehicles.

troops or not you will generally need some chimeras artillery and stuff. (currently i think the name of the game was vendettas (lots of them) and artillery carriage from forge world)

wysiwyg is generally what people want though between friends who cares.

but overall what kinda play style do you like?

Twigbeard wrote:I think the Kurganova troops are as close to proper IG armor as you can get without insta lawsuit, right? I dont think it bothers me at least. Yeah, I'd rather have more subtle feminine assets...but maybe that reads better at range?
Is it very important for the troops to be modeled with the actual weapons they are using? I imagine i could just convert the heavy weapons or something if i had to.

Uh ... what IG armour are you referring to, exactly?
In honesty, they're way oversexualised for any of the "big" IG armies. Some of them could fit for one of the lesser-known feral or hive regiments, however, as those usually dress somewhat less militarily.
How scantly clad and all-female do you want your army to be, exactly? Because otherwise you could also tap various 28mm real world conflict miniature outlets - that way you'd get something very close to, for example, Valhallans, or Praetorians. Although you'll probably only find female minis for the former.

As for the weapons ... yeah, "what you see is what you get". In case you fancy conversion, you don't have to make the guns look 100% 40k, but just so that everyone can see what weapon it is supposed to represent. The muzzles seem to be the most important part, actually, due to their characteristic shape. Adding battery packs for lasguns or tubes for meltaguns goes a long way of making sure, though.

Doesn't auto guns and las guns share the same stats?

i think the most important part are the special weapons like melta plasma flamers and heavy weapons teams.

as getting tricked into thinking that flamer is suddenly a melta kinda miffs most people

 Desubot wrote:
Doesn't auto guns and las guns share the same stats?

i think the most important part are the special weapons like melta plasma flamers and heavy weapons teams.

as getting tricked into thinking that flamer is suddenly a melta kinda miffs most people

Aye, this is true- Your IG could carry M16 as lasguns for all I care, in fact, I would love to see this, but the plasmas and meltas and flamers better be near accurate.

And really, the Iron Empire girls look so awesome, Lynata, even those you think are oversexualised? They look so freakin' good!

(to be completely honest, I like them all. I admit, I don't mind a bit of cheesiness in the girls, but I'm all up for the professional lookin' soldier aswell)

Desubot wrote:Doesn't auto guns and las guns share the same stats?

Great idea.
The lasgun may be the standard armament, but as the Codex notes, some regiments even wield nothing but spear and bow ...
It should be easy to make up a background justification for why this one was raised with autoguns. Maybe the Munitorum shipment from the nearby Forge World is 50 years overdue, so they got local arms? For added dark humour, note that said Forge World was destroyed, but that Imperial bureaucracy takes some time to note how it affects supply lines that have remained unchanged for thousands of years.

TheDraconicLord wrote:And really, the Iron Empire girls look so awesome, Lynata, even those you think are oversexualised? They look so freakin' good!
(to be completely honest, I like them all. I admit, I don't mind a bit of cheesiness in the girls, but I'm all up for the professional lookin' soldier aswell)

Their quality is amazing, but the designs ...
I'm sorry, those ultra-slim arms and legs look too comicbook'ish to me.
It looks better with the Heavy Troopers, but the Regulars would be a no-go for me, personally.

Some of the "Jailbirds" and Kurganova's might work well for a Hiver regiment, though. When your army background mentions that you're recruiting punks and gangers, they are allowed to look the part.

 Lynata wrote:
Their quality is amazing, but the designs ...
I'm sorry, those ultra-slim arms and legs look too comicbook'ish to me.

Coughchough low gravity world coughcough

It could happen

but as much as i love cheesecake i don't think i can wait for any kickstarter (will wait for retail)

Frankly, the Kurganova models are horrible models for 40k. They're cheesecake models at best.

I think the Jailbird army is no more skimpy than the Catachan males, all dat muscle porn(Jailbirds are too skimpy). I do see your point, but besides the impractical boobplate armor on the Kurganova and Iron Emprire troops, I dont think it's over the top at all. Nothing more outragous than what Gamesworkshop currently offers at least. Yeah they are carbon copies as far as body type, but so are the IG males. There is little skin exposed for the majority of the models I would be interested in.
Most of their weapons look like some kind of laser weapon, passable as lasrifles with bayonetes? I believe there are some weapons to be unlocked in the future that can be made to look like plasma weapons with the appropriate paintjob. Like Lynata mentioned, tubes and extra battery packs could convey the meltas and lasweapons
I have been using http://imageshack.us/f/242/igweaponsqr1.jpg/ as my photo refferance, but i could be way off

So i should start working on the Armored part of the army? Chimeras, Vendettas, artillery carriages and stuff huh? Desubot, is waves of disposable minions a playstyle or a sign of despotic cruelty?

 Twigbeard wrote:

So i should start working on the Armored part of the army? Chimeras, Vendettas, artillery carriages and stuff huh? Desubot, is waves of disposable minions a playstyle or a sign of despotic cruelty?

Oh my dear fellow player, allow me to tell you one of the oldest IG mottos: "When in doubt, throw more men at it."

One of the IG HQ's has a rule called "Bring in the next wave!" or something like that.

That's what Commander Chenkov is for.

Send in the next wave.

It's a special rule for conscripts which lets the entire squad come back once they have been whipped out.

Great for bogging down units. then have a commissar near by for ld10 bubble or in it to give the unit stubborn.

Its a usable play style though a lot of people will say its not optimal or whatever.

Chenkov sounds like my kind of Commander, genderbent to Ivanka Kurganova (Snow Version). I really wont mind losing a game as long as i had some fun.
Are conscripts visually/statisticaly different from regular guardsmen? Again sorry for asking questions that i could be answered in the codex i am buying tomorrow

 Twigbeard wrote:
Chenkov sounds like my kind of Commander, genderbent to Ivanka Kurganova (Snow Version). I really wont mind losing a game as long as i had some fun.
Are conscripts visually/statisticaly different from regular guardsmen? Again sorry for asking questions that i could be answered in the codex i am buying tomorrow

They have worse WS and worse BS and terrible Ld. But like Desubot said, stick a comissar in there and they won't run away they are pretty much cannon fodder.

My brother uses Bolsheviks for his Conscripts. The sculpts are slightly smaller and more delicate than the Valhallan figures, but the style matches up pretty well and it makes them visually easy to identify on the table.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
My brother uses Bolsheviks for his Conscripts. The sculpts are slightly smaller and more delicate than the Valhallan figures, but the style matches up pretty well and it makes them visually easy to identify on the table.

And since Chenkov is CLEARLY a reference to second world war Russian tactics, it works to the benefit of the reference.

Ok I think I'm caught up with what you're asking now. General IG advice incoming.

Step 1: Buy the rulebook. Not the 70 dollar hardback monstrosity, hunt down the soft cover 20 dollar version on eBay. "Dark Vengeance Rulebook" should pop up plenty of results.

Step 2: Buy the IG codex. Everything I type past this may as well be in Swahili until you get it. It's really important, if only to just get you a basic idea of how an army works with the Imperial guard and how your squads will be organized. Read up on how infantry platoons work in particular. They are literally a miniature army in your army, and are what an infantry list is built around. A single platoon can have up to 136 guardsmen if you go maximum crazy. Just beware the noob trap of spending too many points on a single platoon. They're only one troop choice, and they're still only guardsmen.

Step 3: Pick a regiment/ look. You seem to have an idea in mind. Good, hang onto that. Make sure you love your idea though, because bare minimum, you'll probably need to paint at least 40-50 guardsmen (LOTS more if you go infantry heavy) If you like the idea of Valhallans, check out WWII infantry models. Warlord makes an awesome plastic kit with 40 guys for around $46 for example. You could also try hunting down the original GW metal models. If you're wanting them, buy them now, because they're not being made anymore and their price is sure to skyrocket on ebay soon.

Step 4: Get an idea of a points level you'll tend to be playing at, and just start writing lists. Find things that look cool to you, and read battle reports and lists in the list forum to get an idea of things to try. If you're going infantry you will need a large supply of lasgun equipped infantry models (this army is typically called Foot guard, Foot, horde, infantry, scrubs, the SIGAoD "The Shooty Imperial Guard Army of Doom", etc.). Lasgun infantry are typically referred to as scrubs. They are wounds for important things, like meltaguns, autocannons, sarge's, etc. A Lasgun is really anything that looks like a rifle of some sort. The codex mentions regiments using everything from flintlocks and bolt action rifles to fully automatic autogun and las weapons, so feel free to use any gun that looks cool for your basic troops. f it's going to be something like a flintlock or musket, try to add some sci fi bitz to it, just to make it more convincing. It'll go a long way to change your army from a cheap proxy army, to a really cool custom one. Also, get lots of special and heavy weapons. Plasmas, meltas, Autocannons, and Lascannons are your bread and butter. You will need a lot of them. Find something that looks close for each type of weapon (or get the official ones) and keep it consistent. Don't have a weapon mean one thing in your command squad and yet be something completely different in another.

Step 5: Play low level games at first, preferably 1,000pts or less. Infantry guard is a very complex army to learn. You have a lot of moving parts and a ton of models, and it only gets crazier with tanks, artillery, and air support added in. Start off with small games, learn how your army works, and remember the 4 main laws of Imperial Guard

1. Your turn has 4 phases. Move. Orders. Shoot. Remove casualties

2. Guardsmen cost 5pts per model for a reason. Get ready to remove them by the handful during the enemy shooting and assault phases. Don't get discouraged, this is just how the army works now. You're not playing WAAC gamers so you should still be fine and win plenty of games once you get the hang of the army. Just bring plenty of infantry and have ways to keep their morale up, either by using company command squads with regimental standards or commissars (or even better, both)

3. Our special rule is "we roll more dice than you." Take that to heart, memorize it, tattoo it to your loved one's forehead so you see it every morning when you wake up, I don't care, just remember it. Be it lasguns, plasmas, artillery, or any other weapon, it helps to bring multiples of it, to ensure the job gets done. Never take one anti tank unit for example. We're the guard. Our units are dirt cheap, and because of that, our units die from a dirty look. We need to be redundant as all get out to compensate for that. Bring some meltas to kill tanks up close, lascannons to kill tanks at long range, and maybe even have Marbo pop up behind the tank for good measure. If you want AA, make sure you have a vendetta, a quadgun, and a truckload of autocannons with Bring it Down! to just keep shooting until you get lucky. You get the idea. Never rely on just one unit to get the job done, which leads to the 4th rule of the Imperial Guard.

4. If you want something done, you need at least 3 units that can do it, because the first one will die, the second will whiff terribly, and the third just might pull it off. Again, this ties into cheap units. They're cheap for a reason. We win by crushing our opponent by weight of fire. We use the law of averages and the "it's gotta hit sometime" to win. For example, a single lasgun shot on a BS 3 guardsmen has a 1/18 chance to kill a space marine (as in 1 out of 18 shots will kill one) How do we overcome that? We issue First Rank Fire Second Rank Fire! and fire 96 shots

Sorry for the massive guide, hopefully that helps some. IG can be hard in the beginning but they're a lot of fun and one of the most interesting armies in the game in terms of lore and customization possibilities. If you can think of it, there's probably been a guard regiment along those lines, so have fun with it.

Welcome to the Guard, and remember, you're here forever.

A thousand thanks for your informative breakdown MrMoustaffa! I will be reading and rereading this post many times in the coming months!
So I picked up the IG codex today and... the Dark Vengeance box set. I really couldnt resist picking up those extra minis so i can rope in another friend or two into my disease. I will have to sneak peaks at the codex between spontanous outbursts of actual work.

So i've dwelt a bit on Step 3: I might just be stretching this all female idea to the limit but i really like the color scheme of the SoB and Protectorate of Menoth. I'd want my army to be a subtle and complimentary reflection of the white, crimson, black and gold theme(s). Is there any Regiment that works closely with the Inquisition? Is it possible to be an IG army with a few Inquisitors/SoB for flavor?

I am lookinging at the Meridian Miniatures-Steam Punk Army as the source of my future conscripts force of 50 or so. Leaning toward the greatcoat with Prussian helmet look to mesh with my Iron Empire Guardswomen from TGG. What do you guys think?

Well from what i remember Inquisitors can have personal armies and stuff so i don't see why not.

You could probably do a Ordos Herdicus themed army as they make use of SOB and could be padded with some IG

Fluff tends to be flexible just don't make female grey knight SPESS MAHRENS and you should do ok.

The SOB do not, specifically, work "with" an IG regiment, as they are from a completely separate part of the Imperium's machine. The Guard is part of the Departmento Munitorum (the bureaucracy that operates the military) while the Sisters of Battle are part of the Ecclesiarchy (the bureaucracy that is the Imperial religion). It is a coin toss as to which is actually more powerful (the IG commands trillions of soldiers, tanks, planes, and all that..... the Ecclesiarchy tells the people what the God-Emperor wants them to do).

It is possible, however, to have the IG regiment you are building be from a Shrine World. That way, the people have strong ties to the Ecclesiarchy, but are not under its direct command (that would violate the Decree Passive) and can justify having SOB allies. This will allow your army to be in the white, black and red that is common to the Ecclesiarchy, but not violate the fluff that prevents the Church from having men under arms.

I think i will be making 2 seperate themes in the army: smaller footsoldier only army in the Iron Empire style and a footsoldier heavy yet mixed forces in the Kurganova Shock Trooper style.

A few more questions for you good folk!

Are there supplements in magazines or other official sources that add significant new characters or options?

What if an IG Commander/General or higher up was personally indebted to the SoB/Inquisition for some rescue or mercy and comissioned/requisitioned an all female army as a gift to the Order Hereticus(im sorry if i am butchering the organizations here, my knowledge is wiki based). They would be all female so as to not violate the Decree Passive. They would most readily come from a Shrine world population with the most devout volunteers from other planets(perhaps the General's home planet) adding to the ranks. Is there some fluff/lore to prevent this?

Look, in all honesty don't let the canon stopping you from doing what you want. They are your models, your army. You are gonna spend a lot of money on them and you are gonna spend hundreds of hours painting them. You MUST do what you really want or else you are gonna hate it because they don't look how you dreamt it.

If someone gives you flak about it? Ignore them, simple. You were the one who had all the work.

And about the first question: I think the only extra source for units are Imperial Armoury books from Forgeworld. FW is a company that's part of GW that specializes in other units. Look around, here.

Twigbeard wrote:Are there supplements in magazines or other official sources that add significant new characters or options?

Aside from the two new Apocalypse formations? Not in current material, I'm afraid.

The reaaally old Citadel Journal #49 added a drop pod option and had some special rules for Sisters who are tasked with purging a Marine Chapter, but just like Forgeworld, Citadel Journal isn't Chapter Approved and as such is not part of the Codex ruleset, in spite of coming from GW as well. Might be interesting if you can convince someone to play against such lists, though. White Dwarf #196 had rules for Frateris Militia meatshields, but although those were Chapter Approved, they are still way too old to count as current. :/
Speaking of Forgeworld, you can also find an option for some flyer and another APC on the website linked by TDL in the post above.

Twigbeard wrote:What if an IG Commander/General or higher up was personally indebted to the SoB/Inquisition for some rescue or mercy and comissioned/requisitioned an all female army as a gift to the Order Hereticus(im sorry if i am butchering the organizations here, my knowledge is wiki based). They would be all female so as to not violate the Decree Passive.

If it's for the Inquisition, then the Decree Passive doesn't mean anything as it applies only to the Ecclesiarchy.
Alternatively, as long as an Imperial Guard regiment is only unofficially attached to some cleric, nobody gives a gak. IG units "volunteer" for Wars of Faith all the time because some Confessor in the regiment convinced the officer in charge it'd be good for their souls - this is how the Ecclesiarchy exerts its unofficial influence. What matters is that the troops would count as faithful volunteers for a single campaign, not the standing army of the church that heeds the Ecclesiarch's every wish.

TheDraconicLord wrote:Look, in all honesty don't let the canon stopping you from doing what you want.

This is true - especially as, contrary to popular belief - there is no such thing as a uniform canon for 40k. Which is why different books will sometimes tell you different things, and why some articles in the various wikis sometimes seem self-contradictory or don't match up with what you've read elsewhere.
Cherrypick what you like, or come up with your own stuff. How closely you want to follow the fluff - and which version of the fluff - is entirely up to you.

Thanks for the input Lynata, you've put me at some ease. I realize I can play this game almost any way I see fit, but there's that irksome itch if you know you've created an abomination. You guys know what im talking about right? You want to be creative and unique without being irreverant of your material...something like that. Personalization without desecration?

Is there a good time to play with more characters? I was just drawing up what i wanted to see in my army. I wanted to have Straken, Chenkov, Al'Raheem, Harker, Marbo and comissars in my army with an flexible/friendly point cap of 1000, i seem to have very little room left for actual troops... Again I am going for near 100% foot soldiers only. I havn't played a single game yet, should i go with more generic officers so i can field more bodies? Do most people just rotate their favorite leaders?