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172 Players

Top 16

1. Catachans with Castellan + 9 Bullgryn
2. Kraken/Kronos Nids + GSC (running the Swarmlord, hell yeah!)
3. DE BDE with a single Saim Hann Farseer in an aux supp det.
4. Ynnari/DE/Unaligned CW
5. Custodes Bikes + DKoK CP Battery
6. Chaos Demons - 3x19 Bloodletters, 3x Nurglings, 3x Blightspawn, 2x PBC, Ahriman, 3 squads of cultists and some other stuff
7. Ynnari/Alaitoc/DE
8. DE Patrol det + Alaitoc wraith army. Straight up 40 wraithguard of various flavors.
9. Ynnari/Alaitoc Rangers/Serpents/DIre Avengers/Spears/Reapers
10. Alpha Legion (unreadable)
11. Tau - Mono T'au Sept 3x Riptide, coldstar, commander with 4x CIB, shield drones, 6 stealth suits, 3 strike teams,
12. Cadians (Unavailable)
13. Ynnari/Harlequins/Ulthwe Rangers/Spears/Reapers/Skyweavers/Eldrad
14.Knight Porphyrion/2 helverins + Lamenters Spearhead with 3 x Dev squads and the Lamenter character + Guard CP battery.
15. Alaitoc/Harlequins Rangers/Guardians/Spears/Banshees/Skyweavers/Razorwings
16. Castellan + 2x Gallant + CP Battery + Adeptus Astartes Battalion with Da Librarian/Scouts and a Rune Priest

Highest Orks
21. Green Tide + Battlewagon
Highest Deathwatch
27. Lots of mixed vet squads with 2x Termies and storm bolter/shield vets. Space Wolf caster detachment of Njal and 2x Rune Priests and... Murderfang?
Highest Admech
38. Cawl Ball + Styrix + Onagers + CP battery
Highest Nectons
54. CCB/Cryptek, Immortals 3x5, Overlord, Destroyers 2x5, 6 Tesla Tomb Blades, Gauss Pylon
Highest Grey Knights
77. 3x Interceptor Squad, BA Scout Battalion with smash captains, 3x seraphim, 3x sister squads.


Edit: BCP App is being weird. It just changed a bunch of these despite everyone having 6 games logged. Will revise in a couple hours when it settles down

Edit 2: Let's try this again, list two: electric boogaloo. Also took a closer look at the lists and broke them down a bit more granularly.

Was that Harlequins list primarily Harlequins? I'd definitely be interested in reading the list.

*Queue demands for IG nerfs

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Was that Harlequins list primarily Harlequins? I'd definitely be interested in reading the list.

I think this is the list. I have come up with similar lists, although I do not have Shining spears. And sometimes I use prophets of flesh rather than Eldar.

Outrider - frozen stars
Troupe Master - caress

12 haywire skyweavers (9 had zephyr glaives)

Solitare with rose.

Air wing - kabal of the black heart

3 × razorwings with dissies

Battalion - alaitoc

Far seer

Warlock skyrunner
Warlocl conclave

5 rangers
5 rangers
10 guardians

5 howling banshees (this one seems odd) nm not odd, I forgot about the anti over watch.

7 shining spears

InstaAxeToast wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Was that Harlequins list primarily Harlequins? I'd definitely be interested in reading the list.

I think this is the list. I have come up with similar lists, although I do not have Shining spears. And sometimes I use prophets of flesh rather than Eldar.

Outrider - frozen stars
Troupe Master - caress

12 haywire skyweavers (9 had zephyr glaives)

Solitare with rose.

Air wing - kabal of the black heart

3 × razorwings with dissies

Battalion - alaitoc

Far seer

Warlock skyrunner
Warlocl conclave

5 rangers
5 rangers
10 guardians

5 howling banshees (this one seems odd) nm not odd, I forgot about the anti over watch.

7 shining spears

So a bunch of haywire to knock down knights and dissies to mulch the rest.

 NurglesR0T wrote:
*Queue demands for IG nerfs

Time to nerf Tau again!

Err this list is different from mine in BCP. I have Daemons at 6 and other differences?

AM
Kraken
Kabal
Ynnari
Custodes
Daemons
Ynnari
Alaitoc
Ynnari

Curious to see those guard lists, especially the Cadian one. I've noticed a theme of Catachan lists built around straken melee stuff being some sort of hidden gem and I'm curious to see if the Catachan Brigade is trying something similar. 9 bullgryns definitely seems to imply that. I want to say some London event had a similar idea with blood Angels do quite well back when smash captains were a thing. I'd imagine the Castellan is fulfilling that role now of killing high toughness targets guardsmen and bullgryns struggle with.

No shocker Castellans are still showing up, I'm sure the strat nerfs hurt but they'll continue to be an excellent choice for armies like infantry guard until their points go up.

 Daedalus81 wrote:
Err this list is different from mine in BCP. I have Daemons at 6 and other differences?

AM
Kraken
Kabal
Ynnari
Custodes
Daemons
Ynnari
Alaitoc
Ynnari

Yeah, it changed like literally three times since I started writing the post. It finalized looking like yours so I'm guessing/hoping thats the final results. Dunno why it changed so much though, all the standings had six games accounted for when I started writing.

Wow, 7 aeldari lists in the top 16, i think i can already hear the pitchforks.

Why? We're conditioned to be used to it by now. Different models, same faction, same gak, same results. They break all the rules and then get a pass because Tolkien.

Eldar have insane speed, good in all phases, and good enough durability with minuses and fliers so it's not surprising they will stay good.

meleti wrote:
Eldar have insane speed, good in all phases, and good enough durability with minuses and fliers so it's not surprising they will stay good.

It's that last one that really frustrates me. Eldar are not supposed to be durable! They're sold as squishy glass cannons that hit hard but can't take the hit themselves. But GW does the same thing every other goddamn developer does and gives the glass cannon a titanium wall to hide behind because people don't like to see their models die or their HP bars vanish.

As a girl who's always preferred tanks, control decks, stall teams, or whatever else strategy is available to grind down an enemy with superior defense until they have no good options left I've always hated the multitude of get-out-of-jail-free cards that glass cannons seem to get.

Alpha Legion (unreadable)

Huehuehue

 Arachnofiend wrote:

meleti wrote:
Eldar have insane speed, good in all phases, and good enough durability with minuses and fliers so it's not surprising they will stay good.

It's that last one that really frustrates me. Eldar are not supposed to be durable! They're sold as squishy glass cannons that hit hard but can't take the hit themselves. But GW does the same thing every other goddamn developer does and gives the glass cannon a titanium wall to hide behind because people don't like to see their models die or their HP bars vanish.

*Laughs in wraithbone*

But seriously, if you want to argue what is “supposed to” be, Eldar should be so fast they’re impossible to hit (hmm, perhaps as some sort of penalty to hit) and with tech and materials far bypassing almost any other faction, combined with psychic foresight of what’s going to happen in the future. I think anyone who sees them as “sold as glass cannons” isn’t paying attention or just wants to complain.

But seriously, the issue seems more Ynnari-based than anything else. Also, keep in mind that they’re an army that was already strong and not hit by recent nerfs, so it makes sense they’d have a strong player base right away after the FAQ.

 Arachnofiend wrote:

meleti wrote:
Eldar have insane speed, good in all phases, and good enough durability with minuses and fliers so it's not surprising they will stay good.

It's that last one that really frustrates me. Eldar are not supposed to be durable! They're sold as squishy glass cannons that hit hard but can't take the hit themselves. But GW does the same thing every other goddamn developer does and gives the glass cannon a titanium wall to hide behind because people don't like to see their models die or their HP bars vanish.

As a girl who's always preferred tanks, control decks, stall teams, or whatever else strategy is available to grind down an enemy with superior defense until they have no good options left I've always hated the multitude of get-out-of-jail-free cards that glass cannons seem to get.

We did the math, and the wave serpent with the fancy engine is considerably tougher than a plague crawler.

HuskyWarhammer wrote:

 Arachnofiend wrote:

meleti wrote:
Eldar have insane speed, good in all phases, and good enough durability with minuses and fliers so it's not surprising they will stay good.

It's that last one that really frustrates me. Eldar are not supposed to be durable! They're sold as squishy glass cannons that hit hard but can't take the hit themselves. But GW does the same thing every other goddamn developer does and gives the glass cannon a titanium wall to hide behind because people don't like to see their models die or their HP bars vanish.

*Laughs in wraithbone*

But seriously, if you want to argue what is “supposed to” be, Eldar should be so fast they’re impossible to hit (hmm, perhaps as some sort of penalty to hit) and with tech and materials far bypassing almost any other faction, combined with psychic foresight of what’s going to happen in the future. I think anyone who sees them as “sold as glass cannons” isn’t paying attention or just wants to complain.

But seriously, the issue seems more Ynnari-based than anything else. Also, keep in mind that they’re an army that was already strong and not hit by recent nerfs, so it makes sense they’d have a strong player base right away after the FAQ.

You and I both know that wraith constructs aren't the "durable" units in the Aeldari codexes. If they were I wouldn't have a problem with it.

Let me ask you this: do you think Eldar should be harder to kill than Necrons?

 NurglesR0T wrote:
*Queue demands for IG nerfs

Lol. 1 IG in top-10 and plenty eldars.

Ynnari needs a hit(Eldar in general imho) and the Loyal 32 are still solid, but honestly that's not a terrible spread.

Highest Grey Knights
77. 3x Interceptor Squad, BA Scout Battalion with smash captains, 3x seraphim, 3x sister squads.

were there any GK with GK majority models in it ? Because it looks more like a SoB army with GK and BA ally, then a GK one.

Karol wrote:

Highest Grey Knights
77. 3x Interceptor Squad, BA Scout Battalion with smash captains, 3x seraphim, 3x sister squads.

were there any GK with GK majority models in it ? Because it looks more like a SoB army with GK and BA ally, then a GK one.

By points, the GK were the biggest faction at 805.

There's only two other players listed as GK, and one doesn't have a list posted. The last place list at 171 if 0-4 with 1470 points of GK and some Admech thrown in for CP.

I would say that's probably a healthier distribution than we had seen pre FAQ2 appart from them being all mostly shooting focused lists at first glance.

That said Aeldari looks like the highest performing group and need looking at.

I'm not surprised by the amount of CP batteries, but the fact that even Admech are taking them says to me that something more fundamental to the units involved to make the loss of synergy with the rest of the list worthwhile.

I would say that CP generation still needs improvements but once Aeldari is addressed that's probably about as closed to balanced as we can expect from th3 current codex's..

I do wonder how much orks will change the meta once they have had time to be able to post some results?

Ynnari aside, I'm really impressed with the list diversity. Healthy.

Would be interesting to see if they revisit the Alaitoc trait and change/remove it. Would probably shift the meta away from CWE lists(ynnari is a separate beast that needs addressing).

I'm not surprised by the amount of CP batteries, but the fact that even Admech are taking them says to me that something more fundamental to the units involved to make the loss of synergy with the rest of the list worthwhile.

Well maybe am wrong, and my big tournament expiriance equals the viability of GK, but isnt the foot print of IG for the points they cost something very important, besides the CP they bring? A Castellan doesn't want to get rushed turn 1 by some jetbikers, and IG allows them to do it. Any shoty imperial army benefits from an IG screen.

By points, the GK were the biggest faction at 805.

Ok, I have a different view on that. Having a castellan in the list wouldn't make it a knight list just because it costs 600+pts. It would kind of a suck to see a top GK player prize go to someone who took 700+1point in GK from someone who plays a 2000pts GK army. Although there probablly werent any GK player there, worrying considering the event with almost 200 people should have at least some casual player in it.

The problem is the Knight being a Plug-and-play addition that increases your chances you chance to win and not something you base the list around when building it from the ground...

No where in the codex or the design article was it ever said that grey knight are a plug and play addition to any other codex. If GW wanted GK to be plug and play, they should have left them the way inquisition or assasins are, with no updates.

HuskyWarhammer wrote:

 Arachnofiend wrote:

meleti wrote:
Eldar have insane speed, good in all phases, and good enough durability with minuses and fliers so it's not surprising they will stay good.

It's that last one that really frustrates me. Eldar are not supposed to be durable! They're sold as squishy glass cannons that hit hard but can't take the hit themselves. But GW does the same thing every other goddamn developer does and gives the glass cannon a titanium wall to hide behind because people don't like to see their models die or their HP bars vanish.

*Laughs in wraithbone*

But seriously, if you want to argue what is “supposed to” be, Eldar should be so fast they’re impossible to hit (hmm, perhaps as some sort of penalty to hit) and with tech and materials far bypassing almost any other faction, combined with psychic foresight of what’s going to happen in the future. I think anyone who sees them as “sold as glass cannons” isn’t paying attention or just wants to complain.

But seriously, the issue seems more Ynnari-based than anything else. Also, keep in mind that they’re an army that was already strong and not hit by recent nerfs, so it makes sense they’d have a strong player base right away after the FAQ.

Yeah, craftworld eldar was never sold to me as "glass cannon." It was sold as "less effective baseline troops, but tons and tons of specialists who are really good at one thing in particular". Dark Eldar and Harlequins are the "super fast glass cannon". Eldar has always had heavy and medium vehicles (hovertanks, wraiths, etc) and aspects that wear heavy armor as well as speedy aspects.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Karol wrote:
No where in the codex or the design article was it ever said that grey knight are a plug and play addition to any other codex. If GW wanted GK to be plug and play, they should have left them the way inquisition or assasins are, with no updates.

he means imperial knights

the_scotsman wrote:
Yeah, craftworld eldar was never sold to me as "glass cannon." It was sold as "less effective baseline troops, but tons and tons of specialists who are really good at one thing in particular". Dark Eldar and Harlequins are the "super fast glass cannon". Eldar has always had heavy and medium vehicles (hovertanks, wraiths, etc) and aspects that wear heavy armor as well as speedy aspects.

Craftworld Eldar have been a bit of everything through the decades.

There isn't really anything wrong with Eldar forces being "elite" - its just that in edition after edition some units have managed to get the perks without paying for them.
I also feel the "they are specialists" card hasn't really worked since 2nd edition. I mean if your Fire Dragons end up facing down Ork boys thats kind of your fault. Its no different from the Ork Players Tankbustas - your dragons have just typically been "better" (I realise they cost too much now).
But then this is tied up with "Marines are all rounders" which has always been nonsense.

Sort of related to the CA thread - Hellions are a glass cannon, Shining Spears not so much.

Not quite sure why people are praising the variety. But I guess thats what we are calling the many flavours of Soup now.

Still +1 for Lamenters making it.

One thing that I hate that soup does, it makes a singular unit seem OP whereas when played within it's native force, it's just a good unit. In this instance, Skyweavers are now taken to take on armour and knights (due to bypassing void shield), and they do it really well. In a pure Harlequin army they are not really a problem, but will probably get nerfed now because of their use in Aeldari soup. This is not the only example.